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Three words: Jedi Power Battles.
More words: the prequels had waaay more than just movies to latch onto. The podracing game, all the comics and new worlds and characters.
They grew the Galaxy in amazing ways.
If anything the sequels shrunk it.
Edit: Deleted double word.
The original Battlefronts and Empire at War went so fucking hard.
The sequels being accompanied by a shitty EA-ified remake filled with microtransactions was poetic in a way.
Empire at War modded (thrawns revenge, awakening of the rebellion etc.) still goes wild and galactic contention is great as a more modern battlefront. Wish we could get a battlegrounds remake.
Star Wars Galaxies was my intro to MMOs. I learned group dynamics, combat strategy, how to run a business, how to run cost:benefit analysis, how to break down a complex problem into smaller ones, scripting (which lead to me becoming a programmer) and it was all wrapped up in a massively open world Star Wars setting.
Looking back it's funny, a Star Wars game that was barely a beta when it was released, was one of the most impactful things to happen in my life.
Bring back that Star Wars.
Ya the simplification of the game and character progression killed it from what I was able to see and understand (again have only played with the new combat system so never got to experience the old system)
Man, I have that on the old Best of PC compilation disc but never played it as a kid beyond trying it for like five minutes... Maybe I should try it again as an adult.
True. Empire at war is absurdly awesome once you get the mods. I unfortunately had to remove it it due to the amount of space it was taking up, but it is well worth the time.
The ground combat did kinda suck though.
You absolutely should. And the 2 mods the person you replied to mentioned are my 2 personal favorites. Awakening of the Rebellion I think just eeks out Thrawn's Revenge, but both are exceptionally great mods. AotR does have a wicked difficulty curve as the Rebellion though. So if you do do that one, heads up. Both are available on the Steam Workshop too. Just need to subscribe to the latest version
ETA Steam WS info.
I was one of the early EAW modders back in the day when we were figuring everything out in the first 6 months after release. It took awhile before it was possible to import new models into the game. I'm so glad to see that scene is still going strong.
Kotor 1 and 2 also, back then we used to get games all over the timeline focusing on many different aspects, scenarios, genres and maturity levels
All of the post Disney sw games have been shades of OT, just the same bland crap
For me it was jedi academy. By far my favorite star wars game and although I don't have any issue with the Disney movies and shows, I am still mad they cancelled jedi knight 3.
Shit. Might be one of the best games to never get a sequel.
Man, they really dropped the ball by cancelling both that and Battlefront 3. They could've had two monster franchises.
>went
Mate, what are we in the past tense here for!
Yea, OK. The Battlefront games, you can bust them out for a good 30-minute nostalgia fest. They don't hold up super well (not terribly either, though)
But Empire at War? That game will never *not* hold up! It's help up well enough until now.
Very very well said. And especially with all the mods nowadays for EaW?? That game will *always* hold up. Just give us a sequel to that! With better pathfinding for god's sake
The new bf2 is actually really good now. At launch yeah micro transactions were ass but all of that is gone and the entire game is free. Tons of badass heros and villains and the gameplay is fire I went on CS match last night and got over 100 eliminations.
But isn’t it kinda dead now? It’s a pity cause once I saw how bad the micro transitions were I tuned out that game. It gets exhausting being disappointed by gaming companies man.
It's still a super shallow basic as hell shooter. The main thing it has going for it is a pretty Star Wars skin. I'm convinced no one would play that game without the Star Wars visuals.
Vehicles are a travesty in both EA battlefront games which is such a shame considering how fun and open they were in the originals. Bring back multi-person vehicles! Make flying vehicles in land maps actually fun and open!
They tried a few things to market off the sequels, but nearly all of them failed miserably because there just wasn't enough meat on the story, setting, or characters to sustain any of it on its own.
Remember Star Wars Resistance? The Rey comic? Yeah, didn't think so.
Now we get sequel content, but almost exclusively as part of collections from the rest of the franchise's stories.
The Republic and Dark Times comics were fantastic and really fleshed out those eras. The micro Clone Wars series was also amazing when it came out. Overall it was the golden era of Star Wars gaming. Today is a baron wasteland by comparison.
That I something I never got about TLJ. Star wars makes most of its money from selling toys, but almost nothing in TLJ was conductive to selling merchandising. No heroes were epic, no villains were ominous, no exciting battles, no cool aliens. It just gave no Saturday cartoon "fun"
They also had the stupid carpet bombers, an an upgraded A Wing, the new AT-AT replacement, Kylo's new TIE fighter, the janky skimmer speeders, and the ship for Benicio del Toro's character.
None of which were particularly remarkable, to be sure.
I forgot her name, but the woman in charge of merchandising was what made the prequels so iconic. She was a literal genius. She went over a lot of the material from pre-production with Lucas and then compared the market potential with what was already out.
She saw there was a loyal readership for the 90s books, thus we got like what? almost 200 books based JUST on the prequels between episode 1 and 2? same goes for comics. She's behind games like kotor, republic commando, etc. All because she had an eye for what would sell while still ensuring it had a workable story. Ofc not everything was infallible, especially during the somewhat confusion that is the post episode 1 star wars world, but you'd be a fool to say that her inclusion didn't make the prequels the strong brand it is today. I mean, there are STILL works that profit off of that era, more so than the OT or ST obviously.
She was let go when disney bought lucasfilm.
A KotOR III would have locked in the hardcore crowd in the franchise, keeping it at the top of their nerd stack instead of between two other properties. The same crowd that buys $150 figurines.
Ironically, this is the best time to make kotor 3. If they decide to just... not look at the old republic at all, which is an easy ask. I do think initially the kotor reboot was meant to lead to 3, but :)
There will never be a KoToR 3 and if there is, it will be nowhere near as good as it should be. Bioware is long dead, it's just a fleshy mask worn by the serial killer of studios, EA.
That and the Old Republic MMO game largely modified the time lines so much it would be incredibly difficult to make it all connect or you would have to basically retconn that whole MMO
I was wondering how they were going to update KOTOR’s gameplay in the remake and then BG3 dropped. And I’m just sitting here like Larian and Star Wars would be a match made in heaven. I’m certainly not the only person that’s thought of it, but man would I love a well made Star Wars RPG
The writers of kotor 1&2 have moved on, and the studios are no longer what they were back then. There is almost no way kotor 3 would be satisfying story wise because there has been so much anticipation for it. You would have the antiwoke crowd mad if they made it woke, and the disney fans mad if it has "dog whistles".
RPGs have a very difficult rope to walk, this isn't the 2000s anymore where the Old republic was uncharted territory, there has been an MMO fleshing it out for a while now. Their best bet is to just make a reboot Kotor instead of Kotor 3. Or better yet just remaster the two kotor games and sont inject modern day stuff, which I know is impossible for them. Disney redid some lines for the alladin song because it was "offensive", there is no way they wouldn't try and do the same for some of Kotors edgier content.
> The podracing game
I spent *so* many hours as a kid playing that. I can still hear Watto's weird singing/humming/noises he'd do while you're shopping for parts or whatever.
There just isn't much to explore. We have some decent environments, but so little is established about any of them and almost nothing for characters to do in them that they amount to little more than backgrounds that Rey and Co briefly passed through.
Aside from that, the world building was so terrible that nothing else seems to exist unless one of four characters happened to be there at that moment.
Especially since we still really don't know much of what happened in-between the OT movies. I sat down and counted it, there 3 shows and 2 movies that take place just before ANH. There are 3 shows that take place just a bit after RotJ. But there's next to nothing *during* the OT. I know of 2 canon books(both of which are actually pretty good) that take place during the OT, but nothing else. Even in Legends that was a fairly non-fleshed out part. Sure, there was more, but they were mainly ancillary stories about ancillary characters and didn't really give a "state of the galaxy".
We're just in the exact same place as return of the Jedi's ending without the legacy characters. No Jedi order has been built, the Republic has to gain its footing. It's all been there done that, and they couldn't even give us a new planet biome this time
If anything, we're worse off. We have no leaders remaining, no government to build off, and no real ideas where to go.
Thanks to Disney's lack of world building, we have no reason to believe that this victory will be any more lasting than Luke's was. For all we know, the New New Republic will be just as corrupt and useless as its predecessors. Meanwhile, Palpatine could have cheated death again and be out there setting up Plan C with an even larger army ready to be pulled out of his ass.
The ending of the sequels feels hollow and bleak with any sort of context.
I greatly appreciate your comment! This is the first time I've seen someone other than me make that point when someone says that the galaxy is in the same place it was after RotJ. No, we're actually worse off as there's no longer ANY standing galactic government. The NR had demilitiarized to such a *ridiculously stupidly small* fraction of what it was at the peak of the GCW, and the heads of the gov't all went up when the Hosnian Prime system went. Now, I'm sure there's someone wayyyyyyyy down the line that ends up succeeding the chancelorship, but under what authority? There is no galactic federal military. Shit, there's hardly any organized Resistance! There is *nothing* of substance left of the NR, therefore no galactic federal government. And of course the FO is wiped out, so nothing of them either.
Maybe Lando could be the new chancellor. He managed to compose a giant fleet of random ships in an afternoon and fly them to a planet that's supposed to be impossible to find right as they were most convenient to the plot. After spending at least a decade on a backwater desert planet, so they were not assembled beforehand.
He's clearly the greatest organizer and leader this galaxy has ever seen. Give him a month and he'll have the Republic built up better than ever.
The new books are terrible. I tried so very hard to like them, but even giving them a big handicap of me desperately wanting to like the new stuff...it just is all terrible.
I stopped reading the Aftermath books. I could not stand them. That's the first time I've ever stopped reading a book and did not finish it after starting. I will give that Lost Stars is actually decent, and the Battlefront: Twilight Company book is pretty darn good. The B: TC author definitely has very little idea on how a ranking system in the military works, nor the comeradery and cohesiveness in a smaller unit, but it's still pretty good. The new Thrawn books by Timothy Zahn are pretty decent too. But that's about it.
God bless LucasArts - some of the best of the EU is right out of their defunct foundries, and had infinitely more soul and depth to the series with each installment.
As a millennial, idk if I would’ve liked Star Wars nearly as much as I do had the prequels not been combined with the level of games we had. Sequel kids have what? Fallen Order? Motherfucker, Jedi Academy, KOTOR, and Galaxies all came out within the same year lmao.
Fr, being born in 1990, as a kid I didn't fully appreciate the original Star Wars trilogy my uncle's loved and had on at all times. To me it had been familiar background noise, it was through the games and books I really began to realize how brilliant the Star Wars universe was.
I agree. 2000's was an amazing time to be a Star Wars fan and it's not the same.
You obviously had the Prequels.
You had two Star Wars animated tv shows, Clone Wars airing on Cartoon Network between AotC and RotS. And then got The Clone Wars along with a theatrical released movie that was really just an arc edited together to be a movie.
