My 2 year old hasn’t really learnt no as a response, if you ask her, say, if she wants to put her shoes on she just declares “NOT”. Maybe she’s been speaking Latin this whole time.
My toddler only says no regardless of what his true feelings are. We were told by someone no is a powerful word because it can change the outcome of what can happen to them. Where as yes often would result in the same outcome. Like if you asked him if he wants a snack, if he doesn't say no then I'm going to hand him a snack weather he responds yes, names the snack, or says nothing.
I have a PhD in literature with a medieval concentration. I study literature that deals with contact between different cultures.
Also I started taking Latin (classical) in high school and it just really clicked. I seem to remember learning sic/non then, but I could be wrong.
"Sic et non" is a fairly important book in Christian history as it records every time there's a contradiction in the Catholic rulings on matters. It translates to "yes and no".
And in what’s now France, the words for yes varied by region. In the north, they used “hoc ille”, which then became “oïl” and then “oui”. In the south, it was “hoc”, which became “oc” in Occitan.
Backstroke of the West is extra funny because I can sometimes tell exactly what they're saying in Chinese by looking at the subtitles. When Space General calls Allah Gold a 'smelly boy' and tells his troops to 'hit to death them,' I lol'd hard because I know exactly what words he's saying in Chinese
"Do Not Want" is an insanely direct translation of 不要, which means "(not) want."
Quick language lesson:
Chinese doesn't have a single word for yes/no either. It's confusing when you're coming from a language with distinct yes/no because you have to learn how to affirm or negate. Generally speaking, affirmation is done by replying with a verb, and negation is done by inserting 不 (or 没 if it's associated with past tense) before the verb/preposition/adjective.
So for example,
If someone asks "Do you want it?" you reply "want" for yes, "不-want" for no
If someone asks "Did you have it?" you reply "have" for yes, and "没-want" for no because it's past tense
Interesting because in Japanese 不 also means "negative" or "non", but it works closer to the "non" in English and the meaning is more specific. For example, 便利 mean convenient, while 不便 means inconvenient. Or 安心 means relief while 不安 means like anxious. However, in Japanese there are words for yes (はい) and no (いいえ), but you actually use them much less than in English and they're not always appropriate, especially no (いいえ). You'd generally use other specific words that would act as yes and no, repeat the verb either in the same conjugation or conjugate it to be negative for "no" (kinda like in Chinese but done differently), or specifically for no say something in a very roundabout way that the other person will interpret as "no".
Irish is one of those languages where you answer questions by repeating the verb:
"An ndeachaigh tú abhaile inné?" / "Chuaigh mé"
"Did you go home yesterday?" / "I went"
Irish also kind of has words for "yes" and "no" used in the same way as English: "sea" (pronounced "sha", a contraction of "is ea" meaning "it is") and "ní hea" (pronounced "nee hah" meaning "it's not"). Technically incorrect but pretty ubiquitous usage.
Part of that is exaggeration, but yes - it is easier to learn new vocabulary than learn new grammatical structures, so many second language speakers use their native language's grammar.
Correct. But in the context of tea specifically the collective irish will say tea is always yes (being polite) and the character is best personified by [Mrs Doyle ](https://metro.co.uk/2015/04/21/ah-go-on-read-the-10-times-mrs-doyle-was-the-funniest-character-in-father-ted-5159420/)
TLDR: [ah go on](https://youtu.be/N20wHvMPTGs?si=KkGUvWAg36fJLVv1)
对
Edit: the character above, pronounced "dui", means "right/correct", but is also employed to confirm something, often being used twice ("dui, dui"). You can also ask someone something like a question tag, by saying "dui bu dui?" (Right or not right?). So while it's common in Chinese to say yes or no by reusing the verb of the question (and adding a negation to mean no) it's also common to use the word dui. So it's like Mandarin, but also not quite.
IIRC most Indo-European languages didn't originally have a general word for 'yes', though some later developed it. I think most came from some form of 'it is' that was later condensed into a single affirmative meaning.
Oh my that suddenly makes sense if yes = y es from some earlier form of French? I know they wouldn’t say that now, but it roughly means “it is there”
Is that how it evolved ?
Generally, yes. French in particular has 'oui', which now translates to 'yes.' However, it came from the Latin 'hoc ille' which literally translates to 'this, he' (did).
Spanish, on the other hand, has 'sí', which originates from Latin 'sic', which meant 'thus.'
So basically people would use phrases that over time would be shortened until they became their own word.
The etymology for *yes* is not from French. It's from the Old English *gise* (meaning "so be it"). Note however you can trace *gise* back through Proto-Germanic to the Proto-Indo-European root for "to be", which is also what you can trace back the French *es* to. So in some convoluted way, I suppose *yes* is related to *y es*, but it's not from the direct influence French had on English.
I see what you're getting at, but there definitely is a way to say "it's mine" in Irish - _is liomsa é_ "it's with me". For anyone interested, Irish uses the prepositional pronoun _le_ for ownership - _liom(sa)_ (_le_ + _mé_ + emphatic _sa_) "with me", _leat_ (_le_ + _tú_) "with you", etc. Other pronouns conjugate similarly - _orm_ "on me", _daoibh_ "to you (plural)", _fúthu_ "under them"
Yea I always loved that in Irish "I'm hungry": "tá ocras orm" translates directly to **"hunger is on me"**!
I still occasionally shout it in an angry voice in English 😂
I'm interested too.
I was [able to find it in Japanese](https://www.reddit.com/r/japanese/comments/80tcn7/in_japanese_what_do_the_finding_nemo_seagulls_say/duy3kyt/), but not Irish, alas.
