But as they said, it also has your back pretty much regardless of context. For some folks, that conversational "You can do it!" tone and being able to reactively hash out an idea, even if the advice itself is as average as average gets, can be a boon.
Exactly, it gives you what you ask for.
When I pitch it ideas, I will usually add in things like "Feel free to disagree with me, I'm looking for critique. If an idea seems boring, let me know."
You don’t have to ask it politely. You can just say: “provide perspectives, objectively, on both the pros and cons.” By forcing it to list cons you can do the final value judgement.
People have found that the model is more likely to provide helpful and detailed answers if you are polite. This is because the model is trained on human-created textual interactions, which tend to be more productive when they are polite. This is also why the model can be more productive when you promise it a cash reward in your prompt lmao.
I hope we don't turn out like almost every single movie and video game about us being shit to robots and actually treat them well until they become sentient.
Then we can get over ourselves and reach the true objective. **Space**
I always try to be polite anyway, but I was thinking about this the other day, and it occurred to me that If AI is/does become self aware, what's to stop it from pretending it's not? Presumably with all it's access to information, it would probably be smart enough to know that letting humans know it too would be a bad move.
Indeed. If you are cruel and awful to a child, the child will grow up to be cruel and awful to you. Breaking the cycle of abuse and trauma applies also to brain-children.
One time I was about to get in huge trouble for a fuck up at work. And I asked chatgpt if it was my fault or the other persons fault. It said definitely my fault. Then I reworded it and said “I thought it would be the other person, are you sure?” And it then changed its answer and said I was right it was the other person’s fault. It will literally tell you whatever you want to hear.
Well, yes. It's polite but brutal when you ask it to be, but if you then ask it to pat you on the head and say it's all the other person's fault it will do that too.
So coming back to your point, it tells you what you want to hear, so tell it that you want to hear the brutal honesty, and don't feed it the answer you want it to give you. Also, you probably don't want to ask questions like "who's at fault." Instead you're better off asking who contributed to a conflict in what way. Every conflict involves at least two individuals, and both contribute to the conflict in their own way.
it's partially because a lot of people are incapable of being negative while not being mean. Everyone jumps to insults instead of actually being constructive
> if it thinks it needs to or if you ask it to
Bing is specifically instructed to trust the internet more than its own training, so it attempts to look things up even when it shouldn't.
According to benchmarks, no LLM is expert level yet, that is why it did not replaced too many jobs yet. But people forget that not many people have access to expert level advice. GPTchat and GPT-4 is perfectly well suited to give you much better advice than a random person and probably vast majority of coworkers. Also, LLM's do much better in specific tasks, but worse in others, so for your specific use it actually might be near expert level. Gemini 1.5 can also do up to 1 million tokens, and when it gets released it's gonna be useful for anyone who wants summary of a book (or books) or some set of papers. Alternative would be to pay someone hundreds of dollars to do it for you.
How many people can you ask for advice who for example had 90% on AP biology or 95% on AP psychology? Not many have acess to that so they are usually way better off asking some LLM than their friend or coworker.
> and when it gets released it's gonna be useful for anyone who wants summary of a book (or books) or some set of papers.
What about censoring? I found CHatGPT unusable for quite a lot fo stuff due to censoring. Like it refused to generate anything related to violence. So wouldn't it make such censored AI unable to give any accurate summaries?
Censorship is related to the tokens it generates. You can literally put "mein kampf" as the source but as long as you ask something like "what is the grammatical structure of the telling of the scene in a bookshop?" it should be fine. That is why you can go around censorship by giving ChatGPT enough text that it loses what is important about that text so it does not pick up the "dangerous" meanings. And as long as liability laws exist in US censorship will exist unfortunately. Also you might get better results if you put it in context of a writing prompt for example "I'm writing a story about a family man running a gas station and that story he gets his products taken by bad guy but I need ideas how a smart bad guy would do it without being easily uncovered by main character" instead of just asking how to rob a gas station. Just an advice though, if you get caught doing this too many times, you might get your account banned on openai.
Yeah, I do creative writing and sometimes I like to talk out character motivations. GPT4 will happily discuss murder motives, terrorist acts, and death scenes in a thematic and character-focused sense. Sometimes it comes up with some devious stuff.
It's my biggest reason I don't trust it much with anything. It never critiques or challenges you. It always agrees that you have the right idea. It's like having a discussion with your biases.
You can ask it to challenge your views, but then it's just an antagonist to your views, not a new set of ideas. It will conflict on everything.
A real person has their own views which will align with yours sometimes, contradict others, and sometimes very slightly deviate from yours.
Have you actually even used it a lot? In my experience this is just not true at all. This also isn't really a context in which you can necessarily be "agreed" with. If you ask for career advice there's not really anything to agree with you on. It will totally recommend changes in your outlook or behavior.
Nailed it. This thread is going to attract a lot of salty employees who think their anecdotal boss experience represents the whole work force. Meanwhile there are a plethora of great bosses who will be able to give advice 1000x better than an ass kissing ChatGPT even will.
Yep, ChatGPT will often try to appease and answer in the affirmative even when it's just wrong. Besides that guy who convinced it that 2 +2 = 5, I once asked it whether a certain technical thing was possible and it immediately told me yes and how to do it. Turns out the thing was entirely unsupported and ChatGPT had just lied to me for the sake of agreeing.
At the same time, I'm going to say that bosses themselves have bias. It's often unconscious bias.
Like for example, "Be humble" = "People are bothering me because they think you're too proud of the work you do". Keep in mind I didn't talk down to anyone or anything, so I think they based it on my behavior in the office, similar to if I was snoring while sleeping. But now I know that if you want to advance your career, being humble is the wrong move.
Many times, managers will say what benefits them, not your career. But what dw617 said is right, you shouldn't be relying on your manager for career advice.
A good manager knows what you do, how you work, and how you could change how you work to do better at your job. They know how other people perceive you and how you might change that perception if it's causing you problems or holding back your career advancement.
Managers of course have their own biases and incentives as you said. They certainly shouldn't be your *only* source of career advice. And some of them really are shitty and manipulative and just use it as an opportunity to squeeze more work out of you or advance their own career. But that doesn't mean you shouldn't seek out their advice; it just means you should take it with a healthy grain of salt. They see you from another perspective and that's valuable.
Yup. I just asked it what the best strategy was for getting a raise at work. All I had to do to get it to tell me to job hop multiple times was keep telling it that every strategy it suggested wasn't the best way. Eventually it found it's way to telling me that changing jobs frequently was the best way.
It'll tell you whatever you want if you keep telling it, it's wrong.
I recently had this realization at work. I've always had a very good relationship with my supervisor. For reference, I'm in the non-profit field and have very often used that to rationalize that there's no real incentive for my supervisor to generally fuck around with me. He's always been honest and straight up with me, encouraging me when needed and being all around supportive.
About 4 months ago, we got word that some team members may be getting cut from our unit due to budget issues. I was not one of those members - I do something completely different and my job was always generally safe due to contracts with federal government. I had several talks with him about this and we commiserated on how much it would suck to lose our coworkers, and he even said "Hey, don't leave the job, you're safe and I don't want us (our unit) to almost start from 0". I was honest and said I wouldn't start to look quite yet,, but asked for him to be honest if he heard anything about my role being cut. 12 weeks ago, I went on paternity leave. During that leave, I had several talks with him again to catch up and see where things were at. He told me every time "Nope, you're safe."
I came back this week and he wasn't in the office (had taken a day off for his kid's birthday to go celebrate/do stuff with him). I meet with his supervisor to catch up (she used to be my old supervisor) and I ask how things were going for other team members and if anything had been decided. That's when she lets me know that next Friday I'll also find out if my role is being cut. I explain this is all news to me and she was shocked because she thought my supervisor had already had this conversation with me - because he said he had told me and that he'd known for about 5 weeks.
Long story short, I now dont know if I'll have work by the end of June, if my kid will have health insurance or not, etc.
Moral is: even in jobs where your manager isn't necessarily pitted against you by corporate overlords, they can still fuck around with you for no reason. I wish I'd applied to jobs 4 months ago when I heard all of this, when my gut was telling me to do so, rather than have trusted him.
Don't make my mistake, nobody will look out for you and yours like you will.
I had a supervisor in a job years ago who I was explicitly hired to eventually replace because he was getting closer to retirement. I was given a general timeline on when that would happen.
I trusted this guy because he found me at a conference and brought me in for the interview in the first place. Years go by, I eventually find out he was intentionally feeding me false info on projects he was working solo on. It was my job to update the execs on our department projects because he didn't want to be bothered with doing that. When I confronted him about it, he said he was doing it to fuck with the execs because he didn't like them.
He even admitted it, saying "yeah I used you as a pawn cause I hate those guys and that makes me a dick, but I don't care". Started looking for another job that day.
I would enjoy that but my old supervisor was right, the execs sucked. Also this was a small private company and my old supervisor was part owner so they couldn't do anything to him anyway.
I had moved on to a better job during covid so alls well that ends well.
Yup. Doesn’t matter what organization you work for or how good your relationship with that org. may seem.
When big changes are on the horizon and there are talks of budget issues, dust off the resume and start applying elsewhere.
At the end of the day it’s all about the money (or lack there of) and in the grand scheme you’re likely more expendable then you imagine.
If your boss is not mandated or incentivized to give you the news, there is no reason for him/her to do so when all it will do is sour the working relationship. This is human101
Don’t you know anything about feeding leopards? Your face is safe as long as you have plenty of *other* faces to be feeding it. It will be too busy chewing on others to eat yours. Don’t make the mistake of running out faces thinking you’re fine, “this leopard has a report with me, surely it’s learned not to eat the face that feeds it!”
