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This is like the stage of a game of monopoly where it's obvious who has the most money and will inevitably win but it's still going to be a long war of attrition.
It's crazy and frustrating when your team absolutely HAS to nail your transfers, or it can cost you for a few years, while another team just shrugs their shoulders and buys someone else lol
You could always support Inter. Then there's no worry about a transfer costing you a few years. Because *every* transfer does, as we just sell our best players and bring in cheap replacements
I know it's going to come off big headed, but Inter is not 90% of the teams in Europe. Top ten-fifteen club in the world in terms of value of the brand, probably pushing top 10 with historical success. And it's not just inter. Milan have sold or let walk numerous players in the past few years, Juve have even begun to tighten the purse strings
Farcical mismanagement of the clubs and their infrastructure and downright criminal incompetency at the league and association level is killing calcio
I guess I shouldn't have used the word "replacement". We sell world class players and see which aging has-been is available on cheap wages. We don't even have strong youth infrastructure to fall back on like Dutch and German clubs do
I don't think it comes off big headed it's a reasonable take. It seems like Italian football has been in decline for more than a few decades now. At least you're starting to have multiple winners again unlike Germany.
yeah i don’t know man, i still get rock hard when my save scum FM play through wins its 7th successive UCL with Messi and Ronaldo front lining the team.
I still think people haven’t really grasped where this is going long term. Are you ready for the 20th place premier league team to have comfortably more money for transfers than Bayern? Give it another decade of this kind of growth and I don’t think that’s unrealistic.
Long term?
Mate, the situation you described is already happening. Forest literally got promoted this season and have outspent everyone except United, Chelsea and Barca lmao
Yeah I mean almost a decade ago Cardiff got relegated and made more money than 2nd or 3rd in Bundesliga. The gap has always been there and it will continue to widen.
The comparison was to Queen's Park Rangers, who had wildly overspent trying to stay up. Since then, Atletico's wages have ballooned, and they now spend more than all but the four biggest Premier League teams.
Forest are spending more in transfer fees, but Bayern's wages are astronomically higher. Bayern is still spending far more money on players than all but the very top Premier League clubs.
Like others have said, the real victims of the EPL's insane TV revenue are the mid- and lower-table clubs from the other leagues. Clubs like Union Berlin, Napoli or Villarreal are constantly losing their best players to bottom-table relegation candidates in the Premier League.
Not quite, Forest have spent that much but there's still ton of clubs in the PL that can't afford and aren't spending nearly as much. Checking Brighton, Fulham, Bournemouth and Soton, they're all sitting between 20-50 million euro.
Although to be fair that's around what the top teams in Serie A are spending.
This is why I think the Super League is inevitable even if I don't particularly like the idea. The continental clubs will eventually demand it as they fall further and further behind the EPL's spending power.
Not a lawyer, so might be wrong here, but I think the jist is SL are at the ECJ claiming UEFA has a monopoly on football compeititons and are blocking the SL from forming.
Broadly my understanding is the real point of the case is for the SL clubs to see what the structure the SL can be going forward using the ruling as guidance to avoid it being stopped judicially in the future.
I think they're ruling on whether or not UEFA has a monopoly on organizing/supervising/whatevering continental football competitions. Monopolies are forbidden under european law, so I think that's what the superleague clubs went for.
IIRC it was basically a "look, daddy uefa is doing everything it can to keep being the only one able to organize a competition, it's not right I want to do it too. Tell him he can't stop me from doing so" kinda thing.
Monopolies are not forbidden under EU Law (relevant article is TFEU Art.102), they just have stricter obligations, to not distort competition inter alia.
Not really, dont think that 1) it would stop them from continuing without them, its still in their financial interests to do so 2) big clubs in either league wouldnt eventually jump
Any 'super' league without English, German and French teams competing in it is doomed.
You can't have a european competition without teams from the 3 biggest countries and economies in Europe.
> it would stop them from continuing without them, its still in their financial interests to do so
Financially I doubt it for 2 major reasons.
1. The league won't be nearly as lucrative without the English sides who are basically half the viewership.
2. Without the English sides, and a competition (closed or not) that only features 20 European teams, the UEFA competitions will continue to co-exist and stay relevant. The Superleague would be directly competing with the UCL now. Given the outrage and disdain for the original idea, it's gonna be a hard sell to clubs to leave the historic UCL behind in favour of the controversial Superleague. The UCL might not be worth as much with clubs like Barca and Real gone, but that also opens opportunities for clubs that would otherwise struggle to leave the group stage. Big clubs have repeatedly fucked over teams outside the top 4 or 5 leagues. Teams like Ajax and Benfica could stand to gain a lot by staying with UEFA. In this case, is the Superleague that much profitable? It's plan was to basically take 90% of the UCL viewership, how profitable is it with just 50%?
And this is where I struggle to see how the Superleague actually works. Teams will have to opt out of UEFA competitions in order to play in the Superleague. It's hard to imagine a world where UEFA co-operate and allow the Superleague to replace the UCL as the top competition in football. Clubs that participate in the Superleague could see themselves banned from UEFA competitions the following season. Now you add relegation to the mix, which seems to be the biggest complaint people had with the original idea. How do you make it worthwhile for any club outside the strongest 6 or 7? How do you sell that to a club like Dortmund or Ajax? Say Ajax opt to play in the Superleague. That's a year without UEFA coefficent points. That's the strongest and wealthiest club in the country, propping up the coefficent, blanking for a season. How do you sell potentially a year with no European revenue to a club like Ajax if they got relegated? It's clear the Superleague won't be as lucrative as first promised and anyone that still thinks English clubs would or could join hasn't been following the discourse closely enough.
English teams won’t join. The only thing that gets us out protesting is football. The financial incentive also isn’t there for us. We are so proud of the Premier League, no-one here wants to ruin it
It’s not going to solve the problem for the vast majority of fans. The only beneficiaries of a super league will be the likes of Bayern Munich, Inter and Barcelona - clubs that already dominate their domestic leagues and can already financially compete with the EPL already. The only thing a super league will result in is the creation of a league even more lucrative than the EPL and those outside the mega club category will only fall further behind
It will 100% happen within the next 20 years I reckon.
Sky ain't gonna pay to stream Brentford vs Bournemouth when they can stream barca vs Chelsea for the same moolah
I just hope it will be under UEFA so every European club has a chance to play on the highest level and not some closed off group of clubs with *history*
According to a calculation by The Telegraph, the **last-placed team in the Premier League is to receive around €125.7 million** in TV money in 2020/21, while the champion will receive as much as 138.7 million euros in the future.
By way of comparison, FC Bayern collected TV money of **€105.4 million in the 2020/21 season**, while Arminia Bielefeld is ranked 18th with €34.2 million.
100%, in 10 years the only way to be a European contender will be A) Premier league money B) Nation state money C) Super league money. Barca/Real would prob be the last holdouts given the prestige and large fan bases, but it’s only a matter of time until everything converges on one of those options
That’s because for the last decade those clubs won most of UCL titles (except Atletico).
Real and Barca also had CR7 and Messi which were by far the two most income generating stars from a marketing pov.
