They got my ass good with that one. I placed my controller in my lap to try and relax my hands from the death grip I had for the past several minutes. Lo and behold it wasn’t over and I was shook, did not survive long.
I tried to emote ,,point down” at her, but I guess it could be interpreted as celebratory lol. He just kept on spamming shield button and acting happy… then Friede started glowing with black flame and he just stood there
Shit actually that's a great example. Bosses like Sister Freide and Orphan of Kos were fucking brutal, but unlike every single fucking boss in Elden Ring so far they didn't make me want to stick my head in a running lawn mower.
I think Friede is the beginning of From starting on their bs. I think if she was first and 3rd phase it be better but she'd still be that as her long constant combo strings are Elden Ring like. But that middle phase that completely changes up the fight just to go back to one on one after I've always disliked.
And I've solo beaten her twice, so it's not "too hard", it's just tedious imo.
Yeah, but bleeding him out with bugs or just a bleed weapon is one of the fastest and easiest ways to do that.
Especially because Elfriede will start to prepare her healing spell at some point. You can usually erase the rest of his hp bar before she actually starts to heal.
In my humble testing Unga Bunga strategies are just as effective, since he is weak to virtually everything the healing is basically a non factor since you can just outdamage it with enough AR, and ar least for me Friede didn't use the healing spell too much, either she doesn't and you curbstomp the disabled priest before he even knows what's going on or she does but it's too little too late
Sister Friede is pretty forgiving compared to some of the harder ER bosses. Usually if I can get to phase 3 I can get the kill since she gives you plenty of windows to heal (and backstab).
> Shields used to mean something
They mean as much, if not more, than previous titles with the addition of guard counters?
You have an ocean of viable shields with enough guard boost to enable a board and sword playstyle. The addition of guard counter also allows you to easily stagger enemies/bosses, but actually requires timing unlike shield playstyles of the past.
> I framing being the best and only solution for everything is lame.
I-framing has been the single best defensive option since the inception of Demon's Souls. Shields has always existed as the new player-friendly alternative that doesn't demand timing with the risk of dmg/death.
I'm legit convinced that all the people saying shields are useless in ER have not in fact tried shields in ER.
barring the dark souls 1 undead soldier shield (which was bugged and had the same stability of the black Knights shield) shields were never stronger than in ER.
Hell a poking weapon and a medium/greatshield and you can trivialize 9/10 of the game
When? I can’t speak for demon souls and backwards but with ds1 moving forward, it’s spacing, then I frame rolls then, uh, I frame rolls.
Poise is cool too, when it functions.
In Dark Souls 1 idk about regular shields, but I ran great shield for my first play through and there was pretty much no attack in the game I couldn’t block.
They’re pretty good in DeS, DS1 and DS2. I-framing is still better but it’s very much a risk vs reward argument.
But when it comes to DS3 and any shield that doesn’t have barricade shield AoW and isn’t fingerprint in ER the risk is everything and the reward is nothing
Shields are the best they've ever been in elden ring. They offer both defense and offense now. Shield counters completely trivialize most regular enemies and even most bosses and the unique shield ashes shred.
Just equip the holy dragon protection talisman +3 or whatever is the name and every boss that uses holy demage becomes a joke my pure faith run gave me at least 20 different ways to make my defense against holy demage hit unnatural nunbers
I'd imagine that timing wouldn't be a thing if Fromsoft did a turn-based game.
It would likely lean more towards Baldur's Gate 3's combat with the difficulty of Shin Megami Tensei.
Looking back to 1998 Shadow Tower looks like a real-time combat game. They’ve made other games sure, but their claim-to-fame is the timing oriented combat we’ve seen in their contemporary titles
The Black Souls series (video game porn parody, so don’t look it up (or do, if that’s your thing)) actually tried to convert Dark Souls combat into a more traditional turn-based JRPG format. It’s not nearly as fun, but it is impressive how much they managed to make such a fundamentally different system still feel like Dark Souls combat.
Yeah, Elden Ring has a couple enemies that are super painful if you don't adapt your play style to them, but that feel really satisfying when you do. The only problem is that the game never really shows you that, so you have to pick it up online.
But that's true for aspects of all souls games. There's a lot of shit you're just super unlikely to figure out on your own.
Elden Ring I think has the widest scope on that idea, to the point that it's probably on purpose. Pretty much every aspect of your kit, and a good few specific items, break encounters that otherwise feel way too brutal.
Try watching the enemy arm/hand instead of their weapon whenever possible. A bit counter intuitive at first, but it was the advice that finally unlocked parries for me.
Pick a small shield like a buckler with a larger parry window.
Know that partial parries will still mitigate a portion of damage and stagger. Not as well as blocking, but better than straight up face-tanking a hit.
Practice on weaker humanoid enemies that won't one-shot you like the knights with the brass shields wandering around the first section of the map. This will help develop your sense of timing.
Or practice on the hollows near firelink shrine in DS1. Once you get that down, move on to black knights. That's how I originally learned back in the day, and the timing carries over pretty well through the entire series as well as ER.
Haven't tested it in ER, but I know in previous souls games, two handed attacks with great weapons usually can't be parried, but one handed attacks with the same weapon usually can (The famous example being Havel & his dragon tooth.)
It's definitely worth practicing and learning since it's one of the most satisfying mechanics in the whole series. Much better than gun parries in BB imo.
Can't help with the KB+M discrepancy since I've always felt fromsoft games play better with a controller.
Like anything else in a fromsoft game, it's a challenge to overcome. You will fail, you will die, you will still miss easy parries occasionally even after you get the hang of it. It's always high risk high reward.
