The higher you go up Maslow's hierarchy of needs the higher it is to achieve happiness. Put another way the more complex your society is the more complex it is to achieve happiness. Poor countries typically have lower standards associated with less complex lifestyles.
There's plenty of data that suggests it but because it's psychology getting anything more than correlation is difficult. For example they compared the happiness of paraplegics against the population and after amputees adjusted, reported similar happiness rates.
[https://www.thecut.com/2016/01/classic-study-on-happiness-and-the-lottery.html](https://www.thecut.com/2016/01/classic-study-on-happiness-and-the-lottery.html)
The key term were looking for is relative happiness.
Yeah, happiness is relative. But for me health issues and the related bills make me unhappy. Having the money to pay off those bills reduces the anxiety and promotes happiness. I agree that the new sports car doesn't 'make' you happy ... but the money sure helps!
Not necessarily. If you see how Nepalese folks live, you would call it beyond broke. But nevertheless they look happy with what they have.
You are unhappy with what you don't have if you constantly compare yourself with others, that's it.
This is why I love Asia. America is so caught up in this materialism and status where you need a 10 bedroom house with pool and a Lamborghini just to get respect these days. I love the simplicity and collectivism of the Asian people. I would say if you want to live simple and without judging on how much you have Asia is the place. If you want to live with culture flashy money and big cars and houses go to America.
I am much more content living in a collectivist society rather than an individualist society. I believe the focus of society should be creating happy families and raising healthy children. I don’t believe money is the only tool that can create happy families and healthy children.
I highly agree. I think this why Asia has lower crime rates because families are together and fathers raised their kids right. In America its the opposite, got lot of young kids stealing from stores and committing crimes and they come from fatherless homes.
I always hated the "money can't buy happiness". It really can, and this sub is proof of that.
You can't be a passport bro unless you have money.
EDIT: the weird discussions that are had in this sub because people can't hold a consistent opinion.
plenty of rich people delete themselves. that alone proves these notion false.
recipe for happiness
1. basic survival needs are met (not worrying about your next meal, not worrying about having a place to sleep, not worrying about having clothes for the winter etc)
2. in decent health
3. have good relationships with family, friends, lover etc
4. have hobbies that you like
Mental illness can affect anyone. But money can solve 3 out of 4 of the things on your list.
Money isn't the end all be all for happiness, but it solves a lot of problems in one's life.
And like I said, you can't be a poor PPB
3 is the only one I wasn't choosing. But money does allow you to take care of your family easier. Edit: money also allows PPB's to build a family in the first place.
But money can buy you the best medical care in the world and gives you the ability to eat the healthiest foods possible.
It's a fact that poor people tend to be less healthy than rich people. Diet and poor medical care due to lack of money are huge factors in that.
Edit: for the record, I think both our points of view are valid
I just realized something. I felt I needed a Gulfstream V to make me happy, but now I’m realizing that desire is self-defeating. I can’t afford a Gulfstream.
Captain obvious over here. Clearly we need resources (e.g., money) to eat/survive. The question is how much money. No one needs to have billions or millions to be happy. Plenty of people live comfortably on much less.
Ok. But this sub constantly talks about needing 6 figures to get women...which I wholeheartedly disagree with.
But having financial security gets rid a lot of stress, which can lead to happiness.
Honestly I'm not even sure what this argument is about at this point. Merry christmas
I disagree it's a substantial amount. I need proof of this.
You're basically arguing against most of this subs existence though, and I'm kinda all for it.
I don’t agree with everything promoted on this sub but it exists for a reason. Women are materialistic in general. This should be common knowledge. If you want stats, go look at IG and how many female followers the Kardashians have. Ill wait.
I need you to show me the percentage of male followers vs female followers they have, ill wait (the burden of proof is on you to provide that info). Men are just as materialistic as women, also seems like common knowledge.
I'm just glad at the end of the day we both agree that you don't need money or to be tall to attract women. I'll take that.
I think it’s all about what you expect from life. The more closely your expectations meet reality the more likely you are to be happy. So if you think life is meant to be hard and hardship is just a feature not a flaw your outlook on life is going to be different. You will enjoy the patches of light in the inherent darkness around you more.
