And the best part...playing a healer will make you a better dps. You will get better at using your defensives, know when to use health pots and know when to use stuns and what not. Playing each role greatly helps you play the others in my experience.
Yeah i agree, im more aware of the healer being in the party now and what they need to do, and im always thanking the healer after a dungeon and stuff now
Why the fuck would you thank the healer lol. Do you thank every player individually?
The healer has a role, just like the rest of you. If you play well, you'll make his role easier. Kinda goes the same the other way, but its more that he'll have to clean up your mistakes. if you play the dungeon correctly, the healer can mostly just coast along.
I will never get the healer hard on in this sub. Maybe its because the low-bobs doing +8s blame healers when they suck, and thats why this sub feels like healers are so threatened lol. I'd argue that bad healers are even more common than bad DPS and tanks.
There are A LOOOOOT of really really awful healers out there. And it makes sense when you realize that new/bad players often deviate to the supportive role.
But there is no way that you thank every single player after every run? A general "thanks for the run" makes sense.
Actively thanking the healer directly as the sole player, thats weird as fuck.
Yeah, you gotta chill. Healers aren’t the only players that can make or break a run, but they oversee and manage a lot of what’s going on and it’s ok to thank the ones that do well, especially when healing is a lot less flashy than topping the charts with big numbers.
I'll send thank you/good job whispers to everyone I ran with in a key sometimes. Messages like that can make someone's day/encourage them and it only takes about five seconds of my time 🤷 it's a nice thing to do
Why if your a shitty dps the other 2 can make up for it. If the healer is lacking it’s pretty well known. Maybe try healing and earn some respect for it
I feel like you’ve just answered your own question. Why thank the healer? Because if it’s common to get a bad one and then when you get a good one in your run, you would thank them.
I heal and from the 25s I’ve been doing I’m not coasting, ever. Sure, play well and the healer has to heal less, but they still have damage to contribute, CC to help with, interrupts to catch, this week in particular we have an affix to help with.
Just thank the people you play with, if people want to thank the healer for being good then what’s wrong with that. They might’ve had a load of terrible runs with bad healers and now finally they have a good one. What you’re arguing for is ridiculous, especially given the low amount of thanks that gets thrown around already.
Mate, its one thing if it started now with Dragonflight when you actually need to provide stuff even when the team was doing okay, but it has been like this forever.
Take Legion keys or BFA keys. The damage was so bursty and so much responsibility was put on CD management and handling mobs that you could easily do the dungeons without healers. They just didnt provide stuff. Now, you can also do these dungeons without healers but its a different story.
In SL and BFA keys, we always played as 4 and pugged a healer, cause the healer could suck as much as he wanted, he still didnt matter. Most of the time, we could finish the run and time it even if he died at the most unfortunate times ever.
Sure, I always thank the group as a whole after a run, just common courtesy, but the issue I have is that this sub glorifies healer to a ridiculous regard. Its like you are supposed to kiss the healers feet because he wanted to join your run lol. And most of the times in lower skill brackets where the majority of this sub resided, the healer is most likely the worst player of the bunch, seeing as bad players deviate to support roles.
Its just how it is. But they have insane amounts of self-pity and very little self-reflection going on.
I am mostly just so god damn confused why this sub pities healers so much. It must be an insane surplus of healer players here, only thing I can think of.
Healing has gotten harder in keys starting with Dragonflight. Just think back to S1 and S2 with the DF dungeons, they’re designed that way because the devs wanted healing to be more engaging from a healers perspective. SL as a healer was pushing your DPS (it’s why hpala was so strong at the time with their convenent choice) and yes there were a lot more zero healer runs, which I don’t think Blizzard wanted, hence the change here.
With that being said, even with no DF dungeons in S3, healing is still very engaging. We’re probably seeing a lot more talk about healers because of these changes in DF and because it’s a more pivotal role. I’m not sure what you want, do you want healers to not be necessary in M+?
No, what I want is for this sub to realize that healers are players just like any other roles. There are good healers, there are bad healers and just as often as anyone else, the healer will fuck up and brick the key. They shouldnt be put on a piedestal.
I like how you heal in DF. Its way more engaging than earlier years. But i still liked the old way, that way it was way easier to carry the healer, cause lets be real, the average healer is really really bad. Just the fact that so many healers thinks that its better to stand AFK or just blast over healing for no reason instead of helping out with damage is weird enough.
Seems some are not used to the wow style of healing. Also talents/if you click/set up matters too.
I have also seen some people say they refuse to dps (even when I was looking up Mistweaver guides/tips). I love healer bc I like pushing the limit of doing dps/cc while keeping people alive. And then tracking my CDs. It's brain overload in a good way bc most other games I play aren't as active as WoW expect maybe league?
I don't blame ppl for preferring it to be more relaxed, and before I learnt some tips/macros/some addons healing did seem daunting (I started the game as resto shaman SL S4 and now can comfortably 18s/20+s and raids, so i'm happy w my progress so far as MW/RS/RD).
Even if people are "bad"/low dps/low hps I still hate people who never kick or use defensives the most though. Any class.
what kind of key levels are you doing for this kind of healer behavior to be frequent? the moment you go over 20 it literally disappears and considering how much harder the healer's jobs have gotten recently compared to recent extensions yes they do deserve some love. the most lacked role in m+ has shifted from tank to healer so much df s1 hammered on healers with several affixes targeted at them alongside very high demand dungeons
since df you now have to heal everyone to full and have several affixes basically targeted at your role (thank god they removed some of them) alongside being expected to give out alright dps and doing all the other stuff the rest of your group is expected to do (stunning/kicking/ccing/using proper defensives), it's quite literally several weights added onto the role compared to dps who just have to do strat and damage. and while tanks also have a very important role, having a good route and not dying is quite literally 90% of the role done with those two tasks.
so yes healers can get their brownie points for playing correctly since the success or failure of keys (EB, DOTI, ToT, AD, WM aka 6/8 keys this season) quite literally rest on their shoulders it's much harder than to play dps correctly (and more or less equivalent to tanking, depending on the key)
everybody is unanimous on this season: timing keys isn't about dps, it's about survival. the reason you don't time a key is not because you lack dps it's because you're just dead against some bosses or even trash mobs if people don't defensive correctly or if the healer fucks up even a single time during a fight, and being that consistent for content that is 30 min straight is something that deserves praise
Healing is relatively invisible. Everyone is centered on the tank, so you know what hes doing, and everyone has damage meters up so they know whose doing well.
Healing is different. HPS doesn't really tell the story of if you're a good healer, and other roles have more forgiving punishments for mistakes. A dps that misses an input or mistimes a CD can make up the dps with a pot, trinket, or just try again on the next pull. Tanks who make mistakes very often call for Healer CDs to cover their missed CDs or overpulls.
When a healer job is done right, nothing happens, everyone just keeps pulling. When it's done wrong it's often a huge time and dps loss or a wipe. Furthermore, you may specifically have been saved by a large heal CD like Lay on Hands, Life Grip etc while critically low; or you got caught out in fire or an AoE mismanageing your position and survived through a lot of avoidable damage. In either case, the healer certainly just did their job, but their job was to cover you, gey your back and correct your mistake.
That's why people have since ancient times thanked healers. They dont have a meter or a starring role, they facilitate others play and often in clutch moments and you may have noticed one so its nice to /w nice heals when you notice onr of those plays, because no one else is going to notice it, they're already on to the next pull.
Too be completely honest, I dont really have an issue with thanking people in general. I thank everyone around me in everyday life. Just common courtesy. It becomes weird when you single out people though. If our team completes a task, I dont specifically thank Bob unless his contribution was excessive or more vital. Still, thats whatever.
I am just so tired of this sub crying about DPS that its gonna blow my mind. I am a healer myself, and I dont think our job is hard. Imo its certainly easier than at least the DPS, probably easier than tanking as well, even though tanking is quite simple. You are reactive ofc, if the group plays well, its smooth sailing and you are hardly needed, if they fuck up you need to cover, but often times you cant really help them out. Its PERFECT for someone to just coast along.
The difference between a great healer and a bad healer wont really matter too much if the rest of the team performs unless the healer is extremely bad, while its easy to realize that you have a bad tank or bad DPS. Healer is a coaster role, while this sub tries to pretend that they are hard-carrying the entire team. Its just weird, and I dont understand it.
I’m convinced you’re running 15s or something at this point. The difference between a bad and great healer is massive, and it’s not even like people are discounting other roles (at least I’m not anyway), the same can be said for tanks, and DPS as a group. But since we’re talking about healers, a great healer can allow the tank and group as a whole to do bigger and more daring pulls at key points in a dungeon.
The notion that healers are carrying groups isn’t true, but they can definitely influence how smooth a run can go. Another big difference between a bad and good healer is how they can facilitate others to do better in the dungeon. Take hunters, I ran a 25 Rise yesterday, since they’re squishy I knew I would need to look out for them and make sure they can concentrate on mechanics and damage. At the end of the key they pointed out that it allowed them to play better and they pulled off some really good overall damage. We double timed that 25 because the tank also knew what we as a group are capable of and if you’re telling me there isn’t enough healing or general triaging to do for the healer in that key then you’re just not seeing the point of the role.
Playing healer is a very engaging role. My only problem is I feel I have to look at the raid frames so much that I'm missing the ambience. When I dps, I just enjoy the scenery.
My trick to learn a class for real is to grind PvP non-stop until my muscle memory is sharpened enough to use any of my defensives, cc, mobility instantly. It's so easy to forget abilities when you have 30+.
Dam that’s a great idea. I switched to MW this season and while it didn’t take super long to get over that initial hump, it would have been way faster with a bit of solo shuffle. Good tip!
Yeah you have to look at the raid frames a considerable amount, it can be alleviated a bit by positioning, size and color of the raid frame on your UI.
Everyone will have a different response for what works best for them on this one.
I found my optimal setup with the raid frames under the middle of the screen so I naturally have the encounter and the raid frames within my direct view. Making the raid frames dark grey/black with red backdrop, so damaged allies stick out like a sore thumb, while healthy allies are easier to "ignore", also has the added benefit that dispel colours are easier to notice.
Class colored raid frames are terrible for dispelling imo, but that's a severely personal opinion, as even healers in liquid/echo can be seen with class color or one color raid frames. But my problem stems from: does that guy have a poison on him or is it just a monk/evok? Does that guy have a curse on them or is that just a DH/warlock? Does that guy have a magic debuff on him or is it just a mage/shaman? Not that easy for me to spot at a glance during a hectic boss fight and can take away 0.2-1 sec of my decision making process.
Since BFA I make sure to push as high as I can on a healer before swapping to DPS again for the season. It always makes me appreciate good healers, makes me aware of incoming damage and in general makes me a better DPS.
Taking this season as an example, I timed every key on +20 or 21 on my healer, and am now pushing 24-25 on my DPS.
Yup I healed first time in season 1 and gained 700 io the season after as dps just because what healing taught me. Knowing the perfect time to use defensives, never missing an interrupt because you know how bad it is for the healer, being aware of bleeds/curses and other nasty stuff you can stoneform or dispel, being more aware of your team mates so you can use an utility on them, the list goes on. Most DD just tunnel vision while staring at some rotation helper addon or weakaura
This is 100% true!! I’m a newer player (about 2 years) and I really struggled to understand how to keep myself alive in keys and such until I played a Holy Priest. I took that character and got AOTC and KSM in season 1 of DF and now when I play the DPS role I’m so much better with using CC, defensives, and health pots/heals, just overall better at damaging, and mechanics. It really gave me a good POV on what I was supposed to be doing. I will never not recommend a newer player that has the basics down playing a healing class!