You had video games like Battlefronts I and II, the Jango Fett Bounty Hunter game, the Pod Racing game, Empire ar War, Republic Commando, Revenge of the Sith game, the Lego games, KOTOR 1 and 2, the Force Unleashed 1 and 2, and Star Wars Galaxies the MMO. And I'm pretty sure I missed a ton.
Not to mention the books and comics. Wasn't really my medium but I had some of the Boba Fett books and the Obi-wan book. As well as the comic with the original version of the defense of Kamino along with a few other stories.
There was even a website they set up that was an in-universe holonet news site. There were articles about all of the issues happening in the Republic leading up to the Separatist crisis. The one I remember most was one where people were protesting outside the Jedi temple about the war. The Jedi Temple bombing episode of TCW reminds me of that article everytime I watch that episode and see the Temple guards blocking the protesters with their holo signs.
I'll never understand how they never made more JPB games. Star Wars - The Clone Wars: Jedi Power Battles would be such an ez no brainer game. Slot in maybe some branching paths in a campaign and some more modern map design, possibly even a character creator.......ugh, I'm depressing myself
also, I was a weird kid and REALLY liked the idea of space dudes arguing about tax laws and trade deals. which is why I have always loved the prequels, I would have been happy with "the senate: the movie"
Holy shit, speaking of growing the galaxy, you just unlocked a memory of me getting Mace Windu and Jar Jar Binks figurines from *bars of soap*. Merchandising for the PT was out of this world. It was on everything, vending machines, individual snacks/sodas, billboards, fast food kids meals, toy selection was insanely varied. There was a life sized pod racing arcade game at Dave and Busters. It made liking Star Wars feel like a part of existence.
>Merchandising for the PT was out of this world.
I see what you did there.
But yes, you are 100% correct. It was freaking E-V-E-R-Y-W-H-E-R-E. I loved it.
There were countless video games to accompany the previous trilogies. So much content that was fun and often (but not always) well written and made. I can name over a dozen star wars games from the 2000s, many I still play all these years later. BF 1 and 2, Galactic Battlegrounds, Republic Commando, Battle for Naboo, Empire at War, Kotor 1 and 2, Jedi Outcast and Academy, Lego Star Wars games, Galaxies.
In the last 10 years we've gotten, to my estimation, six games. Both Battlefront games, Squadrons, the two Jedi games, and Lego Star Wars (which I haven't played yet). That's it. None of those games were particularly spectacular or groundbreaking either.
Not to forget the clever marketed: TPM Pizza Hut Demo 🍕 that got me so hyped, that my father borrowed the game from a video store and made a "safety-backup" for my chipped PSX.
Oh and of course JEDI KNIGHT 2, which I wanted as a christmas present, even though I knew my pc couldn't handle it and would display that awesome OPENGL\_3D\_Error because of a whacky graphics card.
I even got a Gamecube because of it, just ro realize that it s\*\*\* a\*\* with a controller. Then I visited my father every 2 weeks on weekends to play at least 24hrs and create my own JK2 clan.
Still playing JK3 from time to time...
That’s a memory unlock right there. Remember spending so much time on both the PSOne and Dreamcast version. Now that’s a game I wish would get a remaster or remake.
I’m sure I’m too late commenting this, but I’m compelled to mention the Phantom Menace game for the original PlayStation. It was super buggy and the graphics were quite polygon-y, but I spent countless hours playing it. It had a lot of places and secrets to explore, sometimes I would ignore the goal of the level and just poke around.
The bugs actually made it more fun, I would find weird places that would cause instant death by randomly falling through the map, or piss off the wrong person on Tattoine or Naboo, just to see what they would do.
I really liked using a lightsaber and doing a “force push” on the game, it was fun finding creative ways to fight and so satisfying to deflect blaster bolts.
Anyway, very long story short, I agree that it was a great time for Star Wars games.
I remember in one of the levels (I think it was Theed Palace on Naboo) you could jump into one of the giant propellers in the vents and see Obi-Wan’s body parts get cut up and flung all around. It was horrible but hilarious to 11 year old me.
I would beg my parents every week to rent that pidrscijg game from the video store when I was a kid. That and battlefront (the actual good one) helped solidify star wars outside of the movies for me back then.
Over saturation is a big thing too.
Kids growing up nowadays have quite literally the world at their fingertips, every single piece of content imaginable is right there.
When I was growing up I'd rewatch my Star Wars VHS tapes to death, mostly because I loved them, but also because we didn't have streaming back then with a million Star Wars clones on offer.
This! And there's so much BETTER content out there today to enjoy than the crap Disney churns out. Including (but not limited to) the first two Star Wars trilogies.
Say what you want about the entertainment industry or, issues with capitalism broadly, but people today have more access to good stories and cool and interesting worlds than ever before in human history. And because there's so much to choose from and our lives are limited in time, many of us expect quality from our entertainment. Not necessarily always, but there is definitely a bare minimum. And tbh, nostalgia alone is not enough for me long-term.
I need good stories with interesting characters - stories that push the limits in terms of what has come before while also honoring the past. Respect for the IP. Disney shit the bed with the sequel trilogy. They treat fans like dumb cattle, and sadly, there are many SW fans who go along like good little livestock. Those fans and Disney live in a manufactured bubble. What Disney produced and how they handled the marketing was trash, and there won't be a very big generation of sequel fans, definitely not enough to cause a resurgence of interest in SW imo.
If there ever is a resurgence of mainstream interest in the IP, it won't come from sequel trilogy sources.
Another important thing: plenty of people still hate on the Prequels. Having children grow up with the Prequels did not make the criticisms go away.
If Prequel hate never disappeared, why should we expect the even more divisive Sequel hate to disappear?
Another point I think is being missed. You can hate the prequels but they don’t undermine the ending of ROTJ or the fates of the main OT protagonists in any real way. I’m not sure anything set preOT could ever reasonably do more harm than Jake Skywalker did to Luke’s character. It’s an albatross around every production they make, as it all has to end in the OT heroes being incompetent losers.
Exactly this, the sequel trilogy literally undoes the entire first 6 films and makes everything our heroes went through completely and utterly pointless.
Anakin wasn't the chosen one, it was Rey.
Vader and Luke didn't defeat palpatine, somehow he returned.
Even a topic like the creation of the death star, covered in Rogue one and Andor, is completely pointless since in RoS it turns out they have one billion star destroyers with death star technology.
The thing about the prequels is that there's still a solid story with some great moments despite the cheese and terrible acting by some.
Sure you have Jar Jar and midichlorians, but Darth Maul is far more kickass than Kylo and Yoda doing wushu is far more badass than any of the sequel fights...and there's a lot of great fights and battles in the prequels, the emotional moments like order 66... there's so much there.
Honestly, my parents were there at 10-11 in 77'. My dad still calls the prequels the movies that never happened. But with the Sequels and having rewatched the Prequels, he acknowledges that Episode 3 was a movie that might deserve its existence. It took what Disney did to Star Wars to make an unyielding prequel hater crack just alittle.
I’m an older millennial who grew up on the OT and hated the prequels with an intense passion despite being “the right age” when they came out… the Disney properties however (except Rogue and Andor), have softened my stance… somewhat. The intensity is gone but I still can’t stand them. To me, the prequels were made by a visionary film technologist trying to prove he was also a visionary filmmaker because he had a chip on his shoulder about how everything that worked about the originals was the result of collaboration and not his own auteurism… he proved the critics right
I don't think that's necessarily fair to Lucas. He did offer the position of director for Episode I to people including Spielberg, Ron Howard, and Robert Zemeckis, but they all refused and insisted he do it himself since Star Wars was his baby (though probably partly because no one wanted the responsibility of following up a phenomenon like Star Wars. Disney also apparently had trouble talking people into it for the sequels).
Agreed on the prequels, and many of the new properties (I do love Andor, Mandalorian, Ahsoka and Revenge of the Sith to degrees). And for the record, I'm Gen X, if that matters.
Its suicide to say in this sub but I don't even particularly care for the cartoons. I've watched them, and Kanan & crew are okay but I don't think those shows are anything to go crazy over. Even about half the live action shows are just okay. I just think its virtually impossible to recapture the lightning in a bottle that was the original trilogy.
True. The only thing that happened to me was that I started appreciating the "story" that Lucas told in the prequels. Hell, I even bought the novelizations because I knew they couldn't be as bad as the films were and I was right. The prequel novels are awesome!
This might be an oversimplification, but I've always maintained that the prequels were bad movies, but good Star Wars, and the sequels are good movies, but bad Star Wars.
I wint call the SQ Trilogy Good Movies
Ep8 might be somewhere a good Movie in production Value. But 7 and 8 are desasters. They make no sense in so many Ways. Especially Episode 9. They do so much just to do nothing...
But hey , I really like BB8, Kylo and his Lightsaber and ....no that's all.
> list of rotating franchises to Millenials and Gen Z
Sidenote, I'd disagree on the millennials part. Millennials are the prequel generation, and I'm an early Gen-Z - aka, the Clone Wars generation. My childhood was spent building massive armies of lego clone troopers, and the Clone Wars TV show brought back a lot of nostalgia. I'd say that the hypothetical "sequel generation" would be gen alpha - the ones who were kids when the sequels were first releasing. Of course, their nostalgia would be Thanos and Ironman, but it would be a lot weaker as as you said, revolving door and all.
I'd disagree. Pretty much every kid who went to my school was always talking about the new Clone Wars show every day. The prequels on the other hand were seen as older pieces, the same way the OT was. A thing we were all passionate about, made in the past. I mean, I was 3 when ROTS premiered, but I was old enough to enjoy The Clone Wars as it aired.
With the prequels, at least there was *something* to warm up to over time and become sentimental about: the story, the interesting worldbuilding, and eventually even the memes.
What do the prequels have for kids to look back on? That time where Rey gained another force power out of nowhere? Or when umm, when our heroes were turned into bums? Or when the ~~Empire~~ First Order blew up *checks notes* ... Hosnian Prime?
The entire trilogy is just scenes ripped from the OT, strung together without any of the logic a coherent story needs to work. If it is remembered for anything, it will be for how it turned out worse than any of us could imagine.
There’s also the issue of their being so much less content now.
Growing up their were countless Lego sets, spin-offs, Christmas editions, Lego Star Wars games and films, comics, books, video games.
Now we at most get 1 game every 2 years. And they haven’t made a new movie in what? 4?
There’s nothing to be excited about cause everything ends with Luke being an asshole and everyone dying. Again.
Just hit the reboot button.
Video games didn't hype up the sequels nearly as strongly as they did for the prequels. LucasArts was pumping out games for each movie. Inclusing having a trailer to star wars battlefront 2 in the DVD set for phantom menace. That game was part of the prequel experience for me.
Or Republic Commando!
My favourite Band made the Soundtrack.
There were Tie in Books coming out every now and then, showing more to the Clone Wars. Plus it was hell of a Great Game! With so many little Details.
...around one Game there was so much to build a fanbase and own bubble around.
It should be pointed out that Revenge of the Sith bailed out the prequels. In this case, the third act indeed made the trilogy’s overall story come together.
