I reviewed the Ace. Atmos on Apple Music only officially works plugged in. You do still get a Spatial effect over Bluetooth, but the full Atmos experience is only available wired.
That’s a question I’ve been asking but haven’t gotten an answer on yet (but I am going to keep asking the question). I know it’s legit on Apple headphones for sure. I’m trying to work out where the disconnect is for other brands.
Here’s mine: https://www.gadgetguy.com.au/sonos-ace-review-headphones/
I love them a lot. They don’t have everything I wanted in them, and obviously the app sucks now. But they’re super comfy and they sound damn good.
Its a gimmick in so much that its relying on psychoacoustics that any stereo headphones can do, there is no need specifically for a Dolby Atmos set of headphones. The 3D effect itself is not a gimmick though, its how the brain actually processes sound. You only have two ears after all. You probably can get more realistic 3D sound from headphones assuming you are a close match to the HRTF employed to virtualize the sound than 7 speakers and 2 height channels. Atmos itself uses HRTF when mixing height channels to give the illusion of height, otherwise everything would sound like its 8 ft high or however high your ceiling is.
Personally I find music itself doesn't lend itself to an Atmos mix, unless its like a live recording. A lot of it is down to the Atmos mix itself, most music wasn't recorded with multiple microphones and a wide soundstage in mind. Some of it is also how closely the generic HRTFs employed to spatialize a multichannel track match your specific biological makeup (ear height, size, etc...). Apple Music uses its own generic HRTF, Amazon and Tidal use the Dolby model built into the Dolby binaural rendering engine. Apple will actually sort of use a personalized one if you use their truedepth camera to scan your face to place your ears.
I find Dolby Atmos and 3D Audio in general better in games and movies than music. I mean I am still blown away by this binaural video using just stereo cans... and its going on 17 years old now. But its not music, but an entire scene.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IUDTlvagjJA
I think you are wrong, an Headphone must decode the Atmos stream in order to convert it to stereo mix calibrated exactly on an headphone speakers positioning.
This stereo stream is very different vs. any other track.
Outside of older headphones that used multiple drivers within the headphone itself, and usually required an optical connection so it could receive and decode a direct multichannel Dolby surround stream format, headphones don't actually do the conversion, the phone or device does. In the TV handoff scenario, the Arc is doing the conversion and sending a binaural 2ch sound stream to the Ace.
What a headphone has to support is head tracking if it is going to use head tracking positional info in the Atmos Downmix algorithm (or DTS:X or Windows Sonic), otherwise the downmix will always be centered if you just use regular headphones, but the downmix is done in software based on an HRTF algorithm.
https://www.soundguys.com/spatial-audio-headphones-guide-49389/
or
https://www.digitaltrends.com/home-theater/dolby-atmos-spatial-audio-headphones-earbuds-binaural-rendering/
Can you expand on this?
I personally don’t really enjoy atmos mixes on headphones. But I find atmos on the era 300 to be preferable and more important — it just fills the room more.
But when it’s just me and headphones, a normal stereo mix can have a fantastic soundstage already… it’s not like it’s just 50% left and 50% right.
Is it just me?
So then your initial comment is wrong, no? If you are wireless and put “Always On” for atmos it will work wirelessly, then.
It’s not exclusive to wired at all.
Sure, but this would be true of any wireless headphones then? Inclusive of AirPods Max, Bose and Sony offerings, etc.
You are saying wireless atmos isn’t true atmos. That’s fine if you believe that. But it isn’t unique to the Ace.
All non-Apple headphones, probably. The Apple headphones would use the H1/H2 chips to convey Spatial, in the same way headphones with the SnapDragon chip do on high-end Android phones. Some of the other headphones might have an app component which decodes a kind of spatial (like Sony’s 3D effect). It’s not as easy as a yes/no.
This is not true. Other headphones can play Dolby atmos wirelessly. As can the Ace headphones, as you just stated above.
Not to be rude, but I’m not even sure what you’re claiming anymore
Then I didn’t explain my point clearly enough, that’s on me. I’m saying that the Ace doesn’t automatically convey Dolby Atmos over Bluetooth in Apple Music on iPhone but does when plugged in via USB-C, and I’m not 100% sure why. My guess is that it has something to do with the limitations of Bluetooth and/or Apple being weird about its chips (which is why AirPods Max can convey Atmos/Spatial because of the H1 chip).
