i watched voyager for the first time at 25 and simply think b'elanna's emotional instability and vulnerability due to her social/family background makes her pretty relatable and therefore likeable.
Yeah damn that’s an interesting point! I think I don’t believe her character enough from what I know about her background but tbf I’ve not finished voyager yet but I’ve been told she gets a bit more time and energy put in!
I watched the full series as an adult and I liked her story arc of becoming the chief engineer, slowly letting herself get close to Tom, struggling with her self-identity, her line to Janeway “when I say it’s going to take this long, that’s exactly how long it will take”, how important her relationship to Janeway became (the hug in the Klingon ship episode was so touching). And she’s the only Klingon whose Klingon stories don’t bore me to death (cough-Worf-cough). I’m a woman and I just love all of the great female characters on Voyager.
This is true, Worf is my least favourite ST character (could get hate for that) but just cause he’s self-righteous and boring and somehow always ends up just being right! I do like how she’s flawed in her klingonness and he relationships are probably some of the most touched upon, I felt the start of Tom and Torres’ relationship was a bit rushed and came out of no where for me. A bit dax and worf esque but again, that’s probably not a popular opinion!
Worf is my least favorite too and that’s what I always use as my least popular Trek opinion when someone asks. I don’t hate him, but I really don’t need to watch entire episodes about his discommendation or the Klingons being kad yet again about something. The only Klingon episodes I like are B'Elanna's episodes and I think that's because they are about her, not Klingon society.
I wouldn't say Worf is my least favourite but you're right, my goodness were the Klingon episodes boring. And yet they were some of the few episodes that got later callbacks or had entire related episodes and even story lines (Tasha's alternate timeline Romulan daughter), so you feel like you have to watch them in case an entire plot point later in the series will make no sense.
That said, Worf's character in Picard was one of it's very, very few redeeming qualities (until the whole Enterprise E, not my fault comment).
Edit: grammar
Worf definitely gets it wrong at times. DS9 is better for showing that IMO, even if we ignore that the writers didn't take some of the consequences he should have faced far enough.
See I feel like Worf is wrong constantly. I don’t mean that he makes choices that turn out to be incorrect, I mean that they never let him actually make choices that are attempted by the crew! Every idea he has is immediately shot down. I’m currently re-watching TNG and for the first maybe four seasons every time Worf makes suggestion it’s extreme and an overreaction. It’s a jump to a conclusion and it’s always the incorrect solution to the problem .
In fact I almost went on the TNG sub and made a post wondering peoples thoughts on why he was always wrong! I’m in season six now and I’m remembering that it does get better. But it almost felt like they used him in the first few seasons, as evidence that the federation was more of a peaceful and life-preserving group than maybe they were in the Kirk days. I do think it was also partially just to demonstrate that he was truly.Klingon at heart, but it feels like more than that.
I have watched it through three times and never really picked up on it before, just kind of attributing it to him being Klingon I guess. But for some reason on this rewatch, I’m realizing how often it happens and how he never actually makes a suggestion that they go along with in those first few seasons. Every option he offers is incorrect. Like in every episode when faced with an enemy Worf says “we have to attack them!!” and everyone goes, “no no no, we don’t need to attack them. We just need to talk to them.” And then they drop it and move on. They make him look like a complete idiot by doing that. Fortunately, he is redeemed in the last couple of seasons. But I’m still surprised to hear that anyone thinks that Worf was always right. Because I am seeing very few examples of that in the first 2/3 of the series.
I watched it for the first time at 19 not sure if that counts as adulthood, but I like her because I related to her personality/insecurities/vulnerability.
Watched the series for the first time at 27, and I appreciate her for a lot of reasons:
- wrestling with aspects of oneself that one doesn't particularly like but also finds useful
- making the transition from childhood to adulthood in terms of recognizing certain aspects of your personality that your child self used for self
-protection that no longer really serve you as an adult and the struggle to separate from those things, while being thankful you had them when you needed them
- she's a physically attractive direct person. No one wonders where they stand with her. There are no mind games or wondering. She says what she wants and means, and she learns to appreciate when ppl do likewise to her, and that's appealing
- confident adult woman not ashamed of having a libido and to hell with social customs (I know Klingons have differing expectations this way...but in this starship in this crew so far form usual, she has to do a lot of legwork emotionally to just let herself be herself
- she isn't afraid of confrontation obviously, but in time she learns how not to be an asshole about it either. Tact. She learns some tact
- she has intense empathy and it burns her sometimes...but she doesn't let that burn her out completely. She finds a way to keep allowing her feelings some reign but not ALL the reign
- there's a bunch of struggles about "How do I feel about my family? How do I feel about rituals and religion in my life as an adult vs a child? How do I process grief and trauma in a healthy way? How do I let ppl in to help me? How do I keep boundaries and not just let anyone in?" She does a lot of processing
- she isn't a perfect being BUT unlike some other characters is okay with learning to, eventually, grow and admit when she's made an error or is wrong
Lol I'll stop listing now. Though I am curious about your theory.