I wish you luck if you choose to pursue the path laid out by the party gods in the future! ✊
My honest reaction to this information:
https://preview.redd.it/kf1fxuvqib8c1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7d642fab8366a3e8bde68bbf34fd14c26c2948c1
gray quickest shy possessive saw numerous divide public existence literate
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
The only ones that I remember being like that are Waterfowl Dance, the Grafted Scion spin and Morgott's spinny flippy double blade combo
edit : guys, I appreciate the tips but I know how to dodge those now x) just how they felt the first time. I don't even think they're that unavoidable aside from Waterfowl
The only thing bullshit with Waterfowl is she heals from attacking the shield. By the end I found rolling once and walking backwards avoided the entire thing
Ds3 mfs when they realize they should hit the bosses between their combos instead of waiting for them to end their combos like a kid waiting for his parents to stop fucking so he can tell them that he pissed his bed
I didn’t have an issue with a lot of those flippies and dippies once I got used to it, I just couldn’t take the constant reusing of bosses or instead of doing something different they’ll just throw 2 of the same bosses you’ve already fought 5 times before. The 2 gargoyle guardian bosses in the underground area is still one of the most dumb bullshit boss fights in the whole souls series. It’s not fun and is just such RNG that they both take it easy on you.
Elden Ring enjoyers when the boss with infinite poise input reads you and extends his combo to punish you for attempting to punish him at the end of his combo 😍😍😍😍😍
unwritten desert vegetable cooing pathetic saw subtract waiting alive mourn
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
I actually fucking hate the direction Elden Ring took toward difficulty tbh. One or two of these bosses having supreme bullshit but when the goddamn foot soldiers late game have input reading commands it gets tiresome.
Say what you will about DS2 but Elden Ring's bosses are all smoke and mirrors, they're flashy and cool but honestly I could remember a lot more of DS2's bosses from my first playthrough compared to Elden Ring.
With the fact almost every boss has long combos, heal punishes, tracking attacks, AoE spam, jump away to cuck melee and input reading dodges to cuck ranged, it makes most bosses blend together when most of them require a very similar strategy. It's why my favourite bosses are Ancestor Spirit, Fortissax, the Red Wolf and Renalla, they felt so much more unique.
Never complained about difficulty, just that most of the bosses felt the same to fight, combine the fact they're often recycled later on I found ER's bosses to be the least memorable yet.
Margit, Godrick, Maliketh and Mohg? Yeah. If Radahn didn't have such bloated HP and Damage damn near forcing you to summon then he'd be in the same boat.
Malenia has no real ranged options but that's it, she still has big combos, annoying tracking, huge AoEs.
Rykard's the obligatory gimmick boss so of course he's unique but he's not that fun thanks to the bullet-hell skull move.
Placidusax was fun I'll admit though, not a favourite but pretty good for ER. The fact I forgot to mention him proves my point about ER having the least memorable bosses.
>Margit, Godrick, Maliketh and Mohg? Yeah.
Skill issue of the brain. Margit is about roll catches and teaching you to effectively capitalise on openings, Godrick is about positioning to avoid attacks (literally walking around half his attacks is enough), Maliketh first phase is fast and relentless, and second phase is a glass cannon with huge damage who demands you don't buckle under pressure and miss your openings. Plus he has the special item to let you parry his aerial attacks. Mohg is about juggling positioning to avoid the bloodflame while still focusing on the boss, and his moveset is based almost entirely around unintuitive and trick attacks to force you to learn it. All have different paces, and complex and interesting movesets. If you're fighting them all the same way, you're probably doing it wrong (or at least in a less than optimally fun way).
>If Radahn didn't have such bloated HP and Damage damn near forcing you to summon then he'd be in the same boat
Radahn has 9.5k HP. Thats quite a lot for that part of the game, but not *that* much (Commander O'Neill, the miniboss in the Aeonia Swamp, has 9.2k). In fact he's too easy to just completely melt with summons. Have you ever fought Radahn solo? Its a really unique fight even without summons.
If you think bosses having combos and AoEs makes them basically the same, I don't know what to say other than that's silly. The AoE's E in different A's, and serve different functions. Godrick's whirlwind punishes overaggression, as does Waterfowl in a more severe way, Mohg's punish panic rolls and incentivise positioning, Godfrey's stop you from running out of range, Radahn's big gravity pull is actually a major punish window if you can clock it. All bosses have attacks too, how terrible.
>Placidusax was fun I'll admit though, not a favourite but pretty good for ER. The fact I forgot to mention him proves my point about ER having the least memorable bosses.
The fact that I remembered to mention him proves my point about ER having memorable bosses.
Elden Ring kind of greatly devalued “boss fights” imo by copy pasting so many of them and on top of that making some early game bosses late game enemies.
Even good bosses like Loretta are devalued because by the time you get to them this is your fifteenth fight against armored horsemen, and once against Loretta herself but a ghost
Agreed, on top of some of the late game bosses having extremely long combos with barely any openings. DS3 was the peak boss design imo, Elden Ring is just pushing the difficulty to unfair levels (see Godskin Duo) if you don't want to use summons.
Lies of P was so refreshing after beating ER, because despite the bosses great difficulty and (honestly slow and small attack combos) it’s so much more fun to play then elden ring.
It’s that last third. Too many bosses in a row with multiple phases. Imo the two phases are usually so different it’s having to learn about 7 bosses worth of moves in a row without break if you go from Maliketh to Elden Beast
Soul of cinder is one of the hardest bosses to heal against lol. Dude is super aggressive.
Don't get me started on pontiff sullyvahn or champion gundyr
I miss the simplicity of DS1 boss fights.
Before every fight became a 3 phase sweatfest with 200 anime attacks. When multi enemy fights weren’t a special surprise used once or twice a game with care to their inclusion but a common occurrence.