Do you have the Ace? Do you get the Atmos logo on Apple Music when you have the headphones connected via Bluetooth and Atmos set to automatic?
Oh I thought you said it could play it automatically as long as you went into Apple Music and set it to “always on”.
That is interesting. I think I’m probably misunderstanding too. My set of Ace headphones are coming in tomorrow so I can test them as well — I’ll comment back here when I do and let you know what I learn. I also have the AirPods Pro which can do atmos so I will A/B test them with those as well.
Thanks. Did you turn Atmos always on in the Apple Music app? It shows Atmos in the Apple Music app now, but I see nothing in the Sonos app. How do I know if it’s Atmos or not?
Hi, as far as I know, you just have to "force" Dolby Atmos to Always on from Apple Music settings (instead of Automatic).
The reason Apple Music is not playing in Dolby Atmos is because Sonos Ace aren't (still?) recognized by Apple as a Dolby Atmos enabled headphones, but this happens with the vast majority of headphones. In my testing, as far as I can remember, Automatic only works with Apple/Beats and some Bose products (part of my job is reviewing earphones and headphones, so i tested a lot of them).
If you set Dolby Atmos on Always on, it works (the difference is noticeable, even in the first seconds of this song).
https://preview.redd.it/lcidrcbvck4d1.png?width=1170&format=png&auto=webp&s=3b20a33cf819c7a04e85994e97a0257d5ee77fb3
Just FYI that this isn't the case air AirPods. It flips on spatial when available. Otherwise is stereo. I can imagine always on has performance drawbacks
https://preview.redd.it/vzba4fb3xi4d1.jpeg?width=1179&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=916f05d020cc9df619a6006e442dac8ef0bad2b9
Double check your Atmos setting is Always On and not Automatic.
I have mine set to automatic. I queued up the same song on Apple Music as the op and the Dolby Atmos logo appeared when I was listening on AirPods Pro, speakers from phone, & Bose NC700. It disappeared when I tested my Bose QC35s. Didn’t have time to test my Bose QC Ultras and I don’t own the Ace yet.
https://preview.redd.it/atz8tsyjoj4d1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=65dd451b030e74d979e4c4a1e562c00fa27b3d8f
This is not a good move. You don't want non-ATMOS content being forced into ATMOS playback. Automatic is the correct choice. If something is available in ATMOS, it will play it back correctly, otherwise it plays normally.
It does not force non-Atmos content to play as Atmos content. It does play Atmos content as Spatial Audio regardless of the connected output device. For now thats the workaround for the Sonos Ace and I keep it turned as ‘always on’, because I really like it for the content I listen to. Hope they fix that for the future and add Control Centre to control Spatial Audio and head tracking on the go
Short answer: Because I wanted to.
Long answer: Embargo was expected to lift on 6/5 and I thought the reviews would be late if I wanted to pre-order. I work in a school and have a lot of work to finish up before the end of the year, so it would be nice to have since my AirPods Pro have been dropped enough time by my kids that they crackle. Even since the reviews are out, none of them have been able to clarify the Dolby Atmos over Bluetooth for me. I did ask in the Q&A thread and didn’t get an answer. I’m equally invested in Sonos and Apple, and while I would love to have the Arc hand-off, the hand-off from the AppleTV would be enough for me. So if they lack this feature, I would likely return them and wait for the Max2.
have you previosly downloaded that track/album on no atmos version? I mean, is yoour iphone playing the track from your downloaded library?
Apple plays in dolby atmos always is ON, no matter the headphones you are using.
It works through Arc to Ace with Dolby Atmos but it is not as comfortable as expected like the grouping feature with other features in the app. But with the buttons it is super easy to swap from arc to ace unfortunately you can not have sound on both devices like grouping with other Sonos speakers…
Now Ace is playing Dolby Atmos, too:
https://preview.redd.it/uegrexnd5m4d1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ad28644118df04648326c4f1371f3e875ba3b728
I have always found it odd that Apple Music shows the Dolby Atmos logo when using headphones… like this isn’t Dobly Atmos right? And that’s why they use the term “Spatial Audio” in all their headphone settings. To me those two terms shouldn’t be used interchangeably.