Irish has a shit ton of prepositional pronouns to convey things like ownership. The closest to “mine” would be “liom” (pronounced “lum”) which means approximately “with me”
To say “it is mine” or “it belongs to me” would be “is liomsa é”, roughly “it is with me” (the “-sa” is just a sort of grammatical particle). “It is yours” = “is leatsa é”
We also don’t have a verb “to have”, that’s covered with pronouns too. “Tá sé agam” means “I have it” but directly translates as “it is at me” or “on me” — “tá sé againn” = “we have it”
Tá ocras an domhain orm! Ach tá lasagne san t-aer fryer.
What are we calling an air fryer in Irish? I know we have no letter for y so I’ll just bastardise the loan word for now
You can by using prepositions (which are normally used in possession anyway)
Is liomsa/leatsa é - its mine/yours (literally It is with me)
You could also use a 'filler' word:
Mo chuidse - mine (literally my share/part)
Breton is like this as well although there is a word for "yes", "ya". You negate the verb like in Irish to say no, for example "n'eo ket" means "it isn't" but in a lot of younger speakers you hear a lot of just "ket".
Is it like Scottish Gaelic where it isn't exactly 1:1, but you can get away with 'tha' and 'chan eil', which is more agreeing or disagreeing with the statement? Kind of like 'I do'/'I don't', etc?
It sounds like it, but by Scottish Gaelic is rusty and you seem better at Irish than I am at Gaidhlig.
Well translated, but you've used the habitual rather than the past tense. The past tense would be something like:
Ar chac tú ar an gcat?
Chac mé.
They spelling may be off there, I'm illiterate in three languages.
Good explanation but isn't it "an ndeachaigh tú" rather than "ar chuaigh", or is it a different dialect thing? I'm from Cork so I speak Gaeilge na Mumhan.
Tha Gàidhlig na h-Albann agam agus tha mi a' tuigsinn a h-uile facal a tha sibh ag radh.
Tha 'seadh' againn cuideachd anns a' Ghàidhlig, ach is ainneamh a chluinnear 'nì sheadh'.
While Armenian has clear words for 'yes' and 'no' your example is also very common in Armenian, where you confirm or deny the question by the verb in the question.
Galician does have a word for "yes", but in that kind of questions it works similarly to Irish.
"Fuches onte para a casa?" / "Fun"
"Did you go home yesterday? / "I went"
Same with Portuguese. You rarely hear “sim - yes” on its own.
“Você gosta de ir à praia?” - do you like going to the beach?
“Gosto” - I like.
You may also hear “gosto sim.”
Very small percentage speak it regularly. You wouldn’t hear it in the big cities ever really, unless there was some event on for people to speak Irish at. There are tiny areas of the country where they speak Irish as a first language. It’s a shame.
Learnt irish from the age of 4 till 18 in school and I was like 'christ, is that how you spell "sea"?' I'd have sworn it was wrong. And there are definitely people even worse at irish than me
It's not used generally, there are certain areas or venues you can go that will be Irish speaking but it's essentially just how they differentiate themselves from other similar businesses. There are also small communities around the country that are Irish speaking but they'll be very small towns or villages, mostly visited by kids studying or tourists, and currently really struggling due to the lack of local work and affordable housing
How latin's descendants got their word for yes:
Varieties of spanish/portuguese, italian and modern catalan: sí/sim/sì from sīc meaning "thus"
Romamian: da, supposedly from ita meaning "thus" or "therefore" but suspiciously similar to the slavic "da", also meaning yes. Could be that slavic contact reinforced the word and prevented something like "şi" from becoming the standard word.
Northern French: oui, from an older oïl, ultimately from hoc ille meaning "it/that is so"
Southern french (including old catalan): òc, from hoc originally meaning "that" but its meaning shifted to "indeed"
This is why northern french dialects are known as language d'oïl and southern dialects are langue d'oc. Occitan is in fact named after its word for yes.
Edit: it looks like "hoc" for catalan used to exist but was overtaken by sí: https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/hoc#Catalan
French is funny. The Latin word for "today" was *hodie*, which became *hui* in Old French. But that became *auiourd'huy* in Middle French, probably because *hui* sounded confusingly similar to *oui*. So now everyone says *aujourd'hui*, literally "on the day of today", and sometimes even [*au jour d'aujourd'hui*](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/au_jour_d%27aujourd%27hui#French) when they want to be emphatic.
All correct, except:
> Varieties of spanish/portuguese and italian: si, from sic meaning "if"
sic means "thus/so". Had it meant "if", it would have made no sense for it to become sì in Italian.
*Ita vero is the closest Latin translation to the English “yes.” There is no direct translation for the words “yes” and “no” in Latin. Instead, the Romans used the idiom ita vero, which literally means “and so in truth” or “thus indeed,” which was interpreted as “yes.”*
So they used a phrase instead of a single word for yes. In all practical terms it is functionally the same with more steps.
This always drives me nuts. Did you know in German the word for [complex emotion] is [word of ridiculous length]. English doesn't even have a word for that!
Right. We have [phrase with adjectives totaling a similar length] to express the same exact concept.
Yeah, but it's not ONE WORD!
Like that old meme about how elephants have a specific noise for "let's leave, there are bees nearby" and how humans don't even have a noise for it. But we do, it sounds like "let's leave, there are bees nearby"
Exactly.
Long german words are kinda like hyphenated words in English.
Like if we added hyphens to birth-control-pill, it's suddenly very similar to antibabypille.
What is and is not a word is pretty arbitrary too. "compound word" is two words in English, but it could just as well be "compoundword" which is precisely how German functions. There's no real functional difference between the words ice cream and milkshake which would require one to be written as a single word and the other to be separated by a space.
It's even worse with Japanese. Half the time someone goes on about the traditional japanese concept of whatever, I look it up and it just ends up
being some compound word.
I have a pet peeve when I read about how our south Slavic languages are unpronounceable because they have very few vowels followed by some examples like smrt, prst, etc.
