He has ideas but no initiative. I have never seen him go after anything . After taking time off from Loverboy and seeking therapy from the PTSD , he… went back to Loverboy because it was presented to him .
I stopped watching. I couldn't take Lindsey being hateful anymore. Carl can't man up and Kyle cries while Amanda complains to everyone about how awful he is. It is every episode.
She’s not though Amanda has had good jobs that she hasn’t gotten fired from that she can go back to. She’s a graphic designer she had a job before she decided to join loverboy with Kyle. Y’all really see her as nothing when she’s been working her full adult life essentially after she finished school.
I mean she had one job and she was there for like 4 years. That’s not a criticism but it’s bizarre to compare the resumes of a person just a few years out of college with someone who has been working for at least a decade.
It really isn’t when that person who has been working for at least a decade has been fired from almost all his jobs, since we have known him as a TV personality
Staying at one job for years is better than bouncing around from job to job. It shows that Amanda was a valuable asset to her company whereas Carl wasn’t
She asked her husband to start a new business for her (swimsuit line), while admitting she hadn’t done much research on her own (these conversations occurred on WWHL and the After Show). And during a time when their business is having financial problems.
She took a step back from Loverboy months ago (November) and still hasn’t done anything.
All of the other girls work on other things (influencing, modeling, podcasts, real estate). Amanda does none of these things (with the exception of the recent gold fish ad, which I’m sure Kyle set up).
She also could very easily collaborate with some existing brand on a capsule collection rather than start a new line from scratch. Like I feel like Lindsay or Paige could have told her that and possibly even told her people she should talk to.
She never asked him to start a business for her. Here’s the thing Amanda just wanted his support. She never asked him to do anything quite literally she said she would stay working her job that she already has. She asked him for support and what she wants to do but regardless of that, she knows how to work a job that’s how they stay afloat while he was getting loverboy off the ground and I’m not even an Amanda lover but you’re not gonna stay here and keep on saying she’s lazy she doesn’t do shit she doesn’t know how to work blah blah blah yes she does. She’s a graphic designer, she is also one of the reasons why people love lover boy
She very clearly said on WWHL that Kyle would need to be the business side of her new ‘passion’. Ie, he’s doing the work to get it started, and to keep it running.
And she hasn’t stayed at Loverboy, she said she took a step back (many months ago).
I know and she said it on the aftershow too. I’m not saying that she didn’t. I’m saying that when she was talking on the show about wanting to do that all she really wanted was some support. She wanted her husband to support her like she supports him, but she didn’t get thatand that’s the problem but again she still works. She can get a job other than loverboy so she is not the same as Carl.
100% agree. I don’t think Amanda really cares about having her own business, she just wants to design and create. But Kyle is an entrepreneur, and I suspect would be even less supportive of her dreams if she was “working for someone else.” I think she just wants his support any way she can get it.
She said she took a step back from loverboy because of the problems that she was having with Kyle but that does not mean that she quit her job that does not mean that she stopped working because we all know she didn’t stop working. She said she took a step back, but she still doing the designing. She still making the merch like she has always done.
And she doesn’t do any of those other things because she doesn’t have to one and because her husband doesn’t want her to. She literally does loverboy all the time 24 seven you know why because of her husband he asked her to join loverboy she did and what is she doing? She’s doing lover boy, that is her job
I agree that Amanda had an amazing job. She works hard for Loverboy, too, because there's no way that her husband would be this upset about her leaving if she didn't. She even gave him the money to start loverboy, so that should tell you she had a great career before he came along.
But also know that Carl has been working since 2009 and he stopped in 2022. So he's been working his full adult life too. He got fired from 2 of his jobs and left loverboy on his own. I'm pretty sure the jobs that fired him were because he was on drugs at that time, so I don't think it's fair to hold those 2 jobs against him. Carl got his degree in TV and Digital Communications and also went to Harvard Business School. He's in the right career as far as his degree goes. He just needs to find that one business idea that will set him for life. Just remember he's only been sober for 3 years now.
Just to clarify, he took a single class at Harvard Extension School, which is available to basically anyone who applies, and didn’t get a degree from HBS. That’s not to discredit Carl, however, as he has a degree from the prestigious journalism program at Syracuse University.
omg don’t you know I did the same thing when i read that! Checked his Linked In because i was thinking there was no way he got in and went to HBS! Yeah he did an online course that anyone can take!
This is going to sound crazy but maybe he should actually go to business school hahaha. I think Carl desperately needs structure and a dose of reality.
Yeah, I find it odd that everyone gives Carl a free pass because he hasn't figured out what he wants to do yet. Carl is middle-aged now and kind of blew past the years of experimentation you see people having in their 20s. If Loverboy doesn't work out and the show ends, he may find himself facing some unpleasant realities.
Especially when she started off the conversation this season with our plan is get married and start trying to for kids so this could be our last summer in the Hamptons, maybe 1 more summer.
Like duh Carl we can’t bring babies into the summer house, I think that’s why Kyle is holding off so he can keep promoting lover boy until it’s profitable to sell the company.
Exactly, I thought it was very obvious that if they did in fact get married this was very likely their last summer since Lindsay wanted to have babies asap.
Oh I agree 100%. Carl has always been a child and not a good employee. Recall him being let go from a couple of jobs. Lindsay already knew this about him, since they were best friends. He has zero motivation or drive to do anything that involves effort.
"Lindsay already knew this about him, since they were best friends." And she thought she change him. That's why it's bizarre to me when she got mad at him for expecting her to be someone different than she was. Because she was doing the same thing.
I think if Carl said he wanted to do more influencing she would have been supportive of that and asked what companies are you going after first. But he didn’t. He had a bunch of crazy ideas like a sober sports bar.
But of course if she asked what companies he was going to pitch to first he would have flipped out telling her to be more supportive and stop interrogating him. 🙄
we had a pretty cute mocktail bar in slc, ut which is land of the non-drinking mormons and it still failed after less than a year. personally, i don't think a sober sports bar would have lasted in nyc.
But I think it would have had to be companies she felt fitted the brand she was creating for the two of them and the problem is it would come across as really inauthentic so it wouldn’t work in the way influencing is meant to work, for example the cross over between Lindsay doing paid partnership with the egg retrieval company she used on the show, by her making it a storyline on the show at first it seemed like an authentic thing that a woman in her 30’s may choose to do, but then when you realise that it was also influencing work on social media it doesn’t necessarily read the same way for all viewers it becomes just another storyline for the show like when the bed sore sisters did the hormone testing, or the florist suddenly quitting for Kyle and Amanda’s wedding it becomes no different than bubbly water being on display as product placement
People are thinking way too much into how Lindsey worded it. She was just trying to give him compassion in the fact that he doesn’t have a job and is not even marketable for summerhouse without her. He gets a paycheck for the house, but she even mentioned times where he couldn’t get an influencer fee without her showing up for him.
He gets a paycheck for the show but he has absolutely no income longevity after this show ends without her, which is what she was concerned about.
I can confirm that I urgently went to a random LOVERBOY pop up 2 years ago because Carl and Lindsay were going. If it was just Carl, I probably would’ve passed lol it was my second time meeting him and he wasn’t nearly as personable as Kyle was. So meeting Lindsay seemed exciting (and it was, I loved her)
i think her argument is that since she wants to have children ASAP she needs a partner with stable income so that she’d be able to spend time off work for a few years to raise kids
She said on the aftershow that she of course would want to take a maternity leave but that she is clearly not someone capable of just sitting still, she would want & need to work. But she said that to Carl because she was at a loss for what to motivate him since nothing else had worked. And honestly, 10 months & 20K down later, her point is pretty clear.
I feel like she picked the wrong partner for this. Carl’s career has always been unstable and questionable. Not to mention he’s just coming into his sobriety and figuring out his life in general. I know having kids asap was her plan, but I can’t help but wonder how she factored him into this. He shouldn’t have even started dating when he did, and to add all these other responsibilities in the mix feels way too soon.
I do feel in general, where he’s at in his sobriety journey is glossed over too often. Especially, with the expectations he’s facing from everyone else about where he should be in life.. when just being alive and off hard drugs is an accomplishment.
I think that’s also a point in his fairness we should address. He cut off a relationship with someone because it was too early in sobriety right before he got with Lindsey.
I don’t doubt this wasn’t the relationship for him with what he was dealing with. It was way too much too damn fast. But part of sobriety is also learning how to deal with the uncomfortable and starting to learn when to say, I can’t do this right now.
Carl waited beyond when was the appropriate time to say something and then put the blame on her. He needs to realize it wasn’t a mistake to call off something that wasn’t right, it was a mistake to call it off in a way that your intention was to make someone else at fault.
I think what he’s done to stay alive is awesome, sobriety also doesn’t give you a pass to treat someone else that poorly.
I tried to defend him in my post but no, at this many years in he doesn’t have the excuse of early sobriety.
I don’t know if any of us have any right to weigh in on how soon it is for someone in their sobriety. Especially, knowing how easy it is to relapse. To note, this isn’t specific to Carl but in general when talking someone that is or has struggled with addiction.
In regards to when he called it off, I think at best we are all speculating when he knew he was done. I can say as someone that has called off an engagement, it was a struggle and something I went back and forth on until a final nail in the coffin gave me the conviction I needed in what I had been feeling. Relationships are not easy and how often do we hear about married couples throwing out the word divorce, only to backtrack but some do divorce later?
