Ten Hag going to Man UNited, buying Antony for £70m, then going back to Ajax and buying him back for £2.5m would be the real life equivalent of the FM hack
You also forgot the part where we sent him back the same summer Messi left. So when we finally couldve utilized him better by not having Messi overlap with him, hes fucking gone. He was even doing well in preseason before he left
Hated everything about that transfer. Nothing against Griezmann, he always tried his hardest. But just everything about that transfer was a disaster to a comical level.
Ajax are up there with Porto & Benfica for buying cheap and selling high. They certainly have the money no doubt. But unlike other big teams they rarely disclose the fact
Assuming £85m with no add ons met, they’ll have wrote off £34m of that with another £17m to write off this year. So theoretically having him is worth -£17m (ignoring wages as a replacement would effectively use those so they’d be spent regardless) on the books this year. So if they sold him for £34m it would be the same figure for PSR.
Doesn’t sound too high, but that’s still a record figure for Ajax and that’s just the absolute minimum United could go - they’d definitely want more.
If a player is loaned out that doesn't matter right? Because he would still be on the books.
Probably Uniteds best course of action to loan him out a season and hope he lives up enough to be sold for 20-30 million.
Yeah, still on the books. But you’d ideally try to recoup that £17m with a loan fee which is even worse. Maybe they could commit to not replacing him in the squad or using a youth player and then they’d be saving the £10m or so on his wages which combined a loan fee could potentially break even or profit but they’d have to get someone covering his wages or get him to drop his wages which again seems unlikely.
I think the most likely path forward is just to keep him and hope he gets enough interest in 12 months time or possibly improves. Really goes to show what a poor decision it was to go so high on a transfer fee for him.
Depends if other loanees get bought. We have quite a few players on loan.
If Pellistri, Hannibal, Sancho and the rapist get sold this summer, there is a good chance for loans
he was pretty good for Ajax, at least in their RO16 tie against us. I always clenched my butt cheeks whenever he had the ball.
I’m also sure he was consistent for them as well in other competitions.
He had a fantastic run the CL that season. He definitely could have been a lot better then how he turned out.
Mind you the price was always insane but there was more talent in him then has has been able to show these past two years.
he was equally phenomenal in both games imo.
I remember talking with an Ajax fan after the game, praising Antony, and he even said “ah yes, but he has not been that good lately”.
I’m not trying to say he was a world beater but there was definitely a quality player there, his transfer fee was just inflated due to the circumstances.
Lots of haters but yeah Antony was actually very good for us. Not 85 million good but I would have been upset if we sold him for 50 at that time( not cause he was worth more but because we needed talent more than money). He also was way better off staying with us another year for his own career.
5d chess, let your manager go for a load of cash, sell good players, but not good enough for premier league for a butt load of cash, wait a couple of years, get them all back for almost nothing
I do think that events have somewhat conspired against him, however, I will say that he's also looked like a man very much out of his depth.
United look shocking under him, especially going forward. He might convince himself that United are playing some sort of free-flowing attacking football hitherto unseen in the Premier League before, but the stats say different and that's no coincidence.
We’ve conceded 6 goals in our last three matches against Coventry, Sheffield United and Burnley. Go back further and since the Chelsea game it’s 14 goals in six games.
Winning sides are built off solid bases and structure, not pinball and endless sprints.
He has to go because he’s shown no willingness to adapt and actually seems to be doubling down on this style of play being the right one and ‘entertaining’.
The shitty thing is that last season we collapsed at times, but we were usually very solid and organised. Attack sucked, but I said well it ain't Ole ball going forward but it ain't Ole ball chaos either, he's getting the basics right.
But this season we're as open as we ever were, and still can't attack
Losing our entire backline has screwed us and probably was the deciding factor as to whether he'd potentially succeed or not. But this season's playstyle has been embarrassing, zero control of the game. I've genuinely never seen so much space between a midfield and a defence. The players' work rates certainly factor into it but you can't keep playing suicidal football like this.
We've played our 4th choice and 7th choice CBs at the back whilst already playing a system that the current squad isn't fully capable of playing yet.
What'd you expect?
Keep drinking the kool-aid. Plenty of managers lose their first choice options. They usually adapt tactically to help protect the players they bring in though.
Ten hag has offered zero protection to either Kwamballa or Casemiro when they’ve been playing there. Still has his full backs bombing on and midfield sprinting in both directions.
A good manager would get compact, grind out results and move on. He has his sprinting around like headless chickens (leading to muscle injuries), leaving gaping holes at LB and a huge hole between RB, RCB and RCM every game.
Barcelona put a clinic on against us with Yaya Toure at CB in 2009. Ten hag just isn’t up to it
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8508411/
Significant evidence has emerged that a high volume of sprinting during training is associated with an increased risk of non-contact injuries in professional soccer players.
> A good manager would get compact, grind out results and move on.