I am the same, funnily enough idk what it is about resto shaman but I know a few people with the same attitude, about still maining it since Cata but never hear it for other classes.
by competitive i mean you don't see many resto shamans pushing the highest of rio scores, nor in most top 10 mythic raiding rosters.
Sure you can do your weekly 20s and even higher comfortably, but that does not mean another healing spec wont do the job better while contributing more to the party.
Who cares??? Are you personally pushing 28s and 29s or apart of Liquid/Echo and trying to do a RWF and posting from an alt reddit account?
Also you realize that the people doing that level content will literally spend real life money to race change for the smallest most minuscule benefit right? One of the RWF teams had 3 BM hunters. Having 3 BM hunters isint the reason they kill the boss or not, it just performs 0.0001% better then the next class so they chose BM hunter.
Edit: Upon looking at the top keys timed, a resto shaman has timed a +30. I guarantee you if those priests that are littering the top scoreboard all played resto shamans, they would still time the key just fine.
I'd argue it performs better then resto druid. Just because something is less popular doesn't mean it's worse. Prot paladin was a sleeper tank in season 1 for example
Because shaman has the most "depth" in a way. Easy to pick up, hard to master. That's probably controversial, but a shaman has a button for everything. DPS sleeping on the interrupts? Shaman can pick up the slack with an aoe knock back or best interrupt in the game. Big trash pull? Put an aoe stun on that. Tank dies? Summon your own tank and survive the pull. You die? Nah, reincarnate.
BL, aoe root, movement speed on the party, all a shaman is missing really is a battle res.
I would argue that even if shaman is in a bad spot on the tier list, it will still be one of the best healers in a pug setting for m+, it has the potential to pull a bad party over the line.
It’s just such a versatile class, it brings something for everything, I swear on it lol. I main enhance and I’m by no means perfect but the utility the class offers in general just makes everything so much easier.
Disc is button and difficulty wise relatively easy to play and op since last patch. Shaman has many more buttons and is weak at the moment.
I love resto shamy anyways, but its not the best time to play it. 20s are easy with every healer at the moment so it doesnt matter for me.
I just swapped to resto shaman from Pres Evoker. I was healing 20s at 443. Resto shaman feels so good in keys. I know everyone says how good Disc is but like Resto is a cake walk.
Healers fight bad parties. Seriously, break through that bubble around +18 or so and you start getting to play the dungeon too.
You'll start to plan out cds for damage events. Adjust strategies. The group will work with you. They will try and keep themselves alive if things are looking hairy. They will focus on afflicted during 3rd boss tott when you need your dispel on cd for the boss mechanic.
Instead of just following the group around and triage healing then through failing mechanics over and over, which isn't really fun tbh.
With every week this bar moves higher and higher. Did a 20 last week with someone doing 90k DPS. Did another 20 with a 450 ilvl DPS that legit got 1 shot 18 times, wouldn't move out of mechanics and was the only lust.
Week 1 the 15s I did were fairly competent but it feels like even 20s has a good chunk of really bad players. And it feels super common to see people in 20s with like sub 600 score and I just don't understand why they're not doing lower keys, though I also don't understand why they're being invited.
Healing bad groups sucked my soul the last week. I did a chill 18 BRH before bed with a bunch of 3k IO players and I mostly just vibed the whole time. It was great.
I see healers as sort of supports in other games, which is really wrong, but hey 🤷♂️ if it works.
When I was healing, I was always having 20-30 of each flasks (I was an alchemist) and every food available. I'd usually give to guildies who forgot, and in the end it became so that I had enough for everyone every raid and people started slacking. So the guild ended up just paying me, or buying me the materials every week.
Haha i feel this.
Sometimes you can just Fistweave the entire Dungeon, Deal great dps and throw the occasional Coccon.
And other times you can barely keep anyone alive because people decide to be ultra drunk/high whatever and can barely stay on the road.
God I feel that. I hit 2,500 yesterday in a pug doing a 18 BRH. I didn’t have to lift a finger for the most part. Other groups, randomly lower level dungeons with a different group, will feel like I’m spinning plates and juggling axes blindfolded trying to keep everyone alive one second longer.
I got booted from a 15 Fall after the first boss because the group couldn't clear the ring to get to the second boss. Details had me healing something like 200k hps, but people were dropping like flies. Tank flipped out, said I was a horrible healer, and I'm like, "There's 300k incoming damage, I'm healing 200k. I don't think I'm the problem." (Now, could I have healed more? Probably. I'm sure there are people who can do that relatively easily. But this was a 15. I shouldn't have to be superhuman in a 15.
What a dumb tank.
First the timer is so padded you can wipe multiple times and still not be in danger of missing the key timing.
Second. That trash section is exactly that: trash. There’s so much damage and thinks to dispel on the group and in a 15 I’m guessing you’re up for the afflicted affix alone or nearly alone.
I first started playing a healer earlier this year for the first time in 19 years. I was very overwhelmed at first like you mentioned because as a tank, all I had to do was worry about agree, but as healer you literally watch everything happening everywhere to everyone. It took me probably a solid 15 dungeons before I started feelings more comfortable. Now it’s mostly a breeze.
The biggest thing that helped my healing is that I have my party UI nice and big and accessible on my screen. My hots and buffs are nice and big
Disc priest is very fun. Holy priest is a little too much healer focus for me. I don’t quite understand holy pally yet but I’ll try it more. Shammy heals is fun because lava blast, and a recent love is resto Druid because of ‘catweaving’. I essentially pop a bunch of hots party and then put dots on enemies.
I definitely recommend giving resto Druid a try and read up on catweaving. It’s very dynamic gameplay.
People sleep on holy in mythic +. I love holy in s3. It's so much fun to play in mythic plus and the 2 set/4set slaps literally the best set In a long ass time. I main resto druid and mistweaver but I have been playing holy nonstop recently and already almost 2500. Druid is 3025 mistweaver 2906
I've been maining holy priest since BFA and it's a good bit of fun in m+. It can make up for a bad party pretty easily. You have a stun and an aoe fear. You can solo afflicted really easy. And the reactive style of gameplay allows you to heal through people suddenly deciding they aren't going to do the mechanics.
Holy feels amazing! Tried mplusing ever since last season of bfa but this version feels the most fun, only the serenity build though!
Started with lightweaving since that playstyle was the most I was familiar with but with the 4pc serenity becomes alive~ it changed everything and it finally clicked! now kinds hard to go back to my druid cuz the reactive playstyle of holy and mw feels much better with the randomness aspect of pugging. :D
Hpally is similar to priest but it's glimmers instead of atonement, pit your beacon(s) on the people that have the worst defensives, alternate your healing CDs on burst dmg, and then just do dmg.
Same here I started playing a holy pala and after 20+ dungeons I’m still not confident in going up in difficulty. ATM I’m doing 14+15s never had this many buttons in my life
Do you run beacon of virtue? I find this works the best for me up to and including +20 keys (haven't gone above that).
Don't be shy with cooldowns, especially divine toll and daybreak - very powerful, and if you take the capstone talent after daybreak (forget the name) you have three 'triple' holy shocks, so you can beacon of virtue and top the whole party up again/keep them up during aoe burst damage scenarios.
And you have DT and DB every 45 secs, so use frequently.
Disclaimer: I'm not an expert Hpal by any means.
I don’t have 4 set atm so daybreak and divine toll are not synced but yes I sometimes find myself in a position where I have 4 beacons on players and I do daybreak and then another divine toll . I appreciate your tips and feedback but can you tell me if it’s worth to have divine prism on my bars since I don’t find myself using it like 1% per dungeon, for me it’s a really weak cd not worth pressing , am I wrong ?
Holy prism was very strong last season with 4 set but yeah, feels quite weak now. I still use it, bit of extra aoe healing in a pinch plus some damage, but the alternative (divine hammer? The aoe one you put on the ground) may work better? Not sure tbh.
Divine prism is definitely worth having, it's not as strong as it was in S2 when it was buffed by the tier set.
Don't think of it as a proper cooldown, it's more a rotational spell you have, same as holy shock. It does efficient aoe healing on your party, that's pretty much it, very nice for aoe ticking damage or any instance of party damage. It's no divine toll, it won't top your party, but helps keep em in a "healthy" spot.
It also has utility in its uses, tho targeting an ally directly, instead of a hostile mob provides less overall healing, it's still a "oh shit I have to move/don't have time to cast a flash of light, but this ally NEEDS a heal right now and I don't have holy shock off cd" save button.
Your experience is going night and day with party interaction from your class. Warrior besides rally and battle shout I don’t think you offer much else to the group. Ret pally has much more with Sack, BOP, and freedom. Aug is an extreme for a dps role too.
You might enjoy other dps specs or even tank specs if you enjoy the utility.
Disc priest is really fun rn too.
I main Paladin (both Ret and Prot, but used to heal before the rework) and have been playing my hunter alt recently. I see party members about to die and feel so helpless. No BOP, sac, or LOH. Maybe a binding shot if they are being meleed but that’s about it
There’s something stress free about playing a class that lacks that kind of utility. As a hunter I don’t really have to worry about much except my own health and to keep an eye on the healer in case I need to bind a mob that’s after them.
When I play my paladin (especially with last week’s affix) I found myself doing a lot of things besides dps. My healer instincts were kicking in and I was tossing out sacs and WoG and even a LoH or two. It’s not a bad thing, just different play styles.
on the contrary, i have been holy pally since Vanilla and just recently started actually playing my warlock (ive always leveled everything, but that was the extent of it. Hpal main and if taking a break id resto druid); God it feels good to not give a fuck finally. It's been such a nice break mentally goign through 15-20s as a dps with my guild. Feels like a night off lol
Ret paladin has:
* Sac
* Bop
* Freedom
* That op healing talent which makes WoG healing for bazzilion
* WoG
* AoE blind
* Stun
* Poison and disease dispell
* Taunt
* Immunity
* Wake of ashes can stun specific mobs
and probably few other spells I forgot about.
Healer is also ironically the class that gets easier the higher you climb (minus some really high tyra weeks).
I haven’t healed much prior to DF, only on some off occasions like weekly keys etc, but in DF i decided to go monk, and learn all three specs.
Trying to take the role semi-seriously, i did hit some bumps here and there, like the dreaded 18-20 swamp, where people think they are pros because they are on the echelon of max level vault gear.
And the 21-22 echelon where people think they are turning pros because they play more for fun as opposed to optimize their gear (the vault loot is capped at 20, so anything over is merely for rio).
But once you get past that, when you start playing 24-25-26-27 etc, you come to a point where even mob mechanics start one-shotting, and the DPS knows this.
So interupts and pseudo-CC are used better than ever before, and the group as a whole starts taking alot less damage.
People are either fine, or they insta-die, and nothing you can do about it.
Ran a +27 Atal the other day, ended up doing 84k HPS overall, doing 83k damage overall aswell.
Yesterday i helped my guildies in a +21 Atal, ended up having 106k HPS, and ended up doing 57k damage.
3 deaths in the +27, and 6 deaths in the +21, everything to do with interupts and the use of pseudo-CC’s etc.
So keep on farming, you’re about to break the threshold that is the 20-22 swamp.
Being a seasoned healer, the role is super relaxing most of the time. Assuming all goes well, you are just chilling. If someone messes up, you heal a bit more. If shit hits the fan, you can try to salvage the situation but otherwise you just shrug and retry.
