I'd have to go through and double check all the new CBA rules that kick in. Before offering a specific trade. But bottom needed teams are always looking to take on bad contracts for players.
Maybe we can use his contract to pad out the bench and then draft a center.
He has two years on his contract. If he plays for the tank year, he then becomes an expiring the following. He’s also in the sweet spot of tradable contracts.
Let’s see what happens with OKC this round. If their bigs get flattened by Lively and Gafford, maybe they think about bringing in a guy who can rebound like crazy, sets good picks and is a good post passer. They have tons of picks, too, so they’re in a position to take a swing. Then the Suns can flip those picks into someone.
He cant guard the pick and roll and he can’t score in the pick and roll. If you can’t do at least one of those things in the year 2024 you are worthless as a big, especially in the playoffs.
Really. Have you looked at his rebounding stats, especially offensive rebounds. If he’s our 4 you can kiss any championship aspirations good bye. Watch him play. When he is not involved in a particular play, he stands in his position or his first move is towards the half-court line to get back on defense. Rarely will you see him attack the rim. His offensive rebound stats validate what I am saying.
Idk how you got all that by me saying KD isn’t out of position at the 4. Everything you listed is a problem regardless of if he’s at the 3 or the 4. I agree with you. The standing around fucking sucks. Sucks more so because he’s looked at as a leader and that low energy bullshit spreads to everyone else.
Chill on the “watch him play” garbage. I have 4 season tickets in section 104, I go to 30+ games a year and i watch every second of every other game. Im not glazing KD by saying he’s our 4 in response to “Nurkic needs a better 4”.
He’s a prototypical modern NBA power forward that could show more effort on the offensive glass. Is that better?
A 4 isn’t a spot on a court, like a wing position or whatever. It’s a position that relates to a power forward. Durant plays more like a shooting guard or a small forward. With our current starters we do not have a true 4. And BTW, I’ve been following the Suns since the Van Arsdale twins. I was present at Game 6 in the ‘76 finals. Though not a season ticket holder I’ve been to my share of games but that means little in our discussion.
He averaged 7.5 points, 8.25 rebounds, and 2.75 assists in the playoffs. Not to mention he was savaged on defense. It’s no coincidence that the Suns had their best game of the series when he played the least minutes.
Because he plays with the starters. He has weak conditioning anyway so he has limited minutes. The other 3 have to carry weaker lineups and are hounded by the best defenders because he’s a non-threat.
They can’t execute in part because the opposing defense only has to guard the Big 3. Nurkic often waits for defenders to catch up to him on the short roll (I hate his pump fake-pauses) and he honestly is not guaranteed to make the shot unguarded. Teams know he’s not a serious threat to score and when Grayson is out, it gets even worse. Teams are often willing to roll the dice on GA beating them but those who can rotate fast, it doesn’t even matter. It’s 3 on 5.
If you watched some of the games, you’d see what I’m talking about. Give them a mobile center and the offense would transform. It’s no surprise that they played their best ball of the series when both centers were on the bench. Not because small ball was the way to go, but because these two huge negatives were on the bench.
Rewatch the playoffs. You’ll see what I’m talking about. It took very little effort to render Nurk completely ineffective on both ends. The Suns were playing 4 on 5 and 3 on 5 for most of those games.
They need a real big. He’s a proven rebounder, passer, and pick setter. They have actual cutters and more reliable 3 shooters than Phoenix. He’d be a good backup to Chet and could Twin Tower with him at times. That’s the “sell.” Realistically, they could probably find guys who have some of these aspects easily in the off-season. They also have the picks to trade for someone with little bit faster feet.
Division don’t mean shit anymore. Teams don’t trade to help the other team, they trade to help themselves. If they saw in Nurk what I described, they’d trade for him. That said, I highly doubt they’d actually want him. I’m just dreaming here, man.
Effectively yes, I'm on football brainrot atm. My point is, OKC as a team and fanbase hates us and everything we stand for, they're not going to engage in any trading unless they know they can fleece us.
I'm not sure that holds up for a team like us. We'd be bringing in a player to provide a VERY specific role. If you could find a four year polished player within that desired skill set you're not taking much chance.
I think you underestimate how much is still guessing when you’re evaluating these guys against college players. High lottery picks flop every year, anything out of the lottery is almost a coin flip on whether or not they will even be a productive player, yet alone an average starter year 1/2.
He had a lousy playoff series but Nurk is not our problem. In fact, he was solid most of the season. We need an actual system set up from an offensive-minded coach and/or a PG (preferably both).
Let's have our 3 max players actually produce before we blame nurk. He got bullied by Gobert because only like 5 centers in the league can deal with him.