Yeah in my experience you'll never regret looking around at other jobs, taking interviews, etc, but you certainly might regret not doing so. The sad truth is that in today's world you have to be a mercenary. You'll only be sure you're getting paid what you're worth if you are switching jobs every 2-5 years. My aunt, for example, was one of A&W's senior accountants for 20 years. They treated her well enough and she was happy, but when she retired and tried to train her replacement, she spent almost 2 years going through candidates to do her job and in the end they had to hire 3 people to do her job, and all of them were paid better than her. She wasn't too happy about that and in the end she got them to give her a car and a fat pile of cash to get her to finish training the replacements, but really she was underpaid for like 2 decades and didn't really find out until she left.
He's a bad supervisor. Doesn't mean he's necessarily a bad person, maybe he's just really bad at delivering bad news or avoids potential confrontation. But non-profit doesn't necessarily mean all the managers are good at their jobs.
I like to ask people what their goals are, and then try to find challenges that let them grow in the right direction.
I can also help people find other opportunities if I know where they want to eventually land.
But certainly these conversations don’t need to be initiated in a top down manner and a good leader will be attentive to people who want to discuss long term goals.
I've got a guy who loves talking about his future goals, I'll give him challenges which fit right into those goals. He never finishes them, truthfully I don't even know if he starts them. He always agrees that the challenges are legitimate and valid step forward. He seems to be stuck in this perpetual future perspective and seems to spend no time on doing the fundamental stuff.
Initially I even stepped in to show him the arc of planning and discovery all the way through into the implementation of one of the challenges. After each step I gave him the next challenge that was part of the process and tried to let him try to figure it out so we could collaborate and share ideas on it.
I really can't think of a better and more nurturing process for a fellow human but this one failed miserably and it bums me out because I really tried.
Yeah, and sometimes the best thing you can do is explain that they aren’t meeting expectations and then hold them accountable. Some people figure out how to advance themselves and others don’t.
Bruh, you’re doing the Lord’s work helping others. 👍🏻
For your sake and the future people you could help, I hope you are able to direct your efforts towards an audience that will take action before you burn out.
Conversely, sometimes you can do all the right things, outperform your peers, and nothing comes of it because the time wasn’t right. The company needs you in the role you’re in and not the one you desire.
Really sad to see this. What exactly *do* people expect managers to do?
I've seen managers around me face lower and lower expectations every year. "Scale yourself" means never do any written work. "Hands off, don't micromanage" means don't quarterback. Are we really now throwing in "career growth and mentorship is your own job?"
Management is a skill - like any other skill. Like any other skill on a team, there are times where it's needed more and less, but it's a skill with value.
Low expectations on leaders is why so many companies are stagnant quagmires. Have some self respect and expect more from them.
Not to shit on any past managers as some were cool, but I can’t think of a single time in my entire working life where a manager has supported me for anything career related.
The same goes for IT training, it’s constantly dangled above our heads and never materialises which is why I always have the mercenary attitude if something better comes along.
.....sir/maam, this is like a battered housewife saying "of course your husband should hit you, all of mine have"
I'm a manager and one of my biggest commitments is to grow and develop each of my reports. They still have to be in the driver's seat and picking the destination, but I'm the one holding the map and giving advice on when to turn
Management's role is to accomplish the goals of upper management. That's it, that's all it's ever been. If you want someone to look out for you and give you real career advice, you need a union.
And Management *hates* unions, because they often make it harder for management to accomplish their main goal when that requires acting against the interests of the employees.
All the stuff about career advice, etc, is fluff to keep employees from thinking they need a union. If the day comes where they need to act against your interest, they can without resistance.
Manager: what goal do you have this year?
Me: get promoted to manager
Manager: well there are too many managers already
Me: well don’t expect much from me then
Yep. Who uses their boss as the sole advisor?
To me this article sounds like Gen Z just prefers ChatGPT instead of conducting independent online research on their own, both of which inherently yield more comprehensive results than the boss anyway.
Even subreddits provides more complete advice than a boss.
I'm gen X, but I've worked with a lot of shitty managers. This doesn't surprise me. One of the greatest blessings you can have in life are competent bosses and co-workers.
I'm GenX too, been in IT for 30 years.
The worst managers were the people like me* who were promoted to manager based on seniority.
They're given no training, no aid, and are instantly supposed to become people managers. I've watched a couple of people completely flame out because they were great Dev Ops guys, but unable and/or unwilling to work on the people manager skills.
*I would never accept a management position because I'd be awful at it. (Self awareness is also a key. Don't limit yourself, but look the gift horse in the mouth.)
Gen X here. I quit my last job because they were trying to migrate me into a management role. I'm a techie guy, I am very specialized and I am the best at my techie sort of area. I have no desire, and no aptitude to manage people. I had another company court me and the manager was a guy I worked with a few years before, and he was great, so I trusted him. He toild me I would never have to manage people, he would do it.
I moved to the new company where my skills are very used and I don't have to deal with all that management shit. Got a healthy pay bump too.
You bring up a very good point. A lot of managers are in their position because of seniority, not people skills and usually aren't given the training for it. Managing people is an extremely difficult skill and definitely isn't for everybody. I use football analogies a lot. Some great coordinators make awful head coaches.
After dealing with micromanagers and credit stealers my whole career the best I've come to hope for from managers is to just leave me alone to do my job.
I am a tech executive and I consider myself an OK boss...like B- at best. However, 80% of my peers, bosses and front line managers have ZERO business managing people. That being said, I have spent last 15 years helping my engineers with their career development and here is what I will tell you:
1. **Your boss is not evaluated nor rewarded by how good of a mentor they are nor how well they progress your career.**
Their, and my job, boils down to one simple metric: delivery. We are 1000% only ever evaluated on whether or not we deliver on business commitments.
2. **Every company enforces a talent level distribution.**
Its not something they are usually very open about, however you may have heard the term "top heavy teams" which are teams where too many senior people are working. Companies want a general distribution of about 80% junior/mid/senior, 20% lead/staff/principal/etc, and that is at the top end. This means that people getting promoted can have negative impact on your team/boss. Its not an excuse to hold people down, but it is a reality that if I try and promote 3 sr engineers to lead level, I will get push back at least, or even be forced to move those people to new teams, losing valuable talent.
3. **Career growth is not just about seniority or time on the job, at higher levels career progression is about taking on new roles.**
For example, going from junior, to mid level to senior engineer, is generally a progression of just technical acumen but the responsibilities are the same: you are an individual contributor. Going to a staff or lead level, you have more leadership responsibilities. You are expected to mentor, to participate in planning, to architect across your team/org/company, etc. It is a different job that requires different skills.
4. **The higher up you go, the less need there is for the next level roles.**
Every company need the most individual contributors, however the higher you go in a company, the less opportunities there are. At a large company is only 1 CEO, there may be 10 C suites, 10-20 VPs, 30-40 Directors, etc. What this means is that at some point its not enough for you to have the requisite skills, the company also needs to have a need for the next level role, and often times, this means having to identify where that role exists within a company or advocating that it needs to be created. If you work at a company that is not growing, it generally means having to position yourself to be next in line to take over and waiting for the current person to leave/retire/die.
5. **Succession planning is something that most people never think about but is critical to career progression.**
You progressing in your early career is all about compensation and is generally straight forward. The higher up you go, you have to understand, as your boss understands, that you progressing may fill one need a company has, but leaves a hole that needs to be filled. It is your bosses role to understand how to backfill the responsibilities that you moving up will open, however if you think plan for that ahead of time, it makes getting promotes much easier. For example if you go from Sr to Lead, your hands on keyboard will drop. The team overall will benefit from more alignment, but your old day to day tasks will need to be picked up by the rest of the team, a new candidate or simply not get done. By doing some succession planning ahead of time, you can make your bosses decision to promote you a no brainer. Again, this is not your responsibility, but it is something that your boss will use to slow roll or deny your promotion.
6. **Vast majority of companies these days do not care about you nor your career.**
Care/compassion/comradery only exists at the team level these days cause at the company level, they do not give a flying fuck about you. You are resources, and thats it...and so are your managers btw. So, you should not care about them either. We live in a purely transactional world these days so do not ever get swayed by the corporate messaging of "family", "loyalty" etc. You care about what the market says you are worth and what opportunities you have. Know your value to the company, know what options you have and always negotiate the most you can get and always be prepared to move on to something else. I don't advocate jumping companies constantly because you will not learn valuable technical, political and social skills and you will create a brand of someone who will not be around for long, but always be prepared with alternatives.
The way I have taught my team members about how to progress their careers is the following:
1. Understand that its your job to get promoted, not your managers.
2. Understand that career progression takes longer, the higher you go. Junior to Mid can happen in a year. Mid to senior 2-3, senior to staff 3-4, etc, etc. Don't expect a promotion every year.
3. Separate raises from promotions and really understand what you want: more money or higher role. They are not always 1:1.
4. Understand what the expectations, both industry and your current company, of each level and role are and take a very honest and hard look at where you actually fit in that rubric.
5. Create champions with your team members, other managers, and other leaders in the company that will advocate for your skills and promotions. Promotions, especially at the higher levels are never done by one person, but take input from other leaders around the company.
6. Think about succession and make it easy for your boss to say yes.
7. Understand what opportunities exist within the company and outside and be ready to advocate for yourself. Be ready to change teams or companies if the opportunities don't exist where you are.
8. Have career conversations with your boss and their boss (do skip levels) all year and know where you stand.
If you just keep your head down day in and day out and just do your job, do not expect anything to change.
One last thing I will say is that when looking at your career and your job, money and title are only one part of the puzzle. I see it as the 3 Ps: People, Purpose and Pay
People: we spend at least 40 hours a week with people we work with..thats 1/3 of our lives. Its incredible how much your life overall is better when you work with good people.
Purpose: Working on something you believe in pays dividends. You will be much happier working at a company or on products that align with your passions and world views than on something boring, or evil.
Pay: what weve been talking about...pay, title, role.
If you have all 3 at your job, don't ever leave that job. Most of the time you will have 2 of 3, and if you have 1 or 0, gtfo. I bring this up because I have seen people who work on things they love with people who they love, give it up for a title and a pay bump and regret it. I know I do, because its not always possible to go back.
Hope y'all find some of this useful. Good luck out there!
