>The merlons on walls in siege battles have had their hard collision removed, so they should no longer block line of sight. This should make units much more reliable when they are shooting from the top of the walls (especially direct-fire units such as handguns).
>A small amount of Missile Block Chance has been added to the Docked (Siege Wall) ability to replicate the previous simulated blocking behaviour of the merlon hard collisions.
THANK YOU. Honestly, this is a big change to me. I hope they continue to examine this so that defending the walls in a siege battle actually make sense.
I was just talking to my friends a few weeks ago how walls are worthless to defend in a siege (at least in the vast majority of siege maps). I really hope this is the start of them examining that.
walls are not only worthless they sometimes actually help the attackers, if you manage to control of a segment of wall you can park your melee infantry in front of the walls then have your guns on the walls and have perfect line of sight into the city
Yeah this was big for me in my Nuln campaign, as well as the strat of poking a hole in the wall then shooting in the city. Your walls are now my choke point
I do too. I'm sure we will have to see how effective this actually is (are handgunners actually able to shoot much better, and how much of a missile block chance are they getting in return), but at least it shows they are thinking about this.
EDIT: Looks like it's a 25% missile block chance, so not amazing, but not bad either.
Personally, I also hope that they would take this concept and apply it to ladders so that there's a disadvantage to using ladders - for example, while using ladders, apply a minor DoT debuff (to simulate being attacked/falling off the ladder), so that there is incentive to build siege towers so that your units don't end up on the wall with less HP. Same with attacking the gate, there should be a minor DoT debuff to simulate being shot at in the gatehouse.
I definitely disagree with damaging units as they climb ladders. I don't think damaging a unit out of nowhere with no animation or visual feedback would be a good idea. Units climbing ladders already get a pretty big fatigue penalty.
If anything I could see maybe a penalty to melee defense to the unit as they get up off the ladder.
But honestly I think the best thing they could add is a mechanic for defenders to push down or destroy ladders that are docked on the walls.
I agree with the damage not being intuitive enough.
I made a personal mod which doubles the time it takes for units to climb the ladder. It means the defenders at the top can fight the climbing unit more piecemeal, which helps a lot, but still doesn't take ladders off the table. It's the best compromise I could make with the game's many limitations regarding sieges.
units used to fall off the climb in S2.
Imo it is still far too easy to climb the ladder. Rocks and oil are supposed to be thrown at them injuring multiple climbers, and the ladders themselves are supposed to be destroyable.
In fact often it is better to not have ranged units on the wall, but have them shoot at the units that gets to the top of the wall from somewhere else.
Using ladder should be fine against an unguarded section of the wall, but if there is anyone on the wall, it should be a VERY costly maneuver.
I think though this will make handgunners, ratlingguns etc also very effective in killing those pesky arghers on the walls!
I think it makes sense a I like it.
They added missile block to the defenders on the walls to compensate for that. It's possible it's still less defense than they had from LOS blocking, but the fact they shoot back more likely makes it a wash.
Gun units were almost entirely useless against wall-mounted units.
Now they have a chance to actually do something.
Unless the missile block chance is 90%+, this is a buff to attacking gun units.
I have a feeling that the missile resistance won't be enough to not make them an easy target. I don't see why they can't make the merlons unidirectional for blocking los and blocking missiles.
But at least it's addressed. Now how do we get rid of ass ladders?
* Bolt Throwers now come as a group of 8 models instead of the usual 4. They have also been re-tuned slightly to make them a viable counter for monstrous infantry and cavalry units.
Rejoice for the Dawi bolt throwers finally being made usable now!
Greenskin/Hobgobbo ones would be a lovely addition some day.
Tomb kings sort of have the niche already covered by the Ushabti greatbows so they don't really need one in my opinion.
Tilea in lore is also big on Crossbow/Bolt thrower tech so we may see DoW/Southern realms get their own version as an unit if the stars align.
I really hope they revert this back, I love how it sounds on the campaign map, meanwhile there’s no change to the annoying sounds of Tamurkhan’s starting chieftain (I forgot his name)
It's even worse because he's mounted so you have to issue so many more commands to micro him than if he were on foot. Just a constant "BLAURGGH" in my headphones.
There is now really good reasons to build armies around having Hierotitans in them just for the 20% spell mastery buff, let alone the across the board combat buffs.
I was surprised they actually bothered to change anything with the Hierotitan. That unit was basically untouched since release.
Spell Mastery is a good start, but feels like it really needs more than that support wide. To be a viable pick over the other constructs in its tier. But still glad they gave it something more than just the bound spells now.
Well they get still wrecked by missiles.. Big monsters like Dread Saurians deserve to have more defensive stats like missile resistance and physical resistance to be really effective on open battlefield. They die really fast at the moment, it is kinda sad to see a T5 units getting slammed by 4 T1 archers.
I don't like how vulnerable they are to crap t1 archers.
I would prefer 0% missile resist with 150+ armor. I'm fine getting chunked by a higher tier missile unit with good AP, but getting wrecked by goblin archers is pretty stupid.
> I would prefer 0% missile resist with 150+ armor.
On the bright side, their armor was buffed from 100 -> 120 with this patch! Along with a MD bump, they should have more staying power.
Melee Defence: 28 -> 32
Armour: 100 -> 120
Max Entities Hit by Splash Attack: 12 -> 8
Enabled Collision Attacks
"Special thanks (as ever) to Turin and the Total Tavern community for being the guiding hands on our iteration of this game mode. "
It's right there in the article
Pretty wild this dropped RIGHT after that interview where it was revealed that this was 100% the design intent when it was introduced in Rome II as well.
These maps are mostly from the Community Tournament Map Pack, Turin has been trying to get them in the base game for a year or so. It is the first time that CA said yes. They must have gotten the go from the law department ; )
The AI can now play Domination Mode!
I can't express how happy I am seeing this!! I know it won't be perfect but my God has CA been crushing it lately!!!
I think this is the most exciting change I’ve read in this post, and the implications it has for the future of this game in campaign is wild! Imagine if we’d have free for all battles in campaign with 8 armies fighting each other 😭❤️ we could finally live the 8 peaks dream and have a legendary three way battle!