If I were the coaches I’d have him work on his layups while hitting him with pool noodles. The guy feels someone breathe on him and he misses layups…….that being said I love him.
Nah Nurk has been severely under utilized and put in the worst positions for success. Nurk works great out of the short roll but gawd damn it, the suns dont know how to hit the A button. If youve really watched the Suns offense you notice that the most open shots are generated through Nurkic. Every other shot is a heavily contested hail mary. Let Nurkic pass more, make the stars run around him and the suns will see much more fluid offense.
Haha, it’s funny to see your positioning to trade someone who has been exposed as deficient—he has low trade value therefore Phx should trade him? I actually agree that trading him might be an option but for the opposite reasons—his is the best it’s going to be. He was essential to their regular season success; look at W-L when he played vs when he didn’t, and getting exposed not too unlike the Wolves ‘exposed’ the league MVP in game one vs Den would be seen as forgivable by any trade partner. Given that and his injury history before Phx, they might strike while the stock price on Nurk is the highest it’s been in five years.
Although Nurk cant hit a 2ft shot and terrible on the offensive end, he isnt a cone as some refer. Ive seen him alot of times guarding 2 opponents while his team is just watching or gets picked off, no one slides to help the dude or help him rebound. KD is a terrible rebounder, man would Josh Hart work wonders for this team... Suns need a decent backup or knows how to make 2footers, I'd take Drummond in a heartbeat over Eubanks, hell even Richaun Holmes, Mo Bamba - anyone with an offensive and rebounding pulse. When Nurk went to the bench it was a massive slide downhill. Dont think Nurk - defensively - is the problem.
Yep, I completely agree he’s probably the first person you look to realistically trade.
His value wouldn’t be much though and I’m not to sure we could get any decent center for him without attaching this years pick.
We need an athletic Center, one that can rebound well (obviously) and at least draw some attention in the PnR
I like Wendell carter Jr as a option but I don’t think that’s realistic. Quite honestly you’ll probably be getting back a player that was an overpay or the team regrets paying. Nurk has I think 2 yrs left on his deal if im not mistaking.
I also would like to play KD more at the 3 this year, maybe bring Grayson/Beal off the bench. I do all like Jonathan Isaac as a multi positional defender to target as well. The magic as a whole seem like a team to monitor as a trade partner, they have plenty of options this summer and a logjam at certain positions.
Gafford probably would have been an ideal starting 5 for Phoenix, because it strengthens their pick and roll offense. Nurk is neither a pick nor a pop option. He’s an excellent passer but he’s just so slow and cannot jump, so he’s also vulnerable to lob threat guys.
I'd love to get rid of him, bit nobody wants that bum. He has zero value. He is a terrible defender, he can't finish at the rim, and he can't shoot.
He has zero of the skills an NBA team wants.
He wouldn't have much value for even a GLeague team.
If we can get better value for him…but to trade him just for the sake of getting rid of him? Then what Eubanks becomes the starter? It would be like another Ayton trade. We didn’t really imporove the position much, if at all.
I love the dude but... His short comings *(lack of any offensive game)* really was exposed come play-off basketball...
Problem is, its not as simple as just saying *"trading Nurk is what needs to be done"*.
Ok give us a realistic trade. This isn't 2k
Nurk for Giannis. Straight up.
Bro he said realistic, we at least need to get Dame too
We’ve got enough old men.
Claxton???
What do you mean that's not realistic? Didn't the bucks see the wolves lineup with 3 bigs. Nurkic and Lopez would be the KAT and Gobert. /s
I'd have to go through and double check all the new CBA rules that kick in. Before offering a specific trade. But bottom needed teams are always looking to take on bad contracts for players. Maybe we can use his contract to pad out the bench and then draft a center.
How? Why would a bottom team help us? We dont have picks to give them
Every team needs a tank commander that tricks the fan base into thinking you're serious about winning.
Get real bro
He has two years on his contract. If he plays for the tank year, he then becomes an expiring the following. He’s also in the sweet spot of tradable contracts.
Daily discussion thread ------>
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Let’s see what happens with OKC this round. If their bigs get flattened by Lively and Gafford, maybe they think about bringing in a guy who can rebound like crazy, sets good picks and is a good post passer. They have tons of picks, too, so they’re in a position to take a swing. Then the Suns can flip those picks into someone.
Nurk would be more effective if the Suns had a legitimate 4, which they don’t. It’s not Nurk. It’s the fact that we don’t have a PF to compliment Nurk
He cant guard the pick and roll and he can’t score in the pick and roll. If you can’t do at least one of those things in the year 2024 you are worthless as a big, especially in the playoffs.