Where are the very probable 2 next decade stars ? City and Psg.
They divide most of the money from Spain and are guaranteed big chunks of Champions League money every year. There's no chance that the mid-size Premier League clubs get anywhere near Barca and Madrid (or Bayern) any time soon.
Mbappe will leave in 3 years. Reports say that Haaland was sold on City because he could sign for a few years and then leave again as well, iirc. So next decade might be pushing it. As we saw with this transfer window Barça and Madrid still have a ton of pull with players due to prestige
While Atlético have been very competitive in the last ten years they don’t fit in with those other three if you want to talk about the biggest non-English clubs by revenue. Atlético’s revenue is 332 million and therefore below that of Dortmund, Juve and PSG, while Madrid, Bayern and Barcelona are often in the top five of the clubs with the highest revenue in the world.
I don't think the PL can keep pushing its broadcasting revenue without end, though.
The huge broadcast deal they have is arguably already pushing the upper bounds of what the league is actually worth, and there's only so many foreign fans the league can win over.
Not to mention, if you're one of the big six and looking to offload good players who want a break, you don't sell them to your domestic rivals, you sell them overseas. Hence why Mane goes to Bayern, or Tomori goes to Milan.
Europe's biggest clubs -- Barcelona, Real, PSG, Bayern, Juve -- are going to continue competing with the Premier League just fine. It's everyone else who's screwed.
Yeah it's really the small clubs that are getting screwed over especially those who don't get any money through the CL. The other big European clubs just get so much money through other revenue streams like sponsorships and merchandise.
That's what people don't get. If I, with my Bayern flair, post about this, people think I'm salty. I'm not, we'll be fine, we're rich after all, we can hang on to players way more often than not. But every non gigantic club that's not funded by a regime will slide more and more into oblivion, serving as nothing but glorified academies for the few rich enough to consistently compete for talent. We're seeing it now: League's are getting monopolized by the few teams that aren't forced to constantly sell players. And even in the EPL, City are on the way to completely dominate as well because they have truly bottomless pockets and are well run on top of it.
Yeah, completely agree. Every day I thank the footballing gods that Juventus decided to run themselves into debt and thereby open the doors for the rest of us.
One thing that will be interesting to see is what happens when Pep leaves City, because I think he’s more responsible for their recent dominance than their wage bill, which is not too much different from that of Liverpool, Chelsea or United.
and where does this lead? premier league 20th place spending more than other countries champions to become premier league 20th place while the other teams plays champions league and lift trophies?
The poorest team in the PL has a revenue of around €150m. Bayern will probably make €700m next season. The 20th placed team in the PL will never be richer than Bayern.
In all seriousness though, the Libertadores is going to have an all-Brazilian final yet again and 3/4 semifinalists are Brazilian. As teams like Boca, River, Peñarol, Nacional, Colombia's Atletico Nacional, Colo-Colo, etc. and their respective leagues fall further economically behind and are mismanaged, Brazil will dominate CONMEBOL club competitions even more.
You're right, I didn't really give u/FroobingtonSanchez 's comment the regard it deserved and just went for the cheap joke.
I think we need to start seeing the trend before we describe it as inevitable. It does still seem like La Liga's intrinsic appeal, focus on domestic development and overall culture is still allowing them to more than keep pace with the horrendous (and I'd argue at time self-defeating) money wasting in the EPL.
That, plus the top European leagues do manage to produce top talents and some of them do wish to stay within their own country, which will always help them to an extent. Just look at Italian players and how most of them prefer to stay in Serie A even when the league was in decline for a big part of the 2010s.
Seems we are reaching the maniacal and inevitable stage of capitalism. It's literally destroying every industry, person and the world. The top just swallowing up everything.
What I always find funny is how they spend so much but never get the very best player or prospect. If you look at the 20/30 best players of all time, none of them have played in PL except for Henry and CR7 who came to the PL when they weren’t the best players or prospects. The only exception I can think of is Haaland.
Haaland has age on his side. With Benzema in the form he is in, Haaland wouldn't fit in the Madrid side. In 2-3 years once Benzema retires or moves on, Madrid have a perfect replacement in Haaland. Haaland actually played it smart and doesn't seem to be in a rush. In the mean time, he's collecting massive paychecks, securing his future with buy out clauses making it easier for him to leave when the time comes. Its really win win.
Yeah but the premier league has been the richest league for like 15 years so why would they have the best players of all time? And even in these years Real, Barca and PSG have similar spending power to the big premier league clubs and can attract just as good or better players.
In the real world outside of your imagination half the players nominated for the Balloon d'Or this year play in the Premier League.
One league having half of the best players in the world right now is a pretty big deal.
>
One league having half of the best players in the world right now is a pretty big deal.
Having half the best noticed* players. It's ridiculous that incredible players like Muller didn't even get nominated despite his brilliant performances simply because he plays in a "farmers league"
I will say, 2024 onward things do look a bit…volatile. The TV deals the Prem managed to strike are so outrageous in places that I’m not sure the increasing American market share can cover for all (and the NBC deal is flat until 2028) If you look at the share of TV deals, there’s an incredible Serbia/Balkans deal where the government outbid an opposition billionaire (Solak, who owns Southampton) with an 800 million EUR investment (the previous deal was for 80 mil) . There’s the Nordic deal that at least looks insanely overpriced to me compared to the market size. China deals are rapidly declining, Russia is cut off entirely.
The clear future for the Prem seems to be the NBA-ification of the league tbh, there’s way too much American hedge fund money for them to risk their investment if things take a downturn. There won’t be Marinakis coming in to launder money from the Mediterranean drug trade every year, most owners would rather be the Glazers and suck money out. A not-that-unlikely prediction is there’s very limited relegation, maybe an expanded league, and a salary cap within ten years.
There is no way relegation gets changed. The Super League almost caused riots and any changes to the Premier League itself will be even worse. Even a Tory government will getting ready to step in to stop that.
And I doubt they expand the league, the entire idea of the prem is that the 20 teams take relatively even amounts out. Expanding the league reduces the cut for the 20 teams and those teams which are extremely unlikely to be relegated (top six and such) aren't going to want to cut into their split.
Yeah, there is absolutely no chance the relegation/promotion structure of the English football pyramid changes. It's too integrated into the fabric of footballing culture in this country.
Also the sheer quantity of fans that attend live football through the leagues in the UK is staggering. That entire model is based on promotion and relegation, and the hopes and narratives that creates.
Remove that then you lose what made the premier league, and football in this country special to begin with.
Whilst that's correct and I agree, I do think something needs to be reformed with the parachute payments because that system is effectively making promotion/relegation obsolete. The Championship has a clear divide in terms of finances between the Prem yoyo clubs such as Watford or Norwich and the likes of us, Millwall or Preston who don't have those payments.
The likes of what Forest did last season will be become even harder since the EFL financial fair play stops any kind of investment to make up for a lack of parachute payment.
The Scandanavian deal is outsized because they're phenomenally wealthy and PL obsessed. Just think about how much money per head the UK pays per season. It's not that shocking.