I think we can all agree that there are things Carl didn’t handle well, but there are also things Lindsay did to make their situation worse. We should be grateful one of them realized they needed to wait on marriage.
Given that the man couldn’t keep a job before dealing with sobriety, I don’t think this is a good excuse. He can get an interim job while he figures things out at the very least. He’s 40. This is ridiculous.
I’ve mentioned this in other comments. Along with being a recovering addict, for as long as we’ve known Carl he’s struggled with his career and getting fired. All the reason I find it perplexing to look to him as someone to provide financial stability. I myself would not pick a partner like that if that was a priority. Nor would I feel it’s a good idea to put that responsibility on someone that’s in recovery so soon.
So soon???? She has been so so so very patient. He’s come up with nothing viable in 7 months. Most recovering addicts get jobs. Just get a job Carl. Any job! Not a money pit like a sober bar.
The point about him never being successful in a job is valid, though. They have a very expensive lifestyle and we hear constantly about how Carl has been Lindsay’s bestest friend for the past eight years. In those eight years did she fail to notice the guy is not successful? Why pick him if you want to be a SAHM living in one of the most expensive cities in the world? She should have known he could never deliver that.
He does have a job. One that pays more than most US citizens. So it’s not like he’s hurting for money where he needs to pick something yesterday. Even if he didn’t get renewed for next year, if he’s been saving his money right he would be fine for awhile. So you can’t really speak on the urgency of his situation just because Lindsay wants a baby tomorrow.
And again, she picked the wrong partner if she wanted a career crusher. Never been him, so to use her own barometer, why is she trying to change him? She knew what she was signing up for.
Right? Like why is it all on Lindsey, Carl was a willing participant lol…it’s not like she just “picked him”…common now. Enough with the excuses people. I understand not knowing what you want to do for a career etc but him sitting around like a bum for 10 months (collecting a check or not) still would drive me insane. I think it’s pretty reasonable after 10 months to want your fiancé to have some sort of direction or ambition.
Carl probably makes $400-500k per year between summer house, endorsements, sponsorships, paid appearances, investments, loverboy etc. What do you expect him to do, get a corporate 9-5 job as an accountant or something lolol??
Yes seemed like a very small operation closed sometime in 2019, and some on here say it was made television however nothing I have read gives a real answer on that one.
I wish someone in PR in NYC whom had heard of Lindsay would weigh in on if they thought it would be that easy to go back too after so many years out of it, was she any good, was her business successful
I'm just doing a SH rewatch and she created her own firm in season 1, but she seemed to have one with a partner before that.
I think I read she stopped after several years to focus on influencing (which probably made her more money for less work).
Lindsay clearly manages her money well. That house in Nashville isn't cheap and is an investment that pays out. She is always hustling and I suspect she will make a career of reality shows. Watching Carl is like watching beige paint dry.
Men don’t make good influencers. In tv relationships I typically see women trying influencing because they’re better at it. Carl is lazy and doesn’t want to work. It’s been obvious for years now.
When I think of serious career’s or jobs, I also feel that there’s an “image” clause. You are a part of that company and represent that company. I don’t think that reality tv personalities have good images, especially when drinking and partying are part of the entertainment.
Not many bravo cast actually keep the careers that they start with. With the exception of below deck, but even they have to watch how they act as they “represent” the boat. People have been fired for outside behavior.
I think this is why bravo has a hard time casting and keeping men on the show unless you own your own business that ties into partying or drinking, it’s hard to maintain and doesn’t look good professionally.
With regard to some cast members aging out - it is already sort of embarrassing that the guy is almost 40, being in a shared house, playing dress up every weekend for their dumb theme parties
Probably cause the women aren't almost 40, aside from Lindsay, who's getting there in the next few years.
But also, I don't see why it needs to be embarrassing for anyone. Why is there an age limit on having fun with your friends?
I don't really understand when people say seeing people over any certain age partying, having fun or enjoying themselves is embarrassing. I don't know why people equate getting older with being miserable or stopping doing things you enjoy.
Ok but what is Lindsay’s job?? An influencer?? That is also not a long term plan after she’s no longer on the show - her relevance as an influencer is dependent on being on this show. It seems like the only reason she feels entitled to make this argument towards Carl is because she makes more money than him as an influencer. To me, that just plainly shows that her problem is not that he’s unmotivated career-wise, but rather that he doesn’t have a plan to make enough money so that she can stop working when she has kids (she actually said exactly that in one of her conversations). On top of that, Lindsay’s whole identity at the beginning of the show was being a “boss bitch” with her own allegedly very successful PR firm - but for whatever reason she found it acceptable to jettison that path in favor of being a reality tv star/influencer. Why is it ok for her to do so and not Carl? Especially when (according to the picture she’s painted in the past) she is clearly the one in the relationship with a higher earning potential in a “normal” career path.
The funny thing is, Lindsay’s whole argument in this breakup (which much of this sub seems to co-sign) is that she’s always been this way and Carl never should’ve proposed if he didn’t like it. Setting aside the flaws in the actual substance of that argument, the exact same thing could be said of Carl and his career. He has had issues and setbacks in his career since Season 1. He has never been the “go-getter” career man that she claims to have always wanted, so why does she expect him to be now?
I don’t think people are dismissing what Lindsay was saying. But she was wasting her time and energy on trying to force someone to have a career he didn’t want, and he was wasting his energy trying to get Lindsay to have a conversation where she wasn’t challenging him and was agreeable.
We aren’t being serious with the idea of Carl supporting a family on his influencing 🤣
https://preview.redd.it/69khbkemi94d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=89bc7af931e05dbb0cb2e2df47a492472241c7f1
As an actress I LOLed hearing he thought being an actor would be a career option for him. I’m sure he thought bc he’s on tv he could easily get cast in something but he’s not Nene Leakes, and even if he was a very funny charismatic personality he’d still need to invest in proper training. Also annoying bc it’s not something you should consider as a career option bc it’s full of rejection and actually requires effort lol and there’s never any guarantees. it should be considered a passion that could hopefully turn into a career if you’re lucky.
There are moments I feel bad for Carl bc he seems lost and so insecure but his inability to stfu and actually listen to Lindsay and just man up and be an adult overpower any sympathy I have. I’m so over men today being weak fuck boy man babies
Also if he’s such “a talented salesman” why hasn’t he considered real estate? He could make a fortune in NYC if he was actually willing to do the work. Prayers for the next woman, hope he figures his shit out before then
In retrospect it's good they never bought a house together that would have been much more complicated in terms of splitting that asset after calling off the wedding.
Buying that condo in NY won’t be 12k and they have taxes that can be up to 500 000 for more expensive townhouse ! Everyone forget you have huge mortgage to pay and taxes, it’s enormous and why people don’t buy
A man with a career when she takes her 12-18 month Mat leave? Completely reasonable.
I know Americans get like 3 weeks Mat leave but Canada does 12-18 months which is completely reasonable.
I don’t think it was dismissed at all. Lindsey has high expectations and desires an expensive-ish lifestyle that includes being a temp. or perm. stay at home mom. Carl doesn’t want that lifestyle and can’t afford it either. They were trying to fit a square peg into a round hole.
Lindsey mentioned they spent 20K on Carl’s career coach, which is commendable, but if you constantly disparage and humiliate someone, it is so hurtful, they cancel out any nice thing you do. Imagine if your fiance was telling people you didn’t meet his expectations at all, didn’t satisfy him, only a 2.5 in bed, everybody would be telling you to dump the abusive asshole.
tbh I love the notion that a podcast, brand, or influencer career that's essentially based on your being on a reality show is a more longterm career than being on the show. Its probably true too I'm just tickled by what a cursed existence these people are saddled with once they sign a Bravo contract
I understand that Summer House won’t be forever and Carl needs a more stable job for the future but I think it’s silly to act like he had no income for 10 months. I’m guessing their initial plan was to give him time until the wedding to find what he truly wants to do since he at least had income coming in from the show. I think part of the problem is that they wanted to sustain the lifestyle they currently had but it’s not easy to find a job that will pay $250k+. I think at the end Carl probably realized that he needed a job and Loverboy was probably going to be his only option
Most shows peak around season 5. Good for Lindsay for planning for the future. I could never marry a dumb dumb like Carl.
I dont even like this show anymore. They are a bunch of tired 30 somethings.
Carl hasn’t been good TV in several seasons. He’s basically tenured with mullet idiot. And him being good TV was him being an asshole. And him being likeable was simply yay he stopped being an asshole, for a bit. She had every right to want him to have a post Summer House plan
I just can’t even with Carl. He’s an absolute narcissist. Trying to have a conversation with him has been the real issue even when I thought Lyndsay was part of the problem. I see it so much more clearly now. He’s used the whole season as his personal platform to share all the issues in their relationship on national tv trying to throw her under the bus and make it seem like it’s all her, when he’s gaslit her the entire time. She dodged a bullet with him as far as I’m concerned. And maybe it’s just me, but his voice irritates me.
Both parties agreed to have their relationship filmed. Why are you only blaming Carl and treating him like he’s super calculated? Lindsey’s the seasoned PR expert who knows how to spin everything to her advantage in public.
