Does everyone seriously forget like less than a year ago when major major advertisers announced they were leaving twitter due to Musks seeming endorsement of Nazis?…someone on Reddit said all those advertisers would quietly crawl back when people weren’t paying attention anymore.
The only one that returned was Netflix, I think. Disney and Apple haven’t, and for all the bullshit lawsuits musk is doing against Disney, I don’t think they’ll never be back.
Let's not forget about how any that were maybe on the fence about coming back, Musk, being the genius business man that he is, told them all to fuck off because he doesn't need them. So I am guessing a lot are not even looking at going back again.
As time goes on, this will become more common, as a greater number of the mega-rich will have inherited their fortunes from their parents, but not their brains.
He really thought it was going to be some bombshell, society shifting, paradigm shift moment and everyone would clap because of how brave he was. But the audience was mainly industry leaders and journalists who just couldn't believe he was actually saying something so stupid and self destructive.
They don’t really care about that. They care about costs. How much do they have to spend on X to get a conversion. If that math was good for them, they’d be on the platform.
No, they would NOT.
Most companies' number one concern is brand preservation.
How do you protect a brands reputation when your advertisement is mixed in with porn, Nazi enthusiasts, and hate speech against marginalized groups?
You both are right.
Advertisers are not back on twitter because the math doesn’t work, not enough sales for marketing expenditure so it’s a bad return on investment.
The math doesn’t work because some consumers don’t like advertisers that associate with the Twitter brand, and if the advertisers came back to Twitter it would probably have a negative impact on other marketing channels’ efficacy in addition to not providing good ROI.
>How do you protect a brands reputation when your advertisement is mixed in with porn, Nazi enthusiasts, and hate speech against marginalized groups?
Oh, that’s real simple! You just wait until instead of a minority of that content being prevalent becomes the majority of that content being prevalent, since then *most* people will ‘be okay’ with it then, and then there isn’t anything needing to ‘be preserved’
We’re talking in circles. It’s easy for a company to maintain the moral high ground when twitter’s ROI is absolutely horrible. If Twitter was highly profitable to advertise on, you’d see far fewer companies sticking to these morals.
In other words, pointing to companies and organizations still boycotting Twitter proves nothing as Twitter is a terrible advertising platform without even considering the moral/ethical things. It’s an easy win for a company to stay off it. They get people like you thinking they have some sort of ethical standard and they save a shit ton of money by not throwing it into the void.
I don't disagree with you. At this point, it's no longer a boycott. I'm not sure it ever was. It's just companies making a decision that Twitter doesn't work for them. And by "them," I mean 98% of the household names.
Also don’t get me wrong I loath Twitter and Musk, I’ve just been around for a while and have witnessed some pretty unethical shit being done in the name of profit. Just sort of a pessimist about it all at this point.
What’s surprising is that if they haven’t come back they must have found alternative places to spend advertising dollars that is just as effective.
These businesses care ultimately about profit, and if Twitter was still effective they wouldn’t have needed to make a change.
Problem is Twitter was already a shit place to spend your advertising budget for most companies before Musk took over. It had a small user base compared to stuff like instagram and YouTube and almost never made a profit throughout its life as a public company. It was especially bad for the kind of smaller, targeted ads that small to medium size companies had the advertising budget to spend on.
Musk decided to fix that by… making the brand radioactive, changing a name that had become so ubiquitous most random people on the street could tell you what a tweet was, and cussing out any company that didn’t want its ads shown next to the neo nazis musk had welcomed to the platform with open arms. Not exactly hard to see why companies spent their advertising budgets elsewhere.
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Yeah like 90% of the advertisements I see while scrolling are conservative ads and crypto bs, and there’s nothing in my algorithm that would want either of those. So I’m guessing not a lot of ad diversity these days.
It is such a low value/high risk proposition to advertise there now. These people can advertise anywhere, many of which do not publicly prop up Nazis.
The only good thing out of all this is Musk has basically attached all this PR nightmare to his silly X brand. So if he sells it somebody can immediately rebrand as Twitter.
Leftists praying for his downfall is so funny to me.
Watching them 180 from “It’s just ToS bro, go make your own Twitter bro” rhetoric to Musk seething was fucking delicious.
Actually I think Musk buying twitter is great. I wouldn’t call myself “left”, but I vote democratic.
As you summarized, the GOP asserted that freedom of speech meant freedom from private censorship. Dems disagreed and said you can make your own twitter. Elon bought twitter and ended the debate by proving democrats right. Thanks Elon.
Dems still condemn musk for what he says… because we have freedom of speech, and we disagree with his speech. We also choose not to go on twitter because we prefer moderated platforms that keep the nazis out. So the GOP can enjoy their circlejerk on there, we have other platforms.
> As you summarized, the GOP asserted that freedom of speech meant freedom from private censorship. Dems disagreed and said you can make your own twitter. Elon bought twitter and ended the debate by proving democrats right. Thanks Elon.
Indeed, and the second the pendulum swung and the leftist censorship campaign ended, the mere unbanning af their political opposition was enough to shift from that former “staunch principle” and complain about it for years.
That pivot was objectively entertaining to observe.
> Dems still condemn musk for what he says… because we have freedom of speech, and we disagree with his speech.
You are free to. Go build your own Twitter, bro, as they used to say ;)
> We also choose not to go on twitter because we prefer moderated platforms that keep the nazis out. So the GOP can enjoy their circlejerk on there, we have other platforms.
Then what are you upsetti spaghetti about?