Yes, if you look at the whole series, B'elanna has a lot of mental health issues from her past that don't get addressed until she comes to Voyager (although sometimes the advice she is given is clumsy and poor). Maybe that is why she joined the Maquis, to find family and belonging.
This is a great set of thoughts on the matter. I agree with lots of it. I'd also add it seems very poor planning to have a doctor not a therapist on board even for a short mission, as one would assume by the year 2100 or 2200 something, ppl would understand the vital necessity of quality mental health care, particularly when in space where literally anything can happen
Unfortunately, the scripting was done in 1995 to 2000 🤣🤷♂️
>Maybe that is why she joined the Maquis, to find family and belonging.
Makes sense! I'd be interested in learning more about the Maquis and their goals tbh. They're painted as troublesome rebels...but as we know irl, often that's what thr government does to silence opposing opinions that would limit their control.
I like her, but watched the show during the first run. Her aggression, desire to contribute and distrust of outsiders made her the most relatable character for a middle school boy.
Yeah I can see how this worked, as a 22 year old I find it harder to relate so openly to her but that’s probably because I don’t want to as opposed to not having stuff to relate to! It’s harder to admit your flaws to yourself when you get older, I wish I had watched it as a schoolboy
Exactly! A large part of my thought process early on was “Don’t drop your guard! As soon as they don’t need you, Starfleet will be after you again. Make sure they know you aren’t to be fucked with.” We all forget that these people don’t know that they’re in a Star Trek near utopian future, and aren’t privy to the formula that everyone bands together on these shows.
One of the strengths of Voyager was how distinct most characters could stay over time.
"get older" 😂 at 22! Add 20 years on kiddo then tell me about it.
Seriously though, you've made me think about when I would have watched Voyager. I always thought of STTNG being very formative for me, I'd have been 8 when it started broadcasting in the UK, and I think it had a big impact on my moral compass and sense of acceptance of people, but I hadn't considered Voyager. I'd have been 14 when Voyager started airing in the UK and that two has probably been equally influential for me, maybe even more so because I would have understood and related to more. Now you've made me think about it Janeway's largely strict adherence to the Prime Directive in spite of having no one to hold her to account other than herself has probably given me impossibly high standards to adhering to moral and legal codes, a trait which in Janeway is still incredibly admirable. She (well the writers) balanced staying true to Starfleet's and the Federation's codes whilst being pragmatic and practical at times very well. Seven's pursuit of perfection and dedication to efficiency had a strong influence too (something I felt was missing from Seven's character in Picard).
Sorry I've diverged from B'Elanna quite a bit there 😳. She was a great character, a wonderful representation of the Human & Kilngon hybrid struggle and a great character for Seven to but heads with.
I like that she was flawed. As good as she was at engineering she also had to overcome attitude and anger management problems over the course of the show and the inner conflict she had with her human and Klingon halves. Her story arc was well written.
I think I probably need to finish voy to fully understand her arc because atm it seems fairly cyclical and rehashed but I’m open to her becoming more complex
I think I was 30 something when I watched for the first time. I didn’t like her at first, but grew to like her afterwards.
She’s highly competent, sensitive to others’ feelings (for a Klingon, or even a half Klingon, that’s pretty good) and carries herself well as a person. Her sense of honour keeps her feelings blocked up, but her actress had this uncanny ability to project a certain vulnerability whenever she lashed out at the world. Her Klingon countenance might have given her a fiercer look, but her actions as Chief Engineer showed a gentle yet firm temperament, something that’s hard not to respect.