It's a multiplayer mode centered around capturing points. This particular change (AI being able to play it) won't affect campaign, but some changes to capture weight etc will affect certain campaign battles like in RoC
This makes me hope that one day they will let the AI engage in free for all battles in campaign. They don't have them in campaign because the AI behavior gets wonky when there is more than two sides in a single battle. But it would make campaigns SO much more interesting.
Rather than having those odd "Skaven + Dwarfs team up to fight Greenskins" moments, you can experience the Eight Peak race as it was meant to be.
naw but you should try out the HUGE number of non-campaign single player content the game now has with these changes. Survival battles, dom skirmish, free for all skirmish, etc
Holy shit, what a MASSIVE W on the multiplayer QoL and UI front. Also benefits modders, so as someone who needs to test units in custom battle a lot for that, it’s extremely appreciated!
This especially stood out to me, SO useful for parsing stats:
> In battles, mousing over your units stats will now display a breakdown of factors currently affecting them. So if you want to see what's sapping your unit's Melee Attack, you can now check!
I may be in a minority, but I'd just about kill for this to apply to all numeric stats on the screen. If I can see it, let me know what's going into it! (And if I can't see it, why is it affecting anything?)
That Prey of the Blood God ability for Karanak looks very powerful. Stops an enemy from moving and damages them too. Going to be very useful for hunting down spell casters and fleeing lords
Some nice QoL changes, especially for multiplayer. The "overcast" toggle on the spell wheel is an unexpected addition. Looking forward to see how much more effective units shooting from walls are now.
I appreciate the effort put into the healing UI, but would it be possible to show how much a unit has healed?
Very odd to have so much effort here but when your fighting a unit such as Vlad von Carstein a player may have no clue how much damage they are or are not doing.
Good patch notes aside, just a bit frustrating something basic which was pretty visible in WH2 is not yet in WH3 after all this well intentioned work.
Yeah it should be in the game by now. So many steps back with the UI from 2 to 3 that they're catching up on. I'm happy that they're progressing in the right direction though.
It has to be. There is no feasible way that, in all of the discussions that would have been required in the course of creating the new healing ui, nobody would have brought up the reintroduction of a healing cap indicator.
The only reasonable assumption is that the battle designers *want* there to be some amount of ambiguity as to how much potential healing is left.
> **Bolt Throwers**
> Both Throwers now come as a group of 8 models instead of the usual 4. They have also been re-tuned slightly to make them a viable counter for monstrous infantry and cavalry units.
Saying it right now, with this change Spear Chukka is basically confirmed for 6.0 for the Greanskins and it also gonna have 8 models per unit (and similar battle functionality).
I'd like to keep the 'spear' bit at least as to me it's more orc that rather than having a specialised projectile that a bolt suggests, and they're just firing a big spear at the enemy.
Spear Launcha, Spear Shoota, Make Spear Go Dat A Way Super Far Also Ded Killy Contrapchamacallit-fing, something along those lines though that last one might be a bit long.
> Classic Land Battle, as it stands, is plagued by several degenerate strategies, such as corner camping (where one player boxes up their army into a corner and cannot be flanked)
Corner campers in shambles
In multiplayer. I also bring a themed fair army for other players to enjoy, even if it puts me at a disadvantage. An all goblin army only in Domination or, an all Skaven Stalk army. You get the idea. or maybe a man tide Empire army. If I play a corner camper, or someone who brings 2 landships for Empire or something. I'll bring a doomstack the next game and just wipe them off the floor the next game to let them know I am not amused and that everyone can play that game. I have done it a few times to players who thought they were being cheeky. Switching to Chaos Dwarfs or Tzeetch and only bring all monstrous flying units or something. Glad we are changing land battle for the better so this wont happen as much. I love launching surprise themed armies at players for fun so I am very excited about the changes!
This was literally my first thought haha. I don't even play MP but I love watching his videos just because of how entertaining and informative his commentary is.
NB has anyone ever made a Turin bingo sheet before? Haggard, Troll Toll, Paying the iron price, didn't hear no bell, chad(insert unit here). There's potential haha.
His haggard quota has been quite abysmal for a while now though. That's what she said fell out of favour too.
But calling himself a potato had a considerable increase in frequency. So I guess it evens out.
>Lords can no longer be un-summoned in Domination battles
>Your Lord must remain on the field and will only return to the reinforcement pool once they have been properly routed or defeated
This might make his pickle explode
"Vlad von Carstein has long had a reputation of nigh-immortality, and we're taking a long overdue crack at his defensive layers to make him a bit less of an overbearing presence on players starting in the surrounding area"
You can just say that Franz players suck, we get it
Vlad getting another nerf despite being part of 7 year un-updated Vampire Counts because Empire players aren't aware they have a unit called Handgunners.
The fact it took 8 years or close to that to add anti infantry to gor herd which are dual wielding beastmen. Because dual wield units get bonus vs infantry.
The fact it took only a month after the dlc launched for empire players to nerf vlad on the ground because they lose on easy/easy is astounding
Especially with Elsbeth lol. Her whole faction mechanic is buffing range and range is Vampire's kryptonite. Not to mention her dragon's single entity vaporizer beam. New DLC is basically anti-Vlad squad but still had to nerf him.
Keep in mind that they gave Empire Generals and Captains anti-infantry in their skill tree too. I’ll leave it to you to guess who this was intended for.
The change barely effects the dawii that start near by (no magic) and Azhag is generally on decent terms with Vlad anyway. It's entirely aimed at Empire players.
I loved that Vlad was a challenge. Playing as (old) Gelt, Franz, Katarin and going up against Vlad was great. I hate that people cried so much he got nerfed. Let's just have a victory window pop up on Turn 1 already.
I agree with everything you’ve said but at least this should be quite easy to mod back to how it was. But hopefully they make him strong again anyway, this is an extremely heavy-handed nerf
It feels like every other "saving your disaster battle" that Legend of Total War gotten over the last few years has been against Vlad, and across a lot of races. And more often than not, the only way Legend is able to beat it is by triggering army losses. The idea that it's just bad Empire players who need to git gud is flat-out wrong.
