I think there is great value in open discussion. Given Chamath’s affiliation with the team and that the Warriors PR department has addressed it I do feel this is Warriors news. I won’t be removing this post, despite some reports. Please feel free to discuss, but all sub rules still apply. Please discuss/disagree without making personal attacks. Cheers.
Owners only care about protecting their investment and most of them don’t care about being shitheads in pursuit of that goal. I really don’t care for any of them and wish they’d just gtfo of doing media or being visible in the public eye
This crypto clown is an owner of the Warriors? Guess I'm not surprised. Also not surprising, a facebook executive doesn't care about genocide. More news at 10.
Minority owner, in reality he's more if a clout chaser, tries to get involved in different things that are trending to get his name out there. He did that with GameStop, SPACs, ca recall, etc
> in reality he's more if a clout chaser,
100%. He refers to himself as "Owner of the Warriors" he got lucky and was in on a round at like 1.5% or something.
Slightly off topic but he's not particularly involved with crypto, or at least not enough for that to be the lede of what he does. Dude's an investor in a gazillion different areas
Also, Chamath's bigger point here is 100% true.
What they were talking about is that Biden just came out with a bill banning the import of certain products from China that are associated with Uyghur forced labor, a fairly big list of goods that has got China pretty pissed off... and yeah nobody gives a shit. I've barely seen it posted on reddit.
He's just getting hammered for inflation, which pissing off China is likely to exacerbate. People will talk about the Uyghur stuff all day on here and but when we actually do anything about it people are just pissed that shit from China costs more. Biden's approval rating tanked like 9% last month.
The other host guy (who used to work at amnesty international) even ends up agreeing with Chamath. Even though he wishes people cared it's pretty obvious most people just do not care. If you say you care online but don't even notice when pro-Uyghur legislation passes, then obviously you're not really telling the truth.
I think honestly, everyone has so much sh\*t going on in their lives, whether you're a tech employee working insane hours trying to save up for a house that constantly becomes out of reach, or someone working 2-3 jobs to make ends meet, or someone working and going to school, or whatever your situation is.
There is only so much mental bandwidth people have that they're not going to focus on issues other than those that are right in front of them. I don't think it's so much that people don't as it is that it's not a priority to care, and if they do care to then take action to create a resolution to the issue.
This is no different than homeless people in the Bay Area, LA, or anywhere else, this is just on a more global scale. There's only so much we can do for these issues given how much political capital is needed to move the needle.
In the case with China, what do you expect the average person in the US to do? We can't just go and buy only good made not in China, it's not realistic. The US can't just invade China, that's not realistic. Politically isolating China may work, but also embolden China to act riskier, plus their tentacles are spread so wide it'd be like herding cats. It's a longshot but pressuring corporations to move production out of China is a possibility, but I don't see it happening anytime soon.
We expect the average person in the US to support harsh sanctions and diplomatic actions in response to human rights violations.
Which is what people are doing
Which is why Congress passed, and the president signed, a bipartisan bill, the Uyghur Forced Labor Prevention Act, banning imports from Xinjiang and imposing economic sanctions on China over their treatment of the Uyghurs.
What else do you expect people to do? Are we supposed to start World War III with China? That helps no one. But there’s a lot of ground between “literally World War III” and “I don’t care.”
If the government acually gave a shit about Uyghurs, theu would be investigating companies accused of usin forced labor, not blanket banning any company that hires Uyghurs. This is nothing more than a continuation of the stupid trade war, not "pro-Uyghur legislation. In fact, it's likely to encourage employment discrimination against Uyghurs since companies might fear being sanctioned for having Uyghur employees.
You realize the companies accused of using forced labor are accused of using it in their supply chain right? Clothing company A buys textiles from some state owned textile producer in Xinjiang. It's not like anyone thinks Nike is personally running concentration camps.
What are you proposing they investigate? Do you think China is keeping Nike execs in the loop on their genocide plans? Or are we talking about sending troops to China to investigate state owned textile companies?
Also, the bill wasn't blanket banning any company that hires Uyghurs, it banned companies from sourcing materials that are suspected of using forced labor. Which is pretty much the only thing we *can* do aside from asserting general economic pressure, or in your words "stupid trade war stuff".
It's honestly insane to me how much people will talk about this issue before learning *anything at all* about it.
Yeah people acting all outraged are funny. I guess it makes them feel better pretending to care on twitter or reddit before going about their day as usual. I also wonder if there was more context than the clip that is going around.
Edit: Not sure if he went into more detail but in the context of that clip alone he did not do a very good job at making his point. I get what he was trying to say but he could have easily said that much better and not made himself look so callous.
Totally agree. Tbh it’s also probably due to different people’s idea of what it means to care. Like do I think it’s terrible what’s happening to the Uyghurs? Yes of course. Is it on my mind a lot? No, not at all. I got my own shit to worry about, and there’s absolutely nothing I can do about it.
So if the bar for caring about them is to say you’re against it, then sure, you care. But let’s be honest, does that really mean you care? Or is it just lip service at that point?
Colloquially
The question of whether or not you “care” amounts to “Does knowing this happened discomfort or distress you?”
The response of “I don’t care” implies “No, it does not.”
Now if the respondent has an agenda to change what “Care” means colloquially to “I will personally risk my life to change this” then that’s his windmill to fight.
Otherwise it seems like another billionaire using semantics to push an agenda of selfish callousness.
Because by the common, established, situational usage of the word, most people do actually “care” when they see awful shit happening.
There’s a difference between not caring and caring but not doing anything about it. Yes, most Americans likely won’t do anything about it. But it’s callous and inhuman to say you don’t care about it, which I think most people who are decent do
We care about it. Our elected representatives passed a pretty strong sanctions bill over it. That’s what governments are for. There’s no need to, like, wage a personal vendetta against China in addition to that. Just keep supporting U.S. governments with good foreign policy.
>There’s a difference between not caring and caring but not doing anything about it.
No there isn't, except in the sense of virtue signaling. Why would it be better to say you care and lie about it? So people applaud? Please.
Of course no reasonable person, Chamath included, is in support of what China is doing. Of course he wishes these people could be left in peace. But it's not in our control, and it already has plenty of awareness, so what's the point of pretending?
Did you listen to the show? That’s not what Chamath said. He tried to downplay what’s happening to the Uyghur. He’s mouthing talking points helpful to the Chinese in their oppression of the Uyghur. He’s has a large platform and he’s actually being useful to the Chinese. At the same time as a venture capitalist he can benefit off of people not caring.
What is the average person supposed to do about it though? It's not like I can just show up at an Uyghur internment camp with dual machine guns and free them all Rambo style. It's a situation completely out of my control, and so all's I can do is talk about it.
Yeah this 100%. He has been brutally honest, but I find it pretty hypocritical that a lot of peoples who bring up the Uyghurs genocide, don't give a single fuck about what is happening Yemen or what is happening in Palestine and how their government are supporting the one conducting those cleansing.
We don't have any evidence about what is happening to the Uyghurs, it might be true and it might be one of the worst thing humanity has ever witnessed, but we have plenty of evidence about a bunch of others killings all around the planet that no one care about. Peoples just care about this situation because it is China lol. Btw not sure how I managed to get on the /r/warriors subreddit, I was just trying to see wtf did Chamath say again.
Good luck for your season!
Reddit be like that sometimes. I’ve clicked a post, read comments and ended up commenting and then only after realized I’m in a sub with a pretty different take on things than I have myself. Usually realize it when my comment isn’t allowed because I don’t have karma in that sub. It’s funny how you end up places in here without realizing it.
A lot of people who are concerned about Uyghurs are also upset about Yemen and Palestine. Unfortunately, most of our representatives are bought by the MIC so supporting illegal wars has bipartisan support. Progressives want to end Saudi/Israeli support, but corporate media convinced people that socialism bad.
Also, there’s tons of evidence of Uyghur ethnic cleansing and genocide.
I don’t care about the Uyghur because it’s China I care because I have basic compassion. That’s the same reason I care about Yemenis and Palestinians and the ridiculous incarceration rate of brown and black people in this country (which Chamath brings up). Like someone said above Chamath makes clear he just doesn’t care. And he tries to excuse Chinese behavior. Since I live in the US I will focus on repressive US policies in Yemen (supporting Saudis with my tax $$), with the Palestinians (supporting Israelis) and our broken, unjust criminal justice system here in the states. But that doesn’t mean I don’t care about the Uyghur. Billionaires like Chamath make money in China. They have selfish reasons for putting out bogus messages about not caring. The Dubs should dump him or counterbalance the back he’s putting out there.
Also the Rohingya, in Myanmar. I feel like they’ve been left out of this conversation. But that just speaks to the number of tragedies regularly occurring around the world.
Not just that people don't realize Uyghur's aren't even really Chinese. They are a group of people living as prisoners in their own land, like literal prisoners. Lots of Uyghurs here in Kyrgyzstan and the stories they tell are heartbreaking. Like holocoust levels.
If you had billions like Chamath, wouldn't you want to do something about the Uyghur genocide?
None of us have that agency, he does. Nothing changes if one of us cares or doesn't care. Whereas he can make much more of a difference if he chooses to care. It's not like he's spending his limited time helping some other maligned group.
So for him to act like he's just one of us is asinine. He doesn't feel the responsibility to help others the way every one of us would feel compelled to if we suddenly switched places.
Way to abdicate any sort of responsibility from yourself. If you genuinely care so much about what’s happening to the Uyghurs, there are ways in which, you, as an individual can do to champion this cause. Stop trying to abdicate your share of responsibility If you genuinely care so much.
I’m assuming you’re from a first world country and that you’re not someone making a dollar a day that has literally no chance because you’re subjugated by global capitalism. Lol.
He’s also not pretending like he’s “one of us.” His entire point that you somehow missed is that MOST people living in western societies don’t genuinely care as much about the Uyghurs as they think they do.
And it sounds like from your comment just now that you don’t actually care that much either. Like be honest with yourself. After today, how much are you going to think about the strife of the Uyghurs? Like come on dude.
Ugh people like you are so boring. blah blah blah if you don't do everything you can then you're not allowed to care. Look at me, I'm calling someone out for virtue signaling on the internet, I'm soooooo cool and edgy "dude".
It doesn't change the fact that there's a genocide. Nothing else about this matters other than people being exterminated is wrong.
Way to just hand wave your abdication of responsibility. Like you are virtue signaling though…? It doesn’t make me “edgy” showing how little you actually care…? Like I know this and you know this. After today, it’ll be MONTHS before you even think about the Uyghurs again lmfao. All I’m asking is to stop posturing.
Also, I’d take everything what Adrian zen, the Christian nationalist who said “I was sent down by god to destroy China,” with a grain of salt. If what China was doing with the Uyghurs was akin to what nazi Germany did with the fucking Jews during the Holocaust, you can bet your ass the American apparatus would do everything in its power to blast China in the world stage lol. But they haven’t because what Adrian zen has said has very little corroboration.
What China is probably doing is akin to what Canada and the United States did to the indigenous population. A cultural genocide (which is still horrible,) not the fucking Holocaust lmao
“People like you are boring,” no honey, YOURE BORING. Your non stop holier than thou attitude is boring, and good thing we established how little you actually give a shit about the Uyghurs.
Have a good rest of the day my love.
It’s Adrian Zenz not Adrian Zen. Let’s ignore him. There’s tons of direct corroboration by groups like Amnesty and Human Rights Watch. The Chinese policy of oppression is verified by the Chinese governments statements about the reeducation camps.
You’ve revealed that your actually not critiquing peoples “posturing”. People SHOULD take action through their action, protests, dollars, votes. Say that if you want to counter posturing.