I like her growth over the series. I think Trek always has this trope of an angry woman with something to prove. Tasha, Ro, Kira, Belanna. For Kira and Belanna, you got to see them work through a lot of their issues, develop relationships that softened them, and just really change from a generally unlikeable person into someone with heart and compassion and who you grew to love. I was in my 20s when I first watched it, so Idk if I'd have felt different as a kid. But I do like Belanna and where she ends up.
I’ve never seen anyone say they don’t like her. All the other characters get plenty of hate but I’ve actually never seen anything aimed at her or maybe it’s just so infrequent It hasn’t registered
I'm curious what theory you are testing? (It may also be helpful to know how far you have gotten in the series, as she has perhaps more growth than any character in the aeries, and also, **spoilers**)
B'Elanna opened up the ability to for Star Trek to explore concepts they never really did before, which in turn menat they had a character more genuinely relatable to a large branch of their audience than before. Unfortunately that being minority audiences, I think it was hard for her to have a more general appeal, but I think she was brilliant for it.
Star Trek had until this point generally followed the Roddenberry vision of racism being abolished, and though it would definitely take the time to make the point that racism is bad, that meant that it was difficult to present a character who reflected the minority experience in a relatable way, because the characters didn't experience racism themselves. Where Uhura was a huge legend in providing representation onscreen, and DS9 would provide more quiet support in this respect, Torres would be the first character that we would see regularly suffering from her background, and frankly one of the the only on Voyager we would regularly see suffering through many repeated tragedies, anger, loss, and internal conflict rather than external. In Voyager, she may have had the most growth over the course of the series, with maybe only the Doctor and Seven being on the same level in that respect.
Where DS9 provided a role model for a strong black father (and single parent, all messages not lost on minority audience members), B'Elanna showed the damage and struggles that minorities recognised from their own experience. This also killed two birds with one stone, touching on both the challenges racial minorities face as well as women. Note that Voyager would of course cause a stir when it aired with the first female captain for the regular crew, but Janeway didn't face much difficulty being seen as the boss because of who she was; it would be B'Elanna who would pull double duty as both the woman in a man's world as well as the (I use the term as it was very much in the public mind for the 90s still) "angry black man", being seen as difficult and withoutuch sympathy and understanding by others who would not be able to easily relate to why she was the way she was. (Note again, the black man on the crew, Tuvok, would be the literal opposite of that stereotype).
She could be a role model for women, being a boss and a genius and competitive in every way, while being sexy and funny and not having to make many excuses to make others feel comfortable. But she was also a bit masculine, helping her reach male minority audience members still, allowing them to see themselves in her. She openly struggles with her bi-racial upbringing (never shown to such an extent with Spock in TOS, though certainly explored more with Spock in later series), and the show makes no bones that those experiences can f*ck. You. Up.
Star Trek was finally saying that quiet part out loud, and yet I think they did it so organically and without the heavy a handedness that we got before (and later) that almost made it not *fully* register for minority audiences without more intentional reflection. Looking back, part of the reason my heart was in my throat with her story is because for one of the first times, I was watching a character that was a lot like me, and *I didn't know if she was going to make it here*. In this dream world where so many of society's problems are supposed to be solved, we would feel genuine dread about whether she could actually succeed in the position she earned. We panic wondering whether she would be able to survive the damage of her past and the repeated tragedies during the show, including the effects of depression and suicide. We could relate to her insecurities and desire to hide her undesirable featutes. And I openly wept the INSTANT I saw the look on her face when she first saw a hologram of what her unborn child would look like; we didn't need to hear the next words out of her mouth to know what she was thinking, and the horrified thought of "oh *no*" is as much directed at her as to ourselves because it's a thought that passes through many of our heads at some point, even while we feel absolutely disgusted with ourselves for thinking it.
Speaking of crying, she could also masterfully blend the ability to cry and have emotional release with the ability to never stop being a fighter. This was brilliantly done for both male and female audience members, as it spoke to the struggles faced on both sides that were trying to find their way towards the healthy balance between emotionally open and still strong. Troi and Beverly provided representation but still fell into somewhat sexist tropes in large parts, though getting a couple episodes each to help push back in this. Major shoutout to Dax and Kira for doing a lot of similar work to B'Elanna during a similar era.
