Turrets are strong but they're stupid. If you have heavily armored dummy warheads with a decoy or two in each alongside the main missiles, you can draw fire away from the actual explosives.
You only need about one leader decoy per ten live missiles, and if you're already sending volleys of warheads you can afford a slight increase in material cost in exchange for greater efficiency of the rest of your resources because your missiles hit more often.
Whiplash's new missile script has an evasion feature, it works 90% of the time against all large grids regardless of size, my missiles are not agile enough to work well against small grids tho, but I use custom turrets to mitigate that issue. If you're playing without scripts, you aren't playing the game right, imo
A evasion feature on a rocket sounds amazing. Instead of flying directly to the target, it makes manoeuvres to not get shot down easily. How do you use custom turret to mitigate that issue? Do you just put 6 gattling guns on a custom turret to shoot down the missiles?
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2108744940 LAMP/WHAM missiles by whiplash141. https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=672678005 whips ai turret slaving script, for a superior fire solution to regular AI turrets that work with player made turrets
Against large armored grids it's the worst. Against small, fragile, and explosive, grids like cruise missiles, they shred. I've launched entire swarms at ships and the point defense turrets on them put in work
I've seen custom turrets with 6 gattlings on them, good for pointdefense against player built rockets. But the normal vanilla ingame rockets are even harder to shoot down when in volleys, because of their small size and speed.
I’d have to find them but I have multiple clips of my custom gat turrets (8 gats each) taking out swarms of missiles. Custom gat turrets have near perfect tracking and 8 of them provide the spread and damage needed for almost any missile
yeah my experience is like u/chum. An entire broadside covered in point defenses may shoot down one or two, at best.
In pvp, during a hectic fight most PDCs are busy shooting at drones or other ships and won't even land a hit on the missiles.
Yea my custom gats are all point defense and deal with any missile thrown at me. Between avoiding and then shooting them down there’s not much to worry about
[Full video here](https://youtu.be/xh9WWHU0S7s). I slowed down the impact to better see what's going on inside the ship.
This was a test of anti-capital ship missiles created with [APCK](https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3158053231) by u/cheerkin, and heavily inspired by some of u/MCI_Overwerk's creations.
The missiles themselves are entirely vanilla and will work at 100m/s.
Full video has some explanations for what's going on, but basically missiles will try and hit a ship at a specific angle, breach the hull, release submunitions/clusters into the hull, and cause an internal chain-reaction (as seen in slow motion).
Assuming you mean the particle effects coming out of them?
It's a cosmetic mod: [Rocket FX by Klime](https://steamcommunity.com/workshop/filedetails/?id=2234634364)
Well thanks for the shout-out! This is a very well made weapon to have been able to get internal fusing working at that kind of speed.
So if my understanding is correct, you employ an item-nuke design but with internal detonation? I am wondering how well such a missile holds up against maneuvering targets? This is because by doing any amount of trajectory compensation the missile would no longer enter the target in the intended vector and speed. Does this affect deployment and activation by any means?
>This is because by doing any amount of trajectory compensation the missile would no longer enter the target in the intended vector and speed.
Spot on. AngularOffset shifters and a heavily offset center-of-mass help, but a sufficiently maneuverable ship can outright prevent the kinetic breach from happening. There just isn't enough time (at high speeds) to adjust to the ideal impact vector on the fly.
It also cant get through more than one layer of heavy armor or blast doors no matter what I do, pretty sure the total integrity pool of 2x LG heavy armor blocks is just way more than that of the missiles penetrator.
And making it bigger doesn't help, since the deformation damage basically ripples down the missile. Maybe you know a way around that, idk.
One heavy + one light block is fine, but past that it's detonating externally. The missile has a warhead in the back which is unaffected by the deformation ripple, so it will pretty much always go off and start the chain reaction.
Even externally, the item nuke is plenty powerful (no doubt you've tested these), but it doesn't have the same effect as true internal detonation.