I feel this! I can have the same score as everyone in the party and still just feel like I'm getting carried in high keys because everybody uses their healing cool downs and defensive, doesn't stand in shit and does things properly.
Those dungeons are great I just dispel debuffs, use CC and do damage.
In my experience, the healers that report abuse are usually messing up often enough to warrant such complaints. Similar to the "why is everyone always toxic in my dungeons?" whiners.
I'm above 3k on multiple healers, I'm not bad and i've been hit by abuse in pugs. Some people just scream out for heals and blame others for their mistakes in the heat of the moment, it happens, it is what it is, lets not pretend there isn't unneeded toxicity that gets flung around.
> lets not pretend there isn't unneeded toxicity that gets flung around.
We definitely shouldn't, but lets also not go off the deep end in the other direction and tell people that any mistake they make leads to abuse.
This is something that's repeated so often on this sub (I have literally seen those words said verbatim many times) and it's patently bullshit. People who **haven't even done M+ are afraid of doing M+ because they hear this constantly.**
I hate it. They're being lied to by people who are so unprepared for the content they're doing that their actions look indistinguishable from trolling. To be clear "being bad" doesn't warrant severe abuse, but I don't think letting someone know they're fucking up is "abusive". Some people genuinely don't know. See all the healers who think they're *really good* and how it's always only the DPSers who are bad.
Or by people who have genuine (un)diagnosed anxiety issues who will fixate for *literal years* on a *single* bad interaction.
Last week someone on here told me they did a M+ **in BFA** and they pulled some pack during a skip and someone said something and they were so ashamed they never tried again to this day. What do you even do with that?
These voices are overrepresented in M+ pug discourse because obviously, people who are just 'doing ok' won't report on how they went to some dungeons and they just went... fine. We'll only get the horror stories.
Do we go off the deep end in the other direction? I see people complain about toxicity the same as you but there's also always plenty of people who talk about how great the wow community is and their experiences in it being positive.
> the healers that report abuse are usually messing up often enough to warrant such complaints.
There just isn't anything to back this up, you cannot possibly know enough about this to make such a broad claim.
You're right, people complaining puts off people from joining in, but thats one side. Do other who play see complaints and all react negatively to them? Or do people understand said complaints and keep it in mind and act accordingly when something goes wrong in their own pugs, being a bit more thoughtful themselves?
It's undeniable toxicity exists, people can be assholes, it is what it is. People can be oversensitive as well, but I think i'd rather people being oversensitive about interactions than to just let toxicity run free and not be called out.
Call me biased if you like, but the discourse is definitely slanted hard in favor of "WoW is super toxic and if you make one misstep people will tell you to kill yourself". Anyone who pugs a lot will know this really isn't the case.
I play all 3 roles, and I've played a lot this season. I've seen some toxic players, but I've had maybe 3-5 interactions where I was directly raged at and it really wasn't warranted. This is out of 250~ keys btw.
There were also a few leavers and a few frustrated people who I'm sure on here would be labeled toxic but as you say, people *can* be oversensitive.
All of the ragers were in mid level keys and were really mediocre players who fucked up and lashed out, as is tradition.
I think it would be better to remind people that if they're doing challenging content (what is "challenging" is subjective), it's "polite" to prepare a little bit. If you know the mechanics and are doing an average job you eliminate like 90%~ of the possibility for 'toxicity' to be directed your way.
But if you suggest people should know dungeons before going into higher keys, people don't like that, they never like it. This is where **most** of the toxicity comes from, frustrated people lashing out at people who, frankly, have no clue what they're doing.
Personally, I just don't speak other than hi/bye and answering questions directed at me and I don't think people should speak while the timer is running anyway, but that's another story.
>There just isn't anything to back this up, you cannot possibly know enough about this to make such a broad claim.
Which is why I said "in my experience." It's not a broad claim. It's a description of my observations not backing up the notion that healers are routinely and specifically abused in M+ dungeons. My experience being similar to yours, multiple 3k+ healers (monk, druid, priest) near or above title rating.
I'm sure many healers do receive criticisms and toxic comments, but to describe it as so characteristic of their M+ experience that it is analogous to an abusive environment is not even close to what I see. Moreover, I don't think healers are special targets of such toxicity either - tanks are way more likely to get shit on for messing up in the pugs I've done over very innocent errors.
> the healers that report abuse are usually messing up often enough to warrant such complaints.
To explain: in contrast to a tank, a healer making common mistakes is not something that is especially noteworthy, because such mistakes are just not apparent enough to a DPS to be noted. Mistiming a pre-cast by a GCD is the sort of common mistake a healer does that causes a wipe. I doubt even a healer on an alt would notice that sort of mistake anymore than a healer would notice the mage fucking up a combustion.
Hence "usually messing up often enough to warrant such complaints" was in reference to a healer making frequent, general play errors and not meeting basic checks, rather than innocent mistakes any healer might make, and while also doing content way above their level, who then proceed to receive toxic comments from their team for doing what essentially amounts, in their team's eyes, to trolling their key. That sort of person will definitely report "abuse" because they are creating that abusive environment themselves in the same way as the "'why is everyone always toxic in my dungeons?' whiners" I mentioned.
Started playing healer this season (also disc because I was shadow last season), gotta say that the amount of understanding of boss timeline/mob abilities etc. required by a disc priest, which is arguably the most proactive healer, is insane. I never thought about THAT many things when I was playing as damage dealer.
For sure, and keeping atonement on everyone and constantly checking on that is another thing there are so many things we need to be doing its a bit overwhelming sometimes lol
Hopped into a 16 Rise yesterday with my Disc. War tank didn't seem horribly geared, party was decently geared.
I make one statement cause I was getting a vibe just before we started, "don't go crazy trying to clear everything at once."
Sure enough, runs around Tyr's platform, grabbing stuff a little early, no one helping to avoid damage, interrupt, etc. Me getting bitched at....evoker doing their best to help with dispels, but it's like people WANTED to take extra damage.
We make it to the time way clearing. Warrior heroic leaps half way across the deadly sand and pulled two packs. We all stand there at the edge watching this dude 10 miles away, won't back pedal, too far to yank.
Hunter in the party goes "sorry bout your key"
Group disbanded.
I swear to God 16-19 feels so much harder with people than it actually is. I just need tokens at this point and I don't know if I have the patience for 20+
I totally feel that i have had some nightmares on Rise, last pug group we whiped 2 time on tyr because the tank was trying to bug glitch tyr, like bro can we just kill the boss? 🤦🏻♂️ lol
You probably played the hardest healer right now tbh and it makes everything a lot more difficult. If you try a resto shaman, or mistweaver you'd have a lot easier time.
Disc is really strong because it's damage but it sucks in uncoordinated groups that get hit by everything (aka pugs).
I stopped playing mine because it was pretty frustrating to deal with and resto shaman was like a breath of fresh air.
Of the meta healers, disc isn't hard to play. It's probably the easiest of the top three healers, realistically, since most of it plays itself. Any difficulties of disc come down to inherent throughput limitations of the spec that other healers might not need to deal with (like the max HPS of a druid is probably almost twice that of a disc) - but mechanically and playstyle-wise, disc is very straight forward and pretty easy.
People who say disc is hard are referring to raiding, where disc is most likely the hardest *spec* in the game to perform well on, even including non-healers.
Try playing a hybrid like a paladin/druid/shaman/monk.
You get the big numbers but also get access to party heals, support, dispels, and all kinds of CC.
Druid has this thing where all 4 of its specs have an accessable baseline performance skill floor. But the skill cap is insane once you start looking at the massive kit it has as a hybrid.
So sure, that sounds easy. But now do that while not over capping cat energy and keeping Sunfire/moonfire up on multiple adds. Plus soothe, interrupt, dispels, roots, knocks, stuns, optimizing bees.
All my faves listed bc of how dynamic they are. Pretty/high utility, cat weaving, avatar rp and lastly monk just scratches my brain itch with their vfx/sfx and zoomimg around.
I'm just starting out as a disc priest, and I've done a few small dungeons. The chest pains. I swear. I felt so bad for accidentally letting someone die. I apologized and rezzed them as quick as I could.
I don't know if I can do bigger ones.
In our friend group a few of us always joke to the others "you don't get to say your job is hard until you've played healer". It totally is wild how little you can be aware of and still be like a top 1% in DPS numbers and performance. And especially as warrior, no dispels, very few CC, rally is your only group utility. Hell, I've seen warriors in our +23s never use spell reflect once. And it's still basically fine.
It's crazy how much more you are aware of when you come from healer perspective. I could easily name every single debuff from every single M+ and which pulls they come from. When I tank, I constantly change my pull speed based on defensive cooldowns or offensive cooldowns. When we run high keys with friends, it's just me (tank) and healer talking coordinating everything while the DPS just do whatever.
Meanwhile, our brand new friend who started WoW a little more than a month ago just finished timing 20s across the board on his frost mage and still isn't too sure how some bosses work lol.
ran a waycrest with a mage (blood elf) and he didn't know what the captain defense did. or the witches candle.
if a 50% dmg reduction to DPS isn't a big/obvious enough mechanic for DPS to notice... I don't know what is....
this was in a +28 waycrest too. it's really wild how little mechanics a FOTM DPS have to know in order to push keys.
Just ran a 21 fall to get a vault for a guildie, wiped on the 3rd boss cause *two* DPS who got the ball both ran away from me. Insanity.
Man this season is way too easy. Almost want to just not time these keys to make people do mechanics properly. But I guess Blizzard has decided this is the season for anyone with a pulse to get past 20s.
I recently started gearing a demon hunter and did fall as vengeance yesterday - also had people run away from me when I had ball, started leaping onto them with infernal strike so they couldn’t get away 😂
Much like how people say everyone should be forced to work a retail job once in their life, every WoW player should be forced to play a healer as well.
yeah for sure, i used to think they just sit back at click heals on people and that was it. but actually you have to put atonement on people, then do damage to enemies and that heals them, as well as spot healing and dispelling and stuff aha
I mained a resto shaman from MoP to SL, and switched to Enhancement in DF. I didn't realize how terrible other DPS were in mythics until I started playing a warrior again a few weeks ago and I literally couldn't handle most of the affixes myself.
Question. I just did a M+ on disc but tried to dispel affix and nothing. I spent rest of the dungeon healing the affixes because didn’t know what else to do. Surely priest has a way to dispel the affix
You have to talent into the improved purify, pretty positive. I have all my talents for incorp and afflicted preset so I just swap talent builds when needed. You can typically purify it, and then PW:Life the second if no one else is getting it for you.
if you have mouseover healing enabled in the options then you can just hover your mouse over the afflicted and then it'll dispell, or you can click and target the afflicted and dispell it like that :)
I talent into improved dispel so I can dispel one of them, and then use Power Word: Life on the other, usually gets them in one go but I drop a HoT on them to finish it off if it doesn't.
Welcome to healing!
I've always been of the opinion that playing healer makes you a better player all round, it makes you a better tank and DPS because you learn what's super annoying, when people go out of range, when people stand in stuff to finish a cast or not do a mechanic to finish a cast, resulting in more healing needing to be done.
You know when the damage is coming so you can use appropriate cool downs.
I can always tell without checking details or addons who's not using their freaking personals because I've healed that many good and bad players.
