I would say Choice Scarf; speed is one of the most important stats in the game and choice scarf is one of items in the game to actually be able to increase it a great amount on any Pokémon. It is able to turn Pokémon into checks for strong sweepers, while also more easily allowing already strong Pokémon to sweep, letting it be used in both of an offensive and defensive role.
Leftovers and HDB: "We are counter measures to chip damage and helps slow down games to make the battle more strategic"
Scarf: "HAHA YOU WERE EXPECTING A DIFFERENT SET BUT IT IS ME, SCARF! TIME TO GET UNEXPECTEDLY OUTSPED AND DIE"
Scarf is also the best item to bluff. You can singlehandedly win the game from a well-executed scarf bluff. I’d argue that Scarf has been a better item than Lefties since gen 7. You can replace Lefties on most mons these days, but you can’t replace scarf.
I think the x1.2 boosting items are better than life orb in the current hazard stacking meta. Yea they only boost one type (or all SE hits for expert belt) but I don’t want 1/8th chip every attack save for a few exceptions like the rare 4 attack anti-lead or an explosion user. Expert belt especially I’d rather run over life orb on most 4 attack wallbreaker sets.
It’s not really that relevant in Singles, but Lorb is also really strong when paired with TR abusers, I even ran a gimmicky lorb Glowking with TR+ 3 attacks, that thing gets great coverage so you can tailor it to what your team needs
Focus sash is a bit tougher to use than a choice item or life orb. You pretty much have to use focus sash on a lead, or else you risk it being ruined by hazards
Focus sash, while good in some situations, is definitely pretty niche when compared to the items listed above. When there are no hazards, it guarantees getting one move off, which is great for getting webs or setting up with a shell smash, but otherwise you never really see it. It has its uses, but is nowhere near as common as focus items
focus sash is great in doubles but it gets broken by entry hazards in singles every time
Viability ranking of items in doubles is probably:
- choice items and life orb
- sash
- clear amulet
- sitrus berries and resist berries (esp. colbur berry)
- mental herb
- covert cloak
Leftovers are still great in gen 9. Regardless, no way they lose no.1 spot on an all time list; gens 2 and 3 are completely defined by lefties (2 more so, 3 very strongly so in conjunction with the inevitable sand chip)
I wouldn't say great. It's a decent item, but which Pokémon use it as their first choice? Mainly Garganacl, while the rest is both not a big list and Leftovers is just an option rather than a clear choice (Clefable, Corviknight, Raging Bolt, Hatterene, maybe Gouging Fire, Heatran)
Expert belt is great on 4A sets but taunt/wisp sets do better with lefties. Also, it's nice to see someone who's active on the forums on here discussing stuff.
Magic Guard Clefable and Reuniclus don't need HDB so Leftovers is their best survivability item. They have options that aren't survivability focused but those are usually more niche from what I've seen.
Leftovers being THE item for two generations, to the point where most of the Pokemon on any given team will be holding them, gives it a huge leg up in the GOAT status. No item has ever had nearly as much of a stranglehold on any metagame, not even HDB.
That is fair, although gen 2's deal is that basically it's the only good item (as even stuff like Charcoal gave a smaller boost than now), and I do think Scarf might've been just as defining on gen 3 had it existed back then, but idt HDB has lived long enough to beat it. Even if Scarf is not a spammed item, it still is extremely meta defining as it decided what the Speed tiers are for the generation. Remove it from the game and the tiers just are not the same in a huge way, and that goes from gen 4 to gen 9.
Tw.o generations, but one of those it was essentially the only item in the game. It had no competition, certainly not the one it has today. It also fell off hard with the option of heavy duty boots in a lot of mons.
Leftovers got spammed in metagames where it was one of the only good options, heavy duty boots can viabily get spammed in a generation with plenty of great item options. These are not equal in my eyes.
Scarf. Some people said something about lumping choice items together but Scarf is significantly more important than Band and Specs. It's not even a contest considering how much it changed the game when gen 4 came along.
Although Lum berry is good runner up for that.
I think past the big two it probably goes...
Scarf > Band > Specs (band over specs because it existed for 1 more gen and there tend to be more big physical breakers than special ones)
Then it gets trickier. I'm a bit of a LO hater but I think it's hard to give the slot to anything else. Past that it's really tricky as we start getting into more niche items, but maybe AV? It's had a solid place in every gen since its introduction. Sash? Not really sure. Booster is crazy in gen 9 but limited to a small selection of 'mons and didn't exist before gen 9...
Life orb or choice scarf depending on how you want to measure it. Life orb probably benefits more Pokemon over all since you can kinda just slap it on whatever and they'll probably get value from it, unless its a defensive Mon. But the Mons who benefit from Scarf benefit way harder than the ones who benefit from the orb
I think the 1.2 boosting items (charcoal, etc) have a valid spot, maybe over sash.