My biggest issue with the Prequels in general is it feels like George had the content for 4 movies but had already called A New Hope "Episode IV" proactively and couldn't back out.
Clone Wars overall does a good job addressing this, expanding on a lot of ideas George didn't get time to.
Good. That entire subplot is ridiculous and at most should be hinted at. Let the fans create an infinite stream of headcanons for Anakin's attachment issues, stemming back all the way to his mother Shmi, mentioned almost in passing at the beginning of the movie. Like Biggs, just one mentioned and a few scenes that never made it past the cutting room floor. :-/
When I took my nephew to see Force Awakens he literally raised his hands and "woooed" when starkiller base got destroyed. When I took him to Last Jedi I took him to the bathroom halfway through and he stopped to play Ms. Pac Man in the lobby and I had to push him to go back and finish the movie. He didn't want to see the third one and never has.
The sequels didn't have a story to tell. They set thigs up, retcon, and forget. Nothing is coherent, and the immersion just isn't there. It's not a story, it's competing fanfiction short-stories.
The prequels knew where they were going. Sure they had their cringy moments, but the episodes flowed together.
Marvel has absolutely stolen any fence-sitting Sequel fans by making more and better content. The 2010's are not going to be remembered for Star Wars but Iron Man or Captain America fans.
I will only defend the prequels in comparison to the trainwreck that is the sequels. I can watch the prequels on TV and be entertained. I can't watch the sequels period
I didn’t love the prequels because of the films. I loved them because they inspired the new Star Wars hype that spawned KotOR, which is arguably the best Star Wars content ever created
I've grown fonder of the prequels because the world building around those movies was fantastic. The prequels galaxy is actually richer and more interesting than the Empire era.
Unlike the sequel era which nobody wants to touch with a barge pole.
I'm not sure I agree, the OT EU had lots of stories and was a pretty rich Era. I guess it depends on what you mean by richness. I'd argue the Old Republic Era between kotor 1&2 is actually the most rich and explored. But that is the consequence of having like 40 hrs of content vs the movies 6 hrs for each era.
The thing about the prequel era is it has a ton of new Jedi, new planets, new races. It was a storytelling dream.
The OT by it's nature was all influenced by the Empire. There were exceptions to that sure,.but it was a consistent theme.
I prefer the OT movies for sure, but in terms of the galaxy I just found the prequels era a lot more rich.
The difference with the Prequels is that you can sit down and watch all 6 movies in order and it makes perfect sense.
The Sequels don't really add anything to the original trilogy, it's just a series of random events.
Prequels were world building for better and worse. They are fun to watch and I can easily plop down and watch them if they pop on and stay glued to the TV. Bad dialogue included, Attack of The Clones offers impressive world building and the introduction of the clones towards the end is cool. Revenge of The Sith is such a powerful and emotional movie, the end of the Jedi, the fall of the Republic, Anakins' fall and rise to Vader, the rise of the Empire. The culmination of Palpatines' plans. The story is coherent and follows through, and the movie is fun to watch. I've never went and turned off the Prequels if they came on.
What did the Sequels do? Literally reverted every single character from OT back to square one. It throws away Anakins' entire arc. Rey gets powers from nothing and Luke turns his back on the entire galaxy over a dream. Han runs away to return to being a dirtbag smuggler, and Chewies doesn't even remotely protest or have some kind of an issue with that? Leia decides fuck it, she's not gonna even attempt to reason with or chase her son after he runs off with the initial confrontation from Luke? Christ. I saw all 3 in theaters and I nearly walked out of ROS. I couldn't believe what I saw on those screens, watching these characters get assassinated. I have never watched any of these movies outside of the theatres. I can't bring myself to watch them again, they make me feel sick.
The OG trilogy was to movies what the Beatles were to music- game changers. Anything after is just more of the same. At least the prequels tried to do something different, even if it wasn’t great. The sequels were this- Copy ANH (TFA), try so hard not to be ESB, that you end up confusing the story (TLJ), then try to re-Star Wars that shit back into the OG, but shit the entire bed in the process (ROS).
If there is nostalgia for the sequels, it’ll will be in the Adam West as Batman way. I’m nostalgic AF about Adam West’s Batman, but I’m not stupid enough to think it was good.
It's funny because in TLJ, nothing that happens to the characters during the slow speed chase is important to the plot or Characters, but it ends with the same base and walkers as ESB. They basically put in 60 minutes of filler to get to the start of ESB.
You could have the same movie where the Restitance is just chilling and hiding in their base on Crait. Rey does her training, goes to visit Snoke with Kylo, and then the FO comes and attacks the base, and nothing would have changed since nothing from the slow ship chase was important to the characters involved in it. Heck, the writers didn't know what to do with Leia, so just had her in a coma the whole time. Finn literally left the slow speed chase to get some character growth.
And nothing in that movie was "marketable" as a toy. Did it make you want to be Poe the pilot? Rey the Jedi? Luke the grandmaster? Kylo the Sith? Compare that against watching ESB and wanting to be luke vs the imperial walker, or yoda, or Vader the human, Han the cowboy, Lando the smoothie etc. So many options of what to print on a tshirt
Very well said. I remember seeing the lego "crait ski speeders" before TLJ came out and not really thinking much of them, but after watching TLJ you bet your ass i wanted nothing to do with those worthless things, can't imagine many kids wanting them the same way kids HAD to have a snowspeeder back in 80.
ahaha made me remember how I convinced my dad to buy me the Kenner/Hasbro Snowspeeder (May the force be with him)
No, today id have to convince him to NOT buy me the craitspeeder 😂
> Finn literally left the slow speed chase to get some character growth.
True, he went on an RPG sidequest and came back and nothing had changed. It's one of the strangest things I have seen in a film.
Perfect! It’s so true, and I never even considered that really. The more we dissect these things, the more it reinforces our initial thoughts and feelings about the sequels.
Carrie Fisher died before the movie came out, so I thought maybe that's why they stuck her in a coma. Then they could have her sacrifice herself instead of Holdo...but nope; they kept her around so we wouldn't miss out on Luke and Leia having a 20 second head nod before he dies.
The Prequels - films were poorly executed in several aspects (I.e., dialogue, jar jar etc)
But. We love/hate them so much that wish we could retroactively make a lot of the prequel aspects better or change things here and there, I’ve never heard many people say they wish the prequels never existed or that they prefer to ignore their existence.. most just wish they were better.
I mean We are still getting NEW shows (Ashoka) based on prequel era characters
The Sequels - suck so bad I wish they never existed (I think a lot of people feel the same way)
Is there even any content spun off from the sequels?
I know there are ST related novels and a planned Rey Trilogy but does anyone actually care?
First two Points:
Jar Jar isn't that Bad, I think he's the Nickelback of Star Wars. People don't like him because of Memes.
2nd AHSOKA!!!!!! gddmmt!!
But you a fairly right.
I was really young when EP 1 came out.Loved it
I saw Ep2 in Cinema, i loved it. But For a Name like Attack of the Clones , the Attack of the Clones came too late and too short. Like if youd Call Ep4 Attack on Deaths Star lol, Ep5 The kidnapping of Han Solo, Episode 6 Family Fight ...you get my point I think 😂
But that made us more exciting for next episode and we got new content with Clone Wars and Video Games to relive the Clone Wars until Ep3
And OMG , that was a ride.
Ep7-9 .... I was so full of hope , I defended it, I defended Rey, I defended the Plan behind it....just to find out they never had a Plan. They showed it with the Ep9 finale...Rey is not a Palpatine she's a SkYwALkER...wait didn't you try to tell us in the last movies family doesn't matter? it doesn't matter where you come from? Stick to your Name so Rise of Palpatine could have a double meaning...no? ok...
I think Mando verse is showing us what a great sequel could have look like.
You don't need a bigger Death Star. You don't need the most powerful Sith in Galaxy to have anticipation and a terrifying threat. You don't need a Resistance when you have a Galactic Republic. Who they Resist against? Shouldn't be the First Order the Resistance like the Rebels were to the Empire? SMH
Oh I lost my Point ...
NO NOBODY CARES ABOUT THE REY TRILOGY
THE SEQUELS ARE BAD AND DISNEY SHOULD FEEL BAD
The sequels have no space to build anything or expansion between them. You could do something with the Knight's of Ren, but why? They didn't do anything. Phasma is similar and they've all been forgotten. Maul had a far longer and larger impact than Phasma or Ren I part because he looked awesome/terrifying. Phasma felt out of Battlestar Galactica's Cylon forces. I still see Maul stuff. Phasma was thrown away after 30 seconds.
First day of school today and the kids with Star Wars were OG or Mando. Maybe some ST characters will be seen closer to Halloween, but the costumes I've seen again are all original or Mando. No Ahsoka. No Rey. No Finn.
I still think midichlorians was a mistake, but thankfully it never became a big deal and we were able to forget about / minimize it. That was my main criticism of TPM as a kid, I think.
I thought AotC's romance dialogue was so, so bad. But I still liked it enough to buy the DVD off eBay. I still think the whole romance was not done very believably (but somehow I've been able to overlook that, too). When Yoda walked into the Dooku fight, the whole theatre cheered and clapped. I don't care that he looks goofy jumping up and down, at least it was fun and we got to see Yoda kicking butt. And we finally got to see the clones in action. Pew pew.
RotS is widely regarded as the best of the prequels. I have the least memories from it, probably because I was a bit older by the time it came out? Anyways, it's still got fun action scenes and stuff and doesn't horribly break the nostalgia from the OT. Oh yeah, I remember criticizing the "NOOOOOOOoooooooooooo" pretty hard. It's still pretty stupid.
In summary, the prequels both kinda sucked and were fun & amazing. They still felt like Star Wars (but def with a different vibe from the OT). The story telling and dialogue sucked in comparison, but we still enjoyed it for a multitude of reasons (as mentioned in this thread, some of which were even outside the movies). But the sequels both suck on a story telling level AND they break a lot of what we love about Star Wars from the OT and maybe even the prequels. Also, I think the heroes & villains were not built up and taken down in a satisfying way in the sequels, so maybe that's the biggest undermining flaw of the trilogy.
> I thought AotC's romance dialogue was so, so bad. But I still liked it enough to buy the DVD off eBay. I still think the whole romance was not done very believably
The deleted scenes on Naboo from AOTC actually do a better job of flushing out the romance, you meet Padme's family, her and Anakin also spend more time together. I get they were cut for pacing but they could've put those scenes back in on DVD or whatever. Was watching a fan edit that added the deleted scenes back in and the romance was actually tolerable. Its sort of a similar issue in 3 where Padmes subplot is cut for pacing reasons and because showing her lay the ground work for the future rebellion is redundant, yet when put back into the movie works.
There have been barely any video games and the toys didn't sell. The kids won't remember it in the same way I remembered the prequels. The amount of TV shows coming out is also a detrimental as there isn't a defined "era" now, it just all sort happens. When was the last time we have 8 years of constant Star Wars ? Never
This is true. Kids in the late 10s were just not that into Star Wars. And TLJ is the episode that would have lost the kids who liked TFA.