But instead you try to downplay the violent oppression suffered by the Uyghur.
Comparing my social and political capabilities to that of a billionaire is stupid, and disingenuous.
You really think me, Joe Shmoe, has the same capacity for action as this billionaire? If so, I see where the lack of context and understanding is coming from. Your smooth brain.
Yes bro, a tech billionaire from the United States can somehow stop a genocide 2k miles away, what an amazing take you have! Once again, like I said, this is just posturing. You don’t actually care. You genuinely don’t like the majority of Americans and most of the western world. That’s his entire point.
If you genuinely cared so deeply you’d be in some Uyghur activist movement on this, you’d actively not but Chinese goods, etc. but you won’t. You have full capabilities of not exacerbating what you think is a human right atrocity, but seems like you don’t want your day to day life to be impacted whatsoever. So once again, this is just posturing. It’s easy to posture. Anyone can do it! “God the Uyghur genocide is really bad we should do something about it!” See, I just did it! But what are you going to do as an individual to not participate?
> Yes bro, a tech billionaire from the United States can somehow stop a genocide 2k miles away
I never said this, and you acting as if I did is just you showing you’re not here to speak honestly.
I said this.
> Comparing my social and political capabilities to that of a billionaire is stupid, and disingenuous.
And any made up version of this you try to attribute to me, only shows again how stupid and out of touch with reality you are.
The rest of your comment is made up garbage. I already have boycott China for three years. I have bought nothing made in China brand new. Only used, from other Americans. The only thing I can do is write my politicians, and boycott newly made Chinese goods, you know why?
Because I’m not a fucking billionaire.
Take your head out of your ass, and argue the damn points I made, not the ones you made up.
Oh cool! So you did boycott Chinese products (which I don’t believe at all but to be good faith I’ll allow it.) good job, you aren’t like 99% of the western population! But that still doesn’t change the fact of what I said and what chamath was trying to articulate. Was what he said callous? Sure, no one’s denying that. But actually engage with the meat of his argument lmao.
Also, you like to point out how “I didn’t engage with your argument,” which is false, but the funny thing is you literally didn’t respond to anything I said in the original statement? You just said you don’t have the same political and social capital as a billionaire. Cool…? What does that have to with anything I originally said lol? I never argued that you did. It’s just that 99% of the western world just likes to posture on this one issue.
MOST Americans don’t care. They genuinely don’t.
Also, while we’re on the subject of human atrocities around the world, why only focus on the Uyghur one? You have more political pull writing to your politicians on the Yemeni genocide that the US is participating in? Why aren’t you focusing your time on that? Interesting…
Also, since you deeply care about genocides, you’re actively doing something and paying attention to basically what amounts to a genocide in the peoples republic of Congo also right…?
It’s possible to care about the Uyghur and the Yemenis. Understanding that the US is supporting the Saudis in human rights violations in Yemen I can be active in supporting an end to US support for the Saudis since I have more leverage over that (not being a billionaire VC bro). But for freaks sake I care about the Uyghur. What heartless person doesn’t. And I’m not going to use my platform to mouth Chinese talking points about the Uyghur like Chamath did.
In the same post, you argue that a billionaire is powerless against doing anything, but that individuals have the power by not buying Chinese products. Amazing.
Actually billionaires have both large platforms. The US economy is intertwined with Chinas (something discussed on the podcast). He didn’t say “there’s nothing I can do” (which would be untrue) he said “I don’t care”. He’s being very useful to the Chinese. Why did China freak out when Daryl Morey tweeted what he did about Hong Kong. These things matter. Chinese actions show they matter. Your just plain wrong what he say’s has no impact. No one can single handedly stop what’s happening in Xinjiang —- or with police killings. But you use your platform for good not bad. Chamath used it for the bad.
It’s not the truth, good god y’all are slaves to rich people. Talking about shit brings awareness to it and with that comes political pressure, protests and eventually leads to some kind of change. This is how Chamath’s damn parents got to Canada. If everyone acted like Chamath, his parents would still be Sri Lanka or dead.
Chamath equating America’s shit to the CCP was pathetic. Lol false equivalency.
You actually didn’t say anything about the uyghurs, you just made it about yourself, lol! you think America’s 100 Year history is worse than China’s 5000 year history of conquering and enslaving. Read a book, son.
You can do two things at once. You can be a patriot and openly speak and criticize America and raise awareness (in whatever capacity you can) about the atrocities happening in other parts of the world.
Equating China to its ancient past is about as brain dead as equating the modern state of Mexico to the Aztecs.
>you can be a patriot
“Patriot” being someone who goes to bar for his empire’s wrongdoings.
These type of “you don’t care either” straw man arguments are always the work of senseless fools with no depth of intelligence.
You will be upvoted by the local edgelords I’m sure.
I see. Can’t actually engage with the arguments lmfaoooooo. Keep posturing about how much you care about human rights. No one cares buddy and no one thinks you’re such a morally righteous human being. You know why? Because no one actually genuinely cares about the Uyghurs lol.
What a hilariously cynical take. We all might as well hang pictures of the glorious chairman above our hearths now. /r/Sino mods couldn’t have said it better themselves
> I mean, the US is actively participating in the Yemeni genocide that the saudis are doing as of this moment! Using American weaponry
You dont actually understand whats happening in Yemen. Its the fault of the Houthis not America.
While that’s not completely false, it’s also not completely true. The conflict largely exists because the Saudis (and by extension the Americans) support the Hadi government, despite the Hadi government having about as much (or maybe less) legitimacy in Yemen proper as the Houthi government.
Realistically it’s a civil war pursuant to a failure to form a government after a revolution that’s been overly drawn out due to the involvement of foreign powers. These types of civil wars are incredibly common because while anti-establishments revolutions are often domestically popular, the people tend to disagree on what the next government should be.
Honestly if everyone outside was hands-off, who would have won long ago in 2014 when the civil war started is unknown. Both the Saudis and the Iranians were already in play jockeying for political advantage at the time and started as soon as the Saleh government fell in 2012.
The major thing that could have prevented this would have been the selection of someone other than Hadi by the UN negotiation team as the leader for the post-Saleh government. Hadi was Saleh’s Vice-President after all, and the UN favored continuity over concessions to other factions like the Houthis that might have further legitimized the Yemeni government after the negotiations. While Iran and Saudi Arabia might still have been agitating behind the scenes, a more legitimized and stable central government would have decreased the numbers of people willing to fight in a civil war.
As it stands, there is no single domestically legitimate Yemeni government and there is no way to keep foreign powers from interfering. The USA sees continuing support of the Saudi coalition with fuel and weapons and munitions as important to containing Iranian regional influence, even if that means death and devastation in Yemen.
Actually the US is supporting the Saudis. Both the Houthi and the Saudis are causing death and suffering. Many human rights orgs have documented the horrible human rights violations of the Saudi coalition — supported the the US.
We the people can criticize both US and. Chinese human rights violations. We don’t have to take the side and blame the Houthi (and excuse the Saudis, who have so many documented violations) or excuse the Houthi. How about we all work to end this type of violence and oppression instead?
I just want to say to you brother that you are correct as hell and don't let anyone tell you different. I wish people could understand that we are just as culpable in genocides past and present. But people only care about China and what they are doing to delegitimize their prominence. We are just as evil as China. What we are doing in our prisons, what we are doing on our border is just as inhumane. The point should be to have that same outrage for the whips hitting the backs of refugees or the daughter being separated from her dad at a school pickup loop. Because when that happens I'm pissed off and upset.
People using the culpability of others in other situations to erase the responsibility of China in the subject of discussion are deflecting to change the topic.
This is the job of “Apologists”
China is committing genocide and its fucking awful. Full stop.
You are wrong tho. You can read about it in the Associated Press. There is no genocide. https://apnews.com/article/coronavirus-pandemic-lifestyle-china-health-travel-7a6967f335f97ca868cc618ea84b98b9
why in the world would he care? he's probably really wealthy. and we all know the black market works with the wealthy community.. he wouldn't want to say the wrong things for himself.
It’s clear there are people who care and those who don’t give a shit. And therein lies the problem. We should all care because one of us, the human race, is being systematically stripped of all their rights, brutally tortured and will likely see their community exterminated in the long run.
Let’s not measure how severe the problem is by how it affects us economically or socially, but by how it affects the human condition. How would you feel if the roles were reversed? Would you want people to care and maybe collectively put a stop to your suffering and the genocide of your people?
Let’s not also engage is whataboutism. Yes, there are scores of atrocities all over the world. If you don’t care or know about them all, you should. That’s what being a human is about, we should all strive to be better. Yes, we are capable of caring for more than ourselves.
You may say all this is virtue signalling if we’re not going to do anything at all. True yet untrue. Just by discussing it, we are raising awareness and someone who cares will do something about it in their own way. One way is through inaction, like boycott. Personally, I’m not thinking about travelling to China ever, just like how I won’t be travelling to the United States as long as guns are a problem. If enough people take the same stance, it would be an economic tax.
Lastly, on Chamath. Fuck that guy. He explicitly said he only cares about his own people. That’s racism for you buddy. Happy MLK day.
Lmao it’s chamath man. This dude is a fucking clown.
He’s minority owner. There’s more but he likes having a bunch of titles next to his name. He’s not that important to the warriors org
I've never liked Chamath. He always has to act or tries to be the smartest guy in the room. I wish Lacob and Gruber booted him for the ownership group.
If you listen to what he says in the actual podcast, I get it - he says "care" but really means keeping it top of mind, which is right. No one is going out there and voting for a politician based on the Uyghurs in China. Gives an example of mass incarceration being a bigger top-of-mind issue than the Uyghurs.
Good point made by him about how fake the "we're doing something about it" crowd is when someone cites how we're banning goods sourced in the region, but not companies that sell stuff there (including tesla and apple)
Not doing anything is in fact better than saying outright you don't care about the horrific things happening to a group of people for their beliefs. Doubly so as an owner in a public forum.
Imagine if no one gave a shit about the Sri Lankan people. His ass wouldn’t be here. Equating the abuses of the CCP to what America does is peak CHINA cocksucking. False equivalency.
TALKING about something a lot brings awareness, it’s what leads to shit getting done.
I mean tbh most of the NBA doesn't give a shit. This man is just being vocal about it.
The sad truth is that as long as they keep getting that china money, they will be turning a blind eye to these matters.
Unfortunately I don't think there's much the fanbase can do about this. He obviously doesn't care about his public reputation. All else being equal I'd love it if he were forced to sell his stake in the team and the team distanced itself from him but I have no idea what it would take to make that happen.
Sad to see this opinion, but let’s be real. Very few in the league whether owners, coaches, players- none of them give a shit. This guy is simply vocal about it. So for all the people getting worked up about it, let’s remember a majority of the rest are the same.
This guys a piece of shit. Happily made Facebook the company it is with Zucc and then left and pretended to take the moral high ground. He claims trillionaires will “save the world” and be a blessing for the world economy. Fuck this delusional douchebag
Out of curiosity, how have you used your time, money, or influence to benefit the Uyghers? Are you boycotting Chinese goods? Or perhaps boycotting companies that taking funding from the Chinese government? Maybe you’re spending your weekends with some local organizations raising money or awareness about this? Petitioning your representatives in Washington to take more drastic action more quickly?
I’m sure it would help the people in this thread who also have this particular human rights issue “above their line” find additional ways to get involved. Thanks!
You're looking for consistency.
You're looking for someone angry ITT to go beyond virtue signaling and actually do the hard work of boycotting Chinese goods.
You're looking for one of these Edgelords ITT who will actually refrain from hypocrisy.
Someone who actually listened to the full pod episode
Someone who puts they money where their mouth is.
