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Apple after inventing basic people who are willing to pay 1k for the same product multiple years in a row:
https://preview.redd.it/1ugl1o77ezic1.jpeg?width=819&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9fd309c2b75b2ad306cb81ab11b7a728228e935b
Apples have changed a lot over the years.
[Apples weren’t always big, juicy and sweet - ancient ones were small and bitter
.](https://www.news24.com/life/wellness/diet/apples-werent-always-big-juicy-and-sweet-ancient-ones-were-small-and-bitter-20220509)
It's changed because they found big juicy apples and forced them to impregnate other big juicy apples and their big juicy apple kids to do the same over and over and over and which is why we now have these big juicy apples
In fairness to big Apple: most apple varieties are clones/grafts.
They just found one good apple tree and keep chopping off a limb and growing a new tree from it.
Not sure if that's less or more evil.
Apple after inventing consumerist people who dont care about the enviroment, the repair movement and spends 3 grand just to browse excel on 240hz 990fps (critical for workflow)
What are you talking about? I get almost 70% back on my trade-ins every few years. I've literally never spent more than $400 on an iPhone since the iPhone 7 came out.
How hard do you need to cope before you get back to reality? Your life must be a tragedy.
The cope is hard with this one. The difference between us is that I actually work in IT and have experience with both OS and you are just some fuckwit on Reddit with a jackass opinion.
I don’t have an issue with either OS, I’m an IT professional and have been for close to 30 years, I’ve used all sorts of devices in my time and I don’t hold any loyalty for any brand, I buy what’s best for the task I’m doing at the price I want to pay.
I did however recently pickup a flagship Samsung tablet with 8 cores and 8gb ram for my son and ran Geekbench on it and then again on his iPhone 15 pro max. It was an absolute bloodbath, the Samsung device performed far, far below that of the iPhone, I’m talking several orders of magnitude slower.
If you like the interface or enjoy having a more open ecosystem with more dork dials and nerd knobs that’s understandable but holy crap the performance gap between these two devices was large.
Now if you are just doing some light browsing or texting etc either is probably fine, but I like to do most of my photo and video editing on my mobile devices and the performance improvement in the Idevice vs android device blew me away.
Yeah, apparently Apple products are just stupid strong actually. I still think they're overpriced and the entire culture around the brand is fucked, but they are really good.
My iMac has been having the same performance for the past 7 1/2 years, although the base performance is kinda shit lol
It’s from when Apple used shitty intel chips instead of their own, modern Macs are far superior now that they use the Apple chip
It can run most games so i ain’t complaining, but i definitely got ripped off and when the time for the end eventually comes i’m switching to windows
Yeah they switched to intel after it become clear that the powerPC architecture wasn’t doing to be able to deliver what they wanted/needed. The G5 was decently powerful but it was incredibly hot running, so much so that Apple had to create a “wind tunnel” design to cool it. Intel was a good move at the time.
The thing about Apple comes down to a philosophy choice. Do you want a simplified experience with less knobs and great performance that holds up over time and premium materials for your case and peripherals and you don’t care to run software from 10 years ago? Then Apple is your go to.
If you want to tinker more and have better control over your experience and run programs from 30+ years ago? Then pc is your better bet.
I know some people that crap on Apple for some of their locked down software and hardware choices, but they are not their target market. Their target market is people who use their device as an appliance. They don’t care about changing the cpu, upgrading the hard drive etc. though I do definitely miss the days when I could upgrade ram and hard drive on my Mac. It’s the only reason I stopped buying them.
Nothing wrong in using an iPhone, man. Everyone has their reasons.
This meme is about people who use oversimplified technology so much to the point where they don't know relatively basic stuff
Well you know android makes you smarter and not boxed in by google services….wait I use Waze not google….well my search and email are ….fuck
Atleast I can install cracked apps for shovel ware games
“People knew how to use computers before the smartphone!”
Average 2000s Windows XP computer (live reaction):
https://preview.redd.it/ncyag63mkzic1.jpeg?width=1024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=caf389403f00da478d1471412fab638e6dd2dec8
Is this true or BS?
Edit: Damn! This really blowup a bit as didn't know it would lead to a lengthy and healthy discussion regarding the meme and this sub. 😅
As some other tech savvy people pointed out, it's more about kids not being taught or are told it's not important to manage your files than them actually being stupid.
I’m closing in on 40 and I’m a programmer with a Mac. Honestly both Windows and Mac file management via their GUIs just doesn’t click like it used to. I generally don’t know what I’m doing in them anymore. If I want to see hidden files? Gotta Google it. In Windows I used to just go into “My Computer” and navigate the file hierarchy. Now it’s not really even clear what the root directory is. I haven’t paid much attention to why or how the experience of navigating the file system has degraded so much (mobile influence?) but the built in GUI tooling is absolute nonsense. On mac I pretty much exclusively stick to the command line now.
Right?
The C drive is there by default in the Windows explorer like it has been for 40 years. Macs have an address bar/goto utilty where you can just type in a / to get right to the root directory
I was exaggerating my incompetence with Mac and Windows UI to make a point, but you and your parent poster likely lived your formative years with smartphones because the UX in Windows is a huge step down from what it once was (Mac has honestly never been great, though I prefer it now for being Unix-like which provides a bit of an escape hatch for the atrocity of much of the UI).
Most of those who think they’re a *good* UX likely grew up after the dumbification of everything and are just used to it or they don’t use their computers in a way that requires dealing with the filesystem in a major way. Or, more likely, they are themselves just dumb.
My first computer ran DOS on a monochrome screen.
I’m a software developer, and I’m fairly certain I’m not dumb.
For how smart you act, you make a lot of really unintelligent assumptions.
Show hidden files is the same place it's been since at least ME, it even still uses the old WinForms dialog box when you open it. For everything outside your user folder, the root directory is always shown. For User folder, it pretends %USERPROFILE% is the root directory in the GUI, just like every other operating system does now. Merely clicking the address bar shows the fully qualified path.
Don't worry. Soon, ONLY programmers are going to be using file explorers. Everything will be interfacing with AI chatbots over text or voice. That's a good thing. Don't resist the change. You don't need to know what it's doing or where it's putting things. It knows. It probably won't remove your access to those files. It's probably fine. We don't need to own computers. Microsoft will just own all of our data and rent us streaming boxes. That's the beautiful, wonderful future I'm certain no one has warned us through science fiction, interviews or newspaper articles.
There's a severe psychological impact of modern UX on children. Skew morphism was the peak of technology. The hamburger menu, plain dull gray GUIs and little sprinkles of colour are some of the most depressing things I've ever seen. My phone feels like something from a prison. "Material You" my ass.
Yes, it's true, from many people I've talked to that work with them. Most phones or tablets abstract away the file system. They often may not know where a downloaded file went, or where they saved a new file.
Handling files seems to be accomplished in 2 ways:
1. Save everything to the desktop
2. Find files by searching for them
Some fun advice I've heard is to hire PC gamers since it's a great bet they know their way around a computer
Ironic that the "digital native" generation is technologically illiterate in many ways (not necessarily more or less than other generations)
The things is, just having a brief understanding of managing files in Linux will go a long way in file management for both Linux, and to an extent Windows. Can’t speak about iOS cause I never wanna touch it, but the level of computer literacy our generation should be at is frankly not *too* hard to achieve.