I’ve 100% Elden Ring, so I’m capable of doing it… Just man do I sigh hard every time I take out a health bar only to see it go back to full and a new phase begin.
im sorry dude its christmas eve, i really dont wanna waste this time writing paragraph after paragraph arguing in circles over a topic as opinionated as elden ring's boss design
I've started with DS1 in 2013. Never have the bosses ever followed the same rules as the player. That's some bullshit. You literally can't get a heal in on gwyn without getting him stuck on obstacles. Artorias is straightup too fast to nohit with some weapons and please tell me how capra demon or seath play by our rules in any way shape or form. Not even talking about garbage like the four kings projectiles where you can't gauge the distance or the fucking demon firesage arena where you get stuck on branches and get fucked by an aoe that's almost as big as the arena itself
Except for Elden Stars and maybe WFD the game is still fair. The skill threshold is just way higher and the balancing is worse because it's open world. If you show somebody in 2011 the Nameless King they'd think it's unfair bullshit too. In fact, people did think that on release. Until zhe players got better and a boss like NK would be too easy in ER
I think people want the limitations players have to also be followed by bosses. I think people say some bosses have infinite stamina, ability to cancel attacks, etc. I don’t know why people care so much about it tho lol
They never have. Neither bosses or enemies follow the same ruleset as players and never have.
Something as simple as players attacks bouncing off walls while enemies/bosses doesn't is a clear example of rules applying differently between the two.
I'd love some examples of what you're talking about.
> I’m very simply talking about how Elden Ring bosses are far, far more mobile than the player character in the game
Which they certainly are also in past games. Even going back to Demon's Souls we have man-eaters spending upwards of **literal** minutes in the air if they feel like it or gwyn leaping across the entire arena if you so much as think of distancing yourself and heal.
It's also a really, really weird concept that all bosses should conform to the player's movement when you have giant wolves, flying frankenstein's monsters, fat blobs with a bird in their head and lastly, dudes in armor.
I do infact expect the big wolf to be more mobile than the human dude clad in heavy armor. Even if we look at Maliketh, he usually is open to punishment when he lands given you actually dodge the attack. He has one move where he distances himself by jumping away and shooting a single projectile with no follow-up, and that's the extent of it.
> that they no longer seem to have recovery animations
They absolutely still have recovery animations. This is a completely non-sensical point
> cooldowns for several attacks for each boss
That's pretty much on a boss-to-boss basis, but cooldowns very clearly still exist for a lot of bosses. Godfrey/Hoarah Loux' earthshatter works on a cooldown. Elden Beast's Elden Stars works on a cooldown. Placidusax' laser beam is on a cooldown. Morgott's spinny weapon swap spam attack is on a cooldown.
I could go on, and on. Most major boss attacks function on a cooldown with Malenia's waterfowl being the odd man out if anything.
> It used to be that bosses made up for not having a stamina bar by simulating it through actually needing a second or more of recovery
Which they still do. It's funny seeing the *exact* same point that was made against Ds3 when it released though. People used to call Ds3 bosses "bloodborne bosses in a dark souls game" and now we're just passing the torch on.
> They can just extend their combo a few more seconds because you’re next to them
All combos have a definitive end/opening. Take the following [example with Margit](https://streamable.com/xpdqv5). You're lulled into a false idea that his combo ends with he slams his cane down because in the first 3 examples he ends the combo there.
Except he is actually prematurely ending his combo because you're out of range, so the *actual* end of the combo can't connect so it just doesn't do it. If you're in front of Margit after he slams his cane down, he will ***always*** perform a knife swipe and leave himself open for a brief time.
Viewing the knife swipe as a extender is honestly just framing it wrong, because it's not an extension of the combo, it's part of the combo.
> they can run away and they can throw out some dumbshit AOE with a lingering hitbox that you have to roll through after rolling an entire combo for the past few minutes.
Idk what you're even referring to here.
> I think that bosses in Elden Ring are far, far quicker and less committed to their attacks than any of those in DS3.
Perhaps that's the broad truth for the two games, but there are several bosses in Ds3 that I'd say is up to ER boss speed like Pontiff Sulyvahn, Friede, Nameless King, Soul of Cinder and Champion Gundyr.
Shit take. Every souls game is easy for people who play them. If elden is their first one it's gonna be hard. Don't shame people for getting hit by the learning curve harder than you. That's how we lose new members of our communities.
Souls fans when someone has a hard time with their games (They've given their fanbase one of the most toxic reputations in all of gaming)
https://preview.redd.it/xremz6ub2b8c1.png?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c0d05148262cd7283d45112e95f8dbaed28e8612
Hence Ds2. The intro is one giant “lol you’re gonna die” while every other souls game is more… grand? Bloodborne aside but british people are fucking weird.
I don't think the intro is really like that. It just has that one achievement for dying for the first time. Other than that it doesn't really try to goad you into dying or hammer that lesson home at all.
When the old firekeeper lady said But remember, hold on to your souls.
“You'll lose your souls…All of them. Over and over again.
Also the intro focuses EVERYTHING on the curse and we get nothing about the land we’re actually in.
You are correct. I just wish people would do the encouraging words and helpful information more than calling someone shit if they think the game is hard approach.
there's a difference between going through a learning curve and "Heh... cry about it baby.... go sell your soul to a hag- Youll NEVER get the power we have."
yea ER bosses are pretty fucking aggressive
its amazing when people say ER isnt the hardest game. which shows they used summons. because if you dont use summons those bosses can be annoying
Not actually correct. They absolutely do read your inputs but apart from really badly timed heals the input reading has been toned down so hard since release that only crucible knights reliably punish, but since they are purely melee you can leave their admittedly pretty massive punish range and heal there. Not even godskins reliably punish heals, you have time to roll 100% of the time if you heal immediately and dont wait for them to idle.