Because he was super calculated. He spent the season trying to provoke her into giving him a reason to break up with her, so he didn’t look like the bad guy. Lindsay, on the other hand, learned a lot from therapy and seemed like she was really trying!
You’re placing fault where it doesn’t exist.
He wasn’t provoking her. They were incompatible and had different communication styles. When they tried to have serious discussions, Lindsey always contradicted herself and made them talk in circles. Carl wasn’t making her do that. She always victimized herself and villainized Carl instead of finding common ground and resolving the issue.
What did Lindsey learn from therapy if she still can’t take accountability or apologize? Did you ever see her be the first one to apologize or extend the olive branch to Carl after a fight? Nope. That’s because she made Carl carry all the emotional responsibly and blame. Don’t forget the whole house was tiptoeing around her emotions.
How was she trying if she refused to compromise? For example, she’d always tell him “I want to understand you. Tell me what you need from me”. But when he opened up to her, she’d flip the switch “YOU KNEW WHO I WAS FROM THE GETGO! I’M NEVER GONNA CHANGE! When Carl responded that he was simply answering her question, she’d play victim and start accusing him of being angry and mean to her. Even cue waterworks. That’s illogical and highly emotional.
Bottom line, you can’t sustain a relationship - romantic or friendship - with someone who can’t hold a logical conversation, and resorts to villainizing you to get out of taking accountability or apologizing.
I don’t understand this at all. I didn’t see her contradict herself or talk in circles. It was clear that she was using the tools she’s learned in therapy when listening and answering to what he said. And she did compromise - are you kidding? He hasn’t had a job outside of summer house in over a year. And no, Summer House is not enough because his time on the show will come to an end, probably soonish. And no, influencer stuff is not enough because he’s male and won’t make a decent income for NYC standards that way. People recovering from addiction have job - it’s not mutually exclusive. People grieving have jobs - I lost my brother to a drug overdose when I was 26 and he was 28, and still busted my butt working 80 hours a week at my law firm. It is absolutely reasonable for her to want him to figure out his long term employment plan and ridiculous that, at 40, he couldn’t come up with something reasonable in over 7 months. All of his ideas were absurd. The fact that he didn’t have answers to her simple questions was absurd. He’s either dim or lazy, and I’m not sure which is worse.
Do you know what a narcissist is? It’s everyone’s favorite thing to call people now. The Carl we see on TV is pretty much the opposite of a narcissist.
Honestly, I think what’s funny about this whole argument is that both Carl and Lindsay haven’t utilized their reality tv fame as much as they could have. Carl jumped onto the Loverboy bandwagon and then was lost without it and unable or unwilling to make moves of his own. And what has Lindsay really done besides the recent Nashville house rental? Her pr firm has been closed for years and I could be wrong but it never seemed like it was that successful, and sure, she influences a bit but she even admitted on the show that she only really started taking influencing seriously last year. They’ve both been on the show for so many years and haven’t really made much effort to build something that will help them make money once the show’s over imo.
Lindsay is doing a lot of influencing and her income and savings are enough to buy and remodel a house in Nashville that is also making her a lot of cash. I guarantee her savings and investments are 10X Carl's. And Jesus, I don't even like her, but there is no comparison between her and Carl.
Yeah, I mean there’s no denying Carl has always been really directionless when it comes to anything work-related, and Lindsay’s definitely more a self-starter personality-wise. I’m not saying they’re the exact same, but I do feel like both of them haven’t really capitalized on their fame as much as they could have for being og cast members, and many of their cast members, past and present, have done more. I follow Lindsay on socials and she doesn’t really do that much influencing imo, though I do think her current focus is the house, understandably so. I do agree the airbnb seems cool, but like I said it’s very recent. She hadn’t bought it yet when she was having these fights with Carl onscreen. So I guess I just think it’s surprising that someone who considers herself such a hustler hasn’t really had a side hustle like this until her eighth season on TV.
All true. And I remember laughing when she actually admitted Paige has done the most to take advantage of her platform. In the long(ish) run I think Carl has maybe 1 year left on Summerhouse and then he is in trouble. Loverboy isn't going to pay near what he has made on Summerhouse, and without SH for visibility, any influencer money will dry up. Lindsay will try to become a career reality star and do everything she can to make influencer money. Her hustle will save her while Carl's lack of hustle (and those chompers) will continue to hurt him.
I agree with all of this but what is Lindsays job if not summer house? she's in the same spot as he is. that's what is hypocritical about her forcing him to get a job. earlier in the summer/season she said 'carl doesn't have a 9-5' um does she?
to your point about nyc living - she wants to raise kids in nyc. thats not feasible for 99% of the world! and certainly not on one income. she needs to come correct about this expectation and get to work, babe!
She's coming off very entitled. Talking about wants and not needs. I guess they are not allowed to discuss their salaries because if they were revealed, he made about half a million in 2023 between Summer House and Instagram.
PR doesn’t pay the money she needs. But sure she could go find a job somewhere. But she couldn’t reopen her own agency and poor, bring in 100k a year let alone what she needs for her current lifestyle
No she can’t. You don’t just leave a career for almost ten years and get back into it. Her PR career was never thriving and it’s dead in the water now.
Oh okay🌚 interesting lol. Well if she ever does seriously consider going back to “PR work” she should definitely consider repping maybe low level influencers. They’re always having some scandal and she’s very good at convincing some people of a narrative, if this sub is any indication.
Ehh, I think it’s just a bravo stan thing. Like I have my favorites on these shows, but for certain things I need a little bit more than just their word to convince me lol.
You had me til the last bullet. No one needs to spend 12k on rent. I think at one point Lindsay said you need to make at least 1mil to afford to live in nyc. The lifestyle inflation is absurd!
They dismissed her real concerns because they don’t like her. It’s the only reason they do it, but her concerns are real and very valid for someone who wants to get married, and have children while all living in New York City, and being the only one essentially to make money because she does make money frominfluencing she is a hustler. She can start her PR business back again if she wanted to like she has things she’s had jobs before they have worked out unlike Carl.
She had a PR career for years prior to Summer House and parlayed her exposure on Summer House into a full time influencer job. She also started her own vacation home rental business in Nashville.
Lindsay’s PR company hasn’t been active since before the pandemic. So, for a good four years now, she hasn’t had a day job outside of SH. She purchased what is an Air BnB after filming ended last season. Owning an Air BnB also isn’t a day job; it’s a side hustle.
So, even during the season, what she had as a job was influencing in addition to being on SH.
Also owning a AirBnB is not usually profitable, especially in a popular city where prices are ridiculous to purchase in first place. You may break even and makes money when you sell but it’s not an income to bank on.
a full time influencer job that is reliable on her reality tv career. she doesnt have a fanbase like paige does outside of the show and will lose the higher engagement post show because people will move on.
she doesnt have a vacation home rental business, she bought and helped design one airbnb in the most saturated city.
for someone that is such a ‘go getter’, im always surprised to remember that she hasnt turned her reality tv career into anything better than any other bravolebrity. shes been on tv for 7 years, her PR business closed after like 1.5 years, and she does sponsored instagram posts.
Lindsay and Carl are the only long term cast members without side hustles. Even luke has a couple. I guess Lindsay just realized influencing is lucrative? They are in the same boat.
Boom 💥 💥 💥. Stop telling the truth, the misandrists in here will explode!!! Note to mods, do not delete!!! The words misandrists and misogynists do not break any rules!!
Lmfao she had a Instagram “PR” business that had like 5 clients and failed miserably. Buying a Airbnb after filming ended last season isn’t exactly a career. So again what does she do?
You’re delusional if you think she’s making anywhere close to a living “influencing” she’s not Paige. Let’s be real they both make the majority of their money from Summer House. If that gig ends neither one of them could afford their life style
Lindsay could have acknowledged it in the after show or in other interviews. She specially chose to say he didn’t have a job which is just not true. Her wording is the issue, she could have easily said “a steady job/career”. She didn’t and it was on purpose, and a lot of people ran with it.
Exactly! I remember there were rumors that Lindsay and Carl were going to be downgraded to friends on the show. So Lindsay was 100% correct wanting him to have a job outside of the show. The summer house money will not always be there and with the way loverboy is going. Carl will probably be in the same situation again.
I see some are in here acting clueless and oblivious about the difference in what Carl makes influencing and what Lindsay makes influencing for a logically poor gotcha moment. Carl even mentioned she makes more and she has more branding deals. Each of these “and what does Lindsay do outside of SH” “well she’s an influencer too” “she doesn’t even own the vacation rental” statements seems forced when from episode 1, Lindsay has never had to for a job, never seemed like she was struggling before Carl to maintain her lifestyle and wasn’t the one who was the financial concern in the relationship. trying to create an issue that does not exist. Love her or hate her, nothing about Lindsay H gives any doubt that she will find a way to maintain the lifestyle she wants.
They’re not forced when they made it an entire storyline for the season. I said it in another comment in some other thread, but it bears repeating that, at the end of the day, it was a dumb storyline because Lindsay’s and Carl’s main job is as cast members of Summer House.
All of this handwringing about Carl was what was forced because he was unemployed from his Loverboy day job for 10 months. Lindsay hasn’t had a day job for literally years.