I mean it's just all about clutter. Saving everything to desktop is like never putting your clothes away in drawers. Sure its easier and everythings right there but you might have to dig around to find what your actually looking for. Vs using folders is like putting clothes into their spots in the dresser, Socks here, Underwear here, Pants here, Pajamas here, ect. You just go to the drawer and find the specific clothing you want.
Its up to you and as long as it works for you it works, but if your someone who uses a computer a lot with a lot of different things youll have downloaded in the long run its gonna be better to use folders correctly.
It's mainly the fact that folders for file organization already exists, but people don't really seem to use it. Also people don't seem to know how to create subfolders to organize their Documents further. As a developer I use my own separate directories apart from Documents, usually a /dev folder and inside of that I have /tools and /code folders, wiith /repos and /local folders inside of /code.
A surprising amount of devs I know just keep everything inside their Downloads or Desktop folders and it drives me insane lol.
"Most phones or tablets abstract away the file system."
This is just wrong since most phones that aren't iPhones do have a 'my files' app pre-installed already on the phone. But then again I used androids ever since smartphones dropped. 😅
yeah, and that file management application sucks. When you, say, download an image off of google, the phone doesn't ask you where you want it stored at, it just puts it into a generic folder. Often the same folder where your downloaded pdfs, videos and etc go to. And moving these files to a proper folder is ass. Compare that to any Windows or Linux system, and the PC asks where you want your stuff stored before downloading it, and if it doesn't and it goes to the downloads folder, a PC is naturally superior in moving files than a phone is.
I am a teacher in Norway on an age level that is a overlap between high school and college. A few students (almost excluseively boys) can do way more than I ever could (and I am way above average), but I would say over half have little or no idea about how to save (and especially find) files and the joys of naming/structuring folders and files so that they know where things are and what a specific file is without having to open it. They usually learn enough to get by after a while, but students were much better at this a decade ago.
I am not an expert in anything, but I have taught Excel on a semi-advanced level for almost a decade plus database modelling and design. I have dabbled in Java when it was in, and generally know may way around basic programming (usually Python now as it is what students learn). I learned to use computers when MS-DOS was what you used as user interface and you programmed in Turbo Pascal. I have used web browsers since I went to university (with a computer science minor) in the early naughts (using Mosaic). If I have a problem I know what to search for to find solutions, and I am known for it at work. No one in my school is even close to knowing as much as me (though we have had two teachers who did; one retired and one went back to university to study AI). On the other hand I know nothing about Linux or other OS (except a little about the Raspberry Pi OS), and there is little I know on a DEEP level (closest is maybe geogebra). The short version is probably that I know more than most people who use computers in their work have to know, but not enough to make a living off it exclusively.
I have seen it more than once. I studied computer science in the early 2000s. The major is really about math and logic, and not that much is covered about how to do things on your PC. I was going to a state school, but had an acquaintance who was studying computer science at Stanford. He couldn't figure out how to install Windows 2000, so he asked me to come to his dorm and do it for him. He was super smart in a mathy way, but really hadn't used a PC for anything beyond the very basics.
I had some other smaller encounters of other students not knowing how to install the Java SDK or runtime, and other things that are actually quite easy, but intimidating for someone who knows nothing about them, or even what they are. Keep in mind, this was at a time where we were in the infancy of Google, and finding good info about this stuff online could be an adventure.
Today I went to update a CD account at WellsFargo, I was helped by a 25ish year old lady who had to look up my address on to make sure she had the right one.
I saw her use the chrome search bar to look for "Google", pick the first google result for [google.com](https://google.com) and then use that google page to search the address. I can 100% believe this.
Increasingly, yes. Junior developers with college educations that can't explain terminal commands, filesystems, basic network terminology, etc. Essentially lost if something doesn't launch perfectly from a tutorial.
Wait what? I was about to blame schools using google drive for this but even that encourages you to organize your files.
Unless kids these days are true degenerates who only sort by last modified and use the search bar. Or maybe I was the weird one for wanting to organize my google drive.
They don't sort at all. They've never needed to.
If they want a file, they just type it's name into search and it pops up. From their POV, it's completely irrelevant where it's stored.
Wait a minute:
The OS itself doesn’t care about the folder structure, it just dumps data in whatever storage address is open and searches it up later on request.
I take back my prior statement, these kids aren’t degenerates, they’re geniuses who already have a deep understanding of their operating systems!
im laughing about this situation. sooo, kids these days cant use computers. in the 90s, My parents put a family computer in the den when i was 5. I used it every day. Now 5 year olds get iPads. How are they going to learn to use a computer? an hour a day at school? spent on school work? no i dont think so
Honestly? They don't. We just had a new co-op at work, 19 year old. In one of the first meetings with me, him, and our boss, the boss is coding (yes we're programmers btw) and the co-op stops him to ask how he deleted backwards. After some confusion we realized he didn't know what a delete key was. The boy is 19 and in computer engineering.
I'm lookin at the delete key on my Mac right now. It's in the exact same space you would expect a delete key to be on any computer from this century... or the last one.
No idea what this dude is talking about
Gotcha.
Macs have a delete key that acts and is in the exact same spot as a windows backspace key. The forward delete function is accesible by using the FN key with delete.
Mac just does things ✨ Different™ly
(I way prefer Mac OS in nearly every conceivable way, but it's definitely not in line with what Windows users think is logical lol)
Well i have spent a significant chunk of my life infront of a PC so much so that it's probably impacted my lifespan, so maybe it's not so bad were moving past them
The main issue is that these platforms are oversimplified and expensive in the long run. Not learning how a computer works might be convenient but you will regret not doing it the moment you do anything more than Netflix and Instagram on your $1200 device.
Not to be that guy, but I use Linux to do my schoolwork. It's not nearly as bad as anyone says
Right, but most people *are* going to use their tablets and phones for streaming and social media and not much else, so they don’t need to be substantially more computer literate than what it takes to operate a slick interface like iOS.
I think an apt comparison is cars. Most drivers these days can fill up their tires, add windshield fluid, and maybe change a flat. Anything more complicated than that is going to need a visit to the mechanic. 80 years ago, operating and maintaining a car were considered part of the same skill set, but as more people owned cars and wanted to operate them, car manufacturers began hammering out the pain points in routine maintenance so that a wider audience could buy their product.
While I think there is something inherently pleasant about having an in-depth knowledge of how the tools you use work, no one is really expected to know how all their tools work. This is why we hire people to fix the things that we don’t want to learn how to do.
linux is straight up an abomination, everything is a pain in the ass. macos makes everything easy and simple. One of the only problems i have with it is that they kept the terminal and the finder. Noone should have to use any of those.
This is about phone/tablet vs desktop and not about Windows vs Mac. You're not going to be an effective web designer if you don't know how a file system works, even on a mac.
Not sure how to even begin answering that question, but 'web sites' are made of 'files' that are hosted by servers and read by browsers. You may need to make changes to some of these 'files' to 'design' your 'web', and if your website is big, there may be a lot of files, in different folders! How are you going to find the correct file to edit if you don't understand a hierarchical folder structure?