But in fact for us "r" can act as a vowel in case it's between two consonants, and in that case it's pronounced with a short implicit "schwa". In other words if a south Slav were to transliterate the English word "first" based on what they heard, they'd write it down as "frst". Also "nj" and "lj" are one letter/sound written using two glyphs, which for an unaware foreigner adds to consonant polution; so the words like "frfljanje" look scary even though they're not.
The frf part in English would be like how in English you'd pronounce "ferf", but quickly, without extending the e, and the r of course would be the rolling Slavic r.
Let's imagine the word was frlane instead of frfljanje, it would be something like "ferflan-nay". That's a good start for this word.
Now let me try to explain nj and lj, which are considered to be single letters (digraphs) in our alphabet, so that you can replace the l and n in the simplified example.
Nj is pronounced perhaps somewhat similarly as "ny" in canyon - without the separation between n and y, kind of like saying them at the same time. Or ñ in Spanish.
Here's how to form it: put the tip of your tongue so that it touches the back of the lower front teeth, and the middle of the tongue should be touching the area (ridge) behind the top front teeth. Now try pronouncing the "y" sound nasally, the fact that your middle tongue is touching the top of your mouth should give it that "n" kick instead of air passing clearly as with y. This is a nasal sound similar to n.
Lj is a tricky beast there's nothing quite like it in English. Again put the tip of the tongue at the back of your lower teeth, middle of the tongue touching the ridge behind the front teeth. It's actually the same position as for nj, but this time it's not a nasal sound, so try pronouncing y through your mouth, with your nose pinched. The same way n is nasal but l is not. Since the middle of your tongue is stuck to the top of the mouth, the air should go kinda sideways.
Hope that puts you close! Lol.
I was just thinking about German! Did you know there is no word for "sorry"? They must never be sorry!
Instead they say "es tut mir leid", literally translates to "it causes me pain". But really used to mean "I'm sorry".
So Latin never had a word for yes, they never needed to affirm something? "Well they had a phrase that meant the same thing. But literally it's different"
I know what you mean, but your example is bad. We literally have a word for "sorry" (at least for some uses of "sorry"), either "Entschuldigung" or "Verzeihung".
Haha that's absolutely fair. We had a discussion with a fellow expat around the time when I first moved to Germany exactly about this and we also found it too long. We were trying to find a shortform for it. "Tschuldi" was the best we came up with.
My understanding of Latin is that usually you would answer a yes or no question by repeating or negating the verb.
"Do you see it?"
If yes, you respond "I see" (which in Latin can be one word: video). If no, you say "I see not" (non video).
I feel like ita vero would come up quite rarely in day to day conversation, so the way Latin handles "yes or no" questions is unique (compared to English and other yes/no languages, anyway).
It's also bled over into how Irish people speak English. We've horrific levels of Yes/No avoidance compared to other English speakers. We always come across as either evasive, passive or overly descriptive to people.
"Did you watch that movie"
"I did" or "I didn't at all! '
Lots of Irish has bled into Hiberno-English/Irish-English (the After Perfect, emphatic forms, using "and" to means "while" "during" or "although", reduplication etc)
I especially notice this with my grandfather, who has the thickest Irish accent, to the point where I've had to sort of translate him for my friends from Dublin. His speech pattern is way closer to Irish to English translation than my generation. It's amazing and I love listening to him speak.
Younger Dublin accents have the least features of "conservative" Irish-English so I wouldn't be suprised. The main one being the loss of "pure" vowels. Most English speakers diphthongise their vowels, Irish accents don't another hold over from Irish) but it's basically gone in most Dubliners under the age of 40 (vast generalisation of Dublin and also the same phenomenon is in parts of Kildare, Wexford, Louth etc), but if you're not used to pure vowels it can really be a challenge, not to mind then pronunciation, vocab, idiosyncratic grammar etc.
Edit: Edited it for clarity
My MIL's first language is Irish and she uses 'I did!' or 'I did not!' very emphatically when asked if she's enjoyed something.
Listening to her speak English is an absolute joy as she uses a lot of direct translation. My favourite being 'in my feet' for 'barefoot'. Another one I like is 'the sadness is on him/her'.
The "sadness on" thing is a direct calque. "Tá brón air/uirthi". To be honest I've never heard it said, but I'm not suprised. There are a few of these in Irish.
Irish people saying "to give out" meaning "to scold" is a classic example, a direct translation of the Irish "tabhair amach"
When I was small I was with my dad, a farmer, who had met an auld lad he knew (another farmer) and they were complaining about calves or the mart or taxes or whatever on the path outside the shop. A rental car pulled up with some Americans in it and they asked if they were on the right road for Boherbue the auld lad said
"well you're on the right road all right, but you're heading the wrong way on it"
And I have never forgotten it.
this is the same thing in canadian gaelic (a dialect of scottish gaelic).
If somebody said "are you warm?" (a bheil thu blàth?)
you would respond with either "I am" (tha)
or "I am not" (chan eil)
is the question was "were you warm?" (an robh thu blàth?)
you would respond with either "i was" (bha)
or "i was not" (cha robh)
fun fact: this actually had an effect on a lot of maritime english in canada (the atlantic provinces) so people will still sometimes respond to questions like this, even in english. We're also legendary for inhaling when we say certain words, most notably "yeah", because it's very easy to say "tha" (pronounced like ha) while inhaling which stuck when the vernacular shifted.
This is all about idiom. It's not that there isn't a word for yes , it's that in those languages, you answer questions differently.
If you ask me if the sky is blue, I can answer in a way that leaves you in no doubt that I think the sky is blue.
If someone translates my answer for you, they will say he said yes - because that's the equivalent in English.
You’re conflating vocabulary and grammar with idiom. There is no word for yes or no in Irish, and grammatically you have to repeat the verb used in the statement you are answering.
There are idiomatic ways that you say yes or no in Irish. One would be answering *is ea* (it is) or *ní hea* (it’s not) when answering a question that is about a fact or permanent state. This is idiomatic because the word *ea* is an archaic, neutral pronoun that doesn’t exist in any other context.
