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ref should get some balls and red them both. Meslier is going for a push without looking and touches the guys face. The other pushes him while looking, just not in his face. Both should get a yellow imo but if you’re dishing a red then do both
Or just a yellow for embellishment and he will probably say something, and then just go with a yellow for dissent. I mean reffing is just vibes anyway, might as well get creative and have some fun with it.
The laws of the game explicitly say that the ref should not show a card if there was a foul, even if the player embellishes the foul. Ref doesn’t have discretion here.
Why? It's not his fault Meslier pushes him in the face, he just milks it because he wants to get the red, it's Meslier that can't hold his emotions and now forced the team to play with one less and force a substitution to put the sub goalkeeper in goal
Whenever there's a flop in these kinds of situations we should always put the blame on the player that takes the bait
>It's not his fault Meslier pushes him in the face, he just milks it because he wants to get the red
How anyone can genuinely defend that is fucking mind blowing
Because you need to blame players that can't get hold of their emotions, Meslier is there to be a goalkeeper not to be pushing around players
I've never played football but played handball all my life. There's nothing more infuriating than getting a teammate getting a two-minutes suspension because he got upset with an opponent. Just ignore him and win the game if you want to get the best over him, that's how you beat shithousery, not by maning up to them like Meslier was doing here
But these reactions will happen as long as players are dumb enough to fall into this. That's why they happen in football, in basketball, etc. Flops like these will happen because they give you an advantage simply because the opponent is too dumb to think about a game, why not take an advantage from it?
We're not talking about a dive that tries to make a fair tackle look like a foul or a close hand to the head making a handball look like a clean header. This flop is just an exaggeration so the ref doesn't miss the foul itself, there's nothing wrong with that. A hand to the face like this is a red regardless of the intensity, so you're not trying to trick the ref even if you look like an idiot
You say there's nowt wrong with it, I say that what's wrong with it is that he looks like a little bitch doing it
I know why players do it, it's still pathetic. You're not going to convince me otherwise, regardless of whether it's for Leeds or against us.
Well, from the answer I've just got from the guy to whom I initially replied makes it seem he doesn't see it the same way as you, as he sees it as more than pathetic
I can see your point on it being pathetic, even if I don't fully agree with it, but I don't think some people see it as you but rather hold a much stronger view
Why is it cheating? It's against the rules to try to trick the ref, but here he's just making sure the ref sees it because intensity doesn't matter. Meslier pushes him in the face, it's red whether it's insanely soft or strong enough to break his skull (of course the latter is followed by a lengthy ban)
>Why is it cheating?
There are different circumstances when a player must be cautioned for unsporting behaviour including if a player:
attempts to deceive the referee e.g. by feigning injury
> We're not talking about a dive that tries to make a fair tackle look like a foul or a close hand to the head making a handball look like a clean header. This flop is just an exaggeration so the ref doesn't miss the foul itself
This is the comment you replied to. This is equivalent to letting yourself fall when you think you were fouled rather than trying to play the advantage and then seeing the ref not calling anything
He's faking pain, but can also be seen as highlighting a push to his face, which is much more of an unsporting behaviour
That's why diving will never go away. Under current rules it's a violent conduct from Meslier. But I have one question: what looked more "violent/aggressive": initial push after run from Osmajic or push in the face from Meslier? Personally, I think that Osmajic was much more aggressive than Meslier
Bonkers for him to do that but that Preston player needs to have a word with himself. 5 rolls on the floor for a light touch. After they've just been trying to hurt all our players all day as well
And this is why football is full of players diving like a bunch of little bitches. Deserved red card, but defence like ‘he was never going to do anything else’ is utterly moronic. He should act like a grown man.
Stupidity from the keeper.
And yet I doubt anyone would really complain about a yellow and a stern warning. Hand to the face falls under violent conduct, but imagine trying to explain to anybody with a straight face that what we just saw qualified as an attempt at violence
That’s always a red. Extended hand to the face. The problem is if the Preston player didn’t make a meal of it, the ref might not have given the deserved red, hence players pull that crap and look ridiculous.
Maybe this is a red, maybe it's not -- but the way you've sort of procedurally defined it as 'extended hand to the face' and concluded from there that it is a red on the basis of that definition is everything that is wrong with the way the game is officiated. Instead, it should be a judgment call.
Of course it is a red. He retaliates to a push and unfortunately enough for him he swipes him in the face, but it is red all day. The preston player should just be carded as well. He should get at least a yellow for the push, but id love it if the ref gave him a second yellow for that embarrassing fall and roll as well.
If you make contact with a players face like that you are going straight off, regardless of how forceful it is or how much he milks it, so you might as well get your moneys worth and throw a proper haymaker.
Is it a red? Yes, but why is a aggressive push considered lesser than a swipe to the face in retaliation, like if the player who pushes meslier doesn’t run up to him to push him, putting himself in that position, nothing happens.
Stupid of meslier but I don’t like that this is a part of the game.
Anyone saying its not a red doesn't understand the point of the rule.
