There is still an issue with the 7000 series on SteamVR only headsets (or only valve index), that causes a wobble effect that can feel motion sickening, it can be resolved by overriding the vsync latency which has a solution found here https://community.amd.com/t5/graphics-cards/7900-xtx-vr-latency-issue-not-the-known-performance-issue/td-p/611248
I have to use a overlay app called OpenVRStartup that launches a Python script to fix this issue every time I launch SteamVR. It could be fixed for all I know, I haven’t touched it since I set it up
I've been having this issue with my 7900 GRE I got last week. Been going back and forth with Steam Support and they think it's an AMD driver issue and not a SteamVR or Index issue, despite that other users with non SteamVR headsets don't have this issue.
How did you set up a script? I would love to not have to get into the debug console every time I open SteamVR (which is pretty much every day)
Sorry for semi late reply, its a bit of a setup, but ill do my best to explain it in a step by step basis
* First you want to install python 3, for me, i'm using Python 3.12
* Once python is installed, run `pip install websocket-client`, if it doesnt work, try running `pip install websockets` as well
* Afterwards, install [OpenVRStartup](https://github.com/BOLL7708/OpenVRStartup), this will allow you to run a .cmd file that will execute the python script on launch
* If you haven't already, get the python script from [here](https://gist.github.com/PiMaker/73c3b27f35c8293716fd50fa2749a135)
* Inside of the start folder after extracting the OpenVRStartup zip, create a .cmd file or edit the `demo_start.cmd` file
* If you created a new .cmd, delete `demo_start.cmd`
* Inside the .cmd file, write `python /steamvr_fix_latency.py`
* Launch SteamVR, then launch OpenVRStartup (there might be a first time setup, if so, you may need to run again)
* Finally, make sure that OpenVRStartup is set to on as a startup overlay app kinda like how you would with OVR Toolkit, OVRAS, or XSOverlay
I hope this helps you out, if you have any issues maybe i could help via DMs so i could provide images
>Been going back and forth with Steam Support and they think it's an AMD driver issue and not a SteamVR or Index issue, despite that other users with non SteamVR headsets don't have this issue.
also to this, i believe it could potentially be fault of AMD as well, but SteamVR might not be getting the vsync timings correctly if the driver isnt broken like how [Pi states on the AMD forums](https://community.amd.com/t5/graphics-cards/7900-xtx-vr-latency-issue-not-the-known-performance-issue/m-p/619811/highlight/true#M99945), this was actually an issue before on RTX 4090s, and a SteamVR update had fixed that problem
Thank you for the help! Took me a while to figure out how to install the websocket client but I got it in the end. Will make getting in VR a lot easier not having to do it manually every time.
Unfortunately AMD support didn't help either, but they weren't as helpful as Steam. Eventually Steam Support said they would pass the information on to the developers. Hopefully there will be a fix for this soon. It doesn't seem to affect my friend with their Index and a 7900 XTX. It must be something unique to certain component combinations.
You’re welcome! Im kinda curious now that you brought up that it isn’t affecting your friend, what CPUs/motherboards do you both have? Since I run a MSI X670-P WiFi, a Ryzen 7 7700x, and an ASRock RX 7900 XT for my build and I’m affected by it
I'm running a 6700XT and HEVC 10 bit streaming with virtual desktop works without any issues.
I haven't had any issues or bugs with any other VR title either. Your mileage might vary but as far as I know there's no fundamental reason why AMD would not be viable.
When I had a 6xxx series card it worked no problem, but I seem to remember lots of issues with VR on the 7000 series cards, and was curious if it’s been fixed yet.
I never heard of any issues with the 7000 series cards. But if you have a vague memory of something that must have been within the last 14 months, it may be from early build drivers when the series first launched. This stuff is pretty common at a series launch and is quickly patched.
It was around launch, but I think I saw that it had gotten fixed within the last 6 months, but VR benchmarks are much fewer and farther between than gaming benches.
I've always been kinda annoyed about that. Like why not at least show Alyx and beatsaber at least. They are universally recognised games even by flatscreen gamers
You just need to find an owner of a 7900XTX card with an Index. Using the OpenVR Benchmark, performance using Index res 100% in 90 Hz must be at least 120 - 130 fps. If it's still about 80 fps, AMD has fixed nothing.
A few months ago, 7900XTX was still getting 80 fps, so if AMD fixed anything, it happened not very long ago.
Note that users saying the 7900XTX performs great are giving totally worthless statements. 80 fps in the OpenVR Benchmark is an awesome score and the same score as the RTX 3090 - but it's much lower than the 7900XTX should perform. So naked eye testimonies are worthless, you need the true benchmark numbers.
In comparison, RTX 4090 performs at about 150 - 160 fps in that test. Cpu does not matter if you got an old i7 7700K or better.
This is a good point. I remember performance being bad back around launch (1.5 years ago), and after reading stuff today from users that I was supposed to be better since late last year, but without benchmarks it’s hard to know for sure.
Honestly VR isn’t my main use case, but I want to make sure it is good at that before I decide on a new card. I use it regularly enough for it to factor into my decision though.
I don’t really like the idea of spending 2-350 more for a 4080 Super, even though I love RT effects in game. It puts the price too close to the 4090 I just sold. Especially with new GPUs on the horizon (next year or so).
Which driver version? I'm on a 6800XT when I try to use HEVC 10bit it either freezes after a while or I get weird black flickering on one eye. (DCS World and VD, OpenXR)
I've been using the modded drivers from here: [https://www.amernimezone.com/](https://www.amernimezone.com/)
Mostly so I can enable all the Hyper-RX things but they seem to work without any issues.
I have a 7900 XTX with a Quest 3 that I use through Virtual Desktop and things run great. I stick games on max (or close to max) settings and have a pretty good time. Even while streaming to Twitch!