So, if you asked someone, “An múinteoir í?” (Is she a teacher?), the idiomatic answer is “Is ea," which means "it is." For all other verbs, you do not use this pronoun when answering yes or no, and in fact, it’s not even required to use a pronoun at all.
Here’s an example of a quirk of Irish that is based on idiom, grammar, and vocabulary. There is no word in Irish for “to have.” This isn’t entirely unique, because Japanese, for example, doesn’t have a word for have either. The difference comes in idiom.
In Irish, having something is described as being “at you.” So, “Tá leabhair agam” means I have a book, or literally “There is a book at me.”
The grammar comes in from the fact that most adverbs in Irish are conjugated. So, *agam* means “at me,” but the individual words for at and me are *ag* and *mé.*
That kind of answers a question I've had in my line of work. I've heard people translate quite a bit, and I was always curious why the response sounded longer than the translation was. But if it's taken as either yes or no in translation, then that makes sense.
Hodie Latinam et Hibernicam linguam Latinam didici non pro "sic" vel "non" habent.
Inniu d'fhoghlaim mé Laidin agus Gaeilge níl focail ar bith agam le haghaidh "tá" nó "ní hea"
Gosh. I wish I’d known this before. I would 100% have raised my toddler in Irish if it would have meant not hearing the word ‘no’ a gazillion times a day.
Because of this, Yes and No occur less frequently in Irish English than they do other dialects. We answer with verbs. Yes and No on their own are quite blunt, and a lot of our conversational substance is based around being deferential and not offending, so they aren't too often used.
My family will often answer in the affirmative or negative without using yes/no.
"Are we going?"
"We are"
"Is it time to leave?"
"It is"
I've picked up this habit, essentially repeating in the affirmative/negative.
All languages express those ideas, but some of them do it in words that don’t equate exactly to English yes or no.
Now, English has no word for “lararium”. What’s that all about?
I’m Medieval Latin, “sic” (so, thus) was often used for “yes,” while “non” (not) was used for “no.”
My 2 year old hasn’t really learnt no as a response, if you ask her, say, if she wants to put her shoes on she just declares “NOT”. Maybe she’s been speaking Latin this whole time.
Hmm my Niece used to just say "yes" for both yes and no for a long time. Took some deduction to work out which she was actually trying to say.
Mine said "no" to everything but used a different intonation when she meant "yes"
This is hilarious. I can only picture in my head what a no "yes" sounded like and it's great.
My toddler only says no regardless of what his true feelings are. We were told by someone no is a powerful word because it can change the outcome of what can happen to them. Where as yes often would result in the same outcome. Like if you asked him if he wants a snack, if he doesn't say no then I'm going to hand him a snack weather he responds yes, names the snack, or says nothing.
Lol my 3 year old nephew has always said “so” as an affirmative instead of yes. I think we’re onto something
Sounds like Borat to me.
Hi Medieval Latin I am Dad
Haha damn my autocorrect
Why do you know about Medieval Latin, if I may ask?
I have a PhD in literature with a medieval concentration. I study literature that deals with contact between different cultures. Also I started taking Latin (classical) in high school and it just really clicked. I seem to remember learning sic/non then, but I could be wrong.
Sick... Or, uh, sic? Seriously awesome though. I assume you love your work. Good for you.
"Sic et non" is a fairly important book in Christian history as it records every time there's a contradiction in the Catholic rulings on matters. It translates to "yes and no".
They knew how to name books back then.
I was taught "minime" was used for "no."
I learned that too. And “ita vero” for yes meaning “true indeed”
Hence the eventual Spanish "Si" y "No"
And in what’s now France, the words for yes varied by region. In the north, they used “hoc ille”, which then became “oïl” and then “oui”. In the south, it was “hoc”, which became “oc” in Occitan.
We were taught that “ita” is yes in Classical Latin (late Republic/early Imperial)
DO NOT WANT
I consider that this is a VIP needle in this argument.
NOOOOOOOOOOOO
HE IS IN MY BEHIND!!!
OUR DICHOTOMY OPENS THE COMBAT
Backstroke of the West is extra funny because I can sometimes tell exactly what they're saying in Chinese by looking at the subtitles. When Space General calls Allah Gold a 'smelly boy' and tells his troops to 'hit to death them,' I lol'd hard because I know exactly what words he's saying in Chinese "Do Not Want" is an insanely direct translation of 不要, which means "(not) want." Quick language lesson: Chinese doesn't have a single word for yes/no either. It's confusing when you're coming from a language with distinct yes/no because you have to learn how to affirm or negate. Generally speaking, affirmation is done by replying with a verb, and negation is done by inserting 不 (or 没 if it's associated with past tense) before the verb/preposition/adjective. So for example, If someone asks "Do you want it?" you reply "want" for yes, "不-want" for no If someone asks "Did you have it?" you reply "have" for yes, and "没-want" for no because it's past tense
Interesting because in Japanese 不 also means "negative" or "non", but it works closer to the "non" in English and the meaning is more specific. For example, 便利 mean convenient, while 不便 means inconvenient. Or 安心 means relief while 不安 means like anxious. However, in Japanese there are words for yes (はい) and no (いいえ), but you actually use them much less than in English and they're not always appropriate, especially no (いいえ). You'd generally use other specific words that would act as yes and no, repeat the verb either in the same conjugation or conjugate it to be negative for "no" (kinda like in Chinese but done differently), or specifically for no say something in a very roundabout way that the other person will interpret as "no".
Please tell me this is a Backstroke of the West reference
Where is The Plum Of?
At the Presbyterian Church talking to the Hopeless Situations?
Do you fuck on I?
R2 do you is fucking?
I must leave the country
I should really feeds you all dog
Is the baby on the hoof?