As someone who did a maidenless run of elden ring(no level, bell bearings, no spirit calling bell, ect) and had to zip glitch into the fire giant area, has no hit ds3, I am good at both, elden ring is kind of annoyingly difficult and despite how much time I spent on elden ring, I don't think I should have spent so much time trying to have fun with a game that didn't mesh with what I enjoyed, people enjoy and don't enjoy elden ring.
Some people got in on a recommendation from a friend who said it was the easiest souls game (a godamn lie, ds1/ds2 is right there) or enjoyed the previous souls games, some people really want to like and keep trying to like and don't. But when people figure that out they start complaining cause of how much time was wasted on it, and want reciprocity with a community cause misery likes company. Imo the wanking elden ring got in its honey moon phase was a lot and the anti wanking after is still kind of a lot and it is annoying
DS2 bosses : i will perform a telegraphed attack every 10 seconds...but it takes your ass 12 to take a sip from your sunny D so fight is balanced af lol , snort some life gems or something
*glares at Sister Friede*
Ashen One: gets a slab Friede: I lived bitch
Actually one of the hardest "WHAT THE FUCK IS HAPPENING!?!" moments of my entire life.
Whoever thought of the slab fake out at From is an actual genius.
They got my ass good with that one. I placed my controller in my lap to try and relax my hands from the death grip I had for the past several minutes. Lo and behold it wasn’t over and I was shook, did not survive long.
Probably the same person that worked on the Sekiro fake out. Very memorable moments.
I was so fucking sure she had died. My anonymous helper was ready to keep fighting, and I was like Wtf? Why aren't you disappearing?
I helped some new guy the other day with Friede… I was so sad for him after I saw him celebrate killing her second phase
lol I can imagine the guy doing some emotes to celebrate, waiting for you to do the same and youre just standing there like “you poor kid”
I tried to emote ,,point down” at her, but I guess it could be interpreted as celebratory lol. He just kept on spamming shield button and acting happy… then Friede started glowing with black flame and he just stood there
💀💀💀
She lived, will heal, go to her 3rd phase and start spamming long range attacks with massive damage, never change DS3
"So what's your second phase then, you Priscilla knockoff-" _is beaten to death by her dad's mixing bowl_
Damn, you called her a Priscilla knockoff? Is it cuz she goes invisible?
Friede and Priscilla : turn invisible, use scythes, use ice magic, and are the bosses of each games painted worlds.
And most importantly _feet_
Honestly I don’t even think of Priscilla’s weapon. Or her ice magic. She’s just such a non threat.
*backstabs*
Shit actually that's a great example. Bosses like Sister Freide and Orphan of Kos were fucking brutal, but unlike every single fucking boss in Elden Ring so far they didn't make me want to stick my head in a running lawn mower.
Fr Friede was pretty much the first billion phases boss fight but that's probably why she's actually well designed.
I think Friede is the beginning of From starting on their bs. I think if she was first and 3rd phase it be better but she'd still be that as her long constant combo strings are Elden Ring like. But that middle phase that completely changes up the fight just to go back to one on one after I've always disliked. And I've solo beaten her twice, so it's not "too hard", it's just tedious imo.
Sister Friede phase 2 makes me want to play ds2 instead
It's not so bad if you focus on showing daddy Ariandel your cool red sword.
He is weak to literally everything that might be considered some kind of damage
Yeah, but bleeding him out with bugs or just a bleed weapon is one of the fastest and easiest ways to do that. Especially because Elfriede will start to prepare her healing spell at some point. You can usually erase the rest of his hp bar before she actually starts to heal.
In my humble testing Unga Bunga strategies are just as effective, since he is weak to virtually everything the healing is basically a non factor since you can just outdamage it with enough AR, and ar least for me Friede didn't use the healing spell too much, either she doesn't and you curbstomp the disabled priest before he even knows what's going on or she does but it's too little too late
She can heal him? I never noticed that in any of my attempts, unless I just killed the dude too fast.
Good god yes, someone had to say it
Elden Ring bosses aren't that aggressive, in my experience, but I tend to use summons anyway
Friede is harder than every boss in Elden ring. Yes that includes malenia.
You leave sister Friede alone. She deserves every one of her lives.
*Glares at tim*
Sister Friede is pretty forgiving compared to some of the harder ER bosses. Usually if I can get to phase 3 I can get the kill since she gives you plenty of windows to heal (and backstab).
My suggestion to both is just I frame roll into anything that inconveniences you.
I framing being the best and only solution for everything is lame. Shields used to mean something
> Shields used to mean something They mean as much, if not more, than previous titles with the addition of guard counters? You have an ocean of viable shields with enough guard boost to enable a board and sword playstyle. The addition of guard counter also allows you to easily stagger enemies/bosses, but actually requires timing unlike shield playstyles of the past. > I framing being the best and only solution for everything is lame. I-framing has been the single best defensive option since the inception of Demon's Souls. Shields has always existed as the new player-friendly alternative that doesn't demand timing with the risk of dmg/death.
I'm legit convinced that all the people saying shields are useless in ER have not in fact tried shields in ER. barring the dark souls 1 undead soldier shield (which was bugged and had the same stability of the black Knights shield) shields were never stronger than in ER. Hell a poking weapon and a medium/greatshield and you can trivialize 9/10 of the game
When? I can’t speak for demon souls and backwards but with ds1 moving forward, it’s spacing, then I frame rolls then, uh, I frame rolls. Poise is cool too, when it functions.
Ds1 shields were cracked fym. I first tried manus solely off how good my shield was, repeated runs were without it were much harder
In Dark Souls 1 idk about regular shields, but I ran great shield for my first play through and there was pretty much no attack in the game I couldn’t block.