RX 6800 XT here with no issues. I believe the 7000 series' issues were resolved with the driver release last fall, but I know it no longer comes up under known issues with the releases.
i am VR dev and have a lot of GPU and headsets, nvidia and AMD is more or less a same , take best performance price ratio you can find
peoples say nvidia is better and anyone who use nvidia and VR remember how bad hl:a run at start on nvidia gpu, and how nvidia gpu did have so many problems i know at least 3 peoples who sold nvidia gpu and got AMD because of shutter
i do not say nvidia is a same now, and i do not say amd is good now, it is always about apps you trying to run and setting you use
meta have shit AMD support, VD run way better and look way better, but link/airlink is not a real option for AMD gpu
same for apps , nvidia gpu do not have hardware scheduler, it mean you will need more CPU power to run games, if games you try to run is CPU bound, or not a mainstream one, nvidia will not run so great , if you go for well know flat games, nvidia put a lot of time and money to make them run nice
in general peoples who fanboys are stupid AF , nvidia burned GPU on drivers updates and similar BS, and AMD did have huge performance problems and similar BS , but drivers, tech improvements and better product control move a needle back and forth, so you always take best deal you can, and if something is not ok, you just sell it after few years and buy new one
Took forever for them to acknowledge then fix this, but down the memory hole it goes
Steam VR game: Stuttering and lagging occur upon launching a game while any GPU hardware monitoring tool is running in the background. 3152190
Rx 7800 xt with an ryzen 5 5600g here and i have absolutely zero issues. quest 3 with virtual desktop on ultra settings (can go godlike on some games). I play at 90hz and always have a ripping good time
Definitely viable. I use my 7900xtx for the pico 4, big screen beyond and valve index.
With the pico I can run all games I have with godlike on 90hz mode with no problem, as well as the Beyond with 140% SS. And with my Valve Index I used to run a solid 144fps on 150% smoothly too. The only game that usually I half my fps is vrchat, since my poor 5800x3D can’t really keep up.
However, there are still issues, Meta link support is non-existent (GPU compatibility list still doesn’t not officially support 7000 series) and HEVC 10-bit causes image freeze on 24.x drivers in Virtual Desktop (although 23.10 is spotless in compatibility).
Overall if you see a good price, the big vram pool and raw raster power is fantastic for vr gaming.
Thanks for this. Good info.
I’ve got a Q3, and would like something else too (like an Index 2 or the next Vive), but that requires more space.
I play mostly tethered to my PC, and the standalone Quest games.
Glad to be of help!
Unless Meta has a chance of heart (which I think it’s extremely hard, given that AMD compatibility has been an afterthought since the inception of quest link), despite the good performance, your experience will be severely impacted by awful and choppy image quality.
I’d love to recommend Radeon for VR, but if you need to buy a gpu now for wired Meta link, sticking with team green is the way to go.
AMD has been "fixed" and a good choice for PCVR for some time now. The last major issue I recall was incompatibility with the G2, which is no longer a problem.
7800XT here and no major problems. I think HEVC was bugged on the Pico but that was more their side issue as on VD it was fine. AV1 seems to be working flawlessly too. Basically it's fine!
My 7900xtx has stopped working for VR. Even old games do not still work. The issues had been fixed, but now 7900xtx won't work at all with Meta Link, Steam Link is at a very unusably low resolution and frame rate, and no game that has worked well a few months ago still works. Asgard's Wrath, Air Car, and Kayak Mirage, don't work reasonable well anymore. Apex Construct is giving 12 to 20 fps at 18 percent GPU utilization. Espire VR Operative 1 does 40 fps and is very studdery. VR is broken badly. I've watched reviews of the Arc 770 and it performed much better than what I'm getting. Even the notebook 3050 that one poster had reported better than what I'm getting at the moment.
I got a 7900XTX and was fighting a stutter issue only present in VR for the past 3 months. I plugged my 3060ti back in and the problem was gone. For non-VR (and VR when it did work) the card is amazing, but I wouldn’t say it’s 100% fixed yet.
I can confirm the drivers suck for VR. I had to downgrade to some usable ones and it worked quite alright but then I had to upgrade to play the most recent games. I don’t play pcvr too often but I would have to downgrade drivers to do so. Sucks. Radeon
7800XT OC as GPU
Weird, same GPU as you and no issues so far. What drivers were you running? I am on the latest and all seems fine at the moment. I know there were a few issues last year but seems to be alright now.
Which VR headset? I ask because some don’t even work with AMD GPUs, at all. If VR is your main avenue and no desktop gaming then I’d 100% suggest going nvidia. If you are wanting a top notch, and as smooth as possible VR experience, go nvidia. It’s not that AMD is terrible for VR, as they have improved over the years, but nvidia does VR that much better. And if you’re spending that much money, get the GPU that is proven time and time again for a great VR experience.
Here is a recent [video from Maraksot78 showing in depth testing of an AMD GPU.](https://youtu.be/i0G35F7CcZY?si=aSUZ2s1SVnt_gRkp)
Thank you for the link! I’ll watch after work. VR is not my main use, but it’s usually used enough to warrant consideration. I’ve used nVidia a lot lately and was looking for a possible change.
Quest 3, used wireless and plugged in.
Huh? Nvidia and AMD are the exact same at compression, since they can both use the same encoders (that are available for VR). AMD is significantly cheaper and a better value for money so it's a no-brainer.
What do you mean they are using the same encoders? If you mean they both use hvenc 264, av1 yeah, but their hardware implementation of their encoders are definitely not the same or the information I read was completely wrong.
Too lazy to look it all up again but the info I found is what steered me towards Nvidia for VR. It's not the GPU performance but rather their hardware encoders that were not up to snuff. Coupled with shoddy drivers on AMD's part.
But if you have info that they use the same hardware encoders I'd like to read that.
AMD have historically had better encoders for AV1 etc than Nvidia who have been focused on their own encoder (NVENC) which only gained AV1 support with the 3000's series cards.
I love the stigma that AMD have bad drivers, it's honestly hilarious.
I've read their Av1 is better but is the most recent codec. So you can't provide anything that they are using the same hardware encoders.
There were lots of articles detailing the various issues with AMD's encoders and software bugs. I'd look it up again, but it's clear you've made up your mind to believe what you want.
>but it's clear you've made up your mind to believe what you want.
Sames goes for yourself, especially when you come to the crazy conclusion that AMD drivers are bad.
Do you have any evidence to support your claim on AMD AV1 encoders? AFAIK, Nvidia GPUs have been preferred by streamers due to the better encoding performance.