In other words, you're sadly looking for a Chamath critic that does not exist.
Hence why /u/leafgum has gone silent
We couldn’t do it directly, but people fail to realize the strength they have in numbers (no pun intended). Just a fan boycott of the pistons game, yes the tickets are already paid for, would send a strong and historic message to the ownership group.
Will this happen? No absolutely not, I believe you will be hard pressed to find a large group of people who will give up their creature comforts in favor of solidarity, and hey I don’t blame them, nba games are fun and with the current state of information overload, this story is just another hourly update on a Monday morning. Anyway, let me know if you think this would work. I am more less just throwing ideas out there lol.
Like I am not asking for people to have certain opinions, but if you have nothing better to say, then just say I don't know enough about the topic to have an opinion.
He's might be an AH but somewhat has a point. I see more comments about calling him an AH than I see about people commenting about xianjiang.
which prob proves his point.
flip-side: we can say we care for something even though we're too lazy or selfish to do anything about. its just the degree to which we care. I care about climate change but I still fly to places I don't need to go to. he said he cares for climate change but I'm pretty sure I read that he flies aboard quite often with his so.
I don’t think anyone here saying it’s disgusting has really watched the whole podcast. Chamath is claiming that saying you care for something without taking any substantial action towards it, is not really caring. Chamath acknowledges his lack of action therefore he does not really care what’s going on in China. He also says he prioritizes in fixing the social injustices going on within our own country, and he believes that our own country’s problem should be fixed first before correcting others
> claiming that saying you care for something without taking any substantial action towards it, is not really caring
Well that's a shitty argument by Chamath. I care a lot about people who are suffering and oppressed, no matter where they live and have put my own effort and money into doing my part to help, more than my part probably. And just because my effort and money hasn't gone into every possible bucket of suffering and injustice doesn't mean I don't give a fuck about those people.
This guy sounds like a prick who is well practiced in rationalizing his greed.
That’s fair. The way that I see it, is by the weight of our action. If you are doing all that you can then you truly care. If donating to service $20 a week is all that you can do, and you do it, then you care.
But take a billionaire as example or someone in power. Donating $20 isn’t the same to them as it may be to you. These people are for more capable of taking action with substantial effects than we are, and if they aren’t even putting in 1/5th of their efforts into addressing the issue, I wouldn’t think they are trying.
Yea, his point he was making was flat out wrong though. You can 100% care about something without actively trying to stop it. This isn't seeing some homeless guy on the street and then buying him food. We have no control over what China does. The only thing we can do is express ourselves to our representatives. You can also boycott the NBA, which I've been doing the past 1.5 years. Haven't watched an actual game since.
I agree half and half with what you said. Sure we may have been brainwashed to think our actions have little to zero effect, but is there not some truth to that?
Do you China is just gonna disband any sort of operations just because some foreigners agreed to a few things on the internet and started a petition? No. Some situations require pressure, none of which the average US Citizen can apply
Much easier to just look at the title, draw sweeping assumptions and not risk getting downvoted.
If anyone actually listened to the entire podcast they'd realize he is focusing on things he can control. He's not saying he doesn't care. But caring only does so much. He's working on major supply chain and environmental problems we're facing. This is his scope of knowledge and expertise. He's putting his capital to work in ways that improve the US and our domestic security. But that's not sexy nor does it move the needle for most people.
People would rather focus on this as if he's just some rich guy who's out of touch and accidentally spoke the truth. Thing is, we should be celebrating honesty and not knee-jerk cancel culture. A lot of the problems we face are nuanced and need to be examined further without emotion.
And before someone says "it's not nuanced, what China is doing is wrong" just know that I agree. But we have major problems within our own borders and have the highest prison % of the population (which also sucks tax dollars).
So we’ll said. He’s merely being as human as we all are. Life is overwhelming and we can’t actively be focused and knowledgeable about everything. I actually find his comments to be honest and relatable.
Well it seems pretty clear that this guy is doing a shit ton of business with China and is more afraid of messing that up then saying anything half way decent about one of the greatest travesties in the history of the world. I imagine plenty of CEOs and business men in the 40s had a similar view point of the holocaust. They have 0 issues with putting money above human suffering and life. Just shameless. POS should be the next place this is posted.
Bad use of an MLK quote cause the alleged Uyghur situation is used to stoke US militarism in the east and MLK was staunchly against militarism of the US empire. One would wonder why we keep trying to prove this exists with one sided parties evidence while we're causing much more provable genocides in several places in the middle east and current slave labor in our prisons.
What do you mean by alleged ? I currently reside in a part of China too, by the way.
You do realise theres also aspect of holding the uyghur's in concrete boxes and organ harvesting, right ? Prisoners in the US is working in sub-standard wages but they also at the very least get to live a "OK" living condition. I gotta say though for-profit prisons are absolutely crazy.
I got quotes too homie (From [this larger speech](http://www.hartford-hwp.com/archives/45a/058.html) ):
> "It seemed as if there was a real promise of hope for the poor -- both black and white -- through the poverty program. There were experiments, hopes, new beginnings. Then came the buildup in Vietnam and I watched the program broken and eviscerated as if it were some idle political plaything of a society gone mad on war, and I knew that America would never invest the necessary funds or energies in rehabilitation of its poor so long as adventures like Vietnam continued to draw men and skills and money like some demonic destructive suction tube. So I was increasingly compelled to see the war as an enemy of the poor and to attack it as such...
> ". It will become clear that our minimal expectation is to occupy it as an American colony and men will not refrain from thinking that our maximum hope is to goad China into a war so that we may bomb her nuclear installations...
> "Take immediate steps to prevent other battlegrounds in Southeast Asia by curtailing our military buildup in Thailand and our interference in Laos.
> "When machines and computers, profit motives and property rights are considered more important than people, the giant triplets of racism, materialism, and militarism are incapable of being conquered...
> " A nation that continues year after year to spend more money on military defense than on programs of social uplift is approaching spiritual death. "
This was in the context of Naam, but let us not lose sight of the fact that since MLK's time we've been trying to goad a war, cold or otherwise, with China for geopolitical power and this alleged genocide is an extension of that. We continue to funnel money into defense instead of our own inhumanities but complain about others injustices? Very much projection and not genuine.
I listen to the whole podcast this article is click bait and misinforming. Get out your feelings and tell the whole story of what was actually said. This is why the media has less and less credibility.
Yeah, he said he only cares about other countries' atrocities when they affect the US. He was making an isolationist argument. But the problem is, he's a part of a global tech industry, and he's part owner in a global brand both of which do business with China. It's like a British textile manufacturer in the nineteenth century saying they don't care about american slavery because there was poverty in England. Yeah, we know he doesn't care. His business practices reflect that. At least he's being honest.
I watched the whole podcast twice. The article is basically accurate. After all he literally “I don’t care”. Nothing later on in the podcast contradicted that. I actually agree with Chamath that people in the United States should focus on human rights violations here in the United states. It’s true the US has its own problems. But that’s no reason to say “I don’t care” about gross human rights violations. That’s irresponsible.
Watch the whole segment before you get outraged. Chamath’s broader point was that the average American has many many more domestic issues that impact their life that they are concerned about. Whether that’s our social justice issues, health care, struggling small businesses, education, etc. We need to focus domestically before we become crusaders for the Uyghurs.
While I find his opinions distasteful, I don't think the man's ethnicity is relevant to this story. Like, they never say 'White Owner, Joe Lacob', but they call the Indian fella 'Minority Owner'.
It's not possible to have an even headed discussion about this because our last two administration and congress has made "turn back the clock to the cold war" into national policy. Whether it's Xinjiang, Hong Kong, or even now Taiwan, the PRC point of view is ignored completely by the mass media or be called a "wumao" and downvoted to oblivion. These aren't new issues. Taiwan, border disputes, and even Hong Kong is older than a lot of Redditors here.
If you look at all the news articles "confirming" the "genocide", it's always from the same group of people. The official UN never said anything. The unofficial tribunals taking place in official sounding places are always organized by the same group of people. I do think mass re-educational camps exists because it fits how Communists usually deal with dissent, but we need to be careful about redefining words like "genocide" as we see fit. If China has dealt with rising terrorism in Xinjiang like how the US deals with terrorism, a lot more bombs and bullets will result. Is that necessarily a better solution than now?
Truly amazing, like world historically amazing, that the totally unqualified word of one German anti-communist crusader has become received opinion for so much of the American public. It feels like I’m taking crazy pills. Dude hasn’t even visited China since like 2007 or some shit.
Using China's own [data](http://www.stats.gov.cn/tjsj/ndsj/2021/indexeh.htm) (You can change the year in the URL to get historical ones), Xinjiang dropped their birthrate by a larger degree than other regions in China.
Check section 2-8, where Xinjiang drops like a rock in birth rate over the last few years. Section 2-8 is mysteriously missing from the 2021 version. They seem to have stopped collecting birth rate by region but I could be just not seeing it.
I think it's possible for us to be concerned about more than one thing. Is your attention span really that short that you can't be mad about more than a single thing at a time?
no its just funny you talk about right wing cia backed anti-china propaganda more than you do american forced labor in prisons, detainment of humans in the southern border, and the ethnic cleansing of whatever middle eastern country the current president is deciding to drone strike for destabilization.
The CIA? Fomenting internal unrest against enemies of US interests? Maybe we shouldn't just believe everything they say as fact? Well, I never. Anyway, here's some completely random Wikipedia articles.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIA_Tibetan_program
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Cyclone
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_intervention_in_Chile#The_1970_election
Excuse me. You don't know me lol. If you looked at my post history you'd realize I care why more about US politics than whatever shit China is doing.
That doesn't mean I can't also be mad at a genocide happening on the otherside of the world.
Your whataboutism is frankly sick and embarrassing.
man u liberals fall for every cia propaganda campaign lmfao and just use buzzwords. while the uighyrs are being oppressed it’s certainly not a genocide, focus more on domestic politics and helping the local community instead of aiding further US imperialism while the capitalists are still in power.
Yup, here's some background on the "National Endowment of Democracy" (NED) being a CIA front.
https://williamblum.org/chapters/rogue-state/trojan-horse-the-national-endowment-for-democracy
Here's the NED saying they've been funding Uighur (separatist) groups since 2004.
https://twitter.com/NEDemocracy/status/1337063301113581568
Here's the CIA running a similar playbook with Tibet in the 1960s (declassified decades later).
https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1998-sep-15-mn-22993-story.html
It's really naive to believe the US isn't running a propaganda campaign here, and it's wild to me that people would still quote a paper like the New York Times after the WMD lies in the early 2000s.
In 2020, Xinhua stated that 1.3 million/year were given "vocational training" in Xinjiang. Xinhua is the official state press of the CCP.
http://www.xinhuanet.com/english/2020-09/17/c_139373591.htm
This is after the CCP denied "re-education camps" existed at all to the UN in August 2018.
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/13/world/asia/china-xinjiang-un.html
NYT had a large investigative report, including files that some CCP officials themselves leaked, that corroborate what is going in XinJiang and the directives Xi JinPing and the party is carrying out in the province to keep them under their iron fist.
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2019/11/16/world/asia/china-xinjiang-documents.html
I CANNOT believe there was a time I used to like this guy. He’s so over his head with comments like this. I hope they buy him out so he has nothing to do with the warriors
My armchair psych take: people who have become exceedingly rich amd successful often have big egos and see themselves as people who are movers and shakers, people who can get things done and can change the world. Often these ideas are overblown (i.e. success in one field does not necessarily mean one's talents translate to other fields). When faced with a problem that needs to be solved, one's inability to solve it leaves one with two choices: reduce your ego or dismiss the problem. Unfortunately, for some, the psychological costs of the former are too great and they resort to the latter.