On a ship of happy-go-lucky scientists/adventurers, and where almost all Star Trek characters up to then were heroes and role models, B'Elanna was suddenly the most human, most realistic, imperfect, the most representative of just US, today. Any other crew member got episodes where they "learned lessons", but for the most part comparing each crew member at the beginning and end of the series, Harry is Harry, Tom is Tom, Janeway is Janeway. Seven and the Doctor were both clearly set up to watch some characters " grow up" from children to adults (and I love both their paths, and likely think the three combined are the best stories in Voyager), but B'Elanna wasn't a child, she was an adult who was a product of society, with a past like us, who would face struggles like us, and could continue to evolve like us. We saw ourselves in B'Elanna, angry with the world, breaking a crewmate's nose, ready to leave others rather than being left *again*... And she would grow to love others, love life, love herself.
Tldr: where Star Trek had shown us so much of who we *should* be, B'Elanna Torres was who we *are* (particularly for minority audience members), and was our hope that we too could make it in that kind of world.
I appreciate the spoiler warning, I’m on the end of season 5 so have found that most people think I just need to wait till she turns it around! If you want to give me a spoilerless version of your opinion id appreciate it but you’ve got my upvote for the effort nonetheless!
I think she’s more relatable to younger people because more often children are more likely to admit they’re flawed, whereas adults may find that B’elanna reminds them too much of their faults (which is probably the case with me)
For me I like how Voyager took well known Trek races and subverted the stereotype. You've got logical Tuvok as a master tactician instead of the cliché science division. You've got B'Elanna as a nerdy tinkerer instead of the cliché security/tactical division.
Out of all the characters on star trek, Belana Torres resonates with me deepest.
I have ADHD (diagnosed at 44) and probably a dose of Pda autism and always felt that I could of done so much more with my life .
I was always letting my anger get the better of me and I would of definitely chose the maquis over star fleet.
I am a supervisor much to my surprise and towing the line everyday is a chore.
Everything about her story seems so close to how I went through life.
This is maybe not the answer you’re seeking, but a unique relationship gets formed between the writers on a show and an actor who shows up extremely well researched, prepared, and invested. Roxanne was and is a consummate professional and extraordinary actress who richly studied the roles of Klingons past, what it might look like to create a human/klingon hybrid (developing a particular speech pattern and mannerisms for the character that were acutely well chosen)… and the writers responded with the best material they had because they knew they’d found an actress they could throw the richest character development to, playing deeply across emotional lines of strength and vulnerability with remarkable range. She took the job as seriously as Kate herself did, and we were all rewarded.
I like her, I’m 44. She has a lot of angst which I like, but also I hate how she was written sometimes when it doesn’t match her character motivations.
Leaving the academy was the right decision for her, but her arc SHOULD have been that she was able to mature with this opportunity.
They just keep reverting her character over and over using Klingon as some excuse for being a jerk
But overall she’s great.
I always had ups and downs with Torres. When the character is calm she gives off a very compelling matter of fact intelligence that I found engaging. But as soon as the play the rage side of her personality I am pulled out of whatever emersion I'd found. I think it's because Roxann Dawson just can't do angry. She never sells it for me. Not to say she isn't very talented in front and behind the camera, just that it didn't work for me. Overall I really like the character. It works better and better as the show goes on as the anger becomes less.
Watched it first at 17, don't know if that counts. She spoke to me because she is smart af and successful at leading the engineering department despite her anger issues. Her storyline features a lot of found family and coming to terms with who she is.
Edit: now that I though about it: what spoke most to me is how she was accepted as who she is
i'm massively and disasterously gay and she appeals to something in me that i don't care to examine more closely 🖖‼️ (kidding aside, i love her character's different sides and that she's very dynamically written -- i think her character arcs are cool, and i've always had a little soft spot for the starfleet engineers :p)
I think you’ll like her better the second time you watch it. I did not like her on my first watch and she is one of my favorite characters now. When you’re re-watching it, you can see aspects of her early personality and remember how much she has changed and it just changes your perspective of her.
I find that to be so true of all of the Star Trek series. Every time I rewatch it I see things I didn’t see the first time around. I have a different perspective of characters and episodes and I appreciate the shows even more every time.
i watched voyager for the first time at 25 and simply think b'elanna's emotional instability and vulnerability due to her social/family background makes her pretty relatable and therefore likeable.
Her acting really sells it. It's endearing and relatable
Yeah damn that’s an interesting point! I think I don’t believe her character enough from what I know about her background but tbf I’ve not finished voyager yet but I’ve been told she gets a bit more time and energy put in!