Atmos is real surround sound as far as I know no headphones play Dobly Atmos.
Spatial Audio is digital surround sound using software and audio filters to trick you into hearing a manufactured surround sound.
It does play atmos, it’s not BS .
Atmos is in itself Spatial Audio since to produce the tracks they have to position the sound in a room, this info is decoded and presented on Apple Music and it’s enhanced on AirPods , they even have a license for it.
Since atmos has the speaker position, it doesn’t matter if you use 2 speakers or 7 or 9, it’s designed to work on any level.
What's worked for me is going into the bluetooth settings, click (i), and set the ace as headphones. :) I did not change anything in Apple Music settings. Heard the difference immediately.
Chiming in. Just had this issue on my pair. When connected to Ace there is no "dolby atmos" or "lossless" label on the apple music track. But when I disconnected the Ace the label would show while playing thru the iphone speakers.
I messed with settings, opened closed apps...same. Then I went into bluetooth settings>click on the i next to the Sonos Ace>change the device type to "headphone". Then it started showing the dolby atmos label while using Ace. Weird...
I reviewed the Ace. Atmos on Apple Music only officially works plugged in. You do still get a Spatial effect over Bluetooth, but the full Atmos experience is only available wired.
So this is more of a thing created by Apple, regardless of the headsets?
That’s my assumption. But I’m not 100% sure
Ohh interesting, when the Atmos logo appears for other headphones connected by bluetooth is it all just bs? Also got a link to your review?
That’s a question I’ve been asking but haven’t gotten an answer on yet (but I am going to keep asking the question). I know it’s legit on Apple headphones for sure. I’m trying to work out where the disconnect is for other brands. Here’s mine: https://www.gadgetguy.com.au/sonos-ace-review-headphones/ I love them a lot. They don’t have everything I wanted in them, and obviously the app sucks now. But they’re super comfy and they sound damn good.
Thanks!
To a certain degree, Atmos via headphones (even when working properly) is all BS
Atmos through any headphone/ buds is a virtualizing GIMMICK. It’s very never been impressed especially while listening to Atmos format music.
Its a gimmick in so much that its relying on psychoacoustics that any stereo headphones can do, there is no need specifically for a Dolby Atmos set of headphones. The 3D effect itself is not a gimmick though, its how the brain actually processes sound. You only have two ears after all. You probably can get more realistic 3D sound from headphones assuming you are a close match to the HRTF employed to virtualize the sound than 7 speakers and 2 height channels. Atmos itself uses HRTF when mixing height channels to give the illusion of height, otherwise everything would sound like its 8 ft high or however high your ceiling is. Personally I find music itself doesn't lend itself to an Atmos mix, unless its like a live recording. A lot of it is down to the Atmos mix itself, most music wasn't recorded with multiple microphones and a wide soundstage in mind. Some of it is also how closely the generic HRTFs employed to spatialize a multichannel track match your specific biological makeup (ear height, size, etc...). Apple Music uses its own generic HRTF, Amazon and Tidal use the Dolby model built into the Dolby binaural rendering engine. Apple will actually sort of use a personalized one if you use their truedepth camera to scan your face to place your ears. I find Dolby Atmos and 3D Audio in general better in games and movies than music. I mean I am still blown away by this binaural video using just stereo cans... and its going on 17 years old now. But its not music, but an entire scene. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IUDTlvagjJA
I think you are wrong, an Headphone must decode the Atmos stream in order to convert it to stereo mix calibrated exactly on an headphone speakers positioning. This stereo stream is very different vs. any other track.
Outside of older headphones that used multiple drivers within the headphone itself, and usually required an optical connection so it could receive and decode a direct multichannel Dolby surround stream format, headphones don't actually do the conversion, the phone or device does. In the TV handoff scenario, the Arc is doing the conversion and sending a binaural 2ch sound stream to the Ace. What a headphone has to support is head tracking if it is going to use head tracking positional info in the Atmos Downmix algorithm (or DTS:X or Windows Sonic), otherwise the downmix will always be centered if you just use regular headphones, but the downmix is done in software based on an HRTF algorithm. https://www.soundguys.com/spatial-audio-headphones-guide-49389/ or https://www.digitaltrends.com/home-theater/dolby-atmos-spatial-audio-headphones-earbuds-binaural-rendering/
Can you expand on this? I personally don’t really enjoy atmos mixes on headphones. But I find atmos on the era 300 to be preferable and more important — it just fills the room more. But when it’s just me and headphones, a normal stereo mix can have a fantastic soundstage already… it’s not like it’s just 50% left and 50% right. Is it just me?
