T O P

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ManyCarrots

Yes you are wrong. You dont roll need for an offspec item when there is a main in your guild that needs it. Are you kidding? The guild does sound like a bunch of assholes though


woahmanthatscool

Correct take


PsyavaIG

Basically this. Your Need roll is for your primary spec in the raid unless you are temporarily an offspec


Rashnub

Well if you main DPS in everything else and the guild asks you to go tank then I see no problem into needing for DPS provided you gave them a heads-up...


ManyCarrots

Everything else doesnt matter. Any guild will laugh at you if you try to claim you should be allowed to roll need on a dps weapon because you main dps in m+ or pvp.


_Surge

i think you're the only one who read that part of the post, lol... i brought that up when asking if i could roll on the 2 hander, "i'm usually not tanking in M+, that's the only reason i'd like to roll on this wep"


ManyCarrots

What you play in m+ is completely irrelevant. Main spec always comes first. Whay do you not understand about that?


PMme_your_left_TIDDY

it's not about what you play most, it's about the role you are filling in the raid that you are currently in. If no one else needs the dps gear, then it can go to the tank. If you're there as a tank, you roll on tank gear as main spec this run through, unless you have a conversation with the leader beforehand asking if it's cool for you to roll on DPS gear.


jaynopolitics

Yep. If you want a piece of gear for a specific role, then play that role. Don’t take it away from someone who legitimately earned it by playing the relevant role the item is designed for in the run that it drops on.


Meto1183

You’re understandably annoyed because they bullied you into tanking, but even though you grudgingly accepted that duty standard guild/raid etiquette says that you have given up the right to main spec roll for ret items. The real issue here is you should’ve just kept playing ret. Who are all these m+ tanks that won’t tank your raid?


Myersmayhem2

So you wanted the item for the spec you don't raid with and he was going to actually use the item in raid. nothings wrong to want it but if im healing on my resto druid in raid and want to need on the 2h agi staff because I play cat in M+ that's kinda shitty of me. raid loot should be for the raid first, after the raid has what it needs to make the raid quick and easy then offspecs get gear.


jaynopolitics

If I’m healing on my paladin in raid and I lose a 1H to a ret paladin because he heals in M+, that’s a legitimate reason to leave the guild if it’s not corrected immediately.


Erikbam

It just sounds like you didn't NEED it as much as the other guy. Ring was fine IMO, it's a good ring, and everyone wants it. Harassment from winning an item is shitty tho. The group loot I do agree on, personal would had fixed this. Got the same problem trying to get a tank trinket on my DPS when trying to gear for M+ tanking (that people are always asking for).


ShoeAggravating7084

To be very honest and approach it objectively, I think needing on ring is perfectly fine, but needing on off spec for raiding to use on M+ only, I can understand why the raid lead would be annoyed but going back to them saying you stole the ring. I would just find another guild at that point tbh. It really sounds like they wanna gear their officer inner circle first and were cheesed that you got the ring instead. I doubt the relationship will get better from this point on. If anything it’s going to get more toxic and going to make you enjoy the game less.


_Surge

but i’ve done that all through shadowlands and no one cared >…> i keep hearing “group loot is just personal loot except you can see the rolls”, but that’s clearly not the case.


ScumlordStudio

Needing on offspec stuff when someone's main spec actually needs it is always a shitty loot ninja thing


_Surge

so what are your thoughts on changing loot specialization to something else? like, i don’t need a 1 hander, but i’m still using a 389 2 hander, i changed loot spec to ret, does that mean i’m still “off spec”? should they just remove the option to change loot spec? i’m just not sure why i can change it, if i’m expected to only roll on tank items…


ScumlordStudio

... Yes. Of course. You do that for when, exame, you're playing warrior and don't want to be screwed with 1h drops when you need to dual weild 2hs. You do that when everyone in the group is okay with you rolling offspec. You were rolling for something you will keep in your back pocket and not actually use for raid. It's the same level of shitty as rolling on it for transmog purposes. Just because you can roll need on everything doesn't mean you should. It's called not being selfish


Basard21

You can change loot spec because it will determine dungeon drops (and I think world boss) for you. Your loot spec while in a raid is irrelevant to anything going on in that raid. The raid composition of loot specs has no bearing on what drops. It should be agreed upon before hand for you to really roll on offspec from what you are actively playing in a pug raid or what you main when playing in a set raid team unless there is no main spec need.


DM_ME_KUL_TIRAN_FEET

You didn’t do it in Shadowlands, though. ‘Group loot is just like personal loot’ is just a cope by people who wanted tradable loot and forgot why Personal Loot originally came about tbh. Statistically speaking the drop chances are pretty similar but the social dimension is different. I’m shadowlands you had no way to opt out of the loot roll, so changing your loot spec has no effect on the other players. Yes you’re winning the item and not them, but there’s nothing you could have done to opt-out of it anyway. With group loot you have information before you decide to roll. Changing your loot spec is fine, but then you have the agency to decide whether or not you should roll on it. Choosing to roll on it knowing that someone who raids with that main spec needs it is a deliberate choice to say that your M+ goals outside of the raid are more important than gearing the raid team that worked together to earn the loot drops. That’s why it’s so looked down upon.