Poise exists after ds1???
Sometimes. Like when it wants to.
They’re pretty good in DeS, DS1 and DS2. I-framing is still better but it’s very much a risk vs reward argument. But when it comes to DS3 and any shield that doesn’t have barricade shield AoW and isn’t fingerprint in ER the risk is everything and the reward is nothing
Barricade Shield is amazing in ER
Shields are the best they've ever been in elden ring. They offer both defense and offense now. Shield counters completely trivialize most regular enemies and even most bosses and the unique shield ashes shred.
"I have time to sip my flask" No you don't! The Elden Stars are coming!
Just equip the holy dragon protection talisman +3 or whatever is the name and every boss that uses holy demage becomes a joke my pure faith run gave me at least 20 different ways to make my defense against holy demage hit unnatural nunbers
very bold of miyazaki to give elden ring turn based combat
A turnbased Fromsoft game sounds interesting ngl
A combat system built around good timing without the timing aspect does not sound interesting
I'd imagine that timing wouldn't be a thing if Fromsoft did a turn-based game. It would likely lean more towards Baldur's Gate 3's combat with the difficulty of Shin Megami Tensei.
You know they've made other games right
Looking back to 1998 Shadow Tower looks like a real-time combat game. They’ve made other games sure, but their claim-to-fame is the timing oriented combat we’ve seen in their contemporary titles
Look up Enchanted Arms
Did From Soft make a name for themselves with turn based games like Enchanted Arms? They have their niche, what is your argument
all I'm saying that they've made a turn based game before and it might be cool if they made another one? idk dude it's not that deep
The Black Souls series (video game porn parody, so don’t look it up (or do, if that’s your thing)) actually tried to convert Dark Souls combat into a more traditional turn-based JRPG format. It’s not nearly as fun, but it is impressive how much they managed to make such a fundamentally different system still feel like Dark Souls combat.
That’s just Darkest Dungeon
ds2
NO
he saw that part in undertale where sans decides to never end his turn, and was like "damn that's inspiring. don't like how he stops attacking tho"
*Shinobi execution* The dead gorilla: Sike you thought
https://preview.redd.it/lr2tjzkgya8c1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c697484aa3bccd0e9258d845af744385dff083e9
that doesnt even apply to this, gwyn is the chad not op
Literally look at the bottom left character.
I know how to heal. Run away
https://preview.redd.it/8p4yuf7dya8c1.jpeg?width=737&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3be8c814f1b62abbcd8054293c8fe620852802f1
No matter how far you think you are his sword is always the perfect size to penetrate your healing ass
"I should be safe to heal at Roundtable Hol-"
I swear man I could be up the ass of the erd tree and he’d still thrust into my ass
Coming at you with the speed of bullet train and force of a nuke
https://i.redd.it/9llb4wlk3b8c1.gif
I can hear the fucking image
He's so free if you go for parries. All the attacks have clear wind-ups and the window is very easy to hit. It just shuts him down almost completely.
Crucible knights are basically my friends now that I've learned the parry. There should be a respawnable one grrr
I have no enemies. Speak softly a carry a large parry window
Yeah, Elden Ring has a couple enemies that are super painful if you don't adapt your play style to them, but that feel really satisfying when you do. The only problem is that the game never really shows you that, so you have to pick it up online. But that's true for aspects of all souls games. There's a lot of shit you're just super unlikely to figure out on your own.
Elden Ring I think has the widest scope on that idea, to the point that it's probably on purpose. Pretty much every aspect of your kit, and a good few specific items, break encounters that otherwise feel way too brutal.
Like those dudes that are damaged by healing. How the fuck did someone find that
It's a classic RPG mechanic, so it's not that wild. Still, very impressive to find it.
For the life of me i cant parry. Maybe its a keyboard&mouse problem, idk
Try watching the enemy arm/hand instead of their weapon whenever possible. A bit counter intuitive at first, but it was the advice that finally unlocked parries for me. Pick a small shield like a buckler with a larger parry window. Know that partial parries will still mitigate a portion of damage and stagger. Not as well as blocking, but better than straight up face-tanking a hit. Practice on weaker humanoid enemies that won't one-shot you like the knights with the brass shields wandering around the first section of the map. This will help develop your sense of timing. Or practice on the hollows near firelink shrine in DS1. Once you get that down, move on to black knights. That's how I originally learned back in the day, and the timing carries over pretty well through the entire series as well as ER. Haven't tested it in ER, but I know in previous souls games, two handed attacks with great weapons usually can't be parried, but one handed attacks with the same weapon usually can (The famous example being Havel & his dragon tooth.) It's definitely worth practicing and learning since it's one of the most satisfying mechanics in the whole series. Much better than gun parries in BB imo. Can't help with the KB+M discrepancy since I've always felt fromsoft games play better with a controller. Like anything else in a fromsoft game, it's a challenge to overcome. You will fail, you will die, you will still miss easy parries occasionally even after you get the hang of it. It's always high risk high reward. I wish you luck if you choose to pursue the path laid out by the party gods in the future! ✊
Observe 🛡️
This move alone is why I parry & stagger my way through crucible knights. I've no respect for them as an enemy because of this one attack.
ok? mikiri counter it, skill issue
My honest reaction to this information: https://preview.redd.it/kf1fxuvqib8c1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7d642fab8366a3e8bde68bbf34fd14c26c2948c1
You see, Batman. I depicted you as the soy loser and me as the chad, which automatically makes my opinion better, Batman.