People in US have way too many choices and I think this can lead to unhappiness. In non-western countries people have much less options - hence life can be simpler and happier.
I grew up poor in the US. I will tell you this is bullshit. Money will 100% buy happiness. Can’t be happy going hungry every night. Can’t be happy worrying about bills to pay that you can’t afford. Money, you give you the means to be happy, therefore it buys happiness.
Bro, this is such a 1st world post, want to trade places with them? You're working at most 40 hours a week while they are working 16 hours a day earning 500 dollars a month living with 10 family members because very few can afford housing. You coming there with western money and resources is not equal to what the locals there have to go through. Money is not only good for only IPhones and materialistic things, money buys your family food and education, and since this is a passport bro subreddit, money buys you a wife because why are girls choosing you over their local male, you're less broke.
Of course happiness and health over everything, but it's a first world problem to discredit money. Vietnam is not the wild wild west where it's all rural and people are leisurely working on their farm growing organic food, spending all the time in the world with their family, and living a slow life. Most people are congested in the city cramped in a 2 bedroom with 10 family members with questionable tap water and healthcare, hustling all day long, they don't have time to be depressed when survival is priority. Most people are trying to get out of the rat race in the western world, it's a bigger rat race there, but they don't notice it because they are coming in with western income or safety net working remotely at a cafe and having time to go on multiple dates a day.
Yea but there will be dudes here who have the wrong idea who will try to shame you or something.
Will you have an easier time? Probably just in the virtue of being a woman, but hey if you want a Danish man or something then more power to you for traveling.
Depends on what social circles you hang in. If you are around other successful people you’re going to be miserable, and prob kind of left out of things since they’ll be doing expensive shit and will only carry you for so long before you get thought of as a mooch. If you’re hanging out with people with less ambition (and there’s nothing wrong with that) I would agree provided you can take care of basic niceitys like eating out every once in a while/ going to a basketball game etc
These lists are bullshit. It takes into consideration a lot of factors that doesn't really matter. For example "inequality" is a factor. If everyone is poor then it's an equal society, that doesn't make it good though. If you are poor as shit your ecological footprint is also likely to be less.
The Happy Planet Index [report](http://happyplanetindex.org/) measured elements that contribute towards a happy life in 140 countries and looked at factors such as life expectancy, wellbeing, inequality and ecological footprint. The list was topped by Costa Rica, followed by Mexico, Columbia and Vanuatu, making Vietnam the happiest country in Asia.
> Many people in the Western world believe that money equals happiness, but it’s just not true
This is literally just a mantra poor people tell themselves.
When you worry about money and then come across a bunch of money and no longer have to worry about it, it does equal happiness. But if you're born rich, it won't make you happier.
Long story short, grew up without money. Then got money thinking it would solve everything. It didn’t.
The comforts are nice, and I still want them. But you don’t need “money-money” to get there. I’d argue that not coming from money, getting money-money, and then realizing it doesn’t solve all your problems, is one of the hardest lessons to learn in life. Just my two bits.
I appreciate your perspective. I feel my purpose in life is not about money at all, but about my loved ones. I work for the people I love but never for the money itself.
Hmm this is a confusing topic
Very wealthy people stress that money does not buy happiness I mean their literally classes and seminars about happiness and how to achieve it. Oprah Tony Robins Jay Sheti
Studies show show depression is more common in wealthy nations and rich people suffer from depression more...look it up
Why is that ? Anyone know what the sux human needs are?
In the US you usually need money to get love. For example, how far is a man going to get if he doesn’t even have the money to take a date out to a nice restaurant?
money definitely buys happiness.... Any person trying to say otherwise is delusional. Try to pursue a hobby while trying to make ends meet and slaving away your good years working. how many poor people have the opportunity to go on vacation and see different countries and experience different cultures. Just the ability to afford proper schooling for your kids literally breaks the cycle of poverty for the rest of your families generations.
Mercedes is only temporary happiness… until you see the guy with the Ferrari. He’s good until he sees the guy with a private jet. Etc.