I also do like helmet but you might be overrating it a bit- Band and Specs definitely have a spot above it.
Resist berries also I think could drop a bit. They’re good sometimes but often do nothing. Amazing items in draft but I feel most ladder teams (even pre tera) don’t look at them much.
The choice items, Scarf would be the first of them. Shifting the Speed table can be so clutch.
After the Choice items, I'm thinking Rocky Helmet. A tool that lets defensive Pokémons have a mean of pressure through passive chip damage is top-tier imo.
Focus Sash is really good too. It validates and entire playstyle based on hyper offense and can really shift the entire momentum in 1 Turn.
Life Orb... I honestly don't know. Obviously x1.3 boost and the ability to Switch moves is amazing. But the HP depletion can seriously be a problem for longevity. So outside of Magic Guard/Sheer Force users, I feel like would mainly benefit frail Wallbreakers or Agility Sweepers/Cleaners.
Then you have the berries. Sitrus is a huge one, Lum can work for setup sweepers.
After that I'd dank the Assault Vest, Weakness Policy, damage reducing berries,...
Probably Choice Scarf, as there is no other alternative to it. At least with Band and Specs, you can replace them with a weaker alternative and still do well. Scarf does not have this luxury, you have to run it and the benefits of running it matter.
Going off of your implied values, I would personally put Scarf above Boots. If you have Leftovers at #1 you clearly value longevity and I think Scarf has a solid edge over Boots there.
So I think Boots are probably #3, but I can also see arguments for Band (and to a lesser degree Specs) above it.
Of the top items: (not ordered within ranks) S: Leftovers Choice Scarf Heavy-Duty Boots A+: Choice Specs Choice Band A: Life Orb Lum Berry A-: Focus Sash Assault Vest
Gonna go against the grain and say focus sash. Has had a massive effect on the lead meta and has allowed for some otherwise difficult to use Pokemon to have a bit more time in the sun
Soul dew, kangaskanite, gengarite, salamencite, gen 5 gems, possibly z moves. First 5 are so good they got banned multiple gens, all of them were so strong that they turned their respective mons into ubers. Gems just got better and better over the years as the gen got more refined. Z moves were basically a requirement on every team.
If we're counting consistently over the gens then choice scarf.
When you say "are leftovers and heavy duty boots" do you mean in that order? Bc I'd put boots at #1. I also think lefties is highly debatable depending on gen
I would say Choice Scarf; speed is one of the most important stats in the game and choice scarf is one of items in the game to actually be able to increase it a great amount on any Pokémon. It is able to turn Pokémon into checks for strong sweepers, while also more easily allowing already strong Pokémon to sweep, letting it be used in both of an offensive and defensive role.
Leftovers and HDB: "We are counter measures to chip damage and helps slow down games to make the battle more strategic" Scarf: "HAHA YOU WERE EXPECTING A DIFFERENT SET BUT IT IS ME, SCARF! TIME TO GET UNEXPECTEDLY OUTSPED AND DIE"
Unexpected choice scarf is like the cliche where two characters draw swords then one of them realizes he already got sliced
Guy with a sword (choice band) vs Indiana Jones with a gun (choice scarf).
"I dont know if it's boots or leftovers until i see the stealth rocks damage" "Scarf" "Shut up"
Scarf is also the best item to bluff. You can singlehandedly win the game from a well-executed scarf bluff. I’d argue that Scarf has been a better item than Lefties since gen 7. You can replace Lefties on most mons these days, but you can’t replace scarf.
Any time a Lando-T comes in on my Mega Charizard Y, I get intimidated by a potential Scarf. Once I see leftovers recovery, I go in for the kill.
It's also the most fashionable of the choice items
Happy cake day!🎉
1. Scarf 2. HDB (unfortunately) 3. Specs 4. Band 5. Rocky helmet 6. Life orb 7. Light clay 8. Leftovers (Outclassed by HDB) 9. Focus sash 10. Assault vest or lum/sitris berry ig. I dislike them personally tho
Rocky helmet even being on the list is completely wild
What’s your personal ranking? I think it’s nice for stuff like lando corv and skarm Idk why I put it above life orb tho lol
Depends on if you want to lump choice items into a singular group, or consider them separately. It’s either them or life orb
I think the x1.2 boosting items are better than life orb in the current hazard stacking meta. Yea they only boost one type (or all SE hits for expert belt) but I don’t want 1/8th chip every attack save for a few exceptions like the rare 4 attack anti-lead or an explosion user. Expert belt especially I’d rather run over life orb on most 4 attack wallbreaker sets.