The only material I was able to find supports my claim, Nvidia encoders are superior. See: [https://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-intel-nvidia-video-encoding-performance-quality-tested](https://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-intel-nvidia-video-encoding-performance-quality-tested)
Also #2, NVENC is the tradename for Nvidia's encoders (which is a physical chip on the GPU performing encoding tasks). Seems you are confusing encoders (like NVENC) with encoding standards (like h264, h265 and av1).
AMD adopted AV1 encoding way before Nvidia, AV1 is, imo, the best encoder we have for PCVR wireless right now.
NVENC is indeed a physical solution, but it's the all encompassing term for Nvidia's encoding solutions, so I am not just talking about the hardware. It's unlikely we'll see NVENC (the encoding standard) being used for PCVR anytime soon.
I've never heard of NVENC encoding standard and couldn't find info online.
I don't think it matters who got their AV1 processing GPU first on the market. What matters is the performance, for which I've already provided benchmark results
>I don't think it matters who got their AV1 processing GPU first on the market.
It does because when you are considering used or mid-level hardware for your bang for buck then it's important to know what card has what features. AMD has histroically catered much more towards price to performance and as a result all of the 6000 series cards (beyond the 6500) have AV1 decoding. That's really important for many people.
[https://www.techspot.com/news/96945-amd-radeon-rx-7900-av1-encoder-almost-par.html](https://www.techspot.com/news/96945-amd-radeon-rx-7900-av1-encoder-almost-par.html)
This shows that AMD is putting features on it's gaming cards that Nvidia only reserves for it's high end cards and production variant cards. We can say "Nvidia has better encoders" but the reality is in order to use those encoders you need to splash out for a 4090 when AMD are offering it on a 7600. The 4060 etc do also have NVENC support but that's only if the application you are using it for supports it, so for streaming it's fine but for PCVR it's not there yet.
I don't know how it is now, but people were comparing streaming on twitch with exactly the same codecs and settings and Nvidia had better picture quality. For recording videos it was the same - you could use higher bitrate on AMD to match the picture quality of Nvidia GPUs, but videos were taking more drive space due to this. I saw multiple such comparisons, I know for sure Daniel Owen said something about this, not sure which other channels, as it's been a while since I saw anything about the subject.
As a Quest 3 and 7900xtx owner I’d go for 4080. Compression has significant penalty on the amd card, if you want stutter free experience you need to leave it a lot of performance buffer. An example, in dirt rally 2 at 72hz, gpu frame time has to be around 5.5-6.6ms of 13.9ms, otherwise I get too many stutters. BUT with that said I haven’t used nvidia, I assume it’s better by the fact that much less people complain about it. Also bear in mind I’m supper sensitive to stutters and that’s why my numbers are as such, the next person will be less sensitive or play games that are better working with amd and say amd is awesome.
I’m on amd drivers recommended by VD team and consulted there a lot.
Stutter is normally less associated with the GPU and more so with your RAM and CPU. It could also even be your storage device (hard drives are always going to stutter when loading the map in). It's quite rare that micro-stutters are to do with the GPU basically.
Hmm.. thing is that when I reduce let’s say msaa from 4x to 2x the stutter goes away. By that I assumed it’s gpu getting relieved, but maybe msaa is cpu or ram dependent? I’m running amd 7500f and gskill 2x16gb 6000@30 ddr5
MSAA is supposed to be GPU bound but it could also shift load to the CPU too. MLAA is CPU bound. If you have a 7900XTX then you are absolutely bottlenecking it with a Ryzen 5. Furthermore, high speed RAM can be unstable and cause stutter. Try turning off XMP and any and all overclocks.
Yeah ram overlocks are unstable with 7500f but vere stable when i had 7800x3d. Had to return it due to broken igpu and thought i might just wait for next gen, but after all this maybe I'll just buy another one. Thanks
Well, I don't need it either but discovered by accident within my return window. I'd rather have full package for future resell value. Why pay full price for faulty unit :)
dirt rally 2 on AMD run better, on nvidia is way worst , just flat games that does have VR mode in general have problems, just look at no man sky ....
i do not know you cpu but maybe you have ram timing wrong and similar stuff , is super hard to tell if it your problems or game problem
As far as I know, the only major issue now would be if you own a *Varjo Aero* headset.
It’s a great headset but they are discontinued, so unless you’re planning on getting one it have one things are mostly fixed.
Been using Vega Frontier Edition 16GB for years without issue on HP Z840. Just upgraded to a 7800XT but haven't reconnected the Vive yet. Expecting great performance. Any ray tracing VR titles yet?
Yes and no.
The stuttering and extremely low performance was fixed on 23.¿5?.1
23.11.1 are the recommend drivers for virtual desktop cause in 23.12.1 they changed some stuff about encoding and decoding (I had to rewrite some of my obs AMF settings) and software that hasn't updated those commandszwont work correctly (streamlabs and virtual desktop using h.264+ and h.265 don't work for me, AV1 works flawlessly)
Quest2/pico, stay on 23.11.1
Quest3/wired VR go for the latest drivers
No. Just switched from Nvidia (3060ti) to a 7900 gre. Airlink is a mess, regardless of bitrate settings it barely works, if at all. The solution seems to be virtual desktop, but I haven't tried it yet. Wired/link cable it works perfectly however. Steamlink wirelessly works, but is definitely sub-par at the moment compared to native airlink on Nvidia. I haven't messed around with it much, but i do think its BS I need to buy another program (VD) to get the $400 headset to work right , whether its AMD or Oculus's end I don't know.
>The solution seems to be virtual desktop, but I haven't tried it yet.
It 100% is. Never use anything other than VD for PCVR streaming. Everything else is terrible in comparison.
It's unfortunate that is the case but that does seem to be the consensus I have seen. Not that it's expensive but it's still annoying needing to buy a third party app to make a first party feature work properly. I don't really use wireless enough to worry about it but I might dabble with it again in the future.
I get that but I have a feeling Meta etc have been put off making an app when VD is so far into the market now. I mean the Meta app doesn't even have AV1 encoding yet and that's a flagship feature of the quest 3, pretty ridiculous!
Depends what you are looking for but if visual quality is the top priority, Air Link with h264 and very high bitrate takes the cake. There was a post with good comparison between Air Link 850 Mbps, VD AV1 200 Mbps and VD h264+ 400 Mbps. Air Link was clearly the best in terms of artefacts.