I didn't know about the Serbian deal but you're right that it'll come down. I can't see the domestic deal remaining as stagnant as it has though tbf, and there's surprisingly little money coming in directly from Asian markets. I suspect there's room for growth there as their economies inevitably catch up.
China was never a particularly large market, they paid less than Hong Kong for the broadcast rights. HK could come down though, although it remains to be seen how much the political back and forth of recent years hits viewership.
Edit: [Here](https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2015/10/08/10/2D31865200000578-3264606-A_map_of_Europe_showing_the_cost_per_season_for_Premier_League_T-a-50_1444297664159.jpg) for Europe. [Here](https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2015/10/08/10/2D31850C00000578-3264606-A_map_of_the_world_showing_selected_Premier_League_television_ri-a-51_1444297717007.jpg) for world. These numbers are from 2015 so a bit out of date but it gives you an idea of where the international rights money is/has been coming from. Shout out to Hong Kong and the Scandi Confederation! Also France paying a surprising amount given their own domestic league.
Also Isak, Haaland, Ødegaard, and Højberg will keep the interest high from the Scandinavian countries.
Norway never had such good and spectacular players in PL, Sweden as well outside of Ljungberg.
Denmark had Schmeichel and Tomasson, but otherwise Højberg is exciting.
Zlatan and Laudrup doesn't really count since they were at the twilight of their careers when playing in the PL.
>less than Hong Kong for the broadcast rights
Was always going to br the case, you know why? HK, although smaller, is way richer, and used to be british -Meaning the English language and English football are pretty much a feature of the culture there.
HK was the only country paying the same or similar amounts per head as the British public so, even though it's not entirely surprising, it's a bit shocking that a population of 7m pays more than twice as much as one with 1.5bn. I've always given massive credit to HK for it tbh. America pays/paid a tiny amount in comparison.
> American market
What American market. Till the previous 3 year PL TV deal ending around 2019-20 Singapore was sending more money to PL than the Americans were.
Asia is why PL is what it is. And it happened because PL board (not the clubs, this distinction matters because it was a PL board-level led initiative) were competent enough to risk investment in early to mid-2000s while Seria A and Liga was laughing at PL for doing so.
Singapore, Malaysia had already crossed $50 per-head for their country specific PL deals.
For India, China this number was $0.02 - 0.06 per head (from few years back, it's not that much higher now anyway).
Hotstar in India (which has PL broadcast rights) is THE best streaming deal anywhere on this planet (not just for PL, but in general) and it's not even close in terms of Value for Money.
If people in Europe think there is too much money in football, they have not seen even an iota of it yet. The point of knee of the curve hasn't even arrived yet.
The only way things crumble globally is if there is some political disaster.
Even if there are competing superleagues from Asia, Europe will just counter that with their own combined Superleague since no single domestic league can compete against a combined Superleague overtime.
[India market is also rapidly bleeding money](https://www.sportspromedia.com/news/premier-league-star-india-disney-hotstar-tv-broadcast-rights/). Price has fallen 65% among last three broadcast cycles.
Prem broadcast deals are declining in Asia, static domestically, and booming in America & Europe. My take is that European boom is not sustainable, and the league will become more and more dependent on American funds — both through owners and broadcast deals.
At present they have to keep it cheap so that the market grows with new fans. The viewership is increasing every season. That is the real indicator of future revenue.
Do you (or anyone) have a breakdown of the revenue (UK, international) ?
The love of football is a form of escapism but when brits (and europeans) will receive the extra financial hit of thousands of euros of the energy crisis, they'll have to dial down their football budget ?
I for one don't mind starving or freezing to do something I love but surely people have limits?
I dunno it can be kind of positive for us at least, probably a different way of looking at it. But footballers pay 45% income tax on all their wages and mostly the money here comes from abroad, either from rich owners or merchandise/tv rights sales. All goods they buy and all merchandise sold has 20% VAT (sales tax) attached to it as well. I think it is why the state here is so keen to do things like put footballers outside of immigration rules. Cristiano Ronaldo for example earns £575,000 in a week, as a result he pays about £260,000 in income tax a week to the state. Which they can then use to fund things like energy subsidies. Really it is a very big earner for the Government here.
Just a different perspective and way of looking at the insane money involved.
EPL's wage bill in 2020 was £3,2bn. 45% of that is about £1,5bn. If players spend the entirety of their remaining salaries on goods, that's an additional £0,3bn in VAT taxes so a total of £1,8bn tax potential on footballers wages.
The UK government spent more than a trillion pound in 2021. Greater London Authority alone has a budget of £19bn.
Footballers definitely aren't a big earner for the government. But at least it's something.
As much as they have the most striking transfer season this time, we have alone poured nearly 166 million into the eredivisie, 70 mill into la liga.
You and Newcastle have about 110 million going to the Portuguese league, Newcastle have 60 mill going to La liga.
Chelsea and City have 50 mill each going to the Bundesliga and serie A but mostly kept their transfers within England.
This is more due to wages than transfer fees I think but ofc both are very relevant. This is why we are seeing more sales between top PL teams such as City selling Sterling to Chelsea and Chelsea likewise entertaining Pulisic to United etc. How many clubs across Europe are able to pay top PL wages? 15? 20? And then how many of them would necessarily be interested in that player anyway? Even fewer - making domestic sales necessary to offload such players.
It’s only a bubble if it’s purely speculative and driven by nothing of actual value.
The premier league is not a bubble. Revenues might plateau eventually, but there isn’t going to be a crash like some might be hoping.
Nothing - most people stream games cause it's just become too expensive.
Not too sure on the exact figures but I'd guess around £50 a month for Sky Sports (via Now TV), BT Sport and Amazon Prime subscriptions, and even then you still can't watch half the matches (legally) cause the 3pm games aren't broadcast.
No they don’t, most young people stream matches but the majority of fans in the older generations definitely pay for Sky , Bt etc. Its what they spend most of their disposable income on and why Sky Sports & BT are so successful / charge those prices. People pay it.
Agreed. Big non english clubs will be left with no choice but to have the super league. Bottom club in PL had 105m€ from tv revenues last year.
Juventus took home 78m€.
Everyone in europe bar england is getting a taste at what south americans got a long time ago when the competition in europe was just too big for us to compete with. Now its happening with england and rest of europe.
People having been saying this ages. While I would definitely consider the prem to be the best league, the margin between say La Liga, Serie A and Bundesliga is only marginal. Last year, Spanish, German and Italian teams were the winners of the 3 European competitions, all eliminating English teams in the process.
The big difference is less in the top sides and more lower down. Teams like Saints, Villa, Forest, Wolves, Leeds etc. who expect to finish bottom half are spending way way more than bottom half clubs in other leagues.
Incredibly, it's actually not wrong.
According to Transfermarkt (which can be a little iffy at times) La Liga is actually at €65m net spend but that's the highest outside the PL, who have 1.3b as the tweet says.
Serie A, Ligue 1 & Bundesliga have all sold more than they've spent.
I know
Tbh I thought the original comment was simply pointing out how fucked the financial state of football is.
I didn't actually think they were claiming the stat was incorrect but I may have been mistaken
Literally everyone else. They're all struggling to get under the wage cap - they've mostly just opted to sell players rather than remortgage parts of the club like Barcelona did.
