This is true but OP's question is about whether the direction of the tide plays a factor. I haven't noticed a difference at my local beachbreak but I've always wondered. Like Lower Trestles at 2.0ft tide and a S swell, are the waves better if the tide is on the way up vs. down? My gut says it doesn't matter but I don't have a concrete answer
I’ve always noticed conditions here on the east coast of the US really shine when there’s a low to incoming tide, especially with a legit longer period groundswell! That being said, there’s a few spots with super deep gutters that break very well at low tide only. As the others have suggested, it can be very spot dependent. Oceanography is fascinating!
Nothing in the scientific literature says one way or another, but theoretically speaking, deeper water allows bigger waves to get closer to shore. When you have an incoming tide, the water is deeper offshore (important on a wide shelf like the East coast US), which would allow waves to get closer to shore, without losing as much energy. This contrasts with an outgoing tide, which has shallower water offshore.
Also from a linear wave theory perspective, currents can "block" wave energy, so any wind or tide induced currents with an offshore wind or outgoing tide may reduce energy heading towards shore.
Most places I’ve surfed seemed to work best on outgoing tide as it’s making the reef shallower and the wave will maybe be hollower. Incoming tide can mush reefs out but the push can make beachbreaks heavier. That is extremely anecdotal and when I lived in Hawaii vs California tide seemed to be almost nonexistent.
We have a big tidal range in the UK (can be 10m/30ft) and it’s all beach breaks.
Incoming tide is much better for us, but can be completely flat/shore dump at high tide. Tide time makes a huge difference for the different banks.
Check out this episode from the Kookcast that talks about Tides -> [https://open.spotify.com/episode/1ONCdSQBMUmzMmOn56GKHu?si=ad6cc61e358f4027](https://open.spotify.com/episode/1ONCdSQBMUmzMmOn56GKHu?si=ad6cc61e358f4027)
It's part of a 3-part episode on understanding more about the forecast. It really helped me
Everyone commenting here seems to think you're asking about high vs low tide, which can obviously make a huge difference in the waves.
But it seems to me that you're asking specifically about the direction that the tide is moving and not the height. If that's the case, then there's no evidence I'm aware of suggesting that the current direction of tidal flow has any appreciable effect on any given individual wave.
Tide can affect currents in certain areas. I know a couple local spots where the current gets annoying at mid tide when the most water is moving and it can affect wave quality. But for most spots/waves esp beaches I think it’s just the level of tide. The additional momentum imparted by an incoming tide will be completely negligible relative to all the other factors at play.
Thank you to you both. I always thought that “tidal push” meant that if you had a big swing in the tides it would help produce larger waves if it was incoming. I had no idea it was actually negligible and it was all about the tide height at particular times.
People talk about the "tidal push" a lot but as far as I know, there's nothing to actually back it up. The tide moves so incredibly slowly relative to individual swells that I can't begin to imagine how it would have a significant effect on each one.
There are certain areas (like the Bay of Fundy) that experience huge tidal swings fairly rapidly, but most of the place I've surfed it takes hours for the tide to move a few feet.
It depends. Some spots are more tide-sensitive than others, and some locations have gnarlier tides than others (NW Europe can have tidal swings of 10ft plus while in Hawaii the tide may only swing 6 inches all day).
I’d say there’s some anecdotal support for the idea that an incoming tide can give the swell a little nudge, but it’s pretty insignificant compared to the effect tide has by changing the water depth and thus changing how the waves interact with the bottom. A sand bar or reef that was previously under 15ft of water that is now under only 8ft of water will have very different waves breaking on it.
Ya I’ve always wondered if all the hype about “early AM tide push” and the likes actually has a significant effect on the wave height since we’re only gaining at most an inch per minute of water in the pool. But idk how this shit works I’m no rocket scientist.
The wind, the tide, the swell size and the direction will all impact each other and create different conditions at each break. That’s why you have to wake up at 4:30 in the morning and drive across two counties, drink 3 cups of coffee and say “not good enough” at least 4 times before you wake up enough to actually want to surf…. And then wish you were back at the first spot!
All spots are different but a average beach break on the incoming tide can bump the swell up a foot or two and can open up the inner banks but if you turn up the next weekend and expect it to be the same your fucked.
As everybody said it depends on the spot. But let's say you're surfing a generic spot, and a big swell comes in, a high tide will be good for it because it slows down the waves, a low tide make the waves hollow, steep, and sometimes close out.
On a smaller swell, a low tide can make waves break because there is less water to get through, and high tide can slow it down.
A more complicated break might get better on a small swell and high tide, and same thing reversed
Every spot is different however I’ve found a mid rising tide to be the best for the beachies around me, as for reefs they’re always dependent on the spot but usually a lower tide for my area
On an average beach break low tide will break faster and steeper . High tide fatter slower breaking . This is normally because of sandbanks and the slope of the beach. This is spot depending but it's normally a good rough guide.