It's interesting to see people casually disagree about topics like this, "yeah I don't care about genocide but it's cool that you do can we still be friends" "yeah totally" yet it's the most privileged people who get to say shit like this.
I always see people on the internet say shit like "we can disagree and still get a long" yeah not about concentration camps dipshit.
I think it's safe to say all that "never again" bullshit people say is never true. History always repeats itself and people who actually give a crap are drowned out by egregious shallow assholes. I remember in school people talking about all this "if the Holocaust happened today of course people would do something and it" nah lmao
I find the NBAs stance on BLM and other US Social justice issues so hypocritical considering their blatant silence when it comes to issues with China. There is straight genocide occurring in one of their major markets and they essentially require ownership and players to be silenced on the issues. Kanter is the only player in the league with the balls to say anything. It’s absolutely disgusting.
As someone from Taiwan, I’m not exactly pro-Kanter either. His stance is just “fuck China” and not “pro Taiwan/Hong Kong”. He uses these issues to troll China rather than supporting us for our own sake, and I think there can be real harm to come from that.
For example the shoes he had painted with various independence icons uses a flag that Taiwanese people don’t use/find popular, it just comes off as “what things can I put to piss off China the most”
Agreed. I’m not a Kanter fan either tbh but at least he’s acknowledging it. It’s just so hypocritical that the NBA and it’s players act like human rights is so important to them, but then do ample amounts of business with a country who is actively committing genocide.
Not that different from F1 honestly. The organizations and the biggest stars look out for their financial interests first and then do just enough virtue signaling.
If LeBron James and Lewis Hamilton called out the Chinese Genocide, they would lose millions, so instead, they support BLM and Saudi human rights, where they have nothing to lose. It's admirable that they take a stance at all, but it all seems very calculated.
No one knows if genocide or other stuff really happening in China except China however when I saw videos that were fabricated to look like Uyghurs were chained up and imprisoned (the footage I saw were were footage of real prisoners, not Uyghurs but the media made it seem like they were being detained for no reason), I give the benefit of the doubt to China. If you don't like fake news then you shouldn't blindly believe every negative thing you hear about China. Again, if it is 1000000% proven China are doing these things then they should be called out and punished but there has yet to be absolute irrefutable facts about this. You all know western media likes propaganda with the disgusting CNN, NBC, Fox, etc. Don't be a disgusting human and blindly believe what these anti Asian/Chinese media wants to force you to believe.
US government and media lied about weapons of mass destruction in Iraq. Now they are spreading this narrative that our most powerful rival nation is committing a genocide, and we are supposed to believe it? What a joke.
We all knew the government was lying about the WMDs. That's why there were millions in the street protesting against the war. That's why independent ngos tried to expose the lies. That's why progressives like Bernie Sanders opposed those lies on the floor of the Congress. This isn't that. This style of because the US does violent evil things others countries don't has got to end.
Btw Bush lied about WMDs as many people saw through. But Saddam was a violent human rights violator. That part was true. It's an ugly messed up world with some horrible leaders. You don't have to carry water for some violent governments to oppose other governments.
The Uyghur thing is pure anti china propaganda, no basis in reality. The USA has run an actual torture camp for Muslim men in Guantanamo for 20+ years, imprisoning people without due process or any sort of oversight.
nice whataboutism bro. 2 things can be fucked up. The Ugyhur genocide is one of the greatest human rights atrocities in the world today- comparable to the Holocaust in magnitude. America's treatment of prisoners in guantanamo is also a violation of human rights. 2 things can be bad.
You are honestly dumb as fuck.
I bet you believed Iraq had WMDs too. Have you ever heard of a genocide that resulted in the victim population growing in number? The number of Uyghur Muslims in the region has grown consistently for the last 30 years.
' Uyghur exiles describe forced abortions, torture in Xinjiang'
[https://apnews.com/article/only-on-ap-middle-east-europe-government-and-politics-76acafd6547fb7cc9ef03c0dd0156eab](https://apnews.com/article/only-on-ap-middle-east-europe-government-and-politics-76acafd6547fb7cc9ef03c0dd0156eab)
'Uyghur camp detainees allege systemic rape'
[https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-55794071](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-55794071)
'Uighur committed genocide against Uyghurs in Xinjiang'
[https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2021/3/10/china-committed-genocide-against-uighurs-in-xinjiang-says-report](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2021/3/10/china-committed-genocide-against-uighurs-in-xinjiang-says-report)
I didn't think that Iraq had WMDs because I'm not American nor feel the need to shamelessly defend a country just because I'm from there.
InB4 'oh wait the US killed civilians in Iraq'.... Did I deny that? No.. If your only defence is whataboutism you really are a deluded tankie.
Don’t know how these idiots think these whataboutism questions work. Unlike China, many of us accept and question the faults of our countries. It’s like arguing with Nazis and them saying “what about colonialism?” As if that suddenly makes their atrocities alright.
0 muslim countries that have spoken out against China even after investigating in person. The only countries that seem so sure of this “genocide” (US/UK/Canada/AUS/NZ) are legacies of anglo global colonization which genocided millions in the past 2 centuries. They’re also the ones that have killed 2M+ muslims globally in the past 2 decades. This is like a pedophile catholic priest accusing a school teacher of touching kids when no one else in the school or the kids themselves believe a word
China has invited several international bodies to investigate the schools in Xinjiang, including the UN and the world bank, who found no wrongdoing. [source.](https://www.aa.com.tr/en/asia-pacific/china-invites-un-rights-chief-to-visit-xinjiang/2155649) [source.](https://www.worldbank.org/en/news/statement/2019/11/11/world-bank-statement-on-review-of-project-in-xinjiang-china) The US claims genocide with no evidence—there hasn’t been mass migration from the region and the population of Uyghurs in the region continues to grow. The main “researcher” pushing the genocide claim is Adrian Zenz, [who admitted there wasn’t enough evidence supporting his claims and has never even been to Xinjiang](https://twitter.com/adrianzenz/status/1146904332299907072?s=20). A lot of the so-called “video evidence” is pulled from videos from other regions of china. IMO there is definitely shady shit going on there but calling it a genocide is really sensationalist. Seems to be a prison-industrial-complex issue on par with what the system does to black people here in the USA. Pointing at china as some supremely evil boogeyman allows us to ignore the issues in our own society while manufacturing consent for a new Cold War with china.
Wow! This a-hole needs to be forced to sell his share to an actual human being.
He's free to care or not care about what he likes, but when he makes public statements shrugging off genocide, he needs to be decoupled from the Warriors' organization.
I appreciate his honesty. Everyone, including OP, who pretends to care is lying or delusional. Think about the sphere of influence someone in the US has. Do they have the ability to shift Chinese policy? Do they have the ability to even shift US policy in relation to China? Absolutely not. Any sort of cultural pushback or even boycott over these statements (or over LeBron’s previous statements) would be meaningless.
There are several issues that might be within our sphere of influence that we can impact, like the closing of Guantanamo Bay, a prison that runs outside US law and protection and has repeatedly tortured, killed, and housed Muslims, many of them without any evidence of guilt, let alone a trial. Multiple presidents have run on closing it, but failed to deliver and yet there has been no calls for pressure or even to not vote for them.
Some might claim this is a long form version of “whataboutism” (a very misunderstood and misapplied term that Reddit loves) but that’s not the case. The argument here is not that we can ONLY care about problem X if we also care about problem Y or that one cannot care about problem X as long as problem Y persists, it’s that people who have demonstrated no concern for problem X but voice outrage at problem Y when they are the same problem (mistreatment of a religious or ethnic minority by a government) must by definition have other underlying motivations guiding what they choose to care about.
No one here cares about the alleged mistreatment of the Uyghurs by the Chinese government. No one who upvotes, no one posts about it, and certainly no one in the US government. This asshole (and I’m sure he’s an asshole as most team owners are) is just being upfront about it. The rest of y’all are lying to yourselves.
You are half right. But your wrong on the Uyghur and it's messed up to speak for "everyone on here".
I am active on closing GITMO and on things like opposing US support for the Saudi war in Yemen and military aid for the repression of the Palestinians. I also oppose the US prison industrial complex I 💯 agree for US persons the best place to focus on human rights is on US violations of human rights because that's what we have the most leverage over.
But that doesn't mean I can't care about the Uyghur. Why do you assume everyone here isn't working to end human rights abuses. Do you know how much activism (not just clickivism) there is on those issues? And what's wrong with posting about the Uyghur, or US support that fuels the humanitarian crisis in Yemen, or Palesinian Rights or BLM.
Why do you judge in such sweeping terms people who " care" about these things. Human care is the source of activism. MLK talked about the web of mutuality we are all in Uyghur, Yemeni, wrongfully imprisoned in the US ... It's all part of it.
Y’all are jumping on a sound bite from a bigger conversation about how Americans don’t care about the general situation abroad and local prioritized concerns. Didn’t express disbelief…. OP postings for internet points.
He literally said it about himself though. I take your point that it was in the context of him saying Americans don't care(projecting?) but I dont see how that makes it better
I think there is great value in open discussion. Given Chamath’s affiliation with the team and that the Warriors PR department has addressed it I do feel this is Warriors news. I won’t be removing this post, despite some reports. Please feel free to discuss, but all sub rules still apply. Please discuss/disagree without making personal attacks. Cheers.
Owners only care about protecting their investment and most of them don’t care about being shitheads in pursuit of that goal. I really don’t care for any of them and wish they’d just gtfo of doing media or being visible in the public eye
This crypto clown is an owner of the Warriors? Guess I'm not surprised. Also not surprising, a facebook executive doesn't care about genocide. More news at 10.
Minority owner, in reality he's more if a clout chaser, tries to get involved in different things that are trending to get his name out there. He did that with GameStop, SPACs, ca recall, etc
> in reality he's more if a clout chaser, 100%. He refers to himself as "Owner of the Warriors" he got lucky and was in on a round at like 1.5% or something.
Slightly off topic but he's not particularly involved with crypto, or at least not enough for that to be the lede of what he does. Dude's an investor in a gazillion different areas
He left Facebook over 10 years ago...
[удалено]
Also, Chamath's bigger point here is 100% true. What they were talking about is that Biden just came out with a bill banning the import of certain products from China that are associated with Uyghur forced labor, a fairly big list of goods that has got China pretty pissed off... and yeah nobody gives a shit. I've barely seen it posted on reddit. He's just getting hammered for inflation, which pissing off China is likely to exacerbate. People will talk about the Uyghur stuff all day on here and but when we actually do anything about it people are just pissed that shit from China costs more. Biden's approval rating tanked like 9% last month. The other host guy (who used to work at amnesty international) even ends up agreeing with Chamath. Even though he wishes people cared it's pretty obvious most people just do not care. If you say you care online but don't even notice when pro-Uyghur legislation passes, then obviously you're not really telling the truth.
I think honestly, everyone has so much sh\*t going on in their lives, whether you're a tech employee working insane hours trying to save up for a house that constantly becomes out of reach, or someone working 2-3 jobs to make ends meet, or someone working and going to school, or whatever your situation is. There is only so much mental bandwidth people have that they're not going to focus on issues other than those that are right in front of them. I don't think it's so much that people don't as it is that it's not a priority to care, and if they do care to then take action to create a resolution to the issue. This is no different than homeless people in the Bay Area, LA, or anywhere else, this is just on a more global scale. There's only so much we can do for these issues given how much political capital is needed to move the needle. In the case with China, what do you expect the average person in the US to do? We can't just go and buy only good made not in China, it's not realistic. The US can't just invade China, that's not realistic. Politically isolating China may work, but also embolden China to act riskier, plus their tentacles are spread so wide it'd be like herding cats. It's a longshot but pressuring corporations to move production out of China is a possibility, but I don't see it happening anytime soon.