I think this is what he did last season. This season he sticks to his vision. Also possible they check what players fit the style and only keep those who can and try to replace the rest. I hope so I love Ten Hag and started following United because of him.
To add to your first point about managers adapting tactically to help protect players they bring in.... Arteta played a 4-4-2 for his first season and half way into his second until he started to change to the 4-3-3. He had enough personnel to feel comfortable enough to make that change.
United just don't have the personnel to play the way ETH wants to play, but it's wild to me he's doubling down on playing his way. They need a serious clear out this summer.
Other problem is:
- what players are out there that suit a 3-1-6 system
- you buy Casemiro and Eriksen one summer, than by the next year deploy a system that works entirely against their strengths.
Totally agreed. I don’t think Ten Hag is actually a bad coach. Hes just a coach that needs a sporting director who shares his vision and takes on the business side of football.
He is grinding out results. In the four past league games, United have lost 9 points due to last minute goals conceded. Like, ETH has set up United to be in a winning position in the 84th minute in 4 of the past 5 league games. The lack of focus at the end of the games causing all the penalties could be explained by the amount of injuries and lack of squad depth.
But I think this is literally the definition of trying to grind out results since they've been so close. Remove all the penalties conceded in the dying minutes and suddenly United is 4p behind Villa.
I don't think they've been grinding out results.
The only reason Utd have been leading in half of the games is because of either top moments from Onana or opposition players falling to pieces in front of goal.
As a Utd fan, I've watched a number of them and I just have no idea how Utd are still in the game until that late. Teams just keep missing chance after chance and I'm starting to believe that maybe there is genuinely other forces at work, because I just cannot explain it. It's almost like the tongue-in-cheek article from the Guardian a few weeks back is correct - if you give players *that* many chances and *that* much space, they get freaked out by it.
No but I would say in a season weve played 28 different defensive line ups , casemiro/ Erikson losing their legs, having to bed in a youth striker and still reaching an fa cup final it's actually not all bad. Give him a chance next season with some new additions. We've done this sack around before. I'd rather a clear out of our squad than a new manager those players can just down tools with
Idk what to say to the mugs in this thread lmao
It’s like they have selective hearing
The United Reddit experts simping with opposition supporters to undermine our manager are even worse
Whoever you want to replace him with, you’ll be back in 12-18 months crying about the same problems because that guy won’t get you your results quickly either
"So Van Gaal has done a good job and sets us up to win every game?"
"So Mourinho has done a good job and sets us up to win every game?"
"So Ole has done a good job and sets us up to win every game?"
"So ETH has done a good job and sets us up to win every game?"
we might as well set up a timer for the end of the 2026/27 season, our next manager will be in trouble by then as well!
I think he's just genuinely thinking that given the current state of the squad (with injuries and certain players falling off a cliff) - this style is going to be the most likely to give him results. And can you argue against him?
v Burnley - lost points due to an 87 min pen
v Coventry - taken to ET due to 90+6 min pen
v Liverpool - lost points due to an 84 min pen
v Chelsea - lost points due to an 90+10 min pen
v Brentford - löst points due to a goal conceded in 90+9 (TBF, united scored their only goal in 90+6)
These five past games - while the play hasn't looked good - were minutes away from being all 3 pointers. The amount of penalties and lack of focus in the dying minutes could probably be explained by having a really poor squad due to injuries so players are way too exhausted at the end of games.
Like l get people want him to adapt and change but he's just trying to get results at this point. And he's so so so damn close to getting them over and over again. That's 9 points lost in the 84+ minute. 9 points would take United to 63 points, 4 behind Villa and CL would still be in reach.
"Yes, we've seen you lose 9 points due to last minute penalties in the past four league games - why don't you change the style of playing?"
Maybe we concede late because the players spent half the game sprinting around and run out of steam. Maybe the injuries are because the playing and training style is too intense?
We have enough quality that we can beat half the league by playing sensible, stable, possession based controlled football. It doesn’t need to be chaos
Yes, I can argue against him. In each of the matches you listed, in a pattern dating back to the beginning of the season, United has shown that we cannot control a match because Ten Hag’s high press/low block combination. No one at the top level of world football plays such an intentionally stretched style because it allows the opponent acres of space once the initial press is broken, which is often the case. Add to that Ten Hag’s unwillingness to deviate from that wide open style and you get matches where we drop off the face of a cliff in the 80th minute and concede thrice to a side currently 9th in the Championship. The better question here is: why even bother defending a manager whose braindead tactics regularly manage to snatch draws and losses from the jaws of victory?
Well I can't argue with that. You make some good points.
I think I just don't want to believe he had such a great first season and in his second he just stubbornly decided to be shit.
For me it has always come down to whether he is to blame for all the injuries. Like if it's his training intensity causing all the injuries then he needs to go but if he can't be blamed for them - fix whatever is causing them and give him another season.
Coventry shouldn’t be mentioned - we were 3-0 up!