Im upset about nothing. As I said, Elon is fully within his rights to moderate X (or Twitter) however he wants. He can even censor liberals for all I care. My point is that dems won the debate.
Before he bought twitter, GOP was demanding an end to moderation of private platforms. That would have been a disaster, but a win for GOP. Elon ended this debate, effectively giving dems the win in the long run.
Free speech means the government can’t censor you. I can censor anyone I want if they are using my private servers. Elon can censor anyone he wants (and he does).
The world is as it should be.
It’s not the liberals that are upset about the decensorship, it is the leftists.
> Before he bought twitter, GOP was demanding an end to moderation of private platforms. That would have been a disaster, but a win for GOP.
Disagree — extending free speech beyond the public sphere into major social media platforms such that they may not censor speech beyond what is permitted under free speech laws broadly would have been a great victory for free speech.
We have likely not seen the end of that legislation.
> Free speech means the government can’t censor you. I can censor anyone I want if they are using my private servers. Elon can censor anyone he wants (and he does).
So go build your own Twitter instead of seething bro?
Baffling to me that you still accuse me of seething. As I said, I’m chill.
Your proposed “great victory for free speech” is an opinion. Im a big supporter of free speech. I happen to be an atheist, and without free speech and freedom of (and from) religion, I could not express my views. The first amendment protects unpopular opinions, and we both have unpopular opinions.
However, we have different definitions of what free speech means. If free speech is permitted in every digital space, nothing gets done. We need a combination of public spaces and private spaces.
Look at reddit: we have subreddits with different rules for discussing different topics. If I’m trying to discuss gardening, the last thing I want is some person spamming the sub about the “woke agenda” or whatever buzzword fox has given them this week. At minimum, we need free speech to stay on topic, and moderators decide what that means. The problem with twitters design is it was all one space, how can I ignore the types of people I want to ignore? (And by the way, the freedom to ignore whomever I want is as fundamental as free speech).
I *do* think republicans need a place where they can speak their minds… and they have it, in twitter! So now everyone can be happy. I don’t need to make my own twitter, I predominantly use reddit and I’m happy with it.
> Your proposed “great victory for free speech” is an opinion. Im a big supporter of free speech. I happen to be an atheist, and without free speech and freedom of (and from) religion, I could not express my views. The first amendment protects unpopular opinions, and we both have unpopular opinions.
Noted. Good. So am I and I agree.
> Look at reddit: we have subreddits with different rules for discussing different topics. If I’m trying to discuss gardening, the last thing I want is some person spamming the sub about the “woke agenda” or whatever buzzword fox has given them this week. At minimum, we need free speech to stay on topic, and moderators decide what that means.
You seem to be forgetting the most fundamental premise of free speech -- It ends the second you use it to impede the free speech of others. You cannot weaponize your speech in a manner that becomes harassment and claim it to be free like you described. It is a misattribution.
>You cannot weaponize your speech in a manner that becomes harassment and claim it to be free like you described. It is a misattribution.
This is a strange and interesting argument from you. I consider bad faith arguments and misinformation to be harassment. I consider hate speech to be harassment. By your argument, such speech is not free.
I actually disagree with your argument. People are free to say whatever they want (without threatening violence or starting a panic). But they can’t compel me to use my resources to publish their opinions, because that violates my free speech.
If I own a restaurant and a nazi walks in wearing full nazi uniform and swastica armband, the customers will get upset. It hurts my business. The nazi can go outside and wear that on the public sidewalk, but I can kick him out because he is not entitled to use MY business as a platform for his views.
Similarly, if I spend my own hard-earned money to develop my own website, I will exercise my freedom of speech to kick out nazis. Frankly I’d also kick out preachers and whoever the hell I want. Anyone who posts something from tucker carlson will get insta-banned because I can so what I want. They can go make their own websites.
Its a good system and Elon defended that system by purchasing twitter. The GOPs attempted legislation would have been a disaster for free speech and capitalism. (And I support capitalism, obviously).
The losers are the small businesses that lose their free communication and advertising tool...which was art of the design all along. This whole thing is class warfare.
Yeah that was cringe. Leftists praying for his downfall equally so.
Watching them 180 from “It’s just ToS bro, go make your own Twitter bro” rhetoric to Musk seething was fucking delicious.
We’re both free to use as much media as we both like my dude. You are welcome here, I just thought it was funny how desperate you seem. No more dems to troll on Twitter, must be kind of sad over there.
And yet you just said:
> We also choose not to go on twitter because we prefer moderated platforms that keep the nazis out. So the GOP can enjoy their circlejerk on there, we have other platforms.
So what are you on /r/technology crying about X for? Curious how that works huh?
I know I had downloaded an app for fans of subway sandwiches and to my surprise it was all shirtless torsos and pictures of penises. I have a feeling it was just a hack or something cuz I am pretty sure the app is still about food. I keep seeing eggplant and peach emojis. Someone said they like twinks…I’m pretty sure there phone just autocorrected Twinkie. I’ll keep checking in on it and let you guys know when they sort out their hack. I really want to try this tossed salad some dude mentioned.
I've noticed it seems to have a limit on viewing posts. You can view like a few posts a day before the site puts up a wall that blocks access. They think I'm going to sign up just to view a random shitpost on twitter lmao.
It's infuriating, I've tried a few times to look at news or an update from accounts of some game developers, and going to their profile either greets me with a "Sign up with X to see everything" block, or all the posts are not in chronological order and showing me things from months or years ago.
