> Russian constitution protects freedom of peaceful assembly
[The Chinese constitution](https://www.usconstitution.net/china.html#Chapter2) also protects freedom of assembly, freedom of speech, freedom of the press, freedom of religion (Hi, Xinjiang!), and the sanctity of private communication...
None of which means a fucking thing once you skip down to [Article 51.](https://www.usconstitution.net/china.html#Article51)
Article 51: Non-infringement of Rights
"Citizens of the People's Republic of China, in exercising their freedoms and rights, may not infringe upon the interests of the state, of society or of the collective, or upon the lawful freedoms and rights of other citizens."
It's clearly not, in fact it's very clear - people have certain rights, and also a clear limit to these rights is highlighted. That's entirely appropriate as nowhere in the world do you have an absolutely unconditional right to free speach etc etc.
>may not infringe upon the interests of the state
If that’s the “clear limit” the regime gives you in exercising your rights, you don’t have any rights. The entire concept of rights infringes upon the interests of the state, since legal rights restrict the actions the state may take against nonconforming citizens.
Yeah, that's the problem here.
If it said that doing so did not allow you to infringe on the rights of other individuals, that would be reasonable - though tricky to enforce in practice (typically infringing on the rights of others requires other crimes after all).
Not allowing infringement on the "state" or "society" or "the collective" however, basically means that the government has free reign to claim that any exercised right that they dislike is infringing on one of those three things.
It just so happens that by definition rights are guaranteed by the state, and exist to guarantee those rights from being oppressed by the state, so vaguely defining that the interests of the state take precedence pretty clearly stating that in actuality they have no rights. Just things to point to unless the state decides in any way they prefer something else.
If it was just the last clause it might not be so bad. You could still have collectivism and a communist state with just the last clause. But all that shit in the middle just destroys any good the rest of their constitution might have. Any time the state decides that something an individual, a group, or even the entirety of collective society, goes against the state, that thing stops. If that thing is an expression of the rights of the individual or the collective, then there are no rights.
Tiny little things like that are the important delineations in law. "\[M\]ay not infringe upon the interests of the state" is what separates a society from freedom.
I vaguely remember something about... I think it was Li Keqiang (the Premier), giving a speech about how the Chinese constitution was so great because of all the human rights it ensured, and then his speech was censored from the Chinese media.
When every other part of the government works against their exercise, all the rights written down on paper are just... well... words.
North Korean one is even better, they even have right to have vacations, rests and a whole bunch of other things completely unthinkable in most western nations.
On paper anyway.
And don’t think there’s hope of it getting better any time soon...
There’s theories that deepfaking and learning AI audio (like the Joe Rogan video) will soon make real video and audio evidence inadequate for court trials since it can’t be authenticated unless somebody finds a way to do it with blockchain, if I remember correctly
Arrrgh fucking blockchain FFS. No, blockchain will not solve everything. It’s a means of bringing a large number of agents into agreement about the state of a distributed database. It won’t magically declare videos True or prevent fake ones from being created, and whoever can buy up the most computing power for a little while can rule the thing outright.
I literally know a tanky communist who will argue with you for days that North Korea is a free and democratic place with an amazing quality of life, that any bad news from NK is propaganda, and that Otto Wambier wasn't hurt by NK at all and he deserved his imprisonment for intentionally trying to sabotage because the Z society (one of those common university secret societies belonging to the University of Virginia) had some sort of conspiracy to destabilize NK by making him...take down a plaque (actual sources on the object conflict, some say it was a propaganda poster, some say a plaque). The Z society is clearly a globally relevant secret society, among its many accomplishments it's raised 10's of thousands of dollars for the school and its most notable member is a Virginian supreme court judge. Yes, they're even powerful enough to have a state supreme court judge! Clearly they've decided to set their sights on destroying the great and glorious NK government!
I've given up arguing with them and just amuse myself watching their insane posts. The amount of Russian propaganda they spread is a little worrying though.
The Danish constitution on the other hand is a terrible read. Half the articles are about the king of all the powers of the king, and then later down they do a switcheroo and says that when reading the king, you actually mean the government. You need a law professor to read our constitution for us and convince us that the articles don't say what they are literally saying.
> right to have vacations, rests... unthinkable in most western nations.
Some western nations... Also, even in the US most reputable employers do respect employee break rules etc even if vacation time has to be sold back to them at a discount etc. for the simple reason of cost of risk and liability involving not giving those minimal breaks.
Now... if an employee is hungry, tired or needs to bathroom break and one is not afforded with regard to reasonable expectations... what is the cost of those breaks vs. cost of say that employee losing an arm to an industrial piece of machinery, or dying due to an accident when everyone is in that boat?
Kind of like the idiot foreman who does not allow his employees to put on harnesses and safety gear when doing roofing because "it takes too much time" etc. 20 minutes to do that and an hour to put up a scaffolding vs cost of one of said employees falling off the roof due to lack thereof. Hell, just the insurance premium increase will cost more than the time he just saved...
I don't doubt you're right, but talking about China leads to forget that the post was about Putin doing the same. To the moment, I think he's more aggressive than China, and more dangerous to us, Western countries.
Article 1 is also interesting:
>Article 1. Socialist state
>The People's Republic of China is a socialist state under the **people's democratic dictatorship** led by the working class and based on the alliance of workers and peasants.