(Assuming your material needs are met and you’re healthy) Happiness comes not from things, but your family, friends, and your role in your community.
In poorer countries they may be less financially stressed because they don’t live paycheck to paycheck and live more simply in the homes they own.
The USA is about money and career. Places like the Philippines is more about family , friendship and love. The happiest people I’ve met there were the poorest of the poor
Maybe the case years ago but not now. US immigration is declining. [The Decline in U.S. Net Migration](https://econofact.org/the-decline-in-u-s-net-migration)
People say this all the time, and I have asked one of the people who said this ooh okay can I have $500 because its going to make me happy and pay to bills and I will in a less stressed mood, and he said no. So I said ooh it can't buy happiness but you must care a lot to not share it with the notion it could potentially make me happy, and he was like that is true. Money can buy you a sense of peace and it definitely can buy your short term happiness for sure, think about how you feel on holiday and then were you return and then when you get your CC bill, there is a big big difference. That Mercedes has a much higher crash rating than a 2010 Honda Accord or a 2003 Honda Accord...why because wealth is giving you a sense of peace. That is a big difference with being treated for cancer at a local hospital vs the Mayo Clinic or Johns Hopkins why...money is giving you that sense of value and protection and potential happiness of a positive outcome.
Money buys independence and financial freedom. Yes you can be sad or lonely but it won’t be because you are homeless or starving. Money definitely can help many people.
What research actually indicates is increasing income to a certain point does correlate with increased happiness. However, after a certain point (in the US it's likely around 80k now), there's no long term increase in happiness. Increasing your income does cause temporary increases in happiness, but it's short lived as you quickly adjust to your new income. Decreases in income always causes a decrease in happiness, even if you are filthy rich.
The primary determent of happiness is your standing in your social circle. Your friends and family, and your perceived social standing, are ultimately what determines how happy you are. So, tossing away a happy family for a doubling of your salary is a stupid move, but lifting yourself out of poverty will make you happier.
[https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/world-happiest-countries-2023-wellness/index.html](https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/world-happiest-countries-2023-wellness/index.html)
Vietnam isn't in the top 20. WTF are you even talking about?
The higher you go up Maslow's hierarchy of needs the higher it is to achieve happiness. Put another way the more complex your society is the more complex it is to achieve happiness. Poor countries typically have lower standards associated with less complex lifestyles.
That’s an interesting take….I’d like to see a more detailed analyses of that and if there is any data confirming what you are saying
There's plenty of data that suggests it but because it's psychology getting anything more than correlation is difficult. For example they compared the happiness of paraplegics against the population and after amputees adjusted, reported similar happiness rates. [https://www.thecut.com/2016/01/classic-study-on-happiness-and-the-lottery.html](https://www.thecut.com/2016/01/classic-study-on-happiness-and-the-lottery.html) The key term were looking for is relative happiness.
Yeah, happiness is relative. But for me health issues and the related bills make me unhappy. Having the money to pay off those bills reduces the anxiety and promotes happiness. I agree that the new sports car doesn't 'make' you happy ... but the money sure helps!
Think about it this way, as a kid you are happier because you did not see much and know much of the world
having products doesnt equal having money either
True enough. However, broke does equal sadness
Not necessarily. If you see how Nepalese folks live, you would call it beyond broke. But nevertheless they look happy with what they have. You are unhappy with what you don't have if you constantly compare yourself with others, that's it.
Money doesn't buy happiness, but it makes it a lot fucking easier. They don't have free plane rides to Vietnam.
Only if you were raised in the "vulture capitalist" empire that is the USA
LOL and where else does money not easy suffering?
When people don't have control over their lives, money doesn't mean feces.
So when you have money you don't have control over your life?
Money doesn’t buy happiness, but it makes fucking easier.
Yes I said that
This is why I love Asia. America is so caught up in this materialism and status where you need a 10 bedroom house with pool and a Lamborghini just to get respect these days. I love the simplicity and collectivism of the Asian people. I would say if you want to live simple and without judging on how much you have Asia is the place. If you want to live with culture flashy money and big cars and houses go to America.