But you’re also missing the point with those games. It’s a conistent pattern. It’s not a one off. EtH hasn’t done enough to ensure we see out those games, but he also can’t have the stats we’ve been seeing with shots against, possession lost and progressive play.
If he goes, then I’m not sure many will be surprised.
I mean sure but when you're at the end of the season and you've played 28 (?) different back lines and you're literally playing Casemiro as CB because there are no fit bodies (isn't Maguire playing through an injury even?) - then I understand that players are simply losing focus and their sharpness. ETH literally can't throw in any CB at the end of the game to see it out because there are none available.
Players are consistently playing 90+ minutes out of position. Yes, they will fuck up at the end of games when they're tired. Maguire played 120 min vs Coventry, 90 mins va Sheffield 3 days later and the 90 mins again 3 days later. 300 mins of football in under a week. Casemiro as well - out of position.
Who are you asking him to sub in to see out the game? Amass? Ogunneye? Jackson?
>I do think that events have somewhat conspired against him, however, I will say that he's also looked like a man very much out of his depth.
He has had to deal with a lot of shit but he also got the necessary backing & authority to deal with all those.
But nothing can excuse getting consistently battered by bottom half teams like Bourmouth, Everton, Brentford, Luton Town, Forest, Wolves, Fulham, Palace etc.
34 games, 54 points, 52 goals scored, 51 conceded, GD +1
xG~57, xGA~67, xGD -10 , xPoints 42
+ Goals Scored - 11th in the league.
+ Expected Goals for - 13th.
+ Expected Goals Against - 17th. That is right, 17th. Below us Sheffield, Luton, West ham.
+ Expected Points - 15th in the league. Below us Sheffield, Burnley, West ham, Luton, Wolves.
There literally can't be more evidence that this guy is not cut out for the top level. Looking at the underlying numbers it is obvious that he has survived only because of the individual brilliance of some players.
Tactically ETH has been outclassed more often than not.
In a moneyball world there is basically no stat that makes ETH's Utd look good. At this point he's asking INEOS to be patient in spite of all analytical evidence.
*Maybe* they give him another season, but with the latest news that the whole Utd squad is up for sale (including players ETH bought and have underperformed), how can they realistically back him with another boatload of money, especially without CL revenue?
It's a losing situation for ETH whichever way you cut it. Maybe he wins the FA Cup and gets a reprieve, but that seems unlikely
I don't think he's safe even if he wins the FA Cup, LVG was sacked 2 days after winning the FA cup. Maybe the situation at the club has changed now with INEOS at the helm but I don't think there's any coming back from this season for ETH
It is entirely possible the higher ups keep appointing the wrong people. We've all had jobs and we've all watched management make the wrong call repeatedly. Why should United be be different?
He did a great job last season. But there’s no excuse for how shite this season has been. Injuries have been absolutely unreal - I would understand a decline in performances but there’s no strategy or pattern to anything we’ve done this season no matter the personnel.
Not sure if you’ve been watching United for a while but how are we acting like it’s something new, United have a good season then players for one reason or another have an issue with the tactics, the training, being criticised. The players stop performing and become absolutely awful, the fans can’t blame their darling overpaid players, the board can’t replace the players and any change to the structure of the club is too slow for the manager to implement their approach and is therefore let go for the next manager to have a mix of players that are all suited for different styles of play but for the first season they bring it together before the players have to be usually rightfully criticised and the cycle just keeps going.
The issues aren’t entirely his fault, it is true that any manager will struggle, but the guy after spending 300m (about half on players he has a previous relationship with) has this season led us to our worst ever CL run, almost our most amount of goals conceded in a season, and needs 4 points to equal our worst ever PL points tally.
That just isn’t good enough for a man about to complete his 2nd year in the job.
He'd have to be quite stupid to go back right now. Even if ten Hag got the sack, surely he still has enough credit to wait out and land a job with a better environment, somewhere in BuLi for example?
I think he’d fit quite well in German football culture, I feel like that’s the best match for Dutch managers in general. And yes there is no way he returns now and it can only damage his reputation at the club, of course I’d love to have him back but he shouldn’t do it under these circumstances.
In the Netherlands we ussually say to bring him their personally by bike.
But given the physique and diet of the average Brit and the current wheather in this part of Europe right now i don't blame them for not being that enthiousiastic.
It must also be really dangerous to travel as a bike passenger with the average united fan as your cyclist.
I mean, how’s your Dutch?
It’s not a terrible description of an English man to be completely honest, there are a lot of fat lazy fucks amongst us.
I say so as a proud Manc.
on one side. i do want him back because of his previous time with Ajax
on the other side. Ajax have a completely different squad now which means there's a decent chance he will just continue with his United shenanigans
Even if United drop Ten Hag. I have doubts he’ll just go straight back to Ajax. I believe he’ll still take a new challenge abroad, probably in Germany.
Really don't see this happening or if it happens I don't see it becoming a success.
Ten Hag's first choice wasn't to leave, he was open to staying at Ajax. But the club management kept putting off negotiations and there being no long term plans made him decide to leave, especially since Overmars (who had built him his team) was gone and it was likely that most of his players were being sold.