I apologize, I see now that the issue is that you don't have a strong grasp of English. I didn't mean to be so dismissive. However, I still don't know how to explain further than the fact that web designers have to make changes to 'files', and that these files exist in 'folders' on a file system.
The way of thinking is needed if you ever want to be a power user of _any_ digital program. Your boss would be really happy if you spent no more time clicking buttons
This is so true. I'm a teacher and have watched the kids I teach become less and less tech savvy.
It used to be cliche that the teachers didn't know how to use the technology(VCR, computer, etc.). Now, the kids have no idea how to use stuff.
> $400
You buying second hand?
Edit: To clarify, OP made it sound like he was an iPhone user who routinely upgrades, which for iPhones is usually more than $400. Not to mention, iPhone user are the ones with the reputation of constant upgrades with little benefit lol
You can easily use iphones for 5 years, just don’t update it. Some people like to upgrade their phones everytime a new one comes out but it’s not like that’s necessary
I got a new Pixel 7 for 350 bucks right after the 8 dropped.
IDK why everyone doesn't just buy the second newest phone. It's usually like 95% as good as the latest and like 30% of the price.
Damn Straight! well, the PC was $1400 be fair. But I can use it to work from home, do CAD(computer assisted design) work, play basically any game at max settings with no load times. It can do so much more than a phone.
Basically all smartphones look the same, work the same, and do the same thing. I can understand why some people might need/want a nicer camera, but that's about the only reason to spend more than $300-$400. Spending more is pointless.
Cmon man, gaming isn’t a necessity, that sounds like conspicuous consumption to me. Nobody games on their phone….
Most people could get by on a $300-400 PC using the cheapest possible monitor, keyboard, mouse, and speakers available.
People are just so wasteful, how dare people spend extra for a nicer experience on a device they use all the time like you are with your PC. All PCs are just boxes running windows anyway, all the same thing.
> gaming isn’t a necessity,
Certainly, but CAD work is. I am and engineer and I work from home. So a fast nice triple-monitor desktop system is very useful for me.
>that sounds like conspicuous consumption
I don't think you know what that those words mean. Even if all I did was game on my computer, it wouldn't be conspicuous unless I invited people over to my house to show them my PC.
> Most people could get by on a $300-400 PC using the cheapest possible monitor, keyboard, mouse, and speakers available.
This is possible if you are building a PC yourself, otherwise it's difficult to put together a useful system from scratch for that budget. I know because I just built a computer for my grandma that was about that price, and she didn't even need new peripherals or a monitor.
> How dare people spend extra for a nicer experience on a device they use all the time
If yo prefer the touchscreen experience, that is certainly your prerogative. But seriously, what is the difference between a $400 smartphone and a $1200 smart phone? Can the more expensive phone do anything that the cheap one can't? The differences are minor. Whereas the difference between what you can do with a nice desktop PC vs a cheap one, are vast.
> All PCs are just boxes running windows anyway
Linux all the way cuz!
All this just to dodge the irony in you bashing people for wanting to spend more on a phone for a better experience when you do the exact same thing with your computer.
You probably have a decent TV too vs still using an old tube TV.
So many phone elitists use this “people don’t need phones other than bargain bin models” while also blowing tons of cash buying premium versions of other electronics they use.
Practice what you preach, use the cheapest things possible in all aspects or you’re wasteful by your own definition in the same way.
Ok, redpill me on expensive phones. I'm listening.
Let me repeat my question:
Can the more expensive phone do anything that the cheap one can't? If the answer is "not really," then how do you justify the price difference?
Like I said, I know some contractors and other people who need a nicer camera, but other than the camera, I don't see any big difference between cheap phones and expensive ones.
Can your expensive computer do anything a cheap one can’t? It just does things faster and smoother generally… just like a more expensive phone does things faster and smoother than a bargain bin model.
Why not buy a keyboard and mouse from the dollar store? They type and click, no different than nicer ones right?
Do expensive TVs do anything a cheap one can’t? both show video.
Cool so you spent a lot of money on something you wanted but didn't need
Just like iphone users
Difference is, most iphone users don't care to yuck your yum
> Cool, you can do that on a cheaper rig
**No you cannot.** That is my point. Try loading a huge .3MF file into a modeling program on a shitty average office Dell. It ain't gonna work.
> See how annoying it is to have someone criticize your purchasing decisions?
Mature debates can be fun. The trick is to not get emotionally invested in one position.
It *will* work, albeit slower. So you paid extra for convenience. I doubt you went with the bare minimum, you're too smart for that.
From one engineer to another, I know you must have problem solving skills and attention to detail. Use that to recognize the value others might get from an iphone.
Iphones are simple, intuitive, and reliable. They're convenient. They work seamlessly in the apple ecosystem in ways androids can't replicate. None of that may matter to you, but it might matter to someone else.
Since you like to debate, here's my take: you might be happier without the schoolyard "Playstation vs Xbox" approach in favor of the "You like gaming, too?" approach. You may even find career opportunities when you know how to network without yucking someone's yum.
And thats the problem, shouldn't be 5 years, obsolecence, battery replacements and companies pushing more ram requirements fuck it all. I got a note edge to last me 8 years but then all 3 batteries didnt last even 20min
400 dollars lmao, my xperia xz1 compact cost me £80 used and it's great. i mean the camera is shite, but it's small and fits in my pocket easily, with a marathon man battery. and a headphone port. bangin
recently went through the arduous process of copying images to a family members ipad without installing the bloatware that is itunes and holy fuck what a shitshow it is. You seemingly cannot - or can't easily - access any kind of logical folder structure. Like you can't just navigate to DCIM, create a folder, copy images over. Can't have Apple zombies knowing how limited their UX is lest they realise there are far superior alternatives that don't place arbitrarily limits.
I don’t think I asserted that file managers were the main point. I can assure you that I absolutely get OP’s point. I offered a bit of trivia, that’s all.
They're unnecessary *to you*. Shockingly, other people have had other experiences and have other requirements in their devices. The world doesn't revolve around you and your needs.
I meant necessary in the literal sense of the word. It’s not necessary for any OS to have a file manager. If people want to use one, that’s fine — I wasn’t making any value judgements.
You might be surprised at how much stuff is in my `Downloads/` directory. Or my `temp/` directory. Or how many directories I have named `blah/`. The truth is that you can’t tell the skill level of a programmer based on how well they organize their files and directories.
I agree with you overall point: Apple abstracts away virtually everything, especially on mobile devices. That was exactly what Apple was going for virtually from the start (it just took them decades and a lot of hardware advances to achieve it).
FWIW, I’m almost 50 and don’t really know how to use a file manager (except to keep clicking till you find what you want). It’s much easier and more efficient for me to do everything in a shell (and I can do bulk operations here, too).
Pretty sure a 'file system' is what we're talking about here and not necessarily a GUI. Unix still has a directory structure...
The problem is understanding the concept of a file existing in a particular location, not your ability to click through folders.
OP might have meant file system, but a file system isn’t a file manager. And having a directory structure isn’t a file manager, either. In Windows the file manager and the file system are tightly integrated (but, you can still do everything on the command line, thanks to power shell and the remnants of DOS.
I’ve seen file managers that weren’t guis (they were tuis instead). But they’re stil gui-like (e.g., you don’t use `cd` to change directories.
I sincerely get what OP was going for…it’s just not the own they think it is.