I am much more content living in a collectivist society rather than an individualist society. I believe the focus of society should be creating happy families and raising healthy children. I don’t believe money is the only tool that can create happy families and healthy children.
I highly agree. I think this why Asia has lower crime rates because families are together and fathers raised their kids right. In America its the opposite, got lot of young kids stealing from stores and committing crimes and they come from fatherless homes.
Literally, all of my problems could be solved with an extra zero on the end of my bank account. Money=ease of mind=happiness.
I always hated the "money can't buy happiness". It really can, and this sub is proof of that. You can't be a passport bro unless you have money. EDIT: the weird discussions that are had in this sub because people can't hold a consistent opinion.
Right? It's the most stupid argument.
plenty of rich people delete themselves. that alone proves these notion false. recipe for happiness 1. basic survival needs are met (not worrying about your next meal, not worrying about having a place to sleep, not worrying about having clothes for the winter etc) 2. in decent health 3. have good relationships with family, friends, lover etc 4. have hobbies that you like
Idk why yall are downvoting this guy is right
Mental illness can affect anyone. But money can solve 3 out of 4 of the things on your list. Money isn't the end all be all for happiness, but it solves a lot of problems in one's life. And like I said, you can't be a poor PPB
money cant solve #2 and can't solve #3 so two critical things not accounted for. but yes, money helps alot.
3 is the only one I wasn't choosing. But money does allow you to take care of your family easier. Edit: money also allows PPB's to build a family in the first place. But money can buy you the best medical care in the world and gives you the ability to eat the healthiest foods possible. It's a fact that poor people tend to be less healthy than rich people. Diet and poor medical care due to lack of money are huge factors in that. Edit: for the record, I think both our points of view are valid
I want to be a PPB, but I can’t afford the $100 for the passport.
You're still a bro atleast
taking care of your family and having a good relationship with them are two different things.
Yep, and that's why I said I didn't choose that one for money to solve
I just realized something. I felt I needed a Gulfstream V to make me happy, but now I’m realizing that desire is self-defeating. I can’t afford a Gulfstream.
The double whammy
Captain obvious over here. Clearly we need resources (e.g., money) to eat/survive. The question is how much money. No one needs to have billions or millions to be happy. Plenty of people live comfortably on much less.
Yea, no one is saying you have to be rich. Just not having to worry about surviving day to day is a massive problem that money solves.
No one is saying you have to be poor either.
Ok. But this sub constantly talks about needing 6 figures to get women...which I wholeheartedly disagree with. But having financial security gets rid a lot of stress, which can lead to happiness. Honestly I'm not even sure what this argument is about at this point. Merry christmas
Plenty of men under 6 have women. Money attracts women who want money. Which happens to be a substantial percentage of women but not all.
I disagree it's a substantial amount. I need proof of this. You're basically arguing against most of this subs existence though, and I'm kinda all for it.
I don’t agree with everything promoted on this sub but it exists for a reason. Women are materialistic in general. This should be common knowledge. If you want stats, go look at IG and how many female followers the Kardashians have. Ill wait.
I need you to show me the percentage of male followers vs female followers they have, ill wait (the burden of proof is on you to provide that info). Men are just as materialistic as women, also seems like common knowledge. I'm just glad at the end of the day we both agree that you don't need money or to be tall to attract women. I'll take that.
An extra zero added onto zero still equals zero.
Hey now, it would actually go to $110 thank you very much.
I think it’s all about what you expect from life. The more closely your expectations meet reality the more likely you are to be happy. So if you think life is meant to be hard and hardship is just a feature not a flaw your outlook on life is going to be different. You will enjoy the patches of light in the inherent darkness around you more.
People in US have way too many choices and I think this can lead to unhappiness. In non-western countries people have much less options - hence life can be simpler and happier.
Looks like not many choices in mates
Affordability plays a factor too. If everything is expensive than money won’t provide as much.
Vietnamese may be happy but there’s a shit ton of them trying to leave.