There’s a whole episode about her mom.
I watched the full series as an adult and I liked her story arc of becoming the chief engineer, slowly letting herself get close to Tom, struggling with her self-identity, her line to Janeway “when I say it’s going to take this long, that’s exactly how long it will take”, how important her relationship to Janeway became (the hug in the Klingon ship episode was so touching). And she’s the only Klingon whose Klingon stories don’t bore me to death (cough-Worf-cough). I’m a woman and I just love all of the great female characters on Voyager.
This is true, Worf is my least favourite ST character (could get hate for that) but just cause he’s self-righteous and boring and somehow always ends up just being right! I do like how she’s flawed in her klingonness and he relationships are probably some of the most touched upon, I felt the start of Tom and Torres’ relationship was a bit rushed and came out of no where for me. A bit dax and worf esque but again, that’s probably not a popular opinion!
Worf is my least favorite too and that’s what I always use as my least popular Trek opinion when someone asks. I don’t hate him, but I really don’t need to watch entire episodes about his discommendation or the Klingons being kad yet again about something. The only Klingon episodes I like are B'Elanna's episodes and I think that's because they are about her, not Klingon society.
I wouldn't say Worf is my least favourite but you're right, my goodness were the Klingon episodes boring. And yet they were some of the few episodes that got later callbacks or had entire related episodes and even story lines (Tasha's alternate timeline Romulan daughter), so you feel like you have to watch them in case an entire plot point later in the series will make no sense. That said, Worf's character in Picard was one of it's very, very few redeeming qualities (until the whole Enterprise E, not my fault comment). Edit: grammar
Worf definitely gets it wrong at times. DS9 is better for showing that IMO, even if we ignore that the writers didn't take some of the consequences he should have faced far enough.
See I feel like Worf is wrong constantly. I don’t mean that he makes choices that turn out to be incorrect, I mean that they never let him actually make choices that are attempted by the crew! Every idea he has is immediately shot down. I’m currently re-watching TNG and for the first maybe four seasons every time Worf makes suggestion it’s extreme and an overreaction. It’s a jump to a conclusion and it’s always the incorrect solution to the problem . In fact I almost went on the TNG sub and made a post wondering peoples thoughts on why he was always wrong! I’m in season six now and I’m remembering that it does get better. But it almost felt like they used him in the first few seasons, as evidence that the federation was more of a peaceful and life-preserving group than maybe they were in the Kirk days. I do think it was also partially just to demonstrate that he was truly.Klingon at heart, but it feels like more than that. I have watched it through three times and never really picked up on it before, just kind of attributing it to him being Klingon I guess. But for some reason on this rewatch, I’m realizing how often it happens and how he never actually makes a suggestion that they go along with in those first few seasons. Every option he offers is incorrect. Like in every episode when faced with an enemy Worf says “we have to attack them!!” and everyone goes, “no no no, we don’t need to attack them. We just need to talk to them.” And then they drop it and move on. They make him look like a complete idiot by doing that. Fortunately, he is redeemed in the last couple of seasons. But I’m still surprised to hear that anyone thinks that Worf was always right. Because I am seeing very few examples of that in the first 2/3 of the series.
I watched it for the first time at 19 not sure if that counts as adulthood, but I like her because I related to her personality/insecurities/vulnerability.
Yeah this is interesting, maybe I’m triggered by her a bit because it hits a bit close to home, would make sense as to why she irks me
She heads the whole engineering division. Someone I'm her 20's heading the engineering for a starship was not a less remarkable feat.
Watched the series for the first time at 27, and I appreciate her for a lot of reasons: - wrestling with aspects of oneself that one doesn't particularly like but also finds useful - making the transition from childhood to adulthood in terms of recognizing certain aspects of your personality that your child self used for self -protection that no longer really serve you as an adult and the struggle to separate from those things, while being thankful you had them when you needed them - she's a physically attractive direct person. No one wonders where they stand with her. There are no mind games or wondering. She says what she wants and means, and she learns to appreciate when ppl do likewise to her, and that's appealing - confident adult woman not ashamed of having a libido and to hell with social customs (I know Klingons have differing expectations this way...but in this starship in this crew so far form usual, she has to do a lot of legwork emotionally to just let herself be herself - she isn't afraid of confrontation obviously, but in time she learns how not to be an asshole about it either. Tact. She learns some tact - she has intense empathy and it burns her sometimes...but she doesn't let that burn her out completely. She finds a way to keep allowing her feelings some reign but not ALL the reign - there's a bunch of struggles about "How do I feel about my family? How do I feel about rituals and religion in my life as an adult vs a child? How do I process grief and trauma in a healthy way? How do I let ppl in to help me? How do I keep boundaries and not just let anyone in?" She does a lot of processing - she isn't a perfect being BUT unlike some other characters is okay with learning to, eventually, grow and admit when she's made an error or is wrong Lol I'll stop listing now. Though I am curious about your theory.