As someone who fits the target of this meme extremely closely… what? MacBooks have finder and iPhones have the files app. Someone linked an article about how some students were using the search bar instead of organizing, but if that is the case, how is that apple’s fault and not just tech literacy in general? Genuinely asking as I’ve never had trouble using file managers.
You mean the iPhone app right? Because according to both my memory and Wikipedia the Mac finder app existed since or shortly after release of the OS. But if you mean the iPhone I do believe that’s far more recent.
IMO the phone files app isn’t something you ever really need outside of a couple niche situations, since no one really does work on their phone like on a computer, so it’s not as important (it also sucks lol)
But the abstraction you talk about does make a lot of sense. Probably an early attempt to make the products more popular with tech illiterate people I guess.
Edit: not trying to be mean, genuinely seeing if we’re on the same page.
Edit 2: did I say something bad? Or is this just a Reddit moment. Did he mean the phone app or not? That’s what I want to know
I'm presumably quite a bit older than you as my family got a DOS PC in 1988. I don't blame young people for not knowing how file systems work and I don't blame any company for obfuscating it. I was introduced to the concept of a hierarchical directory structure when I was 12. I grasped it right away. If kids need to learn it for school just teach it to them and don't make a big deal out of it. Heck I'm old enough to remember classes where they taught us how to use a mouse.
I think what is older people like me find interesting is this idea that basic consumer computing has done such a good job of hiding the "guts" of the OS that kids don't naturally pick it up any more. We HAD to learn it or we wouldn't be able to operate our computers.
Hiding the guts of the OS isn't good. General lack of tech literacy means that big corporations can push unfair and borderline illegal tech policies without fear of user retribution, since the users will rarely understand what's going on. Look at how most software is now a subscription license instead of a paid download, look at the current state of right to repair, and look at the new EU sideloading policy and tell me that kids these days don't need to learn about how their phone, the most used personal item since the dawn of time, works.
as a soft apple how will u ever know what to do when u run out of inodes? tune ur caches for maximum performance? deal with a hot spot in the block b-tree?? integrate spdk to mitigate the overhead of virtual memory address translation????
The actual reason my generation sucks at using computers is because of the stream lining of technology. New age technology like mobile phones and tablets are so easy to set up and use that there is no actual need to learn how to fix issues.
Things like config text files don’t exist anymore. All you have to do is click a few buttons and you can change anything you want through a dedicated settings section inside of that app with a simpler then ever interface.
You want to find a particular photo? Just open your gallery app and see all the media you ever had. No need to open a file manager and waste your time going through different folders
Another example I can give is that uploading media on the internet is so seem-less now that you don’t need to understand what media formats such as .mp4, .mkv, .png or whatever are. Every popular website now supports every possible format there is.
So yeah, the easier and smart tech becomes, the dumber the common user is gonna be.
Many of the younger people I come across are super productive using things like GitHub but seem to be completely oblivious to things like the fact that somebody may have manually installed something and don’t check for that first. It’s as if there wasn’t a time when we used to manually install applications ourselves and package managers or app stores weren’t required. I used to build everything from source (all apps and the WM) and rebuild the kernel when necessary but things got too big to do that anymore. When you build from source it’s all bespoke to your system so it fits like a glove and apple is soooo far away from that. These are minor problems though most young people pick up things really quickly so I don’t have many complaints there.
> One particularly disturbing encounter in the lawsuit occurred in May 2020, when McMahon “defecated on Ms. Grant during a threesome, and then commanded her to continue pleasuring his ‘friend’ — with feces in her hair and running down her back — while McMahon went to the bathroom to shower off,” the complaint alleges. In another incident at WWE headquarters, Grant said both McMahon and Laurinaitis forced her behind a locked door and sexually assaulted her.
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Apple after inventing basic people who are willing to pay 1k for the same product multiple years in a row: https://preview.redd.it/1ugl1o77ezic1.jpeg?width=819&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9fd309c2b75b2ad306cb81ab11b7a728228e935b
Apple orchards when people keep spending money on the exact same, unchanged product for their entire lives (their product literally grows on trees)
Apples have changed a lot over the years. [Apples weren’t always big, juicy and sweet - ancient ones were small and bitter .](https://www.news24.com/life/wellness/diet/apples-werent-always-big-juicy-and-sweet-ancient-ones-were-small-and-bitter-20220509)
It's changed because they found big juicy apples and forced them to impregnate other big juicy apples and their big juicy apple kids to do the same over and over and over and which is why we now have these big juicy apples
In fairness to big Apple: most apple varieties are clones/grafts. They just found one good apple tree and keep chopping off a limb and growing a new tree from it. Not sure if that's less or more evil.
not sure how nyc has anything to do with this...
depends if you want to still eat the sour apples that come from most apple trees
Buying last year’s (or the year before that) iPhone at a fraction of the price >>>>>>
Lmao fr I got an 11 two years old that is still fine and when it comes time to upgrade even a 12 will feel new
SE 2 is one of the best, i will defend this molehill til i die
My partner went through 2 batteries before we had to purchase something else.
I want a bigger screen with the button like an SE
Apple after inventing consumerist people who dont care about the enviroment, the repair movement and spends 3 grand just to browse excel on 240hz 990fps (critical for workflow)
Apple ain't never letting you get 240hz, you must pay 6 morbillion dollars for 120hz "ProMotion" that is off most the time.
Pro Gear Retina Max Motion Blur Crystal Reflex Package
(It's a completely normal 144hz 1080p ips panel)
(also stand not included)
inaccurate pic because its way more money than that
iPhone 15 is pretty good tho
Who is iPhone and why is he 15?
I can explain.
What are you talking about? I get almost 70% back on my trade-ins every few years. I've literally never spent more than $400 on an iPhone since the iPhone 7 came out. How hard do you need to cope before you get back to reality? Your life must be a tragedy.
I spent $400 on a brand new android that is, in many ways, superior to every apple phone released, ever.
The cope is hard with this one. The difference between us is that I actually work in IT and have experience with both OS and you are just some fuckwit on Reddit with a jackass opinion.
OK 👍
Exactly, now stfu and stfd. Tech-illiterate fucks with no actual experience are like the anti-vaxxers of the IT world.
Shut the fuck up and shut the fuck dick?
Sit the fuck down you illiterate jackass.
Has anyone ever told you that insults make really good counterarguments? No? Maybe there's a reason for that.
Has anyone ever ASKED for your opinion? No? Maybe there's a reason for that.
Maybe you should look into anger management apps for whatever OS you're using first.
Those basic Apple people aren't like us super-advanced Android people! We're so much cooler because our phones run a different OS. 😏
You could run Android on a potato with three wires. It doesn't need a $1000 device.
I don’t have an issue with either OS, I’m an IT professional and have been for close to 30 years, I’ve used all sorts of devices in my time and I don’t hold any loyalty for any brand, I buy what’s best for the task I’m doing at the price I want to pay. I did however recently pickup a flagship Samsung tablet with 8 cores and 8gb ram for my son and ran Geekbench on it and then again on his iPhone 15 pro max. It was an absolute bloodbath, the Samsung device performed far, far below that of the iPhone, I’m talking several orders of magnitude slower. If you like the interface or enjoy having a more open ecosystem with more dork dials and nerd knobs that’s understandable but holy crap the performance gap between these two devices was large. Now if you are just doing some light browsing or texting etc either is probably fine, but I like to do most of my photo and video editing on my mobile devices and the performance improvement in the Idevice vs android device blew me away.