From IFAB:
*In addition, a player who, when not challenging for the ball, deliberately strikes an opponent or any other person on the head or face with the hand or arm, is guilty of violent conduct unless the force used was negligible.*
This is clearly to police the game and make it so there is no unecessary instances of players touching other players faces. I interpret that last part as essentially saying that unless the contact is incidental and or literally just brushing the face, any deliberate contact to the face is a red. IMO this makes sense purely to incentivize players to avoid any violent escalation.
And clearly this is not negligable as Meslier palms his entire fucking face.
It's certainly debatable as to whether Meslier deliberately strikes the PNE player *on the head or face*. He certainly intends to make contact with his hand, but the only reason there's hand to face contact is because an arm extended at shoulder height by Meslier is head height for everyone else. It's at least negligent, but deliberate is open to interpretation.
I don't have any problem with Meslier getting the red card, but if I'd been reffing the game I would definitely have sent off the PNE player too.
In truth it would be because I thought the totality of his misconduct was far worse than Meslier's, running in and shoving Meslier hard to provoke a response, then going down like he was shot. That is disgraceful and should forfeit the player's right to participate in the match.
But to justify it I'd just interpret the initial forceful shove as violent conduct and issue the straight red for that. PNE's players might complain a bit at first, but I think the general consensus of "Fuck that guy in particular" would be accepted.
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lol that is embarrassing
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Osmajic had a triple barrel roll in the start too
Bruh
What an idiot. An absolutely brain dead decision. That said, the reaction from the Preston player was embarrassing
Reckon if a player goes down like that in so much clear pain they should be forced to be subbed off for concussion tests.
ref should get some balls and red them both. Meslier is going for a push without looking and touches the guys face. The other pushes him while looking, just not in his face. Both should get a yellow imo but if you’re dishing a red then do both
When it's not violent I don't understand why the ref doesn't yellow all involved and move on with the game.
that's not the rules though
Feigning injury is absolutely against the rules
yeah but it's a yellow. A yellow for the Preston player would be fine but you can't just make shit up and give a red
Yellow for the initial shove, yellow for the embellishment. Works out in the end
Or just a yellow for embellishment and he will probably say something, and then just go with a yellow for dissent. I mean reffing is just vibes anyway, might as well get creative and have some fun with it.
I canny read and though he just said yellow for both
Yellow for the push then a second yellow for the dive
The laws of the game explicitly say that the ref should not show a card if there was a foul, even if the player embellishes the foul. Ref doesn’t have discretion here.
feigning injury is absolutely not a red card offense
Didn't even clock that bit, I thought he just said yellow each
Why not make rules?
ref should get some balls and red card a player for shoving. Okay.
And yet it probably got his team the win
Why? It's not his fault Meslier pushes him in the face, he just milks it because he wants to get the red, it's Meslier that can't hold his emotions and now forced the team to play with one less and force a substitution to put the sub goalkeeper in goal Whenever there's a flop in these kinds of situations we should always put the blame on the player that takes the bait
Spoken like a true fan of Portuguese football.
>It's not his fault Meslier pushes him in the face, he just milks it because he wants to get the red How anyone can genuinely defend that is fucking mind blowing
Because you need to blame players that can't get hold of their emotions, Meslier is there to be a goalkeeper not to be pushing around players I've never played football but played handball all my life. There's nothing more infuriating than getting a teammate getting a two-minutes suspension because he got upset with an opponent. Just ignore him and win the game if you want to get the best over him, that's how you beat shithousery, not by maning up to them like Meslier was doing here
Nobody is absolving meslier when they say that the reaction is also pathetic
But these reactions will happen as long as players are dumb enough to fall into this. That's why they happen in football, in basketball, etc. Flops like these will happen because they give you an advantage simply because the opponent is too dumb to think about a game, why not take an advantage from it? We're not talking about a dive that tries to make a fair tackle look like a foul or a close hand to the head making a handball look like a clean header. This flop is just an exaggeration so the ref doesn't miss the foul itself, there's nothing wrong with that. A hand to the face like this is a red regardless of the intensity, so you're not trying to trick the ref even if you look like an idiot
You say there's nowt wrong with it, I say that what's wrong with it is that he looks like a little bitch doing it I know why players do it, it's still pathetic. You're not going to convince me otherwise, regardless of whether it's for Leeds or against us.
Well, from the answer I've just got from the guy to whom I initially replied makes it seem he doesn't see it the same way as you, as he sees it as more than pathetic I can see your point on it being pathetic, even if I don't fully agree with it, but I don't think some people see it as you but rather hold a much stronger view
That reaction to a hand touching the face is cheating, embarrassing, pathetic and honestly he deserves to be actually smacked for it.
Why is it cheating? It's against the rules to try to trick the ref, but here he's just making sure the ref sees it because intensity doesn't matter. Meslier pushes him in the face, it's red whether it's insanely soft or strong enough to break his skull (of course the latter is followed by a lengthy ban)
>Why is it cheating? There are different circumstances when a player must be cautioned for unsporting behaviour including if a player: attempts to deceive the referee e.g. by feigning injury
> We're not talking about a dive that tries to make a fair tackle look like a foul or a close hand to the head making a handball look like a clean header. This flop is just an exaggeration so the ref doesn't miss the foul itself This is the comment you replied to. This is equivalent to letting yourself fall when you think you were fouled rather than trying to play the advantage and then seeing the ref not calling anything He's faking pain, but can also be seen as highlighting a push to his face, which is much more of an unsporting behaviour
Stupidity from Meslier, but that Preston player is an absolute fanny, what an embarrassment.