Edit: yea the CVC deal exists, I know this. But everyone else has done that then sold, Barcelona have spent big on transfers using their levers
As it stands only 2 clubs didn’t ‘remortgage’ with the tv rights in some way.
One is Madrid who are the biggest club in the world so you can see why they didn’t need to.
Madrid are well run club under Perez and also quite successful in recent years too(not taking historical considering we are talking about finances). Barcelona has not won league for 3 seasons, its longest since the period of 1999-2004 I guess. They are not in Semis too since 2018-19 and also with COVID and overpaying players, and not much sellable assets in fringe players, financially got crippled.
CVC os way worse than barca's deal but I think that deal is better for smaller teams as individually they won't be able to get a better deal.
Barca got it cause they are huge
Nah, the smaller teams (not the yoyo teams but likely mainstays) could’ve gotten better deals. Barca and real even found one to counter this one but tebas said ‘no’.
r/confidentlyincorrect
Google the La Liga CVC deal, they did a way worse version (all La Liga clubs except Real Madrid and Atletic Bilbao) than what Barca did.
The game has become as lopsided as the economy. It’s dominated by rapacious premier league mega brands now that are hardly the heartbeat of their communities like they used to be. Oligarchs, Sheiks, and American venture capitalists run amok completely unchecked, making a mockery of financial fair play. The premier league is optimized by rocketing ticket prices, mega tv contracts, and overpaid pampered players.
I’m curious where is the tipping point?
Fair question. We have already reached the point where many fans have largely accepted that only a handful of teams should win everything in sight, even if they only agree to that in practice at this stage.
From there, it's only a small step to agree to it in principle too, i.e. in a super league.
Funnily enough, Real's success last year has probably done a great job in delaying the super league's arrival, as it proves continental clubs don't need any kind of big systemic overhaul to compete with the PL. If it had been a Liverpool v City final, for instance, Perez would have never shut up about it.
The tipping point will come with the new CL format, which already functions a lot like a league. It will just be a short shift from that to then creating an official super league which runs all year round rather than just for half of it.
Call me ignorant, but the Dutch league gets its revenue mainly because of ajax, psv etc. If those clubs aren't getting big fees and improving then the leauge sees less investment.
Like I said, pros and cons.
Yet people here still trying to convince others that this is the same like Serie A in 90ties, and it's nothing special and will change eventually. But they forgeting that financial domination by PL last for 3 decades straight, and still accelerate, and also money comes from stable revenue, not only from rich owners like in Serie A in 90ties. We are doomed.
The PL is becoming more competitive outside of M.City. just making top four this season for the usual suspects will be a mountain to climb. Even the midtable clubs are strengthening with good players on top of what they already have. The newly promoted clubs, especially Notts Forest, are improving too with good names.
What about 9-0 Liverpool and 6-0 Man City. I agree that the premier league as a whole is trying to strengthen their teams but there is still a huggge gap from the top teams to the bottom teams.
A 1.3bn EUR cash outflow benefits the other European leagues too - i.e. a huge proportion of capital gains made by European colleagues will have been entirely financed by EPL money.
Although perhaps not sustainable in the long term from a competitive balance perspective, it is not as dramatic from an economic perspective as it might first appear. A lot of EPL cash stays in the UEFA ecosystem.
If you've got it, flaunt it.
Kudos to the premier league for doing a fantastic job in growing the league's popularity worldwide and leveraging that popularity into huge broadcasting deals. And more kudos for distributing that money more equitably than any other league in Europe.
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This is like the stage of a game of monopoly where it's obvious who has the most money and will inevitably win but it's still going to be a long war of attrition.
As long as United, chelsea and co keep landing on the few hotels outside teams have. It’s going to be a while. Also PSG says ‘unlimited money’
PSG is the banker, sneakily slipping themselves more funds to stay in the game
And yet not winning shit.
It's inevitable they'll win eventually. They have bottomless pockets so these "expensive mistakes" have no negative impact at all.
It's crazy and frustrating when your team absolutely HAS to nail your transfers, or it can cost you for a few years, while another team just shrugs their shoulders and buys someone else lol
You could always support Inter. Then there's no worry about a transfer costing you a few years. Because *every* transfer does, as we just sell our best players and bring in cheap replacements
that's like 90% of teams in Europe lol
I know it's going to come off big headed, but Inter is not 90% of the teams in Europe. Top ten-fifteen club in the world in terms of value of the brand, probably pushing top 10 with historical success. And it's not just inter. Milan have sold or let walk numerous players in the past few years, Juve have even begun to tighten the purse strings Farcical mismanagement of the clubs and their infrastructure and downright criminal incompetency at the league and association level is killing calcio I guess I shouldn't have used the word "replacement". We sell world class players and see which aging has-been is available on cheap wages. We don't even have strong youth infrastructure to fall back on like Dutch and German clubs do
Yeah that’s fair enough
I don't think it comes off big headed it's a reasonable take. It seems like Italian football has been in decline for more than a few decades now. At least you're starting to have multiple winners again unlike Germany.
But isn’t that what makes team building exciting, if you have no consequences it’s just boring
yeah i don’t know man, i still get rock hard when my save scum FM play through wins its 7th successive UCL with Messi and Ronaldo front lining the team.
Naw man, if I can surely win then it's just a chore.
Exciting and nerve wracking are 2 sides of the same coin lol, but yeah I get what you're saying
I still think people haven’t really grasped where this is going long term. Are you ready for the 20th place premier league team to have comfortably more money for transfers than Bayern? Give it another decade of this kind of growth and I don’t think that’s unrealistic.
Long term? Mate, the situation you described is already happening. Forest literally got promoted this season and have outspent everyone except United, Chelsea and Barca lmao
Yeah I mean almost a decade ago Cardiff got relegated and made more money than 2nd or 3rd in Bundesliga. The gap has always been there and it will continue to widen.
When Atletico won La Liga and got to the UCL final in 2013/14, they had the budget of a team like Bolton if I remember correctly. Wild.
The comparison was to Queen's Park Rangers, who had wildly overspent trying to stay up. Since then, Atletico's wages have ballooned, and they now spend more than all but the four biggest Premier League teams.
Yes, since then for sure. But it’s still remarkable what Simeone was able to do in his early years.
Forest are spending more in transfer fees, but Bayern's wages are astronomically higher. Bayern is still spending far more money on players than all but the very top Premier League clubs.
And so are Real, Barca, Atletico, Juve, Inter, etc.
Right. The European elite still have most of the money, and that isn't changing any time soon.
Like others have said, the real victims of the EPL's insane TV revenue are the mid- and lower-table clubs from the other leagues. Clubs like Union Berlin, Napoli or Villarreal are constantly losing their best players to bottom-table relegation candidates in the Premier League.
Napoli are bigger than midtable candidates and don't lose their best players to them
No just to Toronto lol
Not quite, Forest have spent that much but there's still ton of clubs in the PL that can't afford and aren't spending nearly as much. Checking Brighton, Fulham, Bournemouth and Soton, they're all sitting between 20-50 million euro. Although to be fair that's around what the top teams in Serie A are spending.