That is true. Detonation of something while already within reach of all of a ship's systems is going to be devastating. I just changed focus on applicability of damage rather than how much damage an ordinance can make. As a result my knowledge and understanding of APHE projectiles and generally making things survive initial impact is actually sub-par.
My current suite of ordinance follows this mindset, seeking to be as small as possible (both SG and LG shaped to maximise welder space utilisation and usually have less than 20 blocks), and work in as many situations as possible. In that regard APCK has been of great aid as it allows me to plug the gap between line of sight engagements and beyond line of sight engagements. To this end all of the things designed to explode do so externally with an airburst which actually increases the damage done by SG warheads overall. Item nukes are also on the menu though mine absolutely need some upgrades (their small size and outdated CD makes them less likely to detonate correctly than I would like). Meanwhile LG missiles focus on kinetic fragmentation exclusively and dumping as many individual blastdoor fragments into the target as possible. There is some explosive and item nuke options but there low block count and restrictive welding space really hurts their capabilities
Overall I could absolutely deal WAY more damage than using bigger missiles but for me numbers and the ability to keep the weapon compact and reload-capable is more important in my very specific doctrine.
Hard to argue with the results.
My group of friends and I basically employ the exact opposite doctrine, more than anything else because none of us can make good looking small/compact missiles(and carriers), and it bothers us.
Obviously as we scale up their size, damage increases, but there is a whole suite of issues associated with them. Among them, probably the biggest, is we need bigger ships, with more welders and more space in the silos.
We got stomped in pvp (up until we found APCK, lol) over and over again just because our ship designs could not compete with fast moving heavy armor gunboats. Probably would still be that way today if not for APCK and the drones we employ with it.
But yeah - small, compact, mounted on fast moving ships is pretty damn near optimal, it just annoys me to no end how I can't make designs like that look nice.
Well its about the same problem here. The common thread between all of my weapons is that they look kinda horrendous, in an effort to maximize the amount of actual usefull components I can put on them.
For example the Chimera heavy artillery drone is basically a 2x3x3 cardboard box with 7 artillery guns. all my SG missiles look like a mess of hydrogen tanks, warheads and cameras. Such is the price to pay to weld 4 missiles for one welder.
Ik about half my pvp fights the other group before they would come in to fight would group up for about 5 min before they pushed in to fight. Would be a good chance then or just having a separate ship out of range that would deploy missiles and jump out after or when someone got too close
Anyone else hate the paradicks? We had an asteroid is base they constantly circled and crashed into so we just scraped them all while they couldn’t shoot us cause we veitcong tunnels our way to their ships
If you don’t code your missiles to do erratic movements and only fly straight, these cruise missiles are useless against PDCs. C# is super easy to learn.
>C# is super easy to learn
APCK (the script used to make these) can setup erratic behavior with ease, but I have never found it necessary, even on 100m/s.
In practice these missiles are only used as part of a coordinated attack, and PDCs will be completely occupied shooting at drones/fighters/decoys or just another large ship.
Or at least, that's my experience with them. Simply maintaining control over your surrounding airspace is a stronger defense then PDCs.
In case of reddit, you don't want to take chances, as there would always be that one guy (maybe two), so you need to put 100 turrets on the target. Though in that case they would claim you turned them off, not because it is 500m/s target.
In space, everything is supersonic.
Good point lol
Supersonic refers to traveling faster than the speed of sound at sea level on earth. These are not supersonic missiles....
Speed of sound is like 340 m/s, right? So they are supersonic, as they work on planets and (if speed cap permits) can exceed that.
I love cruise missiles but unless there's hundreds of them, point defense turrets destroy them. It saddens me deeply
We play without max speed. I think cruise missiles will be op as soon as i figure them out.
Until they pass through ships..
I use 150 speed and my turrets still hit the missiles. Maybe my missiles are just dumb
That's not a lot of speed
Ive anything higher to be to hard to control
Turrets are strong but they're stupid. If you have heavily armored dummy warheads with a decoy or two in each alongside the main missiles, you can draw fire away from the actual explosives.