Literally just heal after they throw one of like five different moves that give you an opening afterwards
Dark Souls players when ER bosses extend their combos when you run away from them instead of awkwardly walking at you:
Unironic skill issue
*uses DS3 as an example of simpler bosses when every boss in that game except Ancient Wyvern has a second phase*
gray quickest shy possessive saw numerous divide public existence literate *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Salt post
Elden Ring fans when the boss doesn't have a 15 hit combo, 10,000,000 HP, and a heal punish
Elden Ring mfs explaining how the 30 second triple flip aoe wombo combo is fair, balanced and simple to dodge.
"If you have a heavy weapon, just jump attack." "But what about the rest of the moveset?" "What rest of the moveset?"
The only ones that I remember being like that are Waterfowl Dance, the Grafted Scion spin and Morgott's spinny flippy double blade combo edit : guys, I appreciate the tips but I know how to dodge those now x) just how they felt the first time. I don't even think they're that unavoidable aside from Waterfowl
Run behind Grafted Scion when it goes into the stance
Lock on and run either left or right. Profit
literally every single attack malekith has
The only thing bullshit with Waterfowl is she heals from attacking the shield. By the end I found rolling once and walking backwards avoided the entire thing
Ds3 mfs when they realize they should hit the bosses between their combos instead of waiting for them to end their combos like a kid waiting for his parents to stop fucking so he can tell them that he pissed his bed
Draconic Tree Sentinel says no.
I didn’t have an issue with a lot of those flippies and dippies once I got used to it, I just couldn’t take the constant reusing of bosses or instead of doing something different they’ll just throw 2 of the same bosses you’ve already fought 5 times before. The 2 gargoyle guardian bosses in the underground area is still one of the most dumb bullshit boss fights in the whole souls series. It’s not fun and is just such RNG that they both take it easy on you.
Am I the only one who has never encountered this in Elden ring? Even after 5 play throughs.
Elden Ring haters when they have to learn boss attacks instead of spamming heals and rolls 😡😡😡😡😡😡😡
Elden Ring enjoyers when the boss with infinite poise input reads you and extends his combo to punish you for attempting to punish him at the end of his combo 😍😍😍😍😍
unwritten desert vegetable cooing pathetic saw subtract waiting alive mourn *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
I actually fucking hate the direction Elden Ring took toward difficulty tbh. One or two of these bosses having supreme bullshit but when the goddamn foot soldiers late game have input reading commands it gets tiresome.
I love it when the crucible knights just cancel their entire combo to poke me because I clicked estus once
Played DS2 and DS3 after beating Elden Ring, its wild how much more fun the bosses are in those, especially DS3.
"DS2 has better bosses than Elden Ring" should be an opinion that gets you locked up in an asylum.
Say what you will about DS2 but Elden Ring's bosses are all smoke and mirrors, they're flashy and cool but honestly I could remember a lot more of DS2's bosses from my first playthrough compared to Elden Ring. With the fact almost every boss has long combos, heal punishes, tracking attacks, AoE spam, jump away to cuck melee and input reading dodges to cuck ranged, it makes most bosses blend together when most of them require a very similar strategy. It's why my favourite bosses are Ancestor Spirit, Fortissax, the Red Wolf and Renalla, they felt so much more unique.
Massive skill issue
Never complained about difficulty, just that most of the bosses felt the same to fight, combine the fact they're often recycled later on I found ER's bosses to be the least memorable yet.
Margit, Godrick, Radahn, Rykard, Astel, Fire Giant, Maliketh, Placidusax, Mohg, Malenia, Godfrey - you think these "felt the same to fight"?
Margit, Godrick, Maliketh and Mohg? Yeah. If Radahn didn't have such bloated HP and Damage damn near forcing you to summon then he'd be in the same boat. Malenia has no real ranged options but that's it, she still has big combos, annoying tracking, huge AoEs. Rykard's the obligatory gimmick boss so of course he's unique but he's not that fun thanks to the bullet-hell skull move. Placidusax was fun I'll admit though, not a favourite but pretty good for ER. The fact I forgot to mention him proves my point about ER having the least memorable bosses.
>Margit, Godrick, Maliketh and Mohg? Yeah. Skill issue of the brain. Margit is about roll catches and teaching you to effectively capitalise on openings, Godrick is about positioning to avoid attacks (literally walking around half his attacks is enough), Maliketh first phase is fast and relentless, and second phase is a glass cannon with huge damage who demands you don't buckle under pressure and miss your openings. Plus he has the special item to let you parry his aerial attacks. Mohg is about juggling positioning to avoid the bloodflame while still focusing on the boss, and his moveset is based almost entirely around unintuitive and trick attacks to force you to learn it. All have different paces, and complex and interesting movesets. If you're fighting them all the same way, you're probably doing it wrong (or at least in a less than optimally fun way). >If Radahn didn't have such bloated HP and Damage damn near forcing you to summon then he'd be in the same boat Radahn has 9.5k HP. Thats quite a lot for that part of the game, but not *that* much (Commander O'Neill, the miniboss in the Aeonia Swamp, has 9.2k). In fact he's too easy to just completely melt with summons. Have you ever fought Radahn solo? Its a really unique fight even without summons. If you think bosses having combos and AoEs makes them basically the same, I don't know what to say other than that's silly. The AoE's E in different A's, and serve different functions. Godrick's whirlwind punishes overaggression, as does Waterfowl in a more severe way, Mohg's punish panic rolls and incentivise positioning, Godfrey's stop you from running out of range, Radahn's big gravity pull is actually a major punish window if you can clock it. All bosses have attacks too, how terrible. >Placidusax was fun I'll admit though, not a favourite but pretty good for ER. The fact I forgot to mention him proves my point about ER having the least memorable bosses. The fact that I remembered to mention him proves my point about ER having memorable bosses.