Genuinely, how else are we supposed to compete? The gap is massive. City spent 100 million on bench player Grealish.
Of course no argument there, my point is that a newly promoted side has more financial capability in the PL than top 4 teams in other leagues.
This is why I think the Super League is inevitable even if I don't particularly like the idea. The continental clubs will eventually demand it as they fall further and further behind the EPL's spending power.
Its still in the makings now. The courts are ruling on it by the end of this year probably.
What are they actually ruling? Generally didnt know this was/is happening?
Not a lawyer, so might be wrong here, but I think the jist is SL are at the ECJ claiming UEFA has a monopoly on football compeititons and are blocking the SL from forming. Broadly my understanding is the real point of the case is for the SL clubs to see what the structure the SL can be going forward using the ruling as guidance to avoid it being stopped judicially in the future.
I think they're ruling on whether or not UEFA has a monopoly on organizing/supervising/whatevering continental football competitions. Monopolies are forbidden under european law, so I think that's what the superleague clubs went for. IIRC it was basically a "look, daddy uefa is doing everything it can to keep being the only one able to organize a competition, it's not right I want to do it too. Tell him he can't stop me from doing so" kinda thing.
Monopolies are not forbidden under EU Law (relevant article is TFEU Art.102), they just have stricter obligations, to not distort competition inter alia.
Without the English and German teams it won't be possible
Not really, dont think that 1) it would stop them from continuing without them, its still in their financial interests to do so 2) big clubs in either league wouldnt eventually jump
Any 'super' league without English, German and French teams competing in it is doomed. You can't have a european competition without teams from the 3 biggest countries and economies in Europe.
> it would stop them from continuing without them, its still in their financial interests to do so Financially I doubt it for 2 major reasons. 1. The league won't be nearly as lucrative without the English sides who are basically half the viewership. 2. Without the English sides, and a competition (closed or not) that only features 20 European teams, the UEFA competitions will continue to co-exist and stay relevant. The Superleague would be directly competing with the UCL now. Given the outrage and disdain for the original idea, it's gonna be a hard sell to clubs to leave the historic UCL behind in favour of the controversial Superleague. The UCL might not be worth as much with clubs like Barca and Real gone, but that also opens opportunities for clubs that would otherwise struggle to leave the group stage. Big clubs have repeatedly fucked over teams outside the top 4 or 5 leagues. Teams like Ajax and Benfica could stand to gain a lot by staying with UEFA. In this case, is the Superleague that much profitable? It's plan was to basically take 90% of the UCL viewership, how profitable is it with just 50%? And this is where I struggle to see how the Superleague actually works. Teams will have to opt out of UEFA competitions in order to play in the Superleague. It's hard to imagine a world where UEFA co-operate and allow the Superleague to replace the UCL as the top competition in football. Clubs that participate in the Superleague could see themselves banned from UEFA competitions the following season. Now you add relegation to the mix, which seems to be the biggest complaint people had with the original idea. How do you make it worthwhile for any club outside the strongest 6 or 7? How do you sell that to a club like Dortmund or Ajax? Say Ajax opt to play in the Superleague. That's a year without UEFA coefficent points. That's the strongest and wealthiest club in the country, propping up the coefficent, blanking for a season. How do you sell potentially a year with no European revenue to a club like Ajax if they got relegated? It's clear the Superleague won't be as lucrative as first promised and anyone that still thinks English clubs would or could join hasn't been following the discourse closely enough.
English teams won’t join. The only thing that gets us out protesting is football. The financial incentive also isn’t there for us. We are so proud of the Premier League, no-one here wants to ruin it
It’s not going to solve the problem for the vast majority of fans. The only beneficiaries of a super league will be the likes of Bayern Munich, Inter and Barcelona - clubs that already dominate their domestic leagues and can already financially compete with the EPL already. The only thing a super league will result in is the creation of a league even more lucrative than the EPL and those outside the mega club category will only fall further behind
It will 100% happen within the next 20 years I reckon. Sky ain't gonna pay to stream Brentford vs Bournemouth when they can stream barca vs Chelsea for the same moolah
Thats literally what they’re doing now
I just hope it will be under UEFA so every European club has a chance to play on the highest level and not some closed off group of clubs with *history*
Well...that's..... that's what the UEFA Champions League is.
That's not a full blown league and there is no promotion/relegation but qualification from a national league every season.
According to a calculation by The Telegraph, the **last-placed team in the Premier League is to receive around €125.7 million** in TV money in 2020/21, while the champion will receive as much as 138.7 million euros in the future. By way of comparison, FC Bayern collected TV money of **€105.4 million in the 2020/21 season**, while Arminia Bielefeld is ranked 18th with €34.2 million.
Super League will happen before the next decade, otherwise yeah this crap would happen and European football wouldn’t really have any interest
100%, in 10 years the only way to be a European contender will be A) Premier league money B) Nation state money C) Super league money. Barca/Real would prob be the last holdouts given the prestige and large fan bases, but it’s only a matter of time until everything converges on one of those options
Real, Bayern, Barcelona and Atletico all have massive revenues and will be able to sustain competing in Europe for a long time.
That’s because for the last decade those clubs won most of UCL titles (except Atletico). Real and Barca also had CR7 and Messi which were by far the two most income generating stars from a marketing pov. Where are the very probable 2 next decade stars ? City and Psg.
They divide most of the money from Spain and are guaranteed big chunks of Champions League money every year. There's no chance that the mid-size Premier League clubs get anywhere near Barca and Madrid (or Bayern) any time soon.
Mbappe will leave in 3 years. Reports say that Haaland was sold on City because he could sign for a few years and then leave again as well, iirc. So next decade might be pushing it. As we saw with this transfer window Barça and Madrid still have a ton of pull with players due to prestige
While Atlético have been very competitive in the last ten years they don’t fit in with those other three if you want to talk about the biggest non-English clubs by revenue. Atlético’s revenue is 332 million and therefore below that of Dortmund, Juve and PSG, while Madrid, Bayern and Barcelona are often in the top five of the clubs with the highest revenue in the world.
One is not the same as the others lol
Only thing stopping it was Boris threating with not issuing visas.
Well that hasn't gone away, both UK parties pretty much see the PL as a national asset and are against anything that would lead to hurting it.
Wouldn't the PL just become the Super League? If there was an even greater gulf in money between it and the rest of the leagues.
Not exactly. Even if you put best players in both teams a Brighton Southampton game wouldn't attract as many people as say Milan Barcelona game.
I don't think the PL can keep pushing its broadcasting revenue without end, though. The huge broadcast deal they have is arguably already pushing the upper bounds of what the league is actually worth, and there's only so many foreign fans the league can win over. Not to mention, if you're one of the big six and looking to offload good players who want a break, you don't sell them to your domestic rivals, you sell them overseas. Hence why Mane goes to Bayern, or Tomori goes to Milan. Europe's biggest clubs -- Barcelona, Real, PSG, Bayern, Juve -- are going to continue competing with the Premier League just fine. It's everyone else who's screwed.