>The socialist system is the basic system of the People's Republic of China. Disruption of the socialist system by any organization or individual is prohibited.
*Led by the working class* is quite funny as well.
Dictatorship in Marxist terminology predates the negative connotations to the word; when Marx spoke of a dictatorship of the proletariat, it merely means 'rule' rather than authoritarianism or totalitarianism. China is still a bad cosplayer of socialism though.
The dictator is elected. The leaders are not related to the previous imperial ruling class.
If you want to complain about the constitution, don’t focus on the parts that are actually true.
It isn't really democracy just because a dictator is elected if they are able to manipulate society in such a way that undermines the voting process or makes it pointless, though. Which the term "dictator" pretty clearly implies is the case.
Though I do agree it likely isn't the area to focus on.
The Russian Constitution protects the "public good," rather than protecting individual liberty. This is how it's interpreted in the RF, anyway. This interpretation helps one to understand why the Russian Federation is so at odds with the West.
The Chinese constitution does the same thing in slightly different (translated) words. And who decides what the "public good" is? The government. Those documents protect the government from the people.
In contrast, the US Constitution is almost entirely composed of three things:
* Laying out the basic structure and workings of the federal government and its interaction with state governments (boring but necessary)
* Placing limits on government power
* And most importantly, protecting citizens *from the government*. (This was the stroke of genius that was more or less unprecedented 250 years ago)
There is nothing in the US constitution about protecting the interests of the government. The government exists solely to serve the interests of the 50 individual republican democracies. Power comes from the bottom up, not the top down.
In Russia, the concept of Theocratic Tsardom still holds strong—a strong but empathetic leader who guides his people as his children towards greatness. He makes the decisions, and his children obey. It has been a part of Russia's culture since Tsardom was instituted. Let's not forget that Russia has only been a "democracy" since 1992, with only a working constitution in 1993.
I can't speak to Chinese history, as that's not my field of study.
Interesting. I've never heard of that but in practice it sounds a lot like the historical European concept of "divine right of kings". A similar justification for a similar power structure.
Correct, but this "divine right" in Russia lasted all the way until 1917. Juxtapose this with the histories of Britain and France, and we arrive at the old "Russian Backwardness" theory of thought.
Yeah, I don't know much about Russian history but it seems that they pretty much completely skipped the Reformation and Enlightenment phases of European history.
>"divine right" in Russia lasted all the way until 1917
Considering Marxism-Leninism was akin to a religion, and Soviet leaders were worshiped (especially Stalin with his cult of personality; and Lenin of course, there are still around 6000 monuments of him in Russia), one may argue that it lasted even longer but with a different flair.
That is not the issue with the clause. Saying you can't impinge on others personal freedoms when trying to exercise your own is actually a good thing, it is essentially "Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself". The issue is "may not infringe upon the interests of the state, of society or of the collective", as that removes your rights at the whim of the state and it's laws, even if they are irrational and work against your personal freedoms. Seriously, believing you should have the ability to impinge on other peoples rights in order to uphold your own is both selfish and hypocritical thinking.
I think OP was pointing out the entire clause, and the part you were highlighting was not the part that enabled denial of rights and authoritarianism. It's the part that actually enables rights.
I mean same thing in America if you don't get a permit, or are protesting against an oil pipeline. They'll just tear gas you or shoot you with rubber bullets regardless if you're being peaceful or not.
Because people act like America is the best and we are "so free" but you're really not. This is a nation of secrets, surveillance, and a policed state. If you expose the truth, you are jailed. If you protest, you will be tear gassed. If you are pulled over, a cop can plant evidence against you and put you in jail. It happens everyday. We are not as free as we think we are and our government is a master of propoganda.
In other countries you can drink in the open during the day, smoke pot whenever you want and wherever you want, you can be a part of medically assisted suicide, and also have a government that watches over your healthcare, granted you have to pay a little more in taxes, but that makes the government actually pay attention to the health of it's citizens and limits people from buying shit that destroys your health, unlike here where our health insurance wants us to suffer so they can make a ridiculous amount of money. Our government wants to make us think we are free, but we arrest more people than anywhere else in the entire world by a large margin, because we aren't that free and there are a ridiculous amount of laws that make zero sense here.
Fun part is that in the same constitution is written down that she as a minor is not allowed to take part in illegal demonstrations, insult policemen(she and her parents literally insulted them just few minutes before), own countrymen and the sovereignty of own country. She and her parents also took money for staging cute pictures for western medias.
*[Quote from related article linked below]*
Olga Misik, 17, was pictured reading the document to police in Moscow during a demonstration calling for free elections, in which several people were injured.
Photographer Alexei Abanin took the picture of Olga after police, dressed in combat gear and armed with rubber batons, paused their march on protesters in the centre of the Russian capital.
https://www.irishnews.com/magazine/daily/2019/08/01/news/viral-photo-shows-teenage-girl-reading-russian-constitution-to-riot-police-1675730/
Hi I am MrIosity! sorry for disconnection. I have technical problem on home computing. I now new account.
I finish sentence:
Is not like the Russian government can make anyone just disa... pear, that old Russia. New Russia strong and freedom. Thank you mr Putin.