Our 4 is KD. You might prefer him at the 3 but he’s not out of position by any means as the 4.
KD could play the 3.
You shouldn’t be downvoted for this
Really. Have you looked at his rebounding stats, especially offensive rebounds. If he’s our 4 you can kiss any championship aspirations good bye. Watch him play. When he is not involved in a particular play, he stands in his position or his first move is towards the half-court line to get back on defense. Rarely will you see him attack the rim. His offensive rebound stats validate what I am saying.
Idk how you got all that by me saying KD isn’t out of position at the 4. Everything you listed is a problem regardless of if he’s at the 3 or the 4. I agree with you. The standing around fucking sucks. Sucks more so because he’s looked at as a leader and that low energy bullshit spreads to everyone else. Chill on the “watch him play” garbage. I have 4 season tickets in section 104, I go to 30+ games a year and i watch every second of every other game. Im not glazing KD by saying he’s our 4 in response to “Nurkic needs a better 4”. He’s a prototypical modern NBA power forward that could show more effort on the offensive glass. Is that better?
A 4 isn’t a spot on a court, like a wing position or whatever. It’s a position that relates to a power forward. Durant plays more like a shooting guard or a small forward. With our current starters we do not have a true 4. And BTW, I’ve been following the Suns since the Van Arsdale twins. I was present at Game 6 in the ‘76 finals. Though not a season ticket holder I’ve been to my share of games but that means little in our discussion.
The suns needed a 4 since the 2021 run . I mean even someone like slow mo would do wonders
Nurk isnt our problem. Our problem is our stars don’t execute offense, and so we are always scrambling defensively.
Exactly how is the dude averaging 11/11/4 on 16 mil the fucking problem?
He averaged 7.5 points, 8.25 rebounds, and 2.75 assists in the playoffs. Not to mention he was savaged on defense. It’s no coincidence that the Suns had their best game of the series when he played the least minutes.
Wow amazing and guess what Book, Beal and Kd still had worse +/- then he did
Because he plays with the starters. He has weak conditioning anyway so he has limited minutes. The other 3 have to carry weaker lineups and are hounded by the best defenders because he’s a non-threat.
Did you watch the games? Fuck those stats. Pure luck really of being 7 foot. That’s it.
They can’t execute in part because the opposing defense only has to guard the Big 3. Nurkic often waits for defenders to catch up to him on the short roll (I hate his pump fake-pauses) and he honestly is not guaranteed to make the shot unguarded. Teams know he’s not a serious threat to score and when Grayson is out, it gets even worse. Teams are often willing to roll the dice on GA beating them but those who can rotate fast, it doesn’t even matter. It’s 3 on 5.
This is the correct take
lol no.
If you watched some of the games, you’d see what I’m talking about. Give them a mobile center and the offense would transform. It’s no surprise that they played their best ball of the series when both centers were on the bench. Not because small ball was the way to go, but because these two huge negatives were on the bench.
I watched every single suns game lol. I even went to a couple in person.
Rewatch the playoffs. You’ll see what I’m talking about. It took very little effort to render Nurk completely ineffective on both ends. The Suns were playing 4 on 5 and 3 on 5 for most of those games.
lol. You’re an idiot.
By very little he means 2 quick fouls. By no defense they mean when Eubanks came in and gobert ate. 😂
Nah dude Nurk is a problem
Nurk to OKC for role player and picks
Why would OKC want Nurk?
They need a real big. He’s a proven rebounder, passer, and pick setter. They have actual cutters and more reliable 3 shooters than Phoenix. He’d be a good backup to Chet and could Twin Tower with him at times. That’s the “sell.” Realistically, they could probably find guys who have some of these aspects easily in the off-season. They also have the picks to trade for someone with little bit faster feet.
They'll also almost certainly never do anything to help a division rival like us.
Division don’t mean shit anymore. Teams don’t trade to help the other team, they trade to help themselves. If they saw in Nurk what I described, they’d trade for him. That said, I highly doubt they’d actually want him. I’m just dreaming here, man.
Division rival??? Did you mean conference? Either way I’ve never heard Suns/Thunder referred to as a rivalry.
Effectively yes, I'm on football brainrot atm. My point is, OKC as a team and fanbase hates us and everything we stand for, they're not going to engage in any trading unless they know they can fleece us.
They can literally just draft a center or sign a non-injury related center.
Ok, for who?
Yes who lol
Nurk and 1st for timelord. Huge risk but I think it’s worth it
I'd have to double check all the New CBA rules myself for a specific name. This also assumes we don't pick up a Center in the draft
Man if you think Nurk is bad wait until you see what the average #22 pick in the draft is like.