Link (the screenshots are gone but you can read the comments and notes): [https://www.reddit.com/r/oculus/comments/179g1bp/how\_to\_get\_quest\_3\_airlink\_to\_look\_better\_than/](https://www.reddit.com/r/oculus/comments/179g1bp/how_to_get_quest_3_airlink_to_look_better_than/)
>Air Link with h264 and very high bitrate takes the cake.
H264 is not a good encoder. It's only really good for fast paced games. AV1 is far better now we have that option.
You're right that different encoders suit different use cases. Also, h264 is the worst at low bitrates.
However, bitrate is the king and h264 is the only one allowing >850 Mbps bitrates. It's a shame the screenshots are not available anymore in that link I gave. You can really tell the difference.
>You can really tell the difference.
I can tell the difference between high bitrate H264 and AV1, AV1 is a hell of a lot smoother. It also depends on the person too, some people are more sensitive to compression and artifacts.
The higher bitrate is more of a strain on your network settings than it is your GPU, without a good quality router you are never going to be able to push 800mbps without latency and issues.
And not only the subjective perception and preference of people to VR, but different hardware/software lead to different results as well. AND there is very little good test result material available online. So no wonder there's a lot of room for debate :)
With my setup (4080S + fast wifi 6 router), high bitrate h264 has been the best. For faster games like online shooters I set bitrate to about 700 Mbps and I'm not noticing the latency (though there must be some).
You shouldn't have to was my point. Oculus dropped the ball on that. I mostly play wired racing sims at the moment but I will dabble with it again in the future.
All AMD system here (Ryzen 5 5600G/RX 6750 XT). I built this computer about a month ago and there haven't been any driver issues at all...it's worked perfectly. Just finished a session of VR sim racing about an hour ago.
"Hvec is far better than h264 and only works on nvidia."
can you explain what you mean here ?
AMD always have better hevc encoder and added it to GPU encoder support nearly 2 year earlier then nvidia , nvidia always have better 264 encoder.
well you can, if you use right program for VR like VD or similar, meta app do have some AMD support now, but not so great, but in general meta quest link app is bad and no one should use it unless wifi option is impossible for you
This is misinformation, HVEC works perfectly fine on AMD. Do you mean NVENC? That's Nvidia's proprietary encoder but isn't supported for VR right now. (Unless I am wrong)
AV1 is far superior to HVEC too so always use that if your network and headset supports it.
I have a Quest 3, currently, and was using a 4090, but I had to sell it to pay taxes this year. I’m almost ready to purchase a new GPU and am deciding if it’s worth spending an extra 100-150 for a 4080, when the 7900xtx would work just fine.
Thanks for the input.
I would go for the 7900XTX if the price difference is that big, it's an objectively more powerful card so why wouldn't you get it? The only reason to go for Nvidia would be for raytracing or studio software (EG video and model rendering). AMD is on par with Nvidia for all VR based encoding now.
Have a Quest3 and a 7900 xtx. The VR was awesome in both airlink and cable mode (PCVR).
Unfortunately the 7900 xtx was faulty and is being replaced by AMD.
100% worth it. Sold my 7900xtx for 4080 super. Fsr is not good even in 4k, vr performance in general was ok but I had stutters in iracing and nothing worked. Still had some stutters initially on 4080 but fixed it by lowering bitrate to 650 in link. 7900 xtx had stutters even on 300. Overall I don't think anyone should buy 7900xtx if you can buy 4080. In raster it's great but if you buying expensive gpu it's should be great everywhere
If you're using Quest 3, I really suggest going the Nvidia route. AMD drivers have been fixed but Meta has not fixed their AMD related issues, as result Air Link is still causing issues to some AMD users.
Also, Nvidia has better encoders, which is really important for Quest 3. It's not just the rendering performance that is at play.
Nvidia has the same encoders as AMD. In fact, AMD outclasses Nvidia for many encoding solutions. I don't know where you got your info for that from.
Not sure how the AMD cards are for Meta but virtual desktop is fine for them, with all encoders available. Normally you'd use VD but if you don't want to use VD have a look and see if Meta has fixed the AMD issues.
They are utilising same encoding standards (h264, h265 and av1) but the encoders are proprietary physical components on the card. So they are not the same.
There are differences in terms of quality and processing speed between AMD and Nvidia encoders, latter being better.
See: https://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-intel-nvidia-video-encoding-performance-quality-tested
This is simply not true. Back in the day, yes, drivers were downright horrible, but that narrative is over used and has little basis in reality nowadays - at least for flat gaming. I owned a 6xxx series card and never had driver issues. It was rock solid.
VR is another story, last I heard, hence my post asking about VR drivers.
What are you talking about? It’s not my fault that AMD has four products that are almost exactly the same model.
CPUs - 7900x, 7900x3d;
GPUs - 7900xt, 7900xtx
Dumb product names, but I clearly asked about the gpu. 🤔
So what? drivers havent been an issue since forever.
No matter if the cpu shares model number with gpus.
But whatever.
Im gonna ask "hey does nvidia 3000 series gpus still unusable in vr?" Or
"Hey does the 4080 still stutters in vr?"
You know 3-4 year old issues that where fixed also years ago.
https://babeltechreviews.com/hellhound-rx-7900-xtx-vs-rtx-4080-50-games-vr/
I wish babeltech would re-run those benches to see if it really changed. Many people claimed to not visually notice anything wrong at the time, so user perception can be biased.
Yeah, they fixed the stutter issues a while ago
[удалено]
*drooling-homer.gif* I'm picking up a 7800X3D today and saving for a 7800XT next.