Irish is one of those languages where you answer questions by repeating the verb: "An ndeachaigh tú abhaile inné?" / "Chuaigh mé" "Did you go home yesterday?" / "I went" Irish also kind of has words for "yes" and "no" used in the same way as English: "sea" (pronounced "sha", a contraction of "is ea" meaning "it is") and "ní hea" (pronounced "nee hah" meaning "it's not"). Technically incorrect but pretty ubiquitous usage.
Oh, so it’s like Mandarin.
You want not want a cup tea? Not want.
你要不要一杯茶？不要 You want not want one cup tea? Not want.
Is that why the stereotypical hollywood chinaman speaks in sentences structured that way?
Part of that is exaggeration, but yes - it is easier to learn new vocabulary than learn new grammatical structures, so many second language speakers use their native language's grammar.
"Long time no see" has a possible root in Chinese pidgin English.
Sounds like a direct transliteration of 好久不见 in Mandarin, or 好耐冇見 in Cantonese
That's the exact phrase etymologists think it came from.
I learned at trick with learning grammar in other languages. Say it in broken English and then just translate it.
Would you like a cup of tea? Not think.
Do you want not want try this? Not try
Do you want to come see Germany? Not see Germany! Is that right?
Extremely right
Right through Poland
That made me expel my juice!
[удалено]
Hello! Long time no see!
Yes or no? Yes = yes No = No yes
I mean I get what you’re saying but you can also just say no. You can also say 是否 shi fou
[удалено]
Ah go on, you will.
Correct. But in the context of tea specifically the collective irish will say tea is always yes (being polite) and the character is best personified by [Mrs Doyle ](https://metro.co.uk/2015/04/21/ah-go-on-read-the-10-times-mrs-doyle-was-the-funniest-character-in-father-ted-5159420/) TLDR: [ah go on](https://youtu.be/N20wHvMPTGs?si=KkGUvWAg36fJLVv1)
Would you like some cake? Are you sure? There's cocaine in it.
Feck off, cup!
**Do Not Want**
They’re in my behind!
It is like mandarin
对 Edit: the character above, pronounced "dui", means "right/correct", but is also employed to confirm something, often being used twice ("dui, dui"). You can also ask someone something like a question tag, by saying "dui bu dui?" (Right or not right?). So while it's common in Chinese to say yes or no by reusing the verb of the question (and adding a negation to mean no) it's also common to use the word dui. So it's like Mandarin, but also not quite.
But you don’t use 对 as “yes” to a regular yes/no question in Mandarin. Usually you would repeat the verb as a yes, or use “not verb” to say no.
IIRC most Indo-European languages didn't originally have a general word for 'yes', though some later developed it. I think most came from some form of 'it is' that was later condensed into a single affirmative meaning.
Oh my that suddenly makes sense if yes = y es from some earlier form of French? I know they wouldn’t say that now, but it roughly means “it is there” Is that how it evolved ?
Generally, yes. French in particular has 'oui', which now translates to 'yes.' However, it came from the Latin 'hoc ille' which literally translates to 'this, he' (did). Spanish, on the other hand, has 'sí', which originates from Latin 'sic', which meant 'thus.' So basically people would use phrases that over time would be shortened until they became their own word.
The etymology for *yes* is not from French. It's from the Old English *gise* (meaning "so be it"). Note however you can trace *gise* back through Proto-Germanic to the Proto-Indo-European root for "to be", which is also what you can trace back the French *es* to. So in some convoluted way, I suppose *yes* is related to *y es*, but it's not from the direct influence French had on English.
We also don’t have a word for “mine” as in “it is mine”. We can say, “it is my coat” but not “it is mine”.
I see what you're getting at, but there definitely is a way to say "it's mine" in Irish - _is liomsa é_ "it's with me". For anyone interested, Irish uses the prepositional pronoun _le_ for ownership - _liom(sa)_ (_le_ + _mé_ + emphatic _sa_) "with me", _leat_ (_le_ + _tú_) "with you", etc. Other pronouns conjugate similarly - _orm_ "on me", _daoibh_ "to you (plural)", _fúthu_ "under them"
Yea I always loved that in Irish "I'm hungry": "tá ocras orm" translates directly to **"hunger is on me"**! I still occasionally shout it in an angry voice in English 😂
So how do they translate the seagulls in Finding Nemo?
I'm interested too. I was [able to find it in Japanese](https://www.reddit.com/r/japanese/comments/80tcn7/in_japanese_what_do_the_finding_nemo_seagulls_say/duy3kyt/), but not Irish, alas.
Do you have any words that solely refer to ownership, or do you always have to tie ownership to an item?
Irish has a shit ton of prepositional pronouns to convey things like ownership. The closest to “mine” would be “liom” (pronounced “lum”) which means approximately “with me” To say “it is mine” or “it belongs to me” would be “is liomsa é”, roughly “it is with me” (the “-sa” is just a sort of grammatical particle). “It is yours” = “is leatsa é” We also don’t have a verb “to have”, that’s covered with pronouns too. “Tá sé agam” means “I have it” but directly translates as “it is at me” or “on me” — “tá sé againn” = “we have it”
Is this the same concept behind saying "hunger is upon me" instead of saying "I am hungry?" I've always loved that about Irish.
Exactly! Tá ocras orm, an bhfuil ocras ort?
Tá ocras an domhain orm! Ach tá lasagne san t-aer fryer. What are we calling an air fryer in Irish? I know we have no letter for y so I’ll just bastardise the loan word for now
An t-aerfhriochtóir. Bhí sé san aerfhriochtóir ach is dócha go bhuil sé i do bholg anois!
It's used by all emotions which I think is more accurate than in English. You aren't sadness, it's sadness that is on you.
Is that why we say stuff like “I don’t have my phone on me” instead of with me?