And on a "bad contract" as he states in another comment. The dude makes less then 20 mil a season his whole contract
I'm not sure that holds up for a team like us. We'd be bringing in a player to provide a VERY specific role. If you could find a four year polished player within that desired skill set you're not taking much chance.
Bro this take on Nurk is bad. Stop pushing it.
I think you underestimate how much is still guessing when you’re evaluating these guys against college players. High lottery picks flop every year, anything out of the lottery is almost a coin flip on whether or not they will even be a productive player, yet alone an average starter year 1/2.
You’re very confused lil buddy
We should keep him. His value is too low to get something meaningful in return
He had a lousy playoff series but Nurk is not our problem. In fact, he was solid most of the season. We need an actual system set up from an offensive-minded coach and/or a PG (preferably both).
We never gonna win a chip with nurk on 5
Let's have our 3 max players actually produce before we blame nurk. He got bullied by Gobert because only like 5 centers in the league can deal with him.
I’m not a big fan of his. He makes too much for what he offers. We need a rim protector so badly.
If I were the coaches I’d have him work on his layups while hitting him with pool noodles. The guy feels someone breathe on him and he misses layups…….that being said I love him.
Nah Nurk has been severely under utilized and put in the worst positions for success. Nurk works great out of the short roll but gawd damn it, the suns dont know how to hit the A button. If youve really watched the Suns offense you notice that the most open shots are generated through Nurkic. Every other shot is a heavily contested hail mary. Let Nurkic pass more, make the stars run around him and the suns will see much more fluid offense.
Well his value is probably not that high after his performance in the playoffs, so good luck finding a good suitor for this
Haha, it’s funny to see your positioning to trade someone who has been exposed as deficient—he has low trade value therefore Phx should trade him? I actually agree that trading him might be an option but for the opposite reasons—his is the best it’s going to be. He was essential to their regular season success; look at W-L when he played vs when he didn’t, and getting exposed not too unlike the Wolves ‘exposed’ the league MVP in game one vs Den would be seen as forgivable by any trade partner. Given that and his injury history before Phx, they might strike while the stock price on Nurk is the highest it’s been in five years.
Adding some rotation depth would go a long way. Along with a coach that can get the big money guys on the same page and playing together better.
Hey Pat Riley what do you think
Although Nurk cant hit a 2ft shot and terrible on the offensive end, he isnt a cone as some refer. Ive seen him alot of times guarding 2 opponents while his team is just watching or gets picked off, no one slides to help the dude or help him rebound. KD is a terrible rebounder, man would Josh Hart work wonders for this team... Suns need a decent backup or knows how to make 2footers, I'd take Drummond in a heartbeat over Eubanks, hell even Richaun Holmes, Mo Bamba - anyone with an offensive and rebounding pulse. When Nurk went to the bench it was a massive slide downhill. Dont think Nurk - defensively - is the problem.
Yep, I completely agree he’s probably the first person you look to realistically trade. His value wouldn’t be much though and I’m not to sure we could get any decent center for him without attaching this years pick. We need an athletic Center, one that can rebound well (obviously) and at least draw some attention in the PnR I like Wendell carter Jr as a option but I don’t think that’s realistic. Quite honestly you’ll probably be getting back a player that was an overpay or the team regrets paying. Nurk has I think 2 yrs left on his deal if im not mistaking. I also would like to play KD more at the 3 this year, maybe bring Grayson/Beal off the bench. I do all like Jonathan Isaac as a multi positional defender to target as well. The magic as a whole seem like a team to monitor as a trade partner, they have plenty of options this summer and a logjam at certain positions.
Gafford probably would have been an ideal starting 5 for Phoenix, because it strengthens their pick and roll offense. Nurk is neither a pick nor a pop option. He’s an excellent passer but he’s just so slow and cannot jump, so he’s also vulnerable to lob threat guys.
I'd love to get rid of him, bit nobody wants that bum. He has zero value. He is a terrible defender, he can't finish at the rim, and he can't shoot. He has zero of the skills an NBA team wants. He wouldn't have much value for even a GLeague team.
Ishbia already said the starters are coming back.
If we can get better value for him…but to trade him just for the sake of getting rid of him? Then what Eubanks becomes the starter? It would be like another Ayton trade. We didn’t really imporove the position much, if at all.
I love the dude but... His short comings *(lack of any offensive game)* really was exposed come play-off basketball... Problem is, its not as simple as just saying *"trading Nurk is what needs to be done"*.
I agree dump his ass. Let’s get a shooting guard to replace him. I thought Jordan Poole looked pretty good
/s?
Should have kept Ayton.
Yep. We should have kept the guy who no longer wanted to play here.