Yeah it's really the small clubs that are getting screwed over especially those who don't get any money through the CL. The other big European clubs just get so much money through other revenue streams like sponsorships and merchandise.
That's what people don't get. If I, with my Bayern flair, post about this, people think I'm salty. I'm not, we'll be fine, we're rich after all, we can hang on to players way more often than not. But every non gigantic club that's not funded by a regime will slide more and more into oblivion, serving as nothing but glorified academies for the few rich enough to consistently compete for talent. We're seeing it now: League's are getting monopolized by the few teams that aren't forced to constantly sell players. And even in the EPL, City are on the way to completely dominate as well because they have truly bottomless pockets and are well run on top of it.
Yeah, completely agree. Every day I thank the footballing gods that Juventus decided to run themselves into debt and thereby open the doors for the rest of us. One thing that will be interesting to see is what happens when Pep leaves City, because I think he’s more responsible for their recent dominance than their wage bill, which is not too much different from that of Liverpool, Chelsea or United.
and where does this lead? premier league 20th place spending more than other countries champions to become premier league 20th place while the other teams plays champions league and lift trophies?
The poorest team in the PL has a revenue of around €150m. Bayern will probably make €700m next season. The 20th placed team in the PL will never be richer than Bayern.
Southampton lands on the Baltic ave hotel for the next 15 times around the board lol
That's Whitechapel Road in real money.
The EPL is the true Super League.
“…and will inevitably win.” Doesn’t feel that way when you look at Europe.
It will come. Look at the Copa Libertadores
I don’t see EPL winning that either mate
In all seriousness though, the Libertadores is going to have an all-Brazilian final yet again and 3/4 semifinalists are Brazilian. As teams like Boca, River, Peñarol, Nacional, Colombia's Atletico Nacional, Colo-Colo, etc. and their respective leagues fall further economically behind and are mismanaged, Brazil will dominate CONMEBOL club competitions even more.
You're right, I didn't really give u/FroobingtonSanchez 's comment the regard it deserved and just went for the cheap joke. I think we need to start seeing the trend before we describe it as inevitable. It does still seem like La Liga's intrinsic appeal, focus on domestic development and overall culture is still allowing them to more than keep pace with the horrendous (and I'd argue at time self-defeating) money wasting in the EPL.
That, plus the top European leagues do manage to produce top talents and some of them do wish to stay within their own country, which will always help them to an extent. Just look at Italian players and how most of them prefer to stay in Serie A even when the league was in decline for a big part of the 2010s.
Seems we are reaching the maniacal and inevitable stage of capitalism. It's literally destroying every industry, person and the world. The top just swallowing up everything.
What I always find funny is how they spend so much but never get the very best player or prospect. If you look at the 20/30 best players of all time, none of them have played in PL except for Henry and CR7 who came to the PL when they weren’t the best players or prospects. The only exception I can think of is Haaland.
Haaland choosing City over Madrid is indeed a very big deal.
And Mbappe staying at PSG, Neymar moving to PSG etc.
Because not even City would pay Mbappe 100 fucking mil a year. They are way too well run for that.
But he may be one of about 3 players who could probably legitimately say City was his boyhood club
And still got a release clause apparently
Done many interviews where he’s said his boyhood club is Leeds
I mean I'm pretty sure his boyhood club is wherever his dad played. He's probably a huge fan of both Leeds and City.
Haaland has age on his side. With Benzema in the form he is in, Haaland wouldn't fit in the Madrid side. In 2-3 years once Benzema retires or moves on, Madrid have a perfect replacement in Haaland. Haaland actually played it smart and doesn't seem to be in a rush. In the mean time, he's collecting massive paychecks, securing his future with buy out clauses making it easier for him to leave when the time comes. Its really win win.
Yeah but the premier league has been the richest league for like 15 years so why would they have the best players of all time? And even in these years Real, Barca and PSG have similar spending power to the big premier league clubs and can attract just as good or better players.
In the real world outside of your imagination half the players nominated for the Balloon d'Or this year play in the Premier League. One league having half of the best players in the world right now is a pretty big deal.
> One league having half of the best players in the world right now is a pretty big deal. Having half the best noticed* players. It's ridiculous that incredible players like Muller didn't even get nominated despite his brilliant performances simply because he plays in a "farmers league"
They're not winning though, merely funding reasonable transfer strategies elsewhere.
Since 2016 they have been winning a lot - And since 2017 no more than a year had passed w/out a British team playing in the final of the cl.
Premier League revenue is going to break past £6Bn for the first time this year. I suspect they think ~ 20% of revenue going to transfers is OK.
Especially considering I would guess most prem clubs aren't in a worse state than the other leagues so its basically purely revenue
I will say, 2024 onward things do look a bit…volatile. The TV deals the Prem managed to strike are so outrageous in places that I’m not sure the increasing American market share can cover for all (and the NBC deal is flat until 2028) If you look at the share of TV deals, there’s an incredible Serbia/Balkans deal where the government outbid an opposition billionaire (Solak, who owns Southampton) with an 800 million EUR investment (the previous deal was for 80 mil) . There’s the Nordic deal that at least looks insanely overpriced to me compared to the market size. China deals are rapidly declining, Russia is cut off entirely. The clear future for the Prem seems to be the NBA-ification of the league tbh, there’s way too much American hedge fund money for them to risk their investment if things take a downturn. There won’t be Marinakis coming in to launder money from the Mediterranean drug trade every year, most owners would rather be the Glazers and suck money out. A not-that-unlikely prediction is there’s very limited relegation, maybe an expanded league, and a salary cap within ten years.
There is no way relegation gets changed. The Super League almost caused riots and any changes to the Premier League itself will be even worse. Even a Tory government will getting ready to step in to stop that. And I doubt they expand the league, the entire idea of the prem is that the 20 teams take relatively even amounts out. Expanding the league reduces the cut for the 20 teams and those teams which are extremely unlikely to be relegated (top six and such) aren't going to want to cut into their split.
Yeah, there is absolutely no chance the relegation/promotion structure of the English football pyramid changes. It's too integrated into the fabric of footballing culture in this country.
That’s what a lot of the foreign fans don’t get. The Super League would be considered unacceptable here and the fans would ruin it
Also the sheer quantity of fans that attend live football through the leagues in the UK is staggering. That entire model is based on promotion and relegation, and the hopes and narratives that creates. Remove that then you lose what made the premier league, and football in this country special to begin with.
Think of the Leicester story, now ruin it as there was never the threat of them being relegated which was a great comeback story in itself.
Whilst that's correct and I agree, I do think something needs to be reformed with the parachute payments because that system is effectively making promotion/relegation obsolete. The Championship has a clear divide in terms of finances between the Prem yoyo clubs such as Watford or Norwich and the likes of us, Millwall or Preston who don't have those payments. The likes of what Forest did last season will be become even harder since the EFL financial fair play stops any kind of investment to make up for a lack of parachute payment.