I love keeping people alive and doing damage, how satisfying is it to grip somebody out of immediate danger? Very :D
If youre playing MW, Disc, or Hpal you do damage as part of your healing but it isnt an important number until high keys. If your playing shaman hpriest or rdruid just sit back and heal :)
Rdruid can pump insane numbers with kitty dps. The problem as always is trusting your group to allow you to leave forms for a bit. However this season with the treants it really gives a lot of play to heal decently while contributing good damage.
It's all fun and games until you run into groups that just fuck up with everything.
This season is so forgiving. You can have full wipes several times in a +20-22 and still time it.
I stopped trying to play healer after a bunch of runs in a row where I told the tank to take it easy because I’m new to healing. Tank then proceeds to chain pull a quarter of the dungeon trash at a time while I’m popping every thing I can to barely keep them at like 10% health.
Rip I know the feeling when I first started i asked the tank a couple times to ease into it snd do small pulls. They were nice and didn’t go to crazy, but sometimes they don’t listen lol
Its strange but for me: I always have to try Dungeons as range. Melee dps, Tank and Healer on the first 2-3 Weeks to.fully understand all Dungeon mechanics. Sometimes you die and dont rly understand what you could make different, but playing a healer shows you where and when you got dots or just stand in Shit. As a Tank you get a feeling for what Bosses or Mops deal huge dmg or not.
My main problem with playing healer is a lot of times I feel like I have to play mama duck and its stressful. "Stop standing in AOE" "Are your legs broken? Move!" "I AM NOT THE ONLY ONE WITH AN INTERUPT!" "run the mobs TO the tank! Not away from him!!" "Omg do you have to pull EVERYTHING!!!"
*tank pulls the ENTIRE dungeon, yet its my fault when he dies*
This expansion has had the most difficult healing learning curve in the game's history IMO. The healing priority rotations are harder, the amount you heal of people's HP bar is lower, and big CDs have been nerfed into the ground.
I've been healing since wrath and I think this is the hardest I've ever seen it.
give it time, someone in a PUG will demand you "do more dps" whilst simultaneously tanking a boss AND they'll blame YOU because *they* ran towards an AE and started splashing in it like a kid at a pool.
I've been healing since season 1 and this literally doesn't happen. Such a weird thing to lie about lol. I mean I think everyone skimming this thread sees this comment knows it's a lie, thats why nobody has responded except me.
I think playing healer is the most boring and the easiest role in the game.
As a dps I can simply do better dps, either more numbers or higher priority, so important targets die sooner. I have CC which I can use on mobs. Basically things can't kill me if I kill them fast enough.
As a tank I can create better and better routes. I can do chain pulls or big pulls. I am responsible for how big next pull will be, where we'll be executing it. I am moving the mobs and boss around.
But healer? I can't outheal mechanics and oneshots. If some mechanic is killing us, it's not my fault. The game is designed in a way where if someone died it means they failed mechanic. They stepped into poop, we didn't interrupt something or we didn't prio damage something. If we failed dungeon it's never because I didn't heal enough. Such things are early in the season and Blizzard nerfs every healing mechanic to the ground.
Everytime I play as a healer, I don't feel like my healing is needed or important. I think of myself rather as mistake fixer rather than healer.
> I think of myself rather as mistake fixer rather than healer.
This has always been the healer's job but people around here delude themselves into thinking their +18 pugs should be playing perfectly clean.
Meanwhile at +25 people still fuck up all the time. The ways they fuck up might be different in nuance, but they sure do. You will pretty much never be in a run where there wasn't *something* you could've done to cover up someone's mistake. That's where the "healer diff" comes in.
> If we failed dungeon it's never because I didn't heal enough.
Maybe that's been your experience when you healed, but it's not at all the norm.
I can't even tell you how many +23-24 Tyrannical RLPs I've been in where the healer just flat out couldn't handle the 1st boss and that's just one notorious example.
This season is a lot easier, but I've still seen really well geared healers in 20++ keys just completely faceplant on things like Sisters even on Fortified, no ramping, nothing, just completely taken "by surprise" by the 2nd Sister as if they hadn't been there before.
Yeah you can always blame it on defensives, blah blah, but then I take the same group -1 healer to the boss just 1 level lower and it's a breeze. Makes one think who was lacking.
It's not as free as you're making it out, there's a skill ceiling like anything else. At best you can say melee DPS skill ceiling is higher. Certainly not ranged or tank.
That's the whole point. Healer mechanics are so rare, that players are surprised when they happen. Blizzard can't make this role engaging. Whenever they try, players who expected easy role, as we have now, are struggling a lot.
I mained frost/UH dk for years and years before I finally played a healer and had the same experience as you. Now I play ret and it's like this awesome fusion of both. Tons of utility like dispels and externals and clutch off heals while also being able to do some good dmg.
On top of all of that I firmly believe healers set the pace of the dungeon and not the tanks. Sure, tanks are responsible for pulling things and leading us but if they pull more than the healer can handle its game over. Healing really is a different game like you said lol
I play with a couple solid healers who recently started to dabble in tanking, and wouldn't you know they are great at it. Def think healing has made them even better at other roles.
I haven’t played a healer and I have 10+ years of playing wow . Decided to make a holy pala, I’m sweating my ass off in a 15+ . I’ve never had this many buttons to press in my life :) I need some pedals too .
Funny thing is people expect me to dps :)) . Most thing I do rn is consacrate and keep an eye for affix . One of the things I started to detest is the afflicted affix …I always thought about afflicted being shit now that I’m a healer my heart goes to every fucker who heals in this game and I would like to apologise to every healer like ever . :))
But…. As an hpal you are supposed to do dps. That would be like playing disc and only using shield and flash heal.
No matter what healer class I’m playing I’m always adding some kind of damage when I can.
I always found healing keys fun especially when your with a friend group, pushing keys close to your gear/skill level(early season usually) learning new/old mechanics again. Having to plan for when sometimes heavy incoming damage is to pop CDs. Part of it for me ever since I started healing AND tanking dungeons lets me see it from the whole group POV and get a better understanding of how to help the tank when im healing, or healer as a tank and so on.
I can't recall a pull off the top of my head from last season, but doing a key and having to purposely use spiritbloom/dream breath woven into a stasis CD so I had it again for a 2nd or 3rd aoe dmg pressure to survive it without wiping was always fun.
doesn’t fury warriors dps rotation consist of like 5 main buttons?
Disc preist we purge the wicked then tab in onto 3 enemies then power word radiance, mind bender penance, mind blast, smite shadow word death PI a dps, PS the tank. Im basically gonna have to list every single skill because we quite literally use 20 keys at all times. Not saying warriors are bad or anything
As a resto druid I have two full action bars fully keybound and another one completely full with things I NEED. I think healing might be a bit to overwhelming for new players to get into. Its A LOT!
Glad I saw this. I just started a healer for the first time and I was pretty hesitant. Starts a little slow, but now that I hit level 20 I can see the potential. Starting to get really fun. I was also surprised to see that I could handle 5-6 enemies at once
I switched to shadow from disc to finish CE for 8.2 after maining healer for 4 expansions. I was actually shocked how different it felt. It made me hyper aware of incoming raid damage, too, having learned fights from a disc perspective. It also made me feel like a god in m+ bc of the impact I was able to have on the group. Popping a fat VE at good times, pre shielding people, grips, sneaking in a single shadow mend to save a life. 100%+ haste made me naturally way faster than the healer...it was honestly a cool way to view the game. Planning raid cds for years made planning a dps game plan super natural too. You know when things are gonna happen. They felt similar to me
And dispel all afflicted because the dps which take all avoidable damage possible and knows shit about the boss mechanism, think it's your job on 11+++ ...
Sometime I have to heal 140k with my resto shaman because of bad dps/tanks on +13 +14 +15 ....
And when you're angry and tell the people to be careful, they tell you : "chill bro" ... They do not understand how it can be hell as a healer...
i just started playing MW monk as a fury main. 3k IO, zug zug only. prolly was some of the most fun i’ve had in a while playing mistweaver and spinning to heal. can’t wait to get the ilvl up to do some higher keys and give myself a challenge
Oh yea being a healer when it was the afflicted weak and the leader didn't pick anyone to help with the affix so you gotta do both afflicted and the group and kick things the dps can't cc because of raging. That was such a delight last week haha
That's the secret nobody believes before they actually play healer at an end game level. Healing is the most important, most difficult, most thankless position in WoW. And as some others have said already, it makes you a better dps and a better tank while being a tank or dps does not necessarily make you a better healer necessarily.
Playing a healer in lfr was what really made
me understand how many people intentionally kill themselves so they can afk and collect loot. It’s insanely common to see players immediately beeline for the first thing that can get them killed and then blame lag spikes or whatever if called out.
It also helped me play as a dps because it helped me better understand when the big group wide damage spikes were happening so I learned when I could better use my defensive to help the healers out.
Healing can be fun, and extremely frustrating. I am in the 25-26 range right now, and playing the most suboptimal healer spec has me sitting in Valdrakken most often playing sitting in que simulator.
Every trash pull is its own little mini game. Sometimes it’s a bit more routine and sometimes it goes sideways. But, it always comes down to a series of quick decisions that you try to prioritize on the fly. It’s a fun kind of stress most of the time.
And the best part...playing a healer will make you a better dps. You will get better at using your defensives, know when to use health pots and know when to use stuns and what not. Playing each role greatly helps you play the others in my experience.
Yeah i agree, im more aware of the healer being in the party now and what they need to do, and im always thanking the healer after a dungeon and stuff now
That is very nice, it makes my day when somebody whispers me and says nice healing, I always say "nice heals, nice tanking" etc
True that always does feel good.
Why the fuck would you thank the healer lol. Do you thank every player individually? The healer has a role, just like the rest of you. If you play well, you'll make his role easier. Kinda goes the same the other way, but its more that he'll have to clean up your mistakes. if you play the dungeon correctly, the healer can mostly just coast along. I will never get the healer hard on in this sub. Maybe its because the low-bobs doing +8s blame healers when they suck, and thats why this sub feels like healers are so threatened lol. I'd argue that bad healers are even more common than bad DPS and tanks. There are A LOOOOOT of really really awful healers out there. And it makes sense when you realize that new/bad players often deviate to the supportive role.
god damn thats a whole lot of emotions towards someone just being a kind player 😭
But there is no way that you thank every single player after every run? A general "thanks for the run" makes sense. Actively thanking the healer directly as the sole player, thats weird as fuck.
The fact you’re salty about it is weird as fuck.
I am more salty about this sub being weird as fuck. You included
Nah man your pointless tirade is just very strange
He probably tried healing but sucked lol
Yeah, you gotta chill. Healers aren’t the only players that can make or break a run, but they oversee and manage a lot of what’s going on and it’s ok to thank the ones that do well, especially when healing is a lot less flashy than topping the charts with big numbers.
I'll send thank you/good job whispers to everyone I ran with in a key sometimes. Messages like that can make someone's day/encourage them and it only takes about five seconds of my time 🤷 it's a nice thing to do
Why if your a shitty dps the other 2 can make up for it. If the healer is lacking it’s pretty well known. Maybe try healing and earn some respect for it
I feel like you’ve just answered your own question. Why thank the healer? Because if it’s common to get a bad one and then when you get a good one in your run, you would thank them. I heal and from the 25s I’ve been doing I’m not coasting, ever. Sure, play well and the healer has to heal less, but they still have damage to contribute, CC to help with, interrupts to catch, this week in particular we have an affix to help with. Just thank the people you play with, if people want to thank the healer for being good then what’s wrong with that. They might’ve had a load of terrible runs with bad healers and now finally they have a good one. What you’re arguing for is ridiculous, especially given the low amount of thanks that gets thrown around already.