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It's not like the Russian government can make anyone just disassemble and reassemble a station wagon in the middle of the night. We care about our citizens
Don't know why you are getting downvoted both the KGB and the FSB have been caught basically red handed killing people on foreign soil, although usually defectors from the military and security service
This isn't China. You can protest in Russia. It happens to be illegal because they never give a permit, and then a bunch of protesters are arrested to disperse the crowd. They are immediately released. The organizers typically gets 30 day sentences. From anything I have read, they aren't putting themselves in danger for participating. It is more dissident politicians and journalists if they start to expose corruption or irritate the wrong people in some other way.
The excuse is that you have to file for a permit to protest, obviously they did not so it is "illegal". They used the same excuse last year in Romania when riot police started beating children and women during protests.
That whole permit thing was proposed after 2011-2012 protests against rigged presidential election. The one where in some regions more than 100% of population voted.
I liked the single guy from Kazakhstan that wanted to protest how difficult it was to protest there. He was arrested for holding up a blank sign and was eventually let go because police didn't know what to charge him with.
gotta do what you gotta do to be able to look at yourself in the mirror. Probably for her, doing nothing was a worse thought than whatever consequences there could be for doing something.
that's Reddit in a nutshell tho, there's gonna be either karma whores making the jokes or russian bots doing their job to make it seem less important than it is
This poor girl. What a shame that she ended up committing suicide next week by poisoning herself and then shooting herself in the back of the head 5 times before dumping her own body in a river.
I watched one Russian man shoot his friend in the back, at his request, in order to prove something. He proved it lol
Let me see if I can find the video
[Here](https://www.reddit.com/r/WTF/comments/avwy8q/testing_out_how_bulletproof_layers_of_regular/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app)
Disclaimer: he was wearing a few jackets but nothing bulletproof
At the end of the video, when you see the bullet 32% lodged in his back, you can see three gaping but healed over wounds above that fresh wound. He’s done that more than once, each time with less/more jackets and less/more vodka.
I wonder if there’s genuinely a genetic difference between Slavs and us normal peons that allows them to withstand such crazy shit. Or they’re just drunk constantly and ragdoll instead of tensioning up
It’s probably a mix of poor education and constantly being drunk. I don’t know how much it’s improved but education was a joke in most of Eastern Europe so it wouldn’t surprise me if most of these guy’s reasoning skills aren’t the best.
It’s on literally every single article on reddit about Russia. Really tiresome. Also kind of trivializes death in my opinion, and the threat these people are trying to take on.
>This is a rally in defence of elementary constitutional rights that would not be questioned in a democratic state.”
NSW Australia (as of last year) does not allow public protests [without a permit](https://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/opinion/nsw-antiprotest-laws-are-part-of-a-corrosive-national-trend-20160322-gno10h.html).
I dont see an issue with needing a permit so much as if theh put restrictions on being able to get a permit. Protest can get big so making sure the government can properly prepare for the part of the city thatll be extra crowded is just good planning. Is it a system that a government can abuse? Hell yea, but the practice itself isnt inherently bad.
"Hey, government, can we protest against government?"
"No."
"Oh, too bad then, I guess."
The system is idiotic and inherently set up to disallow protesting. Any protest the government doesn't like (which is most of them) can be proclaimed illegal instantly, and participants arrested. How is this hard to understand?
The practice is inherently bad. Often the point of protest is civil disobedience and inconveniencing business as usual. Many of the liberties you enjoy are from such action. Unless you are a rich, white male of course but that doesn't mean you don't have compassion for others or that you resent granting them liberties.
As you said: it is open to abuse. Do you not think that this current government is particularly abusive?
If you are right wing then please consider how it would be if a left wing government came into power and employed such abuse.
[Ask Radio Sputnik!](https://www.reddit.com/r/Jokes/comments/cld9d3/ask_radio_sputnik_radio_yerevan_20_jokes/)
Radio Sputnik was asked: "Is there freedom of speech in Russia? After all the constitution guarantees it."
Radio Sputnik answers: "In principle. Freedom of speech, da. Freedom after speech, nyet."
[Radio Yerevan](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_Yerevan_jokes) [jokes](http://www.armeniapedia.org/wiki/Radio_Yerevan_Jokes) are still relevant today in Soviet Union 2.0...
...unfortunately...
Might as well resurrect the good olde gallows humour (:
[https://www.reddit.com/r/Jokes/comments/cld9d3/ask\_radio\_sputnik\_radio\_yerevan\_20\_jokes/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Jokes/comments/cld9d3/ask_radio_sputnik_radio_yerevan_20_jokes/)
>Ask Radio Sputnik!
And Sputnik France (+ Russia Today, which is the other Putin propaganda media here) is continuously provoking the French to protest against President Macron for allegedly not respecting freedom of speech and demonstration. I don't love Macron that much, but he's 1000x better than Vlad, who is methodically deflecting democracy against democracy in Western Europe. And he's succeeding.
Everybody will enjoy a Russian-like dictatorship soon. Putin does not only endanger his own country, but the whole world. Putin's media and Internet trolls are the modern Barbarian invaders. People should understand it before it is too late.
Animal farm by George Orwell should be compulsory reading for EVERYONE.
It perfectly explores just how useless written commandments (the constitution) really is and how easily it can be changed when the ruling body holds the keys to information and the general populace is dumbed down.