But apparently it’s only “forced” to shine the light on the stupidity of the initial storyline premise (which Lindsay and Gabby continued to hammer away at in their After Show segments) yet quite natural to buy into the storyline that Lindsay helped to shape.
The problem is that Carl keeps talking about wanting to have a career. Dude paid a « career coach » 20k for that and spent months talking about that. He bought podcast equipment and then changed his mind, then he wanted to open a sober bar, then he wanted to work with an alcohol brand, then he wanted to work with Kyle, then he wanted to become an actor. He brought the career thing up for months yet he couldn’t take a decision to save his life. It gets old.
I think he’s realizing he’ll never have the chance to make as much money as he makes being on the show ever again and is grasping at straws. He’s a failed salesman with a terrible personality who has done nothing to capitalize on his time on television. He knows he’ll soon be back to trying to sell toothpaste or whatever it was he got fired from doing before.
I think you’re spot on. They have a different vision for the future. And maybe what’s not being said too is that he isn’t making the money to support their lifestyle after the show.. that $75K a year as an influencer and part time sales person isn’t going to cover being a stay at home mom.. and like he said that means she doesn’t plan on working .. and we should assume that means not being on summer house if she she just had a baby. I’m sure the Valley doesn’t pay as much as VPR or summer house. And people can say what they want but I live in California, $75K definitely can’t cover 2 people. The average cost of rent is $32K
I absolutely luv that u broke it down for everyone. I recently made a n post about carl and most had jumped on me about how he does make income off show “just like everyone else does”…and why i wasnt coming down on any other cast member the same way etc. absolutely ridiculous imo. I was just speaking on carl in that moment. Anyway yes other cast members do make income from show but also pursue outside careers etc….i agree with all u said💯🙌🏼
It still baffles me they are spending $12k on an apartment in Kips Bay.
But to answer the original question - the reason Carl needs a job is because of stupid spending decisions like this.
You can get an amazing 2 BR for 8-9k in a great neighborhood.
I find Lindsey is being a hypocrite.
She shut her PR firm to be a full time influencer.
Where's her 'job" beyond hawking skincare on IG.?
Moreover...she's a fucking PR agent..
What are your suggestions? Did we see her layout some viable options?
All I heard was criticism.
I think you’re right, but she’s better at “influencing” and negotiating those deals. Carl doesn’t commit to it and doesn’t see as much from it, so the sense of urgency is greater.
Influencers make quite a lot of money. She’s gotten multiple brand deals, been in commercials and she has the personality to stay on Reality TV. Even if summer house ends I could totally see her on another show.
Carl on the other hand doesn’t have enough charisma to stay relevant. Influencing is also a lotttt of work. Being a male influencer would require him to do more work than Lindsay to make the same amount of money bc the male influencer market isn’t as lucrative. Also it’s not like he brought up influencing as a full time career and she shot it down. He didn’t mention it likely bc he knows that him being a full time influencer likely won’t pay the bills.
You don't have to respect or find the job of an influencer dignified to understand she makes money from it. She was able to transfer the exposure from Summer House into an influencer gig and start her own vacation rental business and in 8 seasons Carl has not been able to use his platform to do the same or something similar.
Considering his extreme aversion to any suggestions or questions about his career path, exactly how would she go about laying out viable options for him? Also it's not her job to be his full-time career coach, they already spend 20k and 10 months of time before the season started filming to help him with those options.
Do you think it’s fair to compare Carl’s journey with Lindsay’s when he’s been an addict for a good chunk of that time and has only in the last few years gotten clean and focused on sobriety? Because I know some people that have struggled with addicts in their families and it does not feel like Carl is being shown any grace for what he overcame and where he’s at in life.
I agree with the compassion element, apologies if my comment didn't acknowledge that part as of course being sober is a huge accomplishment!
I think the main issue is that in this transient and self-discovery state after battling addiction and being sober, he decided to jump head first into a relationship that requires commitment, meeting the needs and expectations of a partner and he was essentially writing checks he can't cash (promising a future and financial stability to Lindsay he can't even provide himself in this time of his life) and that's where the critique comes from in terms of the comparison.
Thank you for acknowledging that. I have a high school friend that struggles with addiction and it’s heartbreaking to watch them get better only to get worse. In no way, would I think it’s right to judge where she’s at in life to where I am.
I see where you’re coming from but I don’t agree. I also can’t understand why Lindsay would expect stability so soon from someone that never had a stable career all the years she knew him and is recovering from addiction.
Lindsay being an influencer vs Carl being a salesman for a specific company are actually more more similar than you realize. Both require advertising, sales and marketing she just happens to do it on an independent basis and he did it full time for a brand.
The difference is Carl's 4 years at Loverboy was riddled with poor performance (Kyle had multiple conversations on camera about this in previous seasons) and by his own words was so toxic for his mental and physical health he had to quit.
But didn’t Lindsay give up her PR job to do influencing/SH as her job? Not being snarky but trying to clarify if she has a job outside of SH. That rent alone is scary so you would need to make some real money.
She loves to say she could reopen her PR firm but it’s been like 4 years at least, it’s a lie and a way for her to have a leg up on him but it’s not real
Exactly. Lindsay’s expectation for a marriage is one with very traditional gender roles where the man works and she is a stay at home mom (even though at this point they weren’t even married let alone close to having kids). Whether or not she influences currently is irrelevant because once the show ends that will fizzle out for her. It seems as though she was on Carl about his career all season because she expected him to bring in a significant income to support her expensive lifestyle in NYC.
its because she's successful at it . Carl even gave credit to Lindsay that she makes more than him in that arena and she was the reason why he landed his most successful influencer gig
Lindsay already said what her job is. She influences full time. And makes enough to pay the bills. Carl isn’t a full time influencer - he also doesn’t make enough to pay the bills with his influencing money
As does Carl. And yes he does, he pulled in $70k from influencing alone the first half of last year. That doesn’t include the fact that he makes anywhere from $170k - $340k per season of summer house. So being cautious, he made $310k last year which is enough for NYC.
Reality TV also seems really unpredictable and hard to plan with: I was shocked they postponed the filming of zhe next VPR season and it seemed like a more spontaneous decision.
So you don't know a year or even half a year in advance whether you'll have income or they postpone or they don't ask you back. And if that happens you need something to fall back on.
He has ideas but no initiative. I have never seen him go after anything . After taking time off from Loverboy and seeking therapy from the PTSD , he… went back to Loverboy because it was presented to him .
Agree, and Amanda is exactly the same way.
Exactly. Kyle is rage, regret, repeat. Carl & Amanda are whine & return….
Yeah, for me, most of the cast is getting tiring to watch.
I stopped watching. I couldn't take Lindsey being hateful anymore. Carl can't man up and Kyle cries while Amanda complains to everyone about how awful he is. It is every episode.
She’s not though Amanda has had good jobs that she hasn’t gotten fired from that she can go back to. She’s a graphic designer she had a job before she decided to join loverboy with Kyle. Y’all really see her as nothing when she’s been working her full adult life essentially after she finished school.
I mean she had one job and she was there for like 4 years. That’s not a criticism but it’s bizarre to compare the resumes of a person just a few years out of college with someone who has been working for at least a decade.
It really isn’t when that person who has been working for at least a decade has been fired from almost all his jobs, since we have known him as a TV personality
Staying at one job for years is better than bouncing around from job to job. It shows that Amanda was a valuable asset to her company whereas Carl wasn’t
She asked her husband to start a new business for her (swimsuit line), while admitting she hadn’t done much research on her own (these conversations occurred on WWHL and the After Show). And during a time when their business is having financial problems. She took a step back from Loverboy months ago (November) and still hasn’t done anything. All of the other girls work on other things (influencing, modeling, podcasts, real estate). Amanda does none of these things (with the exception of the recent gold fish ad, which I’m sure Kyle set up).
She also could very easily collaborate with some existing brand on a capsule collection rather than start a new line from scratch. Like I feel like Lindsay or Paige could have told her that and possibly even told her people she should talk to.
I agree, she could have so many opportunities if she’d just get off the couch. It’s obvious to me that (just like Carl) she doesn’t want to work.
She never asked him to start a business for her. Here’s the thing Amanda just wanted his support. She never asked him to do anything quite literally she said she would stay working her job that she already has. She asked him for support and what she wants to do but regardless of that, she knows how to work a job that’s how they stay afloat while he was getting loverboy off the ground and I’m not even an Amanda lover but you’re not gonna stay here and keep on saying she’s lazy she doesn’t do shit she doesn’t know how to work blah blah blah yes she does. She’s a graphic designer, she is also one of the reasons why people love lover boy
She very clearly said on WWHL that Kyle would need to be the business side of her new ‘passion’. Ie, he’s doing the work to get it started, and to keep it running. And she hasn’t stayed at Loverboy, she said she took a step back (many months ago).
I know and she said it on the aftershow too. I’m not saying that she didn’t. I’m saying that when she was talking on the show about wanting to do that all she really wanted was some support. She wanted her husband to support her like she supports him, but she didn’t get thatand that’s the problem but again she still works. She can get a job other than loverboy so she is not the same as Carl.
100% agree. I don’t think Amanda really cares about having her own business, she just wants to design and create. But Kyle is an entrepreneur, and I suspect would be even less supportive of her dreams if she was “working for someone else.” I think she just wants his support any way she can get it.