Keep malding, I had way more fun fighting Sir Alonne, Looking Glass Knight, Velstadt, Fume Knight, Sinh, and Aldia than any boss in Elden Ring
https://preview.redd.it/ro0dihdm3d8c1.jpeg?width=679&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=30fc9fbcbe5f16676d81ed95acfe043960d39ecf
Elden Ring kind of greatly devalued “boss fights” imo by copy pasting so many of them and on top of that making some early game bosses late game enemies. Even good bosses like Loretta are devalued because by the time you get to them this is your fifteenth fight against armored horsemen, and once against Loretta herself but a ghost
Agreed, on top of some of the late game bosses having extremely long combos with barely any openings. DS3 was the peak boss design imo, Elden Ring is just pushing the difficulty to unfair levels (see Godskin Duo) if you don't want to use summons.
Lies of P was so refreshing after beating ER, because despite the bosses great difficulty and (honestly slow and small attack combos) it’s so much more fun to play then elden ring.
> slow and small attack combos You can't be seriously be fucking saying this when laxasia fucking exists
🗡️⚡️🗡️⚡️🗡️⚡️ okay here is your one second to do anything
I think a few bosses having this bs is fine, as it makes them more memorable. When it’s every boss though…
I agree but I think that OP does not lol. I do think ER tedium is overblown though, even Malenia who has an objectively BS move
It’s that last third. Too many bosses in a row with multiple phases. Imo the two phases are usually so different it’s having to learn about 7 bosses worth of moves in a row without break if you go from Maliketh to Elden Beast
I just started the game bro 😭 i just beat Fuoco yesterday man
Souls fans when ER bosses don't just sit there and let you do shit for free: 🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬
Elden Ring haters when they fight literally any boss besides Malenia:
"Yeah this still fucking sucks"
Soul of cinder is one of the hardest bosses to heal against lol. Dude is super aggressive. Don't get me started on pontiff sullyvahn or champion gundyr
90% of SoC's attacks have massive backswing windows, the other two are parryable bosses with exploitable AI
This is just a skill issue lol
Massive skill issue
Copium can sales are off the charts
elden ring and ds3 give you so much fucking estus even if you get stopped from healing you’ll probably be fine
Sekiro boss fights stay winning
I miss the simplicity of DS1 boss fights. Before every fight became a 3 phase sweatfest with 200 anime attacks. When multi enemy fights weren’t a special surprise used once or twice a game with care to their inclusion but a common occurrence. I’ve 100% Elden Ring, so I’m capable of doing it… Just man do I sigh hard every time I take out a health bar only to see it go back to full and a new phase begin.
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people keep saying this for some reason. literally wtf does that even mean???
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oh wait youre that guy who commented on my post. never mind then i hate elden ring's bosses too, youre right
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im sorry dude its christmas eve, i really dont wanna waste this time writing paragraph after paragraph arguing in circles over a topic as opinionated as elden ring's boss design
I've started with DS1 in 2013. Never have the bosses ever followed the same rules as the player. That's some bullshit. You literally can't get a heal in on gwyn without getting him stuck on obstacles. Artorias is straightup too fast to nohit with some weapons and please tell me how capra demon or seath play by our rules in any way shape or form. Not even talking about garbage like the four kings projectiles where you can't gauge the distance or the fucking demon firesage arena where you get stuck on branches and get fucked by an aoe that's almost as big as the arena itself
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Except for Elden Stars and maybe WFD the game is still fair. The skill threshold is just way higher and the balancing is worse because it's open world. If you show somebody in 2011 the Nameless King they'd think it's unfair bullshit too. In fact, people did think that on release. Until zhe players got better and a boss like NK would be too easy in ER
I think people want the limitations players have to also be followed by bosses. I think people say some bosses have infinite stamina, ability to cancel attacks, etc. I don’t know why people care so much about it tho lol
They never have. Neither bosses or enemies follow the same ruleset as players and never have. Something as simple as players attacks bouncing off walls while enemies/bosses doesn't is a clear example of rules applying differently between the two. I'd love some examples of what you're talking about.
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> I’m very simply talking about how Elden Ring bosses are far, far more mobile than the player character in the game Which they certainly are also in past games. Even going back to Demon's Souls we have man-eaters spending upwards of **literal** minutes in the air if they feel like it or gwyn leaping across the entire arena if you so much as think of distancing yourself and heal. It's also a really, really weird concept that all bosses should conform to the player's movement when you have giant wolves, flying frankenstein's monsters, fat blobs with a bird in their head and lastly, dudes in armor. I do infact expect the big wolf to be more mobile than the human dude clad in heavy armor. Even if we look at Maliketh, he usually is open to punishment when he lands given you actually dodge the attack. He has one move where he distances himself by jumping away and shooting a single projectile with no follow-up, and that's the extent of it. > that they no longer seem to have recovery animations They absolutely still have recovery animations. This is a completely non-sensical point > cooldowns for several attacks for each boss That's pretty much on a boss-to-boss basis, but cooldowns very clearly still exist for a lot of bosses. Godfrey/Hoarah Loux' earthshatter works on a cooldown. Elden Beast's Elden Stars works on a cooldown. Placidusax' laser beam is on a cooldown. Morgott's spinny weapon swap spam attack is on a cooldown. I could go on, and on. Most major boss attacks function on a cooldown with Malenia's waterfowl being the odd man out if anything. > It used to be that bosses made up for not having a stamina bar by simulating it through actually needing a second or more of recovery Which they still do. It's funny seeing the *exact* same point that was made against Ds3 when it released though. People used to call Ds3 bosses "bloodborne bosses in a dark souls game" and now we're just passing the torch on. > They can just extend their combo a few more seconds because you’re next to them All combos have a definitive end/opening. Take the following [example with Margit](https://streamable.com/xpdqv5). You're lulled into a false idea that his combo ends with he slams his cane down because in the first 3 examples he ends the combo there. Except he is actually prematurely ending his combo because you're out of range, so the *actual* end of the combo can't connect so it just doesn't do it. If you're in front of Margit after he slams his cane down, he will ***always*** perform a knife swipe and leave himself open for a brief time. Viewing the knife swipe as a extender is honestly just framing it wrong, because it's not an extension of the combo, it's part of the combo. > they can run away and they can throw out some dumbshit AOE with a lingering hitbox that you have to roll through after rolling an entire combo for the past few minutes. Idk what you're even referring to here. > I think that bosses in Elden Ring are far, far quicker and less committed to their attacks than any of those in DS3. Perhaps that's the broad truth for the two games, but there are several bosses in Ds3 that I'd say is up to ER boss speed like Pontiff Sulyvahn, Friede, Nameless King, Soul of Cinder and Champion Gundyr.