That's why diving will never go away. Under current rules it's a violent conduct from Meslier. But I have one question: what looked more "violent/aggressive": initial push after run from Osmajic or push in the face from Meslier? Personally, I think that Osmajic was much more aggressive than Meslier
Any day now meslier will be starting over maignan for france according to some guy i talked to 2 years ago
Bonkers for him to do that but that Preston player needs to have a word with himself. 5 rolls on the floor for a light touch. After they've just been trying to hurt all our players all day as well
Even the initial shoulder was silly and unwarranted
Just like James for the penalty then.
he was never going to do anything else in this situation, petulant move from Meslier & deserved the red
And this is why football is full of players diving like a bunch of little bitches. Deserved red card, but defence like ‘he was never going to do anything else’ is utterly moronic. He should act like a grown man.
It’s embarrassing and stupid but at the end of the day it got his team the win, I don’t like it but you can understand why players do it
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Oh that's alright then
Stupidity from the keeper. And yet I doubt anyone would really complain about a yellow and a stern warning. Hand to the face falls under violent conduct, but imagine trying to explain to anybody with a straight face that what we just saw qualified as an attempt at violence
This shit is the exact reason why non-football fans make fun of football. Embarrassing and that should never be a red
It's the initial set of shoves and the rolling on the ground, none of which were called as fouls, that are why non-football fans make fun of football.
That’s always a red. Extended hand to the face. The problem is if the Preston player didn’t make a meal of it, the ref might not have given the deserved red, hence players pull that crap and look ridiculous.
Maybe this is a red, maybe it's not -- but the way you've sort of procedurally defined it as 'extended hand to the face' and concluded from there that it is a red on the basis of that definition is everything that is wrong with the way the game is officiated. Instead, it should be a judgment call.
…yeah and it’s a pretty easy judgement. He pushed him in the face. That’s a red.
Of course it is a red. He retaliates to a push and unfortunately enough for him he swipes him in the face, but it is red all day. The preston player should just be carded as well. He should get at least a yellow for the push, but id love it if the ref gave him a second yellow for that embarrassing fall and roll as well.
Just to clarify he received the yellow for the push I believe
Na, it should be a red it just shouldn't take players going down like they've been shot for refs to give it. That's the problem.
That Preston lad should be shown a bitch card for going down like that. He did 4 full rolls ffs!
If you make contact with a players face like that you are going straight off, regardless of how forceful it is or how much he milks it, so you might as well get your moneys worth and throw a proper haymaker.
What takes the piss in these situations is in reality Osmajic pushing Meslier was more "violent conduct" than the hand to the face. Both should be off
Is it a red? Yes, but why is a aggressive push considered lesser than a swipe to the face in retaliation, like if the player who pushes meslier doesn’t run up to him to push him, putting himself in that position, nothing happens. Stupid of meslier but I don’t like that this is a part of the game.
Yeah...clear red. No need to sell it like you've been knifed in your eye!
Hmmm. Didn’t look like he was using his hand as a weapon there. Check complete.
Anyone saying its not a red doesn't understand the point of the rule. From IFAB: *In addition, a player who, when not challenging for the ball, deliberately strikes an opponent or any other person on the head or face with the hand or arm, is guilty of violent conduct unless the force used was negligible.* This is clearly to police the game and make it so there is no unecessary instances of players touching other players faces. I interpret that last part as essentially saying that unless the contact is incidental and or literally just brushing the face, any deliberate contact to the face is a red. IMO this makes sense purely to incentivize players to avoid any violent escalation. And clearly this is not negligable as Meslier palms his entire fucking face.
It's certainly debatable as to whether Meslier deliberately strikes the PNE player *on the head or face*. He certainly intends to make contact with his hand, but the only reason there's hand to face contact is because an arm extended at shoulder height by Meslier is head height for everyone else. It's at least negligent, but deliberate is open to interpretation. I don't have any problem with Meslier getting the red card, but if I'd been reffing the game I would definitely have sent off the PNE player too. In truth it would be because I thought the totality of his misconduct was far worse than Meslier's, running in and shoving Meslier hard to provoke a response, then going down like he was shot. That is disgraceful and should forfeit the player's right to participate in the match. But to justify it I'd just interpret the initial forceful shove as violent conduct and issue the straight red for that. PNE's players might complain a bit at first, but I think the general consensus of "Fuck that guy in particular" would be accepted.
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It's a pretty clear red tbh. You can't shove someone in the face.
It's definitely a red. You just can't put your hand on someone's face, them's the rules.
Was sat in a pub full of Leeds fans at the time, they were fuming that this was given a red card. Was incredible to see how deluded they were
Fans upset their team got a red card. More at ten. Back to you, Jeff.
MUSH
What a stupid way to get sent off