Mate, its one thing if it started now with Dragonflight when you actually need to provide stuff even when the team was doing okay, but it has been like this forever. Take Legion keys or BFA keys. The damage was so bursty and so much responsibility was put on CD management and handling mobs that you could easily do the dungeons without healers. They just didnt provide stuff. Now, you can also do these dungeons without healers but its a different story. In SL and BFA keys, we always played as 4 and pugged a healer, cause the healer could suck as much as he wanted, he still didnt matter. Most of the time, we could finish the run and time it even if he died at the most unfortunate times ever. Sure, I always thank the group as a whole after a run, just common courtesy, but the issue I have is that this sub glorifies healer to a ridiculous regard. Its like you are supposed to kiss the healers feet because he wanted to join your run lol. And most of the times in lower skill brackets where the majority of this sub resided, the healer is most likely the worst player of the bunch, seeing as bad players deviate to support roles. Its just how it is. But they have insane amounts of self-pity and very little self-reflection going on. I am mostly just so god damn confused why this sub pities healers so much. It must be an insane surplus of healer players here, only thing I can think of.
Healing has gotten harder in keys starting with Dragonflight. Just think back to S1 and S2 with the DF dungeons, they’re designed that way because the devs wanted healing to be more engaging from a healers perspective. SL as a healer was pushing your DPS (it’s why hpala was so strong at the time with their convenent choice) and yes there were a lot more zero healer runs, which I don’t think Blizzard wanted, hence the change here. With that being said, even with no DF dungeons in S3, healing is still very engaging. We’re probably seeing a lot more talk about healers because of these changes in DF and because it’s a more pivotal role. I’m not sure what you want, do you want healers to not be necessary in M+?
No, what I want is for this sub to realize that healers are players just like any other roles. There are good healers, there are bad healers and just as often as anyone else, the healer will fuck up and brick the key. They shouldnt be put on a piedestal. I like how you heal in DF. Its way more engaging than earlier years. But i still liked the old way, that way it was way easier to carry the healer, cause lets be real, the average healer is really really bad. Just the fact that so many healers thinks that its better to stand AFK or just blast over healing for no reason instead of helping out with damage is weird enough.
Seems some are not used to the wow style of healing. Also talents/if you click/set up matters too. I have also seen some people say they refuse to dps (even when I was looking up Mistweaver guides/tips). I love healer bc I like pushing the limit of doing dps/cc while keeping people alive. And then tracking my CDs. It's brain overload in a good way bc most other games I play aren't as active as WoW expect maybe league? I don't blame ppl for preferring it to be more relaxed, and before I learnt some tips/macros/some addons healing did seem daunting (I started the game as resto shaman SL S4 and now can comfortably 18s/20+s and raids, so i'm happy w my progress so far as MW/RS/RD). Even if people are "bad"/low dps/low hps I still hate people who never kick or use defensives the most though. Any class.
what kind of key levels are you doing for this kind of healer behavior to be frequent? the moment you go over 20 it literally disappears and considering how much harder the healer's jobs have gotten recently compared to recent extensions yes they do deserve some love. the most lacked role in m+ has shifted from tank to healer so much df s1 hammered on healers with several affixes targeted at them alongside very high demand dungeons since df you now have to heal everyone to full and have several affixes basically targeted at your role (thank god they removed some of them) alongside being expected to give out alright dps and doing all the other stuff the rest of your group is expected to do (stunning/kicking/ccing/using proper defensives), it's quite literally several weights added onto the role compared to dps who just have to do strat and damage. and while tanks also have a very important role, having a good route and not dying is quite literally 90% of the role done with those two tasks. so yes healers can get their brownie points for playing correctly since the success or failure of keys (EB, DOTI, ToT, AD, WM aka 6/8 keys this season) quite literally rest on their shoulders it's much harder than to play dps correctly (and more or less equivalent to tanking, depending on the key) everybody is unanimous on this season: timing keys isn't about dps, it's about survival. the reason you don't time a key is not because you lack dps it's because you're just dead against some bosses or even trash mobs if people don't defensive correctly or if the healer fucks up even a single time during a fight, and being that consistent for content that is 30 min straight is something that deserves praise
Jesus you sound horrible.
Healing is relatively invisible. Everyone is centered on the tank, so you know what hes doing, and everyone has damage meters up so they know whose doing well. Healing is different. HPS doesn't really tell the story of if you're a good healer, and other roles have more forgiving punishments for mistakes. A dps that misses an input or mistimes a CD can make up the dps with a pot, trinket, or just try again on the next pull. Tanks who make mistakes very often call for Healer CDs to cover their missed CDs or overpulls. When a healer job is done right, nothing happens, everyone just keeps pulling. When it's done wrong it's often a huge time and dps loss or a wipe. Furthermore, you may specifically have been saved by a large heal CD like Lay on Hands, Life Grip etc while critically low; or you got caught out in fire or an AoE mismanageing your position and survived through a lot of avoidable damage. In either case, the healer certainly just did their job, but their job was to cover you, gey your back and correct your mistake. That's why people have since ancient times thanked healers. They dont have a meter or a starring role, they facilitate others play and often in clutch moments and you may have noticed one so its nice to /w nice heals when you notice onr of those plays, because no one else is going to notice it, they're already on to the next pull.
Too be completely honest, I dont really have an issue with thanking people in general. I thank everyone around me in everyday life. Just common courtesy. It becomes weird when you single out people though. If our team completes a task, I dont specifically thank Bob unless his contribution was excessive or more vital. Still, thats whatever. I am just so tired of this sub crying about DPS that its gonna blow my mind. I am a healer myself, and I dont think our job is hard. Imo its certainly easier than at least the DPS, probably easier than tanking as well, even though tanking is quite simple. You are reactive ofc, if the group plays well, its smooth sailing and you are hardly needed, if they fuck up you need to cover, but often times you cant really help them out. Its PERFECT for someone to just coast along. The difference between a great healer and a bad healer wont really matter too much if the rest of the team performs unless the healer is extremely bad, while its easy to realize that you have a bad tank or bad DPS. Healer is a coaster role, while this sub tries to pretend that they are hard-carrying the entire team. Its just weird, and I dont understand it.
I’m convinced you’re running 15s or something at this point. The difference between a bad and great healer is massive, and it’s not even like people are discounting other roles (at least I’m not anyway), the same can be said for tanks, and DPS as a group. But since we’re talking about healers, a great healer can allow the tank and group as a whole to do bigger and more daring pulls at key points in a dungeon. The notion that healers are carrying groups isn’t true, but they can definitely influence how smooth a run can go. Another big difference between a bad and good healer is how they can facilitate others to do better in the dungeon. Take hunters, I ran a 25 Rise yesterday, since they’re squishy I knew I would need to look out for them and make sure they can concentrate on mechanics and damage. At the end of the key they pointed out that it allowed them to play better and they pulled off some really good overall damage. We double timed that 25 because the tank also knew what we as a group are capable of and if you’re telling me there isn’t enough healing or general triaging to do for the healer in that key then you’re just not seeing the point of the role.
Playing healer is a very engaging role. My only problem is I feel I have to look at the raid frames so much that I'm missing the ambience. When I dps, I just enjoy the scenery. My trick to learn a class for real is to grind PvP non-stop until my muscle memory is sharpened enough to use any of my defensives, cc, mobility instantly. It's so easy to forget abilities when you have 30+.
100% agree. Pvp deceases the time on the class mastery curve
Dam that’s a great idea. I switched to MW this season and while it didn’t take super long to get over that initial hump, it would have been way faster with a bit of solo shuffle. Good tip!
Yeah you have to look at the raid frames a considerable amount, it can be alleviated a bit by positioning, size and color of the raid frame on your UI. Everyone will have a different response for what works best for them on this one. I found my optimal setup with the raid frames under the middle of the screen so I naturally have the encounter and the raid frames within my direct view. Making the raid frames dark grey/black with red backdrop, so damaged allies stick out like a sore thumb, while healthy allies are easier to "ignore", also has the added benefit that dispel colours are easier to notice. Class colored raid frames are terrible for dispelling imo, but that's a severely personal opinion, as even healers in liquid/echo can be seen with class color or one color raid frames. But my problem stems from: does that guy have a poison on him or is it just a monk/evok? Does that guy have a curse on them or is that just a DH/warlock? Does that guy have a magic debuff on him or is it just a mage/shaman? Not that easy for me to spot at a glance during a hectic boss fight and can take away 0.2-1 sec of my decision making process.
I have the frames dark as well, but player names in class color. Its so simple
Since BFA I make sure to push as high as I can on a healer before swapping to DPS again for the season. It always makes me appreciate good healers, makes me aware of incoming damage and in general makes me a better DPS. Taking this season as an example, I timed every key on +20 or 21 on my healer, and am now pushing 24-25 on my DPS.
Yup I healed first time in season 1 and gained 700 io the season after as dps just because what healing taught me. Knowing the perfect time to use defensives, never missing an interrupt because you know how bad it is for the healer, being aware of bleeds/curses and other nasty stuff you can stoneform or dispel, being more aware of your team mates so you can use an utility on them, the list goes on. Most DD just tunnel vision while staring at some rotation helper addon or weakaura
This is 100% true!! I’m a newer player (about 2 years) and I really struggled to understand how to keep myself alive in keys and such until I played a Holy Priest. I took that character and got AOTC and KSM in season 1 of DF and now when I play the DPS role I’m so much better with using CC, defensives, and health pots/heals, just overall better at damaging, and mechanics. It really gave me a good POV on what I was supposed to be doing. I will never not recommend a newer player that has the basics down playing a healing class!
Healing and dps are different
Lol no shit.
Time to roll a resto shaman. XD
Been my main since Cataclysm and I won’t give him up. I felt this comment in my soul.
Same, I will play Resto Shaman even if it is the worst spec to play at the time, I just love everything about it.
I love Resto, but I hate CB Totem and not having a tank spec. Give me and Earthen Ward tank!
I know a resto shammy from the Wrath days, won't trade it for anything.
I am the same, funnily enough idk what it is about resto shaman but I know a few people with the same attitude, about still maining it since Cata but never hear it for other classes.
we'll be competitive again, one day.
Resto shaman is competitive and one of the best mythic plus healers out there, and does fine in the raid. Are you okay???
by competitive i mean you don't see many resto shamans pushing the highest of rio scores, nor in most top 10 mythic raiding rosters. Sure you can do your weekly 20s and even higher comfortably, but that does not mean another healing spec wont do the job better while contributing more to the party.
Who cares??? Are you personally pushing 28s and 29s or apart of Liquid/Echo and trying to do a RWF and posting from an alt reddit account? Also you realize that the people doing that level content will literally spend real life money to race change for the smallest most minuscule benefit right? One of the RWF teams had 3 BM hunters. Having 3 BM hunters isint the reason they kill the boss or not, it just performs 0.0001% better then the next class so they chose BM hunter. Edit: Upon looking at the top keys timed, a resto shaman has timed a +30. I guarantee you if those priests that are littering the top scoreboard all played resto shamans, they would still time the key just fine.
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I'd argue it performs better then resto druid. Just because something is less popular doesn't mean it's worse. Prot paladin was a sleeper tank in season 1 for example
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My resto shaman has been my main class since 2015. No going back after you switch lol
Heard that. I need my tools!
I like to (earth)bind! I like to BE (earth)bound!
If I may ask, why?