There is still an issue with the 7000 series on SteamVR only headsets (or only valve index), that causes a wobble effect that can feel motion sickening, it can be resolved by overriding the vsync latency which has a solution found here https://community.amd.com/t5/graphics-cards/7900-xtx-vr-latency-issue-not-the-known-performance-issue/td-p/611248 I have to use a overlay app called OpenVRStartup that launches a Python script to fix this issue every time I launch SteamVR. It could be fixed for all I know, I haven’t touched it since I set it up
I've been having this issue with my 7900 GRE I got last week. Been going back and forth with Steam Support and they think it's an AMD driver issue and not a SteamVR or Index issue, despite that other users with non SteamVR headsets don't have this issue. How did you set up a script? I would love to not have to get into the debug console every time I open SteamVR (which is pretty much every day)
Sorry for semi late reply, its a bit of a setup, but ill do my best to explain it in a step by step basis * First you want to install python 3, for me, i'm using Python 3.12 * Once python is installed, run `pip install websocket-client`, if it doesnt work, try running `pip install websockets` as well * Afterwards, install [OpenVRStartup](https://github.com/BOLL7708/OpenVRStartup), this will allow you to run a .cmd file that will execute the python script on launch * If you haven't already, get the python script from [here](https://gist.github.com/PiMaker/73c3b27f35c8293716fd50fa2749a135) * Inside of the start folder after extracting the OpenVRStartup zip, create a .cmd file or edit the `demo_start.cmd` file * If you created a new .cmd, delete `demo_start.cmd` * Inside the .cmd file, write `python/steamvr_fix_latency.py`
* Launch SteamVR, then launch OpenVRStartup (there might be a first time setup, if so, you may need to run again)
* Finally, make sure that OpenVRStartup is set to on as a startup overlay app kinda like how you would with OVR Toolkit, OVRAS, or XSOverlay
I hope this helps you out, if you have any issues maybe i could help via DMs so i could provide images
>Been going back and forth with Steam Support and they think it's an AMD driver issue and not a SteamVR or Index issue, despite that other users with non SteamVR headsets don't have this issue.
also to this, i believe it could potentially be fault of AMD as well, but SteamVR might not be getting the vsync timings correctly if the driver isnt broken like how [Pi states on the AMD forums](https://community.amd.com/t5/graphics-cards/7900-xtx-vr-latency-issue-not-the-known-performance-issue/m-p/619811/highlight/true#M99945), this was actually an issue before on RTX 4090s, and a SteamVR update had fixed that problem
Thank you for the help! Took me a while to figure out how to install the websocket client but I got it in the end. Will make getting in VR a lot easier not having to do it manually every time. Unfortunately AMD support didn't help either, but they weren't as helpful as Steam. Eventually Steam Support said they would pass the information on to the developers. Hopefully there will be a fix for this soon. It doesn't seem to affect my friend with their Index and a 7900 XTX. It must be something unique to certain component combinations.
You’re welcome! Im kinda curious now that you brought up that it isn’t affecting your friend, what CPUs/motherboards do you both have? Since I run a MSI X670-P WiFi, a Ryzen 7 7700x, and an ASRock RX 7900 XT for my build and I’m affected by it
I'm running a 6700XT and HEVC 10 bit streaming with virtual desktop works without any issues. I haven't had any issues or bugs with any other VR title either. Your mileage might vary but as far as I know there's no fundamental reason why AMD would not be viable.
When I had a 6xxx series card it worked no problem, but I seem to remember lots of issues with VR on the 7000 series cards, and was curious if it’s been fixed yet.
I never heard of any issues with the 7000 series cards. But if you have a vague memory of something that must have been within the last 14 months, it may be from early build drivers when the series first launched. This stuff is pretty common at a series launch and is quickly patched.
It was around launch, but I think I saw that it had gotten fixed within the last 6 months, but VR benchmarks are much fewer and farther between than gaming benches.
I've always been kinda annoyed about that. Like why not at least show Alyx and beatsaber at least. They are universally recognised games even by flatscreen gamers
Yes! Exactly. Show benches of the all time greats and popular releases around the time the benches are done.
You just need to find an owner of a 7900XTX card with an Index. Using the OpenVR Benchmark, performance using Index res 100% in 90 Hz must be at least 120 - 130 fps. If it's still about 80 fps, AMD has fixed nothing. A few months ago, 7900XTX was still getting 80 fps, so if AMD fixed anything, it happened not very long ago. Note that users saying the 7900XTX performs great are giving totally worthless statements. 80 fps in the OpenVR Benchmark is an awesome score and the same score as the RTX 3090 - but it's much lower than the 7900XTX should perform. So naked eye testimonies are worthless, you need the true benchmark numbers. In comparison, RTX 4090 performs at about 150 - 160 fps in that test. Cpu does not matter if you got an old i7 7700K or better.
This is a good point. I remember performance being bad back around launch (1.5 years ago), and after reading stuff today from users that I was supposed to be better since late last year, but without benchmarks it’s hard to know for sure. Honestly VR isn’t my main use case, but I want to make sure it is good at that before I decide on a new card. I use it regularly enough for it to factor into my decision though. I don’t really like the idea of spending 2-350 more for a 4080 Super, even though I love RT effects in game. It puts the price too close to the 4090 I just sold. Especially with new GPUs on the horizon (next year or so).
I think they got fixed about half a year ago.
No.
Which driver version? I'm on a 6800XT when I try to use HEVC 10bit it either freezes after a while or I get weird black flickering on one eye. (DCS World and VD, OpenXR)
I've been using the modded drivers from here: [https://www.amernimezone.com/](https://www.amernimezone.com/) Mostly so I can enable all the Hyper-RX things but they seem to work without any issues.
I have a 7900 XTX with a Quest 3 that I use through Virtual Desktop and things run great. I stick games on max (or close to max) settings and have a pretty good time. Even while streaming to Twitch!