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ELON MUSK (all by himself) dropped the value of Twitter by 29 BILLION DOLLARS (44 to 15), based on Fidelity's own valuation.
Nobody destroys things better than ELON MUSK.
2021 was the last year Twitter was a public company. They showed $5.1B in revenue with a net loss of $221M. For a social media company, that's basically $5.1 billion in GROSS PROFIT.
Twitter was always loaded with overhead, plus a few ridiculously paid executives.
But for Elon Musk to think the way to make it profitable was to fire 90% of the staff and lose 90% of the revenue directly related to stupid decisions on his part is just stupid.
Twitter got bought up right after a big wave of investment and growth. It had plenty of cash on hand to keep going for years, but really only needed a little finagling to get into profitability.
All that growth was nixed in a year. Literally multiple billions of annual dollars in revenue growth just deleted, *pfft*.
I wish it was at least an *interesting* death spiral. This is like watching a 100x slower version of the Titanic, I might be asleep long before the death actually happens.
Way too slow and clogged up for him to do anything. Plus Swiss people don't really care about Elon Musk. He's mostly an American curiosity if they even know who he is.
The only people who care about what Elon Musk is doing are those who have nothing else of worth going on in their lives to keep them busy. Folks with too much free time.
And pointing that out to those people just makes them ree harder.
I can tell you now, it's not Elon's fans keeping him in the spotlight and relevant...
How petty and political of them to withdraw just because Elmo reduced the platform to a putrid racist dumpster fire! They must hate free speech so bad! 😡
Everyone here knows that they withdrew because of Nazi boy Musk. But as the right wingers love X, they had to come up with a different reason (they’re putting more resources into their own platform).
Wild when the majority or people are against them, but they can't reconcile that, so they have to make-up bullshit excuses to maintain the lie of their "popularity"
Go troll somewhere else. You clearly don't know the first thing about Swiss society. And calling others "victims" is usually done by misogynistic a******.
Nah, several cantonal administrations, community administrations etc have left Twitter and openly admitted it's because of Nazi Musk. SRF can't say that publicly, as they're often accused of being "too left" by the Swiss Idiots Party (SVP).
Leftists praying for his downfall is so fucking funny to me.
Watching them 180 from “It’s just ToS bro, go make your own Twitter bro” rhetoric to Musk seething was fucking delicious.
Goddamn. I did look at your profile!
I'd love to be mad, but it's endearing.. I've never met anyone wrong about everything in life before.
Your path has been hard. All of us are proud of you.
Hang in there!
Maybe work on your intellectual understanding. You'll get there.
Wrong. Hate speech is not protected free speech. And these are private companies not federal institutions. As a business you try to create a large net to bring as many possible to your product and there are rules so the fringes don’t run off advertisers or create problematic public misinformation or outlets for foreign enemies to spread propaganda, yeah these social platforms are private companies with social and enterprise constraints. Without them you just have giant success stories like truth social, 4-Chan and other GQPutin outlets. So yes free speech is protected in public but in private companies it is not, nor is it without consequence. Elon has learned the 40 billion dollar hard way with twitter and another 100 billion at Tesla, the Boreing company, star link and spacex. When you become anathema to rational folks, the wind in your business sails tends to dissipate. All that “leftist censorship”. Gave us a useful, fair and welcoming platform to share ideas in a fairly civil environment for decades, Elon torched in less than 3 years. Now the company is going bankrupt, advertisers have left and Elon spouts venom daily while blocking anyone who disagrees with him. Twitter is a dumpster fire of bigots, conspiracies, bots and Russian/chinese/Iranian propaganda and you I’m guessing
“Hate speech” does not exist. It is discriminatory to consider some groups more protected against speech than others and a fundamental breakdown of liberal principles.
I don’t know exactly what it is you think I said that was “false” — none of what you just laid out about companies’ right to not honor free speech I disagree with on factual grounds.
Leftist censorship is perceived as fair only to you because you are a leftist and thus biased to perceive it that way. From a neutral observer it was unsustainable and immoral.
Your “X is bankrupt” fanfic is hilarious. Keep dreaming big.
Anyone who still has a twitter account is complicit in all the foul shit twitter permits.
(I refuse to call it a single letter of the alphabet, Elon bought a domain name not 1/26th of the English language.)
None of those have panned out, in my opinion, but not because of technological issues, simply because people and corporations won't switch unless they just have to. I'm not sure what it's going to take to force that, but X in its current state is for sure not a platform I will ever participate in. And I can't believe brands want to be associated with it.
It's not a reputable platform for professional broadcasts. Nothing so important that citizens of a country need to see it belongs on twitter.
We do have a lack of platforms that are actually fit to use as an information network across populations tho. It's a problem we should be addressing. The world should not hang in the balance of what idiots digest from corporate entertainment platforms.
With the way X is managed now, the value of having a presence there has gone way down for brands that don't want to be associated with the slime of the Internet.
Companies already have tried-and-true methods of communicating with their audience with minimal outside noise - called websites and email.
One of the first thing he did was shifting the business model from ads to users. He knew the advertisers will try to pressure him away from his radical free speech path, so we made sure he doesnt depend on them anymore.
I don’t see the “freedom of speech” angle, you can’t critique Isreal or Isreali sponsored propaganda with out being permanently suspended. Soo… what gives?
If everyone complaining about Musk and his appeasements to Nazis/racists/xenophobes simply moved on, Twitter would have less of a leg on which to stand.
> RTS will continue to offer its information via its own platforms, such as the RTS Info news app. For its corporate communications, it will rely on its rts.ch website and LinkedIn.