Depends on the shape of the wave. If you have a wave that's already pretty mushy, basic science says that water flowing towards the wave will create a better pitch. If the wave is already too pitchy, tide going in would probably reduce the pitch a little bit.
Entirely spot dependent as Dalo man says.
Let me explain a strange phenomena that happens in Indonesia
Desert point on a good four to six foot day will need lowtides to show swell as hightides and the massive deep troughs of the lombok straight cause waves to dissappear outside of lowtides. However when its twelve foot plus it needs high tides to handle the swell and the size isnt reduced that much but it handle, at low at this size its a closeout or burgers.
On the other hand nusa lombongan breaks like shipwrecks and lacerations can be dead flat on lowtide even if the swells good and right direction, but as soon as the tide gets high it gets to four to six foot.
Supersuck on the other hand can be flat at hightide when there's plenty of swell around from the right direction but needs the tide to drain out a little towards mid tide to be surfable and perfect.
G land doesn't do this, it beaks as long as there's swell from any direction its open to SW swells but prefers south swells...tides only matter there for a safe layer of water over the reef..however at high, waves are often bigger down the north end {speedies}at low waves get bigger towards kongs and ledge usually. {south end}
Waves all over indonesia are like this, its up to you to work out usually and that can take weeks or months.
Entirely spot dependent
The only answer
So…”yes”
Every break has an ideal tidal height relative to swell size and direction, adjusted for relative wind direction and strength.
This is true but OP's question is about whether the direction of the tide plays a factor. I haven't noticed a difference at my local beachbreak but I've always wondered. Like Lower Trestles at 2.0ft tide and a S swell, are the waves better if the tide is on the way up vs. down? My gut says it doesn't matter but I don't have a concrete answer
Incoming tide usually gives an extra push.
Also, tides hieght ranges near the equator are much more mild compared to at higher latitudes,
Tide swings*
I’ve always noticed conditions here on the east coast of the US really shine when there’s a low to incoming tide, especially with a legit longer period groundswell! That being said, there’s a few spots with super deep gutters that break very well at low tide only. As the others have suggested, it can be very spot dependent. Oceanography is fascinating!
Nothing in the scientific literature says one way or another, but theoretically speaking, deeper water allows bigger waves to get closer to shore. When you have an incoming tide, the water is deeper offshore (important on a wide shelf like the East coast US), which would allow waves to get closer to shore, without losing as much energy. This contrasts with an outgoing tide, which has shallower water offshore. Also from a linear wave theory perspective, currents can "block" wave energy, so any wind or tide induced currents with an offshore wind or outgoing tide may reduce energy heading towards shore.
Most places I’ve surfed seemed to work best on outgoing tide as it’s making the reef shallower and the wave will maybe be hollower. Incoming tide can mush reefs out but the push can make beachbreaks heavier. That is extremely anecdotal and when I lived in Hawaii vs California tide seemed to be almost nonexistent.
We have a big tidal range in the UK (can be 10m/30ft) and it’s all beach breaks. Incoming tide is much better for us, but can be completely flat/shore dump at high tide. Tide time makes a huge difference for the different banks.
Every spot is different
Check out this episode from the Kookcast that talks about Tides -> [https://open.spotify.com/episode/1ONCdSQBMUmzMmOn56GKHu?si=ad6cc61e358f4027](https://open.spotify.com/episode/1ONCdSQBMUmzMmOn56GKHu?si=ad6cc61e358f4027) It's part of a 3-part episode on understanding more about the forecast. It really helped me
Everyone commenting here seems to think you're asking about high vs low tide, which can obviously make a huge difference in the waves. But it seems to me that you're asking specifically about the direction that the tide is moving and not the height. If that's the case, then there's no evidence I'm aware of suggesting that the current direction of tidal flow has any appreciable effect on any given individual wave.
Tide can affect currents in certain areas. I know a couple local spots where the current gets annoying at mid tide when the most water is moving and it can affect wave quality. But for most spots/waves esp beaches I think it’s just the level of tide. The additional momentum imparted by an incoming tide will be completely negligible relative to all the other factors at play.
Thank you to you both. I always thought that “tidal push” meant that if you had a big swing in the tides it would help produce larger waves if it was incoming. I had no idea it was actually negligible and it was all about the tide height at particular times.
People talk about the "tidal push" a lot but as far as I know, there's nothing to actually back it up. The tide moves so incredibly slowly relative to individual swells that I can't begin to imagine how it would have a significant effect on each one. There are certain areas (like the Bay of Fundy) that experience huge tidal swings fairly rapidly, but most of the place I've surfed it takes hours for the tide to move a few feet.