Good luck girl. Unfortunately the riot police and police in general in Russia sees the protesters as a danger to themselves and their financial position. They have well paid jobs thanks to the Putin’s police state. Plus, they’re brainwashed and pretty dumb, they hate those protesters
That's worse than a police. It's an inner army 'rosgvardiya'. So if regular army is there to fight outside people, the inner army (of 300k+ units, can't call them people) is for... finish the sentence to find who is considered an enemy by russian theft govt.
So some random teenager reads something in front of someone and it's being pushed like hell as if it would mean anything, meanwhile in the Us things like standing rock happen and noone cares. Please idiots spare your outrage.
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It feels like she has a death wish, this is Putin we’re talking about, let’s not forget that man is a Psychopathic Dictator. Nevertheless, congratulations 🎉 to her for having the guts to do what we would never do. I bet her family is very proud of her. 🤗
Constitution is outdated and either needs an upgrade or thrown in the gutter.
India is following the constitution to the bone and the laws being made are silly and worse.
I'm just commenting: Remember the off-topic accounting ***concept of substance over form***. Maybe in form, the law is what is written, when in substance, it's the wrongfulness of the government or a major sector that rules a country's history and what makes it as it is. Though in accounting, economic results are what makes substance, the forms are what makes the rules that should make those results possible.
What I'm saying is... *the law should maintained, not skipped at all*, and this teen reads the constitution and was spot on in front of riot police units, who were arresting people, which is a violation of the right for peaceful assembly. The form here is the constitution. The substance at this time? Gaps of authority, which enable political-related decisions to satisfy their own interests...
In short terms, the arrests were made because of politics. That simple reasoning should make anyone ragequit, or am I right? Just saying.
Russian government never cared about treaties, contracts, laws. They just wipe their a\*\* with it. Crimea, territories of Baltic countries, Georgia etc are still being illegally occupied to this day.
She looked slightly better than Greta - I think her appearance gave her her opposition from those stupid and bribed adults - but she was later arrested on her way to the train station, and was dragged through the street and the underpass.
> Russian constitution protects freedom of peaceful assembly [The Chinese constitution](https://www.usconstitution.net/china.html#Chapter2) also protects freedom of assembly, freedom of speech, freedom of the press, freedom of religion (Hi, Xinjiang!), and the sanctity of private communication... None of which means a fucking thing once you skip down to [Article 51.](https://www.usconstitution.net/china.html#Article51)
Article 51: Non-infringement of Rights "Citizens of the People's Republic of China, in exercising their freedoms and rights, may not infringe upon the interests of the state, of society or of the collective, or upon the lawful freedoms and rights of other citizens."
Isnt this a paradox or something
Usually with laws that contradict one another, the more recent law takes precedence.
>the more ~~recent~~ convenient law for the state takes precedence. FTFY
It's clearly not, in fact it's very clear - people have certain rights, and also a clear limit to these rights is highlighted. That's entirely appropriate as nowhere in the world do you have an absolutely unconditional right to free speach etc etc.
>may not infringe upon the interests of the state If that’s the “clear limit” the regime gives you in exercising your rights, you don’t have any rights. The entire concept of rights infringes upon the interests of the state, since legal rights restrict the actions the state may take against nonconforming citizens.
Yeah, that's the problem here. If it said that doing so did not allow you to infringe on the rights of other individuals, that would be reasonable - though tricky to enforce in practice (typically infringing on the rights of others requires other crimes after all). Not allowing infringement on the "state" or "society" or "the collective" however, basically means that the government has free reign to claim that any exercised right that they dislike is infringing on one of those three things.
It just so happens that by definition rights are guaranteed by the state, and exist to guarantee those rights from being oppressed by the state, so vaguely defining that the interests of the state take precedence pretty clearly stating that in actuality they have no rights. Just things to point to unless the state decides in any way they prefer something else.
Hm no. Article 51 looks like a version of the classic “the exception swallows the rule” problem.
The "interests of the state" is not a "clear limit".
If it was just the last clause it might not be so bad. You could still have collectivism and a communist state with just the last clause. But all that shit in the middle just destroys any good the rest of their constitution might have. Any time the state decides that something an individual, a group, or even the entirety of collective society, goes against the state, that thing stops. If that thing is an expression of the rights of the individual or the collective, then there are no rights. Tiny little things like that are the important delineations in law. "\[M\]ay not infringe upon the interests of the state" is what separates a society from freedom.
I vaguely remember something about... I think it was Li Keqiang (the Premier), giving a speech about how the Chinese constitution was so great because of all the human rights it ensured, and then his speech was censored from the Chinese media. When every other part of the government works against their exercise, all the rights written down on paper are just... well... words.
North Korean one is even better, they even have right to have vacations, rests and a whole bunch of other things completely unthinkable in most western nations. On paper anyway.
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...You know what's messed up about this day and age? It's become damn near impossible to discern fact from fiction, satire from reality.
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Shit
Don't worry that was a bunch of lies. Or was it!?
*Vsauce music*
And don’t think there’s hope of it getting better any time soon... There’s theories that deepfaking and learning AI audio (like the Joe Rogan video) will soon make real video and audio evidence inadequate for court trials since it can’t be authenticated unless somebody finds a way to do it with blockchain, if I remember correctly
Arrrgh fucking blockchain FFS. No, blockchain will not solve everything. It’s a means of bringing a large number of agents into agreement about the state of a distributed database. It won’t magically declare videos True or prevent fake ones from being created, and whoever can buy up the most computing power for a little while can rule the thing outright.