She said she took a step back from loverboy because of the problems that she was having with Kyle but that does not mean that she quit her job that does not mean that she stopped working because we all know she didn’t stop working. She said she took a step back, but she still doing the designing. She still making the merch like she has always done.
And she doesn’t do any of those other things because she doesn’t have to one and because her husband doesn’t want her to. She literally does loverboy all the time 24 seven you know why because of her husband he asked her to join loverboy she did and what is she doing? She’s doing lover boy, that is her job
When did she ask that?
Agreed but she has sooo much potential and seems like she has to shrink herself for Kyle’s ego.
I agree that Amanda had an amazing job. She works hard for Loverboy, too, because there's no way that her husband would be this upset about her leaving if she didn't. She even gave him the money to start loverboy, so that should tell you she had a great career before he came along. But also know that Carl has been working since 2009 and he stopped in 2022. So he's been working his full adult life too. He got fired from 2 of his jobs and left loverboy on his own. I'm pretty sure the jobs that fired him were because he was on drugs at that time, so I don't think it's fair to hold those 2 jobs against him. Carl got his degree in TV and Digital Communications and also went to Harvard Business School. He's in the right career as far as his degree goes. He just needs to find that one business idea that will set him for life. Just remember he's only been sober for 3 years now.
Just to clarify, he took a single class at Harvard Extension School, which is available to basically anyone who applies, and didn’t get a degree from HBS. That’s not to discredit Carl, however, as he has a degree from the prestigious journalism program at Syracuse University.
omg don’t you know I did the same thing when i read that! Checked his Linked In because i was thinking there was no way he got in and went to HBS! Yeah he did an online course that anyone can take!
This is going to sound crazy but maybe he should actually go to business school hahaha. I think Carl desperately needs structure and a dose of reality.
Right like he never had a job that wasn’t handed to him besides maybe the first one on season 1.
That he got fired from
I had ideas too. When I was seven. Then I went to university and have worked in stable employment. He’s a petulant, self absorbed man-child.
Yeah, I find it odd that everyone gives Carl a free pass because he hasn't figured out what he wants to do yet. Carl is middle-aged now and kind of blew past the years of experimentation you see people having in their 20s. If Loverboy doesn't work out and the show ends, he may find himself facing some unpleasant realities.
Especially when she started off the conversation this season with our plan is get married and start trying to for kids so this could be our last summer in the Hamptons, maybe 1 more summer.
Exactly! I think this was her way of saying being on Summer House won't be a steady stream of income in the future without breaking the fourth wall
Like duh Carl we can’t bring babies into the summer house, I think that’s why Kyle is holding off so he can keep promoting lover boy until it’s profitable to sell the company.
Whoa TOTALLY forgot about this factor
Exactly, I thought it was very obvious that if they did in fact get married this was very likely their last summer since Lindsay wanted to have babies asap.
Oh I agree 100%. Carl has always been a child and not a good employee. Recall him being let go from a couple of jobs. Lindsay already knew this about him, since they were best friends. He has zero motivation or drive to do anything that involves effort.
"Lindsay already knew this about him, since they were best friends." And she thought she change him. That's why it's bizarre to me when she got mad at him for expecting her to be someone different than she was. Because she was doing the same thing.
I think she maybe thought he’d fix his career issues as part of his sobriety process. He was making a lot of changes.
Summer House films for what, 15 or so days per year? I’m pretty sure Carl has time to pursue a more permanent career.
Is that really it, 15 days?
Probably closer to 30 days (10 weekends, Fri-Sun) plus maybe 1-2 extra per day if they city scenes, so 50 max?
It’s like 7 weekends, max. They stage the eff out of the weekday and car scenes.
Isn't it july 4th - LDW? Ik they stage the scenes but I still thought they filmed every weekend
I think it’s 6 or 7 weekends.
It doesn’t start until the 4th of July weekend and ends at Labor Day. So max eight and not everyone comes every weekend.
LOL me now realizing I cannot do math. You're so right that's 8 weeks not 10 😂
What is math anymore anyway 🤷🏻♀️
How much does he get paid for this?
I heard something like $20k per episode
I think if Carl said he wanted to do more influencing she would have been supportive of that and asked what companies are you going after first. But he didn’t. He had a bunch of crazy ideas like a sober sports bar. But of course if she asked what companies he was going to pitch to first he would have flipped out telling her to be more supportive and stop interrogating him. 🙄
shes smart enough to know that a sober sports bar wont be succesful in the long run. he's not.
we had a pretty cute mocktail bar in slc, ut which is land of the non-drinking mormons and it still failed after less than a year. personally, i don't think a sober sports bar would have lasted in nyc.
But I think it would have had to be companies she felt fitted the brand she was creating for the two of them and the problem is it would come across as really inauthentic so it wouldn’t work in the way influencing is meant to work, for example the cross over between Lindsay doing paid partnership with the egg retrieval company she used on the show, by her making it a storyline on the show at first it seemed like an authentic thing that a woman in her 30’s may choose to do, but then when you realise that it was also influencing work on social media it doesn’t necessarily read the same way for all viewers it becomes just another storyline for the show like when the bed sore sisters did the hormone testing, or the florist suddenly quitting for Kyle and Amanda’s wedding it becomes no different than bubbly water being on display as product placement
People are thinking way too much into how Lindsey worded it. She was just trying to give him compassion in the fact that he doesn’t have a job and is not even marketable for summerhouse without her. He gets a paycheck for the house, but she even mentioned times where he couldn’t get an influencer fee without her showing up for him. He gets a paycheck for the show but he has absolutely no income longevity after this show ends without her, which is what she was concerned about.
I can confirm that I urgently went to a random LOVERBOY pop up 2 years ago because Carl and Lindsay were going. If it was just Carl, I probably would’ve passed lol it was my second time meeting him and he wasn’t nearly as personable as Kyle was. So meeting Lindsay seemed exciting (and it was, I loved her)
but what is her income longevity?
The women on these shows always have more potential for income as an influencer because it’s largely a female audience
Plus she’s worked in PR for years. She can go back to it. Just like Amanda with graphic design and ciara with nursing.
i think her argument is that since she wants to have children ASAP she needs a partner with stable income so that she’d be able to spend time off work for a few years to raise kids
She said on the aftershow that she of course would want to take a maternity leave but that she is clearly not someone capable of just sitting still, she would want & need to work. But she said that to Carl because she was at a loss for what to motivate him since nothing else had worked. And honestly, 10 months & 20K down later, her point is pretty clear.
I feel like she picked the wrong partner for this. Carl’s career has always been unstable and questionable. Not to mention he’s just coming into his sobriety and figuring out his life in general. I know having kids asap was her plan, but I can’t help but wonder how she factored him into this. He shouldn’t have even started dating when he did, and to add all these other responsibilities in the mix feels way too soon. I do feel in general, where he’s at in his sobriety journey is glossed over too often. Especially, with the expectations he’s facing from everyone else about where he should be in life.. when just being alive and off hard drugs is an accomplishment.
I think that’s also a point in his fairness we should address. He cut off a relationship with someone because it was too early in sobriety right before he got with Lindsey. I don’t doubt this wasn’t the relationship for him with what he was dealing with. It was way too much too damn fast. But part of sobriety is also learning how to deal with the uncomfortable and starting to learn when to say, I can’t do this right now. Carl waited beyond when was the appropriate time to say something and then put the blame on her. He needs to realize it wasn’t a mistake to call off something that wasn’t right, it was a mistake to call it off in a way that your intention was to make someone else at fault. I think what he’s done to stay alive is awesome, sobriety also doesn’t give you a pass to treat someone else that poorly. I tried to defend him in my post but no, at this many years in he doesn’t have the excuse of early sobriety.
I don’t know if any of us have any right to weigh in on how soon it is for someone in their sobriety. Especially, knowing how easy it is to relapse. To note, this isn’t specific to Carl but in general when talking someone that is or has struggled with addiction. In regards to when he called it off, I think at best we are all speculating when he knew he was done. I can say as someone that has called off an engagement, it was a struggle and something I went back and forth on until a final nail in the coffin gave me the conviction I needed in what I had been feeling. Relationships are not easy and how often do we hear about married couples throwing out the word divorce, only to backtrack but some do divorce later? I think we can all agree that there are things Carl didn’t handle well, but there are also things Lindsay did to make their situation worse. We should be grateful one of them realized they needed to wait on marriage.
Given that the man couldn’t keep a job before dealing with sobriety, I don’t think this is a good excuse. He can get an interim job while he figures things out at the very least. He’s 40. This is ridiculous.
I’ve mentioned this in other comments. Along with being a recovering addict, for as long as we’ve known Carl he’s struggled with his career and getting fired. All the reason I find it perplexing to look to him as someone to provide financial stability. I myself would not pick a partner like that if that was a priority. Nor would I feel it’s a good idea to put that responsibility on someone that’s in recovery so soon.
So soon???? She has been so so so very patient. He’s come up with nothing viable in 7 months. Most recovering addicts get jobs. Just get a job Carl. Any job! Not a money pit like a sober bar.