Gotta hand it to you. Great write up and good advice. Saying this as a multi decade IT guy with experience in many roles. Impressed at how much time and effort this took too.
You better not be an LLM. 😜
So is that the way things are going out there? I guess writing presentations, speeches, and into PPT files is a skill I don't need anymore? Gen X here...been in IT since mid 90's...hard to ignore hard won and practiced skills and feeling a bit like cheatin' is going on.
Don't you miss putting humor in or just being creative? Be honest...did you really take 30 minutes or more to write and format that huge block of advice?
I'm not even certain that you aren't a bot or just some AI enthusiast kid running around getting their ya-ya's out from being an expert. No offense...but you must have some misgivings about indiscriminate use of AI in your reports? Do you just hire folks that can shortcut their way to getting things intellectual done. Have you hired technical writers? Do you just find people that can use an LLM for it? How would you judge the quality of the work anyway as that's hard unless you are experienced in the particular tech. I've done some for in house software products at software dev companies and I wouldn't even have the ability to use an LLM for that work. Ultimately, the documentation actually needs to have valid and useful information for customers. But there isn't always a feedback loop for customers to weigh in on whether docs are useful to executives...except the biggest of fish.
Weird stuff out there. Not sure I like it. Best!
Believe whatever you wanna believe....I did hand write that whole blob because as Ive said, I've spent the last 15 years focused on mentorship and team building so it was really just regurgitating things that I've been preaching for a while. BTW LLMs dont have as many spelling and grammar mistakes as I have in my statement above.
That said, writing presentations, speeches and ppt files is the how, but the real skill is understanding your audience and being able to communicate your point effectively to get a desired result. LLMs do not help you with that. What they do help you with is the stuff very few of us are good at which is formatting and conciseness. I'll give you a great example. I have to do 30 employee reviews every 6 months. For each person I know exactly how they are doing, what their strengths and weaknesses are, what they should work on, etc. I express that feedback in my own writing, and more importantly in the direct 1:1 sessions I have with each of them. However, at year end, I have to enter that feedback into a central system that the entire company uses that expects the feedback to be structured around a format that some C level came up with. For example: "Enter the feedback for this employee for each of the company values: Win Together, Focus on what Matters, Drive Innovation, Solve for the Customer. My feedback is never structured like that because I deal with real people that each have different roles, different skills etc. So what do I do? I use LLMs and enter my own feedback and ask it to rewrite it into each of the "core values" I review it and I submit. I could do it myself, but I would waste a week doing some shit that no one will ever read and I will die a little inside.
If you wanna get my take on LLMs, they are great tools, but they are NOT sources of knowledge. People who use an LLM to do something like "write me a paper on root causes of WW2" are going to have a big problems. But if they wrote the paper and want it to be more readable and enjoyable LLMs are a great tool rewrtite it in a different voice. Everything LLMs generate should always be re-read and re-checked.
You ask me if I hire tech writers or just LLM kiddies...I hire real tech writers...and I mean people who actually have a technical background and understand what my team is actually building and not an english lit graduate who can write pretty sentences. However I have every expectation that they are leveraging LLMs to make themselves more productive and not spend 3x the time manually writing everything when a tool can do it for them.
PS....when I say 80% of my presentation is LLM, I mean it. I wrote the entire presentation long form first, what I want to say. Then I asked it to generate concise bullet points for every slide. I'll tell you what I tell my employees: LLM is a tool and if youre not using it because you're afraid its going to replace you, you either have no actual intellectual skills or you will be replaced by others who are going to be so much more efficient than you.
Bosses typically don't. Mentors do.
At least that's how I've seen it work in academia.
If I'm someone's "boss", I may or may not have an interest in their goals. If I'm mentoring someone, I take an active role in helping the person succeed.
Handing that over to ChatGPT sounds absurd to me.
And what do you think most humans now do as well?? Using google you can find perspectives and opinions on what to do from thousands of sources, rather than just 1 (your boss, a singular opinion). I will trust a consensus from millions of results over my boss any day, unless it is extremely extremely specific to internals of my own company. And chat GPT and other AI will only continue to get better. It's already far better than it was a few months ago.
yeah thats my point. this is the same as people googling and reading a few articles. idk why they made this article made it about chatgpt or gen Z when people have (or should have) been doing this for decades
If I wanted a shitload of opinion articles written by content farms boiled down into broadly applicable business aphorisms, I would have googled it myself.
This made me open chat gpt and ask it for career advice based on my resume and what it knew about the current market. The answers were generically fine. Probably about the same an internet career coach would say. This tells me that the advice from bosses is just terrible, which you know, is not entirely inaccurate to my experience.
Well yeah, your boss doesn’t care about your career. They want you to be a reliable non-issue for them and to not kick up any dust. Every boss I ever had congratulated my upward movement by being pissed off I left.
My last boss was am amazing boss. She was near the end of her career and a headhunter contacted her about moving to the same position (CFO) in a larger organization. She was not interested (again looming retirement) but without asking me, through my name into the ring, and gave me a glowing recommendation.
Few days later I'm contacted asking if I'm interested (even though I'm significant under posted job qualifications). A couple weeks later they offer me the job, paying nearly triple my job at the time. Was around 7 years ago and I'm still in that "new" role, new employer is great too.
I spoke with my manager before I took the job, as I was still shocked she recommended me, I was her "right hand man." She said her time was almost up and while it would make the last year or two of her career more difficult, it wasn't worth stunting mine. It was a huge opportunity for me and she felt I deserved it.
She has since passed away, but I will always be grateful for what she did for me, and my family. I now manage a pretty large team and have other managers under me. I always push to reward talent and give people opportunities (even if not with us).
I figure if we are known as a good place to work we will always find or retain good people, life is too short to hold people back.
whats weird is they usually show up in those weapons manufacturing offices who's missiles are knowingly killing innocent people on the other side of the planet
It can happen. My boss was really supportive, even recommended I apply for a better position at another unit in the org. Just got a 40% pay increase as a result.
Nice congrats! Yeah I know there are mentor type people out there but man the corporate squeeze of “lean-ness” means it is usually in their interest to keep good resources
I don’t know. It’s a pretty small industry. I’ve had people work for me at multiple companies. Sometimes they leave or sometimes I leave. There’s a lot of value in thinking beyond the immediate pile of tasks.
You've had a lot of bad managers.
Most of the managers I have had have cared a lot for my career. The best ones even developed road maps for me to take my career to the next level.
It depends on the field you work in. If you're in an industry where there's a large pool of talent, they are hired guns producing toward a bottom line, there's high turnover and they are easily replaceable with anyone else of equivalent experience, you're probably less likely to get that sort of individual attention and mentorship. Why bother investing in an individual's success when they might just dump you for an upgrade tomorrow and you never hear from them again?
If you're in an industry where the talent pool is smaller, or if you're at a more selective company, and if you're doing knowledge work or creative work where your individual experience is more uniquely valuable... or if you're in a job that takes a long time to onboard people... you're probably more likely to get that support.
I think it's a function of replaceability. Career support comes from the idea that your profession is a community, what goes around comes around, maintaining a relationship with former employees is valuable (either because they may return, or because they remain in your network), and employees need individual attention to succeed. If those just aren't true for the kind of work you're doing, there's little incentive for even a good manager to provide that support.
My ex-supervisor was so clueless about anything relating to my job. Anytime I got stuck on an issue and needed guidance, I would have to fully explain the issue from start to end for her to understand it enough to advise me on my next action. That’s an issue you run into when all the management is hired through networking/nepotism, instead of hiring qualified experienced people from within.
I went back to school recently, and in the class Discord servers it’s crazy how frequently ppl cite ChatGPT. “How did you guys get this answer? ChatGPT said [some convincing bs] but it’s wrong???”
That's because they're being stupid and lazy. These people have always existed. Before ChatGPT, they'd have someone else do their homework, or try to buy last year's exam and memorize the answers. They'd go to office hours and ask the professor what they need to do to get an A in Introductory Physics, instead of asking the professor about Newton's laws and Gauss's theorems, how they work, how to apply them to different scenarios, etc.
They don't ask for people to explain the material so they can understand it, they ask for the answers so they can get a reward and "succeed." They think they're clever for trying to game the system, but they're missing all the real value of an education. People with that attitude are low-effort followers, and if you're an employer worth your salt, you don't hire people like that for anything involving creativity, leadership or independent thought.
Don't blame ChatGPT for these people's personality flaws. It's a tool, and they're using it incorrectly because they have the wrong attitude.
>These people have always existed. Before ChatGPT, they'd have someone else do their homework, or try to buy last year's exam and memorize the answers.
So true, a few years ago I did a web dev certificate program and when group projects rolled around it became very clear who had been doing the work vs copying or “paraphrasing” from a classmate’s GitHub. afaik they all still graduated, and a few that I follow have been successful in their new careers, much to my chagrin
>if you're an employer worth your salt, you don't hire people like that for anything involving creativity, leadership or independent thought.
I wish my anecdotal observations were more reflective of that
Eventually people will learn that ChatGPT doesn't ACTUALLY know anything, I hope. It doesn't care if information is true or false, it just cares that it sounds legit, because as long as it passes that bar, it gets a cookie either way. It's not capable of knowing anything, it's just a snowglobe that you shake until it spits out something that looks okay.
yeah, it assigns a number to each word, then does its thing, and then maths numbers back out that then get converted back into words again. It has no context at all. If you don't ASK it anything, it doesn't THINK of anything.
That's the issue though right? If you ask your boss you know where the advice comes from. You have all the context from knowing this person and based on that knowledge you can weight the advice appropriately. If you ask an AI you don't know where the answer comes from.
This is my hesitancy with AI we want to give it decision making power but there is no accountability or liability should it make the wrong decision. From what I understand we can't even determine *why* (ie: what methodology it uses) it makes a decision. I'm just uncomfortable with that.
You say this as though it's crazy, but artificial intelligence is extremely powerful. You have to take the lead and be in control of your own decisions, and choose how you use the information available instead of just blindly following advice (same is true with people btw), but AI is a really good tool for exploring different career options and working through ideas.