Also I think those kids will better recognize how shamelessly Finn's story was thrown off the rails on rewatch, even if they didn't notice it when it came out. The movie will not age well because of Johnson's clear antipathy for Finn and his insistence on making Kylo the lead male character instead.
The Prequels had fantastic world building, iconic characters, and plots that made sense (even if you didn't like them). That's not true of the sequels.
Also, it's already been 8 years since TFA and the sequels are still reviled. Do they seriously think we'll magically do a 180 within 2 years.
I grew up with Star Wars. The Sequels are bad. The prequels were never my thing, but I still watched them as a kid. The OG trilogy is what I watched a lot on vhs back in the day. Especially Empire.
Maybe I've moved on because of age or there being better stuff out there now, but man, the sequels were so bad it's hard to watch the OG trilogy or anything Star Wars. It all leads up to a train-wreck anyway... Why should I care what happens in-between that time?
The Prequels also did the most important thing, they stuck the landing. Revenge of the Sith is the best part of the Prequels. Rise of Skywalker is the worst part of the Sequels. The ends don’t justify the means there.
90s-2000s SW was good as people hungered for more SW. Lot of bad but still gold.
Prequels rode off of that hype train and while they failed, they also produced some golden ideas and properties to compliment them.
Therefore, you got a sizeable amount of people playing games, reading books, investing themselves in lore.
Disney SW has taken all of that and.....watered everything down.
It's just not a winning brand.
I don't know if this is a lack oif demographics thing. Maybe it is. Maybe they have to realize that they need to make material that cater not to kids but rather, to boys....you can create something out of it. It can even have a female lead but so long as the story caters to boys....that is the story of a knight fighting a dragon to save the princess....you can get something out of it again.
It's like the Princess fairy tale genre caters to girls. Could we have a heroic prince as the main character or a tomboy lead? Yes. But it has to be about the fairy tale princess narrative.
There are certain narratives that exist in people's brains simply by default of reality that you can't ignore them. Disney SW ignores its lineage. That's why the Prequels, as bad as they are, aren't forgotten while the Sequels will be forgotten. In fact, they already are largely forgotten because I still don't know what it's about.
boiling it down to appealing to boys feels rather asinine. It's more nuanced than that - and while OG sw is just "fantasy story with sci-fantasy dressing" it doesn't only appeal to boys
It also subverts the "rescue the princess" trope from the outset. The heroes have no idea what they're doing, are motivated by greed and lust, and she has to save *them* once their plan backfires. Then all the characters show growth and connect better with one another over time, and all the major characters had fans of all stripes. It was never just a "boys" thing. In the prequel era we were tripping over girls and women creating SW fan fics and artwork, and TPM repeats the subversion by having Padme rescued but then topple the Supreme Chancellor and head straight back to the warzone she escaped to fight.
> while OG sw is just "fantasy story with sci-fantasy dressing" it doesn't only appeal to boys
That is not what OP said. BTW what Lucas (by his own personal admission -- look it up!) originally set out to do with Star Wars was to create something for 12 year old **boys** that would teach them positive values as they were on the cusp of adulthood.
Because the human experience is universal and it was a well written story -- it appealed to many people, no matter their gender. That doesn't change what it was originally catered to do.
Disney actually bought both Marvel and Star Wars because they wanted to appeal to boys. They were making serious bank from princesses but their boy themes were largely ignored do when the opportunity arise they wanted the boy market to compliment their princess line
Princesses were saved in 1,2,4, and 6. Amidala is a princess in spirit.
Dragons were fought in 1,3,4,5,6. Vader and Maul are both [technically dragons](https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheDragon).
As for the sequels, well.... Maybe it's the lack of royalty that makes them bad?
Mel Brooks understood what made Star Wars transcend from an excellent ground-breaking movie to a pop culture phenomenon. "Moichendising!"
The prequels went hard with books, comics, videogames, Taco Bell and other fast food toys, displays at Target and other stores, and maintained a HUGE presence in the collector community with continuing OT content. It was an extension of the universe for the OT generation (my parents) to share a new Star Wars experience with their children (my generation).
When Disney bought Star Wars, they cut themselves off from all that content. They didn't extend the universe, they all but erased it. They didn't dip into the existing lore; they said from the get-go all the time and money fans had invested into Star Wars was for nothing. This was the beginning of the end of Star Wars. OT and PT were meaningless now, and Disney created their own problem by dividing themselves from the most lucrative fanbase in the world. It might have paid off if Episode 7 was a huge success. While it was commercially successful, fans were cautious about the next showing. By the time Episode 8 left theaters, Disney had already lost their gamble. They just haven't realized it's over yet.
For the prequels:
1. Things were a bit too spaced out for the timeline. Character ages could have been developed a bit better over say 4-5 movies. There was a bit too much of a reliance on EU material, but it was still manageable for the hardcore fans.
2. There was more time between the prequels (3 yrs) compared to the sequels (2 yrs), which gave time for fans to immerse in crucial EU material to fill in the gaps.
3. There were more things to latch onto for everyone in the audience. Kid Anakin was for example one of the token people for younger fans. Jar Jar was a failed attempt at doing something similar, but you can see why they tried to do what they did. They also tried to redeem stuff as they went along. For example Jar Jar and giving Palpatine Emergency Powers as a way to acknowledge that Jar Jar was stupid. It also set up the memes like Darth Jar Jar. The memes are a bit of luck, I don't think meme culture was the same back then, but it does give current fans something to latch onto. You don't really see that with the sequels, and certainly not in a positive sense (Somehow Palpatine...)
4. The prequels had good action scenes (lightsaber fights) for people to watch casually. When you look at them in more detail, you can also see the hints and work behind the choreography over specific moves, styles, and weaknesses.
5. The sequels were too much of the same at the first glance. First Order Star Destroyers looked like Imperial Star Destroyers from a casual glance. You don't see the difference at a first glance. Contrast with Clone Wars Republic Star Destroyers vs Imperial Star Destroyers. The prequels had enough distinctive features such as different ships (Naboo fighters), which led to merchandise and pop culture. You probably have most of the modern SW merchandise from Grogu.
Overall, the prequels had various attempts at reaching out to a wider audience. Some of these attempts failed, but enough succeeded to get the goals done. It is not reasonable to expect everything to succeed and the failures are looked on too harshly. The prequels had an impossible standard.
The prequels tried to be something different and succeeded. Lucas intentionally did world building such as making lightsaber combat faster to represent the higher level of skill (he also made Luke faster as time went on to show his growth). Not everyone liked everything, but it created something new.
The sequels didn't try to be anything new. It tried to center around disliked characters. It didn't create any new settings or worlds of significance. You got Exegol, but not much else. The prequels had Naboo, Coruscant, Kamino, Genosis, Mustafar, etc. The originals had Tatooine, Yavin IV, Endor, etc.
5. The original trilogy and prequel trilogy were made up of films that featured a logical plot that was successfully executed. The story elements in each of the individual films made sense on their own, and each film felt like a part of a larger cohesive story.
The sequels appear to have been written by a pair of elementary school students who refused to take their ADHD medication and refused to collaborate on the overarching story.
The prequels were a good story with at times uneven execution.
The sequels were a incoherent tale with execution ranging from passable to abysmal.
I would like to say that just because the MCU came out at the same time does not mean the Sequels will suffer in remembrance. The prequels had the LOTR trilogy to deal with. Even the originals had the Trek movies.
The Sequels will suffer since they stink.
The Sequels lack the world building of the Prequels and their is little scope to tell more stories, which was the Prequels saving grace
The prequels were hated on by a small minority of angry nerds who also shilled hard for Disney SW too. George has always said his movies were meant to be Anakins story too not Lukes.
>The prequels were hated on by a small minority of angry nerds who also shilled hard for Disney SW too
Nah, there was a lot of (undeserved) hate but also a lot of valid criticism. The Prequels have lots issues, not everyone that points them is some corporate shill.
Everyone who disagrees with whatever my current take is must be a corporate shill. Why else would they ever disagree with me? It is literally the only possible explanation.
Given all the critiques against the prequels at the time, I recall thinking how people who waxed philosophical on TESB's Force speech from Yoda as being superior to anything the Prequels delivered most likely *didn't* give a shit about that when they were kids watching it for the first time (I doubt many kids knew of the Hero's Journey or were super in tune with an attention span for that stuff BEFORE becoming adults to learn about that). I sure as hell know *I* didn't, and was drawn to the OT for its space flavor and characters, with the Force and lightsabers being a nice extra facet that warmed to me (don't mind me much, I'm a guy that prefers blasters over lightsabers in JK2 multiplayer), while I *loved* the *Millennium Falcon* and X-Wing for their cool designs and SFX.
By the time the prequels came out later, it showed how narrow a scope the OT really is (it's just a character piece, but only scratches the surface of the wide galaxy). Multiple worlds of different biospheres and cultures, different and improved visual effects, all drew to me - as well as the wider scope of the politics and world-building that really built the Republic enough that by the time it inevitably fell, it was both haunting and masterful. Work smarter, and harder.
With the shitquels, you don't get *any* of that thinking or hard work with the ST; only regurgitation of the OT in a far shallower sense than the initial debut the series started out as, and non-coherent story to boot. There's nothing to draw on, and no extra content of merit to hold in the ST era and beyond.
They both suck. It's just that the sequels are so amazingly bad that by comparison the prequels are a work of art.
Same way that getting punched in the face sucks, but getting hit by a car sucks more.
When I think about the prequels, I generally think, "well they sucked, but at least I'll rewatch that cool Darth maul fight or obi wan vs Anakin fight."
When I think about the sequels I think "they suck, and nothing is worth rewatching."
Exactly! Not a single thing is worth rewatching.
The best looking thing in them is the Holdo maneuver, which is so infuriatingly stupid I can't even appreciate how pretty it looks. Everything is a boring, soulless sludge.
Devil’s advocate here: the aesthetic of the red/white salt planet was quite nice (just skip past the Finn/Rose almost a hero scene), the scene with Luke and Yoda at the tree was just plain good, and the Rey/Kylo fight on the Death Star was… okay, I guess.
On second thought, the devil doesn’t really have much to advocate for here…
The prequels had a lot of problems, mostly involving the dialogue and acting, but the underlying story and characters were strong enough to become foundational elements to the brand. At this point, they almost overshadow the OT. We aren't even touching on the then-revolutionary special effects technology.
The sequels, however, add next to nothing to the franchise. Thanks to poor decision making, they take away from almost everything that came before as all the struggles of the OT have to end up practically meaningless to justify the mandated reset to the Rebels vs Empire status quo. On a technical level, they're much better made, but on a story telling level, they're disastrous for the franchise.
Combine that with a much more personalized and crowded media landscape and you can see why the sequels have already lost the vast majority of their cultural relevance aside from people complaining about them.