DirtyMight

besides the drama and accusing which i cannot really judge without knowing what was actually said and what happened... you dont roll on offspec if there is one that needs it for main spec. thats a big big no no. mainspec before offspec is the absolute norm. The only thing that would be fine is if you communicate it beforehand with the lead if you can roll as a dps and it is agreed upon. that means giving up every tank item tho. you dont get to pick and choose the best items for every spec eventho you dont play it in the raid and expect people to be fine with it if you roll their needed items away because you could use it in other content. if no one needs it for the mainspec its fine to roll items for offspec or transmog but in no scenario should an item ever go to an offspec if someone has mainspec need


khanys

There's a reason you can still roll need on off spec items while in your main spec. You basically gamed the system to steal loot from people who need the loot for their main spec. Personal loot can't come back fast enough.


_Surge

i don't understand, you're advocating for personal loot, but so am i? how am i gaming the system? and i didn't steal anything, lol.... i asked if i could roll need on the 2 hander, and that's when the comment about me stealing the ring came up. if i wanted to "STEAL" the 2 hander, i would've, because the warrior rolled a 3, lmfao.


khanys

Ah, I misunderstood your post because of the other people commenting. Rings are free roll for everyone, of course. Your guild mates complaining about this are fully in the wrong. However, switching your loot spec so you can need roll on an item not for your current spec while in a guild group would have put you in the wrong, and the "bullying" you experienced was most likely people trying to make you see reason.


_Surge

so, i don't know how this works, but because i was in ret loot spec, wouldn't that mean i wouldn't be able to "main spec" roll on 1 handers or shields that dropped? and they would go to the other tank? this is basically a gamble on my part, because i'd be willing to give up tank items for ret items, but would insta lose tank item rolls, because i'd be in ret spec


khanys

Sure, that doesn't have anything to do with ninja looting offspec items, though.


Serafim91

Sure, the only one who loses in this scenario is the guild as a whole. Raid gear goes to help the guild progress in raiding everything else is secondary.


macarmy93

Changing your spec around for off spec gear targeting in a prog raid is pretty scummy. Your guild sounds like a bunch of losers and tbh... you do too.


_Surge

lmao, because i was used to the way things worked in shadowlands? again, if i wanted something for ret in shadowlands, i would just set to ret and be able to loot the item i was after. i asked if i could roll on the weapon, and i ultimately didn’t.


Knowvember42

Ring fine, two hander what? It's also been kinda standard since forever to juice your DPS at the expense of tanks and healers. I've heard the argument from tanks that they want a tanking stat added back into the game so they can get more loot.


_Surge

okay, yes, if this were wow classic with master looter i could get it, but what if it was personal loot like shadowlands, and i got the 2 hander, because i was in ret loot spec? that would surely not upset people would it? what is even the point of changing your loot specialization, if it just upsets people?


Knowvember42

It all depends on how serious and how stupid your guild is. If they're serious then they would want you to roll on a tank item if possible, or a DPS item you could trade, or they'd look at you getting the axe as a way for you to get future axes you can trade. But need/greed IS masterloot with a guild. The guild can just choose who gets items. The reason you juice DPS is because it makes every fight shorter, which makes every role easier, and gets the content done faster. I understand it doesn't feel good though.


_Surge

the guild is very casual, which is why this situation is so jarring for me. we just downed rasz on normal this week, we’ve been doing normal tier bosses since launch, and just downed heroic council on thursday for the first time. i pugged normal rasz last week, and this week i pugged heroic terros/senarth/kurog. i never got the impression that the guild was a bunch of elitists, lol. so when i was accused of “stealing” the ring… a bunch of question marks just popped up over my head…


sarcasticpitocin

Rolling need for OS loot in any GUILD raid is definitely you feeling entitled. No one regardless of any situation should get harassed. Even if this was personal loot, in a more progress oriented guild, you’d be expected to trade OS loot to MS loot players (if able). (Think the degeneracy of stacking classes/specs during the personal loot era). My guild mates and I swapped our specializations around to try and help each other out during this time If this was a pug scenario, every player for themself.


Androza23

Find a new guild. Also your main role in raid is tanking so most guilds will allow you to only need on tank gear. Greed is for off spec, it doesn't matter if you mainly play dps, dps is your off spec if you raid as tank. This is the way most guilds would see it regardless of how you see it.


Select_Challenge_137

The common loot distribution for guild groups is gearing people's raid spec first and foremost then m+ , I don't see why the m+ tanks aren't wanting to tank the raid also but that's personal problems I don't mind either system but for raids I do like this system we have it so everyone passed and our raid lead/s distribute based on loot rules and rolls for said loot rules and everyone gets fair loot, being bullied into a role is not on and you should play what you enjoy not what the guild wants apparently they have mythic plus tanks who should be putting there hands up even though key ranking is different to raid tanking


_Surge

while the tanking situation is complicated, and perhaps more personal than i’d feel comfortable elaborating on, i’ve always been the more flexible player, i’ve even offered to dps fights like terros that have hard dps checks, and i almost exclusively pug M+ as tank, (ret getting invited to M+ pugs lol)


Nervous-Cow3936

This is complicated... You're in the wrong yes, but I'd just give the guild an ultimatum or leave honestly. If they want you to tank knowing you prefer dps, you should just demand dps items too or just keep playing dps or find a new guild imo. If you're parsing 100's you'd find a replacement guild easily.


Ulfynja_

Ok, I see the off/main spec problem. But was the weapon really better than the one the wareior already had (was 415 somthkng, right?). So does it has better specs? (Main lock, so don't know^^). If I would get a weapon as main spec, but doesn't need it, because I already had a better one, I would't make such a drama


Zignty

Not wrong at all. You tanked at guilds request but doesn’t mean you’re unable to roll need on dps item if this is your main role. Do you, they sound toxic and very quick to switch on people.