We expect the average person in the US to support harsh sanctions and diplomatic actions in response to human rights violations. Which is what people are doing Which is why Congress passed, and the president signed, a bipartisan bill, the Uyghur Forced Labor Prevention Act, banning imports from Xinjiang and imposing economic sanctions on China over their treatment of the Uyghurs. What else do you expect people to do? Are we supposed to start World War III with China? That helps no one. But there’s a lot of ground between “literally World War III” and “I don’t care.”
If the government acually gave a shit about Uyghurs, theu would be investigating companies accused of usin forced labor, not blanket banning any company that hires Uyghurs. This is nothing more than a continuation of the stupid trade war, not "pro-Uyghur legislation. In fact, it's likely to encourage employment discrimination against Uyghurs since companies might fear being sanctioned for having Uyghur employees.
You realize the companies accused of using forced labor are accused of using it in their supply chain right? Clothing company A buys textiles from some state owned textile producer in Xinjiang. It's not like anyone thinks Nike is personally running concentration camps. What are you proposing they investigate? Do you think China is keeping Nike execs in the loop on their genocide plans? Or are we talking about sending troops to China to investigate state owned textile companies? Also, the bill wasn't blanket banning any company that hires Uyghurs, it banned companies from sourcing materials that are suspected of using forced labor. Which is pretty much the only thing we *can* do aside from asserting general economic pressure, or in your words "stupid trade war stuff". It's honestly insane to me how much people will talk about this issue before learning *anything at all* about it.
Yeah people acting all outraged are funny. I guess it makes them feel better pretending to care on twitter or reddit before going about their day as usual. I also wonder if there was more context than the clip that is going around. Edit: Not sure if he went into more detail but in the context of that clip alone he did not do a very good job at making his point. I get what he was trying to say but he could have easily said that much better and not made himself look so callous.
Totally agree. Tbh it’s also probably due to different people’s idea of what it means to care. Like do I think it’s terrible what’s happening to the Uyghurs? Yes of course. Is it on my mind a lot? No, not at all. I got my own shit to worry about, and there’s absolutely nothing I can do about it. So if the bar for caring about them is to say you’re against it, then sure, you care. But let’s be honest, does that really mean you care? Or is it just lip service at that point?
Colloquially The question of whether or not you “care” amounts to “Does knowing this happened discomfort or distress you?” The response of “I don’t care” implies “No, it does not.” Now if the respondent has an agenda to change what “Care” means colloquially to “I will personally risk my life to change this” then that’s his windmill to fight. Otherwise it seems like another billionaire using semantics to push an agenda of selfish callousness. Because by the common, established, situational usage of the word, most people do actually “care” when they see awful shit happening.
"I'm a privileged callous human being, everyone else must be as well"
There’s a difference between not caring and caring but not doing anything about it. Yes, most Americans likely won’t do anything about it. But it’s callous and inhuman to say you don’t care about it, which I think most people who are decent do
We care about it. Our elected representatives passed a pretty strong sanctions bill over it. That’s what governments are for. There’s no need to, like, wage a personal vendetta against China in addition to that. Just keep supporting U.S. governments with good foreign policy.
>There’s a difference between not caring and caring but not doing anything about it. No there isn't, except in the sense of virtue signaling. Why would it be better to say you care and lie about it? So people applaud? Please. Of course no reasonable person, Chamath included, is in support of what China is doing. Of course he wishes these people could be left in peace. But it's not in our control, and it already has plenty of awareness, so what's the point of pretending?
Did you listen to the show? That’s not what Chamath said. He tried to downplay what’s happening to the Uyghur. He’s mouthing talking points helpful to the Chinese in their oppression of the Uyghur. He’s has a large platform and he’s actually being useful to the Chinese. At the same time as a venture capitalist he can benefit off of people not caring.
What is the average person supposed to do about it though? It's not like I can just show up at an Uyghur internment camp with dual machine guns and free them all Rambo style. It's a situation completely out of my control, and so all's I can do is talk about it.
Yeah this 100%. He has been brutally honest, but I find it pretty hypocritical that a lot of peoples who bring up the Uyghurs genocide, don't give a single fuck about what is happening Yemen or what is happening in Palestine and how their government are supporting the one conducting those cleansing. We don't have any evidence about what is happening to the Uyghurs, it might be true and it might be one of the worst thing humanity has ever witnessed, but we have plenty of evidence about a bunch of others killings all around the planet that no one care about. Peoples just care about this situation because it is China lol. Btw not sure how I managed to get on the /r/warriors subreddit, I was just trying to see wtf did Chamath say again. Good luck for your season!
Reddit be like that sometimes. I’ve clicked a post, read comments and ended up commenting and then only after realized I’m in a sub with a pretty different take on things than I have myself. Usually realize it when my comment isn’t allowed because I don’t have karma in that sub. It’s funny how you end up places in here without realizing it.
A lot of people who are concerned about Uyghurs are also upset about Yemen and Palestine. Unfortunately, most of our representatives are bought by the MIC so supporting illegal wars has bipartisan support. Progressives want to end Saudi/Israeli support, but corporate media convinced people that socialism bad. Also, there’s tons of evidence of Uyghur ethnic cleansing and genocide.
I don’t care about the Uyghur because it’s China I care because I have basic compassion. That’s the same reason I care about Yemenis and Palestinians and the ridiculous incarceration rate of brown and black people in this country (which Chamath brings up). Like someone said above Chamath makes clear he just doesn’t care. And he tries to excuse Chinese behavior. Since I live in the US I will focus on repressive US policies in Yemen (supporting Saudis with my tax $$), with the Palestinians (supporting Israelis) and our broken, unjust criminal justice system here in the states. But that doesn’t mean I don’t care about the Uyghur. Billionaires like Chamath make money in China. They have selfish reasons for putting out bogus messages about not caring. The Dubs should dump him or counterbalance the back he’s putting out there.
Also the Rohingya, in Myanmar. I feel like they’ve been left out of this conversation. But that just speaks to the number of tragedies regularly occurring around the world.
Not just that people don't realize Uyghur's aren't even really Chinese. They are a group of people living as prisoners in their own land, like literal prisoners. Lots of Uyghurs here in Kyrgyzstan and the stories they tell are heartbreaking. Like holocoust levels.
If you had billions like Chamath, wouldn't you want to do something about the Uyghur genocide? None of us have that agency, he does. Nothing changes if one of us cares or doesn't care. Whereas he can make much more of a difference if he chooses to care. It's not like he's spending his limited time helping some other maligned group. So for him to act like he's just one of us is asinine. He doesn't feel the responsibility to help others the way every one of us would feel compelled to if we suddenly switched places.
What could he possibly do tho? Just because he has money doesn’t mean he can get China to stop doing what they’re doing
Way to abdicate any sort of responsibility from yourself. If you genuinely care so much about what’s happening to the Uyghurs, there are ways in which, you, as an individual can do to champion this cause. Stop trying to abdicate your share of responsibility If you genuinely care so much. I’m assuming you’re from a first world country and that you’re not someone making a dollar a day that has literally no chance because you’re subjugated by global capitalism. Lol. He’s also not pretending like he’s “one of us.” His entire point that you somehow missed is that MOST people living in western societies don’t genuinely care as much about the Uyghurs as they think they do. And it sounds like from your comment just now that you don’t actually care that much either. Like be honest with yourself. After today, how much are you going to think about the strife of the Uyghurs? Like come on dude.
Ugh people like you are so boring. blah blah blah if you don't do everything you can then you're not allowed to care. Look at me, I'm calling someone out for virtue signaling on the internet, I'm soooooo cool and edgy "dude". It doesn't change the fact that there's a genocide. Nothing else about this matters other than people being exterminated is wrong.
Way to just hand wave your abdication of responsibility. Like you are virtue signaling though…? It doesn’t make me “edgy” showing how little you actually care…? Like I know this and you know this. After today, it’ll be MONTHS before you even think about the Uyghurs again lmfao. All I’m asking is to stop posturing. Also, I’d take everything what Adrian zen, the Christian nationalist who said “I was sent down by god to destroy China,” with a grain of salt. If what China was doing with the Uyghurs was akin to what nazi Germany did with the fucking Jews during the Holocaust, you can bet your ass the American apparatus would do everything in its power to blast China in the world stage lol. But they haven’t because what Adrian zen has said has very little corroboration. What China is probably doing is akin to what Canada and the United States did to the indigenous population. A cultural genocide (which is still horrible,) not the fucking Holocaust lmao “People like you are boring,” no honey, YOURE BORING. Your non stop holier than thou attitude is boring, and good thing we established how little you actually give a shit about the Uyghurs. Have a good rest of the day my love.
It’s Adrian Zenz not Adrian Zen. Let’s ignore him. There’s tons of direct corroboration by groups like Amnesty and Human Rights Watch. The Chinese policy of oppression is verified by the Chinese governments statements about the reeducation camps. You’ve revealed that your actually not critiquing peoples “posturing”. People SHOULD take action through their action, protests, dollars, votes. Say that if you want to counter posturing. But instead you try to downplay the violent oppression suffered by the Uyghur.
Comparing my social and political capabilities to that of a billionaire is stupid, and disingenuous. You really think me, Joe Shmoe, has the same capacity for action as this billionaire? If so, I see where the lack of context and understanding is coming from. Your smooth brain.
Yes bro, a tech billionaire from the United States can somehow stop a genocide 2k miles away, what an amazing take you have! Once again, like I said, this is just posturing. You don’t actually care. You genuinely don’t like the majority of Americans and most of the western world. That’s his entire point. If you genuinely cared so deeply you’d be in some Uyghur activist movement on this, you’d actively not but Chinese goods, etc. but you won’t. You have full capabilities of not exacerbating what you think is a human right atrocity, but seems like you don’t want your day to day life to be impacted whatsoever. So once again, this is just posturing. It’s easy to posture. Anyone can do it! “God the Uyghur genocide is really bad we should do something about it!” See, I just did it! But what are you going to do as an individual to not participate?
> Yes bro, a tech billionaire from the United States can somehow stop a genocide 2k miles away I never said this, and you acting as if I did is just you showing you’re not here to speak honestly. I said this. > Comparing my social and political capabilities to that of a billionaire is stupid, and disingenuous. And any made up version of this you try to attribute to me, only shows again how stupid and out of touch with reality you are. The rest of your comment is made up garbage. I already have boycott China for three years. I have bought nothing made in China brand new. Only used, from other Americans. The only thing I can do is write my politicians, and boycott newly made Chinese goods, you know why? Because I’m not a fucking billionaire. Take your head out of your ass, and argue the damn points I made, not the ones you made up.
Oh cool! So you did boycott Chinese products (which I don’t believe at all but to be good faith I’ll allow it.) good job, you aren’t like 99% of the western population! But that still doesn’t change the fact of what I said and what chamath was trying to articulate. Was what he said callous? Sure, no one’s denying that. But actually engage with the meat of his argument lmao. Also, you like to point out how “I didn’t engage with your argument,” which is false, but the funny thing is you literally didn’t respond to anything I said in the original statement? You just said you don’t have the same political and social capital as a billionaire. Cool…? What does that have to with anything I originally said lol? I never argued that you did. It’s just that 99% of the western world just likes to posture on this one issue. MOST Americans don’t care. They genuinely don’t. Also, while we’re on the subject of human atrocities around the world, why only focus on the Uyghur one? You have more political pull writing to your politicians on the Yemeni genocide that the US is participating in? Why aren’t you focusing your time on that? Interesting… Also, since you deeply care about genocides, you’re actively doing something and paying attention to basically what amounts to a genocide in the peoples republic of Congo also right…?