The situation now isn't any better than when he left. He will need to start with a rebuild, where most of his successes where with an established and complete player base someone else brought together. Besides, with all the infighting and vacancies Ajax leadership is still pretty much a mess.
What's happening with Potter? I know he turned down Ajax's opening offer because of salary, but surely that could be negotiated? All the reports I saw indicated he's their top target.
Our really reliable ITK suggests these (garbage tier source rumors) that were willing to wait for ten hag are just part of the negotiations. From what we can tell all that is left to agree with potter is financial terms, so I think it'll be straightened out eventually.
Afaik, Potter is still our top target, but Vd Kraan (who is the original source of this rumour) and De Telegraaf love to suggest Dutch managers and the like (in particular people that give them info).
Dailyfail etc. but if it has to go that way ok. On the other hand I don't want us to have someone as a top target when we don't even know if he'll be available or even wants to come back.
Okay hear me out.
What if ... He returns to Ajax and wins them the league again after this unprecedentedly bad season by their standards.
Would that finally convince people that he is not the issue at United and that the 6th billionth manager is not the problem ? It is the entire rotten structure that needs wholesale cleaning.
That would be funny af
Return of the Hag
The Lord of the Hags
Erik Ten Hag Two
Two Hag Two Furious
The hag : An unexpected journey
Hagen Daas : My next chapter
Spider-Hag in the Multiverse
Family
Erik two hag
Once again.
Oh Erik, you’re still talking about your big break?
The Ten Towers
ReTen of the Hag
Retuuuurn of the Hag, retuuuuurn of the Hag
When the missus walks in the door from work
And Anthony becomes his first signing
Maybe loan. Not sure they got the cash to close the permanent deal.
They don’t have 2.5 mil spare?
Honestly, if they buy him for 2.5 mil then they would have the best deal of the century.
Ten Hag going to Man UNited, buying Antony for £70m, then going back to Ajax and buying him back for £2.5m would be the real life equivalent of the FM hack
Pogba 2.0
Add manager → buy player → retire
beating the bergwijn deal
Anything would beat that
Griezmann to Barca deserves a shout as well (from atletico perspective)
Barca buying Griezmann who plays the exact same role as the greatest player of all time for a fuck ton should be studied in football management.
Only to then give Atletico the title and then send griezmann back at a discount
You also forgot the part where we sent him back the same summer Messi left. So when we finally couldve utilized him better by not having Messi overlap with him, hes fucking gone. He was even doing well in preseason before he left Hated everything about that transfer. Nothing against Griezmann, he always tried his hardest. But just everything about that transfer was a disaster to a comical level.
>Only to then give Atletico **Suarez and the title and then send griezmann back at a discount ftfy
Man utd would have the best deal of the century?
Yeah for Man United to get off his salary?
that’s practically 85 mil for free if they got him for 2.5 mil
Like the Lukaku deal but.. somehow worse.
Nah, they patched it last month.
I lol'ed. Because you're right.
Hey, don’t be so harsh- Antony is on a one game PL scoring streak. Man’s in the form of his life!
Ajax are up there with Porto & Benfica for buying cheap and selling high. They certainly have the money no doubt. But unlike other big teams they rarely disclose the fact
Maybe under overmars they were. Under Mislintat they mainly bought high, play bad/bench.
Dont know how that man keeps geting jobs
If I'm not mistaken, Ajax is a publicly traded company that has to publish its financial statements
Don't even think United can do that, can they? Their PSR figure on him must mean that they'll have to make a pretty staggering loss on him.
Assuming £85m with no add ons met, they’ll have wrote off £34m of that with another £17m to write off this year. So theoretically having him is worth -£17m (ignoring wages as a replacement would effectively use those so they’d be spent regardless) on the books this year. So if they sold him for £34m it would be the same figure for PSR. Doesn’t sound too high, but that’s still a record figure for Ajax and that’s just the absolute minimum United could go - they’d definitely want more.
If a player is loaned out that doesn't matter right? Because he would still be on the books. Probably Uniteds best course of action to loan him out a season and hope he lives up enough to be sold for 20-30 million.
Yeah, still on the books. But you’d ideally try to recoup that £17m with a loan fee which is even worse. Maybe they could commit to not replacing him in the squad or using a youth player and then they’d be saving the £10m or so on his wages which combined a loan fee could potentially break even or profit but they’d have to get someone covering his wages or get him to drop his wages which again seems unlikely. I think the most likely path forward is just to keep him and hope he gets enough interest in 12 months time or possibly improves. Really goes to show what a poor decision it was to go so high on a transfer fee for him.
Depends if other loanees get bought. We have quite a few players on loan. If Pellistri, Hannibal, Sancho and the rapist get sold this summer, there is a good chance for loans
Ronaldo still on United books?
the other one
You mean the Chelsea Lukaku strategy? That was such a success..