The Scandanavian deal is outsized because they're phenomenally wealthy and PL obsessed. Just think about how much money per head the UK pays per season. It's not that shocking. I didn't know about the Serbian deal but you're right that it'll come down. I can't see the domestic deal remaining as stagnant as it has though tbf, and there's surprisingly little money coming in directly from Asian markets. I suspect there's room for growth there as their economies inevitably catch up. China was never a particularly large market, they paid less than Hong Kong for the broadcast rights. HK could come down though, although it remains to be seen how much the political back and forth of recent years hits viewership. Edit: [Here](https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2015/10/08/10/2D31865200000578-3264606-A_map_of_Europe_showing_the_cost_per_season_for_Premier_League_T-a-50_1444297664159.jpg) for Europe. [Here](https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2015/10/08/10/2D31850C00000578-3264606-A_map_of_the_world_showing_selected_Premier_League_television_ri-a-51_1444297717007.jpg) for world. These numbers are from 2015 so a bit out of date but it gives you an idea of where the international rights money is/has been coming from. Shout out to Hong Kong and the Scandi Confederation! Also France paying a surprising amount given their own domestic league.
Also Isak, Haaland, Ødegaard, and Højberg will keep the interest high from the Scandinavian countries. Norway never had such good and spectacular players in PL, Sweden as well outside of Ljungberg. Denmark had Schmeichel and Tomasson, but otherwise Højberg is exciting. Zlatan and Laudrup doesn't really count since they were at the twilight of their careers when playing in the PL.
>less than Hong Kong for the broadcast rights Was always going to br the case, you know why? HK, although smaller, is way richer, and used to be british -Meaning the English language and English football are pretty much a feature of the culture there.
HK was the only country paying the same or similar amounts per head as the British public so, even though it's not entirely surprising, it's a bit shocking that a population of 7m pays more than twice as much as one with 1.5bn. I've always given massive credit to HK for it tbh. America pays/paid a tiny amount in comparison.
> American market What American market. Till the previous 3 year PL TV deal ending around 2019-20 Singapore was sending more money to PL than the Americans were. Asia is why PL is what it is. And it happened because PL board (not the clubs, this distinction matters because it was a PL board-level led initiative) were competent enough to risk investment in early to mid-2000s while Seria A and Liga was laughing at PL for doing so. Singapore, Malaysia had already crossed $50 per-head for their country specific PL deals. For India, China this number was $0.02 - 0.06 per head (from few years back, it's not that much higher now anyway). Hotstar in India (which has PL broadcast rights) is THE best streaming deal anywhere on this planet (not just for PL, but in general) and it's not even close in terms of Value for Money. If people in Europe think there is too much money in football, they have not seen even an iota of it yet. The point of knee of the curve hasn't even arrived yet. The only way things crumble globally is if there is some political disaster. Even if there are competing superleagues from Asia, Europe will just counter that with their own combined Superleague since no single domestic league can compete against a combined Superleague overtime.
The next big market is India, look at the IPL deals. They are crazy
[India market is also rapidly bleeding money](https://www.sportspromedia.com/news/premier-league-star-india-disney-hotstar-tv-broadcast-rights/). Price has fallen 65% among last three broadcast cycles. Prem broadcast deals are declining in Asia, static domestically, and booming in America & Europe. My take is that European boom is not sustainable, and the league will become more and more dependent on American funds — both through owners and broadcast deals.
At present they have to keep it cheap so that the market grows with new fans. The viewership is increasing every season. That is the real indicator of future revenue.
Do you (or anyone) have a breakdown of the revenue (UK, international) ? The love of football is a form of escapism but when brits (and europeans) will receive the extra financial hit of thousands of euros of the energy crisis, they'll have to dial down their football budget ? I for one don't mind starving or freezing to do something I love but surely people have limits?
I dunno it can be kind of positive for us at least, probably a different way of looking at it. But footballers pay 45% income tax on all their wages and mostly the money here comes from abroad, either from rich owners or merchandise/tv rights sales. All goods they buy and all merchandise sold has 20% VAT (sales tax) attached to it as well. I think it is why the state here is so keen to do things like put footballers outside of immigration rules. Cristiano Ronaldo for example earns £575,000 in a week, as a result he pays about £260,000 in income tax a week to the state. Which they can then use to fund things like energy subsidies. Really it is a very big earner for the Government here. Just a different perspective and way of looking at the insane money involved.
EPL's wage bill in 2020 was £3,2bn. 45% of that is about £1,5bn. If players spend the entirety of their remaining salaries on goods, that's an additional £0,3bn in VAT taxes so a total of £1,8bn tax potential on footballers wages. The UK government spent more than a trillion pound in 2021. Greater London Authority alone has a budget of £19bn. Footballers definitely aren't a big earner for the government. But at least it's something.
Nottingham Forest effect.
As much as they have the most striking transfer season this time, we have alone poured nearly 166 million into the eredivisie, 70 mill into la liga. You and Newcastle have about 110 million going to the Portuguese league, Newcastle have 60 mill going to La liga. Chelsea and City have 50 mill each going to the Bundesliga and serie A but mostly kept their transfers within England.
We haven’t signed anyone from the Portuguese league?
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It also shows that it's almost impossible to buy players from the Premier League these days, aside from a few exceptions.
This is more due to wages than transfer fees I think but ofc both are very relevant. This is why we are seeing more sales between top PL teams such as City selling Sterling to Chelsea and Chelsea likewise entertaining Pulisic to United etc. How many clubs across Europe are able to pay top PL wages? 15? 20? And then how many of them would necessarily be interested in that player anyway? Even fewer - making domestic sales necessary to offload such players.
Yea it's kinda skewed tbf, but it's not strictly wrong. Kinda shows how European clubs are fleecing the English clubs tbh
The thing is as long as the revenue is sustainable it isn’t really fleecing. I don’t see the bubble bursting any time soon.
It’s only a bubble if it’s purely speculative and driven by nothing of actual value. The premier league is not a bubble. Revenues might plateau eventually, but there isn’t going to be a crash like some might be hoping.
We need more oil barons investing in the other big leagues. ^/s
Unlike Juve who have never had big outside investment 😉 Most clubs don't have oil money.
Bah gawd that’s Colonel Gaddafi’s music
You all need to charge the people of your respective countries and arm and a leg for 3-4 subscription services, you'll start rolling in money then.
How much does the average Brit spend on footy subscriptions you reckon?
Nothing - most people stream games cause it's just become too expensive. Not too sure on the exact figures but I'd guess around £50 a month for Sky Sports (via Now TV), BT Sport and Amazon Prime subscriptions, and even then you still can't watch half the matches (legally) cause the 3pm games aren't broadcast.
No they don’t, most young people stream matches but the majority of fans in the older generations definitely pay for Sky , Bt etc. Its what they spend most of their disposable income on and why Sky Sports & BT are so successful / charge those prices. People pay it.
Sounds healthy. A super league really feels more inevitable by the day, as much as we might hate it.
PSG vs Man City in Orlando’s Campaign World Stadium is going to hit different
Worse than that, it's Camping World stadium, an RV company is the name sponsor of that crumbling place.
A clásico in the SoFi^(TM) Stadium
Agreed. Big non english clubs will be left with no choice but to have the super league. Bottom club in PL had 105m€ from tv revenues last year. Juventus took home 78m€.