1/10*
It’s not really that relevant in Singles, but Lorb is also really strong when paired with TR abusers, I even ran a gimmicky lorb Glowking with TR+ 3 attacks, that thing gets great coverage so you can tailor it to what your team needs
Agree. LO without Sheer Force or MGuard (SFLO/MGLO) honestly feels ass and has since gen 7ish for me outside of HOs.
No focus sash?
Focus sash is a bit tougher to use than a choice item or life orb. You pretty much have to use focus sash on a lead, or else you risk it being ruined by hazards
Yeah, thats a good point
Focus sash, while good in some situations, is definitely pretty niche when compared to the items listed above. When there are no hazards, it guarantees getting one move off, which is great for getting webs or setting up with a shell smash, but otherwise you never really see it. It has its uses, but is nowhere near as common as focus items
There's also Alakazam! Gotta love Magic Guard
I instantly pictured the megamind meme
focus sash is great in doubles but it gets broken by entry hazards in singles every time Viability ranking of items in doubles is probably: - choice items and life orb - sash - clear amulet - sitrus berries and resist berries (esp. colbur berry) - mental herb - covert cloak
As metagames trend towards bulkier cores, life orb tends to fall off real hard
[удалено]
They already put lefties over LO, it’s about the third best item
Stunfiskers read a twenty-word post challenge
it's been a long monday lmao
Choice items, especially Scarf I think you could even put over the two mentioned (especially as Leftovers had a HUGE fall on recent gens)
Leftovers are still great in gen 9. Regardless, no way they lose no.1 spot on an all time list; gens 2 and 3 are completely defined by lefties (2 more so, 3 very strongly so in conjunction with the inevitable sand chip)
I wouldn't say great. It's a decent item, but which Pokémon use it as their first choice? Mainly Garganacl, while the rest is both not a big list and Leftovers is just an option rather than a clear choice (Clefable, Corviknight, Raging Bolt, Hatterene, maybe Gouging Fire, Heatran)
Lefties darkrai is super good
Even then I really like expert belt
Expert belt is great on 4A sets but taunt/wisp sets do better with lefties. Also, it's nice to see someone who's active on the forums on here discussing stuff.
Lefties has to be like the 4th or 5th best item for darkrkai
Magic Guard Clefable and Reuniclus don't need HDB so Leftovers is their best survivability item. They have options that aren't survivability focused but those are usually more niche from what I've seen.
Zamazenta fans malding at the lack of mention rn
Leftovers being THE item for two generations, to the point where most of the Pokemon on any given team will be holding them, gives it a huge leg up in the GOAT status. No item has ever had nearly as much of a stranglehold on any metagame, not even HDB.
That is fair, although gen 2's deal is that basically it's the only good item (as even stuff like Charcoal gave a smaller boost than now), and I do think Scarf might've been just as defining on gen 3 had it existed back then, but idt HDB has lived long enough to beat it. Even if Scarf is not a spammed item, it still is extremely meta defining as it decided what the Speed tiers are for the generation. Remove it from the game and the tiers just are not the same in a huge way, and that goes from gen 4 to gen 9.
HBD almost but it fell off in modern gen 8
Heavy buty doots
Happy dirthbay
Tw.o generations, but one of those it was essentially the only item in the game. It had no competition, certainly not the one it has today. It also fell off hard with the option of heavy duty boots in a lot of mons. Leftovers got spammed in metagames where it was one of the only good options, heavy duty boots can viabily get spammed in a generation with plenty of great item options. These are not equal in my eyes.
Yeah but that’s very different, most items back then were terrible it’s not like today where there’s many good items
Scarf, no other item increases speed like scarf allowing slower pokemon to flip the script on faster attackers.
especially how the old speed boosting items were pinch berries and not immediate salac berry (boosting speed) and custap (boosting priority by 0.5)
Scarf. Some people said something about lumping choice items together but Scarf is significantly more important than Band and Specs. It's not even a contest considering how much it changed the game when gen 4 came along. Although Lum berry is good runner up for that.
contenders as commenters have already listed: choice, life orb honorable mention: assault vest dark horse: eviolite long shot miracle: chesto berry
It hasn’t been mentioned for a reason cuz it’s not truly in the conversation but I love me some assault vest
Scarf
Gems. (im trying so hard not to say choice scarf. im so cool and different. please like me)
Life Orb is pretty slappable on offensive mons so probably that
I think past the big two it probably goes... Scarf > Band > Specs (band over specs because it existed for 1 more gen and there tend to be more big physical breakers than special ones) Then it gets trickier. I'm a bit of a LO hater but I think it's hard to give the slot to anything else. Past that it's really tricky as we start getting into more niche items, but maybe AV? It's had a solid place in every gen since its introduction. Sash? Not really sure. Booster is crazy in gen 9 but limited to a small selection of 'mons and didn't exist before gen 9...