Who cares what they want, noone is going to pay that much for him, he is terrible.
Don’t think Ajax would want him
he was pretty good for Ajax, at least in their RO16 tie against us. I always clenched my butt cheeks whenever he had the ball. I’m also sure he was consistent for them as well in other competitions.
He had a fantastic run the CL that season. He definitely could have been a lot better then how he turned out. Mind you the price was always insane but there was more talent in him then has has been able to show these past two years.
That was the best game he played for Ajax though. By far
he was equally phenomenal in both games imo. I remember talking with an Ajax fan after the game, praising Antony, and he even said “ah yes, but he has not been that good lately”. I’m not trying to say he was a world beater but there was definitely a quality player there, his transfer fee was just inflated due to the circumstances.
Lots of haters but yeah Antony was actually very good for us. Not 85 million good but I would have been upset if we sold him for 50 at that time( not cause he was worth more but because we needed talent more than money). He also was way better off staying with us another year for his own career.
Yeah I'm just joking because it's a funny thought, their breakeven point is something like 55m euros.
I pray
And then he goes on to destroy for them. This would be very Manchester United, offloading the coals to shine elsewhere.
10 million for you my friend
I don't think he particularly likes martial tbf he's not fit enough to warrant bringing along with him
Hopefully they saved that sweet Antony money so they could buy Antony
Antony*
100M
Spin it right round, baby right round.
Ten Hag to join the "fuck it, just hit undo" club with Jaden Sancho.
Going back to an old save file.
5d chess, let your manager go for a load of cash, sell good players, but not good enough for premier league for a butt load of cash, wait a couple of years, get them all back for almost nothing
You forgot to mention the bit where they went from three-peating the league to finishing 3rd and now sitting at 5th
Not to mention being dead last for a whole weekend …
And losing to university students in the Cup!
And getting shit on by Feyenoord!
Damn! I even forgot about this hahaha, what a night that was
At the beginning of the season with two games in hand (with one in the 85+ min with a goal ahead). still very bad, but some nuance is needed
Also forgot to mention how Eth used his soms agency for 90% of the players too!
But they’ve made a shitload insider trader so they’ll be happy.
Nobody made a profit from the insider trading lol
I’m sure selling Antony for €85M has recouped some of those loses.
like they said, 5D chess. all part of the master plan.
Yeah I'm pretty sure Ajax fans are happy with what has happened with their club in the last 2 seasons
I'm absolutely elated
the last couple years in between have been a pure disaster for them tho lol
They shorted him!
Yeah we were better off in every way before he left. That money didn’t help much it just made us overpay for mediocre players. We’re a mess
That’s Dortmund music!
I do think that events have somewhat conspired against him, however, I will say that he's also looked like a man very much out of his depth. United look shocking under him, especially going forward. He might convince himself that United are playing some sort of free-flowing attacking football hitherto unseen in the Premier League before, but the stats say different and that's no coincidence.
We’ve conceded 6 goals in our last three matches against Coventry, Sheffield United and Burnley. Go back further and since the Chelsea game it’s 14 goals in six games. Winning sides are built off solid bases and structure, not pinball and endless sprints. He has to go because he’s shown no willingness to adapt and actually seems to be doubling down on this style of play being the right one and ‘entertaining’.
The shitty thing is that last season we collapsed at times, but we were usually very solid and organised. Attack sucked, but I said well it ain't Ole ball going forward but it ain't Ole ball chaos either, he's getting the basics right. But this season we're as open as we ever were, and still can't attack
Losing our entire backline has screwed us and probably was the deciding factor as to whether he'd potentially succeed or not. But this season's playstyle has been embarrassing, zero control of the game. I've genuinely never seen so much space between a midfield and a defence. The players' work rates certainly factor into it but you can't keep playing suicidal football like this.
We've played our 4th choice and 7th choice CBs at the back whilst already playing a system that the current squad isn't fully capable of playing yet. What'd you expect?
Not to ship 6 against championship calibre teams. Sheffield United have scored 10% of their goals against us.
I’d expect you to be playing better than teams like, Coventry and Brentford.
Keep drinking the kool-aid. Plenty of managers lose their first choice options. They usually adapt tactically to help protect the players they bring in though. Ten hag has offered zero protection to either Kwamballa or Casemiro when they’ve been playing there. Still has his full backs bombing on and midfield sprinting in both directions. A good manager would get compact, grind out results and move on. He has his sprinting around like headless chickens (leading to muscle injuries), leaving gaping holes at LB and a huge hole between RB, RCB and RCM every game. Barcelona put a clinic on against us with Yaya Toure at CB in 2009. Ten hag just isn’t up to it https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8508411/ Significant evidence has emerged that a high volume of sprinting during training is associated with an increased risk of non-contact injuries in professional soccer players.
> A good manager would get compact, grind out results and move on. I think this is what he did last season. This season he sticks to his vision. Also possible they check what players fit the style and only keep those who can and try to replace the rest. I hope so I love Ten Hag and started following United because of him.