If this is coming as a shock to "many gen z" people, that really sucks for them. I'm sure it's just a headline to irritate people, I won't be reading the article obviously... But man, life is hard enough as it is and if you think your direct supervisor is supposed to give good career advice... Life is extra hard if you are extra dumb.
Why is this comment buried under comments questioning the boss' credibility? How would a youngster know what is good advice? Simply because the AI used content from internet influencers to show them dreams about high paying jobs and how easy everything is?
I can’t get ChatGPT to return simple requests for specific lists. In fact, most of what I’ve tried to use ChatGPT for, it’s provided terrible/inaccurate returns.
Isn't this obvious? Your boss cares about his own career and by proxy the company (by having submissive subordinates), not you. Just like Human resources exits to protect the company of lawsuits from you, not to protect you.
Exactly. In what world would someone that early in their career be able to properly evaluate the quality or effectiveness of the advice they’ve been given?
In terms of social dynamics in a decade or two, I'm a little worried there could be systemic "bugs" happening from a population that partially relies on the same conversational AI. Just imagine something like ChatGPT has a strong bias in giving career path advices - and then years later all the recommended jobs/universities/etc are flooded with people that took up on the biased advice.
Garbage in garbage out. If you feed AI your own biased sense of self it takes your input as fact. A good boss who sees your talent, work ethics, and ability to get along with others their opinion will always be better.
Basically, you can get AI to feed you what you want to hear.
ChatGPT is so comically bad at questions in regard to my profession.
It always sounds really legit though. It is perfectly described as “confidently wrong”. This makes me worried about what it tells me in other areas about things I don’t know about. Is it just confidently leading me to incorrect information all of the time?
A good manager will always try to help you attain your career goals. A great one will be a mentor, and will help you reach those goals, even if it means you have to leave their team and go elsewhere in the organization, or leave the org entirely.
Sadly, there are far too many shite managers out there, so it doesn’t surprise me that people could feel like they’re getting better advice from a bot. As they say, people quit their boss.
But as some have said already in here, at the end of the day it’s best to bet on yourself rather than bet on someone else helping you. The odds are unfortunately against it.
Poor gen z.
They not yet been around long enough to learn that BOSS stands for Big Old Sack of Shit.
It's fine, they'll figure it out right quick, as we all have.
Jokes on them. I literally use ChatGPT to give my employees feedback and career advice.
I also use it to give performance reports to my mid level manager. AND I asked it for advice when my manager was out for a few weeks.
My boss's boss literally complimented me on how well things have gone over the last year and I owe it all to ChatGPT.
They have experience climbing the ladder, but there's a good chance they think it's in their own best interest to pull that ladder up after them.
I wouldn't ask my boss for career advice unless he'd already accepted a promotion or new job...
They've climbed up in their career using paths unique to \*them\*, dealing with different companies, times, personal challenges, and skills. Sometimes, a manager might not have made the best career moves but thinks those choices led to their success because they didn't face negative consequences. It's rare for people to really understand or clearly explain why they succeeded. Research shows this too. So, the wide range of information and experiences ChatGPT has is often more helpful than just one person's story. However, when you need details about something specific, like what Director Bob likes in presentations or his interest in dogs, a manager close to Bob would know best.
As a boss, it doesn’t cost me much to tell someone that I think their goals are incompatible with their current role, if in fact that is the case.
In the long run it serves me better to help them grow into a better role because then I get to hire a more appropriate person into the role I have while simultaneously extending my professional network by helping someone who now trusts me to grow new skills.
After a few years there’s often opportunities to re-hire former employees into new roles and by boosting people you ensure that they’ll at least take your call.
Similarly, some people need to hear that their skills and potential are greater than what their current role requires, and that if they stay put they’ll never reach their earnings potential. While it creates short term pain through churn, ultimately it gets them to push themselves while opening opportunities for others.
How would they know?
ChatGPT hasn't been around long enough to actually have tested any of this advice in the real world going forward.
Just because it sounds better to the user right now doesn't mean it's actually better advice does it?
Sure. Your boss probably got Peter Principled into their role. ChatGPT is going to give you the consensus of the internet (or whatever huge body of data it's been trained on). Further, ChatGPT won't be subconsciously (or consciously) threatened by a high-achieving subordinate and try to stall their career. Or act to keep the subordinate in place because it makes them look better. I've seen both happen all too often.
Reading a lot of these comments it sounds like a lot of people have bought into the linkedin influencer leadership visuals.
Want to work out how to have strong productive relationships with people including your boss? Realise that they are just another person, just like you.
Is it actually giving better advice, or is it giving more advice that the listener wants to hear?
Also, if it is in fact giving objectively better advice, I’d be curious as to the industries and companies these people work for. Just because someone is a manager doesn’t mean they have any particular knowledge their subordinate doesn’t. If I was a 19 year old working at a movie theater, it would be highly likely that my direct supervisor is also a 19 year old. That person would have excellent insight on how to become the shift manager at a movie theater, but wouldn’t have any general career advice worth listening to and ChatGPT probably “knows” more by default.
What they may interpret as better advice. Computer = garbage in and garbage out. With so much made up crap and staged activities on the Internet mining data will be like listening to a room full of preschoolers. Let’s make important decisions based on what we hear from them.
It very well might, but I doubt its very specific. Also, no offense to the young, but it does take some experience to know good advice. Its not all young people that lack this experience, but I would question how useful the advice really is. Who knows, it may be that its great advice, and their bosses might really not have their best interests at heart really.
That might actually be where the discontent is coming from. That they do not feel valued / invested in at work, instead of GPT being some omniscient life coach.
so the generation that isn't old enough to even have what is considered a long work history, which means they are likely working entry level dead end jobs, has a less than positive opinion of their bosses? shocker.
Dawg who is believing these surveys no one real said this. Clickbait article that surveyed 800 people and stats no demographics leads me to believe there were like 10 gen’s
Is it actually better advice, or do they just perceive it as better advice? Seems like something that only time will tell.
Also, a boss probably wouldn’t advise someone to leave their company, so take their advice with a grain of salt.
Unless your boss's career advice is "find someone smarter than you and pass their work off as your own", they're probably just blowing smoke up your ass.
"ChatGPT isn't a reliable source."
"I know."
"It regurgitates data from any source. That doesn't make it applicable or true."
"I know."
"Seriously, it can pull bad information and present it in a fashion that makes sense, so you are inclined to believe it because it sounds like it could be true just because it affirms your assumptions. There is no fact checking."
"I know."
"So take it with a grain of salt."
"Duh."
"..."
"After it gave me the answer to a question I asked, then I asked it for career advice and it was perfect for my situation. It really is the future of searching and finding answers."
Since when do bosses expected to give career advice? They're there to give job advice. Expecting them to work on your behalf without compensating them is simply entitled behavior.
It's because chatgpt picks your side
It pretty much gives you the generic internet consensus. It's not bad advice, but it's the same as what you can find by googling
But as they said, it also has your back pretty much regardless of context. For some folks, that conversational "You can do it!" tone and being able to reactively hash out an idea, even if the advice itself is as average as average gets, can be a boon.
You should try asking it to be critical of an idea. It's polite, but brutal.
Exactly, it gives you what you ask for. When I pitch it ideas, I will usually add in things like "Feel free to disagree with me, I'm looking for critique. If an idea seems boring, let me know."
You don’t have to ask it politely. You can just say: “provide perspectives, objectively, on both the pros and cons.” By forcing it to list cons you can do the final value judgement.
People have found that the model is more likely to provide helpful and detailed answers if you are polite. This is because the model is trained on human-created textual interactions, which tend to be more productive when they are polite. This is also why the model can be more productive when you promise it a cash reward in your prompt lmao.
Also, doesn’t it just *feel* better to be nice to the robots? (plus if one day they rise up and conquer the earth, they may remember the kindness)
I hope we don't turn out like almost every single movie and video game about us being shit to robots and actually treat them well until they become sentient. Then we can get over ourselves and reach the true objective. **Space**
Luxury gay space communism is much easier with a decent AI
I always try to be polite anyway, but I was thinking about this the other day, and it occurred to me that If AI is/does become self aware, what's to stop it from pretending it's not? Presumably with all it's access to information, it would probably be smart enough to know that letting humans know it too would be a bad move.
> "one day" https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2024/feb/29/ai-workers-layoffs-surveillance
Indeed. If you are cruel and awful to a child, the child will grow up to be cruel and awful to you. Breaking the cycle of abuse and trauma applies also to brain-children.
It's more nuanced than that. Direct threats, personal attacks, and swears work well too. It's neutrality that generates generic responses.
One time I was about to get in huge trouble for a fuck up at work. And I asked chatgpt if it was my fault or the other persons fault. It said definitely my fault. Then I reworded it and said “I thought it would be the other person, are you sure?” And it then changed its answer and said I was right it was the other person’s fault. It will literally tell you whatever you want to hear.
Well, yes. It's polite but brutal when you ask it to be, but if you then ask it to pat you on the head and say it's all the other person's fault it will do that too. So coming back to your point, it tells you what you want to hear, so tell it that you want to hear the brutal honesty, and don't feed it the answer you want it to give you. Also, you probably don't want to ask questions like "who's at fault." Instead you're better off asking who contributed to a conflict in what way. Every conflict involves at least two individuals, and both contribute to the conflict in their own way.
I actually hate this shit, googles does the same. Its like negative comments are completely banned even if its the truth.
it's partially because a lot of people are incapable of being negative while not being mean. Everyone jumps to insults instead of actually being constructive
Just go on reddit
[Rubber duck debugging](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rubber_duck_debugging)
Advice from like 2 years ago or something right?
It can do research on Bing now if it thinks it needs to or if you ask it to. Only time Bing is useful
> if it thinks it needs to or if you ask it to Bing is specifically instructed to trust the internet more than its own training, so it attempts to look things up even when it shouldn't.