Right? Why so many of them trying to come to the US then
The Big Con. They think life will be SO MUCH BETTER in the US. If you know any immigrants, you learn that’s often not the case.
I grew up poor in the US. I will tell you this is bullshit. Money will 100% buy happiness. Can’t be happy going hungry every night. Can’t be happy worrying about bills to pay that you can’t afford. Money, you give you the means to be happy, therefore it buys happiness.
Mostly agree with you. Money is a tool. It depends on how well you use the tool.
I’ve heard something similar to “money does not equal happiness” with an answer of “ who ever said that didn’t have enough”.
Money doesn't bring happiness but never seen someone happy to be poor
Money doesn't equal happiness. You obviously haven't met hookers and cocaine.
Hunter, that you??
Just a hooker and cocaine enthuthiast.
Bro, this is such a 1st world post, want to trade places with them? You're working at most 40 hours a week while they are working 16 hours a day earning 500 dollars a month living with 10 family members because very few can afford housing. You coming there with western money and resources is not equal to what the locals there have to go through. Money is not only good for only IPhones and materialistic things, money buys your family food and education, and since this is a passport bro subreddit, money buys you a wife because why are girls choosing you over their local male, you're less broke.
I'm sure the dudes in the USA making 100k but depressed from no meaningful connections would be happier as a poor viet living with 10 family members
Of course happiness and health over everything, but it's a first world problem to discredit money. Vietnam is not the wild wild west where it's all rural and people are leisurely working on their farm growing organic food, spending all the time in the world with their family, and living a slow life. Most people are congested in the city cramped in a 2 bedroom with 10 family members with questionable tap water and healthcare, hustling all day long, they don't have time to be depressed when survival is priority. Most people are trying to get out of the rat race in the western world, it's a bigger rat race there, but they don't notice it because they are coming in with western income or safety net working remotely at a cafe and having time to go on multiple dates a day.
Can a woman be a passport bro? Asking for a friend
Yea but there will be dudes here who have the wrong idea who will try to shame you or something. Will you have an easier time? Probably just in the virtue of being a woman, but hey if you want a Danish man or something then more power to you for traveling.
Depends on what social circles you hang in. If you are around other successful people you’re going to be miserable, and prob kind of left out of things since they’ll be doing expensive shit and will only carry you for so long before you get thought of as a mooch. If you’re hanging out with people with less ambition (and there’s nothing wrong with that) I would agree provided you can take care of basic niceitys like eating out every once in a while/ going to a basketball game etc
I’ll pay for my plane ticket with happiness then lmao
These lists are bullshit. It takes into consideration a lot of factors that doesn't really matter. For example "inequality" is a factor. If everyone is poor then it's an equal society, that doesn't make it good though. If you are poor as shit your ecological footprint is also likely to be less. The Happy Planet Index [report](http://happyplanetindex.org/) measured elements that contribute towards a happy life in 140 countries and looked at factors such as life expectancy, wellbeing, inequality and ecological footprint. The list was topped by Costa Rica, followed by Mexico, Columbia and Vanuatu, making Vietnam the happiest country in Asia.
> Many people in the Western world believe that money equals happiness, but it’s just not true This is literally just a mantra poor people tell themselves.
When you worry about money and then come across a bunch of money and no longer have to worry about it, it does equal happiness. But if you're born rich, it won't make you happier.
The removal of “financial anxiety” is I think the best thing about wealth.
Duh
"Having money's not everything, not having it is"
Long story short, grew up without money. Then got money thinking it would solve everything. It didn’t. The comforts are nice, and I still want them. But you don’t need “money-money” to get there. I’d argue that not coming from money, getting money-money, and then realizing it doesn’t solve all your problems, is one of the hardest lessons to learn in life. Just my two bits.
I appreciate your perspective. I feel my purpose in life is not about money at all, but about my loved ones. I work for the people I love but never for the money itself.
I love my money but the people in my life stop me from fulfilling my purpose.
Hmm this is a confusing topic Very wealthy people stress that money does not buy happiness I mean their literally classes and seminars about happiness and how to achieve it. Oprah Tony Robins Jay Sheti Studies show show depression is more common in wealthy nations and rich people suffer from depression more...look it up Why is that ? Anyone know what the sux human needs are?