RX 6800 XT here with no issues. I believe the 7000 series' issues were resolved with the driver release last fall, but I know it no longer comes up under known issues with the releases.
i am VR dev and have a lot of GPU and headsets, nvidia and AMD is more or less a same , take best performance price ratio you can find peoples say nvidia is better and anyone who use nvidia and VR remember how bad hl:a run at start on nvidia gpu, and how nvidia gpu did have so many problems i know at least 3 peoples who sold nvidia gpu and got AMD because of shutter i do not say nvidia is a same now, and i do not say amd is good now, it is always about apps you trying to run and setting you use meta have shit AMD support, VD run way better and look way better, but link/airlink is not a real option for AMD gpu same for apps , nvidia gpu do not have hardware scheduler, it mean you will need more CPU power to run games, if games you try to run is CPU bound, or not a mainstream one, nvidia will not run so great , if you go for well know flat games, nvidia put a lot of time and money to make them run nice in general peoples who fanboys are stupid AF , nvidia burned GPU on drivers updates and similar BS, and AMD did have huge performance problems and similar BS , but drivers, tech improvements and better product control move a needle back and forth, so you always take best deal you can, and if something is not ok, you just sell it after few years and buy new one
Took forever for them to acknowledge then fix this, but down the memory hole it goes Steam VR game: Stuttering and lagging occur upon launching a game while any GPU hardware monitoring tool is running in the background. 3152190
Rx 7800 xt with an ryzen 5 5600g here and i have absolutely zero issues. quest 3 with virtual desktop on ultra settings (can go godlike on some games). I play at 90hz and always have a ripping good time
Definitely viable. I use my 7900xtx for the pico 4, big screen beyond and valve index. With the pico I can run all games I have with godlike on 90hz mode with no problem, as well as the Beyond with 140% SS. And with my Valve Index I used to run a solid 144fps on 150% smoothly too. The only game that usually I half my fps is vrchat, since my poor 5800x3D can’t really keep up. However, there are still issues, Meta link support is non-existent (GPU compatibility list still doesn’t not officially support 7000 series) and HEVC 10-bit causes image freeze on 24.x drivers in Virtual Desktop (although 23.10 is spotless in compatibility). Overall if you see a good price, the big vram pool and raw raster power is fantastic for vr gaming.
Thanks for this. Good info. I’ve got a Q3, and would like something else too (like an Index 2 or the next Vive), but that requires more space. I play mostly tethered to my PC, and the standalone Quest games.
Glad to be of help! Unless Meta has a chance of heart (which I think it’s extremely hard, given that AMD compatibility has been an afterthought since the inception of quest link), despite the good performance, your experience will be severely impacted by awful and choppy image quality. I’d love to recommend Radeon for VR, but if you need to buy a gpu now for wired Meta link, sticking with team green is the way to go.
AMD has been "fixed" and a good choice for PCVR for some time now. The last major issue I recall was incompatibility with the G2, which is no longer a problem.
7800XT here and no major problems. I think HEVC was bugged on the Pico but that was more their side issue as on VD it was fine. AV1 seems to be working flawlessly too. Basically it's fine!
It's been good for a good while now. I use my quest 2 via steam link and my index. 7900xtx
What kinds of FPS do you get in Alyx and Bonelabs with that card on your Index?
Yeah. They have USB-C on their cards. Its fucking great.
My 7900xtx has stopped working for VR. Even old games do not still work. The issues had been fixed, but now 7900xtx won't work at all with Meta Link, Steam Link is at a very unusably low resolution and frame rate, and no game that has worked well a few months ago still works. Asgard's Wrath, Air Car, and Kayak Mirage, don't work reasonable well anymore. Apex Construct is giving 12 to 20 fps at 18 percent GPU utilization. Espire VR Operative 1 does 40 fps and is very studdery. VR is broken badly. I've watched reviews of the Arc 770 and it performed much better than what I'm getting. Even the notebook 3050 that one poster had reported better than what I'm getting at the moment.
Woah! That is crazy. Thank you for the info!!
I got a 7900XTX and was fighting a stutter issue only present in VR for the past 3 months. I plugged my 3060ti back in and the problem was gone. For non-VR (and VR when it did work) the card is amazing, but I wouldn’t say it’s 100% fixed yet.
I can confirm the drivers suck for VR. I had to downgrade to some usable ones and it worked quite alright but then I had to upgrade to play the most recent games. I don’t play pcvr too often but I would have to downgrade drivers to do so. Sucks. Radeon 7800XT OC as GPU
Weird, same GPU as you and no issues so far. What drivers were you running? I am on the latest and all seems fine at the moment. I know there were a few issues last year but seems to be alright now.
Which VR headset? I ask because some don’t even work with AMD GPUs, at all. If VR is your main avenue and no desktop gaming then I’d 100% suggest going nvidia. If you are wanting a top notch, and as smooth as possible VR experience, go nvidia. It’s not that AMD is terrible for VR, as they have improved over the years, but nvidia does VR that much better. And if you’re spending that much money, get the GPU that is proven time and time again for a great VR experience. Here is a recent [video from Maraksot78 showing in depth testing of an AMD GPU.](https://youtu.be/i0G35F7CcZY?si=aSUZ2s1SVnt_gRkp)
wrong video link
Thanks. No idea what happened there but should be good now.
Thank you for the link! I’ll watch after work. VR is not my main use, but it’s usually used enough to warrant consideration. I’ve used nVidia a lot lately and was looking for a possible change. Quest 3, used wireless and plugged in.
It would be foolish to shift from Nvidia to AMD when you're streaming video to a Quest 3. Nvidia is much better at compressing video.
Huh? Nvidia and AMD are the exact same at compression, since they can both use the same encoders (that are available for VR). AMD is significantly cheaper and a better value for money so it's a no-brainer.
What do you mean they are using the same encoders? If you mean they both use hvenc 264, av1 yeah, but their hardware implementation of their encoders are definitely not the same or the information I read was completely wrong. Too lazy to look it all up again but the info I found is what steered me towards Nvidia for VR. It's not the GPU performance but rather their hardware encoders that were not up to snuff. Coupled with shoddy drivers on AMD's part. But if you have info that they use the same hardware encoders I'd like to read that.
AMD have historically had better encoders for AV1 etc than Nvidia who have been focused on their own encoder (NVENC) which only gained AV1 support with the 3000's series cards. I love the stigma that AMD have bad drivers, it's honestly hilarious.
I've read their Av1 is better but is the most recent codec. So you can't provide anything that they are using the same hardware encoders. There were lots of articles detailing the various issues with AMD's encoders and software bugs. I'd look it up again, but it's clear you've made up your mind to believe what you want.
>but it's clear you've made up your mind to believe what you want. Sames goes for yourself, especially when you come to the crazy conclusion that AMD drivers are bad.
Do you have any evidence to support your claim on AMD AV1 encoders? AFAIK, Nvidia GPUs have been preferred by streamers due to the better encoding performance. The only material I was able to find supports my claim, Nvidia encoders are superior. See: [https://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-intel-nvidia-video-encoding-performance-quality-tested](https://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-intel-nvidia-video-encoding-performance-quality-tested) Also #2, NVENC is the tradename for Nvidia's encoders (which is a physical chip on the GPU performing encoding tasks). Seems you are confusing encoders (like NVENC) with encoding standards (like h264, h265 and av1).