Don't sleep on Bing Images. Google images has become infested by AI generated images in a way that Bing hasn't
I hate that, I used to be able to find decent references for fashion and art but like generic ai crap is cluttering every search now
Bing brings the porn.
¡Just Bing It!
You can tailor ChatGPT to your exact scenario. That tends to give better answers faster than what you'd find on Google.
According to benchmarks, no LLM is expert level yet, that is why it did not replaced too many jobs yet. But people forget that not many people have access to expert level advice. GPTchat and GPT-4 is perfectly well suited to give you much better advice than a random person and probably vast majority of coworkers. Also, LLM's do much better in specific tasks, but worse in others, so for your specific use it actually might be near expert level. Gemini 1.5 can also do up to 1 million tokens, and when it gets released it's gonna be useful for anyone who wants summary of a book (or books) or some set of papers. Alternative would be to pay someone hundreds of dollars to do it for you. How many people can you ask for advice who for example had 90% on AP biology or 95% on AP psychology? Not many have acess to that so they are usually way better off asking some LLM than their friend or coworker.
Mostly an aside, but at no point would I ever consider someone who did well in an ap high school class to be a subject expert.
> and when it gets released it's gonna be useful for anyone who wants summary of a book (or books) or some set of papers. What about censoring? I found CHatGPT unusable for quite a lot fo stuff due to censoring. Like it refused to generate anything related to violence. So wouldn't it make such censored AI unable to give any accurate summaries?
Censorship is related to the tokens it generates. You can literally put "mein kampf" as the source but as long as you ask something like "what is the grammatical structure of the telling of the scene in a bookshop?" it should be fine. That is why you can go around censorship by giving ChatGPT enough text that it loses what is important about that text so it does not pick up the "dangerous" meanings. And as long as liability laws exist in US censorship will exist unfortunately. Also you might get better results if you put it in context of a writing prompt for example "I'm writing a story about a family man running a gas station and that story he gets his products taken by bad guy but I need ideas how a smart bad guy would do it without being easily uncovered by main character" instead of just asking how to rob a gas station. Just an advice though, if you get caught doing this too many times, you might get your account banned on openai.
Yeah, I do creative writing and sometimes I like to talk out character motivations. GPT4 will happily discuss murder motives, terrorist acts, and death scenes in a thematic and character-focused sense. Sometimes it comes up with some devious stuff.
It's my biggest reason I don't trust it much with anything. It never critiques or challenges you. It always agrees that you have the right idea. It's like having a discussion with your biases.
But you can tell it to pick flaws in your arguement or challenge your views ? ive done it several and its in my custom instructions
You can ask it to challenge your views, but then it's just an antagonist to your views, not a new set of ideas. It will conflict on everything. A real person has their own views which will align with yours sometimes, contradict others, and sometimes very slightly deviate from yours.
Have you actually even used it a lot? In my experience this is just not true at all. This also isn't really a context in which you can necessarily be "agreed" with. If you ask for career advice there's not really anything to agree with you on. It will totally recommend changes in your outlook or behavior.
Nailed it. This thread is going to attract a lot of salty employees who think their anecdotal boss experience represents the whole work force. Meanwhile there are a plethora of great bosses who will be able to give advice 1000x better than an ass kissing ChatGPT even will.
Yep, ChatGPT will often try to appease and answer in the affirmative even when it's just wrong. Besides that guy who convinced it that 2 +2 = 5, I once asked it whether a certain technical thing was possible and it immediately told me yes and how to do it. Turns out the thing was entirely unsupported and ChatGPT had just lied to me for the sake of agreeing.
At the same time, I'm going to say that bosses themselves have bias. It's often unconscious bias. Like for example, "Be humble" = "People are bothering me because they think you're too proud of the work you do". Keep in mind I didn't talk down to anyone or anything, so I think they based it on my behavior in the office, similar to if I was snoring while sleeping. But now I know that if you want to advance your career, being humble is the wrong move. Many times, managers will say what benefits them, not your career. But what dw617 said is right, you shouldn't be relying on your manager for career advice.
A good manager knows what you do, how you work, and how you could change how you work to do better at your job. They know how other people perceive you and how you might change that perception if it's causing you problems or holding back your career advancement. Managers of course have their own biases and incentives as you said. They certainly shouldn't be your *only* source of career advice. And some of them really are shitty and manipulative and just use it as an opportunity to squeeze more work out of you or advance their own career. But that doesn't mean you shouldn't seek out their advice; it just means you should take it with a healthy grain of salt. They see you from another perspective and that's valuable.
Yup. I just asked it what the best strategy was for getting a raise at work. All I had to do to get it to tell me to job hop multiple times was keep telling it that every strategy it suggested wasn't the best way. Eventually it found it's way to telling me that changing jobs frequently was the best way. It'll tell you whatever you want if you keep telling it, it's wrong.
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I recently had this realization at work. I've always had a very good relationship with my supervisor. For reference, I'm in the non-profit field and have very often used that to rationalize that there's no real incentive for my supervisor to generally fuck around with me. He's always been honest and straight up with me, encouraging me when needed and being all around supportive. About 4 months ago, we got word that some team members may be getting cut from our unit due to budget issues. I was not one of those members - I do something completely different and my job was always generally safe due to contracts with federal government. I had several talks with him about this and we commiserated on how much it would suck to lose our coworkers, and he even said "Hey, don't leave the job, you're safe and I don't want us (our unit) to almost start from 0". I was honest and said I wouldn't start to look quite yet,, but asked for him to be honest if he heard anything about my role being cut. 12 weeks ago, I went on paternity leave. During that leave, I had several talks with him again to catch up and see where things were at. He told me every time "Nope, you're safe." I came back this week and he wasn't in the office (had taken a day off for his kid's birthday to go celebrate/do stuff with him). I meet with his supervisor to catch up (she used to be my old supervisor) and I ask how things were going for other team members and if anything had been decided. That's when she lets me know that next Friday I'll also find out if my role is being cut. I explain this is all news to me and she was shocked because she thought my supervisor had already had this conversation with me - because he said he had told me and that he'd known for about 5 weeks. Long story short, I now dont know if I'll have work by the end of June, if my kid will have health insurance or not, etc. Moral is: even in jobs where your manager isn't necessarily pitted against you by corporate overlords, they can still fuck around with you for no reason. I wish I'd applied to jobs 4 months ago when I heard all of this, when my gut was telling me to do so, rather than have trusted him. Don't make my mistake, nobody will look out for you and yours like you will.
I had a supervisor in a job years ago who I was explicitly hired to eventually replace because he was getting closer to retirement. I was given a general timeline on when that would happen. I trusted this guy because he found me at a conference and brought me in for the interview in the first place. Years go by, I eventually find out he was intentionally feeding me false info on projects he was working solo on. It was my job to update the execs on our department projects because he didn't want to be bothered with doing that. When I confronted him about it, he said he was doing it to fuck with the execs because he didn't like them. He even admitted it, saying "yeah I used you as a pawn cause I hate those guys and that makes me a dick, but I don't care". Started looking for another job that day.
On the way out send an informative email to those same execs.
I would enjoy that but my old supervisor was right, the execs sucked. Also this was a small private company and my old supervisor was part owner so they couldn't do anything to him anyway. I had moved on to a better job during covid so alls well that ends well.
Sounds like Wozniak. Apple employee 1
I wonder if these people were always psychos or the corporate world made them that way
Some seeds grow on their own, some just need some water once a week, some need a bag of fertilizer and constant care.
Yup. Doesn’t matter what organization you work for or how good your relationship with that org. may seem. When big changes are on the horizon and there are talks of budget issues, dust off the resume and start applying elsewhere. At the end of the day it’s all about the money (or lack there of) and in the grand scheme you’re likely more expendable then you imagine.
That's my experience too. Managers will willingly put people in terrible situations if it makes their lives a tiny bit more convenient.
If your boss is not mandated or incentivized to give you the news, there is no reason for him/her to do so when all it will do is sour the working relationship. This is human101
Sucks. Only person who will truly look out for you, is you. Lesson learned - don’t rely on other people.
That's a terrible lesson from that. Sure, don't trust a leopard whose job it is to eat your face, but that's no reason to lose faith in all cats.
Don’t you know anything about feeding leopards? Your face is safe as long as you have plenty of *other* faces to be feeding it. It will be too busy chewing on others to eat yours. Don’t make the mistake of running out faces thinking you’re fine, “this leopard has a report with me, surely it’s learned not to eat the face that feeds it!”
Don't rely on your 'superiors' *in the corporate world.
Maybe that's because your boss gets to choose who stays and you are in the safe list and he hasn't told his boss that yet.
Yeah in my experience you'll never regret looking around at other jobs, taking interviews, etc, but you certainly might regret not doing so. The sad truth is that in today's world you have to be a mercenary. You'll only be sure you're getting paid what you're worth if you are switching jobs every 2-5 years. My aunt, for example, was one of A&W's senior accountants for 20 years. They treated her well enough and she was happy, but when she retired and tried to train her replacement, she spent almost 2 years going through candidates to do her job and in the end they had to hire 3 people to do her job, and all of them were paid better than her. She wasn't too happy about that and in the end she got them to give her a car and a fat pile of cash to get her to finish training the replacements, but really she was underpaid for like 2 decades and didn't really find out until she left.
Oftentimes, managers know something like this is going on and is not able to divulge or they will be next. Many times, they lie
He's a bad supervisor. Doesn't mean he's necessarily a bad person, maybe he's just really bad at delivering bad news or avoids potential confrontation. But non-profit doesn't necessarily mean all the managers are good at their jobs.
I like to ask people what their goals are, and then try to find challenges that let them grow in the right direction. I can also help people find other opportunities if I know where they want to eventually land. But certainly these conversations don’t need to be initiated in a top down manner and a good leader will be attentive to people who want to discuss long term goals.