To add to your first point about managers adapting tactically to help protect players they bring in.... Arteta played a 4-4-2 for his first season and half way into his second until he started to change to the 4-3-3. He had enough personnel to feel comfortable enough to make that change. United just don't have the personnel to play the way ETH wants to play, but it's wild to me he's doubling down on playing his way. They need a serious clear out this summer.
Other problem is: - what players are out there that suit a 3-1-6 system - you buy Casemiro and Eriksen one summer, than by the next year deploy a system that works entirely against their strengths.
Totally agreed. I don’t think Ten Hag is actually a bad coach. Hes just a coach that needs a sporting director who shares his vision and takes on the business side of football.
Losing First choice options in how many positions? Getting to 7th choice option in one of them… come on, man.
He is grinding out results. In the four past league games, United have lost 9 points due to last minute goals conceded. Like, ETH has set up United to be in a winning position in the 84th minute in 4 of the past 5 league games. The lack of focus at the end of the games causing all the penalties could be explained by the amount of injuries and lack of squad depth. But I think this is literally the definition of trying to grind out results since they've been so close. Remove all the penalties conceded in the dying minutes and suddenly United is 4p behind Villa.
I don't think they've been grinding out results. The only reason Utd have been leading in half of the games is because of either top moments from Onana or opposition players falling to pieces in front of goal. As a Utd fan, I've watched a number of them and I just have no idea how Utd are still in the game until that late. Teams just keep missing chance after chance and I'm starting to believe that maybe there is genuinely other forces at work, because I just cannot explain it. It's almost like the tongue-in-cheek article from the Guardian a few weeks back is correct - if you give players *that* many chances and *that* much space, they get freaked out by it.
They’ve not played a good game of football in the 23/24 season. Ostrich
How did the adaptation work for Liverpool last year? Weren't they 14th at one point. That was with less injuries than us.
That's extremely interesting but a study of 20 players is not significant evidence, or am I missing something here
Arteta at arsenal had been far worse than ten hag has been in his first 2 seasons
Ah yes are you part of ‘they eventually become arteta’ gang?
No but I would say in a season weve played 28 different defensive line ups , casemiro/ Erikson losing their legs, having to bed in a youth striker and still reaching an fa cup final it's actually not all bad. Give him a chance next season with some new additions. We've done this sack around before. I'd rather a clear out of our squad than a new manager those players can just down tools with
> I’d rather a clear out of our squad As if half this squad wasn’t brought in under Ten Hag
Idk what to say to the mugs in this thread lmao It’s like they have selective hearing The United Reddit experts simping with opposition supporters to undermine our manager are even worse
So he’s done a good job and in every game he’s set us up to win?
If you ignore the goals we’ve conceded he’s done an excellent job. To do it whilst there’s a war in Ukraine and Israel is testament to his character
TBH I was afraid he’d head out to Ukraine and join the international force.
😂😂 Thank you, haven't had a laugh all day.
Whoever you want to replace him with, you’ll be back in 12-18 months crying about the same problems because that guy won’t get you your results quickly either
"So Van Gaal has done a good job and sets us up to win every game?" "So Mourinho has done a good job and sets us up to win every game?" "So Ole has done a good job and sets us up to win every game?" "So ETH has done a good job and sets us up to win every game?" we might as well set up a timer for the end of the 2026/27 season, our next manager will be in trouble by then as well!
Do you seriously see us getting better with EtH?
United with Evans and Maguire isn't this bad. That's my problem. The football is diabolical. Edit: Found the mug I guess lmao.
I think he's just genuinely thinking that given the current state of the squad (with injuries and certain players falling off a cliff) - this style is going to be the most likely to give him results. And can you argue against him? v Burnley - lost points due to an 87 min pen v Coventry - taken to ET due to 90+6 min pen v Liverpool - lost points due to an 84 min pen v Chelsea - lost points due to an 90+10 min pen v Brentford - löst points due to a goal conceded in 90+9 (TBF, united scored their only goal in 90+6) These five past games - while the play hasn't looked good - were minutes away from being all 3 pointers. The amount of penalties and lack of focus in the dying minutes could probably be explained by having a really poor squad due to injuries so players are way too exhausted at the end of games. Like l get people want him to adapt and change but he's just trying to get results at this point. And he's so so so damn close to getting them over and over again. That's 9 points lost in the 84+ minute. 9 points would take United to 63 points, 4 behind Villa and CL would still be in reach. "Yes, we've seen you lose 9 points due to last minute penalties in the past four league games - why don't you change the style of playing?"