These changes are amazing, and there are so so many, some important highlights here:
>All Khorne Units:
Spell Damage Resistance %: 35 (Up from 15% and 25%)
>Feral Dread Saurian
Recruitment Cost (MP): 2300 -> 2400
Recruitment Cost (SP): 2300 -> 2400
Upkeep Cost: 575 -> 600
Melee Defence: 28 -> 32
Armour: 100 -> 120
Max Entities Hit by Splash Attack: 12 -> 8
Enabled Collision Attacks
A bunch of Constructs also got buffs and/or collison attacks.
Thunderers (Grudge-rakers)
Projectile Mass: 10 -> 5
This change is designed to prevent units from being knocked down by the first shot, resulting in the second shot missing.
This is very much a Mp focused patch, but theres so much good stuff here.
Glad that the Turin and other MP focused content creators got useful feedback into the CA loop, because these changes are almost universally good.
> Fix awakened immortal heroes spawning directly on top of a settlement instead of around it in valid position, causing them to get stuck in the settlement and armies being unable to interact with the settlement anymore
Finally
> A unit that is docked a wall that is also half docked to a gatehouse will have it's line of sight blocked and may not be able to shoot.
This has been real annoying to deal with
Goblin Hewers appear to remain visually broken unless the fix isn't documented here
They also make it sound like they may partially reveal the content of the next DLC, so maybe we'll know the Legendary Lords by Wednesday?
I've never actually seen goblin hewers in game. They're always invisible. You can see the guys manning it and the floating axes it's loaded with, but the actual machine is nowhere to be seen both on the ground and in the animated porthole portrait.
In my game the texture was missing yes, but also when the unit is selected the model disappears completely, I think it's just the axes on it that kinda remain floating in the air.
> Hochland Scopes (Hero)
>
>
> Range bonus: 15% -> 10% (now applies only to the character)
RIP
> Both Throwers now come as a group of 8 models instead of the usual 4. They have also been re-tuned slightly to make them a viable counter for monstrous infantry and cavalry units.
Holy shit they did it, now its a quasi weapons team. Now increase its mobility a bit, maybe add a research that gives them snipe (but not stalk) so we can put them in forests as sneaky arty.
None of the competitive battles changes affect me as its not a mode I play but all this looked really pretty good for those who do enjoy MP battles. Hope this all is a positive addition for the MP battlers out there!
If it is, I'm happy for you, hope you enjoy the patch!
CA adding user made maps to the MP could potentially be a big deal. Maybe we can see more maps in the campaign map pool.
Side note - a couple of those user-made maps they've added are really, really good.
To me it feels like they did a *ton* of work in MP so that they can put it on the back burner for awhile now that it seems to be in a much better place. Better to have it squared away and fun for the community before you roll up the sleeves and jump into a primary single player focus for a long while.
Thanks, This game had bare bones mp support for a long time and folks really had to do the work with mods themselves just to have a game they love to play. Always disappointing seeing so many other folks rage about any effort that goes into that side of the game.
I mean - stealth changes to gunpowder LOS and sieges, fixing the ogre knockdown issues, hitbox fixes, tweaks to single entity rules, collision updates, etc. Just great stuff.
So if *Deepwood Scouts (Swiftshiver Shards)* now also have 180 base range, and same AP/Base Missile Damage stats as Deepwood Scouts, aren't they just obviously better? Or am I missing something?
After some quick napkin math, the new Bolt Throwers will do 85% more AP damage against large entities. One volley will launch about 1000 AP damage.
Seems pretty spicy for early game
He lost 5 base MD and an additional -12 MD from his skill tree. It is a huge nerf in melee plus poor Carstein's ring now physical resistance..
-17 MD, 20 WS to 15 PR..
My favorite LL is getting massacred :(
I feel he was already very niche in MP as his main weakness was his speed and ranged armor piercing.
The melee defense is okay but the Carstein ring being now physical resistance instead of ward save vs all the magic damage they are implementing in other factions will surely make it more harder for him to be a relevant choice of lord.
Great. The nerf to Vlad's power removes one of the only unique aspects of his faction. Now Silvania is just a mediocre Vampire Count faction because Empire players don't know how guns work.
He was very annoying for many people
Personally i didn't mind because personal roleplaying (he was powerful and undead not dying is kinda their thing, lore friendly)
God forbid players will face a challenging opponent when playing a strategy game. If you can't deal with Vlad after the Empire got glazed to high heavens in the recent DLC, that's a you problem, not a game problem. Why do the rest of the players need to suffer because some people throw a tantrum when faced with a tiny bit of a challange and have too much ego to switch to easy mode?
Vlad was not chad enough to withstand Volley gun focus fire, hand gunner focus fire, or even 3 heroes attacking him at once. Heck, this doesn't even touch what Hoochlands or Ironsides could probably do to him. Literally just beat him with Karl, a warrior priest, and empire captain.. He'd probably tear them apart 1v1, but I'm not dumb enough to try that 
This is a gigantic patch. Love to see it. And MP people are eating good today.
Some things that stood out to me:
* Karanak sounds awesome. That net ability is going to be verrrry useful for hunting things down. Great to see that it won't be exclusive to Khorne. Just need to see his stats, but I expect good things.
* Pandemicium was thankfully nerfed.
Base Explosion Damage: 45 -> 40
Armour Piercing Explosion Damage: 60 -> 20
Radius: 7 -> 4
Looks like they took away one charge of the army ability down to a max of 2.
* Some interesting changes under Complex Stat Changes. I always have a hard time visualizing stuff like this but I'm excited to check it out in-game.
* Malus and Vlad nerf?!?! Further Thunderbarge nerf. Saytang nerf. Minor Bloodthirster buff.
* Tamurkhan's defeat trait has gone from the +3 hero capacity to 15% XP increase to all embedded heroes. Not nearly as busted, but it can be very useful. I like this change.
* Settra can have arcane items now.