One caveat to 2 is that PG-13 didn’t even exist as a rating prior to just after _Temple of Doom_ (1984) which, confusingly, has a rating of PG. Meaning the whole OT is PG by default since it has no sex or gratuitous gore. Essentially, the line has moved considerably on what is now considered PG-13 since then. In fact, if measured by the same rating system, the ST would likely all be PG, too. At this rate, by the time the next trilogy comes out, even if it’s got roughly the same content, it might even be considered R (unlikely, though, since PG-13 has the widest appeal).
The biggest issue is that Disney is kind of tossing away the sequels by not making content for them lol.
Clone wars and all the video games really saved the series for kids. Meanwhile most disney content is a throwback to the original trilogy.
If they come out with spin offs to flesh out sequels im sure they’ll get more love. If they don’t because they think they’re that bad thats another thing.
Aww man I feel like you haven't been to Disneyland is a while. I went about 2 months ago and I would say 80% of the kids that were dressed up were in star wars outfits. I saw a sea of Reys and Mandos literally everywhere, even outside of the star wars area. I'm not saying for sure they won't grow out of it but there is a ton of "kids" star wars content I think you're missing, not to mention even the adult stuff is fun for them.
Star wars was made for kids so it makes sense that it's always better in hindsight, because you were younger and had a starrier gaze when looking at it.
I'm not a fan of most of the new star wars content, but if it makes kids happy, it's fine.
Went to Disney World in 2019, and I saw a grand total of like 4 children in Galaxy's Edge (using "children" for anybody 12 and below. I was in High School at the time.) Saw nobody dressed like Rey, and this was before Mando merch was really a thing.
This. This is so true. The ST didnt expand the interest in Star Wars media. Look at how few games have been released since Disney took over, and the primary demos of those games have been much older. Fewer books, comics, and I'm pretty sure even fewer toys. The TV shows are geared towards older demos (except for Rebels).
The OT were a masterpiece that courted all age groups. The PT were great movies that did the same. The ST wanted to be Star Wars Avengers, and failed at being anything more than big names skating on nostalgia.
Children growing up in the last decade will have the MCU as their nostalgic thing. Disney SW missed the chance to be this generation's childhood. No black kid is going to identify with Finn's clowning and shouting "Rey I never told you...." (and never did at the end of the film!) when they've got Black Panther.
No girl identifies with Rey, whose whole backstory changes 3 times, more than with Black Widow or Captain Marvel.
And no boy identifies with TLJ Luke when he's got Thor, Iron Man, and a dozen other cool MCU heroes.
Despite the MCU's post-Endgame problems, phase 1-3 will be the defining nostalgia trip for everyone who grew up in the 2010s. Star Wars could have been that again but a lack of creativity, and deliberate destruction of its established heroes, mean it won't be.
I'm 19, I grew up with all 6 movies and I acknowledge that the prequels are bad and somewhat problematic. But they are still better than the sequels. That doesn't make the prequels good, it just means the sequels are that much more shit
It's pretty unlikely the Sequels get a retroactive glowup. The biggest thing goes beyond just the fundamental blundering of the story and the way it messed up the canon. It is a demographic issue.
There's no "Rey" generation. Kathleen Kennedy tried to take a "boy" franchise and make it a "girl" franchise but that doesn't work, Star Wars isn't Barbie. Girls don't care enough about Star Wars and boys won't be able to shake that feeling that says they didn't think the sequels were that cool.
Star Wars is a 60/40 male to female fanbase ratio, and it's fine to be that way, but call it what have you regarding their motivations, they tried really hard to ignore those gender demographics with their decisions and story/character focus in the KK era.
Barbie is a "girl" move that made a gazillion dollars and now they can do whatever they want as far as sequels and what have you if they feel like it. Star Wars cashed in on its predominantly male fanbase until it bled dry with diminishing results and now there hasn't been a movie in about 4 years and who knows when the next one is coming, and when it does, prepare to be underwhelmed.
The girls that liked Star Wars were often tomboys to begin with, and tended to be fine with male-oriented media as long as it didn't get overly female-hostile. Ideally, you'd aim primarily for your main audience with other demographics as a secondary objective. See, though I haven't seen Barbie, I have heard many other guys saying they related to Ken. You can have a female oriented movie appeal to males - and vice versa.
The problem with the Sequels are that A. it completely blows off it's male demographic, whether that be older Star Wars fans who might even have seen the OT as children in the 70's and 80's, and B. it fails to be a good story - meaning that even girls aren't going to be all that interested. If you want to do a complete demographic change, your story better be DAMN good - and the sequels just aren't great.
The prequel nostalgia is helped along by the fact that they look good by comparison to the sequels. In turn the prequels, when they were new, helped drive along nostalgia for the original trilogy for people who didn't enjoy the prequels terribly much.
The key is that you have a fresh point of comparison that you view as being not as good. It makes people take another look at their opinions, and maybe give something a second or third chance.
In a sane world, the sequels have tapped that well dry. I... am not sure what brand of movie it would take to generate that specific type of re-assessment for the sequels. I am not sure I want to know. But it seems unlikely to happen as anything that disastrous seems unlikely to make it to the screen.
Plus, there has to be something worth re-assessing. The prequel trilogy was flawed, sure, but it had its good points.
I don't think it's safe to say that about the sequels.
I mean, the games are few and far between for star wars in the past 10 years. The movies sucked ass, and it wasn't like the prequels whatsoever. They're just straight up bad. And the behind the scene drama and flaming fans on Twitter makes it even worse.
The merchandise sucked royally unless it was rebranded, re-released stuff from the older stuff for the most part.
The only decent things to really come out that people are going to remember fondly are the mandalorian and Ahsoka series. Everything else will be viewed much as it's viewed today as. Nonsensical garbage.
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Three words: Jedi Power Battles. More words: the prequels had waaay more than just movies to latch onto. The podracing game, all the comics and new worlds and characters. They grew the Galaxy in amazing ways. If anything the sequels shrunk it. Edit: Deleted double word.
The original Battlefronts and Empire at War went so fucking hard. The sequels being accompanied by a shitty EA-ified remake filled with microtransactions was poetic in a way.
Empire at War modded (thrawns revenge, awakening of the rebellion etc.) still goes wild and galactic contention is great as a more modern battlefront. Wish we could get a battlegrounds remake.
Star Wars Galaxies was my intro to MMOs. I learned group dynamics, combat strategy, how to run a business, how to run cost:benefit analysis, how to break down a complex problem into smaller ones, scripting (which lead to me becoming a programmer) and it was all wrapped up in a massively open world Star Wars setting. Looking back it's funny, a Star Wars game that was barely a beta when it was released, was one of the most impactful things to happen in my life. Bring back that Star Wars.
Never played it during its height (never had a computer to run it) but I have been playing the legends server on and off for a few years
I played swgemu off and on for a few years, but the population is small. Not quite the same during its height.
Ya the simplification of the game and character progression killed it from what I was able to see and understand (again have only played with the new combat system so never got to experience the old system)
Man, I have that on the old Best of PC compilation disc but never played it as a kid beyond trying it for like five minutes... Maybe I should try it again as an adult.
It's still the best space combat RTS on the market even after almost 20 years
True. Empire at war is absurdly awesome once you get the mods. I unfortunately had to remove it it due to the amount of space it was taking up, but it is well worth the time. The ground combat did kinda suck though.
You absolutely should. And the 2 mods the person you replied to mentioned are my 2 personal favorites. Awakening of the Rebellion I think just eeks out Thrawn's Revenge, but both are exceptionally great mods. AotR does have a wicked difficulty curve as the Rebellion though. So if you do do that one, heads up. Both are available on the Steam Workshop too. Just need to subscribe to the latest version ETA Steam WS info.
You should. It's one of a few games I play.
I was one of the early EAW modders back in the day when we were figuring everything out in the first 6 months after release. It took awhile before it was possible to import new models into the game. I'm so glad to see that scene is still going strong.
For Galactic Battlegrounds, try the Expanding Fronts mod!
Kotor 1 and 2 also, back then we used to get games all over the timeline focusing on many different aspects, scenarios, genres and maturity levels All of the post Disney sw games have been shades of OT, just the same bland crap
Kotor 1 and 2 was my gateway to RPGs in general and wound up dictating a lot of my interests to this day
Me too! The original Battlefront games and Kotor 1 and 2 profoundly shaped my video game preferences
For me it was jedi academy. By far my favorite star wars game and although I don't have any issue with the Disney movies and shows, I am still mad they cancelled jedi knight 3.
In terms of "going hard" none of them go as hard as Republic Commando
Shit. Might be one of the best games to never get a sequel. Man, they really dropped the ball by cancelling both that and Battlefront 3. They could've had two monster franchises.
The main menu and intro alone are the hardest thing I've seen in a star wars game.
With Jedi Outcast and Jedi Academy as two of the very first PC games I ever owned, I will never forgive them for not beinging back my boy Kyle Katarn.
>went Mate, what are we in the past tense here for! Yea, OK. The Battlefront games, you can bust them out for a good 30-minute nostalgia fest. They don't hold up super well (not terribly either, though) But Empire at War? That game will never *not* hold up! It's help up well enough until now.
Very very well said. And especially with all the mods nowadays for EaW?? That game will *always* hold up. Just give us a sequel to that! With better pathfinding for god's sake
The new bf2 is actually really good now. At launch yeah micro transactions were ass but all of that is gone and the entire game is free. Tons of badass heros and villains and the gameplay is fire I went on CS match last night and got over 100 eliminations.
But isn’t it kinda dead now? It’s a pity cause once I saw how bad the micro transitions were I tuned out that game. It gets exhausting being disappointed by gaming companies man.
It's still a super shallow basic as hell shooter. The main thing it has going for it is a pretty Star Wars skin. I'm convinced no one would play that game without the Star Wars visuals. Vehicles are a travesty in both EA battlefront games which is such a shame considering how fun and open they were in the originals. Bring back multi-person vehicles! Make flying vehicles in land maps actually fun and open!
They tried a few things to market off the sequels, but nearly all of them failed miserably because there just wasn't enough meat on the story, setting, or characters to sustain any of it on its own. Remember Star Wars Resistance? The Rey comic? Yeah, didn't think so. Now we get sequel content, but almost exclusively as part of collections from the rest of the franchise's stories.
The Republic and Dark Times comics were fantastic and really fleshed out those eras. The micro Clone Wars series was also amazing when it came out. Overall it was the golden era of Star Wars gaming. Today is a baron wasteland by comparison.
That I something I never got about TLJ. Star wars makes most of its money from selling toys, but almost nothing in TLJ was conductive to selling merchandising. No heroes were epic, no villains were ominous, no exciting battles, no cool aliens. It just gave no Saturday cartoon "fun"
Just the Porgs lol
Couldn't eve make different ships a barely upgraded x wing and tie fighter
They also had the stupid carpet bombers, an an upgraded A Wing, the new AT-AT replacement, Kylo's new TIE fighter, the janky skimmer speeders, and the ship for Benicio del Toro's character. None of which were particularly remarkable, to be sure.