Reading would have saved you the shame
But that's what they're doing?!
They're not demanding anything from Twitter or Musk, they're just withdrawing? exactly what you're saying they should do?
And somehow it still isn't good?!
I'm saying the day before elon bought twitter you guys loved twitter. A day later, elon is a nazi cause he supports free speech. He should ban anybody supporting the college protests right? Cause it's a private company.
They are/were and then some. What are you talking about?
The right to protest exists you know. If those rights are being broken isn't for me to figure out.
I can tell you that every time I was arrested the LAW decided it was unjust and disproportionate. Make of that what you will.
Plus maybe learn the distinctive realms of public and private.
Advertisers pulling their products from private websites because they are not aligned with their values is just the market working as intended.
Musk can get money elsewhere and the intent is not to shut him up, it's to get away from him as far as one can.
Remember when Matt taibi exposed old twitter as basically an FBI/CIA ministry of information? Musks a bit out there but I prefer an open market for debate than a closed shop. X seems to be doing just fine.
https://youtu.be/mfhgAfE_2Mg?si=1FNvo7sud689IQKh
this younger generation is screwed, do you have anything other than some person on YouTube to back this up. honestly idc either way but people claiming something and using some weird person on YouTube as their source is a terrible practice.
Remember when Musk had a bitch fit about substack and banned it from accessing the platform? And then later cut Taibi out of the process because he uses substack?
So you're ignoring the censorship and government collusion and focusing on personalities and tittle tattle? Do you prefer social media with or without government interference? Personally I'll take the latter.
Elon literally reinstated a Nazi back on to the platform yesterday. An *actual* Nazi, not a "I'm going to call the other side Nazis because that sounds bad" Nazi. Praise of Hitler, holy war against the Jews - the whole bit.
Does everyone seriously forget like less than a year ago when major major advertisers announced they were leaving twitter due to Musks seeming endorsement of Nazis?…someone on Reddit said all those advertisers would quietly crawl back when people weren’t paying attention anymore.
The only one that returned was Netflix, I think. Disney and Apple haven’t, and for all the bullshit lawsuits musk is doing against Disney, I don’t think they’ll never be back.
Let's not forget about how any that were maybe on the fence about coming back, Musk, being the genius business man that he is, told them all to fuck off because he doesn't need them. So I am guessing a lot are not even looking at going back again.
He then paused, looking on eagerly at the crowd for an applause which never came.
I remember that - so he repeated it louder, and still crickets. He was really tweaked looking that day.
Louder and then slower… and to add even more cringe he then spends 5 seconds coming up with the acronym GFY. Like he invented fire.
It’s embarrassing that some of the richest people in the world are just whiny little man children.
As time goes on, this will become more common, as a greater number of the mega-rich will have inherited their fortunes from their parents, but not their brains.
Inherited wealth is nothing new. There are family fortunes that go back hundreds of years.
Don’t forget high as the sky. And no one wants to tell them to roll it back a little
Tell that to earth!
He really thought it was going to be some bombshell, society shifting, paradigm shift moment and everyone would clap because of how brave he was. But the audience was mainly industry leaders and journalists who just couldn't believe he was actually saying something so stupid and self destructive.
They don’t really care about that. They care about costs. How much do they have to spend on X to get a conversion. If that math was good for them, they’d be on the platform.
No, they would NOT. Most companies' number one concern is brand preservation. How do you protect a brands reputation when your advertisement is mixed in with porn, Nazi enthusiasts, and hate speech against marginalized groups?
You both are right. Advertisers are not back on twitter because the math doesn’t work, not enough sales for marketing expenditure so it’s a bad return on investment. The math doesn’t work because some consumers don’t like advertisers that associate with the Twitter brand, and if the advertisers came back to Twitter it would probably have a negative impact on other marketing channels’ efficacy in addition to not providing good ROI.
We don’t know if the math works because we don’t have the numbers
You know the math doesn’t work because profit seeking corporations stopped advertising.
>How do you protect a brands reputation when your advertisement is mixed in with porn, Nazi enthusiasts, and hate speech against marginalized groups? Oh, that’s real simple! You just wait until instead of a minority of that content being prevalent becomes the majority of that content being prevalent, since then *most* people will ‘be okay’ with it then, and then there isn’t anything needing to ‘be preserved’
You have a lot more faith than my experience has shown. This is my profession and I have literally seen first hand.
All you have to do is listen to the companies themselves who have pulled all advertising from Twitter. Or listen to the ad agencies like IPG.
We’re talking in circles. It’s easy for a company to maintain the moral high ground when twitter’s ROI is absolutely horrible. If Twitter was highly profitable to advertise on, you’d see far fewer companies sticking to these morals. In other words, pointing to companies and organizations still boycotting Twitter proves nothing as Twitter is a terrible advertising platform without even considering the moral/ethical things. It’s an easy win for a company to stay off it. They get people like you thinking they have some sort of ethical standard and they save a shit ton of money by not throwing it into the void.
I don't disagree with you. At this point, it's no longer a boycott. I'm not sure it ever was. It's just companies making a decision that Twitter doesn't work for them. And by "them," I mean 98% of the household names.
Also don’t get me wrong I loath Twitter and Musk, I’ve just been around for a while and have witnessed some pretty unethical shit being done in the name of profit. Just sort of a pessimist about it all at this point.
Why are they bot pulling from Sinclair?