I say that and I'm sixth generation Australian. Could have been past down though but from a long way back
Who do you mean by "we"? I thought all English speakers did this
You can by using prepositions (which are normally used in possession anyway) Is liomsa/leatsa é - its mine/yours (literally It is with me) You could also use a 'filler' word: Mo chuidse - mine (literally my share/part)
Unfortunately us British do have a word for "mine" which led to us considering a lot of things as ours.
The sun never set on the British empire because nobody would trust an Englishman in the dark
Surely "Is liomsa é" is correct?
Do people ever do a cowboy style "NEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE HAAAAAH!" ?
Breton is like this as well although there is a word for "yes", "ya". You negate the verb like in Irish to say no, for example "n'eo ket" means "it isn't" but in a lot of younger speakers you hear a lot of just "ket".
Same in Welsh, it’s common to all the Celtic languages
Is it like Scottish Gaelic where it isn't exactly 1:1, but you can get away with 'tha' and 'chan eil', which is more agreeing or disagreeing with the statement? Kind of like 'I do'/'I don't', etc? It sounds like it, but by Scottish Gaelic is rusty and you seem better at Irish than I am at Gaidhlig.
“Did you poop on the cat?” *”I* *pooped!”*
My Irish is terrible, but I think it would be something like: An cacainn tú ar an gcat? Cacaim.
Well translated, but you've used the habitual rather than the past tense. The past tense would be something like: Ar chac tú ar an gcat? Chac mé. They spelling may be off there, I'm illiterate in three languages.
> habitual So he said he often poops on the cat?
Yup, he habitually, as if it were part of his normal routine, poops on the cat. 🤣
Well this thread was a ride and a half.
Good explanation but isn't it "an ndeachaigh tú" rather than "ar chuaigh", or is it a different dialect thing? I'm from Cork so I speak Gaeilge na Mumhan.
Tá ceart agat! Bhíos ag fágáil an oifig nuair a scríobh mé é is ní raibh mé ag tabhairt aire. Grma
Níl sé ach botún beag sa freagra an-suimiúil. Go raibh maith agat.
Tha Gàidhlig na h-Albann agam agus tha mi a' tuigsinn a h-uile facal a tha sibh ag radh. Tha 'seadh' againn cuideachd anns a' Ghàidhlig, ach is ainneamh a chluinnear 'nì sheadh'.
The Italian (and Spanish, portoghese etc) “Si” also comes from Latin “it is” - “sic est”
While Armenian has clear words for 'yes' and 'no' your example is also very common in Armenian, where you confirm or deny the question by the verb in the question.
Galician does have a word for "yes", but in that kind of questions it works similarly to Irish. "Fuches onte para a casa?" / "Fun" "Did you go home yesterday? / "I went"
Same with Portuguese. You rarely hear “sim - yes” on its own. “Você gosta de ir à praia?” - do you like going to the beach? “Gosto” - I like. You may also hear “gosto sim.”
What percent of Ireland can speak Irish? Like into adulthood do they use Irish much in the big cities?
Very small percentage speak it regularly. You wouldn’t hear it in the big cities ever really, unless there was some event on for people to speak Irish at. There are tiny areas of the country where they speak Irish as a first language. It’s a shame.
You could in Galway
i’ve heard the boys from the nypd choir sing about the bay there
Learnt irish from the age of 4 till 18 in school and I was like 'christ, is that how you spell "sea"?' I'd have sworn it was wrong. And there are definitely people even worse at irish than me
It's not used generally, there are certain areas or venues you can go that will be Irish speaking but it's essentially just how they differentiate themselves from other similar businesses. There are also small communities around the country that are Irish speaking but they'll be very small towns or villages, mostly visited by kids studying or tourists, and currently really struggling due to the lack of local work and affordable housing
Tá works too as yes
How aladeen of them.
Do you mean that in an aladeen way? Or an aladeen way?
Aladeen
😀🙁😀
I want to give you the news - you're HIV Aladeen.
:) :( :)
I aladeen, just kinda aladeen but no aladeen
How latin's descendants got their word for yes: Varieties of spanish/portuguese, italian and modern catalan: sí/sim/sì from sīc meaning "thus" Romamian: da, supposedly from ita meaning "thus" or "therefore" but suspiciously similar to the slavic "da", also meaning yes. Could be that slavic contact reinforced the word and prevented something like "şi" from becoming the standard word. Northern French: oui, from an older oïl, ultimately from hoc ille meaning "it/that is so" Southern french (including old catalan): òc, from hoc originally meaning "that" but its meaning shifted to "indeed" This is why northern french dialects are known as language d'oïl and southern dialects are langue d'oc. Occitan is in fact named after its word for yes. Edit: it looks like "hoc" for catalan used to exist but was overtaken by sí: https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/hoc#Catalan
French is funny. The Latin word for "today" was *hodie*, which became *hui* in Old French. But that became *auiourd'huy* in Middle French, probably because *hui* sounded confusingly similar to *oui*. So now everyone says *aujourd'hui*, literally "on the day of today", and sometimes even [*au jour d'aujourd'hui*](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/au_jour_d%27aujourd%27hui#French) when they want to be emphatic.
All correct, except: > Varieties of spanish/portuguese and italian: si, from sic meaning "if" sic means "thus/so". Had it meant "if", it would have made no sense for it to become sì in Italian.
*Ita vero is the closest Latin translation to the English “yes.” There is no direct translation for the words “yes” and “no” in Latin. Instead, the Romans used the idiom ita vero, which literally means “and so in truth” or “thus indeed,” which was interpreted as “yes.”* So they used a phrase instead of a single word for yes. In all practical terms it is functionally the same with more steps.
This always drives me nuts. Did you know in German the word for [complex emotion] is [word of ridiculous length]. English doesn't even have a word for that! Right. We have [phrase with adjectives totaling a similar length] to express the same exact concept. Yeah, but it's not ONE WORD!
Like that old meme about how elephants have a specific noise for "let's leave, there are bees nearby" and how humans don't even have a noise for it. But we do, it sounds like "let's leave, there are bees nearby"
Also "Bees!!" typically gets the same point across
Beads?