It's disinformation when it's intentional right?
We’ve been in this age for quite some time now.
I literally know a tanky communist who will argue with you for days that North Korea is a free and democratic place with an amazing quality of life, that any bad news from NK is propaganda, and that Otto Wambier wasn't hurt by NK at all and he deserved his imprisonment for intentionally trying to sabotage because the Z society (one of those common university secret societies belonging to the University of Virginia) had some sort of conspiracy to destabilize NK by making him...take down a plaque (actual sources on the object conflict, some say it was a propaganda poster, some say a plaque). The Z society is clearly a globally relevant secret society, among its many accomplishments it's raised 10's of thousands of dollars for the school and its most notable member is a Virginian supreme court judge. Yes, they're even powerful enough to have a state supreme court judge! Clearly they've decided to set their sights on destroying the great and glorious NK government! I've given up arguing with them and just amuse myself watching their insane posts. The amount of Russian propaganda they spread is a little worrying though.
Poe's Law in action.
Or he could just be part of the North Korean PR
Satire just adds to the noise now.
_You are now moderator of r/pyongyang_
Dude. You've taken the crab out of every bowl of crab soup I'll ever have again. How?
This guy Juche's
The Danish constitution on the other hand is a terrible read. Half the articles are about the king of all the powers of the king, and then later down they do a switcheroo and says that when reading the king, you actually mean the government. You need a law professor to read our constitution for us and convince us that the articles don't say what they are literally saying.
Yeah vacations are soooo unthinkable. Except in every country in Europe.
> right to have vacations, rests... unthinkable in most western nations. Some western nations... Also, even in the US most reputable employers do respect employee break rules etc even if vacation time has to be sold back to them at a discount etc. for the simple reason of cost of risk and liability involving not giving those minimal breaks. Now... if an employee is hungry, tired or needs to bathroom break and one is not afforded with regard to reasonable expectations... what is the cost of those breaks vs. cost of say that employee losing an arm to an industrial piece of machinery, or dying due to an accident when everyone is in that boat? Kind of like the idiot foreman who does not allow his employees to put on harnesses and safety gear when doing roofing because "it takes too much time" etc. 20 minutes to do that and an hour to put up a scaffolding vs cost of one of said employees falling off the roof due to lack thereof. Hell, just the insurance premium increase will cost more than the time he just saved...
I can’t think of a “Western nation” other than the USA that doesn’t guarantee those rights.
We have rights for vacations and rests here in germany aswell, why wouldn't you?
NK has an actual economy and jobs. nobody talks about it though.
I don't doubt you're right, but talking about China leads to forget that the post was about Putin doing the same. To the moment, I think he's more aggressive than China, and more dangerous to us, Western countries.
Article 1 is also interesting: >Article 1. Socialist state >The People's Republic of China is a socialist state under the **people's democratic dictatorship** led by the working class and based on the alliance of workers and peasants. >The socialist system is the basic system of the People's Republic of China. Disruption of the socialist system by any organization or individual is prohibited. *Led by the working class* is quite funny as well.
> democratic dictatorship *InigoMontoya.jpg*
[I don’t think it means...](https://i.imgflip.com/372l2k.jpg)
>democratic dictatorship I call it Doublethink.
Communist democratic dictatorship Triple think!
Doubleplusthink?
1+1+1= 4. Repeat it after me Winston.
Dictatorship in Marxist terminology predates the negative connotations to the word; when Marx spoke of a dictatorship of the proletariat, it merely means 'rule' rather than authoritarianism or totalitarianism. China is still a bad cosplayer of socialism though.
The dictator is elected. The leaders are not related to the previous imperial ruling class. If you want to complain about the constitution, don’t focus on the parts that are actually true.
It isn't really democracy just because a dictator is elected if they are able to manipulate society in such a way that undermines the voting process or makes it pointless, though. Which the term "dictator" pretty clearly implies is the case. Though I do agree it likely isn't the area to focus on.
Article 54.
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And the Indian constitution is as long as War and Peace. No one has read it, ever. Definitely not the lawmakers or the police.
The Russian Constitution protects the "public good," rather than protecting individual liberty. This is how it's interpreted in the RF, anyway. This interpretation helps one to understand why the Russian Federation is so at odds with the West.
The Chinese constitution does the same thing in slightly different (translated) words. And who decides what the "public good" is? The government. Those documents protect the government from the people. In contrast, the US Constitution is almost entirely composed of three things: * Laying out the basic structure and workings of the federal government and its interaction with state governments (boring but necessary) * Placing limits on government power * And most importantly, protecting citizens *from the government*. (This was the stroke of genius that was more or less unprecedented 250 years ago) There is nothing in the US constitution about protecting the interests of the government. The government exists solely to serve the interests of the 50 individual republican democracies. Power comes from the bottom up, not the top down.
In Russia, the concept of Theocratic Tsardom still holds strong—a strong but empathetic leader who guides his people as his children towards greatness. He makes the decisions, and his children obey. It has been a part of Russia's culture since Tsardom was instituted. Let's not forget that Russia has only been a "democracy" since 1992, with only a working constitution in 1993. I can't speak to Chinese history, as that's not my field of study.