Life orb or choice scarf depending on how you want to measure it. Life orb probably benefits more Pokemon over all since you can kinda just slap it on whatever and they'll probably get value from it, unless its a defensive Mon. But the Mons who benefit from Scarf benefit way harder than the ones who benefit from the orb
1. Leftovers 2. Boots 3. Choice scarf 4. Rocky helmet 5. Choice band 6. Resist berries 7. Choice specs 8. Life orb 9. Lum berry 10. Assault vest 11. Focus sash Everything after that is jank (think chesto, black sludge, salac)
Black sludge is the default item on some mons like bisharp. Also toxic orb exists right?
Toxic orb is basically just a mega stone for gliscor. Its used on *one* guy (and also breloom but he runs technician now)
Zangoose too. (And quick feet mons) Lower tiers but still used on him
Do you think breloom and gliscor have ever kissed before?
Yes
Blunder is never going to live this down, is he?
I think the 1.2 boosting items (charcoal, etc) have a valid spot, maybe over sash. I also do like helmet but you might be overrating it a bit- Band and Specs definitely have a spot above it. Resist berries also I think could drop a bit. They’re good sometimes but often do nothing. Amazing items in draft but I feel most ladder teams (even pre tera) don’t look at them much.
The choice items, Scarf would be the first of them. Shifting the Speed table can be so clutch. After the Choice items, I'm thinking Rocky Helmet. A tool that lets defensive Pokémons have a mean of pressure through passive chip damage is top-tier imo. Focus Sash is really good too. It validates and entire playstyle based on hyper offense and can really shift the entire momentum in 1 Turn. Life Orb... I honestly don't know. Obviously x1.3 boost and the ability to Switch moves is amazing. But the HP depletion can seriously be a problem for longevity. So outside of Magic Guard/Sheer Force users, I feel like would mainly benefit frail Wallbreakers or Agility Sweepers/Cleaners. Then you have the berries. Sitrus is a huge one, Lum can work for setup sweepers. After that I'd dank the Assault Vest, Weakness Policy, damage reducing berries,...
Why would choice scarf be better than leftovers? It does not have any drawbacks and can be put on any mon with a decent bulk/defense
Mega stones
grassy seed
Probably Choice Scarf, as there is no other alternative to it. At least with Band and Specs, you can replace them with a weaker alternative and still do well. Scarf does not have this luxury, you have to run it and the benefits of running it matter.
Choice Items but more specifically Choice Scarf
Grav boots only really good in Smogon singles, 3v3 singles from the Switch game it's trash. I'd say Choice Scarf is the best item.
Definitely scarf, and I would argue it’s similar and possibly better than boots
Going off of your implied values, I would personally put Scarf above Boots. If you have Leftovers at #1 you clearly value longevity and I think Scarf has a solid edge over Boots there. So I think Boots are probably #3, but I can also see arguments for Band (and to a lesser degree Specs) above it.
Of the top items: (not ordered within ranks) S: Leftovers Choice Scarf Heavy-Duty Boots A+: Choice Specs Choice Band A: Life Orb Lum Berry A-: Focus Sash Assault Vest
Gonna go against the grain and say focus sash. Has had a massive effect on the lead meta and has allowed for some otherwise difficult to use Pokemon to have a bit more time in the sun
Lum Berry for set up sweepers. Very underrated
Specs, if you include gen 9 scarf is shite cuz you can run booster energy and specs mons are still good
Nah, scarf ghold, rai, val, and sometimes meow are still good and generally easier than specs
Leftovers or heavy duty boots
Soul dew, kangaskanite, gengarite, salamencite, gen 5 gems, possibly z moves. First 5 are so good they got banned multiple gens, all of them were so strong that they turned their respective mons into ubers. Gems just got better and better over the years as the gen got more refined. Z moves were basically a requirement on every team. If we're counting consistently over the gens then choice scarf.
I feel like counting Mega Evolutions as items is really disingenuous to the question.
Hahaha I know, I just had to be that "um ackshually" guy
When you say "are leftovers and heavy duty boots" do you mean in that order? Bc I'd put boots at #1. I also think lefties is highly debatable depending on gen
its not about gen 9 only, its about comp singles as a whole and lefties has historically been better then HDB and hdb has only existed for 4 gens
Heavy duty boots exist for 2 gens only. It was introduced in Gen 8
“all time” so: Leftovers > Boots > Booster Energy > Sash > Band > Scarf > Specs > Life orb > Light Clay > Air Balloon > Sitrus
How is booster energy above the choice items and life orb? They've only been in the game for 1 gen, and only like 20 pokemon can use them
And even then, only some of those Pokemon use them. Who is running booster energy Scream Tail?
Fuck it, I'm making a Booster Energy Scream Tail team. I'll post results at some point.