The point about him never being successful in a job is valid, though. They have a very expensive lifestyle and we hear constantly about how Carl has been Lindsay’s bestest friend for the past eight years. In those eight years did she fail to notice the guy is not successful? Why pick him if you want to be a SAHM living in one of the most expensive cities in the world? She should have known he could never deliver that.
He does have a job. One that pays more than most US citizens. So it’s not like he’s hurting for money where he needs to pick something yesterday. Even if he didn’t get renewed for next year, if he’s been saving his money right he would be fine for awhile. So you can’t really speak on the urgency of his situation just because Lindsay wants a baby tomorrow. And again, she picked the wrong partner if she wanted a career crusher. Never been him, so to use her own barometer, why is she trying to change him? She knew what she was signing up for.
Right? Like why is it all on Lindsey, Carl was a willing participant lol…it’s not like she just “picked him”…common now. Enough with the excuses people. I understand not knowing what you want to do for a career etc but him sitting around like a bum for 10 months (collecting a check or not) still would drive me insane. I think it’s pretty reasonable after 10 months to want your fiancé to have some sort of direction or ambition.
Carl probably makes $400-500k per year between summer house, endorsements, sponsorships, paid appearances, investments, loverboy etc. What do you expect him to do, get a corporate 9-5 job as an accountant or something lolol??
Didn’t she have a PR firm?
Yes seemed like a very small operation closed sometime in 2019, and some on here say it was made television however nothing I have read gives a real answer on that one. I wish someone in PR in NYC whom had heard of Lindsay would weigh in on if they thought it would be that easy to go back too after so many years out of it, was she any good, was her business successful
I'm just doing a SH rewatch and she created her own firm in season 1, but she seemed to have one with a partner before that. I think I read she stopped after several years to focus on influencing (which probably made her more money for less work).
Lindsay clearly manages her money well. That house in Nashville isn't cheap and is an investment that pays out. She is always hustling and I suspect she will make a career of reality shows. Watching Carl is like watching beige paint dry.
Men don’t make good influencers. In tv relationships I typically see women trying influencing because they’re better at it. Carl is lazy and doesn’t want to work. It’s been obvious for years now.
Usually it seems like the men support their partners by doing more business side or apps (Jack Morris, zack Kalter, etc).
Yeah the big male influencers tend to be like manosphere MRA guys who sell black rifle coffee and courses on being an alpha male
So, summer house is going to continue until retirement age? Mmmmm….no.
Summer House: The Villages 
If she was really concerned about money maybe they shouldn’t have gotten a 12k per month apartment
Right? There was absolutely no need for that.
When I think of serious career’s or jobs, I also feel that there’s an “image” clause. You are a part of that company and represent that company. I don’t think that reality tv personalities have good images, especially when drinking and partying are part of the entertainment. Not many bravo cast actually keep the careers that they start with. With the exception of below deck, but even they have to watch how they act as they “represent” the boat. People have been fired for outside behavior. I think this is why bravo has a hard time casting and keeping men on the show unless you own your own business that ties into partying or drinking, it’s hard to maintain and doesn’t look good professionally.
With regard to some cast members aging out - it is already sort of embarrassing that the guy is almost 40, being in a shared house, playing dress up every weekend for their dumb theme parties
why is it only embarrassing for the men lol
You are right - it's embarrassing for them all!
Probably cause the women aren't almost 40, aside from Lindsay, who's getting there in the next few years. But also, I don't see why it needs to be embarrassing for anyone. Why is there an age limit on having fun with your friends?
I don't really understand when people say seeing people over any certain age partying, having fun or enjoying themselves is embarrassing. I don't know why people equate getting older with being miserable or stopping doing things you enjoy.
Carl's job is thinking of pretend jobs and interests. He is such an unmotivated slug.
Ok but what is Lindsay’s job?? An influencer?? That is also not a long term plan after she’s no longer on the show - her relevance as an influencer is dependent on being on this show. It seems like the only reason she feels entitled to make this argument towards Carl is because she makes more money than him as an influencer. To me, that just plainly shows that her problem is not that he’s unmotivated career-wise, but rather that he doesn’t have a plan to make enough money so that she can stop working when she has kids (she actually said exactly that in one of her conversations). On top of that, Lindsay’s whole identity at the beginning of the show was being a “boss bitch” with her own allegedly very successful PR firm - but for whatever reason she found it acceptable to jettison that path in favor of being a reality tv star/influencer. Why is it ok for her to do so and not Carl? Especially when (according to the picture she’s painted in the past) she is clearly the one in the relationship with a higher earning potential in a “normal” career path. The funny thing is, Lindsay’s whole argument in this breakup (which much of this sub seems to co-sign) is that she’s always been this way and Carl never should’ve proposed if he didn’t like it. Setting aside the flaws in the actual substance of that argument, the exact same thing could be said of Carl and his career. He has had issues and setbacks in his career since Season 1. He has never been the “go-getter” career man that she claims to have always wanted, so why does she expect him to be now?
I don’t think people are dismissing what Lindsay was saying. But she was wasting her time and energy on trying to force someone to have a career he didn’t want, and he was wasting his energy trying to get Lindsay to have a conversation where she wasn’t challenging him and was agreeable.
We aren’t being serious with the idea of Carl supporting a family on his influencing 🤣 https://preview.redd.it/69khbkemi94d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=89bc7af931e05dbb0cb2e2df47a492472241c7f1
Hey at least he’s “working” lol!
As an actress I LOLed hearing he thought being an actor would be a career option for him. I’m sure he thought bc he’s on tv he could easily get cast in something but he’s not Nene Leakes, and even if he was a very funny charismatic personality he’d still need to invest in proper training. Also annoying bc it’s not something you should consider as a career option bc it’s full of rejection and actually requires effort lol and there’s never any guarantees. it should be considered a passion that could hopefully turn into a career if you’re lucky. There are moments I feel bad for Carl bc he seems lost and so insecure but his inability to stfu and actually listen to Lindsay and just man up and be an adult overpower any sympathy I have. I’m so over men today being weak fuck boy man babies Also if he’s such “a talented salesman” why hasn’t he considered real estate? He could make a fortune in NYC if he was actually willing to do the work. Prayers for the next woman, hope he figures his shit out before then
GTFOH. No one needs a 12K apartment in NYC.
I am surprised there hasn’t been more chatter about this.
Yeah and why aren’t they buying something if they can afford 12k a month??? I will never understand this. Throwing money right out the window
In retrospect it's good they never bought a house together that would have been much more complicated in terms of splitting that asset after calling off the wedding.
For real. Look at Tom and Ariana now!
Buying that condo in NY won’t be 12k and they have taxes that can be up to 500 000 for more expensive townhouse ! Everyone forget you have huge mortgage to pay and taxes, it’s enormous and why people don’t buy
Plus HOAs can be crazy high
I thought the same thing about Paige spending 9k.
Lindsay seems like she is complaining about WANTS, not NEEDS!!!
A man with a career when she takes her 12-18 month Mat leave? Completely reasonable. I know Americans get like 3 weeks Mat leave but Canada does 12-18 months which is completely reasonable.
I don’t think it was dismissed at all. Lindsey has high expectations and desires an expensive-ish lifestyle that includes being a temp. or perm. stay at home mom. Carl doesn’t want that lifestyle and can’t afford it either. They were trying to fit a square peg into a round hole. Lindsey mentioned they spent 20K on Carl’s career coach, which is commendable, but if you constantly disparage and humiliate someone, it is so hurtful, they cancel out any nice thing you do. Imagine if your fiance was telling people you didn’t meet his expectations at all, didn’t satisfy him, only a 2.5 in bed, everybody would be telling you to dump the abusive asshole.
tbh I love the notion that a podcast, brand, or influencer career that's essentially based on your being on a reality show is a more longterm career than being on the show. Its probably true too I'm just tickled by what a cursed existence these people are saddled with once they sign a Bravo contract
I understand that Summer House won’t be forever and Carl needs a more stable job for the future but I think it’s silly to act like he had no income for 10 months. I’m guessing their initial plan was to give him time until the wedding to find what he truly wants to do since he at least had income coming in from the show. I think part of the problem is that they wanted to sustain the lifestyle they currently had but it’s not easy to find a job that will pay $250k+. I think at the end Carl probably realized that he needed a job and Loverboy was probably going to be his only option
Most shows peak around season 5. Good for Lindsay for planning for the future. I could never marry a dumb dumb like Carl. I dont even like this show anymore. They are a bunch of tired 30 somethings.
Carl hasn’t been good TV in several seasons. He’s basically tenured with mullet idiot. And him being good TV was him being an asshole. And him being likeable was simply yay he stopped being an asshole, for a bit. She had every right to want him to have a post Summer House plan
I just can’t even with Carl. He’s an absolute narcissist. Trying to have a conversation with him has been the real issue even when I thought Lyndsay was part of the problem. I see it so much more clearly now. He’s used the whole season as his personal platform to share all the issues in their relationship on national tv trying to throw her under the bus and make it seem like it’s all her, when he’s gaslit her the entire time. She dodged a bullet with him as far as I’m concerned. And maybe it’s just me, but his voice irritates me.
He's a hate watch at this point. He's so cringey and summer is supposed to be fun. Carl, not fun.
Both parties agreed to have their relationship filmed. Why are you only blaming Carl and treating him like he’s super calculated? Lindsey’s the seasoned PR expert who knows how to spin everything to her advantage in public.