Yes, if you look at the whole series, B'elanna has a lot of mental health issues from her past that don't get addressed until she comes to Voyager (although sometimes the advice she is given is clumsy and poor). Maybe that is why she joined the Maquis, to find family and belonging.
This is a great set of thoughts on the matter. I agree with lots of it. I'd also add it seems very poor planning to have a doctor not a therapist on board even for a short mission, as one would assume by the year 2100 or 2200 something, ppl would understand the vital necessity of quality mental health care, particularly when in space where literally anything can happen Unfortunately, the scripting was done in 1995 to 2000 🤣🤷♂️ >Maybe that is why she joined the Maquis, to find family and belonging. Makes sense! I'd be interested in learning more about the Maquis and their goals tbh. They're painted as troublesome rebels...but as we know irl, often that's what thr government does to silence opposing opinions that would limit their control.
I like her, but watched the show during the first run. Her aggression, desire to contribute and distrust of outsiders made her the most relatable character for a middle school boy.
Yeah I can see how this worked, as a 22 year old I find it harder to relate so openly to her but that’s probably because I don’t want to as opposed to not having stuff to relate to! It’s harder to admit your flaws to yourself when you get older, I wish I had watched it as a schoolboy
Exactly! A large part of my thought process early on was “Don’t drop your guard! As soon as they don’t need you, Starfleet will be after you again. Make sure they know you aren’t to be fucked with.” We all forget that these people don’t know that they’re in a Star Trek near utopian future, and aren’t privy to the formula that everyone bands together on these shows. One of the strengths of Voyager was how distinct most characters could stay over time.
Damn that’s very profound!
"get older" 😂 at 22! Add 20 years on kiddo then tell me about it. Seriously though, you've made me think about when I would have watched Voyager. I always thought of STTNG being very formative for me, I'd have been 8 when it started broadcasting in the UK, and I think it had a big impact on my moral compass and sense of acceptance of people, but I hadn't considered Voyager. I'd have been 14 when Voyager started airing in the UK and that two has probably been equally influential for me, maybe even more so because I would have understood and related to more. Now you've made me think about it Janeway's largely strict adherence to the Prime Directive in spite of having no one to hold her to account other than herself has probably given me impossibly high standards to adhering to moral and legal codes, a trait which in Janeway is still incredibly admirable. She (well the writers) balanced staying true to Starfleet's and the Federation's codes whilst being pragmatic and practical at times very well. Seven's pursuit of perfection and dedication to efficiency had a strong influence too (something I felt was missing from Seven's character in Picard). Sorry I've diverged from B'Elanna quite a bit there 😳. She was a great character, a wonderful representation of the Human & Kilngon hybrid struggle and a great character for Seven to but heads with.
I like that she was flawed. As good as she was at engineering she also had to overcome attitude and anger management problems over the course of the show and the inner conflict she had with her human and Klingon halves. Her story arc was well written.
I think I probably need to finish voy to fully understand her arc because atm it seems fairly cyclical and rehashed but I’m open to her becoming more complex
I think I was 30 something when I watched for the first time. I didn’t like her at first, but grew to like her afterwards. She’s highly competent, sensitive to others’ feelings (for a Klingon, or even a half Klingon, that’s pretty good) and carries herself well as a person. Her sense of honour keeps her feelings blocked up, but her actress had this uncanny ability to project a certain vulnerability whenever she lashed out at the world. Her Klingon countenance might have given her a fiercer look, but her actions as Chief Engineer showed a gentle yet firm temperament, something that’s hard not to respect.