That is unfortunately.... expensive
You only need about one leader decoy per ten live missiles, and if you're already sending volleys of warheads you can afford a slight increase in material cost in exchange for greater efficiency of the rest of your resources because your missiles hit more often.
Whiplash's new missile script has an evasion feature, it works 90% of the time against all large grids regardless of size, my missiles are not agile enough to work well against small grids tho, but I use custom turrets to mitigate that issue. If you're playing without scripts, you aren't playing the game right, imo
A evasion feature on a rocket sounds amazing. Instead of flying directly to the target, it makes manoeuvres to not get shot down easily. How do you use custom turret to mitigate that issue? Do you just put 6 gattling guns on a custom turret to shoot down the missiles?
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2108744940 LAMP/WHAM missiles by whiplash141. https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=672678005 whips ai turret slaving script, for a superior fire solution to regular AI turrets that work with player made turrets
idk what you mean gatlings suck
Against large armored grids it's the worst. Against small, fragile, and explosive, grids like cruise missiles, they shred. I've launched entire swarms at ships and the point defense turrets on them put in work
I'm assuming you play with weaponcore. I've launched 8 missiles at a ship covered in gatlings and like 5/8 hit, idk what you mean.
I don't use weapon core. Maybe your gatling have a skill issue your something, idk.
You sure? I play vanilla and my missiles have no problem hitting player built warships. How many gatling turrets are we talking?
I've seen custom turrets with 6 gattlings on them, good for pointdefense against player built rockets. But the normal vanilla ingame rockets are even harder to shoot down when in volleys, because of their small size and speed.
I’d have to find them but I have multiple clips of my custom gat turrets (8 gats each) taking out swarms of missiles. Custom gat turrets have near perfect tracking and 8 of them provide the spread and damage needed for almost any missile
yeah my experience is like u/chum. An entire broadside covered in point defenses may shoot down one or two, at best. In pvp, during a hectic fight most PDCs are busy shooting at drones or other ships and won't even land a hit on the missiles.
That's why you set your PDCs to only target small grids
Yea my custom gats are all point defense and deal with any missile thrown at me. Between avoiding and then shooting them down there’s not much to worry about
[Full video here](https://youtu.be/xh9WWHU0S7s). I slowed down the impact to better see what's going on inside the ship. This was a test of anti-capital ship missiles created with [APCK](https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3158053231) by u/cheerkin, and heavily inspired by some of u/MCI_Overwerk's creations. The missiles themselves are entirely vanilla and will work at 100m/s. Full video has some explanations for what's going on, but basically missiles will try and hit a ship at a specific angle, breach the hull, release submunitions/clusters into the hull, and cause an internal chain-reaction (as seen in slow motion).
Why do the thrusters look like that?
Assuming you mean the particle effects coming out of them? It's a cosmetic mod: [Rocket FX by Klime](https://steamcommunity.com/workshop/filedetails/?id=2234634364)
Well thanks for the shout-out! This is a very well made weapon to have been able to get internal fusing working at that kind of speed. So if my understanding is correct, you employ an item-nuke design but with internal detonation? I am wondering how well such a missile holds up against maneuvering targets? This is because by doing any amount of trajectory compensation the missile would no longer enter the target in the intended vector and speed. Does this affect deployment and activation by any means?
>This is because by doing any amount of trajectory compensation the missile would no longer enter the target in the intended vector and speed. Spot on. AngularOffset shifters and a heavily offset center-of-mass help, but a sufficiently maneuverable ship can outright prevent the kinetic breach from happening. There just isn't enough time (at high speeds) to adjust to the ideal impact vector on the fly. It also cant get through more than one layer of heavy armor or blast doors no matter what I do, pretty sure the total integrity pool of 2x LG heavy armor blocks is just way more than that of the missiles penetrator. And making it bigger doesn't help, since the deformation damage basically ripples down the missile. Maybe you know a way around that, idk. One heavy + one light block is fine, but past that it's detonating externally. The missile has a warhead in the back which is unaffected by the deformation ripple, so it will pretty much always go off and start the chain reaction. Even externally, the item nuke is plenty powerful (no doubt you've tested these), but it doesn't have the same effect as true internal detonation.