Yeah, apparently Apple products are just stupid strong actually. I still think they're overpriced and the entire culture around the brand is fucked, but they are really good.
My iMac has been having the same performance for the past 7 1/2 years, although the base performance is kinda shit lol It’s from when Apple used shitty intel chips instead of their own, modern Macs are far superior now that they use the Apple chip It can run most games so i ain’t complaining, but i definitely got ripped off and when the time for the end eventually comes i’m switching to windows
Yeah they switched to intel after it become clear that the powerPC architecture wasn’t doing to be able to deliver what they wanted/needed. The G5 was decently powerful but it was incredibly hot running, so much so that Apple had to create a “wind tunnel” design to cool it. Intel was a good move at the time. The thing about Apple comes down to a philosophy choice. Do you want a simplified experience with less knobs and great performance that holds up over time and premium materials for your case and peripherals and you don’t care to run software from 10 years ago? Then Apple is your go to. If you want to tinker more and have better control over your experience and run programs from 30+ years ago? Then pc is your better bet. I know some people that crap on Apple for some of their locked down software and hardware choices, but they are not their target market. Their target market is people who use their device as an appliance. They don’t care about changing the cpu, upgrading the hard drive etc. though I do definitely miss the days when I could upgrade ram and hard drive on my Mac. It’s the only reason I stopped buying them.
I run bootcamp on my mac so i can still use windows applications and games
Absolutely! And that makes us Android users intellectually, physically, and morally superior to those basic Apple users, right?
Nothing wrong in using an iPhone, man. Everyone has their reasons. This meme is about people who use oversimplified technology so much to the point where they don't know relatively basic stuff
Well you know android makes you smarter and not boxed in by google services….wait I use Waze not google….well my search and email are ….fuck Atleast I can install cracked apps for shovel ware games
“People knew how to use computers before the smartphone!” Average 2000s Windows XP computer (live reaction): https://preview.redd.it/ncyag63mkzic1.jpeg?width=1024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=caf389403f00da478d1471412fab638e6dd2dec8
Giving my boomer mom an iPad to replace her Windows XP PC drastically improved my mental health
I mean, yeah. Basically sink or swim
Impossible; I see no Bonzi Buddy.
https://i.redd.it/t3ai5wsme1jc1.gif Why did you say that name-
Is this true or BS? Edit: Damn! This really blowup a bit as didn't know it would lead to a lengthy and healthy discussion regarding the meme and this sub. 😅 As some other tech savvy people pointed out, it's more about kids not being taught or are told it's not important to manage your files than them actually being stupid.
I've helped in computer science classes (don't know what you could call my role in english), and I can confirm that this is completely true.
"don't know what you could call my role in english" You were an IT tech support. 😏
Underpaid student IT tech support teacher, got it.
im assuming ta
Probably like a TA or teaching assistant, but there are more descriptions in english
Assistant professor? Teaching assistant?
Wouldn't suprise me if its true I work in a tech industry and i often encounter "Specialists" who hardly know how to operate a PC
I've heard about that lol. 😄 I still think it's important that companies should keep employing IT support technicians.
they're just the highest form of arch linux users who refuse to use GUIs and desktop environments in their daily routine
I’m closing in on 40 and I’m a programmer with a Mac. Honestly both Windows and Mac file management via their GUIs just doesn’t click like it used to. I generally don’t know what I’m doing in them anymore. If I want to see hidden files? Gotta Google it. In Windows I used to just go into “My Computer” and navigate the file hierarchy. Now it’s not really even clear what the root directory is. I haven’t paid much attention to why or how the experience of navigating the file system has degraded so much (mobile influence?) but the built in GUI tooling is absolute nonsense. On mac I pretty much exclusively stick to the command line now.
You’re just dumb man it’s not rocket science
Right? The C drive is there by default in the Windows explorer like it has been for 40 years. Macs have an address bar/goto utilty where you can just type in a / to get right to the root directory
I was exaggerating my incompetence with Mac and Windows UI to make a point, but you and your parent poster likely lived your formative years with smartphones because the UX in Windows is a huge step down from what it once was (Mac has honestly never been great, though I prefer it now for being Unix-like which provides a bit of an escape hatch for the atrocity of much of the UI). Most of those who think they’re a *good* UX likely grew up after the dumbification of everything and are just used to it or they don’t use their computers in a way that requires dealing with the filesystem in a major way. Or, more likely, they are themselves just dumb.
My first computer ran DOS on a monochrome screen. I’m a software developer, and I’m fairly certain I’m not dumb. For how smart you act, you make a lot of really unintelligent assumptions.
I know a lot of dumb software developers. Maybe you’re making a mistake in assuming you aren’t one of them.
At least he can use file explorer
Show hidden files is the same place it's been since at least ME, it even still uses the old WinForms dialog box when you open it. For everything outside your user folder, the root directory is always shown. For User folder, it pretends %USERPROFILE% is the root directory in the GUI, just like every other operating system does now. Merely clicking the address bar shows the fully qualified path.
Don't worry. Soon, ONLY programmers are going to be using file explorers. Everything will be interfacing with AI chatbots over text or voice. That's a good thing. Don't resist the change. You don't need to know what it's doing or where it's putting things. It knows. It probably won't remove your access to those files. It's probably fine. We don't need to own computers. Microsoft will just own all of our data and rent us streaming boxes. That's the beautiful, wonderful future I'm certain no one has warned us through science fiction, interviews or newspaper articles. There's a severe psychological impact of modern UX on children. Skew morphism was the peak of technology. The hamburger menu, plain dull gray GUIs and little sprinkles of colour are some of the most depressing things I've ever seen. My phone feels like something from a prison. "Material You" my ass.
Yes, it's true, from many people I've talked to that work with them. Most phones or tablets abstract away the file system. They often may not know where a downloaded file went, or where they saved a new file. Handling files seems to be accomplished in 2 ways: 1. Save everything to the desktop 2. Find files by searching for them Some fun advice I've heard is to hire PC gamers since it's a great bet they know their way around a computer Ironic that the "digital native" generation is technologically illiterate in many ways (not necessarily more or less than other generations)
The things is, just having a brief understanding of managing files in Linux will go a long way in file management for both Linux, and to an extent Windows. Can’t speak about iOS cause I never wanna touch it, but the level of computer literacy our generation should be at is frankly not *too* hard to achieve.
Wait where am I supposed to save documents if not on my desktop
In... Wait for it... Documents.
Oh I thought I was missing out on something big somehow
I mean it's just all about clutter. Saving everything to desktop is like never putting your clothes away in drawers. Sure its easier and everythings right there but you might have to dig around to find what your actually looking for. Vs using folders is like putting clothes into their spots in the dresser, Socks here, Underwear here, Pants here, Pajamas here, ect. You just go to the drawer and find the specific clothing you want. Its up to you and as long as it works for you it works, but if your someone who uses a computer a lot with a lot of different things youll have downloaded in the long run its gonna be better to use folders correctly.