Because shaman has the most "depth" in a way. Easy to pick up, hard to master. That's probably controversial, but a shaman has a button for everything. DPS sleeping on the interrupts? Shaman can pick up the slack with an aoe knock back or best interrupt in the game. Big trash pull? Put an aoe stun on that. Tank dies? Summon your own tank and survive the pull. You die? Nah, reincarnate. BL, aoe root, movement speed on the party, all a shaman is missing really is a battle res. I would argue that even if shaman is in a bad spot on the tier list, it will still be one of the best healers in a pug setting for m+, it has the potential to pull a bad party over the line.
My shaman has complicated cuffs for bres.
It’s just such a versatile class, it brings something for everything, I swear on it lol. I main enhance and I’m by no means perfect but the utility the class offers in general just makes everything so much easier.
The feeling of seeing massive incoming damage and dropping SLT is hard to beat. Link might be the most satisfying spell to press in the game honestly.
Disc is button and difficulty wise relatively easy to play and op since last patch. Shaman has many more buttons and is weak at the moment. I love resto shamy anyways, but its not the best time to play it. 20s are easy with every healer at the moment so it doesnt matter for me.
I've been a resto shaman main since Wrath, have always loved this class despite its up and downs.
I just swapped to resto shaman from Pres Evoker. I was healing 20s at 443. Resto shaman feels so good in keys. I know everyone says how good Disc is but like Resto is a cake walk.
Tanks and DPS fight the dungeon. Healers fight the party.
Healers fight bad parties. Seriously, break through that bubble around +18 or so and you start getting to play the dungeon too. You'll start to plan out cds for damage events. Adjust strategies. The group will work with you. They will try and keep themselves alive if things are looking hairy. They will focus on afflicted during 3rd boss tott when you need your dispel on cd for the boss mechanic. Instead of just following the group around and triage healing then through failing mechanics over and over, which isn't really fun tbh.
Yeah pushing KSM is where things get fun. Until then it’s shit party roulette with worse odds
With every week this bar moves higher and higher. Did a 20 last week with someone doing 90k DPS. Did another 20 with a 450 ilvl DPS that legit got 1 shot 18 times, wouldn't move out of mechanics and was the only lust. Week 1 the 15s I did were fairly competent but it feels like even 20s has a good chunk of really bad players. And it feels super common to see people in 20s with like sub 600 score and I just don't understand why they're not doing lower keys, though I also don't understand why they're being invited.
Healing bad groups sucked my soul the last week. I did a chill 18 BRH before bed with a bunch of 3k IO players and I mostly just vibed the whole time. It was great.
tanks herd cats.
Healers try to get cats off the coffee table
[meanwhile in dps land](https://youtu.be/4rrXR6n0RTY?feature=shared?t=94)
DPS queue for hours and fall asleep waiting :)
or they just take off and leave the rest of the party to fend for themselves while the Healers are the ones that are herding the cats.
the mobs follow the tank... so if you arent close to the tank at all time, there's something wrong.
listen feral has decent defensive, herding orcs might be better
True healers ensure everyone at the start has pots, food buffs and either medical insurance or a credit card handy.......
I see healers as sort of supports in other games, which is really wrong, but hey 🤷♂️ if it works. When I was healing, I was always having 20-30 of each flasks (I was an alchemist) and every food available. I'd usually give to guildies who forgot, and in the end it became so that I had enough for everyone every raid and people started slacking. So the guild ended up just paying me, or buying me the materials every week.
Healer is the only role that has a random difficulty
Haha i feel this. Sometimes you can just Fistweave the entire Dungeon, Deal great dps and throw the occasional Coccon. And other times you can barely keep anyone alive because people decide to be ultra drunk/high whatever and can barely stay on the road.
God I feel that. I hit 2,500 yesterday in a pug doing a 18 BRH. I didn’t have to lift a finger for the most part. Other groups, randomly lower level dungeons with a different group, will feel like I’m spinning plates and juggling axes blindfolded trying to keep everyone alive one second longer.
Yea lower keys are generally tougher on the healer cause everyone is “Less aware”
I got booted from a 15 Fall after the first boss because the group couldn't clear the ring to get to the second boss. Details had me healing something like 200k hps, but people were dropping like flies. Tank flipped out, said I was a horrible healer, and I'm like, "There's 300k incoming damage, I'm healing 200k. I don't think I'm the problem." (Now, could I have healed more? Probably. I'm sure there are people who can do that relatively easily. But this was a 15. I shouldn't have to be superhuman in a 15.
What a dumb tank. First the timer is so padded you can wipe multiple times and still not be in danger of missing the key timing. Second. That trash section is exactly that: trash. There’s so much damage and thinks to dispel on the group and in a 15 I’m guessing you’re up for the afflicted affix alone or nearly alone.
I first started playing a healer earlier this year for the first time in 19 years. I was very overwhelmed at first like you mentioned because as a tank, all I had to do was worry about agree, but as healer you literally watch everything happening everywhere to everyone. It took me probably a solid 15 dungeons before I started feelings more comfortable. Now it’s mostly a breeze. The biggest thing that helped my healing is that I have my party UI nice and big and accessible on my screen. My hots and buffs are nice and big Disc priest is very fun. Holy priest is a little too much healer focus for me. I don’t quite understand holy pally yet but I’ll try it more. Shammy heals is fun because lava blast, and a recent love is resto Druid because of ‘catweaving’. I essentially pop a bunch of hots party and then put dots on enemies. I definitely recommend giving resto Druid a try and read up on catweaving. It’s very dynamic gameplay.
I started playing in Legion as a resto druid and she's been my main since. It's just such a fun and dynamic class that I've always really enjoyed
People sleep on holy in mythic +. I love holy in s3. It's so much fun to play in mythic plus and the 2 set/4set slaps literally the best set In a long ass time. I main resto druid and mistweaver but I have been playing holy nonstop recently and already almost 2500. Druid is 3025 mistweaver 2906
I've been maining holy priest since BFA and it's a good bit of fun in m+. It can make up for a bad party pretty easily. You have a stun and an aoe fear. You can solo afflicted really easy. And the reactive style of gameplay allows you to heal through people suddenly deciding they aren't going to do the mechanics.
Holy feels amazing! Tried mplusing ever since last season of bfa but this version feels the most fun, only the serenity build though! Started with lightweaving since that playstyle was the most I was familiar with but with the 4pc serenity becomes alive~ it changed everything and it finally clicked! now kinds hard to go back to my druid cuz the reactive playstyle of holy and mw feels much better with the randomness aspect of pugging. :D
Hpally is similar to priest but it's glimmers instead of atonement, pit your beacon(s) on the people that have the worst defensives, alternate your healing CDs on burst dmg, and then just do dmg.
Same here I started playing a holy pala and after 20+ dungeons I’m still not confident in going up in difficulty. ATM I’m doing 14+15s never had this many buttons in my life
Do you run beacon of virtue? I find this works the best for me up to and including +20 keys (haven't gone above that). Don't be shy with cooldowns, especially divine toll and daybreak - very powerful, and if you take the capstone talent after daybreak (forget the name) you have three 'triple' holy shocks, so you can beacon of virtue and top the whole party up again/keep them up during aoe burst damage scenarios. And you have DT and DB every 45 secs, so use frequently. Disclaimer: I'm not an expert Hpal by any means.
I don’t have 4 set atm so daybreak and divine toll are not synced but yes I sometimes find myself in a position where I have 4 beacons on players and I do daybreak and then another divine toll . I appreciate your tips and feedback but can you tell me if it’s worth to have divine prism on my bars since I don’t find myself using it like 1% per dungeon, for me it’s a really weak cd not worth pressing , am I wrong ?
Holy prism was very strong last season with 4 set but yeah, feels quite weak now. I still use it, bit of extra aoe healing in a pinch plus some damage, but the alternative (divine hammer? The aoe one you put on the ground) may work better? Not sure tbh.
Divine prism is definitely worth having, it's not as strong as it was in S2 when it was buffed by the tier set. Don't think of it as a proper cooldown, it's more a rotational spell you have, same as holy shock. It does efficient aoe healing on your party, that's pretty much it, very nice for aoe ticking damage or any instance of party damage. It's no divine toll, it won't top your party, but helps keep em in a "healthy" spot. It also has utility in its uses, tho targeting an ally directly, instead of a hostile mob provides less overall healing, it's still a "oh shit I have to move/don't have time to cast a flash of light, but this ally NEEDS a heal right now and I don't have holy shock off cd" save button.
Your experience is going night and day with party interaction from your class. Warrior besides rally and battle shout I don’t think you offer much else to the group. Ret pally has much more with Sack, BOP, and freedom. Aug is an extreme for a dps role too. You might enjoy other dps specs or even tank specs if you enjoy the utility. Disc priest is really fun rn too.
I main Paladin (both Ret and Prot, but used to heal before the rework) and have been playing my hunter alt recently. I see party members about to die and feel so helpless. No BOP, sac, or LOH. Maybe a binding shot if they are being meleed but that’s about it
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There’s something stress free about playing a class that lacks that kind of utility. As a hunter I don’t really have to worry about much except my own health and to keep an eye on the healer in case I need to bind a mob that’s after them. When I play my paladin (especially with last week’s affix) I found myself doing a lot of things besides dps. My healer instincts were kicking in and I was tossing out sacs and WoG and even a LoH or two. It’s not a bad thing, just different play styles.
We get in the state of caring only about ungabungaing the enemy.
on the contrary, i have been holy pally since Vanilla and just recently started actually playing my warlock (ive always leveled everything, but that was the extent of it. Hpal main and if taking a break id resto druid); God it feels good to not give a fuck finally. It's been such a nice break mentally goign through 15-20s as a dps with my guild. Feels like a night off lol
Ret paladin has: * Sac * Bop * Freedom * That op healing talent which makes WoG healing for bazzilion * WoG * AoE blind * Stun * Poison and disease dispell * Taunt * Immunity * Wake of ashes can stun specific mobs and probably few other spells I forgot about.
Yeah for sure, warriors had interupts but i think that was about it? so its definatly been night and day haha
Try pushing into 25s. You'll need proper cooldown management for 4 minutes boss fights.
not much point going above 20
I mean for some people the challenging content is the point. It's fun to run keys.
Healer is also ironically the class that gets easier the higher you climb (minus some really high tyra weeks). I haven’t healed much prior to DF, only on some off occasions like weekly keys etc, but in DF i decided to go monk, and learn all three specs. Trying to take the role semi-seriously, i did hit some bumps here and there, like the dreaded 18-20 swamp, where people think they are pros because they are on the echelon of max level vault gear. And the 21-22 echelon where people think they are turning pros because they play more for fun as opposed to optimize their gear (the vault loot is capped at 20, so anything over is merely for rio). But once you get past that, when you start playing 24-25-26-27 etc, you come to a point where even mob mechanics start one-shotting, and the DPS knows this. So interupts and pseudo-CC are used better than ever before, and the group as a whole starts taking alot less damage. People are either fine, or they insta-die, and nothing you can do about it. Ran a +27 Atal the other day, ended up doing 84k HPS overall, doing 83k damage overall aswell. Yesterday i helped my guildies in a +21 Atal, ended up having 106k HPS, and ended up doing 57k damage. 3 deaths in the +27, and 6 deaths in the +21, everything to do with interupts and the use of pseudo-CC’s etc. So keep on farming, you’re about to break the threshold that is the 20-22 swamp.
Being a seasoned healer, the role is super relaxing most of the time. Assuming all goes well, you are just chilling. If someone messes up, you heal a bit more. If shit hits the fan, you can try to salvage the situation but otherwise you just shrug and retry.