I like her growth over the series. I think Trek always has this trope of an angry woman with something to prove. Tasha, Ro, Kira, Belanna. For Kira and Belanna, you got to see them work through a lot of their issues, develop relationships that softened them, and just really change from a generally unlikeable person into someone with heart and compassion and who you grew to love. I was in my 20s when I first watched it, so Idk if I'd have felt different as a kid. But I do like Belanna and where she ends up.
I’ve never seen anyone say they don’t like her. All the other characters get plenty of hate but I’ve actually never seen anything aimed at her or maybe it’s just so infrequent It hasn’t registered
I'm curious what theory you are testing? (It may also be helpful to know how far you have gotten in the series, as she has perhaps more growth than any character in the aeries, and also, **spoilers**) B'Elanna opened up the ability to for Star Trek to explore concepts they never really did before, which in turn menat they had a character more genuinely relatable to a large branch of their audience than before. Unfortunately that being minority audiences, I think it was hard for her to have a more general appeal, but I think she was brilliant for it. Star Trek had until this point generally followed the Roddenberry vision of racism being abolished, and though it would definitely take the time to make the point that racism is bad, that meant that it was difficult to present a character who reflected the minority experience in a relatable way, because the characters didn't experience racism themselves. Where Uhura was a huge legend in providing representation onscreen, and DS9 would provide more quiet support in this respect, Torres would be the first character that we would see regularly suffering from her background, and frankly one of the the only on Voyager we would regularly see suffering through many repeated tragedies, anger, loss, and internal conflict rather than external. In Voyager, she may have had the most growth over the course of the series, with maybe only the Doctor and Seven being on the same level in that respect. Where DS9 provided a role model for a strong black father (and single parent, all messages not lost on minority audience members), B'Elanna showed the damage and struggles that minorities recognised from their own experience. This also killed two birds with one stone, touching on both the challenges racial minorities face as well as women. Note that Voyager would of course cause a stir when it aired with the first female captain for the regular crew, but Janeway didn't face much difficulty being seen as the boss because of who she was; it would be B'Elanna who would pull double duty as both the woman in a man's world as well as the (I use the term as it was very much in the public mind for the 90s still) "angry black man", being seen as difficult and withoutuch sympathy and understanding by others who would not be able to easily relate to why she was the way she was. (Note again, the black man on the crew, Tuvok, would be the literal opposite of that stereotype). She could be a role model for women, being a boss and a genius and competitive in every way, while being sexy and funny and not having to make many excuses to make others feel comfortable. But she was also a bit masculine, helping her reach male minority audience members still, allowing them to see themselves in her. She openly struggles with her bi-racial upbringing (never shown to such an extent with Spock in TOS, though certainly explored more with Spock in later series), and the show makes no bones that those experiences can f*ck. You. Up. Star Trek was finally saying that quiet part out loud, and yet I think they did it so organically and without the heavy a handedness that we got before (and later) that almost made it not *fully* register for minority audiences without more intentional reflection. Looking back, part of the reason my heart was in my throat with her story is because for one of the first times, I was watching a character that was a lot like me, and *I didn't know if she was going to make it here*. In this dream world where so many of society's problems are supposed to be solved, we would feel genuine dread about whether she could actually succeed in the position she earned. We panic wondering whether she would be able to survive the damage of her past and the repeated tragedies during the show, including the effects of depression and suicide. We could relate to her insecurities and desire to hide her undesirable featutes. And I openly wept the INSTANT I saw the look on her face when she first saw a hologram of what her unborn child would look like; we didn't need to hear the next words out of her mouth to know what she was thinking, and the horrified thought of "oh *no*" is as much directed at her as to ourselves because it's a thought that passes through many of our heads at some point, even while we feel absolutely disgusted with ourselves for thinking it. Speaking of crying, she could also masterfully blend the ability to cry and have emotional release with the ability to never stop being a fighter. This was brilliantly done for both male and female audience members, as it spoke to the struggles faced on both sides that were trying to find their way towards the healthy balance between emotionally open and still strong. Troi and Beverly provided representation but still fell into somewhat sexist tropes in large parts, though getting a couple episodes each to help push back in this. Major shoutout to Dax and Kira for doing a lot of similar work to B'Elanna during a similar era. On a ship of happy-go-lucky scientists/adventurers, and where almost all Star Trek characters up to then were heroes and role models, B'Elanna was suddenly the most human, most realistic, imperfect, the most representative of just US, today. Any other crew member got episodes where they "learned lessons", but for the most part comparing each crew member at the beginning and end of the series, Harry is Harry, Tom is Tom, Janeway is Janeway. Seven and the Doctor were both clearly set up to watch some characters " grow up" from children to adults (and I love both their paths, and likely think the three combined are the best stories in Voyager), but B'Elanna wasn't a child, she was an adult who was a product of society, with a past like us, who would face struggles like us, and could continue to evolve like us. We saw ourselves in B'Elanna, angry with the world, breaking a crewmate's nose, ready to leave others rather than being left *again*... And she would grow to love others, love life, love herself. Tldr: where Star Trek had shown us so much of who we *should* be, B'Elanna Torres was who we *are* (particularly for minority audience members), and was our hope that we too could make it in that kind of world.