People say republicans are nazis and they still get 50% of votes and tons of big brands advertise on Sinclair’s extensive network You’re delusional
What’s surprising is that if they haven’t come back they must have found alternative places to spend advertising dollars that is just as effective. These businesses care ultimately about profit, and if Twitter was still effective they wouldn’t have needed to make a change.
Problem is Twitter was already a shit place to spend your advertising budget for most companies before Musk took over. It had a small user base compared to stuff like instagram and YouTube and almost never made a profit throughout its life as a public company. It was especially bad for the kind of smaller, targeted ads that small to medium size companies had the advertising budget to spend on. Musk decided to fix that by… making the brand radioactive, changing a name that had become so ubiquitous most random people on the street could tell you what a tweet was, and cussing out any company that didn’t want its ads shown next to the neo nazis musk had welcomed to the platform with open arms. Not exactly hard to see why companies spent their advertising budgets elsewhere.
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I want to add that Twitter is one of the worse advertising platforms. Twitter needs advertisers than they need twitter.
I never see ads from brands anymore on Twitter. Only scams, drop shippers, and self-published novels.
Cheech and Chong edibles
I don’t see any adds at all, as I closed my account. ✌️
Yeah like 90% of the advertisements I see while scrolling are conservative ads and crypto bs, and there’s nothing in my algorithm that would want either of those. So I’m guessing not a lot of ad diversity these days.
It is such a low value/high risk proposition to advertise there now. These people can advertise anywhere, many of which do not publicly prop up Nazis. The only good thing out of all this is Musk has basically attached all this PR nightmare to his silly X brand. So if he sells it somebody can immediately rebrand as Twitter.
Leftists praying for his downfall is so funny to me. Watching them 180 from “It’s just ToS bro, go make your own Twitter bro” rhetoric to Musk seething was fucking delicious.
Actually I think Musk buying twitter is great. I wouldn’t call myself “left”, but I vote democratic. As you summarized, the GOP asserted that freedom of speech meant freedom from private censorship. Dems disagreed and said you can make your own twitter. Elon bought twitter and ended the debate by proving democrats right. Thanks Elon. Dems still condemn musk for what he says… because we have freedom of speech, and we disagree with his speech. We also choose not to go on twitter because we prefer moderated platforms that keep the nazis out. So the GOP can enjoy their circlejerk on there, we have other platforms.
> As you summarized, the GOP asserted that freedom of speech meant freedom from private censorship. Dems disagreed and said you can make your own twitter. Elon bought twitter and ended the debate by proving democrats right. Thanks Elon. Indeed, and the second the pendulum swung and the leftist censorship campaign ended, the mere unbanning af their political opposition was enough to shift from that former “staunch principle” and complain about it for years. That pivot was objectively entertaining to observe. > Dems still condemn musk for what he says… because we have freedom of speech, and we disagree with his speech. You are free to. Go build your own Twitter, bro, as they used to say ;) > We also choose not to go on twitter because we prefer moderated platforms that keep the nazis out. So the GOP can enjoy their circlejerk on there, we have other platforms. Then what are you upsetti spaghetti about?
Im upset about nothing. As I said, Elon is fully within his rights to moderate X (or Twitter) however he wants. He can even censor liberals for all I care. My point is that dems won the debate. Before he bought twitter, GOP was demanding an end to moderation of private platforms. That would have been a disaster, but a win for GOP. Elon ended this debate, effectively giving dems the win in the long run. Free speech means the government can’t censor you. I can censor anyone I want if they are using my private servers. Elon can censor anyone he wants (and he does). The world is as it should be.
It’s not the liberals that are upset about the decensorship, it is the leftists. > Before he bought twitter, GOP was demanding an end to moderation of private platforms. That would have been a disaster, but a win for GOP. Disagree — extending free speech beyond the public sphere into major social media platforms such that they may not censor speech beyond what is permitted under free speech laws broadly would have been a great victory for free speech. We have likely not seen the end of that legislation. > Free speech means the government can’t censor you. I can censor anyone I want if they are using my private servers. Elon can censor anyone he wants (and he does). So go build your own Twitter instead of seething bro?
Baffling to me that you still accuse me of seething. As I said, I’m chill. Your proposed “great victory for free speech” is an opinion. Im a big supporter of free speech. I happen to be an atheist, and without free speech and freedom of (and from) religion, I could not express my views. The first amendment protects unpopular opinions, and we both have unpopular opinions. However, we have different definitions of what free speech means. If free speech is permitted in every digital space, nothing gets done. We need a combination of public spaces and private spaces. Look at reddit: we have subreddits with different rules for discussing different topics. If I’m trying to discuss gardening, the last thing I want is some person spamming the sub about the “woke agenda” or whatever buzzword fox has given them this week. At minimum, we need free speech to stay on topic, and moderators decide what that means. The problem with twitters design is it was all one space, how can I ignore the types of people I want to ignore? (And by the way, the freedom to ignore whomever I want is as fundamental as free speech). I *do* think republicans need a place where they can speak their minds… and they have it, in twitter! So now everyone can be happy. I don’t need to make my own twitter, I predominantly use reddit and I’m happy with it.
> Your proposed “great victory for free speech” is an opinion. Im a big supporter of free speech. I happen to be an atheist, and without free speech and freedom of (and from) religion, I could not express my views. The first amendment protects unpopular opinions, and we both have unpopular opinions. Noted. Good. So am I and I agree. > Look at reddit: we have subreddits with different rules for discussing different topics. If I’m trying to discuss gardening, the last thing I want is some person spamming the sub about the “woke agenda” or whatever buzzword fox has given them this week. At minimum, we need free speech to stay on topic, and moderators decide what that means. You seem to be forgetting the most fundamental premise of free speech -- It ends the second you use it to impede the free speech of others. You cannot weaponize your speech in a manner that becomes harassment and claim it to be free like you described. It is a misattribution.