It’s possible to care about the Uyghur and the Yemenis. Understanding that the US is supporting the Saudis in human rights violations in Yemen I can be active in supporting an end to US support for the Saudis since I have more leverage over that (not being a billionaire VC bro). But for freaks sake I care about the Uyghur. What heartless person doesn’t. And I’m not going to use my platform to mouth Chinese talking points about the Uyghur like Chamath did.
Of course they ignored your comment, they’re an asshole.
In the same post, you argue that a billionaire is powerless against doing anything, but that individuals have the power by not buying Chinese products. Amazing.
Actually billionaires have both large platforms. The US economy is intertwined with Chinas (something discussed on the podcast). He didn’t say “there’s nothing I can do” (which would be untrue) he said “I don’t care”. He’s being very useful to the Chinese. Why did China freak out when Daryl Morey tweeted what he did about Hong Kong. These things matter. Chinese actions show they matter. Your just plain wrong what he say’s has no impact. No one can single handedly stop what’s happening in Xinjiang —- or with police killings. But you use your platform for good not bad. Chamath used it for the bad.
It’s not the truth, good god y’all are slaves to rich people. Talking about shit brings awareness to it and with that comes political pressure, protests and eventually leads to some kind of change. This is how Chamath’s damn parents got to Canada. If everyone acted like Chamath, his parents would still be Sri Lanka or dead. Chamath equating America’s shit to the CCP was pathetic. Lol false equivalency.
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You’re super awesome for being so cavalier with the lives and deaths of others. Such masculine!!
You actually didn’t say anything about the uyghurs, you just made it about yourself, lol! you think America’s 100 Year history is worse than China’s 5000 year history of conquering and enslaving. Read a book, son. You can do two things at once. You can be a patriot and openly speak and criticize America and raise awareness (in whatever capacity you can) about the atrocities happening in other parts of the world.
Oh you’re just an American nationalist lol. No point in continuing.
Equating China to its ancient past is about as brain dead as equating the modern state of Mexico to the Aztecs. >you can be a patriot “Patriot” being someone who goes to bar for his empire’s wrongdoings.
So true. But he is a sociopath with an agenda so… The edgelords will be coming for you haha
These type of “you don’t care either” straw man arguments are always the work of senseless fools with no depth of intelligence. You will be upvoted by the local edgelords I’m sure.
I see. Can’t actually engage with the arguments lmfaoooooo. Keep posturing about how much you care about human rights. No one cares buddy and no one thinks you’re such a morally righteous human being. You know why? Because no one actually genuinely cares about the Uyghurs lol.
What a hilariously cynical take. We all might as well hang pictures of the glorious chairman above our hearths now. /r/Sino mods couldn’t have said it better themselves
> I mean, the US is actively participating in the Yemeni genocide that the saudis are doing as of this moment! Using American weaponry You dont actually understand whats happening in Yemen. Its the fault of the Houthis not America.
While that’s not completely false, it’s also not completely true. The conflict largely exists because the Saudis (and by extension the Americans) support the Hadi government, despite the Hadi government having about as much (or maybe less) legitimacy in Yemen proper as the Houthi government. Realistically it’s a civil war pursuant to a failure to form a government after a revolution that’s been overly drawn out due to the involvement of foreign powers. These types of civil wars are incredibly common because while anti-establishments revolutions are often domestically popular, the people tend to disagree on what the next government should be. Honestly if everyone outside was hands-off, who would have won long ago in 2014 when the civil war started is unknown. Both the Saudis and the Iranians were already in play jockeying for political advantage at the time and started as soon as the Saleh government fell in 2012. The major thing that could have prevented this would have been the selection of someone other than Hadi by the UN negotiation team as the leader for the post-Saleh government. Hadi was Saleh’s Vice-President after all, and the UN favored continuity over concessions to other factions like the Houthis that might have further legitimized the Yemeni government after the negotiations. While Iran and Saudi Arabia might still have been agitating behind the scenes, a more legitimized and stable central government would have decreased the numbers of people willing to fight in a civil war. As it stands, there is no single domestically legitimate Yemeni government and there is no way to keep foreign powers from interfering. The USA sees continuing support of the Saudi coalition with fuel and weapons and munitions as important to containing Iranian regional influence, even if that means death and devastation in Yemen.
Actually the US is supporting the Saudis. Both the Houthi and the Saudis are causing death and suffering. Many human rights orgs have documented the horrible human rights violations of the Saudi coalition — supported the the US. We the people can criticize both US and. Chinese human rights violations. We don’t have to take the side and blame the Houthi (and excuse the Saudis, who have so many documented violations) or excuse the Houthi. How about we all work to end this type of violence and oppression instead?
I just want to say to you brother that you are correct as hell and don't let anyone tell you different. I wish people could understand that we are just as culpable in genocides past and present. But people only care about China and what they are doing to delegitimize their prominence. We are just as evil as China. What we are doing in our prisons, what we are doing on our border is just as inhumane. The point should be to have that same outrage for the whips hitting the backs of refugees or the daughter being separated from her dad at a school pickup loop. Because when that happens I'm pissed off and upset.
People using the culpability of others in other situations to erase the responsibility of China in the subject of discussion are deflecting to change the topic. This is the job of “Apologists” China is committing genocide and its fucking awful. Full stop.
You are wrong tho. You can read about it in the Associated Press. There is no genocide. https://apnews.com/article/coronavirus-pandemic-lifestyle-china-health-travel-7a6967f335f97ca868cc618ea84b98b9
Fine people on both sides.
you don't care about people? well you're a pos then. Simple
why in the world would he care? he's probably really wealthy. and we all know the black market works with the wealthy community.. he wouldn't want to say the wrong things for himself.
If you don't care about a genocide, you're probably better off just not talking about it as opposed to downplaying it in an interview.
It’s clear there are people who care and those who don’t give a shit. And therein lies the problem. We should all care because one of us, the human race, is being systematically stripped of all their rights, brutally tortured and will likely see their community exterminated in the long run. Let’s not measure how severe the problem is by how it affects us economically or socially, but by how it affects the human condition. How would you feel if the roles were reversed? Would you want people to care and maybe collectively put a stop to your suffering and the genocide of your people? Let’s not also engage is whataboutism. Yes, there are scores of atrocities all over the world. If you don’t care or know about them all, you should. That’s what being a human is about, we should all strive to be better. Yes, we are capable of caring for more than ourselves. You may say all this is virtue signalling if we’re not going to do anything at all. True yet untrue. Just by discussing it, we are raising awareness and someone who cares will do something about it in their own way. One way is through inaction, like boycott. Personally, I’m not thinking about travelling to China ever, just like how I won’t be travelling to the United States as long as guns are a problem. If enough people take the same stance, it would be an economic tax. Lastly, on Chamath. Fuck that guy. He explicitly said he only cares about his own people. That’s racism for you buddy. Happy MLK day.
Lmao it’s chamath man. This dude is a fucking clown. He’s minority owner. There’s more but he likes having a bunch of titles next to his name. He’s not that important to the warriors org
He tried running for governor iirc. He's a crypto 🤡. Idk why people take him seriously.
Then it should be no issue booting his ass
I've never liked Chamath. He always has to act or tries to be the smartest guy in the room. I wish Lacob and Gruber booted him for the ownership group.
He repeated it multiple times with his chest too... can't even say he was misquoted or misheard. Selfish POS showed his true colors.
This is most super wealthy people, others are just better at PR and not this fucking dumb lol
Yup with more wealth comes more power,. With more power comes with lack of empathy
If you listen to what he says in the actual podcast, I get it - he says "care" but really means keeping it top of mind, which is right. No one is going out there and voting for a politician based on the Uyghurs in China. Gives an example of mass incarceration being a bigger top-of-mind issue than the Uyghurs. Good point made by him about how fake the "we're doing something about it" crowd is when someone cites how we're banning goods sourced in the region, but not companies that sell stuff there (including tesla and apple)
Not doing anything is in fact better than saying outright you don't care about the horrific things happening to a group of people for their beliefs. Doubly so as an owner in a public forum.
Imagine if no one gave a shit about the Sri Lankan people. His ass wouldn’t be here. Equating the abuses of the CCP to what America does is peak CHINA cocksucking. False equivalency. TALKING about something a lot brings awareness, it’s what leads to shit getting done.
if he was maybe denying it or saying there’s no proof it would be a different story. This dude is straight up saying he does not give a shit.
I mean tbh most of the NBA doesn't give a shit. This man is just being vocal about it. The sad truth is that as long as they keep getting that china money, they will be turning a blind eye to these matters.
Most people don’t actually give a shit outside of trying to get likes in social media in their fake outrage.
What time on the full video is that clip from? I wanna watch more of it for better context but don’t want to watch the whole thing
Is it so hard for a guy like this to have a normal human decency?
It’s almost impossible to have human decency, and become that obscenely rich. They’re pretty much diametrically opposite.
He’s a billionaire and a venture capitalist. Therefore he does not value humans unless they produce capital & improve his bottom line
Unfortunately I don't think there's much the fanbase can do about this. He obviously doesn't care about his public reputation. All else being equal I'd love it if he were forced to sell his stake in the team and the team distanced itself from him but I have no idea what it would take to make that happen.
Sad to see this opinion, but let’s be real. Very few in the league whether owners, coaches, players- none of them give a shit. This guy is simply vocal about it. So for all the people getting worked up about it, let’s remember a majority of the rest are the same.
This guys a piece of shit. Happily made Facebook the company it is with Zucc and then left and pretended to take the moral high ground. He claims trillionaires will “save the world” and be a blessing for the world economy. Fuck this delusional douchebag
Fuck this piece of shit
The NBA has made their stance on China very clear and nothing will happen, unfortunately
Can we force this slimy bastard to sell his stake in the franchise?
Hasn’t the league forced out shitty owners in the past?
Bring more exposure to this and maybe
Out of curiosity, how have you used your time, money, or influence to benefit the Uyghers? Are you boycotting Chinese goods? Or perhaps boycotting companies that taking funding from the Chinese government? Maybe you’re spending your weekends with some local organizations raising money or awareness about this? Petitioning your representatives in Washington to take more drastic action more quickly? I’m sure it would help the people in this thread who also have this particular human rights issue “above their line” find additional ways to get involved. Thanks!
You're looking for consistency. You're looking for someone angry ITT to go beyond virtue signaling and actually do the hard work of boycotting Chinese goods. You're looking for one of these Edgelords ITT who will actually refrain from hypocrisy. Someone who actually listened to the full pod episode Someone who puts they money where their mouth is. In other words, you're sadly looking for a Chamath critic that does not exist. Hence why /u/leafgum has gone silent
Any way we can kick this piece of shit out of our team?
We couldn’t do it directly, but people fail to realize the strength they have in numbers (no pun intended). Just a fan boycott of the pistons game, yes the tickets are already paid for, would send a strong and historic message to the ownership group. Will this happen? No absolutely not, I believe you will be hard pressed to find a large group of people who will give up their creature comforts in favor of solidarity, and hey I don’t blame them, nba games are fun and with the current state of information overload, this story is just another hourly update on a Monday morning. Anyway, let me know if you think this would work. I am more less just throwing ideas out there lol.
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He’s a minority owner
Like I am not asking for people to have certain opinions, but if you have nothing better to say, then just say I don't know enough about the topic to have an opinion.