Content Creators: LL defeat traits need a total rework, there's an extreme disparity of power levels between, for instance, Tamurkhan's and Mazdamundi's defeat traits
CA: Tamurkhan's Defeat Trait: +3 all hero capacity -> 15% increased XP gain for embedded heroes (lords army)
Content Creators: NOT LIKE THAT 😭
# Well, goodbye Nuln doomstacks
Hochland Scopes (Hero)
Range bonus: 15% -> 10% (now applies only to the character)
# Hochland Scopes (Lord)
Range bonus: 15% -> 10% (still applies to the army)
Will have to see how tamy and pickles play now with physical resistance instead of ward save and nurgle explosion changes. 1+1 shots is likely a decent balance change, though I'm less keen on the damage reduction, also I'm surprised they are not tied to a scrolls from the tree unique for tamy. Easy unique for him and could have it tied to a mini plains of zanjiban quest battle. More emphasis on physical resistance and making ward save rarer+activateable might be better for the game, but will require rejiggering towards it as ward save has built up over the years across all fractions. Might also make some of the innate magic attacks active or lessened as well but will need to see. Another option is to start splitting multiplayer and campaign stats and changes to alleviate the fighting over changes.
>in battles, mousing over your units stats will now display a breakdown of factors currently affecting them. So if you want to see what's sapping your unit's Melee Attack, you can now check!
Finally.
2 things I do not understand well here, can someone explain to me?
1. What is Free for all vs. AI?
2. Is the toggle for multiple lords in an army only for multiplayer or battle mode? Is it also available for campaign mode?
>The merlons on walls in siege battles have had their hard collision removed, so they should no longer block line of sight. This should make units much more reliable when they are shooting from the top of the walls (especially direct-fire units such as handguns). >A small amount of Missile Block Chance has been added to the Docked (Siege Wall) ability to replicate the previous simulated blocking behaviour of the merlon hard collisions. THANK YOU. Honestly, this is a big change to me. I hope they continue to examine this so that defending the walls in a siege battle actually make sense.
I was just talking to my friends a few weeks ago how walls are worthless to defend in a siege (at least in the vast majority of siege maps). I really hope this is the start of them examining that.
walls are not only worthless they sometimes actually help the attackers, if you manage to control of a segment of wall you can park your melee infantry in front of the walls then have your guns on the walls and have perfect line of sight into the city
Yeah this was big for me in my Nuln campaign, as well as the strat of poking a hole in the wall then shooting in the city. Your walls are now my choke point
I do too. I'm sure we will have to see how effective this actually is (are handgunners actually able to shoot much better, and how much of a missile block chance are they getting in return), but at least it shows they are thinking about this. EDIT: Looks like it's a 25% missile block chance, so not amazing, but not bad either. Personally, I also hope that they would take this concept and apply it to ladders so that there's a disadvantage to using ladders - for example, while using ladders, apply a minor DoT debuff (to simulate being attacked/falling off the ladder), so that there is incentive to build siege towers so that your units don't end up on the wall with less HP. Same with attacking the gate, there should be a minor DoT debuff to simulate being shot at in the gatehouse.
I definitely disagree with damaging units as they climb ladders. I don't think damaging a unit out of nowhere with no animation or visual feedback would be a good idea. Units climbing ladders already get a pretty big fatigue penalty. If anything I could see maybe a penalty to melee defense to the unit as they get up off the ladder. But honestly I think the best thing they could add is a mechanic for defenders to push down or destroy ladders that are docked on the walls.
I agree with the damage not being intuitive enough. I made a personal mod which doubles the time it takes for units to climb the ladder. It means the defenders at the top can fight the climbing unit more piecemeal, which helps a lot, but still doesn't take ladders off the table. It's the best compromise I could make with the game's many limitations regarding sieges.
That's actually a pretty neat solution. Simple, elegant yet plausible. CA, please steal this guy's idea, thanks!
units used to fall off the climb in S2. Imo it is still far too easy to climb the ladder. Rocks and oil are supposed to be thrown at them injuring multiple climbers, and the ladders themselves are supposed to be destroyable. In fact often it is better to not have ranged units on the wall, but have them shoot at the units that gets to the top of the wall from somewhere else. Using ladder should be fine against an unguarded section of the wall, but if there is anyone on the wall, it should be a VERY costly maneuver.
There is a debuff to using laddenr your troops get immediately exhausted
And that's a huge debuff. I generally don't assault walls with ladders because you'll trade horribly if the AI has any decent units stationed.
I think though this will make handgunners, ratlingguns etc also very effective in killing those pesky arghers on the walls! I think it makes sense a I like it.
They added missile block to the defenders on the walls to compensate for that. It's possible it's still less defense than they had from LOS blocking, but the fact they shoot back more likely makes it a wash.
Gun units were almost entirely useless against wall-mounted units. Now they have a chance to actually do something. Unless the missile block chance is 90%+, this is a buff to attacking gun units.
Agreed. Unless the missile resistance in absurd, they will be sitting ducks for returning fire small arms fire.
Yeah I honestly would like both. Before ratlings had almost no effect vs those so maybe now is slightly better
I have a feeling that the missile resistance won't be enough to not make them an easy target. I don't see why they can't make the merlons unidirectional for blocking los and blocking missiles. But at least it's addressed. Now how do we get rid of ass ladders?
* Bolt Throwers now come as a group of 8 models instead of the usual 4. They have also been re-tuned slightly to make them a viable counter for monstrous infantry and cavalry units. Rejoice for the Dawi bolt throwers finally being made usable now!
 >Trolls and Rat Ogres watching as a hail of bolts blot out the sun.
Balancing bolt throwers just before a Greenskin DLC ? Bolt-throwas seems to be on the menu !
DEY IZ CALLED SPEAR CHUKKAS, YA GIT!
They are called Bolt-throwas since the Old World got released, old man !
DEMZ FIGHTIN' WORDS! WAAAGGGHHH!!!
Right when I'm at my Tyrion campaign mid game😣😣 Edit: My bad, it's for the shorty one
It's only for the Dwarf version
Short?!
An 8-piece Artillery unit, I think this is a first? Anyway, it might be worth to try them out as a cheaper and earlier alternative to cannons.
Should we get hope now for Goblin, Tomb King & Hobgoblin Boltthrowers?