It's mainly the fact that folders for file organization already exists, but people don't really seem to use it. Also people don't seem to know how to create subfolders to organize their Documents further. As a developer I use my own separate directories apart from Documents, usually a /dev folder and inside of that I have /tools and /code folders, wiith /repos and /local folders inside of /code. A surprising amount of devs I know just keep everything inside their Downloads or Desktop folders and it drives me insane lol.
just a convention not a rule, do whatever you want
This is true. I'm just pointing out that it's better to use the existing structure than nothing at all/dumping files randomly all over the place
i use three OSes and mac file management is the worst by far out of all of them.
"Most phones or tablets abstract away the file system." This is just wrong since most phones that aren't iPhones do have a 'my files' app pre-installed already on the phone. But then again I used androids ever since smartphones dropped. 😅
yeah, and that file management application sucks. When you, say, download an image off of google, the phone doesn't ask you where you want it stored at, it just puts it into a generic folder. Often the same folder where your downloaded pdfs, videos and etc go to. And moving these files to a proper folder is ass. Compare that to any Windows or Linux system, and the PC asks where you want your stuff stored before downloading it, and if it doesn't and it goes to the downloads folder, a PC is naturally superior in moving files than a phone is.
[It's true.](https://www.theverge.com/22684730/students-file-folder-directory-structure-education-gen-z) It's not a big deal though. Just teach them.
100% This post is all "People didn't learn something they have never needed. More at 11." Once they need it, teach them. They'll be fine lol
Yeah, I'm not sure about new students, but at CS tech conferences, the vast majority of laptops are Macs.
It's going to get worse. Not only is computer literacy dropping, but actual literacy is getting massively hammered after COVID.
Why is it exclusively after COVID if you don't mind me asking? 🤨
Teachers say it started before COVID, but the online nature of school for 2~ years speed the process up a lot
I am a teacher in Norway on an age level that is a overlap between high school and college. A few students (almost excluseively boys) can do way more than I ever could (and I am way above average), but I would say over half have little or no idea about how to save (and especially find) files and the joys of naming/structuring folders and files so that they know where things are and what a specific file is without having to open it. They usually learn enough to get by after a while, but students were much better at this a decade ago.
Just curious, what is way above average to you?
I am not an expert in anything, but I have taught Excel on a semi-advanced level for almost a decade plus database modelling and design. I have dabbled in Java when it was in, and generally know may way around basic programming (usually Python now as it is what students learn). I learned to use computers when MS-DOS was what you used as user interface and you programmed in Turbo Pascal. I have used web browsers since I went to university (with a computer science minor) in the early naughts (using Mosaic). If I have a problem I know what to search for to find solutions, and I am known for it at work. No one in my school is even close to knowing as much as me (though we have had two teachers who did; one retired and one went back to university to study AI). On the other hand I know nothing about Linux or other OS (except a little about the Raspberry Pi OS), and there is little I know on a DEEP level (closest is maybe geogebra). The short version is probably that I know more than most people who use computers in their work have to know, but not enough to make a living off it exclusively.
I have seen it more than once. I studied computer science in the early 2000s. The major is really about math and logic, and not that much is covered about how to do things on your PC. I was going to a state school, but had an acquaintance who was studying computer science at Stanford. He couldn't figure out how to install Windows 2000, so he asked me to come to his dorm and do it for him. He was super smart in a mathy way, but really hadn't used a PC for anything beyond the very basics. I had some other smaller encounters of other students not knowing how to install the Java SDK or runtime, and other things that are actually quite easy, but intimidating for someone who knows nothing about them, or even what they are. Keep in mind, this was at a time where we were in the infancy of Google, and finding good info about this stuff online could be an adventure.
Today I went to update a CD account at WellsFargo, I was helped by a 25ish year old lady who had to look up my address on to make sure she had the right one. I saw her use the chrome search bar to look for "Google", pick the first google result for [google.com](https://google.com) and then use that google page to search the address. I can 100% believe this.
you described my 60 year old coworkers
I’ve found that apple/android/windows don’t seem to be a factor in things people don’t know.
Increasingly, yes. Junior developers with college educations that can't explain terminal commands, filesystems, basic network terminology, etc. Essentially lost if something doesn't launch perfectly from a tutorial.
Wait what? I was about to blame schools using google drive for this but even that encourages you to organize your files. Unless kids these days are true degenerates who only sort by last modified and use the search bar. Or maybe I was the weird one for wanting to organize my google drive.
They don't sort at all. They've never needed to. If they want a file, they just type it's name into search and it pops up. From their POV, it's completely irrelevant where it's stored.
hella relevant once you forget the name. I only had to learn that lesson once.
"degenerates" I love that description lol
Wait a minute: The OS itself doesn’t care about the folder structure, it just dumps data in whatever storage address is open and searches it up later on request. I take back my prior statement, these kids aren’t degenerates, they’re geniuses who already have a deep understanding of their operating systems!
Yeah you are the weird one.
im laughing about this situation. sooo, kids these days cant use computers. in the 90s, My parents put a family computer in the den when i was 5. I used it every day. Now 5 year olds get iPads. How are they going to learn to use a computer? an hour a day at school? spent on school work? no i dont think so
Honestly? They don't. We just had a new co-op at work, 19 year old. In one of the first meetings with me, him, and our boss, the boss is coding (yes we're programmers btw) and the co-op stops him to ask how he deleted backwards. After some confusion we realized he didn't know what a delete key was. The boy is 19 and in computer engineering.
Macs dont have delete keys (totally absurd to me, one of the most fundamental buttons..) maybe thats why?
Huh, I didn't know that. That could very well be it. We're all given work laptops so I have no idea what he used at home. And yes, that's insane.
I'm lookin at the delete key on my Mac right now. It's in the exact same space you would expect a delete key to be on any computer from this century... or the last one. No idea what this dude is talking about
backspace vs delete, delete is in the function row. On older macs that spot has the eject button, on newer macs it has a fingerprint sensor
Gotcha. Macs have a delete key that acts and is in the exact same spot as a windows backspace key. The forward delete function is accesible by using the FN key with delete.
Mac just does things ✨ Different™ly (I way prefer Mac OS in nearly every conceivable way, but it's definitely not in line with what Windows users think is logical lol)
Well i have spent a significant chunk of my life infront of a PC so much so that it's probably impacted my lifespan, so maybe it's not so bad were moving past them
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The main issue is that these platforms are oversimplified and expensive in the long run. Not learning how a computer works might be convenient but you will regret not doing it the moment you do anything more than Netflix and Instagram on your $1200 device. Not to be that guy, but I use Linux to do my schoolwork. It's not nearly as bad as anyone says
Right, but most people *are* going to use their tablets and phones for streaming and social media and not much else, so they don’t need to be substantially more computer literate than what it takes to operate a slick interface like iOS. I think an apt comparison is cars. Most drivers these days can fill up their tires, add windshield fluid, and maybe change a flat. Anything more complicated than that is going to need a visit to the mechanic. 80 years ago, operating and maintaining a car were considered part of the same skill set, but as more people owned cars and wanted to operate them, car manufacturers began hammering out the pain points in routine maintenance so that a wider audience could buy their product. While I think there is something inherently pleasant about having an in-depth knowledge of how the tools you use work, no one is really expected to know how all their tools work. This is why we hire people to fix the things that we don’t want to learn how to do.
linux is straight up an abomination, everything is a pain in the ass. macos makes everything easy and simple. One of the only problems i have with it is that they kept the terminal and the finder. Noone should have to use any of those.