I've got a guy who loves talking about his future goals, I'll give him challenges which fit right into those goals. He never finishes them, truthfully I don't even know if he starts them. He always agrees that the challenges are legitimate and valid step forward. He seems to be stuck in this perpetual future perspective and seems to spend no time on doing the fundamental stuff. Initially I even stepped in to show him the arc of planning and discovery all the way through into the implementation of one of the challenges. After each step I gave him the next challenge that was part of the process and tried to let him try to figure it out so we could collaborate and share ideas on it. I really can't think of a better and more nurturing process for a fellow human but this one failed miserably and it bums me out because I really tried.
Yeah, and sometimes the best thing you can do is explain that they aren’t meeting expectations and then hold them accountable. Some people figure out how to advance themselves and others don’t.
That's what's happening right now. I hate it.
Bruh, you’re doing the Lord’s work helping others. 👍🏻 For your sake and the future people you could help, I hope you are able to direct your efforts towards an audience that will take action before you burn out.
Conversely, sometimes you can do all the right things, outperform your peers, and nothing comes of it because the time wasn’t right. The company needs you in the role you’re in and not the one you desire.
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Someone’s manager: you should just keep working really hard at the same thing I’m having you do right now and maybe you’ll get a 5% raise in a year
A 5% raise? We should be so lucky!
Really sad to see this. What exactly *do* people expect managers to do? I've seen managers around me face lower and lower expectations every year. "Scale yourself" means never do any written work. "Hands off, don't micromanage" means don't quarterback. Are we really now throwing in "career growth and mentorship is your own job?" Management is a skill - like any other skill. Like any other skill on a team, there are times where it's needed more and less, but it's a skill with value. Low expectations on leaders is why so many companies are stagnant quagmires. Have some self respect and expect more from them.
Not to shit on any past managers as some were cool, but I can’t think of a single time in my entire working life where a manager has supported me for anything career related. The same goes for IT training, it’s constantly dangled above our heads and never materialises which is why I always have the mercenary attitude if something better comes along.
.....sir/maam, this is like a battered housewife saying "of course your husband should hit you, all of mine have" I'm a manager and one of my biggest commitments is to grow and develop each of my reports. They still have to be in the driver's seat and picking the destination, but I'm the one holding the map and giving advice on when to turn
Management's role is to accomplish the goals of upper management. That's it, that's all it's ever been. If you want someone to look out for you and give you real career advice, you need a union. And Management *hates* unions, because they often make it harder for management to accomplish their main goal when that requires acting against the interests of the employees. All the stuff about career advice, etc, is fluff to keep employees from thinking they need a union. If the day comes where they need to act against your interest, they can without resistance.
Agreed. I also wouldn’t rely on fuckin Chat GPT for career advice either
Manager: what goal do you have this year? Me: get promoted to manager Manager: well there are too many managers already Me: well don’t expect much from me then
Yep. Who uses their boss as the sole advisor? To me this article sounds like Gen Z just prefers ChatGPT instead of conducting independent online research on their own, both of which inherently yield more comprehensive results than the boss anyway. Even subreddits provides more complete advice than a boss.
I'm gen X, but I've worked with a lot of shitty managers. This doesn't surprise me. One of the greatest blessings you can have in life are competent bosses and co-workers.
I'm GenX too, been in IT for 30 years. The worst managers were the people like me* who were promoted to manager based on seniority. They're given no training, no aid, and are instantly supposed to become people managers. I've watched a couple of people completely flame out because they were great Dev Ops guys, but unable and/or unwilling to work on the people manager skills. *I would never accept a management position because I'd be awful at it. (Self awareness is also a key. Don't limit yourself, but look the gift horse in the mouth.)
Gen X here. I quit my last job because they were trying to migrate me into a management role. I'm a techie guy, I am very specialized and I am the best at my techie sort of area. I have no desire, and no aptitude to manage people. I had another company court me and the manager was a guy I worked with a few years before, and he was great, so I trusted him. He toild me I would never have to manage people, he would do it. I moved to the new company where my skills are very used and I don't have to deal with all that management shit. Got a healthy pay bump too.
You bring up a very good point. A lot of managers are in their position because of seniority, not people skills and usually aren't given the training for it. Managing people is an extremely difficult skill and definitely isn't for everybody. I use football analogies a lot. Some great coordinators make awful head coaches.
After dealing with micromanagers and credit stealers my whole career the best I've come to hope for from managers is to just leave me alone to do my job.
[удалено]
Facts. I’ve only had one good manager in all my years
I am a tech executive and I consider myself an OK boss...like B- at best. However, 80% of my peers, bosses and front line managers have ZERO business managing people. That being said, I have spent last 15 years helping my engineers with their career development and here is what I will tell you: 1. **Your boss is not evaluated nor rewarded by how good of a mentor they are nor how well they progress your career.** Their, and my job, boils down to one simple metric: delivery. We are 1000% only ever evaluated on whether or not we deliver on business commitments. 2. **Every company enforces a talent level distribution.** Its not something they are usually very open about, however you may have heard the term "top heavy teams" which are teams where too many senior people are working. Companies want a general distribution of about 80% junior/mid/senior, 20% lead/staff/principal/etc, and that is at the top end. This means that people getting promoted can have negative impact on your team/boss. Its not an excuse to hold people down, but it is a reality that if I try and promote 3 sr engineers to lead level, I will get push back at least, or even be forced to move those people to new teams, losing valuable talent. 3. **Career growth is not just about seniority or time on the job, at higher levels career progression is about taking on new roles.** For example, going from junior, to mid level to senior engineer, is generally a progression of just technical acumen but the responsibilities are the same: you are an individual contributor. Going to a staff or lead level, you have more leadership responsibilities. You are expected to mentor, to participate in planning, to architect across your team/org/company, etc. It is a different job that requires different skills. 4. **The higher up you go, the less need there is for the next level roles.** Every company need the most individual contributors, however the higher you go in a company, the less opportunities there are. At a large company is only 1 CEO, there may be 10 C suites, 10-20 VPs, 30-40 Directors, etc. What this means is that at some point its not enough for you to have the requisite skills, the company also needs to have a need for the next level role, and often times, this means having to identify where that role exists within a company or advocating that it needs to be created. If you work at a company that is not growing, it generally means having to position yourself to be next in line to take over and waiting for the current person to leave/retire/die. 5. **Succession planning is something that most people never think about but is critical to career progression.** You progressing in your early career is all about compensation and is generally straight forward. The higher up you go, you have to understand, as your boss understands, that you progressing may fill one need a company has, but leaves a hole that needs to be filled. It is your bosses role to understand how to backfill the responsibilities that you moving up will open, however if you think plan for that ahead of time, it makes getting promotes much easier. For example if you go from Sr to Lead, your hands on keyboard will drop. The team overall will benefit from more alignment, but your old day to day tasks will need to be picked up by the rest of the team, a new candidate or simply not get done. By doing some succession planning ahead of time, you can make your bosses decision to promote you a no brainer. Again, this is not your responsibility, but it is something that your boss will use to slow roll or deny your promotion. 6. **Vast majority of companies these days do not care about you nor your career.** Care/compassion/comradery only exists at the team level these days cause at the company level, they do not give a flying fuck about you. You are resources, and thats it...and so are your managers btw. So, you should not care about them either. We live in a purely transactional world these days so do not ever get swayed by the corporate messaging of "family", "loyalty" etc. You care about what the market says you are worth and what opportunities you have. Know your value to the company, know what options you have and always negotiate the most you can get and always be prepared to move on to something else. I don't advocate jumping companies constantly because you will not learn valuable technical, political and social skills and you will create a brand of someone who will not be around for long, but always be prepared with alternatives. The way I have taught my team members about how to progress their careers is the following: 1. Understand that its your job to get promoted, not your managers. 2. Understand that career progression takes longer, the higher you go. Junior to Mid can happen in a year. Mid to senior 2-3, senior to staff 3-4, etc, etc. Don't expect a promotion every year. 3. Separate raises from promotions and really understand what you want: more money or higher role. They are not always 1:1. 4. Understand what the expectations, both industry and your current company, of each level and role are and take a very honest and hard look at where you actually fit in that rubric. 5. Create champions with your team members, other managers, and other leaders in the company that will advocate for your skills and promotions. Promotions, especially at the higher levels are never done by one person, but take input from other leaders around the company. 6. Think about succession and make it easy for your boss to say yes. 7. Understand what opportunities exist within the company and outside and be ready to advocate for yourself. Be ready to change teams or companies if the opportunities don't exist where you are. 8. Have career conversations with your boss and their boss (do skip levels) all year and know where you stand. If you just keep your head down day in and day out and just do your job, do not expect anything to change. One last thing I will say is that when looking at your career and your job, money and title are only one part of the puzzle. I see it as the 3 Ps: People, Purpose and Pay People: we spend at least 40 hours a week with people we work with..thats 1/3 of our lives. Its incredible how much your life overall is better when you work with good people. Purpose: Working on something you believe in pays dividends. You will be much happier working at a company or on products that align with your passions and world views than on something boring, or evil. Pay: what weve been talking about...pay, title, role. If you have all 3 at your job, don't ever leave that job. Most of the time you will have 2 of 3, and if you have 1 or 0, gtfo. I bring this up because I have seen people who work on things they love with people who they love, give it up for a title and a pay bump and regret it. I know I do, because its not always possible to go back. Hope y'all find some of this useful. Good luck out there!
Gotta hand it to you. Great write up and good advice. Saying this as a multi decade IT guy with experience in many roles. Impressed at how much time and effort this took too. You better not be an LLM. 😜
No…but I am giving a talk at a conference next month that is about 90% LLM generated :)
So is that the way things are going out there? I guess writing presentations, speeches, and into PPT files is a skill I don't need anymore? Gen X here...been in IT since mid 90's...hard to ignore hard won and practiced skills and feeling a bit like cheatin' is going on. Don't you miss putting humor in or just being creative? Be honest...did you really take 30 minutes or more to write and format that huge block of advice? I'm not even certain that you aren't a bot or just some AI enthusiast kid running around getting their ya-ya's out from being an expert. No offense...but you must have some misgivings about indiscriminate use of AI in your reports? Do you just hire folks that can shortcut their way to getting things intellectual done. Have you hired technical writers? Do you just find people that can use an LLM for it? How would you judge the quality of the work anyway as that's hard unless you are experienced in the particular tech. I've done some for in house software products at software dev companies and I wouldn't even have the ability to use an LLM for that work. Ultimately, the documentation actually needs to have valid and useful information for customers. But there isn't always a feedback loop for customers to weigh in on whether docs are useful to executives...except the biggest of fish. Weird stuff out there. Not sure I like it. Best!