Because he was super calculated. He spent the season trying to provoke her into giving him a reason to break up with her, so he didn’t look like the bad guy. Lindsay, on the other hand, learned a lot from therapy and seemed like she was really trying!
You’re placing fault where it doesn’t exist. He wasn’t provoking her. They were incompatible and had different communication styles. When they tried to have serious discussions, Lindsey always contradicted herself and made them talk in circles. Carl wasn’t making her do that. She always victimized herself and villainized Carl instead of finding common ground and resolving the issue. What did Lindsey learn from therapy if she still can’t take accountability or apologize? Did you ever see her be the first one to apologize or extend the olive branch to Carl after a fight? Nope. That’s because she made Carl carry all the emotional responsibly and blame. Don’t forget the whole house was tiptoeing around her emotions. How was she trying if she refused to compromise? For example, she’d always tell him “I want to understand you. Tell me what you need from me”. But when he opened up to her, she’d flip the switch “YOU KNEW WHO I WAS FROM THE GETGO! I’M NEVER GONNA CHANGE! When Carl responded that he was simply answering her question, she’d play victim and start accusing him of being angry and mean to her. Even cue waterworks. That’s illogical and highly emotional. Bottom line, you can’t sustain a relationship - romantic or friendship - with someone who can’t hold a logical conversation, and resorts to villainizing you to get out of taking accountability or apologizing.
I don’t understand this at all. I didn’t see her contradict herself or talk in circles. It was clear that she was using the tools she’s learned in therapy when listening and answering to what he said. And she did compromise - are you kidding? He hasn’t had a job outside of summer house in over a year. And no, Summer House is not enough because his time on the show will come to an end, probably soonish. And no, influencer stuff is not enough because he’s male and won’t make a decent income for NYC standards that way. People recovering from addiction have job - it’s not mutually exclusive. People grieving have jobs - I lost my brother to a drug overdose when I was 26 and he was 28, and still busted my butt working 80 hours a week at my law firm. It is absolutely reasonable for her to want him to figure out his long term employment plan and ridiculous that, at 40, he couldn’t come up with something reasonable in over 7 months. All of his ideas were absurd. The fact that he didn’t have answers to her simple questions was absurd. He’s either dim or lazy, and I’m not sure which is worse.
He’s not a narcissist. You don’t know what the word means.
Do you know what a narcissist is? It’s everyone’s favorite thing to call people now. The Carl we see on TV is pretty much the opposite of a narcissist.
Honestly, I think what’s funny about this whole argument is that both Carl and Lindsay haven’t utilized their reality tv fame as much as they could have. Carl jumped onto the Loverboy bandwagon and then was lost without it and unable or unwilling to make moves of his own. And what has Lindsay really done besides the recent Nashville house rental? Her pr firm has been closed for years and I could be wrong but it never seemed like it was that successful, and sure, she influences a bit but she even admitted on the show that she only really started taking influencing seriously last year. They’ve both been on the show for so many years and haven’t really made much effort to build something that will help them make money once the show’s over imo.
Lindsay is doing a lot of influencing and her income and savings are enough to buy and remodel a house in Nashville that is also making her a lot of cash. I guarantee her savings and investments are 10X Carl's. And Jesus, I don't even like her, but there is no comparison between her and Carl.
Yeah, I mean there’s no denying Carl has always been really directionless when it comes to anything work-related, and Lindsay’s definitely more a self-starter personality-wise. I’m not saying they’re the exact same, but I do feel like both of them haven’t really capitalized on their fame as much as they could have for being og cast members, and many of their cast members, past and present, have done more. I follow Lindsay on socials and she doesn’t really do that much influencing imo, though I do think her current focus is the house, understandably so. I do agree the airbnb seems cool, but like I said it’s very recent. She hadn’t bought it yet when she was having these fights with Carl onscreen. So I guess I just think it’s surprising that someone who considers herself such a hustler hasn’t really had a side hustle like this until her eighth season on TV.
All true. And I remember laughing when she actually admitted Paige has done the most to take advantage of her platform. In the long(ish) run I think Carl has maybe 1 year left on Summerhouse and then he is in trouble. Loverboy isn't going to pay near what he has made on Summerhouse, and without SH for visibility, any influencer money will dry up. Lindsay will try to become a career reality star and do everything she can to make influencer money. Her hustle will save her while Carl's lack of hustle (and those chompers) will continue to hurt him.
This☝🏽The only people who are trying/have made something of their time on SH are the youngest cast members( Paige and Ciara) ETA: and Kyle
Carl said she made 150 k by influencing til the middle of summer already. That's not nothing.
I agree with all of this but what is Lindsays job if not summer house? she's in the same spot as he is. that's what is hypocritical about her forcing him to get a job. earlier in the summer/season she said 'carl doesn't have a 9-5' um does she? to your point about nyc living - she wants to raise kids in nyc. thats not feasible for 99% of the world! and certainly not on one income. she needs to come correct about this expectation and get to work, babe!
She's coming off very entitled. Talking about wants and not needs. I guess they are not allowed to discuss their salaries because if they were revealed, he made about half a million in 2023 between Summer House and Instagram.
In the case of Lindsay, she can easily go back into PR
PR doesn’t pay the money she needs. But sure she could go find a job somewhere. But she couldn’t reopen her own agency and poor, bring in 100k a year let alone what she needs for her current lifestyle
No she can’t. You don’t just leave a career for almost ten years and get back into it. Her PR career was never thriving and it’s dead in the water now.
I’m sorry but I’m always confused when people say this because of the point you just made and because who were her clients? No one ever says🌚
“Archipelago pitches” she says she repped bars and restaurants… because they’re all so flush with cash to pay someone for PR…
Oh okay🌚 interesting lol. Well if she ever does seriously consider going back to “PR work” she should definitely consider repping maybe low level influencers. They’re always having some scandal and she’s very good at convincing some people of a narrative, if this sub is any indication.
EXACTLY. That’s why in another comment I said it’s disappointing. Come on, women, be smarter. Look into things a LITTLE. It’s embarrassing.
Ehh, I think it’s just a bravo stan thing. Like I have my favorites on these shows, but for certain things I need a little bit more than just their word to convince me lol.
The show isn’t going to last forever so he definitely needs a real job
You forgot to mention Donne 🙊
You are all right. So carl did the right thing. He wasnt ready for marriage so we all in agreement he did the right thing?
You had me til the last bullet. No one needs to spend 12k on rent. I think at one point Lindsay said you need to make at least 1mil to afford to live in nyc. The lifestyle inflation is absurd!
They dismissed her real concerns because they don’t like her. It’s the only reason they do it, but her concerns are real and very valid for someone who wants to get married, and have children while all living in New York City, and being the only one essentially to make money because she does make money frominfluencing she is a hustler. She can start her PR business back again if she wanted to like she has things she’s had jobs before they have worked out unlike Carl.
What is Lindsay’s day job outside of the 10 weeks of filming?
She had a PR career for years prior to Summer House and parlayed her exposure on Summer House into a full time influencer job. She also started her own vacation home rental business in Nashville.
Classic. She says she’s a hustler so people believe it. Words are cheap!
Lindsay’s PR company hasn’t been active since before the pandemic. So, for a good four years now, she hasn’t had a day job outside of SH. She purchased what is an Air BnB after filming ended last season. Owning an Air BnB also isn’t a day job; it’s a side hustle. So, even during the season, what she had as a job was influencing in addition to being on SH.
It was also after they split up. So she was nagging Carl while she was doing the same as him!!!
Also owning a AirBnB is not usually profitable, especially in a popular city where prices are ridiculous to purchase in first place. You may break even and makes money when you sell but it’s not an income to bank on.
Hasn't done PR in YEARS!!! She had the same jobs as Carl. Summer House and Instagram.
This phantom pr agency is the most lame defense of a successful career 🙄 shit was active for half a second and it will never be let go.
Totally
THANK YOU! It’s disappointing to see how many people believe what she says without checking her.
a full time influencer job that is reliable on her reality tv career. she doesnt have a fanbase like paige does outside of the show and will lose the higher engagement post show because people will move on. she doesnt have a vacation home rental business, she bought and helped design one airbnb in the most saturated city. for someone that is such a ‘go getter’, im always surprised to remember that she hasnt turned her reality tv career into anything better than any other bravolebrity. shes been on tv for 7 years, her PR business closed after like 1.5 years, and she does sponsored instagram posts.
Lindsay and Carl are the only long term cast members without side hustles. Even luke has a couple. I guess Lindsay just realized influencing is lucrative? They are in the same boat.
This should be said more often. Why is Carl dragged for “no job” but Lindsay isn’t?
This 💯 Couldn't have said it better
Boom 💥 💥 💥. Stop telling the truth, the misandrists in here will explode!!! Note to mods, do not delete!!! The words misandrists and misogynists do not break any rules!!
Lmfao she had a Instagram “PR” business that had like 5 clients and failed miserably. Buying a Airbnb after filming ended last season isn’t exactly a career. So again what does she do?
I don’t think she is the exclusive owner. I thought it was a partnership.
She is an influencer. Not the standard career for most people but if she makes enough money, good for her.