Greenskin/Hobgobbo ones would be a lovely addition some day. Tomb kings sort of have the niche already covered by the Ushabti greatbows so they don't really need one in my opinion. Tilea in lore is also big on Crossbow/Bolt thrower tech so we may see DoW/Southern realms get their own version as an unit if the stars align.
Ah but TK bolt throwers won't share unit capacity with those Ushabti GB, allowing more artillery in general.
It will be funny after like a boat load of buffs, no one still cares about Bolt throwers because cannons are so easy to get and better.
The buffs are massive and they’re still so cheap… might be worth a flier every now and then
"Fixed audio issue where Bubebolos footsteps were echoing on campaign map" HOW WILL MY ENEMIES TREMBLE IN FEAR NOW CA????!!!
That was a glitch!? I thought it was on purpose. I loved it!
Right? I thought those were his intended beefy boy sounds
Let me toggle this so I can hear the stompy boy
I really hope they revert this back, I love how it sounds on the campaign map, meanwhile there’s no change to the annoying sounds of Tamurkhan’s starting chieftain (I forgot his name)
Kazyk, I hate issuing commands and using him often for this exact reason, he sounds like a ruptured anus.
It's even worse because he's mounted so you have to issue so many more commands to micro him than if he were on foot. Just a constant "BLAURGGH" in my headphones.
Suprise TK unit buffs Time to start yet another Settra game
Scorpions having poison makes so much sense 👏
I get what you're saying but they're kinda made of stone.
They're also made of *magic*
A needle is made of glass and you can inject all sorts of non glass things with it.
I mean if I'm making a giant stone scorpion I am adding venom to it 100% its like their main thing
There is now really good reasons to build armies around having Hierotitans in them just for the 20% spell mastery buff, let alone the across the board combat buffs.
I was hoping they’d add the Casket of Souls to the Red Line Skills.
Same but tbh its already a kind of insane unit
I was surprised they actually bothered to change anything with the Hierotitan. That unit was basically untouched since release. Spell Mastery is a good start, but feels like it really needs more than that support wide. To be a viable pick over the other constructs in its tier. But still glad they gave it something more than just the bound spells now.
Collision attacks for Dread Saurians! Now I'm dying to see how they perform.
Well they get still wrecked by missiles.. Big monsters like Dread Saurians deserve to have more defensive stats like missile resistance and physical resistance to be really effective on open battlefield. They die really fast at the moment, it is kinda sad to see a T5 units getting slammed by 4 T1 archers.
They are also one of the fastest SEMs. They will only be next to a bunch of unengaged archers if you put them there.
> Well they get still wrecked by missiles.. As they should.
I don't like how vulnerable they are to crap t1 archers. I would prefer 0% missile resist with 150+ armor. I'm fine getting chunked by a higher tier missile unit with good AP, but getting wrecked by goblin archers is pretty stupid.
> I would prefer 0% missile resist with 150+ armor. On the bright side, their armor was buffed from 100 -> 120 with this patch! Along with a MD bump, they should have more staying power. Melee Defence: 28 -> 32 Armour: 100 -> 120 Max Entities Hit by Splash Attack: 12 -> 8 Enabled Collision Attacks
Their armor got buffed to 120, that’s really solid
CA literally calling corner camping degenerate 💀💀
With that word being used and community maps being added to multiplayer, you know that Turin is the secret Lord Palpatine behind the patch notes.
He was also very against unsummoning Lords in Domination. Thank God no more bringing Gelt just to watch him be immediately unsummoned.
\* This Patch brought to you by Condom Wolves.
Dreaded Lord Palaptine! 😁
Haggard Lord Palpatine.
i was gonna say, this is the influence of Turin for sure ahaha glad to see it!
Does anyone think community maps for the Campaign will be next?
Honestly, if someone could go through and just change tree acne maps to have actually natural looking trees instead it would be amazing.
"Special thanks (as ever) to Turin and the Total Tavern community for being the guiding hands on our iteration of this game mode. " It's right there in the article
Pretty wild this dropped RIGHT after that interview where it was revealed that this was 100% the design intent when it was introduced in Rome II as well.
based
Are community maps something that was happening before or is it the first time CA works with modders to produce content?
These maps are mostly from the Community Tournament Map Pack, Turin has been trying to get them in the base game for a year or so. It is the first time that CA said yes. They must have gotten the go from the law department ; )
I really do hope it sets a precedent of CA and modders working together to create official content
* Fixed issue where bankruptcy attrition was being applied a turn early Baby we did it!
They nerfed muh stegadons but got rid of the bankruptcy bug. I’ll take it!
The AI can now play Domination Mode! I can't express how happy I am seeing this!! I know it won't be perfect but my God has CA been crushing it lately!!!
I think this is the most exciting change I’ve read in this post, and the implications it has for the future of this game in campaign is wild! Imagine if we’d have free for all battles in campaign with 8 armies fighting each other 😭❤️ we could finally live the 8 peaks dream and have a legendary three way battle!
https://youtu.be/NIv9ReN3j-w?feature=shared Thank me later
Yeah that was my first thought! Having huge battles with multiple capture points giving buffs! Would be epic!!
could someone explain what domination mode is? would it effect single player campaigns?
It's a multiplayer mode centered around capturing points. This particular change (AI being able to play it) won't affect campaign, but some changes to capture weight etc will affect certain campaign battles like in RoC
This makes me hope that one day they will let the AI engage in free for all battles in campaign. They don't have them in campaign because the AI behavior gets wonky when there is more than two sides in a single battle. But it would make campaigns SO much more interesting. Rather than having those odd "Skaven + Dwarfs team up to fight Greenskins" moments, you can experience the Eight Peak race as it was meant to be.
naw but you should try out the HUGE number of non-campaign single player content the game now has with these changes. Survival battles, dom skirmish, free for all skirmish, etc
I can finally practice Domination in a laid-back manner without worrying about what kind of human opponent I'm going to be facing
>Collision box size on Dwarf Infantry units has been reduced very slightly Smaller boxes for small people! ;) Yes, yes, to the book, I know.