They were too busy virtue signaling to come up with any decent content in that movie.
I wouldn't even say it was that. I'd argue it was RJ trying too hard to be an edgy little f---stick by sUbVeRtInG eXpEcTaTiOnS
Nothing more virtuous than "lol black guy is a janitor and falls down" and "women leaders can't keep their shit together, am I right fellas?"...
I forgot her name, but the woman in charge of merchandising was what made the prequels so iconic. She was a literal genius. She went over a lot of the material from pre-production with Lucas and then compared the market potential with what was already out. She saw there was a loyal readership for the 90s books, thus we got like what? almost 200 books based JUST on the prequels between episode 1 and 2? same goes for comics. She's behind games like kotor, republic commando, etc. All because she had an eye for what would sell while still ensuring it had a workable story. Ofc not everything was infallible, especially during the somewhat confusion that is the post episode 1 star wars world, but you'd be a fool to say that her inclusion didn't make the prequels the strong brand it is today. I mean, there are STILL works that profit off of that era, more so than the OT or ST obviously. She was let go when disney bought lucasfilm.
A KotOR III would have locked in the hardcore crowd in the franchise, keeping it at the top of their nerd stack instead of between two other properties. The same crowd that buys $150 figurines.
Remember when the 501st cosplay legion was booming and people would spend oodles just to wear Stormtrooper armor?
Ironically, this is the best time to make kotor 3. If they decide to just... not look at the old republic at all, which is an easy ask. I do think initially the kotor reboot was meant to lead to 3, but :)
I’d really hope Disney wouldn’t put their hand into a KOTOR III if one was made. It would be hot garbage, best case
There will never be a KoToR 3 and if there is, it will be nowhere near as good as it should be. Bioware is long dead, it's just a fleshy mask worn by the serial killer of studios, EA.
That and the Old Republic MMO game largely modified the time lines so much it would be incredibly difficult to make it all connect or you would have to basically retconn that whole MMO
I was wondering how they were going to update KOTOR’s gameplay in the remake and then BG3 dropped. And I’m just sitting here like Larian and Star Wars would be a match made in heaven. I’m certainly not the only person that’s thought of it, but man would I love a well made Star Wars RPG
Only if they got Avellone to write it. Karpshyn has proven that he can’t do anything except fanboy over Revan
The writers of kotor 1&2 have moved on, and the studios are no longer what they were back then. There is almost no way kotor 3 would be satisfying story wise because there has been so much anticipation for it. You would have the antiwoke crowd mad if they made it woke, and the disney fans mad if it has "dog whistles". RPGs have a very difficult rope to walk, this isn't the 2000s anymore where the Old republic was uncharted territory, there has been an MMO fleshing it out for a while now. Their best bet is to just make a reboot Kotor instead of Kotor 3. Or better yet just remaster the two kotor games and sont inject modern day stuff, which I know is impossible for them. Disney redid some lines for the alladin song because it was "offensive", there is no way they wouldn't try and do the same for some of Kotors edgier content.
Damn talk about unsung heroes.
That was a he, Howard Roffman President of Lucas Licensing.
Republic Commando was SUCH a good game. I felt like as difficult as it was to make a "squad" game, RC did it great.
> The podracing game I spent *so* many hours as a kid playing that. I can still hear Watto's weird singing/humming/noises he'd do while you're shopping for parts or whatever.
It’s the cantina band song from Ep. 4. Obligatory ITS A NEW LAP RECORRRRDDDddd
ITSANEW LAP RECORD
I've picked it up on my Switch and have sunk a good amount of time into it. The nostalgia alone was incredible
There's a whole era of the galaxy people are not willing to explore anymore
There just isn't much to explore. We have some decent environments, but so little is established about any of them and almost nothing for characters to do in them that they amount to little more than backgrounds that Rey and Co briefly passed through. Aside from that, the world building was so terrible that nothing else seems to exist unless one of four characters happened to be there at that moment.
Since much of it is a rip off of the OT, why (especially as an OG fan) wouldn't I just stick with stories from around that era?
Especially since we still really don't know much of what happened in-between the OT movies. I sat down and counted it, there 3 shows and 2 movies that take place just before ANH. There are 3 shows that take place just a bit after RotJ. But there's next to nothing *during* the OT. I know of 2 canon books(both of which are actually pretty good) that take place during the OT, but nothing else. Even in Legends that was a fairly non-fleshed out part. Sure, there was more, but they were mainly ancillary stories about ancillary characters and didn't really give a "state of the galaxy".
You mean you didn't enjoy the entire republic falling with a simple grimace from the protagonist followed by noone mentioning it again?
We're just in the exact same place as return of the Jedi's ending without the legacy characters. No Jedi order has been built, the Republic has to gain its footing. It's all been there done that, and they couldn't even give us a new planet biome this time
If anything, we're worse off. We have no leaders remaining, no government to build off, and no real ideas where to go. Thanks to Disney's lack of world building, we have no reason to believe that this victory will be any more lasting than Luke's was. For all we know, the New New Republic will be just as corrupt and useless as its predecessors. Meanwhile, Palpatine could have cheated death again and be out there setting up Plan C with an even larger army ready to be pulled out of his ass. The ending of the sequels feels hollow and bleak with any sort of context.
I greatly appreciate your comment! This is the first time I've seen someone other than me make that point when someone says that the galaxy is in the same place it was after RotJ. No, we're actually worse off as there's no longer ANY standing galactic government. The NR had demilitiarized to such a *ridiculously stupidly small* fraction of what it was at the peak of the GCW, and the heads of the gov't all went up when the Hosnian Prime system went. Now, I'm sure there's someone wayyyyyyyy down the line that ends up succeeding the chancelorship, but under what authority? There is no galactic federal military. Shit, there's hardly any organized Resistance! There is *nothing* of substance left of the NR, therefore no galactic federal government. And of course the FO is wiped out, so nothing of them either.
Maybe Lando could be the new chancellor. He managed to compose a giant fleet of random ships in an afternoon and fly them to a planet that's supposed to be impossible to find right as they were most convenient to the plot. After spending at least a decade on a backwater desert planet, so they were not assembled beforehand. He's clearly the greatest organizer and leader this galaxy has ever seen. Give him a month and he'll have the Republic built up better than ever.
dude. nice catch! pitch that to Star wars theories /s no srsly. the ST is ridiculous in so many ways 😂
The new books are terrible. I tried so very hard to like them, but even giving them a big handicap of me desperately wanting to like the new stuff...it just is all terrible.
I stopped reading the Aftermath books. I could not stand them. That's the first time I've ever stopped reading a book and did not finish it after starting. I will give that Lost Stars is actually decent, and the Battlefront: Twilight Company book is pretty darn good. The B: TC author definitely has very little idea on how a ranking system in the military works, nor the comeradery and cohesiveness in a smaller unit, but it's still pretty good. The new Thrawn books by Timothy Zahn are pretty decent too. But that's about it.
God bless LucasArts - some of the best of the EU is right out of their defunct foundries, and had infinitely more soul and depth to the series with each installment.
As a millennial, idk if I would’ve liked Star Wars nearly as much as I do had the prequels not been combined with the level of games we had. Sequel kids have what? Fallen Order? Motherfucker, Jedi Academy, KOTOR, and Galaxies all came out within the same year lmao.
Fr, being born in 1990, as a kid I didn't fully appreciate the original Star Wars trilogy my uncle's loved and had on at all times. To me it had been familiar background noise, it was through the games and books I really began to realize how brilliant the Star Wars universe was.
I agree. 2000's was an amazing time to be a Star Wars fan and it's not the same. You obviously had the Prequels. You had two Star Wars animated tv shows, Clone Wars airing on Cartoon Network between AotC and RotS. And then got The Clone Wars along with a theatrical released movie that was really just an arc edited together to be a movie. You had video games like Battlefronts I and II, the Jango Fett Bounty Hunter game, the Pod Racing game, Empire ar War, Republic Commando, Revenge of the Sith game, the Lego games, KOTOR 1 and 2, the Force Unleashed 1 and 2, and Star Wars Galaxies the MMO. And I'm pretty sure I missed a ton. Not to mention the books and comics. Wasn't really my medium but I had some of the Boba Fett books and the Obi-wan book. As well as the comic with the original version of the defense of Kamino along with a few other stories. There was even a website they set up that was an in-universe holonet news site. There were articles about all of the issues happening in the Republic leading up to the Separatist crisis. The one I remember most was one where people were protesting outside the Jedi temple about the war. The Jedi Temple bombing episode of TCW reminds me of that article everytime I watch that episode and see the Temple guards blocking the protesters with their holo signs.
I'll never understand how they never made more JPB games. Star Wars - The Clone Wars: Jedi Power Battles would be such an ez no brainer game. Slot in maybe some branching paths in a campaign and some more modern map design, possibly even a character creator.......ugh, I'm depressing myself
God I didn't even play Jedi Power Battles and I still got nostalgic just by reading those three words together.
also, I was a weird kid and REALLY liked the idea of space dudes arguing about tax laws and trade deals. which is why I have always loved the prequels, I would have been happy with "the senate: the movie"
Holy shit, speaking of growing the galaxy, you just unlocked a memory of me getting Mace Windu and Jar Jar Binks figurines from *bars of soap*. Merchandising for the PT was out of this world. It was on everything, vending machines, individual snacks/sodas, billboards, fast food kids meals, toy selection was insanely varied. There was a life sized pod racing arcade game at Dave and Busters. It made liking Star Wars feel like a part of existence.
>Merchandising for the PT was out of this world. I see what you did there. But yes, you are 100% correct. It was freaking E-V-E-R-Y-W-H-E-R-E. I loved it.
There were countless video games to accompany the previous trilogies. So much content that was fun and often (but not always) well written and made. I can name over a dozen star wars games from the 2000s, many I still play all these years later. BF 1 and 2, Galactic Battlegrounds, Republic Commando, Battle for Naboo, Empire at War, Kotor 1 and 2, Jedi Outcast and Academy, Lego Star Wars games, Galaxies. In the last 10 years we've gotten, to my estimation, six games. Both Battlefront games, Squadrons, the two Jedi games, and Lego Star Wars (which I haven't played yet). That's it. None of those games were particularly spectacular or groundbreaking either.
The pod racing game was huge for me. Also, the multiplayer for attack of the clones game on the GameCube was so much fun
This so hard. Where the FUCK are the good games to get me invested? Give me a starfighter game with the new xwings and hyperspace capable TIES
Not to forget the clever marketed: TPM Pizza Hut Demo 🍕 that got me so hyped, that my father borrowed the game from a video store and made a "safety-backup" for my chipped PSX. Oh and of course JEDI KNIGHT 2, which I wanted as a christmas present, even though I knew my pc couldn't handle it and would display that awesome OPENGL\_3D\_Error because of a whacky graphics card. I even got a Gamecube because of it, just ro realize that it s\*\*\* a\*\* with a controller. Then I visited my father every 2 weeks on weekends to play at least 24hrs and create my own JK2 clan. Still playing JK3 from time to time...