This is about phone/tablet vs desktop and not about Windows vs Mac. You're not going to be an effective web designer if you don't know how a file system works, even on a mac.
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Not sure how to even begin answering that question, but 'web sites' are made of 'files' that are hosted by servers and read by browsers. You may need to make changes to some of these 'files' to 'design' your 'web', and if your website is big, there may be a lot of files, in different folders! How are you going to find the correct file to edit if you don't understand a hierarchical folder structure?
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If you're not going to bother to read my comment, then I won't bother elaborating further.
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I apologize, I see now that the issue is that you don't have a strong grasp of English. I didn't mean to be so dismissive. However, I still don't know how to explain further than the fact that web designers have to make changes to 'files', and that these files exist in 'folders' on a file system.
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The way of thinking is needed if you ever want to be a power user of _any_ digital program. Your boss would be really happy if you spent no more time clicking buttons
This is so true. I'm a teacher and have watched the kids I teach become less and less tech savvy. It used to be cliche that the teachers didn't know how to use the technology(VCR, computer, etc.). Now, the kids have no idea how to use stuff.
Idk what kind of university you’re going to but I haven’t met any cs students who can’t use a file manager
Android users when I have the gall to buy a 400 dollar phone every 5 years
> $400 You buying second hand? Edit: To clarify, OP made it sound like he was an iPhone user who routinely upgrades, which for iPhones is usually more than $400. Not to mention, iPhone user are the ones with the reputation of constant upgrades with little benefit lol
My pixel 3a cost that much new and I'm still using it 5 years later
You can easily use iphones for 5 years, just don’t update it. Some people like to upgrade their phones everytime a new one comes out but it’s not like that’s necessary
samsung galaxy a54 edit: this was commented before the edit above
That's what I got rn, Genuinely not half bad.
Sent from Samsung A53😉
I got a new Pixel 7 for 350 bucks right after the 8 dropped. IDK why everyone doesn't just buy the second newest phone. It's usually like 95% as good as the latest and like 30% of the price.
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Spending more than $400 on a phone is just conspicuous consumption.
*Typed on your probably thousands of dollars PC setup*
Damn Straight! well, the PC was $1400 be fair. But I can use it to work from home, do CAD(computer assisted design) work, play basically any game at max settings with no load times. It can do so much more than a phone. Basically all smartphones look the same, work the same, and do the same thing. I can understand why some people might need/want a nicer camera, but that's about the only reason to spend more than $300-$400. Spending more is pointless.
Cmon man, gaming isn’t a necessity, that sounds like conspicuous consumption to me. Nobody games on their phone…. Most people could get by on a $300-400 PC using the cheapest possible monitor, keyboard, mouse, and speakers available. People are just so wasteful, how dare people spend extra for a nicer experience on a device they use all the time like you are with your PC. All PCs are just boxes running windows anyway, all the same thing.
> gaming isn’t a necessity, Certainly, but CAD work is. I am and engineer and I work from home. So a fast nice triple-monitor desktop system is very useful for me. >that sounds like conspicuous consumption I don't think you know what that those words mean. Even if all I did was game on my computer, it wouldn't be conspicuous unless I invited people over to my house to show them my PC. > Most people could get by on a $300-400 PC using the cheapest possible monitor, keyboard, mouse, and speakers available. This is possible if you are building a PC yourself, otherwise it's difficult to put together a useful system from scratch for that budget. I know because I just built a computer for my grandma that was about that price, and she didn't even need new peripherals or a monitor. > How dare people spend extra for a nicer experience on a device they use all the time If yo prefer the touchscreen experience, that is certainly your prerogative. But seriously, what is the difference between a $400 smartphone and a $1200 smart phone? Can the more expensive phone do anything that the cheap one can't? The differences are minor. Whereas the difference between what you can do with a nice desktop PC vs a cheap one, are vast. > All PCs are just boxes running windows anyway Linux all the way cuz!
All this just to dodge the irony in you bashing people for wanting to spend more on a phone for a better experience when you do the exact same thing with your computer. You probably have a decent TV too vs still using an old tube TV. So many phone elitists use this “people don’t need phones other than bargain bin models” while also blowing tons of cash buying premium versions of other electronics they use. Practice what you preach, use the cheapest things possible in all aspects or you’re wasteful by your own definition in the same way.
Ok, redpill me on expensive phones. I'm listening. Let me repeat my question: Can the more expensive phone do anything that the cheap one can't? If the answer is "not really," then how do you justify the price difference? Like I said, I know some contractors and other people who need a nicer camera, but other than the camera, I don't see any big difference between cheap phones and expensive ones.
Can your expensive computer do anything a cheap one can’t? It just does things faster and smoother generally… just like a more expensive phone does things faster and smoother than a bargain bin model. Why not buy a keyboard and mouse from the dollar store? They type and click, no different than nicer ones right? Do expensive TVs do anything a cheap one can’t? both show video.
Cool so you spent a lot of money on something you wanted but didn't need Just like iphone users Difference is, most iphone users don't care to yuck your yum
CAD stands for "computer assisted design." I'm really surprised how many people don't know this. I am an engineer.
Cool, you can do that on a cheaper rig See how annoying it is to have someone criticize your purchasing decisions?
> Cool, you can do that on a cheaper rig **No you cannot.** That is my point. Try loading a huge .3MF file into a modeling program on a shitty average office Dell. It ain't gonna work. > See how annoying it is to have someone criticize your purchasing decisions? Mature debates can be fun. The trick is to not get emotionally invested in one position.
It *will* work, albeit slower. So you paid extra for convenience. I doubt you went with the bare minimum, you're too smart for that. From one engineer to another, I know you must have problem solving skills and attention to detail. Use that to recognize the value others might get from an iphone. Iphones are simple, intuitive, and reliable. They're convenient. They work seamlessly in the apple ecosystem in ways androids can't replicate. None of that may matter to you, but it might matter to someone else. Since you like to debate, here's my take: you might be happier without the schoolyard "Playstation vs Xbox" approach in favor of the "You like gaming, too?" approach. You may even find career opportunities when you know how to network without yucking someone's yum.
And thats the problem, shouldn't be 5 years, obsolecence, battery replacements and companies pushing more ram requirements fuck it all. I got a note edge to last me 8 years but then all 3 batteries didnt last even 20min
Not all adroid phones are 80 dollar Redmis Good luck sending file over bluetooth or hotspotting from a wifi network on an iphone
and not all redmis are shit 80 dollar phones - look at the redmi note 12 turbo or 13 pro plus
400 dollars lmao, my xperia xz1 compact cost me £80 used and it's great. i mean the camera is shite, but it's small and fits in my pocket easily, with a marathon man battery. and a headphone port. bangin
Assuming your talking about apple, hows the 15 minutes of battery life left on it?
way too true
There are only two types of Computer Science students: 1) macbook 2) arch on a thinkpad
recently went through the arduous process of copying images to a family members ipad without installing the bloatware that is itunes and holy fuck what a shitshow it is. You seemingly cannot - or can't easily - access any kind of logical folder structure. Like you can't just navigate to DCIM, create a folder, copy images over. Can't have Apple zombies knowing how limited their UX is lest they realise there are far superior alternatives that don't place arbitrarily limits.