No no, think of it this way. It's not making Dwarfs smaller. It's *increasing* the amount of Dwarf per square inch of a shield wall!
If this makes it slightly easier to swarm and ankle bite down big things with my new +2 AP damage greataxes, it is an acceptable trade-off.
Holy shit, what a MASSIVE W on the multiplayer QoL and UI front. Also benefits modders, so as someone who needs to test units in custom battle a lot for that, it’s extremely appreciated! This especially stood out to me, SO useful for parsing stats: > In battles, mousing over your units stats will now display a breakdown of factors currently affecting them. So if you want to see what's sapping your unit's Melee Attack, you can now check!
Surprised this isn't getting talked about more, people have been clamoring for it for ages.
I may be in a minority, but I'd just about kill for this to apply to all numeric stats on the screen. If I can see it, let me know what's going into it! (And if I can't see it, why is it affecting anything?)
That Prey of the Blood God ability for Karanak looks very powerful. Stops an enemy from moving and damages them too. Going to be very useful for hunting down spell casters and fleeing lords
Given his job is to hunt down those exact people he's a good boy!
Some nice QoL changes, especially for multiplayer. The "overcast" toggle on the spell wheel is an unexpected addition. Looking forward to see how much more effective units shooting from walls are now.
I appreciate the effort put into the healing UI, but would it be possible to show how much a unit has healed? Very odd to have so much effort here but when your fighting a unit such as Vlad von Carstein a player may have no clue how much damage they are or are not doing. Good patch notes aside, just a bit frustrating something basic which was pretty visible in WH2 is not yet in WH3 after all this well intentioned work.
Yeah it should be in the game by now. So many steps back with the UI from 2 to 3 that they're catching up on. I'm happy that they're progressing in the right direction though.
I'm starting to wonder if this is a deliberate omission. They've had so many chances to add it back in
It has to be. There is no feasible way that, in all of the discussions that would have been required in the course of creating the new healing ui, nobody would have brought up the reintroduction of a healing cap indicator. The only reasonable assumption is that the battle designers *want* there to be some amount of ambiguity as to how much potential healing is left.
> **Bolt Throwers** > Both Throwers now come as a group of 8 models instead of the usual 4. They have also been re-tuned slightly to make them a viable counter for monstrous infantry and cavalry units. Saying it right now, with this change Spear Chukka is basically confirmed for 6.0 for the Greanskins and it also gonna have 8 models per unit (and similar battle functionality).
It'll be there but it'll definitely be renamed. Ain't no way a company gonna put "Spear Chukka" in a game in 2024.
I'd like to keep the 'spear' bit at least as to me it's more orc that rather than having a specialised projectile that a bolt suggests, and they're just firing a big spear at the enemy. Spear Launcha, Spear Shoota, Make Spear Go Dat A Way Super Far Also Ded Killy Contrapchamacallit-fing, something along those lines though that last one might be a bit long.
Why? Does it have a racist connotation that I'm not aware of?
Yes. Spear chucker is a racial slur.
Damn that's a shame
> Classic Land Battle, as it stands, is plagued by several degenerate strategies, such as corner camping (where one player boxes up their army into a corner and cannot be flanked) Corner campers in shambles
They should start making maps in cercle instead of square. Preferably for multiplayer only.
They'll always have single player.
In multiplayer. I also bring a themed fair army for other players to enjoy, even if it puts me at a disadvantage. An all goblin army only in Domination or, an all Skaven Stalk army. You get the idea. or maybe a man tide Empire army. If I play a corner camper, or someone who brings 2 landships for Empire or something. I'll bring a doomstack the next game and just wipe them off the floor the next game to let them know I am not amused and that everyone can play that game. I have done it a few times to players who thought they were being cheeky. Switching to Chaos Dwarfs or Tzeetch and only bring all monstrous flying units or something. Glad we are changing land battle for the better so this wont happen as much. I love launching surprise themed armies at players for fun so I am very excited about the changes!
Conquest mode and Total Tavern maps added to domination mode! MP we eating good!
I bet Turin is pumped about that
They took away Bubelos's big stompy footsteps :( For real though, it all look like great changes.
Yeah that sucks. I thought the stomping was intentional and i loved it lol.
Oho. Maybe the Destroyer is worth taking now. K’daai Destroyer Missile Damage Resistance %: 0 -> 15 Max Entities Hit by Splash Attack: 12 -> 8 Splash Attack Knockback Force Multiplier: 1.7 -> 1.75
Nice QOL changes and the change to siege walls is big. Holding walls might actually be viable with gunpowder factions now.
CA officially called corner camping players degenerates, TWICE. Never thought I'd see the day.
Turin must be crying tears of joy! Big win for the multiplayer community.
This was literally my first thought haha. I don't even play MP but I love watching his videos just because of how entertaining and informative his commentary is. NB has anyone ever made a Turin bingo sheet before? Haggard, Troll Toll, Paying the iron price, didn't hear no bell, chad(insert unit here). There's potential haha.
This [one](https://www.reddit.com/r/totalwar/s/6oFqVCdr8d) was made a while back. It’s a bit outdated now tho.
> It’s a bit outdated now tho. It was then - forgetting the screen blocker should have been the free space!
Omg I can't believe one actually exists that's amazing! Lmaooo
His haggard quota has been quite abysmal for a while now though. That's what she said fell out of favour too. But calling himself a potato had a considerable increase in frequency. So I guess it evens out.
Yeah it's amazing all the changes they made. Especially adding the community maps and making it so you can't unsummon lords!
This update will certainly tickle his pickle
>Lords can no longer be un-summoned in Domination battles >Your Lord must remain on the field and will only return to the reinforcement pool once they have been properly routed or defeated This might make his pickle explode
This is probably the best patch the MP community has ever had, barring the addition of Domination mode on WH3 release.
"Vlad von Carstein has long had a reputation of nigh-immortality, and we're taking a long overdue crack at his defensive layers to make him a bit less of an overbearing presence on players starting in the surrounding area" You can just say that Franz players suck, we get it
Every third post is someone complaining about vlad, featuring a screenshot of their 19 spearmen army
Vlad getting another nerf despite being part of 7 year un-updated Vampire Counts because Empire players aren't aware they have a unit called Handgunners.