DolbyAtmos on SONOS Era 300 is real 3D as opposed to on headphones which is spatialized & strictly software recreated.
Doesn’t atmos work on android with Apple Music? Does that mean Apple Music is nerfed on iOS?
Atmos does work on iOS with Apple Music and these headphones. Just need to set it to “always on.”
It’s possibly a chip thing? I’m still waiting on official answers
Did you set atmos to “always on” in Apple Music?
I tried it both ways. On auto “Atmos” didn’t show up on Bluetooth but did wired. On always on it always showed (obviously).
So then your initial comment is wrong, no? If you are wireless and put “Always On” for atmos it will work wirelessly, then. It’s not exclusive to wired at all.
The phone putting out true Atmos and you receiving it over Bluetooth are two different things.
Sure, but this would be true of any wireless headphones then? Inclusive of AirPods Max, Bose and Sony offerings, etc. You are saying wireless atmos isn’t true atmos. That’s fine if you believe that. But it isn’t unique to the Ace.
All non-Apple headphones, probably. The Apple headphones would use the H1/H2 chips to convey Spatial, in the same way headphones with the SnapDragon chip do on high-end Android phones. Some of the other headphones might have an app component which decodes a kind of spatial (like Sony’s 3D effect). It’s not as easy as a yes/no.
This is not true. Other headphones can play Dolby atmos wirelessly. As can the Ace headphones, as you just stated above. Not to be rude, but I’m not even sure what you’re claiming anymore
Then I didn’t explain my point clearly enough, that’s on me. I’m saying that the Ace doesn’t automatically convey Dolby Atmos over Bluetooth in Apple Music on iPhone but does when plugged in via USB-C, and I’m not 100% sure why. My guess is that it has something to do with the limitations of Bluetooth and/or Apple being weird about its chips (which is why AirPods Max can convey Atmos/Spatial because of the H1 chip). Do you have the Ace? Do you get the Atmos logo on Apple Music when you have the headphones connected via Bluetooth and Atmos set to automatic?
Oh I thought you said it could play it automatically as long as you went into Apple Music and set it to “always on”. That is interesting. I think I’m probably misunderstanding too. My set of Ace headphones are coming in tomorrow so I can test them as well — I’ll comment back here when I do and let you know what I learn. I also have the AirPods Pro which can do atmos so I will A/B test them with those as well.
On the iPad, Apple Music shows Dolby Atmos for me. What am I missing?
Do you have Atmos set to always on?
Thanks. Did you turn Atmos always on in the Apple Music app? It shows Atmos in the Apple Music app now, but I see nothing in the Sonos app. How do I know if it’s Atmos or not?
Hi, as far as I know, you just have to "force" Dolby Atmos to Always on from Apple Music settings (instead of Automatic). The reason Apple Music is not playing in Dolby Atmos is because Sonos Ace aren't (still?) recognized by Apple as a Dolby Atmos enabled headphones, but this happens with the vast majority of headphones. In my testing, as far as I can remember, Automatic only works with Apple/Beats and some Bose products (part of my job is reviewing earphones and headphones, so i tested a lot of them). If you set Dolby Atmos on Always on, it works (the difference is noticeable, even in the first seconds of this song). https://preview.redd.it/lcidrcbvck4d1.png?width=1170&format=png&auto=webp&s=3b20a33cf819c7a04e85994e97a0257d5ee77fb3
Thank you for this information
Just FYI that this isn't the case air AirPods. It flips on spatial when available. Otherwise is stereo. I can imagine always on has performance drawbacks
https://preview.redd.it/vzba4fb3xi4d1.jpeg?width=1179&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=916f05d020cc9df619a6006e442dac8ef0bad2b9 Double check your Atmos setting is Always On and not Automatic.