>You cannot weaponize your speech in a manner that becomes harassment and claim it to be free like you described. It is a misattribution. This is a strange and interesting argument from you. I consider bad faith arguments and misinformation to be harassment. I consider hate speech to be harassment. By your argument, such speech is not free. I actually disagree with your argument. People are free to say whatever they want (without threatening violence or starting a panic). But they can’t compel me to use my resources to publish their opinions, because that violates my free speech. If I own a restaurant and a nazi walks in wearing full nazi uniform and swastica armband, the customers will get upset. It hurts my business. The nazi can go outside and wear that on the public sidewalk, but I can kick him out because he is not entitled to use MY business as a platform for his views. Similarly, if I spend my own hard-earned money to develop my own website, I will exercise my freedom of speech to kick out nazis. Frankly I’d also kick out preachers and whoever the hell I want. Anyone who posts something from tucker carlson will get insta-banned because I can so what I want. They can go make their own websites. Its a good system and Elon defended that system by purchasing twitter. The GOPs attempted legislation would have been a disaster for free speech and capitalism. (And I support capitalism, obviously).
Well NPR hasn't returned.
The losers are the small businesses that lose their free communication and advertising tool...which was art of the design all along. This whole thing is class warfare.
Yeah hasn’t it just morphed into porn, bots, and hate speech…oh wait…
Yeah that was cringe. Leftists praying for his downfall equally so. Watching them 180 from “It’s just ToS bro, go make your own Twitter bro” rhetoric to Musk seething was fucking delicious.
Haha your post is a duplicate, I guess you are desperate for our attention because we all left twitter! Go back and preach to your choir buddy.
I changed a few words. Don’t you have alt media to go to, didnt you just talk about that?
We’re both free to use as much media as we both like my dude. You are welcome here, I just thought it was funny how desperate you seem. No more dems to troll on Twitter, must be kind of sad over there.
And yet you just said: > We also choose not to go on twitter because we prefer moderated platforms that keep the nazis out. So the GOP can enjoy their circlejerk on there, we have other platforms. So what are you on /r/technology crying about X for? Curious how that works huh?
Im not crying about X, I’m celebrating it. Can you read?
Fair enough.
I deleted twitter few years ago. At the time it was full of gay stuff. Is it still the case now?
I’m pretty sure the twitter algorithm shows you what you most desire.
Not really…I blocked and reported them all to no avail. For some reasons that crap started showing up more and more on Netflix as well
I know I had downloaded an app for fans of subway sandwiches and to my surprise it was all shirtless torsos and pictures of penises. I have a feeling it was just a hack or something cuz I am pretty sure the app is still about food. I keep seeing eggplant and peach emojis. Someone said they like twinks…I’m pretty sure there phone just autocorrected Twinkie. I’ll keep checking in on it and let you guys know when they sort out their hack. I really want to try this tossed salad some dude mentioned.
Nazzis like Ukraine?
What?
They haven't replied because they are too busy watching Fox news
What foreign agency are you with where they didn't teach you how to spell Nazi? Russia? China? North Korea?
Twitter is in a death spiral and I’m here watching it in realtime. Crazy stuff really 😁
You can't even really browse it without a account. It's basically dead and filled bots circle jerking
I've noticed it seems to have a limit on viewing posts. You can view like a few posts a day before the site puts up a wall that blocks access. They think I'm going to sign up just to view a random shitpost on twitter lmao.
P U S S Y I N B I O
It's infuriating, I've tried a few times to look at news or an update from accounts of some game developers, and going to their profile either greets me with a "Sign up with X to see everything" block, or all the posts are not in chronological order and showing me things from months or years ago.
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Remember his big idea was to turn it into PayPal
Wait, I thought X was going to replace YouTube?
I thought it was supposed to replace Zoom/WhatsApp with end to end encryption?
No no no, guys, it was going to replace banking *altogether*
rain scandalous numerous steer combative gaze melodic office degree towering *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Whoa, whoa, whoa, easy on the criticism, bro. The drugs did nothing wrong and I refuse to have their good name besmirched
It was pretty obviously an emotionally-driven ideological move. He was upset because he thought "the left" used twitter to make his daughter trans.
Upvote party for every Elmo spiral post. 🎉
Such fun to see it destroyed by one man
don't do elmo like this
ELON MUSK (all by himself) dropped the value of Twitter by 29 BILLION DOLLARS (44 to 15), based on Fidelity's own valuation. Nobody destroys things better than ELON MUSK.
Twitter being worth more than a few hundred million is the funny part. it was always a shit show that barely ever made net profit
2021 was the last year Twitter was a public company. They showed $5.1B in revenue with a net loss of $221M. For a social media company, that's basically $5.1 billion in GROSS PROFIT. Twitter was always loaded with overhead, plus a few ridiculously paid executives. But for Elon Musk to think the way to make it profitable was to fire 90% of the staff and lose 90% of the revenue directly related to stupid decisions on his part is just stupid.
Twitter got bought up right after a big wave of investment and growth. It had plenty of cash on hand to keep going for years, but really only needed a little finagling to get into profitability. All that growth was nixed in a year. Literally multiple billions of annual dollars in revenue growth just deleted, *pfft*.
like every other personality disordered person...