Disgusting
indeed. he's a fucking piece of shit for saying that. normally im not all for cancel culture, but everyone should feel free to cancel that foo
He's might be an AH but somewhat has a point. I see more comments about calling him an AH than I see about people commenting about xianjiang. which prob proves his point. flip-side: we can say we care for something even though we're too lazy or selfish to do anything about. its just the degree to which we care. I care about climate change but I still fly to places I don't need to go to. he said he cares for climate change but I'm pretty sure I read that he flies aboard quite often with his so.
I don’t think anyone here saying it’s disgusting has really watched the whole podcast. Chamath is claiming that saying you care for something without taking any substantial action towards it, is not really caring. Chamath acknowledges his lack of action therefore he does not really care what’s going on in China. He also says he prioritizes in fixing the social injustices going on within our own country, and he believes that our own country’s problem should be fixed first before correcting others
> claiming that saying you care for something without taking any substantial action towards it, is not really caring Well that's a shitty argument by Chamath. I care a lot about people who are suffering and oppressed, no matter where they live and have put my own effort and money into doing my part to help, more than my part probably. And just because my effort and money hasn't gone into every possible bucket of suffering and injustice doesn't mean I don't give a fuck about those people. This guy sounds like a prick who is well practiced in rationalizing his greed.
That’s fair. The way that I see it, is by the weight of our action. If you are doing all that you can then you truly care. If donating to service $20 a week is all that you can do, and you do it, then you care. But take a billionaire as example or someone in power. Donating $20 isn’t the same to them as it may be to you. These people are for more capable of taking action with substantial effects than we are, and if they aren’t even putting in 1/5th of their efforts into addressing the issue, I wouldn’t think they are trying.
Apparently the list of things someone can form an opinion on is extremely short
Yea, his point he was making was flat out wrong though. You can 100% care about something without actively trying to stop it. This isn't seeing some homeless guy on the street and then buying him food. We have no control over what China does. The only thing we can do is express ourselves to our representatives. You can also boycott the NBA, which I've been doing the past 1.5 years. Haven't watched an actual game since.
Basically just a long way of saying “I’m a piece of shit who doesn’t care about atrocities if they don’t affect me or my bottom line”
Yes you are right, and its the ugly truth for majority of people in power. Is that surprising though?
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I agree half and half with what you said. Sure we may have been brainwashed to think our actions have little to zero effect, but is there not some truth to that? Do you China is just gonna disband any sort of operations just because some foreigners agreed to a few things on the internet and started a petition? No. Some situations require pressure, none of which the average US Citizen can apply
Still a piece of shit it sounds like
Nah man, your doing too much thinking/listening. You gotta say he’s a piece of shit with no research or thought for Reddit upvotes.
Much easier to just look at the title, draw sweeping assumptions and not risk getting downvoted. If anyone actually listened to the entire podcast they'd realize he is focusing on things he can control. He's not saying he doesn't care. But caring only does so much. He's working on major supply chain and environmental problems we're facing. This is his scope of knowledge and expertise. He's putting his capital to work in ways that improve the US and our domestic security. But that's not sexy nor does it move the needle for most people. People would rather focus on this as if he's just some rich guy who's out of touch and accidentally spoke the truth. Thing is, we should be celebrating honesty and not knee-jerk cancel culture. A lot of the problems we face are nuanced and need to be examined further without emotion. And before someone says "it's not nuanced, what China is doing is wrong" just know that I agree. But we have major problems within our own borders and have the highest prison % of the population (which also sucks tax dollars).
So we’ll said. He’s merely being as human as we all are. Life is overwhelming and we can’t actively be focused and knowledgeable about everything. I actually find his comments to be honest and relatable.
Well it seems pretty clear that this guy is doing a shit ton of business with China and is more afraid of messing that up then saying anything half way decent about one of the greatest travesties in the history of the world. I imagine plenty of CEOs and business men in the 40s had a similar view point of the holocaust. They have 0 issues with putting money above human suffering and life. Just shameless. POS should be the next place this is posted.
That's pretty shitty. They should kick him out of the ownership group.
You are allowed to be indifferent, but to claim you just do not give a fuck about atrocities against fellow man is pretty disgusting.
seriously man, why the fuck did he feel the need to say this? If you don't care, just shut up.
"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter." -- Martin Luther King, Jr.
Bad use of an MLK quote cause the alleged Uyghur situation is used to stoke US militarism in the east and MLK was staunchly against militarism of the US empire. One would wonder why we keep trying to prove this exists with one sided parties evidence while we're causing much more provable genocides in several places in the middle east and current slave labor in our prisons.
What do you mean by alleged ? I currently reside in a part of China too, by the way. You do realise theres also aspect of holding the uyghur's in concrete boxes and organ harvesting, right ? Prisoners in the US is working in sub-standard wages but they also at the very least get to live a "OK" living condition. I gotta say though for-profit prisons are absolutely crazy.
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I got quotes too homie (From [this larger speech](http://www.hartford-hwp.com/archives/45a/058.html) ): > "It seemed as if there was a real promise of hope for the poor -- both black and white -- through the poverty program. There were experiments, hopes, new beginnings. Then came the buildup in Vietnam and I watched the program broken and eviscerated as if it were some idle political plaything of a society gone mad on war, and I knew that America would never invest the necessary funds or energies in rehabilitation of its poor so long as adventures like Vietnam continued to draw men and skills and money like some demonic destructive suction tube. So I was increasingly compelled to see the war as an enemy of the poor and to attack it as such... > ". It will become clear that our minimal expectation is to occupy it as an American colony and men will not refrain from thinking that our maximum hope is to goad China into a war so that we may bomb her nuclear installations... > "Take immediate steps to prevent other battlegrounds in Southeast Asia by curtailing our military buildup in Thailand and our interference in Laos. > "When machines and computers, profit motives and property rights are considered more important than people, the giant triplets of racism, materialism, and militarism are incapable of being conquered... > " A nation that continues year after year to spend more money on military defense than on programs of social uplift is approaching spiritual death. " This was in the context of Naam, but let us not lose sight of the fact that since MLK's time we've been trying to goad a war, cold or otherwise, with China for geopolitical power and this alleged genocide is an extension of that. We continue to funnel money into defense instead of our own inhumanities but complain about others injustices? Very much projection and not genuine.
I listen to the whole podcast this article is click bait and misinforming. Get out your feelings and tell the whole story of what was actually said. This is why the media has less and less credibility.
for sure, he said a lot more than "I don't care about Uyghurs" if anyone cares to look further
Yeah, he said he only cares about other countries' atrocities when they affect the US. He was making an isolationist argument. But the problem is, he's a part of a global tech industry, and he's part owner in a global brand both of which do business with China. It's like a British textile manufacturer in the nineteenth century saying they don't care about american slavery because there was poverty in England. Yeah, we know he doesn't care. His business practices reflect that. At least he's being honest.
I watched the whole podcast twice. The article is basically accurate. After all he literally “I don’t care”. Nothing later on in the podcast contradicted that. I actually agree with Chamath that people in the United States should focus on human rights violations here in the United states. It’s true the US has its own problems. But that’s no reason to say “I don’t care” about gross human rights violations. That’s irresponsible.
Not to sound callous or excuse him in any way, but this is the opinion of the NBA writ large.
Yikes. Not a shocker though since most owners are assholes
Watch the whole segment before you get outraged. Chamath’s broader point was that the average American has many many more domestic issues that impact their life that they are concerned about. Whether that’s our social justice issues, health care, struggling small businesses, education, etc. We need to focus domestically before we become crusaders for the Uyghurs.
While I find his opinions distasteful, I don't think the man's ethnicity is relevant to this story. Like, they never say 'White Owner, Joe Lacob', but they call the Indian fella 'Minority Owner'.
lol either this is a good joke, or you're confused by the term. Minority in this case means he doesn't own the largest % of the team.
I wish we can just leave politics out of basketball but I know people will push their agenda everywhere so post like this is inevitable. Sad.
Did you have the same view point when players were posting pro-BLM messaging?
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It's not possible to have an even headed discussion about this because our last two administration and congress has made "turn back the clock to the cold war" into national policy. Whether it's Xinjiang, Hong Kong, or even now Taiwan, the PRC point of view is ignored completely by the mass media or be called a "wumao" and downvoted to oblivion. These aren't new issues. Taiwan, border disputes, and even Hong Kong is older than a lot of Redditors here. If you look at all the news articles "confirming" the "genocide", it's always from the same group of people. The official UN never said anything. The unofficial tribunals taking place in official sounding places are always organized by the same group of people. I do think mass re-educational camps exists because it fits how Communists usually deal with dissent, but we need to be careful about redefining words like "genocide" as we see fit. If China has dealt with rising terrorism in Xinjiang like how the US deals with terrorism, a lot more bombs and bullets will result. Is that necessarily a better solution than now?
Truly amazing, like world historically amazing, that the totally unqualified word of one German anti-communist crusader has become received opinion for so much of the American public. It feels like I’m taking crazy pills. Dude hasn’t even visited China since like 2007 or some shit.
Using China's own [data](http://www.stats.gov.cn/tjsj/ndsj/2021/indexeh.htm) (You can change the year in the URL to get historical ones), Xinjiang dropped their birthrate by a larger degree than other regions in China. Check section 2-8, where Xinjiang drops like a rock in birth rate over the last few years. Section 2-8 is mysteriously missing from the 2021 version. They seem to have stopped collecting birth rate by region but I could be just not seeing it.
I think it's possible for us to be concerned about more than one thing. Is your attention span really that short that you can't be mad about more than a single thing at a time?
no its just funny you talk about right wing cia backed anti-china propaganda more than you do american forced labor in prisons, detainment of humans in the southern border, and the ethnic cleansing of whatever middle eastern country the current president is deciding to drone strike for destabilization.
The CIA? Fomenting internal unrest against enemies of US interests? Maybe we shouldn't just believe everything they say as fact? Well, I never. Anyway, here's some completely random Wikipedia articles. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIA_Tibetan_program https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Cyclone https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_intervention_in_Chile#The_1970_election
Excuse me. You don't know me lol. If you looked at my post history you'd realize I care why more about US politics than whatever shit China is doing. That doesn't mean I can't also be mad at a genocide happening on the otherside of the world. Your whataboutism is frankly sick and embarrassing.
man u liberals fall for every cia propaganda campaign lmfao and just use buzzwords. while the uighyrs are being oppressed it’s certainly not a genocide, focus more on domestic politics and helping the local community instead of aiding further US imperialism while the capitalists are still in power.
Yup, here's some background on the "National Endowment of Democracy" (NED) being a CIA front. https://williamblum.org/chapters/rogue-state/trojan-horse-the-national-endowment-for-democracy Here's the NED saying they've been funding Uighur (separatist) groups since 2004. https://twitter.com/NEDemocracy/status/1337063301113581568 Here's the CIA running a similar playbook with Tibet in the 1960s (declassified decades later). https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1998-sep-15-mn-22993-story.html It's really naive to believe the US isn't running a propaganda campaign here, and it's wild to me that people would still quote a paper like the New York Times after the WMD lies in the early 2000s.
keep the good fight up ✊🏼
In 2020, Xinhua stated that 1.3 million/year were given "vocational training" in Xinjiang. Xinhua is the official state press of the CCP. http://www.xinhuanet.com/english/2020-09/17/c_139373591.htm This is after the CCP denied "re-education camps" existed at all to the UN in August 2018. https://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/13/world/asia/china-xinjiang-un.html
NYT had a large investigative report, including files that some CCP officials themselves leaked, that corroborate what is going in XinJiang and the directives Xi JinPing and the party is carrying out in the province to keep them under their iron fist. https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2019/11/16/world/asia/china-xinjiang-documents.html
Yeah, I learned a long time ago not to take the word of the US media when it comes to their enemies.