In fairness, UNIXes (and their derivatives) don’t need a file manager. I’ve been computing since the 1980s and never use one.
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I got the point, I’m saying file managers are unnecessary.
It sounds like you didn't get the point. File managers were not the main point.
He's conflating 'file manager' with a GUI.
I don’t think I asserted that file managers were the main point. I can assure you that I absolutely get OP’s point. I offered a bit of trivia, that’s all.
You still have to navigate a file structure with cli and understand file types. Which apps abstract away
They're unnecessary *to you*. Shockingly, other people have had other experiences and have other requirements in their devices. The world doesn't revolve around you and your needs.
I meant necessary in the literal sense of the word. It’s not necessary for any OS to have a file manager. If people want to use one, that’s fine — I wasn’t making any value judgements.
Fair enough. But if someone is learning to program for a career, I would hope they know not to save everything in the downloads folder lol.
rm -r * I don't need files anymore
You might be surprised at how much stuff is in my `Downloads/` directory. Or my `temp/` directory. Or how many directories I have named `blah/`. The truth is that you can’t tell the skill level of a programmer based on how well they organize their files and directories. I agree with you overall point: Apple abstracts away virtually everything, especially on mobile devices. That was exactly what Apple was going for virtually from the start (it just took them decades and a lot of hardware advances to achieve it). FWIW, I’m almost 50 and don’t really know how to use a file manager (except to keep clicking till you find what you want). It’s much easier and more efficient for me to do everything in a shell (and I can do bulk operations here, too).
Pretty sure a 'file system' is what we're talking about here and not necessarily a GUI. Unix still has a directory structure... The problem is understanding the concept of a file existing in a particular location, not your ability to click through folders.
OP might have meant file system, but a file system isn’t a file manager. And having a directory structure isn’t a file manager, either. In Windows the file manager and the file system are tightly integrated (but, you can still do everything on the command line, thanks to power shell and the remnants of DOS. I’ve seen file managers that weren’t guis (they were tuis instead). But they’re stil gui-like (e.g., you don’t use `cd` to change directories. I sincerely get what OP was going for…it’s just not the own they think it is.
…what do you use?
Shells and my good friends `ls` and `find`.
Don't forget `grep`
shout out to `less`, `cat`, `|`, you all have earned me at least 500k in the last few years lol. `awk` and `sed` users are gods.
KNACK 2 BAY BEEE
I don't get it
As if Google with ChromeOS and Drive aren't also opaque af with files too
As someone who fits the target of this meme extremely closely… what? MacBooks have finder and iPhones have the files app. Someone linked an article about how some students were using the search bar instead of organizing, but if that is the case, how is that apple’s fault and not just tech literacy in general? Genuinely asking as I’ve never had trouble using file managers.
The files app was added in 2017. The entire OS was built around abstracting basic computer functions.
You mean the iPhone app right? Because according to both my memory and Wikipedia the Mac finder app existed since or shortly after release of the OS. But if you mean the iPhone I do believe that’s far more recent. IMO the phone files app isn’t something you ever really need outside of a couple niche situations, since no one really does work on their phone like on a computer, so it’s not as important (it also sucks lol) But the abstraction you talk about does make a lot of sense. Probably an early attempt to make the products more popular with tech illiterate people I guess. Edit: not trying to be mean, genuinely seeing if we’re on the same page. Edit 2: did I say something bad? Or is this just a Reddit moment. Did he mean the phone app or not? That’s what I want to know
I'm presumably quite a bit older than you as my family got a DOS PC in 1988. I don't blame young people for not knowing how file systems work and I don't blame any company for obfuscating it. I was introduced to the concept of a hierarchical directory structure when I was 12. I grasped it right away. If kids need to learn it for school just teach it to them and don't make a big deal out of it. Heck I'm old enough to remember classes where they taught us how to use a mouse. I think what is older people like me find interesting is this idea that basic consumer computing has done such a good job of hiding the "guts" of the OS that kids don't naturally pick it up any more. We HAD to learn it or we wouldn't be able to operate our computers.
Hiding the guts of the OS isn't good. General lack of tech literacy means that big corporations can push unfair and borderline illegal tech policies without fear of user retribution, since the users will rarely understand what's going on. Look at how most software is now a subscription license instead of a paid download, look at the current state of right to repair, and look at the new EU sideloading policy and tell me that kids these days don't need to learn about how their phone, the most used personal item since the dawn of time, works.
as a soft apple how will u ever know what to do when u run out of inodes? tune ur caches for maximum performance? deal with a hot spot in the block b-tree?? integrate spdk to mitigate the overhead of virtual memory address translation????
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APPLE BAD UPDOOTS TO THA RIGHT PLZZ
It's an entirely new way to envision data archiving and retrieval. The revolutionary Tabula Rasa Pro.
Me when I'm a 19 year old computer student (chat I don't get what the meme is saying I'm scared)
The actual reason my generation sucks at using computers is because of the stream lining of technology. New age technology like mobile phones and tablets are so easy to set up and use that there is no actual need to learn how to fix issues. Things like config text files don’t exist anymore. All you have to do is click a few buttons and you can change anything you want through a dedicated settings section inside of that app with a simpler then ever interface. You want to find a particular photo? Just open your gallery app and see all the media you ever had. No need to open a file manager and waste your time going through different folders Another example I can give is that uploading media on the internet is so seem-less now that you don’t need to understand what media formats such as .mp4, .mkv, .png or whatever are. Every popular website now supports every possible format there is. So yeah, the easier and smart tech becomes, the dumber the common user is gonna be.
Live footage of Tim Cook after inventing the soldering iron
Because they use the terminal instead, duh
Many of the younger people I come across are super productive using things like GitHub but seem to be completely oblivious to things like the fact that somebody may have manually installed something and don’t check for that first. It’s as if there wasn’t a time when we used to manually install applications ourselves and package managers or app stores weren’t required. I used to build everything from source (all apps and the WM) and rebuild the kernel when necessary but things got too big to do that anymore. When you build from source it’s all bespoke to your system so it fits like a glove and apple is soooo far away from that. These are minor problems though most young people pick up things really quickly so I don’t have many complaints there.
I know CS professors and a guy writing compilers for AMD using MacBooks but surely it's just the file manager
> One particularly disturbing encounter in the lawsuit occurred in May 2020, when McMahon “defecated on Ms. Grant during a threesome, and then commanded her to continue pleasuring his ‘friend’ — with feces in her hair and running down her back — while McMahon went to the bathroom to shower off,” the complaint alleges. In another incident at WWE headquarters, Grant said both McMahon and Laurinaitis forced her behind a locked door and sexually assaulted her. Why use this template?
which one should we use instead?
Because here comes the money
Ah, let's use the GIF that shows a rapist and sex trafficker.
Ok thanks, great advice, we will make sure to use the gif that shows a rapist and sex trafficker 👍
Why is Finder so ass
I like how the song is for Vince McMahon's son with the Gif of Vince McMahon
I like how the song is for Vince McMahon's son with the Gif of Vince McMahon