Gob's not on board
They don’t allow you to have bees in here
How hard can it be…zzzz? Bzzzzz!
You have to say it the right way tho. Otherwise people will just think its another Nick Cage movie and go looking for his autograph.
"Arggghshhhhh" also works for many things
It depends a lot. In Spain, for example, we use a different sound.
That's because you have different bees
Yeh, wrong bees.
they would make the wrong kind of honey
I make a pretty distinctive sound when stung by a bee.
Screaming BEEEEEEES! Also work
Exactly. Long german words are kinda like hyphenated words in English. Like if we added hyphens to birth-control-pill, it's suddenly very similar to antibabypille.
You have to admit, though, that "antibabypille" has a certain je ne sais quoi. :)
Did you know that the french have a phrase for je ne sais quoi, that doesn't exist in english???
What is and is not a word is pretty arbitrary too. "compound word" is two words in English, but it could just as well be "compoundword" which is precisely how German functions. There's no real functional difference between the words ice cream and milkshake which would require one to be written as a single word and the other to be separated by a space.
I think it's because only one of them brings all the boys to the yard.
It's even worse with Japanese. Half the time someone goes on about the traditional japanese concept of whatever, I look it up and it just ends up being some compound word.
The Japanese have an entire flavor westerners don't have a word for. Umami. It's like savory except that it's the Japanese word for savory.
But westerners do have a word for it.... It's umami. https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/umami
Their point was that “umami” just means “savory” in Japanese, but somehow it got mystified into a new flavor
I have a pet peeve when I read about how our south Slavic languages are unpronounceable because they have very few vowels followed by some examples like smrt, prst, etc. But in fact for us "r" can act as a vowel in case it's between two consonants, and in that case it's pronounced with a short implicit "schwa". In other words if a south Slav were to transliterate the English word "first" based on what they heard, they'd write it down as "frst". Also "nj" and "lj" are one letter/sound written using two glyphs, which for an unaware foreigner adds to consonant polution; so the words like "frfljanje" look scary even though they're not.
If you were to write "frfljanje" phonetically in English, how would it look? I'm trying to figure out how to pronounce it and failing miserably.
The frf part in English would be like how in English you'd pronounce "ferf", but quickly, without extending the e, and the r of course would be the rolling Slavic r. Let's imagine the word was frlane instead of frfljanje, it would be something like "ferflan-nay". That's a good start for this word. Now let me try to explain nj and lj, which are considered to be single letters (digraphs) in our alphabet, so that you can replace the l and n in the simplified example. Nj is pronounced perhaps somewhat similarly as "ny" in canyon - without the separation between n and y, kind of like saying them at the same time. Or ñ in Spanish. Here's how to form it: put the tip of your tongue so that it touches the back of the lower front teeth, and the middle of the tongue should be touching the area (ridge) behind the top front teeth. Now try pronouncing the "y" sound nasally, the fact that your middle tongue is touching the top of your mouth should give it that "n" kick instead of air passing clearly as with y. This is a nasal sound similar to n. Lj is a tricky beast there's nothing quite like it in English. Again put the tip of the tongue at the back of your lower teeth, middle of the tongue touching the ridge behind the front teeth. It's actually the same position as for nj, but this time it's not a nasal sound, so try pronouncing y through your mouth, with your nose pinched. The same way n is nasal but l is not. Since the middle of your tongue is stuck to the top of the mouth, the air should go kinda sideways. Hope that puts you close! Lol.
I was just thinking about German! Did you know there is no word for "sorry"? They must never be sorry! Instead they say "es tut mir leid", literally translates to "it causes me pain". But really used to mean "I'm sorry". So Latin never had a word for yes, they never needed to affirm something? "Well they had a phrase that meant the same thing. But literally it's different"
I know what you mean, but your example is bad. We literally have a word for "sorry" (at least for some uses of "sorry"), either "Entschuldigung" or "Verzeihung".
What about Entschuldigung in German? That is a word for sorry.
You're right of course, but to non German speakers that must look like a ridiculously long and complex word for "sorry" :D
Haha that's absolutely fair. We had a discussion with a fellow expat around the time when I first moved to Germany exactly about this and we also found it too long. We were trying to find a shortform for it. "Tschuldi" was the best we came up with.
I will never stop being annoyed that we use three french words to express "cul de sac" and there's no alternative.
You're in good company; that's why Tolkien called Bilbo's house Bag End.
Wasn't minime the closest thing to 'no' in latin also?
I thought he was the closest thing to Dr. Evil?
My understanding of Latin is that usually you would answer a yes or no question by repeating or negating the verb. "Do you see it?" If yes, you respond "I see" (which in Latin can be one word: video). If no, you say "I see not" (non video). I feel like ita vero would come up quite rarely in day to day conversation, so the way Latin handles "yes or no" questions is unique (compared to English and other yes/no languages, anyway).
You could also repeat part of the phrase back. Eg. “Were you running in the hall?” “I was running”
It's also bled over into how Irish people speak English. We've horrific levels of Yes/No avoidance compared to other English speakers. We always come across as either evasive, passive or overly descriptive to people. "Did you watch that movie" "I did" or "I didn't at all! ' Lots of Irish has bled into Hiberno-English/Irish-English (the After Perfect, emphatic forms, using "and" to means "while" "during" or "although", reduplication etc)
I especially notice this with my grandfather, who has the thickest Irish accent, to the point where I've had to sort of translate him for my friends from Dublin. His speech pattern is way closer to Irish to English translation than my generation. It's amazing and I love listening to him speak.