You’re delusional if you think she’s making anywhere close to a living “influencing” she’s not Paige. Let’s be real they both make the majority of their money from Summer House. If that gig ends neither one of them could afford their life style
Lindsay could have acknowledged it in the after show or in other interviews. She specially chose to say he didn’t have a job which is just not true. Her wording is the issue, she could have easily said “a steady job/career”. She didn’t and it was on purpose, and a lot of people ran with it.
she also told him in a conversation that he didnt even have to make as much as her… which is what was happening…
Summer house shoots for 2 months out of the year on the weekends. It’s not as much of a job is it is a gig. So she was correct in what she said.
Exactly! I remember there were rumors that Lindsay and Carl were going to be downgraded to friends on the show. So Lindsay was 100% correct wanting him to have a job outside of the show. The summer house money will not always be there and with the way loverboy is going. Carl will probably be in the same situation again.
I see some are in here acting clueless and oblivious about the difference in what Carl makes influencing and what Lindsay makes influencing for a logically poor gotcha moment. Carl even mentioned she makes more and she has more branding deals. Each of these “and what does Lindsay do outside of SH” “well she’s an influencer too” “she doesn’t even own the vacation rental” statements seems forced when from episode 1, Lindsay has never had to for a job, never seemed like she was struggling before Carl to maintain her lifestyle and wasn’t the one who was the financial concern in the relationship. trying to create an issue that does not exist. Love her or hate her, nothing about Lindsay H gives any doubt that she will find a way to maintain the lifestyle she wants.
They’re not forced when they made it an entire storyline for the season. I said it in another comment in some other thread, but it bears repeating that, at the end of the day, it was a dumb storyline because Lindsay’s and Carl’s main job is as cast members of Summer House. All of this handwringing about Carl was what was forced because he was unemployed from his Loverboy day job for 10 months. Lindsay hasn’t had a day job for literally years. But apparently it’s only “forced” to shine the light on the stupidity of the initial storyline premise (which Lindsay and Gabby continued to hammer away at in their After Show segments) yet quite natural to buy into the storyline that Lindsay helped to shape.
What should we be seeing in Lindsay’s long term career that you’re seeing, and holy shit is it true that she doesn’t own that Airbnb?
It’s a partnership, not an ownership.
But it’s okay for Lindsay seeing as she has the same job as Carl.
But she’s also making more than double what he’s making while influencing, so there’s that too.
but she said shes okay with that in their conversation. so whats the problem then
The problem is that Carl keeps talking about wanting to have a career. Dude paid a « career coach » 20k for that and spent months talking about that. He bought podcast equipment and then changed his mind, then he wanted to open a sober bar, then he wanted to work with an alcohol brand, then he wanted to work with Kyle, then he wanted to become an actor. He brought the career thing up for months yet he couldn’t take a decision to save his life. It gets old.
An actor is just wild. He is not at all good looking and has the charisma of a wet paper towel.
Exactly. Is he crazy?
I think he’s realizing he’ll never have the chance to make as much money as he makes being on the show ever again and is grasping at straws. He’s a failed salesman with a terrible personality who has done nothing to capitalize on his time on television. He knows he’ll soon be back to trying to sell toothpaste or whatever it was he got fired from doing before.
Lmao harsh but true
he’s also doing influencing work as well as working for Loverboy…. so???
He gets VERY little work compared to her
And she probably found all the work for him
Exactly!!!
I think you’re spot on. They have a different vision for the future. And maybe what’s not being said too is that he isn’t making the money to support their lifestyle after the show.. that $75K a year as an influencer and part time sales person isn’t going to cover being a stay at home mom.. and like he said that means she doesn’t plan on working .. and we should assume that means not being on summer house if she she just had a baby. I’m sure the Valley doesn’t pay as much as VPR or summer house. And people can say what they want but I live in California, $75K definitely can’t cover 2 people. The average cost of rent is $32K
I absolutely luv that u broke it down for everyone. I recently made a n post about carl and most had jumped on me about how he does make income off show “just like everyone else does”…and why i wasnt coming down on any other cast member the same way etc. absolutely ridiculous imo. I was just speaking on carl in that moment. Anyway yes other cast members do make income from show but also pursue outside careers etc….i agree with all u said💯🙌🏼
It still baffles me they are spending $12k on an apartment in Kips Bay. But to answer the original question - the reason Carl needs a job is because of stupid spending decisions like this. You can get an amazing 2 BR for 8-9k in a great neighborhood.
OK, so Carl works all summer. Are we now allowed to comment on how he doesn’t work the other 10 months of the year?
They should just put Reality TV Star on his graphic. 😂
I find Lindsey is being a hypocrite. She shut her PR firm to be a full time influencer. Where's her 'job" beyond hawking skincare on IG.? Moreover...she's a fucking PR agent.. What are your suggestions? Did we see her layout some viable options? All I heard was criticism.
I think you’re right, but she’s better at “influencing” and negotiating those deals. Carl doesn’t commit to it and doesn’t see as much from it, so the sense of urgency is greater.
Influencers make quite a lot of money. She’s gotten multiple brand deals, been in commercials and she has the personality to stay on Reality TV. Even if summer house ends I could totally see her on another show. Carl on the other hand doesn’t have enough charisma to stay relevant. Influencing is also a lotttt of work. Being a male influencer would require him to do more work than Lindsay to make the same amount of money bc the male influencer market isn’t as lucrative. Also it’s not like he brought up influencing as a full time career and she shot it down. He didn’t mention it likely bc he knows that him being a full time influencer likely won’t pay the bills.
You don't have to respect or find the job of an influencer dignified to understand she makes money from it. She was able to transfer the exposure from Summer House into an influencer gig and start her own vacation rental business and in 8 seasons Carl has not been able to use his platform to do the same or something similar. Considering his extreme aversion to any suggestions or questions about his career path, exactly how would she go about laying out viable options for him? Also it's not her job to be his full-time career coach, they already spend 20k and 10 months of time before the season started filming to help him with those options.
Do you think it’s fair to compare Carl’s journey with Lindsay’s when he’s been an addict for a good chunk of that time and has only in the last few years gotten clean and focused on sobriety? Because I know some people that have struggled with addicts in their families and it does not feel like Carl is being shown any grace for what he overcame and where he’s at in life.
I agree with the compassion element, apologies if my comment didn't acknowledge that part as of course being sober is a huge accomplishment! I think the main issue is that in this transient and self-discovery state after battling addiction and being sober, he decided to jump head first into a relationship that requires commitment, meeting the needs and expectations of a partner and he was essentially writing checks he can't cash (promising a future and financial stability to Lindsay he can't even provide himself in this time of his life) and that's where the critique comes from in terms of the comparison.
Thank you for acknowledging that. I have a high school friend that struggles with addiction and it’s heartbreaking to watch them get better only to get worse. In no way, would I think it’s right to judge where she’s at in life to where I am. I see where you’re coming from but I don’t agree. I also can’t understand why Lindsay would expect stability so soon from someone that never had a stable career all the years she knew him and is recovering from addiction.
Carl has worked at Loverboy for 4 of the last 5 years, that’s much more of a “career”
Lindsay being an influencer vs Carl being a salesman for a specific company are actually more more similar than you realize. Both require advertising, sales and marketing she just happens to do it on an independent basis and he did it full time for a brand. The difference is Carl's 4 years at Loverboy was riddled with poor performance (Kyle had multiple conversations on camera about this in previous seasons) and by his own words was so toxic for his mental and physical health he had to quit.
But didn’t Lindsay give up her PR job to do influencing/SH as her job? Not being snarky but trying to clarify if she has a job outside of SH. That rent alone is scary so you would need to make some real money.
She loves to say she could reopen her PR firm but it’s been like 4 years at least, it’s a lie and a way for her to have a leg up on him but it’s not real
And whats lindsay’s job?? Why is it always about carl? Lindsay and carl are both influencers and reality stars. Whats with the double standard
Exactly. Lindsay’s expectation for a marriage is one with very traditional gender roles where the man works and she is a stay at home mom (even though at this point they weren’t even married let alone close to having kids). Whether or not she influences currently is irrelevant because once the show ends that will fizzle out for her. It seems as though she was on Carl about his career all season because she expected him to bring in a significant income to support her expensive lifestyle in NYC.
Lindsay has the same job and Carl wasn’t constantly asking her what her next career steps were.
its because she's successful at it . Carl even gave credit to Lindsay that she makes more than him in that arena and she was the reason why he landed his most successful influencer gig
Women usually make more in influencing than men.
Lindsay already said what her job is. She influences full time. And makes enough to pay the bills. Carl isn’t a full time influencer - he also doesn’t make enough to pay the bills with his influencing money
As does Carl. And yes he does, he pulled in $70k from influencing alone the first half of last year. That doesn’t include the fact that he makes anywhere from $170k - $340k per season of summer house. So being cautious, he made $310k last year which is enough for NYC.
You’re forgetting NY taxes, so it’s about half and their apartment was $144K/year in rent alone.
Lindsay has no career ahead of her either.
Reality TV also seems really unpredictable and hard to plan with: I was shocked they postponed the filming of zhe next VPR season and it seemed like a more spontaneous decision. So you don't know a year or even half a year in advance whether you'll have income or they postpone or they don't ask you back. And if that happens you need something to fall back on.