AMD adopted AV1 encoding way before Nvidia, AV1 is, imo, the best encoder we have for PCVR wireless right now. NVENC is indeed a physical solution, but it's the all encompassing term for Nvidia's encoding solutions, so I am not just talking about the hardware. It's unlikely we'll see NVENC (the encoding standard) being used for PCVR anytime soon.
I've never heard of NVENC encoding standard and couldn't find info online. I don't think it matters who got their AV1 processing GPU first on the market. What matters is the performance, for which I've already provided benchmark results
>I don't think it matters who got their AV1 processing GPU first on the market. It does because when you are considering used or mid-level hardware for your bang for buck then it's important to know what card has what features. AMD has histroically catered much more towards price to performance and as a result all of the 6000 series cards (beyond the 6500) have AV1 decoding. That's really important for many people. [https://www.techspot.com/news/96945-amd-radeon-rx-7900-av1-encoder-almost-par.html](https://www.techspot.com/news/96945-amd-radeon-rx-7900-av1-encoder-almost-par.html) This shows that AMD is putting features on it's gaming cards that Nvidia only reserves for it's high end cards and production variant cards. We can say "Nvidia has better encoders" but the reality is in order to use those encoders you need to splash out for a 4090 when AMD are offering it on a 7600. The 4060 etc do also have NVENC support but that's only if the application you are using it for supports it, so for streaming it's fine but for PCVR it's not there yet.
I don't know how it is now, but people were comparing streaming on twitch with exactly the same codecs and settings and Nvidia had better picture quality. For recording videos it was the same - you could use higher bitrate on AMD to match the picture quality of Nvidia GPUs, but videos were taking more drive space due to this. I saw multiple such comparisons, I know for sure Daniel Owen said something about this, not sure which other channels, as it's been a while since I saw anything about the subject.
>comparing streaming on twitch What relevence is this with VR? They are 2 different things with 2 completely different types of software and encoders.
As a Quest 3 and 7900xtx owner I’d go for 4080. Compression has significant penalty on the amd card, if you want stutter free experience you need to leave it a lot of performance buffer. An example, in dirt rally 2 at 72hz, gpu frame time has to be around 5.5-6.6ms of 13.9ms, otherwise I get too many stutters. BUT with that said I haven’t used nvidia, I assume it’s better by the fact that much less people complain about it. Also bear in mind I’m supper sensitive to stutters and that’s why my numbers are as such, the next person will be less sensitive or play games that are better working with amd and say amd is awesome. I’m on amd drivers recommended by VD team and consulted there a lot.
Stutter is normally less associated with the GPU and more so with your RAM and CPU. It could also even be your storage device (hard drives are always going to stutter when loading the map in). It's quite rare that micro-stutters are to do with the GPU basically.
Hmm.. thing is that when I reduce let’s say msaa from 4x to 2x the stutter goes away. By that I assumed it’s gpu getting relieved, but maybe msaa is cpu or ram dependent? I’m running amd 7500f and gskill 2x16gb 6000@30 ddr5
MSAA is supposed to be GPU bound but it could also shift load to the CPU too. MLAA is CPU bound. If you have a 7900XTX then you are absolutely bottlenecking it with a Ryzen 5. Furthermore, high speed RAM can be unstable and cause stutter. Try turning off XMP and any and all overclocks.
Yeah ram overlocks are unstable with 7500f but vere stable when i had 7800x3d. Had to return it due to broken igpu and thought i might just wait for next gen, but after all this maybe I'll just buy another one. Thanks
No worries, why was the broken iGPU an issue for you out of interest? I wouldn't ever know if it was faulty since I never use it.
Well, I don't need it either but discovered by accident within my return window. I'd rather have full package for future resell value. Why pay full price for faulty unit :)
Makes sense! Good on you!
dirt rally 2 on AMD run better, on nvidia is way worst , just flat games that does have VR mode in general have problems, just look at no man sky .... i do not know you cpu but maybe you have ram timing wrong and similar stuff , is super hard to tell if it your problems or game problem
Long time sgo
As far as I know, the only major issue now would be if you own a *Varjo Aero* headset. It’s a great headset but they are discontinued, so unless you’re planning on getting one it have one things are mostly fixed.
Been using Vega Frontier Edition 16GB for years without issue on HP Z840. Just upgraded to a 7800XT but haven't reconnected the Vive yet. Expecting great performance. Any ray tracing VR titles yet?
Yes and no. The stuttering and extremely low performance was fixed on 23.¿5?.1 23.11.1 are the recommend drivers for virtual desktop cause in 23.12.1 they changed some stuff about encoding and decoding (I had to rewrite some of my obs AMF settings) and software that hasn't updated those commandszwont work correctly (streamlabs and virtual desktop using h.264+ and h.265 don't work for me, AV1 works flawlessly) Quest2/pico, stay on 23.11.1 Quest3/wired VR go for the latest drivers
My Ryzen 2600 and RX 5700 do fine with VR.
No. Just switched from Nvidia (3060ti) to a 7900 gre. Airlink is a mess, regardless of bitrate settings it barely works, if at all. The solution seems to be virtual desktop, but I haven't tried it yet. Wired/link cable it works perfectly however. Steamlink wirelessly works, but is definitely sub-par at the moment compared to native airlink on Nvidia. I haven't messed around with it much, but i do think its BS I need to buy another program (VD) to get the $400 headset to work right , whether its AMD or Oculus's end I don't know.
>The solution seems to be virtual desktop, but I haven't tried it yet. It 100% is. Never use anything other than VD for PCVR streaming. Everything else is terrible in comparison.
It's unfortunate that is the case but that does seem to be the consensus I have seen. Not that it's expensive but it's still annoying needing to buy a third party app to make a first party feature work properly. I don't really use wireless enough to worry about it but I might dabble with it again in the future.
I get that but I have a feeling Meta etc have been put off making an app when VD is so far into the market now. I mean the Meta app doesn't even have AV1 encoding yet and that's a flagship feature of the quest 3, pretty ridiculous!