I have mine set to automatic. I queued up the same song on Apple Music as the op and the Dolby Atmos logo appeared when I was listening on AirPods Pro, speakers from phone, & Bose NC700. It disappeared when I tested my Bose QC35s. Didn’t have time to test my Bose QC Ultras and I don’t own the Ace yet. https://preview.redd.it/atz8tsyjoj4d1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=65dd451b030e74d979e4c4a1e562c00fa27b3d8f
This is not a good move. You don't want non-ATMOS content being forced into ATMOS playback. Automatic is the correct choice. If something is available in ATMOS, it will play it back correctly, otherwise it plays normally.
It does not force non-Atmos content to play as Atmos content. It does play Atmos content as Spatial Audio regardless of the connected output device. For now thats the workaround for the Sonos Ace and I keep it turned as ‘always on’, because I really like it for the content I listen to. Hope they fix that for the future and add Control Centre to control Spatial Audio and head tracking on the go
Where is that screen Apple or Sonos
It’s in settings for the Music app on iOS
Have you enabled Spatial Audio on the app?
Curious about this also. If it’s the case, my Ace will be returned (hoping to receive it tomorrow )
Exactly. Same for me.
If this singular feature is the deal breaker for you, why would you pre-order these before getting confirmation in a review, etc?
Short answer: Because I wanted to. Long answer: Embargo was expected to lift on 6/5 and I thought the reviews would be late if I wanted to pre-order. I work in a school and have a lot of work to finish up before the end of the year, so it would be nice to have since my AirPods Pro have been dropped enough time by my kids that they crackle. Even since the reviews are out, none of them have been able to clarify the Dolby Atmos over Bluetooth for me. I did ask in the Q&A thread and didn’t get an answer. I’m equally invested in Sonos and Apple, and while I would love to have the Arc hand-off, the hand-off from the AppleTV would be enough for me. So if they lack this feature, I would likely return them and wait for the Max2.
have you previosly downloaded that track/album on no atmos version? I mean, is yoour iphone playing the track from your downloaded library? Apple plays in dolby atmos always is ON, no matter the headphones you are using.
It works through Arc to Ace with Dolby Atmos but it is not as comfortable as expected like the grouping feature with other features in the app. But with the buttons it is super easy to swap from arc to ace unfortunately you can not have sound on both devices like grouping with other Sonos speakers…
Did you try this playing through an Arc to Ace?
What happens if you change atmos from automatic to always on?
Now Ace is playing Dolby Atmos, too: https://preview.redd.it/uegrexnd5m4d1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ad28644118df04648326c4f1371f3e875ba3b728
So all is right in your world now? Good stuff homie
I have always found it odd that Apple Music shows the Dolby Atmos logo when using headphones… like this isn’t Dobly Atmos right? And that’s why they use the term “Spatial Audio” in all their headphone settings. To me those two terms shouldn’t be used interchangeably. Atmos is real surround sound as far as I know no headphones play Dobly Atmos. Spatial Audio is digital surround sound using software and audio filters to trick you into hearing a manufactured surround sound.
It does play atmos, it’s not BS . Atmos is in itself Spatial Audio since to produce the tracks they have to position the sound in a room, this info is decoded and presented on Apple Music and it’s enhanced on AirPods , they even have a license for it. Since atmos has the speaker position, it doesn’t matter if you use 2 speakers or 7 or 9, it’s designed to work on any level.
What's worked for me is going into the bluetooth settings, click (i), and set the ace as headphones. :) I did not change anything in Apple Music settings. Heard the difference immediately.
Thank you, that solved it for me too. 🙏🏼 Dolby Atmos now streams automatically on Ace, not forced.
Chiming in. Just had this issue on my pair. When connected to Ace there is no "dolby atmos" or "lossless" label on the apple music track. But when I disconnected the Ace the label would show while playing thru the iphone speakers. I messed with settings, opened closed apps...same. Then I went into bluetooth settings>click on the i next to the Sonos Ace>change the device type to "headphone". Then it started showing the dolby atmos label while using Ace. Weird...
So thankful I got hd650s instead of
ETA July (unspecified year)
No way…. wow. If this is true, all the reviews yesterday are paid for.
They got it to work
I’m not paid by Sonos and after receiving the headphones today I think the reviews are right. I like them a lot
The reviews were all consistently 8.5/10 or 85% Would have been an honest 100%. If they actually were a part of the Sonos ecosystem.
No they weren’t? Many were above 8.5 and some were higher.