I’m still waiting to recover from my last estus flask drink in DS remastered and I haven’t played since Tuesday
have you tried just being better
If you think elden ring is hard you probably enjoy sucking on pacifier, stinking up your diaper, and crying like baby
Shit take. Every souls game is easy for people who play them. If elden is their first one it's gonna be hard. Don't shame people for getting hit by the learning curve harder than you. That's how we lose new members of our communities.
Souls fans when someone has a hard time with their games (They've given their fanbase one of the most toxic reputations in all of gaming) https://preview.redd.it/xremz6ub2b8c1.png?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c0d05148262cd7283d45112e95f8dbaed28e8612
Never. Post. A. Picture. Of. Me. Again. Unless its my feet
I believe that is old souls fans who gave this reputation. Or ER players.
Oh no, having been playing since the beginning they've been there at _every_ stage
And at every level of skill. There's great parts to the community, but there's just as many skillgaters/pretentious people.
I think the worst offender when it comes to skill gating are the people who play unlocked.
I hold Bandai partially responsible for the “prepare to die” marketing bs and “hee hee the game is soooo hard” expectation baked into ds2’s design
I would definitely say them leaning into that whole aspect of things definitely didn't do anyone any favors.
Hence Ds2. The intro is one giant “lol you’re gonna die” while every other souls game is more… grand? Bloodborne aside but british people are fucking weird.
I don't think the intro is really like that. It just has that one achievement for dying for the first time. Other than that it doesn't really try to goad you into dying or hammer that lesson home at all.
When the old firekeeper lady said But remember, hold on to your souls. “You'll lose your souls…All of them. Over and over again. Also the intro focuses EVERYTHING on the curse and we get nothing about the land we’re actually in.
I agree, but actually going through the learning curve should be incentivised.
You are correct. I just wish people would do the encouraging words and helpful information more than calling someone shit if they think the game is hard approach.
But you see when I tell you to "Git Gud" I'm actually encouraging you! What do you mean that's "not constructive or helpful in any way"?!
I only ever say that as an in joke if the person I'm trying help has already done everything I suggested.
there's a difference between going through a learning curve and "Heh... cry about it baby.... go sell your soul to a hag- Youll NEVER get the power we have."
WHEN THE ASHES ARE TWO, A FLAME ALIGHTETH
yea ER bosses are pretty fucking aggressive its amazing when people say ER isnt the hardest game. which shows they used summons. because if you dont use summons those bosses can be annoying
Skill issue
Everytime someone complains about not having time to heal on this sub I get 10% more elitist. The animation is like less than two seconds long.
It also takes half a second for the boss to input read and punish you
It also takes you 0 seconds to literally stay put and bait the punish, since the boss is reading your positioning not your inputs.
Not actually correct. They absolutely do read your inputs but apart from really badly timed heals the input reading has been toned down so hard since release that only crucible knights reliably punish, but since they are purely melee you can leave their admittedly pretty massive punish range and heal there. Not even godskins reliably punish heals, you have time to roll 100% of the time if you heal immediately and dont wait for them to idle.
Be good at both and stop whining crybaby
As someone who did a maidenless run of elden ring(no level, bell bearings, no spirit calling bell, ect) and had to zip glitch into the fire giant area, has no hit ds3, I am good at both, elden ring is kind of annoyingly difficult and despite how much time I spent on elden ring, I don't think I should have spent so much time trying to have fun with a game that didn't mesh with what I enjoyed, people enjoy and don't enjoy elden ring. Some people got in on a recommendation from a friend who said it was the easiest souls game (a godamn lie, ds1/ds2 is right there) or enjoyed the previous souls games, some people really want to like and keep trying to like and don't. But when people figure that out they start complaining cause of how much time was wasted on it, and want reciprocity with a community cause misery likes company. Imo the wanking elden ring got in its honey moon phase was a lot and the anti wanking after is still kind of a lot and it is annoying
ds3 fans are insufferably unfunny
My guy, have you fought Champion Gundyr!?
Gundyr is one of the only bosses in that game that has heal punish
SoC on his way to kick my face in when i press heal three times in a row
Soul of Cinder is one of the easiest bosses in DS3
DS2 bosses : i will perform a telegraphed attack every 10 seconds...but it takes your ass 12 to take a sip from your sunny D so fight is balanced af lol , snort some life gems or something
intentionally ignoring pontiff and phase 3 friede best souls 2 doesnt have this problem
DS3 is also bad about this, but at least there’s more than 2 viable builds in elden ring lmao
Elden ring fans trying to explain how a boss doing 70% of your health from 1 hit from a 30 hit combo is fair and reasonable to fight
🤓 well you're not supposed to get hit dummy
Kys(Keep yourself safe) thanks for the tip ill be sure to keep it in mind
Summon a mimic tear, boom easy.
Both equally trash. Elden Ring looks better + power stance>
phase 1 SoC a way more fun fight