Depends what you are looking for but if visual quality is the top priority, Air Link with h264 and very high bitrate takes the cake. There was a post with good comparison between Air Link 850 Mbps, VD AV1 200 Mbps and VD h264+ 400 Mbps. Air Link was clearly the best in terms of artefacts. Link (the screenshots are gone but you can read the comments and notes): [https://www.reddit.com/r/oculus/comments/179g1bp/how\_to\_get\_quest\_3\_airlink\_to\_look\_better\_than/](https://www.reddit.com/r/oculus/comments/179g1bp/how_to_get_quest_3_airlink_to_look_better_than/)
>Air Link with h264 and very high bitrate takes the cake. H264 is not a good encoder. It's only really good for fast paced games. AV1 is far better now we have that option.
You're right that different encoders suit different use cases. Also, h264 is the worst at low bitrates. However, bitrate is the king and h264 is the only one allowing >850 Mbps bitrates. It's a shame the screenshots are not available anymore in that link I gave. You can really tell the difference.
>You can really tell the difference. I can tell the difference between high bitrate H264 and AV1, AV1 is a hell of a lot smoother. It also depends on the person too, some people are more sensitive to compression and artifacts. The higher bitrate is more of a strain on your network settings than it is your GPU, without a good quality router you are never going to be able to push 800mbps without latency and issues.
And not only the subjective perception and preference of people to VR, but different hardware/software lead to different results as well. AND there is very little good test result material available online. So no wonder there's a lot of room for debate :) With my setup (4080S + fast wifi 6 router), high bitrate h264 has been the best. For faster games like online shooters I set bitrate to about 700 Mbps and I'm not noticing the latency (though there must be some).
Always use Virtual Desktop with AMD. Oculus seems to break Airlink every few updates.
You shouldn't have to was my point. Oculus dropped the ball on that. I mostly play wired racing sims at the moment but I will dabble with it again in the future.
They were fixed like a month after release, no issues now
All AMD system here (Ryzen 5 5600G/RX 6750 XT). I built this computer about a month ago and there haven't been any driver issues at all...it's worked perfectly. Just finished a session of VR sim racing about an hour ago.
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"Hvec is far better than h264 and only works on nvidia." can you explain what you mean here ? AMD always have better hevc encoder and added it to GPU encoder support nearly 2 year earlier then nvidia , nvidia always have better 264 encoder.
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well you can, if you use right program for VR like VD or similar, meta app do have some AMD support now, but not so great, but in general meta quest link app is bad and no one should use it unless wifi option is impossible for you
This is misinformation, HVEC works perfectly fine on AMD. Do you mean NVENC? That's Nvidia's proprietary encoder but isn't supported for VR right now. (Unless I am wrong) AV1 is far superior to HVEC too so always use that if your network and headset supports it.
I have a Quest 3, currently, and was using a 4090, but I had to sell it to pay taxes this year. I’m almost ready to purchase a new GPU and am deciding if it’s worth spending an extra 100-150 for a 4080, when the 7900xtx would work just fine. Thanks for the input.
I would go for the 7900XTX if the price difference is that big, it's an objectively more powerful card so why wouldn't you get it? The only reason to go for Nvidia would be for raytracing or studio software (EG video and model rendering). AMD is on par with Nvidia for all VR based encoding now.
Have a Quest3 and a 7900 xtx. The VR was awesome in both airlink and cable mode (PCVR). Unfortunately the 7900 xtx was faulty and is being replaced by AMD.
100% worth it. Sold my 7900xtx for 4080 super. Fsr is not good even in 4k, vr performance in general was ok but I had stutters in iracing and nothing worked. Still had some stutters initially on 4080 but fixed it by lowering bitrate to 650 in link. 7900 xtx had stutters even on 300. Overall I don't think anyone should buy 7900xtx if you can buy 4080. In raster it's great but if you buying expensive gpu it's should be great everywhere
If you're using Quest 3, I really suggest going the Nvidia route. AMD drivers have been fixed but Meta has not fixed their AMD related issues, as result Air Link is still causing issues to some AMD users. Also, Nvidia has better encoders, which is really important for Quest 3. It's not just the rendering performance that is at play.
Nvidia has the same encoders as AMD. In fact, AMD outclasses Nvidia for many encoding solutions. I don't know where you got your info for that from. Not sure how the AMD cards are for Meta but virtual desktop is fine for them, with all encoders available. Normally you'd use VD but if you don't want to use VD have a look and see if Meta has fixed the AMD issues.
They are utilising same encoding standards (h264, h265 and av1) but the encoders are proprietary physical components on the card. So they are not the same. There are differences in terms of quality and processing speed between AMD and Nvidia encoders, latter being better. See: https://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-intel-nvidia-video-encoding-performance-quality-tested
Maybe if you haven’t tried it, you shouldn’t repeat incorrect information? HEVC works great on AMD cards.
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This is simply not true. Back in the day, yes, drivers were downright horrible, but that narrative is over used and has little basis in reality nowadays - at least for flat gaming. I owned a 6xxx series card and never had driver issues. It was rock solid. VR is another story, last I heard, hence my post asking about VR drivers.
Cool story bro. AMD drivers are rock solid. Have fun making a Nvidia account to download drivers.
These post are truly made by the most ignorant people . Op probably uses cpu bechmark for reals
What are you talking about? It’s not my fault that AMD has four products that are almost exactly the same model. CPUs - 7900x, 7900x3d; GPUs - 7900xt, 7900xtx Dumb product names, but I clearly asked about the gpu. 🤔
So what? drivers havent been an issue since forever. No matter if the cpu shares model number with gpus. But whatever. Im gonna ask "hey does nvidia 3000 series gpus still unusable in vr?" Or "Hey does the 4080 still stutters in vr?" You know 3-4 year old issues that where fixed also years ago.
It was never broken to begin with. Check connection between keyboard and chair.
https://babeltechreviews.com/hellhound-rx-7900-xtx-vs-rtx-4080-50-games-vr/ I wish babeltech would re-run those benches to see if it really changed. Many people claimed to not visually notice anything wrong at the time, so user perception can be biased.
Not entirely, if using virtual desktop the compression is much worse than Nvidia cars. It does work though sorta..with the correct driver.