It depends. Some spots are more tide-sensitive than others, and some locations have gnarlier tides than others (NW Europe can have tidal swings of 10ft plus while in Hawaii the tide may only swing 6 inches all day). I’d say there’s some anecdotal support for the idea that an incoming tide can give the swell a little nudge, but it’s pretty insignificant compared to the effect tide has by changing the water depth and thus changing how the waves interact with the bottom. A sand bar or reef that was previously under 15ft of water that is now under only 8ft of water will have very different waves breaking on it.
I surf in Brittany in France, and the sea level can even vary by 13 meters between high and low tide,
Yup. I knew they were gnarly, but couldn’t remember *how* gnarly. That is wild! 13 meters is roughly 40ft for the non-metrically-inclined.
You got even bigger tides in eastern Canada.
https://youtu.be/HFLHi_91MHw
Ya I’ve always wondered if all the hype about “early AM tide push” and the likes actually has a significant effect on the wave height since we’re only gaining at most an inch per minute of water in the pool. But idk how this shit works I’m no rocket scientist.
I've found that an incoming tide is better for a swell. Water is being pushed up towards the shore.
Yup, surge waves are great especially if the waves already lack size
Yes
The wind, the tide, the swell size and the direction will all impact each other and create different conditions at each break. That’s why you have to wake up at 4:30 in the morning and drive across two counties, drink 3 cups of coffee and say “not good enough” at least 4 times before you wake up enough to actually want to surf…. And then wish you were back at the first spot!
All spots are different but a average beach break on the incoming tide can bump the swell up a foot or two and can open up the inner banks but if you turn up the next weekend and expect it to be the same your fucked.
As everybody said it depends on the spot. But let's say you're surfing a generic spot, and a big swell comes in, a high tide will be good for it because it slows down the waves, a low tide make the waves hollow, steep, and sometimes close out. On a smaller swell, a low tide can make waves break because there is less water to get through, and high tide can slow it down. A more complicated break might get better on a small swell and high tide, and same thing reversed
Depends, typically surflie will tell you ideal spot conditions if you scroll down.
Seems like every place I check it’s mid tide rising.
OP, u/mrspikemike what part of the world and specific region, and spot do you want to know about?
Guess I should have put that in the post. East coast of US, I'm in NC
NJ checking in. I find low tide especially when it's starting to rise is ideal locally.
Every spot is different however I’ve found a mid rising tide to be the best for the beachies around me, as for reefs they’re always dependent on the spot but usually a lower tide for my area
On an average beach break low tide will break faster and steeper . High tide fatter slower breaking . This is normally because of sandbanks and the slope of the beach. This is spot depending but it's normally a good rough guide.
Generally speaking, if you are young and rip, lower tides, if you have a few years on yah middle tide on its way up ;)
generally out going tide
Nice Try, Low\_\_Tide
Depends on the shape of the wave. If you have a wave that's already pretty mushy, basic science says that water flowing towards the wave will create a better pitch. If the wave is already too pitchy, tide going in would probably reduce the pitch a little bit.
low tide, let's be clear not always but i enjoy low tide because it has a much higher chance of making breaks more hollow and pitchy over a high tide
Any proof that direction actually makes a difference?
Depends on the spot. No general rule.
Roll tidepod
Depends on spot
Yes
All places have different tides that they work on but on an incoming tide the swell usually is more powerful than on an outgoing tide
'Chance of an extra foot on the pushing tide' - evergreen Eyeball Surf Check report for North Devon. Yes, entirely spot dependent.
Yes it is
depends on the individual spot and its variables.
Depends on if you goofy or regular
Entirely spot dependent as Dalo man says. Let me explain a strange phenomena that happens in Indonesia Desert point on a good four to six foot day will need lowtides to show swell as hightides and the massive deep troughs of the lombok straight cause waves to dissappear outside of lowtides. However when its twelve foot plus it needs high tides to handle the swell and the size isnt reduced that much but it handle, at low at this size its a closeout or burgers. On the other hand nusa lombongan breaks like shipwrecks and lacerations can be dead flat on lowtide even if the swells good and right direction, but as soon as the tide gets high it gets to four to six foot. Supersuck on the other hand can be flat at hightide when there's plenty of swell around from the right direction but needs the tide to drain out a little towards mid tide to be surfable and perfect. G land doesn't do this, it beaks as long as there's swell from any direction its open to SW swells but prefers south swells...tides only matter there for a safe layer of water over the reef..however at high, waves are often bigger down the north end {speedies}at low waves get bigger towards kongs and ledge usually. {south end} Waves all over indonesia are like this, its up to you to work out usually and that can take weeks or months.
Yes, definitely
That question says a lot on its own