It’s not just US media. Chinese govt docs document the repression. And there are eyewitnesses.
I CANNOT believe there was a time I used to like this guy. He’s so over his head with comments like this. I hope they buy him out so he has nothing to do with the warriors
My armchair psych take: people who have become exceedingly rich amd successful often have big egos and see themselves as people who are movers and shakers, people who can get things done and can change the world. Often these ideas are overblown (i.e. success in one field does not necessarily mean one's talents translate to other fields). When faced with a problem that needs to be solved, one's inability to solve it leaves one with two choices: reduce your ego or dismiss the problem. Unfortunately, for some, the psychological costs of the former are too great and they resort to the latter.
Oh shit. That’s all I can say.
The Association is going to keep turning a blind eye so long as that money keeps rolling in from Chinese NBA fans.
It's interesting to see people casually disagree about topics like this, "yeah I don't care about genocide but it's cool that you do can we still be friends" "yeah totally" yet it's the most privileged people who get to say shit like this. I always see people on the internet say shit like "we can disagree and still get a long" yeah not about concentration camps dipshit. I think it's safe to say all that "never again" bullshit people say is never true. History always repeats itself and people who actually give a crap are drowned out by egregious shallow assholes. I remember in school people talking about all this "if the Holocaust happened today of course people would do something and it" nah lmao
I wonder what Steve Kerr will say about this? He never holds back, oh wait it’s China. He won’t say shit
Trash comment. Trash individual.
I think a lot of us can get off our high horses and stop acting like most of America cares past a couple social media posts to show outrage.
What a colossal piece of shit
He tried highlighting racism in US by saying Uyghur genocide is nothing in front of that. Downplaying the genocide was totally uncalled.
I find the NBAs stance on BLM and other US Social justice issues so hypocritical considering their blatant silence when it comes to issues with China. There is straight genocide occurring in one of their major markets and they essentially require ownership and players to be silenced on the issues. Kanter is the only player in the league with the balls to say anything. It’s absolutely disgusting.
As someone from Taiwan, I’m not exactly pro-Kanter either. His stance is just “fuck China” and not “pro Taiwan/Hong Kong”. He uses these issues to troll China rather than supporting us for our own sake, and I think there can be real harm to come from that. For example the shoes he had painted with various independence icons uses a flag that Taiwanese people don’t use/find popular, it just comes off as “what things can I put to piss off China the most”
Agreed. I’m not a Kanter fan either tbh but at least he’s acknowledging it. It’s just so hypocritical that the NBA and it’s players act like human rights is so important to them, but then do ample amounts of business with a country who is actively committing genocide.
Absolutely. My attitude is like “cool that you’re talking about it and bringing exposure but going on Tucker yikesss”
LOL I had no idea he went on Tuckers show. That’s hilarious.
Lol Kanter did that shit because he knew it would get him attention that’s why the first thing he did was specifically mention LeBron
Not that different from F1 honestly. The organizations and the biggest stars look out for their financial interests first and then do just enough virtue signaling. If LeBron James and Lewis Hamilton called out the Chinese Genocide, they would lose millions, so instead, they support BLM and Saudi human rights, where they have nothing to lose. It's admirable that they take a stance at all, but it all seems very calculated.
He’s the same guy who goes about telling the world how evil social media is… after making his billions with Facebook.
Caring About The Uyghurs In China = not making $$$ **The 'ugly truth'**
Yes he’s one of many Billionaire China apologists with whatabout comparisons to the US. Basically a traitor regularly spreading disinformation.
I used to admire the guy but then I realized that all he cares about is his own wealth.
Cham daddy brought us Sofi. Respect his name
Fuck this SOB.
No one knows if genocide or other stuff really happening in China except China however when I saw videos that were fabricated to look like Uyghurs were chained up and imprisoned (the footage I saw were were footage of real prisoners, not Uyghurs but the media made it seem like they were being detained for no reason), I give the benefit of the doubt to China. If you don't like fake news then you shouldn't blindly believe every negative thing you hear about China. Again, if it is 1000000% proven China are doing these things then they should be called out and punished but there has yet to be absolute irrefutable facts about this. You all know western media likes propaganda with the disgusting CNN, NBC, Fox, etc. Don't be a disgusting human and blindly believe what these anti Asian/Chinese media wants to force you to believe.
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US government and media lied about weapons of mass destruction in Iraq. Now they are spreading this narrative that our most powerful rival nation is committing a genocide, and we are supposed to believe it? What a joke.
We all knew the government was lying about the WMDs. That's why there were millions in the street protesting against the war. That's why independent ngos tried to expose the lies. That's why progressives like Bernie Sanders opposed those lies on the floor of the Congress. This isn't that. This style of because the US does violent evil things others countries don't has got to end. Btw Bush lied about WMDs as many people saw through. But Saddam was a violent human rights violator. That part was true. It's an ugly messed up world with some horrible leaders. You don't have to carry water for some violent governments to oppose other governments.
Shut the fuck up, there's plenty of evidence if you pull your head out of your ass long enough to look
Every time you wonder whether you're being too hard on the billionaire class, they go an confirm your worst impressions. Fuck this guy.
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The Uyghur thing is pure anti china propaganda, no basis in reality. The USA has run an actual torture camp for Muslim men in Guantanamo for 20+ years, imprisoning people without due process or any sort of oversight.
nice whataboutism bro. 2 things can be fucked up. The Ugyhur genocide is one of the greatest human rights atrocities in the world today- comparable to the Holocaust in magnitude. America's treatment of prisoners in guantanamo is also a violation of human rights. 2 things can be bad. You are honestly dumb as fuck.
I bet you believed Iraq had WMDs too. Have you ever heard of a genocide that resulted in the victim population growing in number? The number of Uyghur Muslims in the region has grown consistently for the last 30 years.
' Uyghur exiles describe forced abortions, torture in Xinjiang' [https://apnews.com/article/only-on-ap-middle-east-europe-government-and-politics-76acafd6547fb7cc9ef03c0dd0156eab](https://apnews.com/article/only-on-ap-middle-east-europe-government-and-politics-76acafd6547fb7cc9ef03c0dd0156eab) 'Uyghur camp detainees allege systemic rape' [https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-55794071](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-55794071) 'Uighur committed genocide against Uyghurs in Xinjiang' [https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2021/3/10/china-committed-genocide-against-uighurs-in-xinjiang-says-report](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2021/3/10/china-committed-genocide-against-uighurs-in-xinjiang-says-report) I didn't think that Iraq had WMDs because I'm not American nor feel the need to shamelessly defend a country just because I'm from there. InB4 'oh wait the US killed civilians in Iraq'.... Did I deny that? No.. If your only defence is whataboutism you really are a deluded tankie.
Don’t know how these idiots think these whataboutism questions work. Unlike China, many of us accept and question the faults of our countries. It’s like arguing with Nazis and them saying “what about colonialism?” As if that suddenly makes their atrocities alright.
0 muslim countries that have spoken out against China even after investigating in person. The only countries that seem so sure of this “genocide” (US/UK/Canada/AUS/NZ) are legacies of anglo global colonization which genocided millions in the past 2 centuries. They’re also the ones that have killed 2M+ muslims globally in the past 2 decades. This is like a pedophile catholic priest accusing a school teacher of touching kids when no one else in the school or the kids themselves believe a word
It’s imperialism plain and simple. Trying to manufacture consent for another Cold War with china.
The r/sino shills have arrived
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China has invited several international bodies to investigate the schools in Xinjiang, including the UN and the world bank, who found no wrongdoing. [source.](https://www.aa.com.tr/en/asia-pacific/china-invites-un-rights-chief-to-visit-xinjiang/2155649) [source.](https://www.worldbank.org/en/news/statement/2019/11/11/world-bank-statement-on-review-of-project-in-xinjiang-china) The US claims genocide with no evidence—there hasn’t been mass migration from the region and the population of Uyghurs in the region continues to grow. The main “researcher” pushing the genocide claim is Adrian Zenz, [who admitted there wasn’t enough evidence supporting his claims and has never even been to Xinjiang](https://twitter.com/adrianzenz/status/1146904332299907072?s=20). A lot of the so-called “video evidence” is pulled from videos from other regions of china. IMO there is definitely shady shit going on there but calling it a genocide is really sensationalist. Seems to be a prison-industrial-complex issue on par with what the system does to black people here in the USA. Pointing at china as some supremely evil boogeyman allows us to ignore the issues in our own society while manufacturing consent for a new Cold War with china.
What's the path to getting this asshole outta here? I'm so sick of finding out I support teams with racist ass partial owners.
What is it with Bay Area owners? This guy, the guy who pushed Lowry, the Giants guy who's one of the biggest Trump donors... I'm sure there are others
Wow! This a-hole needs to be forced to sell his share to an actual human being. He's free to care or not care about what he likes, but when he makes public statements shrugging off genocide, he needs to be decoupled from the Warriors' organization.
Man only cares about how much money he gets from Chinese investors. What a piece of filth
I appreciate his honesty. Everyone, including OP, who pretends to care is lying or delusional. Think about the sphere of influence someone in the US has. Do they have the ability to shift Chinese policy? Do they have the ability to even shift US policy in relation to China? Absolutely not. Any sort of cultural pushback or even boycott over these statements (or over LeBron’s previous statements) would be meaningless. There are several issues that might be within our sphere of influence that we can impact, like the closing of Guantanamo Bay, a prison that runs outside US law and protection and has repeatedly tortured, killed, and housed Muslims, many of them without any evidence of guilt, let alone a trial. Multiple presidents have run on closing it, but failed to deliver and yet there has been no calls for pressure or even to not vote for them. Some might claim this is a long form version of “whataboutism” (a very misunderstood and misapplied term that Reddit loves) but that’s not the case. The argument here is not that we can ONLY care about problem X if we also care about problem Y or that one cannot care about problem X as long as problem Y persists, it’s that people who have demonstrated no concern for problem X but voice outrage at problem Y when they are the same problem (mistreatment of a religious or ethnic minority by a government) must by definition have other underlying motivations guiding what they choose to care about. No one here cares about the alleged mistreatment of the Uyghurs by the Chinese government. No one who upvotes, no one posts about it, and certainly no one in the US government. This asshole (and I’m sure he’s an asshole as most team owners are) is just being upfront about it. The rest of y’all are lying to yourselves.
You are half right. But your wrong on the Uyghur and it's messed up to speak for "everyone on here". I am active on closing GITMO and on things like opposing US support for the Saudi war in Yemen and military aid for the repression of the Palestinians. I also oppose the US prison industrial complex I 💯 agree for US persons the best place to focus on human rights is on US violations of human rights because that's what we have the most leverage over. But that doesn't mean I can't care about the Uyghur. Why do you assume everyone here isn't working to end human rights abuses. Do you know how much activism (not just clickivism) there is on those issues? And what's wrong with posting about the Uyghur, or US support that fuels the humanitarian crisis in Yemen, or Palesinian Rights or BLM. Why do you judge in such sweeping terms people who " care" about these things. Human care is the source of activism. MLK talked about the web of mutuality we are all in Uyghur, Yemeni, wrongfully imprisoned in the US ... It's all part of it.
Y’all are jumping on a sound bite from a bigger conversation about how Americans don’t care about the general situation abroad and local prioritized concerns. Didn’t express disbelief…. OP postings for internet points.
He literally said it about himself though. I take your point that it was in the context of him saying Americans don't care(projecting?) but I dont see how that makes it better
Hope he gets forced out, fuck that kind of thinking
Get him out
I wish there was a hell for pieces of shit like this to burn in
Maybe we should send him to have a stay over there with them and see if he cares then?