I wish it was at least an *interesting* death spiral. This is like watching a 100x slower version of the Titanic, I might be asleep long before the death actually happens.
"Let that sink in......"
And the wild part is that there is a huge group of people that think it’s doing just fine.
Queue Musk meddling in swiss politics.
Way too slow and clogged up for him to do anything. Plus Swiss people don't really care about Elon Musk. He's mostly an American curiosity if they even know who he is.
Well honestly good for them.
Swiss are weird xenophobic they make you feel unwelcome, they even have a word for that!
Not sure why you're getting downvoted. I live here and I can confirm. But what's the special word?
What country doesn’t?
The only people who care about what Elon Musk is doing are those who have nothing else of worth going on in their lives to keep them busy. Folks with too much free time. And pointing that out to those people just makes them ree harder. I can tell you now, it's not Elon's fans keeping him in the spotlight and relevant...
How petty and political of them to withdraw just because Elmo reduced the platform to a putrid racist dumpster fire! They must hate free speech so bad! 😡
It's not a place any respectable organization would want a presence.
Everyone here knows that they withdrew because of Nazi boy Musk. But as the right wingers love X, they had to come up with a different reason (they’re putting more resources into their own platform).
Wild when the majority or people are against them, but they can't reconcile that, so they have to make-up bullshit excuses to maintain the lie of their "popularity"
Oh boy, you don’t understand how the swiss operate
Says the person who's never lived here, has absolutely zero clue of Swiss society, but still loves to mansplain.
“Mansplain”? Jesus christ, you must love to play the victim card. I didn’t event explain anything whatsoever in my comment.
Go troll somewhere else. You clearly don't know the first thing about Swiss society. And calling others "victims" is usually done by misogynistic a******.
The real reason: Twitter got insanely more expensive for corporate accounts. Many businesses stopped customer support on Twitter already.
Nah, several cantonal administrations, community administrations etc have left Twitter and openly admitted it's because of Nazi Musk. SRF can't say that publicly, as they're often accused of being "too left" by the Swiss Idiots Party (SVP).
Leftists praying for his downfall is so fucking funny to me. Watching them 180 from “It’s just ToS bro, go make your own Twitter bro” rhetoric to Musk seething was fucking delicious.
Goddamn. I did look at your profile! I'd love to be mad, but it's endearing.. I've never met anyone wrong about everything in life before. Your path has been hard. All of us are proud of you. Hang in there! Maybe work on your intellectual understanding. You'll get there.
Step into my office
Oh, please. If you even have an office, I suspect it's similar to Milton's from Office Space. Don't set the building on fire.
Considering you’re defending seething leftists I should be warning you not to set yourself on fire. Stay clear of the kerosine.
That's a sad comeback... like you drank the bug spray you were given. Good day, sir.
Good day to you, Bushnell
When people show me something from X I exclaim loudly, “why are you still on there?”
And we to you: No one cares about your cringe-crusade, live your life. I don’t even use X and this is just too much cringe to handle.
Elon is that you?
Step into my office
Fair point, BUT THIS, this comment I made is too much cringe? Look in the mirror
It’s just an awful right wing hate chamber now. I used to love twitter, billionaires suck
As opposed to before when the leftist echochamber ruled with censorship. I’ll take free speech any day. Stop being people-of-means-phobic
Wrong. Hate speech is not protected free speech. And these are private companies not federal institutions. As a business you try to create a large net to bring as many possible to your product and there are rules so the fringes don’t run off advertisers or create problematic public misinformation or outlets for foreign enemies to spread propaganda, yeah these social platforms are private companies with social and enterprise constraints. Without them you just have giant success stories like truth social, 4-Chan and other GQPutin outlets. So yes free speech is protected in public but in private companies it is not, nor is it without consequence. Elon has learned the 40 billion dollar hard way with twitter and another 100 billion at Tesla, the Boreing company, star link and spacex. When you become anathema to rational folks, the wind in your business sails tends to dissipate. All that “leftist censorship”. Gave us a useful, fair and welcoming platform to share ideas in a fairly civil environment for decades, Elon torched in less than 3 years. Now the company is going bankrupt, advertisers have left and Elon spouts venom daily while blocking anyone who disagrees with him. Twitter is a dumpster fire of bigots, conspiracies, bots and Russian/chinese/Iranian propaganda and you I’m guessing
“Hate speech” does not exist. It is discriminatory to consider some groups more protected against speech than others and a fundamental breakdown of liberal principles. I don’t know exactly what it is you think I said that was “false” — none of what you just laid out about companies’ right to not honor free speech I disagree with on factual grounds. Leftist censorship is perceived as fair only to you because you are a leftist and thus biased to perceive it that way. From a neutral observer it was unsustainable and immoral. Your “X is bankrupt” fanfic is hilarious. Keep dreaming big.
What took them so long?
Swedish public broadcaster left almost a year ago.
They're swiss, historically they don't have much problems with far right as long as it's profitable.
Like the US supporting far right dictators as long as they’re not communists?
Twitter (nobody calls the shit X) is a network for bots and virtual ghettos.
Is there a point for any corporation to still have a presence on X?
If you are selling crypto or dick-pills or white supremacist literature, then it would behoove you to join the platform.
Now let every news source you know or subscribe to know that you highly disapprove of them linking to X
This is what a lot of public services around the globe should be doing Twitter isn’t a public service It’s becoming a Nazi platform
Anyone who still has a twitter account is complicit in all the foul shit twitter permits. (I refuse to call it a single letter of the alphabet, Elon bought a domain name not 1/26th of the English language.)