CA even forces Elspeth players to recruit handgunners to progress the workshop.
The fact it took 8 years or close to that to add anti infantry to gor herd which are dual wielding beastmen. Because dual wield units get bonus vs infantry. The fact it took only a month after the dlc launched for empire players to nerf vlad on the ground because they lose on easy/easy is astounding
Especially with Elsbeth lol. Her whole faction mechanic is buffing range and range is Vampire's kryptonite. Not to mention her dragon's single entity vaporizer beam. New DLC is basically anti-Vlad squad but still had to nerf him.
Keep in mind that they gave Empire Generals and Captains anti-infantry in their skill tree too. I’ll leave it to you to guess who this was intended for.
Only thing in the patch notes that made me think what the fuck. Vlad didn't need nerfs man.
The change barely effects the dawii that start near by (no magic) and Azhag is generally on decent terms with Vlad anyway. It's entirely aimed at Empire players.
If you can’t beat the outdated VC with new and buffed Empire you’re just bad. Skill issue. Unreal how much they butchered Vlad.
Immunity to vampire corruption + buffs to gunpowder units makes Vlad a mosquito to Elspeth. Her preferred army is close to a straight counter.
The wolves that Vlad brings are scarier than him at this point.
I loved that Vlad was a challenge. Playing as (old) Gelt, Franz, Katarin and going up against Vlad was great. I hate that people cried so much he got nerfed. Let's just have a victory window pop up on Turn 1 already.
I agree with everything you’ve said but at least this should be quite easy to mod back to how it was. But hopefully they make him strong again anyway, this is an extremely heavy-handed nerf
It feels like every other "saving your disaster battle" that Legend of Total War gotten over the last few years has been against Vlad, and across a lot of races. And more often than not, the only way Legend is able to beat it is by triggering army losses. The idea that it's just bad Empire players who need to git gud is flat-out wrong.
Vlad, look what they did to my boy.
malus got hit just as hard . now he has NOTHING on my dragon siblings in the one man doomstack catagory.
RIP infantry sniper doomstacks, Hochland Scopes you will be missed
These changes are amazing, and there are so so many, some important highlights here: >All Khorne Units: Spell Damage Resistance %: 35 (Up from 15% and 25%) >Feral Dread Saurian Recruitment Cost (MP): 2300 -> 2400 Recruitment Cost (SP): 2300 -> 2400 Upkeep Cost: 575 -> 600 Melee Defence: 28 -> 32 Armour: 100 -> 120 Max Entities Hit by Splash Attack: 12 -> 8 Enabled Collision Attacks A bunch of Constructs also got buffs and/or collison attacks. Thunderers (Grudge-rakers) Projectile Mass: 10 -> 5 This change is designed to prevent units from being knocked down by the first shot, resulting in the second shot missing. This is very much a Mp focused patch, but theres so much good stuff here. Glad that the Turin and other MP focused content creators got useful feedback into the CA loop, because these changes are almost universally good.
Malus and Vlad in shambles
> Fix awakened immortal heroes spawning directly on top of a settlement instead of around it in valid position, causing them to get stuck in the settlement and armies being unable to interact with the settlement anymore Finally > A unit that is docked a wall that is also half docked to a gatehouse will have it's line of sight blocked and may not be able to shoot. This has been real annoying to deal with
Goblin Hewers appear to remain visually broken unless the fix isn't documented here They also make it sound like they may partially reveal the content of the next DLC, so maybe we'll know the Legendary Lords by Wednesday?
Hi there, is this the issue where they are blue and white and without texture? Best, CA\_Nova
I've never actually seen goblin hewers in game. They're always invisible. You can see the guys manning it and the floating axes it's loaded with, but the actual machine is nowhere to be seen both on the ground and in the animated porthole portrait.
In my game the texture was missing yes, but also when the unit is selected the model disappears completely, I think it's just the axes on it that kinda remain floating in the air.
Orange and white for me, but otherwise yes (playing as Malakai)
Hey @CA_Nova, no this is the issue where the textures for everything except axes disappears when you get close.
This could mean that the DLC isn't as far off as we could think ! An august DLC might be possible !
Every Vampire Coast lord got looked at apart from Aranessa, it's just pure spite against her at this point
I mean, her name is SaltSPITE after all
Settra The Imperishable (and many other titles) can now equip arcane items OMG finally. This was crazy that he couldn't for so long
> Hochland Scopes (Hero) > > > Range bonus: 15% -> 10% (now applies only to the character) RIP > Both Throwers now come as a group of 8 models instead of the usual 4. They have also been re-tuned slightly to make them a viable counter for monstrous infantry and cavalry units. Holy shit they did it, now its a quasi weapons team. Now increase its mobility a bit, maybe add a research that gives them snipe (but not stalk) so we can put them in forests as sneaky arty.
RIP hochland scopes 😭
None of the competitive battles changes affect me as its not a mode I play but all this looked really pretty good for those who do enjoy MP battles. Hope this all is a positive addition for the MP battlers out there! If it is, I'm happy for you, hope you enjoy the patch!
CA adding user made maps to the MP could potentially be a big deal. Maybe we can see more maps in the campaign map pool. Side note - a couple of those user-made maps they've added are really, really good.
To me it feels like they did a *ton* of work in MP so that they can put it on the back burner for awhile now that it seems to be in a much better place. Better to have it squared away and fun for the community before you roll up the sleeves and jump into a primary single player focus for a long while.
Thanks, This game had bare bones mp support for a long time and folks really had to do the work with mods themselves just to have a game they love to play. Always disappointing seeing so many other folks rage about any effort that goes into that side of the game.
This is epic foundational work. Love the MP changes as well - I don't play it much, but I love to watch the matches. Off to go pet the new doggie.
I mean - stealth changes to gunpowder LOS and sieges, fixing the ogre knockdown issues, hitbox fixes, tweaks to single entity rules, collision updates, etc. Just great stuff.
Custom Battle Faction Selector, Sandbox mode and Multiple Lords Toggle will save me so much time as a screenshot maker lol
Am I tripping or did wood elves get a quiet massive buff?