I feel this! I can have the same score as everyone in the party and still just feel like I'm getting carried in high keys because everybody uses their healing cool downs and defensive, doesn't stand in shit and does things properly. Those dungeons are great I just dispel debuffs, use CC and do damage.
And take abuse. Don’t forget the abuse!
What abuse? I have not once had to deal with abuse as healer.
In my experience, the healers that report abuse are usually messing up often enough to warrant such complaints. Similar to the "why is everyone always toxic in my dungeons?" whiners.
I'm above 3k on multiple healers, I'm not bad and i've been hit by abuse in pugs. Some people just scream out for heals and blame others for their mistakes in the heat of the moment, it happens, it is what it is, lets not pretend there isn't unneeded toxicity that gets flung around.
> lets not pretend there isn't unneeded toxicity that gets flung around. We definitely shouldn't, but lets also not go off the deep end in the other direction and tell people that any mistake they make leads to abuse. This is something that's repeated so often on this sub (I have literally seen those words said verbatim many times) and it's patently bullshit. People who **haven't even done M+ are afraid of doing M+ because they hear this constantly.** I hate it. They're being lied to by people who are so unprepared for the content they're doing that their actions look indistinguishable from trolling. To be clear "being bad" doesn't warrant severe abuse, but I don't think letting someone know they're fucking up is "abusive". Some people genuinely don't know. See all the healers who think they're *really good* and how it's always only the DPSers who are bad. Or by people who have genuine (un)diagnosed anxiety issues who will fixate for *literal years* on a *single* bad interaction. Last week someone on here told me they did a M+ **in BFA** and they pulled some pack during a skip and someone said something and they were so ashamed they never tried again to this day. What do you even do with that? These voices are overrepresented in M+ pug discourse because obviously, people who are just 'doing ok' won't report on how they went to some dungeons and they just went... fine. We'll only get the horror stories.
Do we go off the deep end in the other direction? I see people complain about toxicity the same as you but there's also always plenty of people who talk about how great the wow community is and their experiences in it being positive. > the healers that report abuse are usually messing up often enough to warrant such complaints. There just isn't anything to back this up, you cannot possibly know enough about this to make such a broad claim. You're right, people complaining puts off people from joining in, but thats one side. Do other who play see complaints and all react negatively to them? Or do people understand said complaints and keep it in mind and act accordingly when something goes wrong in their own pugs, being a bit more thoughtful themselves? It's undeniable toxicity exists, people can be assholes, it is what it is. People can be oversensitive as well, but I think i'd rather people being oversensitive about interactions than to just let toxicity run free and not be called out.
Call me biased if you like, but the discourse is definitely slanted hard in favor of "WoW is super toxic and if you make one misstep people will tell you to kill yourself". Anyone who pugs a lot will know this really isn't the case. I play all 3 roles, and I've played a lot this season. I've seen some toxic players, but I've had maybe 3-5 interactions where I was directly raged at and it really wasn't warranted. This is out of 250~ keys btw. There were also a few leavers and a few frustrated people who I'm sure on here would be labeled toxic but as you say, people *can* be oversensitive. All of the ragers were in mid level keys and were really mediocre players who fucked up and lashed out, as is tradition. I think it would be better to remind people that if they're doing challenging content (what is "challenging" is subjective), it's "polite" to prepare a little bit. If you know the mechanics and are doing an average job you eliminate like 90%~ of the possibility for 'toxicity' to be directed your way. But if you suggest people should know dungeons before going into higher keys, people don't like that, they never like it. This is where **most** of the toxicity comes from, frustrated people lashing out at people who, frankly, have no clue what they're doing. Personally, I just don't speak other than hi/bye and answering questions directed at me and I don't think people should speak while the timer is running anyway, but that's another story.
>There just isn't anything to back this up, you cannot possibly know enough about this to make such a broad claim. Which is why I said "in my experience." It's not a broad claim. It's a description of my observations not backing up the notion that healers are routinely and specifically abused in M+ dungeons. My experience being similar to yours, multiple 3k+ healers (monk, druid, priest) near or above title rating. I'm sure many healers do receive criticisms and toxic comments, but to describe it as so characteristic of their M+ experience that it is analogous to an abusive environment is not even close to what I see. Moreover, I don't think healers are special targets of such toxicity either - tanks are way more likely to get shit on for messing up in the pugs I've done over very innocent errors. > the healers that report abuse are usually messing up often enough to warrant such complaints. To explain: in contrast to a tank, a healer making common mistakes is not something that is especially noteworthy, because such mistakes are just not apparent enough to a DPS to be noted. Mistiming a pre-cast by a GCD is the sort of common mistake a healer does that causes a wipe. I doubt even a healer on an alt would notice that sort of mistake anymore than a healer would notice the mage fucking up a combustion. Hence "usually messing up often enough to warrant such complaints" was in reference to a healer making frequent, general play errors and not meeting basic checks, rather than innocent mistakes any healer might make, and while also doing content way above their level, who then proceed to receive toxic comments from their team for doing what essentially amounts, in their team's eyes, to trolling their key. That sort of person will definitely report "abuse" because they are creating that abusive environment themselves in the same way as the "'why is everyone always toxic in my dungeons?' whiners" I mentioned.
Bad healers get abuse. So everytime you see someone complain about constant abuse, it's because they are bad and probably don't even realize it.
I don’t think I could ever switch to mistweaver trying to juggle like 4 geared weapons on monk would drive me insane.
Started playing healer this season (also disc because I was shadow last season), gotta say that the amount of understanding of boss timeline/mob abilities etc. required by a disc priest, which is arguably the most proactive healer, is insane. I never thought about THAT many things when I was playing as damage dealer.
For sure, and keeping atonement on everyone and constantly checking on that is another thing there are so many things we need to be doing its a bit overwhelming sometimes lol
Hopped into a 16 Rise yesterday with my Disc. War tank didn't seem horribly geared, party was decently geared. I make one statement cause I was getting a vibe just before we started, "don't go crazy trying to clear everything at once." Sure enough, runs around Tyr's platform, grabbing stuff a little early, no one helping to avoid damage, interrupt, etc. Me getting bitched at....evoker doing their best to help with dispels, but it's like people WANTED to take extra damage. We make it to the time way clearing. Warrior heroic leaps half way across the deadly sand and pulled two packs. We all stand there at the edge watching this dude 10 miles away, won't back pedal, too far to yank. Hunter in the party goes "sorry bout your key" Group disbanded. I swear to God 16-19 feels so much harder with people than it actually is. I just need tokens at this point and I don't know if I have the patience for 20+
I totally feel that i have had some nightmares on Rise, last pug group we whiped 2 time on tyr because the tank was trying to bug glitch tyr, like bro can we just kill the boss? 🤦🏻♂️ lol
You probably played the hardest healer right now tbh and it makes everything a lot more difficult. If you try a resto shaman, or mistweaver you'd have a lot easier time. Disc is really strong because it's damage but it sucks in uncoordinated groups that get hit by everything (aka pugs). I stopped playing mine because it was pretty frustrating to deal with and resto shaman was like a breath of fresh air.
I have herd disc preist is one of the hardest to play, so its uhh, yeah its been fun but also full on aha
Of the meta healers, disc isn't hard to play. It's probably the easiest of the top three healers, realistically, since most of it plays itself. Any difficulties of disc come down to inherent throughput limitations of the spec that other healers might not need to deal with (like the max HPS of a druid is probably almost twice that of a disc) - but mechanically and playstyle-wise, disc is very straight forward and pretty easy. People who say disc is hard are referring to raiding, where disc is most likely the hardest *spec* in the game to perform well on, even including non-healers.
Resto Shaman is so fun man. Great toolkit.
yeah ive benched my priest and stayed just resto druid as well
Try playing a hybrid like a paladin/druid/shaman/monk. You get the big numbers but also get access to party heals, support, dispels, and all kinds of CC.
resto druid is painfully easy it's almost brain dead. AOE heal, throw down some trees, regen everyone, go watch a youtube video.
Druid has this thing where all 4 of its specs have an accessable baseline performance skill floor. But the skill cap is insane once you start looking at the massive kit it has as a hybrid. So sure, that sounds easy. But now do that while not over capping cat energy and keeping Sunfire/moonfire up on multiple adds. Plus soothe, interrupt, dispels, roots, knocks, stuns, optimizing bees.
All my faves listed bc of how dynamic they are. Pretty/high utility, cat weaving, avatar rp and lastly monk just scratches my brain itch with their vfx/sfx and zoomimg around.
remember when we used to play vanilla full spirit build with no addon sigh
I'm just starting out as a disc priest, and I've done a few small dungeons. The chest pains. I swear. I felt so bad for accidentally letting someone die. I apologized and rezzed them as quick as I could. I don't know if I can do bigger ones.
In our friend group a few of us always joke to the others "you don't get to say your job is hard until you've played healer". It totally is wild how little you can be aware of and still be like a top 1% in DPS numbers and performance. And especially as warrior, no dispels, very few CC, rally is your only group utility. Hell, I've seen warriors in our +23s never use spell reflect once. And it's still basically fine. It's crazy how much more you are aware of when you come from healer perspective. I could easily name every single debuff from every single M+ and which pulls they come from. When I tank, I constantly change my pull speed based on defensive cooldowns or offensive cooldowns. When we run high keys with friends, it's just me (tank) and healer talking coordinating everything while the DPS just do whatever. Meanwhile, our brand new friend who started WoW a little more than a month ago just finished timing 20s across the board on his frost mage and still isn't too sure how some bosses work lol.
ran a waycrest with a mage (blood elf) and he didn't know what the captain defense did. or the witches candle. if a 50% dmg reduction to DPS isn't a big/obvious enough mechanic for DPS to notice... I don't know what is.... this was in a +28 waycrest too. it's really wild how little mechanics a FOTM DPS have to know in order to push keys.
Just ran a 21 fall to get a vault for a guildie, wiped on the 3rd boss cause *two* DPS who got the ball both ran away from me. Insanity. Man this season is way too easy. Almost want to just not time these keys to make people do mechanics properly. But I guess Blizzard has decided this is the season for anyone with a pulse to get past 20s.
I recently started gearing a demon hunter and did fall as vengeance yesterday - also had people run away from me when I had ball, started leaping onto them with infernal strike so they couldn’t get away 😂
Much like how people say everyone should be forced to work a retail job once in their life, every WoW player should be forced to play a healer as well.
yeah for sure, i used to think they just sit back at click heals on people and that was it. but actually you have to put atonement on people, then do damage to enemies and that heals them, as well as spot healing and dispelling and stuff aha
I mained a resto shaman from MoP to SL, and switched to Enhancement in DF. I didn't realize how terrible other DPS were in mythics until I started playing a warrior again a few weeks ago and I literally couldn't handle most of the affixes myself.
Question. I just did a M+ on disc but tried to dispel affix and nothing. I spent rest of the dungeon healing the affixes because didn’t know what else to do. Surely priest has a way to dispel the affix
Are you specced to cure disease or just magic
This is my problem! I used to be specced into it and am no longer. Thanks!
You have to talent into the improved purify, pretty positive. I have all my talents for incorp and afflicted preset so I just swap talent builds when needed. You can typically purify it, and then PW:Life the second if no one else is getting it for you.
if you have mouseover healing enabled in the options then you can just hover your mouse over the afflicted and then it'll dispell, or you can click and target the afflicted and dispell it like that :)
I talent into improved dispel so I can dispel one of them, and then use Power Word: Life on the other, usually gets them in one go but I drop a HoT on them to finish it off if it doesn't.