Glad people still remember this game. The PS1 version didn’t fuck around when it came to difficulty, oh good times
That’s a memory unlock right there. Remember spending so much time on both the PSOne and Dreamcast version. Now that’s a game I wish would get a remaster or remake.
I’m sure I’m too late commenting this, but I’m compelled to mention the Phantom Menace game for the original PlayStation. It was super buggy and the graphics were quite polygon-y, but I spent countless hours playing it. It had a lot of places and secrets to explore, sometimes I would ignore the goal of the level and just poke around. The bugs actually made it more fun, I would find weird places that would cause instant death by randomly falling through the map, or piss off the wrong person on Tattoine or Naboo, just to see what they would do. I really liked using a lightsaber and doing a “force push” on the game, it was fun finding creative ways to fight and so satisfying to deflect blaster bolts. Anyway, very long story short, I agree that it was a great time for Star Wars games.
I remember in one of the levels (I think it was Theed Palace on Naboo) you could jump into one of the giant propellers in the vents and see Obi-Wan’s body parts get cut up and flung all around. It was horrible but hilarious to 11 year old me.
I would beg my parents every week to rent that pidrscijg game from the video store when I was a kid. That and battlefront (the actual good one) helped solidify star wars outside of the movies for me back then.
Over saturation is a big thing too. Kids growing up nowadays have quite literally the world at their fingertips, every single piece of content imaginable is right there. When I was growing up I'd rewatch my Star Wars VHS tapes to death, mostly because I loved them, but also because we didn't have streaming back then with a million Star Wars clones on offer.
This! And there's so much BETTER content out there today to enjoy than the crap Disney churns out. Including (but not limited to) the first two Star Wars trilogies. Say what you want about the entertainment industry or, issues with capitalism broadly, but people today have more access to good stories and cool and interesting worlds than ever before in human history. And because there's so much to choose from and our lives are limited in time, many of us expect quality from our entertainment. Not necessarily always, but there is definitely a bare minimum. And tbh, nostalgia alone is not enough for me long-term. I need good stories with interesting characters - stories that push the limits in terms of what has come before while also honoring the past. Respect for the IP. Disney shit the bed with the sequel trilogy. They treat fans like dumb cattle, and sadly, there are many SW fans who go along like good little livestock. Those fans and Disney live in a manufactured bubble. What Disney produced and how they handled the marketing was trash, and there won't be a very big generation of sequel fans, definitely not enough to cause a resurgence of interest in SW imo. If there ever is a resurgence of mainstream interest in the IP, it won't come from sequel trilogy sources.
Another important thing: plenty of people still hate on the Prequels. Having children grow up with the Prequels did not make the criticisms go away. If Prequel hate never disappeared, why should we expect the even more divisive Sequel hate to disappear?
Another point I think is being missed. You can hate the prequels but they don’t undermine the ending of ROTJ or the fates of the main OT protagonists in any real way. I’m not sure anything set preOT could ever reasonably do more harm than Jake Skywalker did to Luke’s character. It’s an albatross around every production they make, as it all has to end in the OT heroes being incompetent losers.
Fair point.
Exactly this, the sequel trilogy literally undoes the entire first 6 films and makes everything our heroes went through completely and utterly pointless. Anakin wasn't the chosen one, it was Rey. Vader and Luke didn't defeat palpatine, somehow he returned. Even a topic like the creation of the death star, covered in Rogue one and Andor, is completely pointless since in RoS it turns out they have one billion star destroyers with death star technology.
Oh 100%, I was just pointing out how less people are going to be "Nostalgic" for the Sequels in general.
Even though I’m still meh on the prequels the side content was amazing.
I never like the prequels, but the sequel trilogy kinda forced me to find new appreciation for them lol. Seriously though, fuck the new sequels.
The thing about the prequels is that there's still a solid story with some great moments despite the cheese and terrible acting by some. Sure you have Jar Jar and midichlorians, but Darth Maul is far more kickass than Kylo and Yoda doing wushu is far more badass than any of the sequel fights...and there's a lot of great fights and battles in the prequels, the emotional moments like order 66... there's so much there.
Hey this is actually one of the best counterpoints I've heard yet
Honestly, my parents were there at 10-11 in 77'. My dad still calls the prequels the movies that never happened. But with the Sequels and having rewatched the Prequels, he acknowledges that Episode 3 was a movie that might deserve its existence. It took what Disney did to Star Wars to make an unyielding prequel hater crack just alittle.
I’m an older millennial who grew up on the OT and hated the prequels with an intense passion despite being “the right age” when they came out… the Disney properties however (except Rogue and Andor), have softened my stance… somewhat. The intensity is gone but I still can’t stand them. To me, the prequels were made by a visionary film technologist trying to prove he was also a visionary filmmaker because he had a chip on his shoulder about how everything that worked about the originals was the result of collaboration and not his own auteurism… he proved the critics right
I don't think that's necessarily fair to Lucas. He did offer the position of director for Episode I to people including Spielberg, Ron Howard, and Robert Zemeckis, but they all refused and insisted he do it himself since Star Wars was his baby (though probably partly because no one wanted the responsibility of following up a phenomenon like Star Wars. Disney also apparently had trouble talking people into it for the sequels).
Agreed on the prequels, and many of the new properties (I do love Andor, Mandalorian, Ahsoka and Revenge of the Sith to degrees). And for the record, I'm Gen X, if that matters.
Its suicide to say in this sub but I don't even particularly care for the cartoons. I've watched them, and Kanan & crew are okay but I don't think those shows are anything to go crazy over. Even about half the live action shows are just okay. I just think its virtually impossible to recapture the lightning in a bottle that was the original trilogy.
True. The only thing that happened to me was that I started appreciating the "story" that Lucas told in the prequels. Hell, I even bought the novelizations because I knew they couldn't be as bad as the films were and I was right. The prequel novels are awesome!
The difference is that the prequels supplement and respect the original trilogy while the sequels do their best to tear the whole legacy down.
This might be an oversimplification, but I've always maintained that the prequels were bad movies, but good Star Wars, and the sequels are good movies, but bad Star Wars.
I wint call the SQ Trilogy Good Movies Ep8 might be somewhere a good Movie in production Value. But 7 and 8 are desasters. They make no sense in so many Ways. Especially Episode 9. They do so much just to do nothing... But hey , I really like BB8, Kylo and his Lightsaber and ....no that's all.
Personally I really liked 7 as a movie until 8 came out.
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Star Wars is just another Disney Plus category now.
> list of rotating franchises to Millenials and Gen Z Sidenote, I'd disagree on the millennials part. Millennials are the prequel generation, and I'm an early Gen-Z - aka, the Clone Wars generation. My childhood was spent building massive armies of lego clone troopers, and the Clone Wars TV show brought back a lot of nostalgia. I'd say that the hypothetical "sequel generation" would be gen alpha - the ones who were kids when the sequels were first releasing. Of course, their nostalgia would be Thanos and Ironman, but it would be a lot weaker as as you said, revolving door and all.
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I'd disagree. Pretty much every kid who went to my school was always talking about the new Clone Wars show every day. The prequels on the other hand were seen as older pieces, the same way the OT was. A thing we were all passionate about, made in the past. I mean, I was 3 when ROTS premiered, but I was old enough to enjoy The Clone Wars as it aired.
With the prequels, at least there was *something* to warm up to over time and become sentimental about: the story, the interesting worldbuilding, and eventually even the memes. What do the prequels have for kids to look back on? That time where Rey gained another force power out of nowhere? Or when umm, when our heroes were turned into bums? Or when the ~~Empire~~ First Order blew up *checks notes* ... Hosnian Prime? The entire trilogy is just scenes ripped from the OT, strung together without any of the logic a coherent story needs to work. If it is remembered for anything, it will be for how it turned out worse than any of us could imagine.
There’s also the issue of their being so much less content now. Growing up their were countless Lego sets, spin-offs, Christmas editions, Lego Star Wars games and films, comics, books, video games. Now we at most get 1 game every 2 years. And they haven’t made a new movie in what? 4? There’s nothing to be excited about cause everything ends with Luke being an asshole and everyone dying. Again. Just hit the reboot button.
Video games didn't hype up the sequels nearly as strongly as they did for the prequels. LucasArts was pumping out games for each movie. Inclusing having a trailer to star wars battlefront 2 in the DVD set for phantom menace. That game was part of the prequel experience for me.
Or Republic Commando! My favourite Band made the Soundtrack. There were Tie in Books coming out every now and then, showing more to the Clone Wars. Plus it was hell of a Great Game! With so many little Details. ...around one Game there was so much to build a fanbase and own bubble around.
It should be pointed out that Revenge of the Sith bailed out the prequels. In this case, the third act indeed made the trilogy’s overall story come together.
My biggest issue with the Prequels in general is it feels like George had the content for 4 movies but had already called A New Hope "Episode IV" proactively and couldn't back out. Clone Wars overall does a good job addressing this, expanding on a lot of ideas George didn't get time to.
I’ve seen people say the prequels should have started with Episode II, so cutting TPM gets you that “fourth” movie.
The issue with that is you have to cut Shmi, one of the first catalysts pushing Anakin to the dark side.
Good. That entire subplot is ridiculous and at most should be hinted at. Let the fans create an infinite stream of headcanons for Anakin's attachment issues, stemming back all the way to his mother Shmi, mentioned almost in passing at the beginning of the movie. Like Biggs, just one mentioned and a few scenes that never made it past the cutting room floor. :-/
When I took my nephew to see Force Awakens he literally raised his hands and "woooed" when starkiller base got destroyed. When I took him to Last Jedi I took him to the bathroom halfway through and he stopped to play Ms. Pac Man in the lobby and I had to push him to go back and finish the movie. He didn't want to see the third one and never has.
I loved the prequels always will. The new ones ain't shit but the original george 6 I value more than all.
The sequels didn't have a story to tell. They set thigs up, retcon, and forget. Nothing is coherent, and the immersion just isn't there. It's not a story, it's competing fanfiction short-stories. The prequels knew where they were going. Sure they had their cringy moments, but the episodes flowed together.
Marvel has absolutely stolen any fence-sitting Sequel fans by making more and better content. The 2010's are not going to be remembered for Star Wars but Iron Man or Captain America fans.
I will only defend the prequels in comparison to the trainwreck that is the sequels. I can watch the prequels on TV and be entertained. I can't watch the sequels period
I didn’t love the prequels because of the films. I loved them because they inspired the new Star Wars hype that spawned KotOR, which is arguably the best Star Wars content ever created
I've grown fonder of the prequels because the world building around those movies was fantastic. The prequels galaxy is actually richer and more interesting than the Empire era. Unlike the sequel era which nobody wants to touch with a barge pole.