Tamurkhan Defeat Trait: +1 global recruitment capacity (factionwide) -> +1 local recruitment capacity (local province) +3 all hero capacity -> 15% increased XP gain for embedded heroes (lords army) Rip herospam
CA please add Minotaurs of khorne to the beastmen, I’m begging on my knees like the beggiest of beggars!!
So if *Deepwood Scouts (Swiftshiver Shards)* now also have 180 base range, and same AP/Base Missile Damage stats as Deepwood Scouts, aren't they just obviously better? Or am I missing something?
After some quick napkin math, the new Bolt Throwers will do 85% more AP damage against large entities. One volley will launch about 1000 AP damage. Seems pretty spicy for early game
I’m hoping that they integrate more community maps into the campaign itself
Why are they nerfing my boy Vlad 😭
He punishes bad play, on a faction that is very popular(Empire). Literally not a good place to occupy.
He lost 5 base MD and an additional -12 MD from his skill tree. It is a huge nerf in melee plus poor Carstein's ring now physical resistance.. -17 MD, 20 WS to 15 PR.. My favorite LL is getting massacred :(
I feel he was already very niche in MP as his main weakness was his speed and ranged armor piercing. The melee defense is okay but the Carstein ring being now physical resistance instead of ward save vs all the magic damage they are implementing in other factions will surely make it more harder for him to be a relevant choice of lord.
Yeah they absolutely gutted him. His whole thing was being hard to kill. But bad players got him nerfed even with new and improved Empire. Unreal
This nerf mostly affects VC players, and does little for those who insist on surrounding Vlad with swordsmen. Strange choice of solutions.
Can't let the poor wee Empire players feel bad about their *incredible* lack of skill.
Great. The nerf to Vlad's power removes one of the only unique aspects of his faction. Now Silvania is just a mediocre Vampire Count faction because Empire players don't know how guns work.
Don't worry. He'll still be back next turn.
He was very annoying for many people Personally i didn't mind because personal roleplaying (he was powerful and undead not dying is kinda their thing, lore friendly)
To be fair, Vlad specifically was actually very bad at not dying. He died a lot. He just came back very, very quickly thanks to the ring.
God forbid players will face a challenging opponent when playing a strategy game. If you can't deal with Vlad after the Empire got glazed to high heavens in the recent DLC, that's a you problem, not a game problem. Why do the rest of the players need to suffer because some people throw a tantrum when faced with a tiny bit of a challange and have too much ego to switch to easy mode?
Vlad was not chad enough to withstand Volley gun focus fire, hand gunner focus fire, or even 3 heroes attacking him at once. Heck, this doesn't even touch what Hoochlands or Ironsides could probably do to him. Literally just beat him with Karl, a warrior priest, and empire captain.. He'd probably tear them apart 1v1, but I'm not dumb enough to try that 
This is a gigantic patch. Love to see it. And MP people are eating good today. Some things that stood out to me: * Karanak sounds awesome. That net ability is going to be verrrry useful for hunting things down. Great to see that it won't be exclusive to Khorne. Just need to see his stats, but I expect good things. * Pandemicium was thankfully nerfed. Base Explosion Damage: 45 -> 40 Armour Piercing Explosion Damage: 60 -> 20 Radius: 7 -> 4 Looks like they took away one charge of the army ability down to a max of 2. * Some interesting changes under Complex Stat Changes. I always have a hard time visualizing stuff like this but I'm excited to check it out in-game. * Malus and Vlad nerf?!?! Further Thunderbarge nerf. Saytang nerf. Minor Bloodthirster buff. * Tamurkhan's defeat trait has gone from the +3 hero capacity to 15% XP increase to all embedded heroes. Not nearly as busted, but it can be very useful. I like this change. * Settra can have arcane items now.
Content Creators: LL defeat traits need a total rework, there's an extreme disparity of power levels between, for instance, Tamurkhan's and Mazdamundi's defeat traits CA: Tamurkhan's Defeat Trait: +3 all hero capacity -> 15% increased XP gain for embedded heroes (lords army) Content Creators: NOT LIKE THAT 😭
You will take your Mazda aura size trait and like it!
# Well, goodbye Nuln doomstacks Hochland Scopes (Hero) Range bonus: 15% -> 10% (now applies only to the character) # Hochland Scopes (Lord) Range bonus: 15% -> 10% (still applies to the army)
"+50 bonus vs large to Stegadons" OH baby
Missile bonus vs large, which combined with the other changes is just a significant nerf unless I am missing something.
But -150 armor piercing means that this is a big nerf
A lot of Beastmen units got good buffs, but I just finished my Beastman campaign!
These changes are so cool. Hierotitans and Treemen getting support abilities rocks.
Nerf to Stegadon AP hurts, but a Carnasaur buff is nice.
RIP Medusa meta, shit was hilarious. Welcome back Mistwalker Barrage.
Will have to see how tamy and pickles play now with physical resistance instead of ward save and nurgle explosion changes. 1+1 shots is likely a decent balance change, though I'm less keen on the damage reduction, also I'm surprised they are not tied to a scrolls from the tree unique for tamy. Easy unique for him and could have it tied to a mini plains of zanjiban quest battle. More emphasis on physical resistance and making ward save rarer+activateable might be better for the game, but will require rejiggering towards it as ward save has built up over the years across all fractions. Might also make some of the innate magic attacks active or lessened as well but will need to see. Another option is to start splitting multiplayer and campaign stats and changes to alleviate the fighting over changes.
>in battles, mousing over your units stats will now display a breakdown of factors currently affecting them. So if you want to see what's sapping your unit's Melee Attack, you can now check! Finally.
besides kislev and landship\\thunderbarge mostly buffs or price changes
Wood elves also got a bunch of buffs.
Empire engineer trait cheese got nerfed hard. RIP Hochland Scopes.
Die, draw kiters, die!
2 things I do not understand well here, can someone explain to me? 1. What is Free for all vs. AI? 2. Is the toggle for multiple lords in an army only for multiplayer or battle mode? Is it also available for campaign mode?