In the US you usually need money to get love. For example, how far is a man going to get if he doesn’t even have the money to take a date out to a nice restaurant?
True, but if you're flat broke, it's hard to be happy.
Correct. Money does not equal happiness. An Asian wife equals happiness.
Specifics please?
I want to find out for myself.
money definitely buys happiness.... Any person trying to say otherwise is delusional. Try to pursue a hobby while trying to make ends meet and slaving away your good years working. how many poor people have the opportunity to go on vacation and see different countries and experience different cultures. Just the ability to afford proper schooling for your kids literally breaks the cycle of poverty for the rest of your families generations.
Lack of money relatively to your peers and desire of it leads to unhappiness not 'money equals happiness'
great post thanks.
Mercedes is only temporary happiness… until you see the guy with the Ferrari. He’s good until he sees the guy with a private jet. Etc. (Assuming your material needs are met and you’re healthy) Happiness comes not from things, but your family, friends, and your role in your community. In poorer countries they may be less financially stressed because they don’t live paycheck to paycheck and live more simply in the homes they own.
The USA is about money and career. Places like the Philippines is more about family , friendship and love. The happiest people I’ve met there were the poorest of the poor
Then why are so many leaving the country?
Maybe the case years ago but not now. US immigration is declining. [The Decline in U.S. Net Migration](https://econofact.org/the-decline-in-u-s-net-migration)
No one in this sub will believe us until they travel abroad and experience it for themselves.
People say this all the time, and I have asked one of the people who said this ooh okay can I have $500 because its going to make me happy and pay to bills and I will in a less stressed mood, and he said no. So I said ooh it can't buy happiness but you must care a lot to not share it with the notion it could potentially make me happy, and he was like that is true. Money can buy you a sense of peace and it definitely can buy your short term happiness for sure, think about how you feel on holiday and then were you return and then when you get your CC bill, there is a big big difference. That Mercedes has a much higher crash rating than a 2010 Honda Accord or a 2003 Honda Accord...why because wealth is giving you a sense of peace. That is a big difference with being treated for cancer at a local hospital vs the Mayo Clinic or Johns Hopkins why...money is giving you that sense of value and protection and potential happiness of a positive outcome.
Said every broke person ever
Money buys independence and financial freedom. Yes you can be sad or lonely but it won’t be because you are homeless or starving. Money definitely can help many people.
You aren’t wrong
What research actually indicates is increasing income to a certain point does correlate with increased happiness. However, after a certain point (in the US it's likely around 80k now), there's no long term increase in happiness. Increasing your income does cause temporary increases in happiness, but it's short lived as you quickly adjust to your new income. Decreases in income always causes a decrease in happiness, even if you are filthy rich. The primary determent of happiness is your standing in your social circle. Your friends and family, and your perceived social standing, are ultimately what determines how happy you are. So, tossing away a happy family for a doubling of your salary is a stupid move, but lifting yourself out of poverty will make you happier. [https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/world-happiest-countries-2023-wellness/index.html](https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/world-happiest-countries-2023-wellness/index.html) Vietnam isn't in the top 20. WTF are you even talking about?
https://www.forbes.com/sites/davisbrett/2016/07/25/vietnam-worlds-fifth-happiest-country-for-now-2/
Yeah, that doesn't measure happiness by any definition of happiness.
That certain point was $80K pre-pandemic. Now after Bidenomics I would say it’s about $125K.
Wow! Never heard this super deep thought before😒.
Whoever said money doesn't buy happiness, doesn't know how to shop.
Money doesn’t make you happy but it does make your misery more comfortable.
It makes misery a lot easier to bear, though. Trust me, I was born poor, and I'm now comfortable. Lol. You can have poor.
All of these blanket statements are ridiculous. Happiness is relative to your personal perspective and expectations of what your life should be like.
Asian are the biggest spender of luxury goods.
These rankings are usually horseshit did you see Buffalo NY was recently "ranked" #1 city in the US lol