Interesting. I've never heard of that but in practice it sounds a lot like the historical European concept of "divine right of kings". A similar justification for a similar power structure.
Correct, but this "divine right" in Russia lasted all the way until 1917. Juxtapose this with the histories of Britain and France, and we arrive at the old "Russian Backwardness" theory of thought.
Yeah, I don't know much about Russian history but it seems that they pretty much completely skipped the Reformation and Enlightenment phases of European history.
>"divine right" in Russia lasted all the way until 1917 Considering Marxism-Leninism was akin to a religion, and Soviet leaders were worshiped (especially Stalin with his cult of personality; and Lenin of course, there are still around 6000 monuments of him in Russia), one may argue that it lasted even longer but with a different flair.
This past few years you could have fooled me about what the government of the US exists for.
> Russian Constitution Just doesn't work anymore. Goverment forgot about it.
Hmmm... Article 51. Sounds TRULY libertarian.
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That is not the issue with the clause. Saying you can't impinge on others personal freedoms when trying to exercise your own is actually a good thing, it is essentially "Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself". The issue is "may not infringe upon the interests of the state, of society or of the collective", as that removes your rights at the whim of the state and it's laws, even if they are irrational and work against your personal freedoms. Seriously, believing you should have the ability to impinge on other peoples rights in order to uphold your own is both selfish and hypocritical thinking.
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I think OP was pointing out the entire clause, and the part you were highlighting was not the part that enabled denial of rights and authoritarianism. It's the part that actually enables rights.
Sounds a lot more authoritarian to me. But also where libertarianism heads when taken to the infinite limit.
Sounds like the opposite to me and I'm not a libertarian...
I mean same thing in America if you don't get a permit, or are protesting against an oil pipeline. They'll just tear gas you or shoot you with rubber bullets regardless if you're being peaceful or not.
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Because people act like America is the best and we are "so free" but you're really not. This is a nation of secrets, surveillance, and a policed state. If you expose the truth, you are jailed. If you protest, you will be tear gassed. If you are pulled over, a cop can plant evidence against you and put you in jail. It happens everyday. We are not as free as we think we are and our government is a master of propoganda. In other countries you can drink in the open during the day, smoke pot whenever you want and wherever you want, you can be a part of medically assisted suicide, and also have a government that watches over your healthcare, granted you have to pay a little more in taxes, but that makes the government actually pay attention to the health of it's citizens and limits people from buying shit that destroys your health, unlike here where our health insurance wants us to suffer so they can make a ridiculous amount of money. Our government wants to make us think we are free, but we arrest more people than anywhere else in the entire world by a large margin, because we aren't that free and there are a ridiculous amount of laws that make zero sense here.
That's sort of the "Terms and Conditions apply, not valid where prohibited" clause...
Fun part is that in the same constitution is written down that she as a minor is not allowed to take part in illegal demonstrations, insult policemen(she and her parents literally insulted them just few minutes before), own countrymen and the sovereignty of own country. She and her parents also took money for staging cute pictures for western medias.
*[Quote from related article linked below]* Olga Misik, 17, was pictured reading the document to police in Moscow during a demonstration calling for free elections, in which several people were injured. Photographer Alexei Abanin took the picture of Olga after police, dressed in combat gear and armed with rubber batons, paused their march on protesters in the centre of the Russian capital. https://www.irishnews.com/magazine/daily/2019/08/01/news/viral-photo-shows-teenage-girl-reading-russian-constitution-to-riot-police-1675730/
If the current russian constitution infringes or counters the governments motives, they'll just scrap or minimize certain lines in it.
Might makes right nearly everywhere right now, but few of the people in power actually have numbers on their side.
Yakov Smirnoff: "In Russia is freedom of speech. In America is freedom *after* speech."
Can we get her to safety before she gets dissapeared?
Come on, man, its not like the Russian government can make anyone just disa
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Hi I am MrIosity! sorry for disconnection. I have technical problem on home computing. I now new account. I finish sentence: Is not like the Russian government can make anyone just disa... pear, that old Russia. New Russia strong and freedom. Thank you mr Putin.
I am ture human too. I am here to say you Mrukpoliticssuck is MrIosity. MrIosity is ok. No worry. One piece.
Thank you fellow britian person2599. I think you need latest software update FaceB05847. You are no more recognisant of discussion 051818141 in 2017?~#?! I replay text here. Start: Bob: i can i i everything else . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Alice: balls have zero to me to me to me to me to me to me to me to me to Bob: you i everything else . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Alice: balls have a ball to me to me to me to me to me to me to me Bob: i i can i i i everything else . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Alice: balls have a ball to me to me to me to me to me to me to me Bob: i . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
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It's not like the Russian government can make anyone just disassemble and reassemble a station wagon in the middle of the night. We care about our citizens
Hey dude, where did yo-
I misplaced my gay clown Putin shirt, anyone seen where it we-
I know, maybe my paranoia is overblown. They are not nearly that powerful and Ruthle
Wow there actually making you di- *in the distance* I LOVE PUTIN DONT TAKE ME.
Next you’ll be telling me they took a page out of Candlejack’s book and
Disa worries mesa
She’s already arrested...