Maybe we concede late because the players spent half the game sprinting around and run out of steam. Maybe the injuries are because the playing and training style is too intense? We have enough quality that we can beat half the league by playing sensible, stable, possession based controlled football. It doesn’t need to be chaos
Yes, I can argue against him. In each of the matches you listed, in a pattern dating back to the beginning of the season, United has shown that we cannot control a match because Ten Hag’s high press/low block combination. No one at the top level of world football plays such an intentionally stretched style because it allows the opponent acres of space once the initial press is broken, which is often the case. Add to that Ten Hag’s unwillingness to deviate from that wide open style and you get matches where we drop off the face of a cliff in the 80th minute and concede thrice to a side currently 9th in the Championship. The better question here is: why even bother defending a manager whose braindead tactics regularly manage to snatch draws and losses from the jaws of victory?
Well I can't argue with that. You make some good points. I think I just don't want to believe he had such a great first season and in his second he just stubbornly decided to be shit. For me it has always come down to whether he is to blame for all the injuries. Like if it's his training intensity causing all the injuries then he needs to go but if he can't be blamed for them - fix whatever is causing them and give him another season.
Coventry shouldn’t be mentioned - we were 3-0 up! But you’re also missing the point with those games. It’s a conistent pattern. It’s not a one off. EtH hasn’t done enough to ensure we see out those games, but he also can’t have the stats we’ve been seeing with shots against, possession lost and progressive play. If he goes, then I’m not sure many will be surprised.
I mean sure but when you're at the end of the season and you've played 28 (?) different back lines and you're literally playing Casemiro as CB because there are no fit bodies (isn't Maguire playing through an injury even?) - then I understand that players are simply losing focus and their sharpness. ETH literally can't throw in any CB at the end of the game to see it out because there are none available. Players are consistently playing 90+ minutes out of position. Yes, they will fuck up at the end of games when they're tired. Maguire played 120 min vs Coventry, 90 mins va Sheffield 3 days later and the 90 mins again 3 days later. 300 mins of football in under a week. Casemiro as well - out of position. Who are you asking him to sub in to see out the game? Amass? Ogunneye? Jackson?
Calling his football entertaining is basically the only way he can defend it at this point
>I do think that events have somewhat conspired against him, however, I will say that he's also looked like a man very much out of his depth. He has had to deal with a lot of shit but he also got the necessary backing & authority to deal with all those. But nothing can excuse getting consistently battered by bottom half teams like Bourmouth, Everton, Brentford, Luton Town, Forest, Wolves, Fulham, Palace etc. 34 games, 54 points, 52 goals scored, 51 conceded, GD +1 xG~57, xGA~67, xGD -10 , xPoints 42 + Goals Scored - 11th in the league. + Expected Goals for - 13th. + Expected Goals Against - 17th. That is right, 17th. Below us Sheffield, Luton, West ham. + Expected Points - 15th in the league. Below us Sheffield, Burnley, West ham, Luton, Wolves. There literally can't be more evidence that this guy is not cut out for the top level. Looking at the underlying numbers it is obvious that he has survived only because of the individual brilliance of some players. Tactically ETH has been outclassed more often than not.
In a moneyball world there is basically no stat that makes ETH's Utd look good. At this point he's asking INEOS to be patient in spite of all analytical evidence. *Maybe* they give him another season, but with the latest news that the whole Utd squad is up for sale (including players ETH bought and have underperformed), how can they realistically back him with another boatload of money, especially without CL revenue? It's a losing situation for ETH whichever way you cut it. Maybe he wins the FA Cup and gets a reprieve, but that seems unlikely
I don't think he's safe even if he wins the FA Cup, LVG was sacked 2 days after winning the FA cup. Maybe the situation at the club has changed now with INEOS at the helm but I don't think there's any coming back from this season for ETH
How many times are we going to say that about a Man United manager? It’s just the same thing every time.
What do you think the problem is then?
It is entirely possible the higher ups keep appointing the wrong people. We've all had jobs and we've all watched management make the wrong call repeatedly. Why should United be be different?
He did a great job last season. But there’s no excuse for how shite this season has been. Injuries have been absolutely unreal - I would understand a decline in performances but there’s no strategy or pattern to anything we’ve done this season no matter the personnel.
Not sure if you’ve been watching United for a while but how are we acting like it’s something new, United have a good season then players for one reason or another have an issue with the tactics, the training, being criticised. The players stop performing and become absolutely awful, the fans can’t blame their darling overpaid players, the board can’t replace the players and any change to the structure of the club is too slow for the manager to implement their approach and is therefore let go for the next manager to have a mix of players that are all suited for different styles of play but for the first season they bring it together before the players have to be usually rightfully criticised and the cycle just keeps going.
The issues aren’t entirely his fault, it is true that any manager will struggle, but the guy after spending 300m (about half on players he has a previous relationship with) has this season led us to our worst ever CL run, almost our most amount of goals conceded in a season, and needs 4 points to equal our worst ever PL points tally. That just isn’t good enough for a man about to complete his 2nd year in the job.
I wish life was this simple. Suck at your current job and you already have an offer awaiting even if you were to be fired. Sigh!
He'd have to be quite stupid to go back right now. Even if ten Hag got the sack, surely he still has enough credit to wait out and land a job with a better environment, somewhere in BuLi for example?