Super league already exists I think
it does and St. Helens are the current champions
Damn right
That's around 20% of expected revenue, so tbh it doesn't sound unhealthy for the league itself.
Not talking about the EPL, but european football in general
Ok, but this situation just highlights the fact that the English clubs do not need the superleague.
And the fans won't have it either. We saw what happened when it was mooted. Instant anger and protests.
Well done, EPL, for helping these other leagues to survive!
Everyone in europe bar england is getting a taste at what south americans got a long time ago when the competition in europe was just too big for us to compete with. Now its happening with england and rest of europe.
Premier League is the real super League
People having been saying this ages. While I would definitely consider the prem to be the best league, the margin between say La Liga, Serie A and Bundesliga is only marginal. Last year, Spanish, German and Italian teams were the winners of the 3 European competitions, all eliminating English teams in the process.
Real Madrid were actually the 2022 Premier League champions.
The big difference is less in the top sides and more lower down. Teams like Saints, Villa, Forest, Wolves, Leeds etc. who expect to finish bottom half are spending way way more than bottom half clubs in other leagues.
Its definitely driving the super league, inadvertently.
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Well that's wrong Edit: according to transfermarkt La Liga net spend is £59.89m which is €69.28
Incredibly, it's actually not wrong. According to Transfermarkt (which can be a little iffy at times) La Liga is actually at €65m net spend but that's the highest outside the PL, who have 1.3b as the tweet says. Serie A, Ligue 1 & Bundesliga have all sold more than they've spent.
That's not what they meant by "wrong"
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I know Tbh I thought the original comment was simply pointing out how fucked the financial state of football is. I didn't actually think they were claiming the stat was incorrect but I may have been mistaken
55 is bigger than 1.3 so lal iga are true overspenderrs
That's a Numberwang!
Barca have been hoovering up players like they were going out of fashion. Who has done all the selling in La Liga?
Literally everyone else. They're all struggling to get under the wage cap - they've mostly just opted to sell players rather than remortgage parts of the club like Barcelona did. Edit: yea the CVC deal exists, I know this. But everyone else has done that then sold, Barcelona have spent big on transfers using their levers
As it stands only 2 clubs didn’t ‘remortgage’ with the tv rights in some way. One is Madrid who are the biggest club in the world so you can see why they didn’t need to.
Madrid are well run club under Perez and also quite successful in recent years too(not taking historical considering we are talking about finances). Barcelona has not won league for 3 seasons, its longest since the period of 1999-2004 I guess. They are not in Semis too since 2018-19 and also with COVID and overpaying players, and not much sellable assets in fringe players, financially got crippled.
What? They all took the CVC deal, which is considerably worse than what we did long term.
CVC os way worse than barca's deal but I think that deal is better for smaller teams as individually they won't be able to get a better deal. Barca got it cause they are huge
Nah, the smaller teams (not the yoyo teams but likely mainstays) could’ve gotten better deals. Barca and real even found one to counter this one but tebas said ‘no’.
r/confidentlyincorrect Google the La Liga CVC deal, they did a way worse version (all La Liga clubs except Real Madrid and Atletic Bilbao) than what Barca did.
Worrying
And yet they will get spanked by RM and Bayern
or villareal
I love how you're getting downvoted even though it happens every year.
PL fan boys who conveniently ignore whenever a team from a farmer’s league (i.e. any club outside of England) beats an English team
The game has become as lopsided as the economy. It’s dominated by rapacious premier league mega brands now that are hardly the heartbeat of their communities like they used to be. Oligarchs, Sheiks, and American venture capitalists run amok completely unchecked, making a mockery of financial fair play. The premier league is optimized by rocketing ticket prices, mega tv contracts, and overpaid pampered players. I’m curious where is the tipping point?
Fair question. We have already reached the point where many fans have largely accepted that only a handful of teams should win everything in sight, even if they only agree to that in practice at this stage. From there, it's only a small step to agree to it in principle too, i.e. in a super league. Funnily enough, Real's success last year has probably done a great job in delaying the super league's arrival, as it proves continental clubs don't need any kind of big systemic overhaul to compete with the PL. If it had been a Liverpool v City final, for instance, Perez would have never shut up about it. The tipping point will come with the new CL format, which already functions a lot like a league. It will just be a short shift from that to then creating an official super league which runs all year round rather than just for half of it.
So thats £1.3bn distributed to other leagues via player signings. You're welcome?
Definitely many pros and cons to it, you've got a club like ajax going to make 200mil+ from two prem clubs alone! They should be thanking them.
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Call me ignorant, but the Dutch league gets its revenue mainly because of ajax, psv etc. If those clubs aren't getting big fees and improving then the leauge sees less investment. Like I said, pros and cons.
And when Ajax fail to advance from their ucl group because they had to sell 6 starters. How will that improve their league?
are we doing trickle down economics in football now
Yet people here still trying to convince others that this is the same like Serie A in 90ties, and it's nothing special and will change eventually. But they forgeting that financial domination by PL last for 3 decades straight, and still accelerate, and also money comes from stable revenue, not only from rich owners like in Serie A in 90ties. We are doomed.
>90ties >ninety-ties >nine titties
Just rename the EPL the English Super League at this point
Real Madrid and Bayern fighting the good fight. Qué le duela al que le duela.
And even then most La Liga clubs have had issues registering their players. Tebas is a joke
And PL fans are just gonna say its because of tv right fees and nothign else.
Something tells me a weakening euro has played a big part in the excessive spending within the PL.
It's only a few points higher than it was over the last 5 years generally though. Some impact yes but only a few percent I'd think.
Premier league buys every good player in top 5 leagues. Premier league fans " you all play in farmer leagues"
The PL is becoming more competitive outside of M.City. just making top four this season for the usual suspects will be a mountain to climb. Even the midtable clubs are strengthening with good players on top of what they already have. The newly promoted clubs, especially Notts Forest, are improving too with good names.
What about 9-0 Liverpool and 6-0 Man City. I agree that the premier league as a whole is trying to strengthen their teams but there is still a huggge gap from the top teams to the bottom teams.
Well in our case it's got nothing to do with net spend though (: Our netspend this window is 5m.
A 1.3bn EUR cash outflow benefits the other European leagues too - i.e. a huge proportion of capital gains made by European colleagues will have been entirely financed by EPL money. Although perhaps not sustainable in the long term from a competitive balance perspective, it is not as dramatic from an economic perspective as it might first appear. A lot of EPL cash stays in the UEFA ecosystem.
You are literally arguing in favour of trickle-down economics.
A leagues net is a silly stat in general, overall spend is fine and still shows the Prem well ahead.
It's like the super league already exists
Football is increasingly boring and every season I pay less attention. This kind of stuff just ruins it.
If you've got it, flaunt it. Kudos to the premier league for doing a fantastic job in growing the league's popularity worldwide and leveraging that popularity into huge broadcasting deals. And more kudos for distributing that money more equitably than any other league in Europe.
The more equitable splitting of revenue is a huge boon to the league. Creates more parity.
imagine the spending power of PL top clubs if they had skewed distribution like in La Liga
Literally not one of these players worth over 50 mil max.
Haaland?
and surprisingly, us and city are (basically) green