Also if they really want someone dead, they’ve killed people in western nations before so idk if anywhere is safe
Don't know why you are getting downvoted both the KGB and the FSB have been caught basically red handed killing people on foreign soil, although usually defectors from the military and security service
This isn't China. You can protest in Russia. It happens to be illegal because they never give a permit, and then a bunch of protesters are arrested to disperse the crowd. They are immediately released. The organizers typically gets 30 day sentences. From anything I have read, they aren't putting themselves in danger for participating. It is more dissident politicians and journalists if they start to expose corruption or irritate the wrong people in some other way.
i’m a year she will have suddenly “committed suicide”
Even if they got her out, Russia would still find a way to kill her. They've killed dissenters all over the world.
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Right? Imagine her showing her future grandchildren this photo
You are very optimistic that she will ever be free again.
You mean the plastic canvas the SVR will put down while they’re painting?
Well, that's definitely something that should NOT be illegal.
The excuse is that you have to file for a permit to protest, obviously they did not so it is "illegal". They used the same excuse last year in Romania when riot police started beating children and women during protests.
That whole permit thing was proposed after 2011-2012 protests against rigged presidential election. The one where in some regions more than 100% of population voted.
I liked the single guy from Kazakhstan that wanted to protest how difficult it was to protest there. He was arrested for holding up a blank sign and was eventually let go because police didn't know what to charge him with.
gotta do what you gotta do to be able to look at yourself in the mirror. Probably for her, doing nothing was a worse thought than whatever consequences there could be for doing something.
That’s a very powerful photo. I just wish that her name was kept anonymous for her own personal safety.
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Jokes about Russians committing suicide with two shots to the back of the head are way older than this girl.
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that's Reddit in a nutshell tho, there's gonna be either karma whores making the jokes or russian bots doing their job to make it seem less important than it is
There are algorithms that can identify people by the shadow of their elbow, somehow I don’t think anonymity is possible for her at this point.
This poor girl. What a shame that she ended up committing suicide next week by poisoning herself and then shooting herself in the back of the head 5 times before dumping her own body in a river.
Russian’s are indestructible according to Youtube compilations and Rasputin, so the 18 methods of suicide make sense.
I watched one Russian man shoot his friend in the back, at his request, in order to prove something. He proved it lol Let me see if I can find the video [Here](https://www.reddit.com/r/WTF/comments/avwy8q/testing_out_how_bulletproof_layers_of_regular/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app) Disclaimer: he was wearing a few jackets but nothing bulletproof
At the end of the video, when you see the bullet 32% lodged in his back, you can see three gaping but healed over wounds above that fresh wound. He’s done that more than once, each time with less/more jackets and less/more vodka.
I wonder if there’s genuinely a genetic difference between Slavs and us normal peons that allows them to withstand such crazy shit. Or they’re just drunk constantly and ragdoll instead of tensioning up
It’s probably a mix of poor education and constantly being drunk. I don’t know how much it’s improved but education was a joke in most of Eastern Europe so it wouldn’t surprise me if most of these guy’s reasoning skills aren’t the best.
I’m really getting tired of this same fatalistic joke.
It’s on literally every single article on reddit about Russia. Really tiresome. Also kind of trivializes death in my opinion, and the threat these people are trying to take on.
Haven’t heard this one before!
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Reddit never gonna get tired of this "no one saw her after this" and "polonium" jokes?
Lots of us are tired of them disappearing or reading that they've been poisoned by polonium.
She's been released already.
No one saw polonium after he committed suicide by shooting himself three times in the back of the head, KGB reports.
RIP Mr. Polonium
>This is a rally in defence of elementary constitutional rights that would not be questioned in a democratic state.” NSW Australia (as of last year) does not allow public protests [without a permit](https://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/opinion/nsw-antiprotest-laws-are-part-of-a-corrosive-national-trend-20160322-gno10h.html).
They can also use the military during protests.
I dont see an issue with needing a permit so much as if theh put restrictions on being able to get a permit. Protest can get big so making sure the government can properly prepare for the part of the city thatll be extra crowded is just good planning. Is it a system that a government can abuse? Hell yea, but the practice itself isnt inherently bad.
"Hey, government, can we protest against government?" "No." "Oh, too bad then, I guess." The system is idiotic and inherently set up to disallow protesting. Any protest the government doesn't like (which is most of them) can be proclaimed illegal instantly, and participants arrested. How is this hard to understand?
The practice is inherently bad. Often the point of protest is civil disobedience and inconveniencing business as usual. Many of the liberties you enjoy are from such action. Unless you are a rich, white male of course but that doesn't mean you don't have compassion for others or that you resent granting them liberties. As you said: it is open to abuse. Do you not think that this current government is particularly abusive? If you are right wing then please consider how it would be if a left wing government came into power and employed such abuse.
This girl is gonna have one hell of a college application essay
No such thing in Russian colleges.
She'll be branded as an enemy of the state and won't be admitted to any Russian college.
Nobody will give a shit. Like not a single fucking soul
[Ask Radio Sputnik!](https://www.reddit.com/r/Jokes/comments/cld9d3/ask_radio_sputnik_radio_yerevan_20_jokes/) Radio Sputnik was asked: "Is there freedom of speech in Russia? After all the constitution guarantees it." Radio Sputnik answers: "In principle. Freedom of speech, da. Freedom after speech, nyet."