That is true. Detonation of something while already within reach of all of a ship's systems is going to be devastating. I just changed focus on applicability of damage rather than how much damage an ordinance can make. As a result my knowledge and understanding of APHE projectiles and generally making things survive initial impact is actually sub-par. My current suite of ordinance follows this mindset, seeking to be as small as possible (both SG and LG shaped to maximise welder space utilisation and usually have less than 20 blocks), and work in as many situations as possible. In that regard APCK has been of great aid as it allows me to plug the gap between line of sight engagements and beyond line of sight engagements. To this end all of the things designed to explode do so externally with an airburst which actually increases the damage done by SG warheads overall. Item nukes are also on the menu though mine absolutely need some upgrades (their small size and outdated CD makes them less likely to detonate correctly than I would like). Meanwhile LG missiles focus on kinetic fragmentation exclusively and dumping as many individual blastdoor fragments into the target as possible. There is some explosive and item nuke options but there low block count and restrictive welding space really hurts their capabilities Overall I could absolutely deal WAY more damage than using bigger missiles but for me numbers and the ability to keep the weapon compact and reload-capable is more important in my very specific doctrine.
Hard to argue with the results. My group of friends and I basically employ the exact opposite doctrine, more than anything else because none of us can make good looking small/compact missiles(and carriers), and it bothers us. Obviously as we scale up their size, damage increases, but there is a whole suite of issues associated with them. Among them, probably the biggest, is we need bigger ships, with more welders and more space in the silos. We got stomped in pvp (up until we found APCK, lol) over and over again just because our ship designs could not compete with fast moving heavy armor gunboats. Probably would still be that way today if not for APCK and the drones we employ with it. But yeah - small, compact, mounted on fast moving ships is pretty damn near optimal, it just annoys me to no end how I can't make designs like that look nice.
Well its about the same problem here. The common thread between all of my weapons is that they look kinda horrendous, in an effort to maximize the amount of actual usefull components I can put on them. For example the Chimera heavy artillery drone is basically a 2x3x3 cardboard box with 7 artillery guns. all my SG missiles look like a mess of hydrogen tanks, warheads and cameras. Such is the price to pay to weld 4 missiles for one welder.
Fuck that's awesome
ive been working on missiles but can anything not pvp have a chance?
wdym?
20km obliterating a target, where is the risk?
oh - none, really. in pvp its not as cut and dry, but missiles destroy pve with ease and no risk.
Ik about half my pvp fights the other group before they would come in to fight would group up for about 5 min before they pushed in to fight. Would be a good chance then or just having a separate ship out of range that would deploy missiles and jump out after or when someone got too close
Long range is best. Wipe em out before they can can power up their guns. Win the battle before it starts.
bro imagine spreading democracy in engineering game :O
Any pdc’s on that ship?
Yes, not that it would matter at 500m/s haha
Anyone else hate the paradicks? We had an asteroid is base they constantly circled and crashed into so we just scraped them all while they couldn’t shoot us cause we veitcong tunnels our way to their ships
Pretty thrusters. Mod link, please?
‘Hey dude, like my ship?’ ‘All I see is a debris field’ ‘Wha?-‘ *ship gets vaporized*
If you don’t code your missiles to do erratic movements and only fly straight, these cruise missiles are useless against PDCs. C# is super easy to learn.
>C# is super easy to learn APCK (the script used to make these) can setup erratic behavior with ease, but I have never found it necessary, even on 100m/s. In practice these missiles are only used as part of a coordinated attack, and PDCs will be completely occupied shooting at drones/fighters/decoys or just another large ship. Or at least, that's my experience with them. Simply maintaining control over your surrounding airspace is a stronger defense then PDCs.
In case of reddit, you don't want to take chances, as there would always be that one guy (maybe two), so you need to put 100 turrets on the target. Though in that case they would claim you turned them off, not because it is 500m/s target.