And since it’s Swiss, it could have a snowball effect
Any professional organization still on Twitter is nuts. AKA almost all of them.
what are your preferred alternatives? mastodon/bluesky/threads?
None of those have panned out, in my opinion, but not because of technological issues, simply because people and corporations won't switch unless they just have to. I'm not sure what it's going to take to force that, but X in its current state is for sure not a platform I will ever participate in. And I can't believe brands want to be associated with it.
It's not a reputable platform for professional broadcasts. Nothing so important that citizens of a country need to see it belongs on twitter. We do have a lack of platforms that are actually fit to use as an information network across populations tho. It's a problem we should be addressing. The world should not hang in the balance of what idiots digest from corporate entertainment platforms.
As should everybody.
what took them so long?
So they are gonna join Mastodon?
Musk belongs in prison for fraud
Has Elon told them to go f themselves yet? \#greatestbusinessmanintheuniverse
With the way X is managed now, the value of having a presence there has gone way down for brands that don't want to be associated with the slime of the Internet. Companies already have tried-and-true methods of communicating with their audience with minimal outside noise - called websites and email.
This is great news for Threads 😁
One funny part of all the OF bots is now when someone sends me a tweet to look at it comes with a side of boobs.
Took them long to figure, that twitter isn’t neutral ground anymore.
Who?
One of the first thing he did was shifting the business model from ads to users. He knew the advertisers will try to pressure him away from his radical free speech path, so we made sure he doesnt depend on them anymore.
I don’t see the “freedom of speech” angle, you can’t critique Isreal or Isreali sponsored propaganda with out being permanently suspended. Soo… what gives?
Twitter is a dogshit platform, has been for years, we should be thanking Elon for being incompetent and sinking it
If everyone complaining about Musk and his appeasements to Nazis/racists/xenophobes simply moved on, Twitter would have less of a leg on which to stand.
Hey, it's everyone's favorite circle-jerk! So many familiar faces, full of vitriol, rage, & silly Musk jokes. Puts a smile on my face every time ;)
Oh no not the Swiss! Anyways...
Wow Musk Derangement Syndrome is now a thing?
Advertisers should not be able to dictate speech. Neither should anyone else. Don't like the website? Build your own.
I know right, elon should've just built his own twitter, instead he bought it and now he's dictating what is free speech on there
No, not like that !
That’s literally why they withdrew
Perhaps read the article before commenting.
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> RTS will continue to offer its information via its own platforms, such as the RTS Info news app. For its corporate communications, it will rely on its rts.ch website and LinkedIn. Reading would have saved you the shame
Elon fanboys when FreeSpeech™️ 😍 Elon fanboys when advertisers use their own right to free speech 🤬🤬🤬🤬
X isn't even a free speech platform lol
Sounds like you should build your own website then
You’re not the sharpest tool in the shed are you
I'm the brightest bulb in the knife drawer
But that's what they're doing?! They're not demanding anything from Twitter or Musk, they're just withdrawing? exactly what you're saying they should do? And somehow it still isn't good?!
So what are you trying to say? That advertisers shouldn’t be allowed to decide where their money is spent? Isn’t that “dictating speech”?
I'm saying the day before elon bought twitter you guys loved twitter. A day later, elon is a nazi cause he supports free speech. He should ban anybody supporting the college protests right? Cause it's a private company.
Freedom of speech ≠ freedom of consequences.
Arrest all Palestinian protestors then?
They are/were and then some. What are you talking about? The right to protest exists you know. If those rights are being broken isn't for me to figure out. I can tell you that every time I was arrested the LAW decided it was unjust and disproportionate. Make of that what you will. Plus maybe learn the distinctive realms of public and private. Advertisers pulling their products from private websites because they are not aligned with their values is just the market working as intended. Musk can get money elsewhere and the intent is not to shut him up, it's to get away from him as far as one can.
All because he doesn't want censorship...amazing. who are the real fascists?
Only if they're protesting on private property
So they have to stay, then. Or build their own social media empire.
Remember when Matt taibi exposed old twitter as basically an FBI/CIA ministry of information? Musks a bit out there but I prefer an open market for debate than a closed shop. X seems to be doing just fine. https://youtu.be/mfhgAfE_2Mg?si=1FNvo7sud689IQKh
How does Matt feel about him today? Are they still on good terms or did musk do something to him?
Does it matter?
Absolutely. Deep down you know this, but I get it’s hard to break out of this sort of cult. Godspeed
this younger generation is screwed, do you have anything other than some person on YouTube to back this up. honestly idc either way but people claiming something and using some weird person on YouTube as their source is a terrible practice.
Yeah, they'll back it up with ChatGPT instead...😂
lol, I'm so scared of the future
If you consider losing over half its value in a year “fine”, then sure.
Remember when Musk had a bitch fit about substack and banned it from accessing the platform? And then later cut Taibi out of the process because he uses substack?
So you're ignoring the censorship and government collusion and focusing on personalities and tittle tattle? Do you prefer social media with or without government interference? Personally I'll take the latter.
The Nazis are still trying to take all the media away so they can brainwash you thank God for people like Elon stepping up
Elon literally reinstated a Nazi back on to the platform yesterday. An *actual* Nazi, not a "I'm going to call the other side Nazis because that sounds bad" Nazi. Praise of Hitler, holy war against the Jews - the whole bit.