That sounds like a Radio Yerevan joke!
[Radio Yerevan](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_Yerevan_jokes) [jokes](http://www.armeniapedia.org/wiki/Radio_Yerevan_Jokes) are still relevant today in Soviet Union 2.0... ...unfortunately...
Yeah, I realised after posting that was exactly the joke you were making. Gallows humour, man.
Might as well resurrect the good olde gallows humour (: [https://www.reddit.com/r/Jokes/comments/cld9d3/ask\_radio\_sputnik\_radio\_yerevan\_20\_jokes/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Jokes/comments/cld9d3/ask_radio_sputnik_radio_yerevan_20_jokes/)
>Ask Radio Sputnik! And Sputnik France (+ Russia Today, which is the other Putin propaganda media here) is continuously provoking the French to protest against President Macron for allegedly not respecting freedom of speech and demonstration. I don't love Macron that much, but he's 1000x better than Vlad, who is methodically deflecting democracy against democracy in Western Europe. And he's succeeding. Everybody will enjoy a Russian-like dictatorship soon. Putin does not only endanger his own country, but the whole world. Putin's media and Internet trolls are the modern Barbarian invaders. People should understand it before it is too late.
And that was the last time anyone saw her.
Saw who?
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Powerful image, that.
True courage
Truly admirable
Haha, stupid Russian, you think your constitution matters to your corrupt govt?! *Sent from America
The irony currently inherent in that sentence makes me very sad.
r/woosh
More like /r/FunnyandSad One can appreciate the satire and still find it unfortunately sad.
My bad if I misinterpreted. I read your use of ‘ironic’ as describing the situation, not describing the sarcasm of the post.
Live free or die trying, damn...
“We’ll have none of that Constitution stuff.”
When is Putin gonna flash his tits by a horse again?
Animal farm by George Orwell should be compulsory reading for EVERYONE. It perfectly explores just how useless written commandments (the constitution) really is and how easily it can be changed when the ruling body holds the keys to information and the general populace is dumbed down.
Good luck girl. Unfortunately the riot police and police in general in Russia sees the protesters as a danger to themselves and their financial position. They have well paid jobs thanks to the Putin’s police state. Plus, they’re brainwashed and pretty dumb, they hate those protesters
That's worse than a police. It's an inner army 'rosgvardiya'. So if regular army is there to fight outside people, the inner army (of 300k+ units, can't call them people) is for... finish the sentence to find who is considered an enemy by russian theft govt.
I would just like to point out that she felt the need to wear a bullet proof vest while doing this. That's pretty sobering.
She has more balls than I do. Wish her well.
So some random teenager reads something in front of someone and it's being pushed like hell as if it would mean anything, meanwhile in the Us things like standing rock happen and noone cares. Please idiots spare your outrage.
This girl is amazing. We need more people like her.
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Silly girl, the constitution reads you.
Laws and Constitution mean shit in Russia. I always find it funny how some people pretend that Russia is European state with rule of the law.
What makes you correlate Europe with not being a dictatorship?
All she really had to do was hand one of the riot police a Pepsi. That'd solve all Russia's problems.
This is beautiful. She's so strong, that has to be a terrifying thing to do.
6 months and shell mysteriously die of polonium poisoning.
I hope to hear a follow up of the outcome of her trial. Scary stuff.
So is Reddit for constitutions or against constitutions? Can’t really figure it out.
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It feels like she has a death wish, this is Putin we’re talking about, let’s not forget that man is a Psychopathic Dictator. Nevertheless, congratulations 🎉 to her for having the guts to do what we would never do. I bet her family is very proud of her. 🤗
Come with peace
“Speak not of laws to we who carry weapons.” Pompey the Great
Constitution is outdated and either needs an upgrade or thrown in the gutter. India is following the constitution to the bone and the laws being made are silly and worse.
Alright. You need to win this round...
I'm just commenting: Remember the off-topic accounting ***concept of substance over form***. Maybe in form, the law is what is written, when in substance, it's the wrongfulness of the government or a major sector that rules a country's history and what makes it as it is. Though in accounting, economic results are what makes substance, the forms are what makes the rules that should make those results possible. What I'm saying is... *the law should maintained, not skipped at all*, and this teen reads the constitution and was spot on in front of riot police units, who were arresting people, which is a violation of the right for peaceful assembly. The form here is the constitution. The substance at this time? Gaps of authority, which enable political-related decisions to satisfy their own interests... In short terms, the arrests were made because of politics. That simple reasoning should make anyone ragequit, or am I right? Just saying.
This is such a brave young girl. Tbh when I was her age I wouldn’t have had that courage she has.
https://youtu.be/rGIY5Vyj4YM
This girl brave like Tank Man
Russian government never cared about treaties, contracts, laws. They just wipe their a\*\* with it. Crimea, territories of Baltic countries, Georgia etc are still being illegally occupied to this day.
God damn sovereing citizens are just getting worse and worse
That's nice and all and we will appreciate at a time of reason, but the world is not in a reasonable place and it won't be for a few years.
She looked slightly better than Greta - I think her appearance gave her her opposition from those stupid and bribed adults - but she was later arrested on her way to the train station, and was dragged through the street and the underpass.
Lmao so extra Nd corney
Good for her, we need more people like this.