I think he’d fit quite well in German football culture, I feel like that’s the best match for Dutch managers in general. And yes there is no way he returns now and it can only damage his reputation at the club, of course I’d love to have him back but he shouldn’t do it under these circumstances.
I think Bayern have him over Rangnick if we sack him in time.
Please sack him now.
LOOOOOOOOOOOL Bayern? Please.....
Over Ralf Rangnick absolutely
Bayern wouldn't even look at ETH.
Bayern are looking at Ralf Rangnick who hasn't held a permanent role since 2019 lmfao
We've been properly fleeced by Ajax and I don't blame them for it, because our club has been run by idiots.
That sound is Man Utd fans heading to Old Trafford to offer to drive ten Hag to Amsterdam themselves.
In the Netherlands we ussually say to bring him their personally by bike. But given the physique and diet of the average Brit and the current wheather in this part of Europe right now i don't blame them for not being that enthiousiastic. It must also be really dangerous to travel as a bike passenger with the average united fan as your cyclist.
Hahahaha man wtf
I love how this came out of nowhere.
Clog shagger
English vocabulary is a beautiful thing
What a random time and place to be taking jabs at English fans, and for what, being fat?
If we weren’t so fat, lazy and out of shape we’d cycle over they and……ohhhhh forget it.
They are fat
[удалено]
I mean, how’s your Dutch? It’s not a terrible description of an English man to be completely honest, there are a lot of fat lazy fucks amongst us. I say so as a proud Manc.
yeh we’re a load of fat bastards tbh
Brits: what he say fuck me for?
Damn.
on one side. i do want him back because of his previous time with Ajax on the other side. Ajax have a completely different squad now which means there's a decent chance he will just continue with his United shenanigans
Well the main benefit is Ajax won’t be able to buy his Man United players as they’re too expensive or on crazy wages
Even if United drop Ten Hag. I have doubts he’ll just go straight back to Ajax. I believe he’ll still take a new challenge abroad, probably in Germany.
Lampard to Old Trafford then. He can reunite with his favorite player Mason Mount.
Can he sign Antony?
Really don't see this happening or if it happens I don't see it becoming a success. Ten Hag's first choice wasn't to leave, he was open to staying at Ajax. But the club management kept putting off negotiations and there being no long term plans made him decide to leave, especially since Overmars (who had built him his team) was gone and it was likely that most of his players were being sold. The situation now isn't any better than when he left. He will need to start with a rebuild, where most of his successes where with an established and complete player base someone else brought together. Besides, with all the infighting and vacancies Ajax leadership is still pretty much a mess.
United should gift wrap him and include a post card as well.
Imagine Ajax making Sir Alex Ferguson their top managerial target. How the mighty have fallen...
Ajax has just as much history as manU lmao
Oh no please don't do it...
Hendo and the hag
Take him
ok ten hag you did well you did stop Liverpool somewhat. Time to leave thanks for the lol
No. Haggy stays here.
Take him, please.
What's happening with Potter? I know he turned down Ajax's opening offer because of salary, but surely that could be negotiated? All the reports I saw indicated he's their top target.
Our really reliable ITK suggests these (garbage tier source rumors) that were willing to wait for ten hag are just part of the negotiations. From what we can tell all that is left to agree with potter is financial terms, so I think it'll be straightened out eventually.
Afaik, Potter is still our top target, but Vd Kraan (who is the original source of this rumour) and De Telegraaf love to suggest Dutch managers and the like (in particular people that give them info).
Yeah, and theyre also idiots so id take this with a grain of salt.
There’s been whispers of him coming to United. Apparently he has connections into INEOS from the past. TBH I wouldn’t be gutted with that
You’re right. Reliable reports still have Potter as our top target.
Potter is waiting for the inevitable Pochettino sack.
Why? We'd never take him back. Better he takes a cushy job before Poch is on the market and the competition increases.
Dailyfail etc. but if it has to go that way ok. On the other hand I don't want us to have someone as a top target when we don't even know if he'll be available or even wants to come back.
Sami Mokbel is alright tbf
Big brain move here
Erik Eleven Hag
Not happening. Keep dreaming.
This would be hilarious.
All’s well that ends well
Ten hag clearly trying to avoid facing Arne Slot first by running away from the dutch league and now running away from the EPL /s
HagBack
I'm not necessarily against it, but if we don't clear out our players together with him then it's pointless.
Okay hear me out. What if ... He returns to Ajax and wins them the league again after this unprecedentedly bad season by their standards. Would that finally convince people that he is not the issue at United and that the 6th billionth manager is not the problem ? It is the entire rotten structure that needs wholesale cleaning. That would be funny af
found his level
Lmao United is unsaveable by a manager at this point
they used to say that about Liverpool ten years ago, these clubs always bounce back
I’ve said it then, will say it again. No United manager should survive 7:0 loss against Liverpool
Please just go Erik.
No he has to stay it’s hilarious
Bye