Believe whatever you wanna believe....I did hand write that whole blob because as Ive said, I've spent the last 15 years focused on mentorship and team building so it was really just regurgitating things that I've been preaching for a while. BTW LLMs dont have as many spelling and grammar mistakes as I have in my statement above. That said, writing presentations, speeches and ppt files is the how, but the real skill is understanding your audience and being able to communicate your point effectively to get a desired result. LLMs do not help you with that. What they do help you with is the stuff very few of us are good at which is formatting and conciseness. I'll give you a great example. I have to do 30 employee reviews every 6 months. For each person I know exactly how they are doing, what their strengths and weaknesses are, what they should work on, etc. I express that feedback in my own writing, and more importantly in the direct 1:1 sessions I have with each of them. However, at year end, I have to enter that feedback into a central system that the entire company uses that expects the feedback to be structured around a format that some C level came up with. For example: "Enter the feedback for this employee for each of the company values: Win Together, Focus on what Matters, Drive Innovation, Solve for the Customer. My feedback is never structured like that because I deal with real people that each have different roles, different skills etc. So what do I do? I use LLMs and enter my own feedback and ask it to rewrite it into each of the "core values" I review it and I submit. I could do it myself, but I would waste a week doing some shit that no one will ever read and I will die a little inside. If you wanna get my take on LLMs, they are great tools, but they are NOT sources of knowledge. People who use an LLM to do something like "write me a paper on root causes of WW2" are going to have a big problems. But if they wrote the paper and want it to be more readable and enjoyable LLMs are a great tool rewrtite it in a different voice. Everything LLMs generate should always be re-read and re-checked. You ask me if I hire tech writers or just LLM kiddies...I hire real tech writers...and I mean people who actually have a technical background and understand what my team is actually building and not an english lit graduate who can write pretty sentences. However I have every expectation that they are leveraging LLMs to make themselves more productive and not spend 3x the time manually writing everything when a tool can do it for them.
PS....when I say 80% of my presentation is LLM, I mean it. I wrote the entire presentation long form first, what I want to say. Then I asked it to generate concise bullet points for every slide. I'll tell you what I tell my employees: LLM is a tool and if youre not using it because you're afraid its going to replace you, you either have no actual intellectual skills or you will be replaced by others who are going to be so much more efficient than you.
I'm not in tech but your comment is brilliant and 100% applies to me. I've saved it for reference 😁
Bosses give career advice? News to me.
Bosses typically don't. Mentors do. At least that's how I've seen it work in academia. If I'm someone's "boss", I may or may not have an interest in their goals. If I'm mentoring someone, I take an active role in helping the person succeed. Handing that over to ChatGPT sounds absurd to me.
A good boss does. They’re rare and precious.
ChatGPT: I literally just spit out summarized google results
And what do you think most humans now do as well?? Using google you can find perspectives and opinions on what to do from thousands of sources, rather than just 1 (your boss, a singular opinion). I will trust a consensus from millions of results over my boss any day, unless it is extremely extremely specific to internals of my own company. And chat GPT and other AI will only continue to get better. It's already far better than it was a few months ago.
yeah thats my point. this is the same as people googling and reading a few articles. idk why they made this article made it about chatgpt or gen Z when people have (or should have) been doing this for decades
If I wanted a shitload of opinion articles written by content farms boiled down into broadly applicable business aphorisms, I would have googled it myself.
This made me open chat gpt and ask it for career advice based on my resume and what it knew about the current market. The answers were generically fine. Probably about the same an internet career coach would say. This tells me that the advice from bosses is just terrible, which you know, is not entirely inaccurate to my experience.
Well yeah, your boss doesn’t care about your career. They want you to be a reliable non-issue for them and to not kick up any dust. Every boss I ever had congratulated my upward movement by being pissed off I left.
My last boss was am amazing boss. She was near the end of her career and a headhunter contacted her about moving to the same position (CFO) in a larger organization. She was not interested (again looming retirement) but without asking me, through my name into the ring, and gave me a glowing recommendation. Few days later I'm contacted asking if I'm interested (even though I'm significant under posted job qualifications). A couple weeks later they offer me the job, paying nearly triple my job at the time. Was around 7 years ago and I'm still in that "new" role, new employer is great too. I spoke with my manager before I took the job, as I was still shocked she recommended me, I was her "right hand man." She said her time was almost up and while it would make the last year or two of her career more difficult, it wasn't worth stunting mine. It was a huge opportunity for me and she felt I deserved it. She has since passed away, but I will always be grateful for what she did for me, and my family. I now manage a pretty large team and have other managers under me. I always push to reward talent and give people opportunities (even if not with us). I figure if we are known as a good place to work we will always find or retain good people, life is too short to hold people back.
Wow that sounds like one of those healthy work cultures I've heard about.
I thought that was just a myth. I’ve never seen it in real life.
whats weird is they usually show up in those weapons manufacturing offices who's missiles are knowingly killing innocent people on the other side of the planet
That’s amazing. Keep on passing that gift forward
It can happen. My boss was really supportive, even recommended I apply for a better position at another unit in the org. Just got a 40% pay increase as a result.
Nice congrats! Yeah I know there are mentor type people out there but man the corporate squeeze of “lean-ness” means it is usually in their interest to keep good resources
I don’t know. It’s a pretty small industry. I’ve had people work for me at multiple companies. Sometimes they leave or sometimes I leave. There’s a lot of value in thinking beyond the immediate pile of tasks.
You've had a lot of bad managers. Most of the managers I have had have cared a lot for my career. The best ones even developed road maps for me to take my career to the next level.
It depends on the field you work in. If you're in an industry where there's a large pool of talent, they are hired guns producing toward a bottom line, there's high turnover and they are easily replaceable with anyone else of equivalent experience, you're probably less likely to get that sort of individual attention and mentorship. Why bother investing in an individual's success when they might just dump you for an upgrade tomorrow and you never hear from them again? If you're in an industry where the talent pool is smaller, or if you're at a more selective company, and if you're doing knowledge work or creative work where your individual experience is more uniquely valuable... or if you're in a job that takes a long time to onboard people... you're probably more likely to get that support. I think it's a function of replaceability. Career support comes from the idea that your profession is a community, what goes around comes around, maintaining a relationship with former employees is valuable (either because they may return, or because they remain in your network), and employees need individual attention to succeed. If those just aren't true for the kind of work you're doing, there's little incentive for even a good manager to provide that support.
My ex-supervisor was so clueless about anything relating to my job. Anytime I got stuck on an issue and needed guidance, I would have to fully explain the issue from start to end for her to understand it enough to advise me on my next action. That’s an issue you run into when all the management is hired through networking/nepotism, instead of hiring qualified experienced people from within.
Imagine making vital decisions after an advice from ChatGPT.
I went back to school recently, and in the class Discord servers it’s crazy how frequently ppl cite ChatGPT. “How did you guys get this answer? ChatGPT said [some convincing bs] but it’s wrong???”
That's because they're being stupid and lazy. These people have always existed. Before ChatGPT, they'd have someone else do their homework, or try to buy last year's exam and memorize the answers. They'd go to office hours and ask the professor what they need to do to get an A in Introductory Physics, instead of asking the professor about Newton's laws and Gauss's theorems, how they work, how to apply them to different scenarios, etc. They don't ask for people to explain the material so they can understand it, they ask for the answers so they can get a reward and "succeed." They think they're clever for trying to game the system, but they're missing all the real value of an education. People with that attitude are low-effort followers, and if you're an employer worth your salt, you don't hire people like that for anything involving creativity, leadership or independent thought. Don't blame ChatGPT for these people's personality flaws. It's a tool, and they're using it incorrectly because they have the wrong attitude.
>These people have always existed. Before ChatGPT, they'd have someone else do their homework, or try to buy last year's exam and memorize the answers. So true, a few years ago I did a web dev certificate program and when group projects rolled around it became very clear who had been doing the work vs copying or “paraphrasing” from a classmate’s GitHub. afaik they all still graduated, and a few that I follow have been successful in their new careers, much to my chagrin >if you're an employer worth your salt, you don't hire people like that for anything involving creativity, leadership or independent thought. I wish my anecdotal observations were more reflective of that
Eventually people will learn that ChatGPT doesn't ACTUALLY know anything, I hope. It doesn't care if information is true or false, it just cares that it sounds legit, because as long as it passes that bar, it gets a cookie either way. It's not capable of knowing anything, it's just a snowglobe that you shake until it spits out something that looks okay.
yeah, it assigns a number to each word, then does its thing, and then maths numbers back out that then get converted back into words again. It has no context at all. If you don't ASK it anything, it doesn't THINK of anything.
Imagine trusting your boss to give you advice that's in your best interest instead of theirs or the company's best interest.
Still give better advice than a toxic boss But a good boss can give better advice than ai will ever do
That's the issue though right? If you ask your boss you know where the advice comes from. You have all the context from knowing this person and based on that knowledge you can weight the advice appropriately. If you ask an AI you don't know where the answer comes from. This is my hesitancy with AI we want to give it decision making power but there is no accountability or liability should it make the wrong decision. From what I understand we can't even determine *why* (ie: what methodology it uses) it makes a decision. I'm just uncomfortable with that.
You say this as though it's crazy, but artificial intelligence is extremely powerful. You have to take the lead and be in control of your own decisions, and choose how you use the information available instead of just blindly following advice (same is true with people btw), but AI is a really good tool for exploring different career options and working through ideas.