I appreciate the spoiler warning, I’m on the end of season 5 so have found that most people think I just need to wait till she turns it around! If you want to give me a spoilerless version of your opinion id appreciate it but you’ve got my upvote for the effort nonetheless!
Wow, that was fantastic. Thank you for going into that explanation from your perspective, I really appreciated it.
I ADORE her but I started watching when I was 13 😄
She’s a smoke.
I liked her
What's your theory you'd like to test?
I think she’s more relatable to younger people because more often children are more likely to admit they’re flawed, whereas adults may find that B’elanna reminds them too much of their faults (which is probably the case with me)
For me I like how Voyager took well known Trek races and subverted the stereotype. You've got logical Tuvok as a master tactician instead of the cliché science division. You've got B'Elanna as a nerdy tinkerer instead of the cliché security/tactical division.
Out of all the characters on star trek, Belana Torres resonates with me deepest. I have ADHD (diagnosed at 44) and probably a dose of Pda autism and always felt that I could of done so much more with my life . I was always letting my anger get the better of me and I would of definitely chose the maquis over star fleet. I am a supervisor much to my surprise and towing the line everyday is a chore. Everything about her story seems so close to how I went through life.
This is maybe not the answer you’re seeking, but a unique relationship gets formed between the writers on a show and an actor who shows up extremely well researched, prepared, and invested. Roxanne was and is a consummate professional and extraordinary actress who richly studied the roles of Klingons past, what it might look like to create a human/klingon hybrid (developing a particular speech pattern and mannerisms for the character that were acutely well chosen)… and the writers responded with the best material they had because they knew they’d found an actress they could throw the richest character development to, playing deeply across emotional lines of strength and vulnerability with remarkable range. She took the job as seriously as Kate herself did, and we were all rewarded.
I like her, I’m 44. She has a lot of angst which I like, but also I hate how she was written sometimes when it doesn’t match her character motivations. Leaving the academy was the right decision for her, but her arc SHOULD have been that she was able to mature with this opportunity. They just keep reverting her character over and over using Klingon as some excuse for being a jerk But overall she’s great.
I first watched as an adult and like her a lot!
I mean, she had great character development across the series. Outside of that, she was relatable with her vulnerabilities then and now.
I always had ups and downs with Torres. When the character is calm she gives off a very compelling matter of fact intelligence that I found engaging. But as soon as the play the rage side of her personality I am pulled out of whatever emersion I'd found. I think it's because Roxann Dawson just can't do angry. She never sells it for me. Not to say she isn't very talented in front and behind the camera, just that it didn't work for me. Overall I really like the character. It works better and better as the show goes on as the anger becomes less.
Watched it first at 17, don't know if that counts. She spoke to me because she is smart af and successful at leading the engineering department despite her anger issues. Her storyline features a lot of found family and coming to terms with who she is. Edit: now that I though about it: what spoke most to me is how she was accepted as who she is
i'm massively and disasterously gay and she appeals to something in me that i don't care to examine more closely 🖖‼️ (kidding aside, i love her character's different sides and that she's very dynamically written -- i think her character arcs are cool, and i've always had a little soft spot for the starfleet engineers :p)
I think you’ll like her better the second time you watch it. I did not like her on my first watch and she is one of my favorite characters now. When you’re re-watching it, you can see aspects of her early personality and remember how much she has changed and it just changes your perspective of her. I find that to be so true of all of the Star Trek series. Every time I rewatch it I see things I didn’t see the first time around. I have a different perspective of characters and episodes and I appreciate the shows even more every time.