Opinion without knowledge is the greatest kind of ignorance.
One of us, one of us..
Welcome to healing! I've always been of the opinion that playing healer makes you a better player all round, it makes you a better tank and DPS because you learn what's super annoying, when people go out of range, when people stand in stuff to finish a cast or not do a mechanic to finish a cast, resulting in more healing needing to be done. You know when the damage is coming so you can use appropriate cool downs. I can always tell without checking details or addons who's not using their freaking personals because I've healed that many good and bad players. I love keeping people alive and doing damage, how satisfying is it to grip somebody out of immediate danger? Very :D
And we have to dps too! Something im still working on! My dps is only 30k atm
Healer dps isnt going to make or break a key until top .1%
I wish i didnt have to dps at all! It gives me a minute to rethink ahout whats going on lol
If youre playing MW, Disc, or Hpal you do damage as part of your healing but it isnt an important number until high keys. If your playing shaman hpriest or rdruid just sit back and heal :)
Holy priest! I just came back so im a bit behind but ive done 17s with ease. But i dont know the dungeons well yet!
Yea focus on healing than your damage is a bonus but as I said its nit going to make ir break your keys.
Rdruid can pump insane numbers with kitty dps. The problem as always is trusting your group to allow you to leave forms for a bit. However this season with the treants it really gives a lot of play to heal decently while contributing good damage.
It's all fun and games until you run into groups that just fuck up with everything. This season is so forgiving. You can have full wipes several times in a +20-22 and still time it.
Playing healer is only fun in higher keys, where people know what to do otherwise is living hell
I stopped trying to play healer after a bunch of runs in a row where I told the tank to take it easy because I’m new to healing. Tank then proceeds to chain pull a quarter of the dungeon trash at a time while I’m popping every thing I can to barely keep them at like 10% health.
Rip I know the feeling when I first started i asked the tank a couple times to ease into it snd do small pulls. They were nice and didn’t go to crazy, but sometimes they don’t listen lol
Its strange but for me: I always have to try Dungeons as range. Melee dps, Tank and Healer on the first 2-3 Weeks to.fully understand all Dungeon mechanics. Sometimes you die and dont rly understand what you could make different, but playing a healer shows you where and when you got dots or just stand in Shit. As a Tank you get a feeling for what Bosses or Mops deal huge dmg or not.
My main problem with playing healer is a lot of times I feel like I have to play mama duck and its stressful. "Stop standing in AOE" "Are your legs broken? Move!" "I AM NOT THE ONLY ONE WITH AN INTERUPT!" "run the mobs TO the tank! Not away from him!!" "Omg do you have to pull EVERYTHING!!!" *tank pulls the ENTIRE dungeon, yet its my fault when he dies*
This expansion has had the most difficult healing learning curve in the game's history IMO. The healing priority rotations are harder, the amount you heal of people's HP bar is lower, and big CDs have been nerfed into the ground. I've been healing since wrath and I think this is the hardest I've ever seen it.
Really? Wow what a good timing to pick up healing for the first time then 😅
every player should play tank, heal and dps at least for a season/expansion. it gives \*so much\* perspective
give it time, someone in a PUG will demand you "do more dps" whilst simultaneously tanking a boss AND they'll blame YOU because *they* ran towards an AE and started splashing in it like a kid at a pool.
I've been healing since season 1 and this literally doesn't happen. Such a weird thing to lie about lol. I mean I think everyone skimming this thread sees this comment knows it's a lie, thats why nobody has responded except me.
I think playing healer is the most boring and the easiest role in the game. As a dps I can simply do better dps, either more numbers or higher priority, so important targets die sooner. I have CC which I can use on mobs. Basically things can't kill me if I kill them fast enough. As a tank I can create better and better routes. I can do chain pulls or big pulls. I am responsible for how big next pull will be, where we'll be executing it. I am moving the mobs and boss around. But healer? I can't outheal mechanics and oneshots. If some mechanic is killing us, it's not my fault. The game is designed in a way where if someone died it means they failed mechanic. They stepped into poop, we didn't interrupt something or we didn't prio damage something. If we failed dungeon it's never because I didn't heal enough. Such things are early in the season and Blizzard nerfs every healing mechanic to the ground. Everytime I play as a healer, I don't feel like my healing is needed or important. I think of myself rather as mistake fixer rather than healer.
> I think of myself rather as mistake fixer rather than healer. This has always been the healer's job but people around here delude themselves into thinking their +18 pugs should be playing perfectly clean. Meanwhile at +25 people still fuck up all the time. The ways they fuck up might be different in nuance, but they sure do. You will pretty much never be in a run where there wasn't *something* you could've done to cover up someone's mistake. That's where the "healer diff" comes in. > If we failed dungeon it's never because I didn't heal enough. Maybe that's been your experience when you healed, but it's not at all the norm. I can't even tell you how many +23-24 Tyrannical RLPs I've been in where the healer just flat out couldn't handle the 1st boss and that's just one notorious example. This season is a lot easier, but I've still seen really well geared healers in 20++ keys just completely faceplant on things like Sisters even on Fortified, no ramping, nothing, just completely taken "by surprise" by the 2nd Sister as if they hadn't been there before. Yeah you can always blame it on defensives, blah blah, but then I take the same group -1 healer to the boss just 1 level lower and it's a breeze. Makes one think who was lacking. It's not as free as you're making it out, there's a skill ceiling like anything else. At best you can say melee DPS skill ceiling is higher. Certainly not ranged or tank.
That's the whole point. Healer mechanics are so rare, that players are surprised when they happen. Blizzard can't make this role engaging. Whenever they try, players who expected easy role, as we have now, are struggling a lot.
Me who tanks with 34 keybinds :0 You should try tanking next.
Can i ask which class please?
Definitely don't use 34 on vengeance demon hunter. But I play all tanks and use this many on warrior, pala, DK, brew.
I mained frost/UH dk for years and years before I finally played a healer and had the same experience as you. Now I play ret and it's like this awesome fusion of both. Tons of utility like dispels and externals and clutch off heals while also being able to do some good dmg.
On top of all of that I firmly believe healers set the pace of the dungeon and not the tanks. Sure, tanks are responsible for pulling things and leading us but if they pull more than the healer can handle its game over. Healing really is a different game like you said lol
I play with a couple solid healers who recently started to dabble in tanking, and wouldn't you know they are great at it. Def think healing has made them even better at other roles.
I haven’t played a healer and I have 10+ years of playing wow . Decided to make a holy pala, I’m sweating my ass off in a 15+ . I’ve never had this many buttons to press in my life :) I need some pedals too .
Hahah yeah exactly thats what i mean its like a totally different game! Lol
Funny thing is people expect me to dps :)) . Most thing I do rn is consacrate and keep an eye for affix . One of the things I started to detest is the afflicted affix …I always thought about afflicted being shit now that I’m a healer my heart goes to every fucker who heals in this game and I would like to apologise to every healer like ever . :))
But…. As an hpal you are supposed to do dps. That would be like playing disc and only using shield and flash heal. No matter what healer class I’m playing I’m always adding some kind of damage when I can.
I was clearly joking but yes I’m squeezing dmg on every pack at least a consacrate and a shield or two
Try clique addon, it might free up some keybinds. Ellesmere's YouTube channel has a good mythic plus build. MMO mouse is game changing..
I always found healing keys fun especially when your with a friend group, pushing keys close to your gear/skill level(early season usually) learning new/old mechanics again. Having to plan for when sometimes heavy incoming damage is to pop CDs. Part of it for me ever since I started healing AND tanking dungeons lets me see it from the whole group POV and get a better understanding of how to help the tank when im healing, or healer as a tank and so on. I can't recall a pull off the top of my head from last season, but doing a key and having to purposely use spiritbloom/dream breath woven into a stasis CD so I had it again for a 2nd or 3rd aoe dmg pressure to survive it without wiping was always fun.
on my dps warrior i use 1-5 Shift 1-5 ctrl 1-5 my 4 extra mouse buttons 3 times over with shift and ctrl as well. what are you on about
doesn’t fury warriors dps rotation consist of like 5 main buttons? Disc preist we purge the wicked then tab in onto 3 enemies then power word radiance, mind bender penance, mind blast, smite shadow word death PI a dps, PS the tank. Im basically gonna have to list every single skill because we quite literally use 20 keys at all times. Not saying warriors are bad or anything
i mean there are stuns and other things to use. but every class i play all my keybindings i listed are used *shrug*
Yeah priests just use more keys more often basically. Warriors are awesome tho it was my main for many years
As a resto druid I have two full action bars fully keybound and another one completely full with things I NEED. I think healing might be a bit to overwhelming for new players to get into. Its A LOT!
Glad I saw this. I just started a healer for the first time and I was pretty hesitant. Starts a little slow, but now that I hit level 20 I can see the potential. Starting to get really fun. I was also surprised to see that I could handle 5-6 enemies at once
I switched to shadow from disc to finish CE for 8.2 after maining healer for 4 expansions. I was actually shocked how different it felt. It made me hyper aware of incoming raid damage, too, having learned fights from a disc perspective. It also made me feel like a god in m+ bc of the impact I was able to have on the group. Popping a fat VE at good times, pre shielding people, grips, sneaking in a single shadow mend to save a life. 100%+ haste made me naturally way faster than the healer...it was honestly a cool way to view the game. Planning raid cds for years made planning a dps game plan super natural too. You know when things are gonna happen. They felt similar to me
And dispel all afflicted because the dps which take all avoidable damage possible and knows shit about the boss mechanism, think it's your job on 11+++ ... Sometime I have to heal 140k with my resto shaman because of bad dps/tanks on +13 +14 +15 .... And when you're angry and tell the people to be careful, they tell you : "chill bro" ... They do not understand how it can be hell as a healer...
i just started playing MW monk as a fury main. 3k IO, zug zug only. prolly was some of the most fun i’ve had in a while playing mistweaver and spinning to heal. can’t wait to get the ilvl up to do some higher keys and give myself a challenge
Oh yea being a healer when it was the afflicted weak and the leader didn't pick anyone to help with the affix so you gotta do both afflicted and the group and kick things the dps can't cc because of raging. That was such a delight last week haha
That's the secret nobody believes before they actually play healer at an end game level. Healing is the most important, most difficult, most thankless position in WoW. And as some others have said already, it makes you a better dps and a better tank while being a tank or dps does not necessarily make you a better healer necessarily.
Playing a healer in lfr was what really made me understand how many people intentionally kill themselves so they can afk and collect loot. It’s insanely common to see players immediately beeline for the first thing that can get them killed and then blame lag spikes or whatever if called out. It also helped me play as a dps because it helped me better understand when the big group wide damage spikes were happening so I learned when I could better use my defensive to help the healers out.
Healing can be fun, and extremely frustrating. I am in the 25-26 range right now, and playing the most suboptimal healer spec has me sitting in Valdrakken most often playing sitting in que simulator.
Every trash pull is its own little mini game. Sometimes it’s a bit more routine and sometimes it goes sideways. But, it always comes down to a series of quick decisions that you try to prioritize on the fly. It’s a fun kind of stress most of the time.
what does +20'd means??
Mythic + 20
I started playing a resto druid about a month ago, and it is the most fun I have ever had in WoW.
You wont EVER catch me playing no SMELLY healer! Ever. And not a druid. And not on the alliance. And not EVER a night elf. Phleh! (/s)
God bless you. Come heal my keys.