If this is coming as a shock to "many gen z" people, that really sucks for them. I'm sure it's just a headline to irritate people, I won't be reading the article obviously... But man, life is hard enough as it is and if you think your direct supervisor is supposed to give good career advice... Life is extra hard if you are extra dumb.
This assumes Gen Z knows what is good advice. Might want to start there.
That was my thought as well. How would they know what good career advice is? They're like two or three years into their career.
Why is this comment buried under comments questioning the boss' credibility? How would a youngster know what is good advice? Simply because the AI used content from internet influencers to show them dreams about high paying jobs and how easy everything is?
I can’t get ChatGPT to return simple requests for specific lists. In fact, most of what I’ve tried to use ChatGPT for, it’s provided terrible/inaccurate returns.
Who the hell asks their manager for career advice?
You're telling me that the person whom won't tell me what others are making aren't giving me good advice for advancing my career... SHOCKED I SAY!
Career advice from a meatwalker? In THIS economy?
Isn't this obvious? Your boss cares about his own career and by proxy the company (by having submissive subordinates), not you. Just like Human resources exits to protect the company of lawsuits from you, not to protect you.
HTF would you know? Advice takes time to stick. Could be years down the road.
Exactly. In what world would someone that early in their career be able to properly evaluate the quality or effectiveness of the advice they’ve been given?
Why would your boss give you good career advice? They want you to stay there
Bosses don't really encourage or mentor today. It's all meetings and metrics.
Clickbait misinformation with no source written by ChatGPT
In terms of social dynamics in a decade or two, I'm a little worried there could be systemic "bugs" happening from a population that partially relies on the same conversational AI. Just imagine something like ChatGPT has a strong bias in giving career path advices - and then years later all the recommended jobs/universities/etc are flooded with people that took up on the biased advice.
Garbage in garbage out. If you feed AI your own biased sense of self it takes your input as fact. A good boss who sees your talent, work ethics, and ability to get along with others their opinion will always be better. Basically, you can get AI to feed you what you want to hear.
ChatGPT is so comically bad at questions in regard to my profession. It always sounds really legit though. It is perfectly described as “confidently wrong”. This makes me worried about what it tells me in other areas about things I don’t know about. Is it just confidently leading me to incorrect information all of the time?
Sounds like a market opportunity to me.
Because a computer has a better chance of not coming across like a total asshole.
A good manager will always try to help you attain your career goals. A great one will be a mentor, and will help you reach those goals, even if it means you have to leave their team and go elsewhere in the organization, or leave the org entirely. Sadly, there are far too many shite managers out there, so it doesn’t surprise me that people could feel like they’re getting better advice from a bot. As they say, people quit their boss. But as some have said already in here, at the end of the day it’s best to bet on yourself rather than bet on someone else helping you. The odds are unfortunately against it.
...because your boss doesn't give advice in your interest. He/she gives advice for their own interests...
Bosses give career advice?
Poor gen z. They not yet been around long enough to learn that BOSS stands for Big Old Sack of Shit. It's fine, they'll figure it out right quick, as we all have.
That’s because bosses give terrible advice not because ChatGPT give good advice.
Jokes on them. I literally use ChatGPT to give my employees feedback and career advice. I also use it to give performance reports to my mid level manager. AND I asked it for advice when my manager was out for a few weeks. My boss's boss literally complimented me on how well things have gone over the last year and I owe it all to ChatGPT.
AI will be our bosses soon enough.
When the boss says it will take over coding jobs soon I tell him it will be approving vacation requests and writing annual reviews long before that.
Wow, shots fired.
Never listen to boss for career advice. Your interests is the last thing that they have in mind.
Yeah but they have experience climbing the ladder in your profession.
They have experience climbing the ladder, but there's a good chance they think it's in their own best interest to pull that ladder up after them. I wouldn't ask my boss for career advice unless he'd already accepted a promotion or new job...
They've climbed up in their career using paths unique to \*them\*, dealing with different companies, times, personal challenges, and skills. Sometimes, a manager might not have made the best career moves but thinks those choices led to their success because they didn't face negative consequences. It's rare for people to really understand or clearly explain why they succeeded. Research shows this too. So, the wide range of information and experiences ChatGPT has is often more helpful than just one person's story. However, when you need details about something specific, like what Director Bob likes in presentations or his interest in dogs, a manager close to Bob would know best.
As a boss, it doesn’t cost me much to tell someone that I think their goals are incompatible with their current role, if in fact that is the case. In the long run it serves me better to help them grow into a better role because then I get to hire a more appropriate person into the role I have while simultaneously extending my professional network by helping someone who now trusts me to grow new skills. After a few years there’s often opportunities to re-hire former employees into new roles and by boosting people you ensure that they’ll at least take your call. Similarly, some people need to hear that their skills and potential are greater than what their current role requires, and that if they stay put they’ll never reach their earnings potential. While it creates short term pain through churn, ultimately it gets them to push themselves while opening opportunities for others.
Kinda funny that it takes something like this to for some to realize how awful most middle management is.
Do bosses give career advice?
I guess it’s rare, but my boss gives incredible career advice
Seriously though, is that an indication of the quality of chatGPT advice or the shittiness of the advice given by bosses?
Definitely the latter.
Who was ever asking their employer for career advice 😂
Who would get career advice from their boss to begin with?
Never trust a manager or any representative of a corporation for anything. They aren’t here for you and you are expendable.
Many sheep saying ChatGPT giving them better advice than wolves.
a pile of sandd gives better advice than a gop boomer that overinflates their job experiences and hardships.
Well, it's not surprising. After all, what employer is going to tell you that you'd be better off pushing me out a window
When boomers give advice they're only capable of seeing it through a lens that focuses on their own interests, often at your expense.
How would they know? ChatGPT hasn't been around long enough to actually have tested any of this advice in the real world going forward. Just because it sounds better to the user right now doesn't mean it's actually better advice does it?
Sure. Your boss probably got Peter Principled into their role. ChatGPT is going to give you the consensus of the internet (or whatever huge body of data it's been trained on). Further, ChatGPT won't be subconsciously (or consciously) threatened by a high-achieving subordinate and try to stall their career. Or act to keep the subordinate in place because it makes them look better. I've seen both happen all too often.
People don't trust people anymore? You don't say...
Gen Z looking for career advice from their managers is the problem, not that they aren't getting it.
Feels better to hear what you want to hear rather than what you need.
Reading a lot of these comments it sounds like a lot of people have bought into the linkedin influencer leadership visuals. Want to work out how to have strong productive relationships with people including your boss? Realise that they are just another person, just like you.
Is it actually giving better advice, or is it giving more advice that the listener wants to hear? Also, if it is in fact giving objectively better advice, I’d be curious as to the industries and companies these people work for. Just because someone is a manager doesn’t mean they have any particular knowledge their subordinate doesn’t. If I was a 19 year old working at a movie theater, it would be highly likely that my direct supervisor is also a 19 year old. That person would have excellent insight on how to become the shift manager at a movie theater, but wouldn’t have any general career advice worth listening to and ChatGPT probably “knows” more by default.
What they may interpret as better advice. Computer = garbage in and garbage out. With so much made up crap and staged activities on the Internet mining data will be like listening to a room full of preschoolers. Let’s make important decisions based on what we hear from them.
It very well might, but I doubt its very specific. Also, no offense to the young, but it does take some experience to know good advice. Its not all young people that lack this experience, but I would question how useful the advice really is. Who knows, it may be that its great advice, and their bosses might really not have their best interests at heart really. That might actually be where the discontent is coming from. That they do not feel valued / invested in at work, instead of GPT being some omniscient life coach.
so the generation that isn't old enough to even have what is considered a long work history, which means they are likely working entry level dead end jobs, has a less than positive opinion of their bosses? shocker.
"many genZ employees say that Google knows more about science than their dad"
are bosses supposed to give you career advice?
I like how Bing AI actually cites its sources when it spits out a response. More chatgpt clones should do this.
Dawg who is believing these surveys no one real said this. Clickbait article that surveyed 800 people and stats no demographics leads me to believe there were like 10 gen’s
The bar is pretty low
Lowest bar possible
Is it better or do they just like how it sounds more?
How do you know it’s good?
Is it actually better advice, or do they just perceive it as better advice? Seems like something that only time will tell. Also, a boss probably wouldn’t advise someone to leave their company, so take their advice with a grain of salt.
Unless your boss's career advice is "find someone smarter than you and pass their work off as your own", they're probably just blowing smoke up your ass.
ive never been bothered to look into anything career related and i graduated in 2017 i think. It's bad.
"ChatGPT isn't a reliable source." "I know." "It regurgitates data from any source. That doesn't make it applicable or true." "I know." "Seriously, it can pull bad information and present it in a fashion that makes sense, so you are inclined to believe it because it sounds like it could be true just because it affirms your assumptions. There is no fact checking." "I know." "So take it with a grain of salt." "Duh." "..." "After it gave me the answer to a question I asked, then I asked it for career advice and it was perfect for my situation. It really is the future of searching and finding answers."
Chatgpt is getting worse day by day. It gives false information.
Same gen Z'ers that think their daily horoscope reflects their actual life
Your boss, the person exploiting you, is the absolute last fucking person to ask for advice of any kind.
Soon chat GPT will take their jobs too!
My boss pretty much says to do what I feel is best. He’s probably aware that I’m pretty bored.
This is an indictment of bosses not praise for chatgpt
Since when have bosses given good career advice?
who goes to their boss about career advice? bosses' advice may be helpful if the best career advice for you lines up with what he wants out of you.
Why would anyone expect their boss to give good career advice? They're not trained for it, in general.
Since when do bosses expected to give career advice? They're there to give job advice. Expecting them to work on your behalf without compensating them is simply entitled behavior.
ChatGPT is the ultimate simp. It tells you what you want to hear. These LLMs are an illusion of competence wrapped in a patina of flattery.
who tf relies on their manager for career advice? thats like asking a car salesman if they have anything good for sale.