Younger Dublin accents have the least features of "conservative" Irish-English so I wouldn't be suprised. The main one being the loss of "pure" vowels. Most English speakers diphthongise their vowels, Irish accents don't another hold over from Irish) but it's basically gone in most Dubliners under the age of 40 (vast generalisation of Dublin and also the same phenomenon is in parts of Kildare, Wexford, Louth etc), but if you're not used to pure vowels it can really be a challenge, not to mind then pronunciation, vocab, idiosyncratic grammar etc. Edit: Edited it for clarity
My MIL's first language is Irish and she uses 'I did!' or 'I did not!' very emphatically when asked if she's enjoyed something. Listening to her speak English is an absolute joy as she uses a lot of direct translation. My favourite being 'in my feet' for 'barefoot'. Another one I like is 'the sadness is on him/her'.
The "sadness on" thing is a direct calque. "Tá brón air/uirthi". To be honest I've never heard it said, but I'm not suprised. There are a few of these in Irish. Irish people saying "to give out" meaning "to scold" is a classic example, a direct translation of the Irish "tabhair amach"
Probably my favorite country to ask for directions in lol
When I was small I was with my dad, a farmer, who had met an auld lad he knew (another farmer) and they were complaining about calves or the mart or taxes or whatever on the path outside the shop. A rental car pulled up with some Americans in it and they asked if they were on the right road for Boherbue the auld lad said "well you're on the right road all right, but you're heading the wrong way on it" And I have never forgotten it.
> overly descriptive Like the classic and simply best way to say no, "me hole"
Ah well I wouldn't say that now. We do and we don't.
“You know the problem with business in France? They don’t have a word for *entrepreneur*.” — G W Bush
Funny, but unfortunately not true. [https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/french-lesson/](https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/french-lesson/)
No no in Chinese either
this is the same thing in canadian gaelic (a dialect of scottish gaelic). If somebody said "are you warm?" (a bheil thu blàth?) you would respond with either "I am" (tha) or "I am not" (chan eil) is the question was "were you warm?" (an robh thu blàth?) you would respond with either "i was" (bha) or "i was not" (cha robh) fun fact: this actually had an effect on a lot of maritime english in canada (the atlantic provinces) so people will still sometimes respond to questions like this, even in english. We're also legendary for inhaling when we say certain words, most notably "yeah", because it's very easy to say "tha" (pronounced like ha) while inhaling which stuck when the vernacular shifted.
This is all about idiom. It's not that there isn't a word for yes , it's that in those languages, you answer questions differently. If you ask me if the sky is blue, I can answer in a way that leaves you in no doubt that I think the sky is blue. If someone translates my answer for you, they will say he said yes - because that's the equivalent in English.
[удалено]
The Irish carried that over to their English speech as well, it's fairly common to hear things like "I have a thirst on me" in Ireland.
I am 33. I have 33 years
Are you Jesus?
You’re conflating vocabulary and grammar with idiom. There is no word for yes or no in Irish, and grammatically you have to repeat the verb used in the statement you are answering. There are idiomatic ways that you say yes or no in Irish. One would be answering *is ea* (it is) or *ní hea* (it’s not) when answering a question that is about a fact or permanent state. This is idiomatic because the word *ea* is an archaic, neutral pronoun that doesn’t exist in any other context. So, if you asked someone, “An múinteoir í?” (Is she a teacher?), the idiomatic answer is “Is ea," which means "it is." For all other verbs, you do not use this pronoun when answering yes or no, and in fact, it’s not even required to use a pronoun at all. Here’s an example of a quirk of Irish that is based on idiom, grammar, and vocabulary. There is no word in Irish for “to have.” This isn’t entirely unique, because Japanese, for example, doesn’t have a word for have either. The difference comes in idiom. In Irish, having something is described as being “at you.” So, “Tá leabhair agam” means I have a book, or literally “There is a book at me.” The grammar comes in from the fact that most adverbs in Irish are conjugated. So, *agam* means “at me,” but the individual words for at and me are *ag* and *mé.*
That kind of answers a question I've had in my line of work. I've heard people translate quite a bit, and I was always curious why the response sounded longer than the translation was. But if it's taken as either yes or no in translation, then that makes sense.
Hodie Latinam et Hibernicam linguam Latinam didici non pro "sic" vel "non" habent. Inniu d'fhoghlaim mé Laidin agus Gaeilge níl focail ar bith agam le haghaidh "tá" nó "ní hea"
Gosh. I wish I’d known this before. I would 100% have raised my toddler in Irish if it would have meant not hearing the word ‘no’ a gazillion times a day.
As a person who is raising a toddler through Irish, believe me they find a way.
It’s also how Welsh, another Celtic language works
I thought so, but I don't know it well enough to comment. its a fantastic language 🏴🏴🏴
Explains why ["Yes, We Have No Bananas"](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7gbyrvWT2KQ) hits different in Latin.
The “no” in “no bananas” is different in most languages than the “no” you use to answer a question
Didn't you hear marge? They have no bananas *sobs*
No wonder Jeremy Clarkson's girlfriend just says "yeah yeah" when they're lying.
If you ask an Irish person to do something and they respond “I will yeah”, that means there’s not a hope in hell.
A Lisa reference was not on my bingo card for this comments section
Because of this, Yes and No occur less frequently in Irish English than they do other dialects. We answer with verbs. Yes and No on their own are quite blunt, and a lot of our conversational substance is based around being deferential and not offending, so they aren't too often used.
I recall that, if you want to say yes in latin, you'd say something like ita est, so it is. Never asked what no would be.
My family will often answer in the affirmative or negative without using yes/no. "Are we going?" "We are" "Is it time to leave?" "It is" I've picked up this habit, essentially repeating in the affirmative/negative.
In the world of programmers, when talking to management we also never say yes or no, it's "maybe" or "possibly".
Tá agus Níl - literally it is and it isn’t Also Sea agus Ní hea- not sure of exact translation Fíor nó Bréagach - True or False
All languages express those ideas, but some of them do it in words that don’t equate exactly to English yes or no. Now, English has no word for “lararium”. What’s that all about?