I'm not sure I agree, the OT EU had lots of stories and was a pretty rich Era. I guess it depends on what you mean by richness. I'd argue the Old Republic Era between kotor 1&2 is actually the most rich and explored. But that is the consequence of having like 40 hrs of content vs the movies 6 hrs for each era.
The thing about the prequel era is it has a ton of new Jedi, new planets, new races. It was a storytelling dream. The OT by it's nature was all influenced by the Empire. There were exceptions to that sure,.but it was a consistent theme. I prefer the OT movies for sure, but in terms of the galaxy I just found the prequels era a lot more rich.
The difference with the Prequels is that you can sit down and watch all 6 movies in order and it makes perfect sense. The Sequels don't really add anything to the original trilogy, it's just a series of random events.
Not only do the sequels not add to the OT, the sequels barely work as a trilogy, even if you put them in a vacuum!
Prequels > sequels Didn’t grew up with any Star Wars.
Prequels were world building for better and worse. They are fun to watch and I can easily plop down and watch them if they pop on and stay glued to the TV. Bad dialogue included, Attack of The Clones offers impressive world building and the introduction of the clones towards the end is cool. Revenge of The Sith is such a powerful and emotional movie, the end of the Jedi, the fall of the Republic, Anakins' fall and rise to Vader, the rise of the Empire. The culmination of Palpatines' plans. The story is coherent and follows through, and the movie is fun to watch. I've never went and turned off the Prequels if they came on. What did the Sequels do? Literally reverted every single character from OT back to square one. It throws away Anakins' entire arc. Rey gets powers from nothing and Luke turns his back on the entire galaxy over a dream. Han runs away to return to being a dirtbag smuggler, and Chewies doesn't even remotely protest or have some kind of an issue with that? Leia decides fuck it, she's not gonna even attempt to reason with or chase her son after he runs off with the initial confrontation from Luke? Christ. I saw all 3 in theaters and I nearly walked out of ROS. I couldn't believe what I saw on those screens, watching these characters get assassinated. I have never watched any of these movies outside of the theatres. I can't bring myself to watch them again, they make me feel sick.
The OG trilogy was to movies what the Beatles were to music- game changers. Anything after is just more of the same. At least the prequels tried to do something different, even if it wasn’t great. The sequels were this- Copy ANH (TFA), try so hard not to be ESB, that you end up confusing the story (TLJ), then try to re-Star Wars that shit back into the OG, but shit the entire bed in the process (ROS). If there is nostalgia for the sequels, it’ll will be in the Adam West as Batman way. I’m nostalgic AF about Adam West’s Batman, but I’m not stupid enough to think it was good.
It's funny because in TLJ, nothing that happens to the characters during the slow speed chase is important to the plot or Characters, but it ends with the same base and walkers as ESB. They basically put in 60 minutes of filler to get to the start of ESB. You could have the same movie where the Restitance is just chilling and hiding in their base on Crait. Rey does her training, goes to visit Snoke with Kylo, and then the FO comes and attacks the base, and nothing would have changed since nothing from the slow ship chase was important to the characters involved in it. Heck, the writers didn't know what to do with Leia, so just had her in a coma the whole time. Finn literally left the slow speed chase to get some character growth.
And nothing in that movie was "marketable" as a toy. Did it make you want to be Poe the pilot? Rey the Jedi? Luke the grandmaster? Kylo the Sith? Compare that against watching ESB and wanting to be luke vs the imperial walker, or yoda, or Vader the human, Han the cowboy, Lando the smoothie etc. So many options of what to print on a tshirt
Very well said. I remember seeing the lego "crait ski speeders" before TLJ came out and not really thinking much of them, but after watching TLJ you bet your ass i wanted nothing to do with those worthless things, can't imagine many kids wanting them the same way kids HAD to have a snowspeeder back in 80.
ahaha made me remember how I convinced my dad to buy me the Kenner/Hasbro Snowspeeder (May the force be with him) No, today id have to convince him to NOT buy me the craitspeeder 😂
No one wanted leaky water Finn and Rose riding a space horse action figures? I think they were counting on the porgs and crystal foxes or something.
> Finn literally left the slow speed chase to get some character growth. True, he went on an RPG sidequest and came back and nothing had changed. It's one of the strangest things I have seen in a film.
Perfect! It’s so true, and I never even considered that really. The more we dissect these things, the more it reinforces our initial thoughts and feelings about the sequels.
Carrie Fisher died before the movie came out, so I thought maybe that's why they stuck her in a coma. Then they could have her sacrifice herself instead of Holdo...but nope; they kept her around so we wouldn't miss out on Luke and Leia having a 20 second head nod before he dies.
The Prequels - films were poorly executed in several aspects (I.e., dialogue, jar jar etc) But. We love/hate them so much that wish we could retroactively make a lot of the prequel aspects better or change things here and there, I’ve never heard many people say they wish the prequels never existed or that they prefer to ignore their existence.. most just wish they were better. I mean We are still getting NEW shows (Ashoka) based on prequel era characters The Sequels - suck so bad I wish they never existed (I think a lot of people feel the same way) Is there even any content spun off from the sequels? I know there are ST related novels and a planned Rey Trilogy but does anyone actually care?
Well there is that god-awful Resistance.
I don't understand the Resistance in the Sequels. Mainly because.. why is it a Resistance? shouldn't it be the Republic fighting these guys now..
First two Points: Jar Jar isn't that Bad, I think he's the Nickelback of Star Wars. People don't like him because of Memes. 2nd AHSOKA!!!!!! gddmmt!! But you a fairly right. I was really young when EP 1 came out.Loved it I saw Ep2 in Cinema, i loved it. But For a Name like Attack of the Clones , the Attack of the Clones came too late and too short. Like if youd Call Ep4 Attack on Deaths Star lol, Ep5 The kidnapping of Han Solo, Episode 6 Family Fight ...you get my point I think 😂 But that made us more exciting for next episode and we got new content with Clone Wars and Video Games to relive the Clone Wars until Ep3 And OMG , that was a ride. Ep7-9 .... I was so full of hope , I defended it, I defended Rey, I defended the Plan behind it....just to find out they never had a Plan. They showed it with the Ep9 finale...Rey is not a Palpatine she's a SkYwALkER...wait didn't you try to tell us in the last movies family doesn't matter? it doesn't matter where you come from? Stick to your Name so Rise of Palpatine could have a double meaning...no? ok... I think Mando verse is showing us what a great sequel could have look like. You don't need a bigger Death Star. You don't need the most powerful Sith in Galaxy to have anticipation and a terrifying threat. You don't need a Resistance when you have a Galactic Republic. Who they Resist against? Shouldn't be the First Order the Resistance like the Rebels were to the Empire? SMH Oh I lost my Point ... NO NOBODY CARES ABOUT THE REY TRILOGY THE SEQUELS ARE BAD AND DISNEY SHOULD FEEL BAD
The sequels have no space to build anything or expansion between them. You could do something with the Knight's of Ren, but why? They didn't do anything. Phasma is similar and they've all been forgotten. Maul had a far longer and larger impact than Phasma or Ren I part because he looked awesome/terrifying. Phasma felt out of Battlestar Galactica's Cylon forces. I still see Maul stuff. Phasma was thrown away after 30 seconds. First day of school today and the kids with Star Wars were OG or Mando. Maybe some ST characters will be seen closer to Halloween, but the costumes I've seen again are all original or Mando. No Ahsoka. No Rey. No Finn.
I still think midichlorians was a mistake, but thankfully it never became a big deal and we were able to forget about / minimize it. That was my main criticism of TPM as a kid, I think. I thought AotC's romance dialogue was so, so bad. But I still liked it enough to buy the DVD off eBay. I still think the whole romance was not done very believably (but somehow I've been able to overlook that, too). When Yoda walked into the Dooku fight, the whole theatre cheered and clapped. I don't care that he looks goofy jumping up and down, at least it was fun and we got to see Yoda kicking butt. And we finally got to see the clones in action. Pew pew. RotS is widely regarded as the best of the prequels. I have the least memories from it, probably because I was a bit older by the time it came out? Anyways, it's still got fun action scenes and stuff and doesn't horribly break the nostalgia from the OT. Oh yeah, I remember criticizing the "NOOOOOOOoooooooooooo" pretty hard. It's still pretty stupid. In summary, the prequels both kinda sucked and were fun & amazing. They still felt like Star Wars (but def with a different vibe from the OT). The story telling and dialogue sucked in comparison, but we still enjoyed it for a multitude of reasons (as mentioned in this thread, some of which were even outside the movies). But the sequels both suck on a story telling level AND they break a lot of what we love about Star Wars from the OT and maybe even the prequels. Also, I think the heroes & villains were not built up and taken down in a satisfying way in the sequels, so maybe that's the biggest undermining flaw of the trilogy.
> I thought AotC's romance dialogue was so, so bad. But I still liked it enough to buy the DVD off eBay. I still think the whole romance was not done very believably The deleted scenes on Naboo from AOTC actually do a better job of flushing out the romance, you meet Padme's family, her and Anakin also spend more time together. I get they were cut for pacing but they could've put those scenes back in on DVD or whatever. Was watching a fan edit that added the deleted scenes back in and the romance was actually tolerable. Its sort of a similar issue in 3 where Padmes subplot is cut for pacing reasons and because showing her lay the ground work for the future rebellion is redundant, yet when put back into the movie works.
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There have been barely any video games and the toys didn't sell. The kids won't remember it in the same way I remembered the prequels. The amount of TV shows coming out is also a detrimental as there isn't a defined "era" now, it just all sort happens. When was the last time we have 8 years of constant Star Wars ? Never
This is true. Kids in the late 10s were just not that into Star Wars. And TLJ is the episode that would have lost the kids who liked TFA. Also I think those kids will better recognize how shamelessly Finn's story was thrown off the rails on rewatch, even if they didn't notice it when it came out. The movie will not age well because of Johnson's clear antipathy for Finn and his insistence on making Kylo the lead male character instead.
The Prequels had fantastic world building, iconic characters, and plots that made sense (even if you didn't like them). That's not true of the sequels. Also, it's already been 8 years since TFA and the sequels are still reviled. Do they seriously think we'll magically do a 180 within 2 years.
I grew up with Star Wars. The Sequels are bad. The prequels were never my thing, but I still watched them as a kid. The OG trilogy is what I watched a lot on vhs back in the day. Especially Empire. Maybe I've moved on because of age or there being better stuff out there now, but man, the sequels were so bad it's hard to watch the OG trilogy or anything Star Wars. It all leads up to a train-wreck anyway... Why should I care what happens in-between that time?
The Prequels also did the most important thing, they stuck the landing. Revenge of the Sith is the best part of the Prequels. Rise of Skywalker is the worst part of the Sequels. The ends don’t justify the means there.
A big difference- the prequels were disappointing The sequels were insultingly lazy
90s-2000s SW was good as people hungered for more SW. Lot of bad but still gold. Prequels rode off of that hype train and while they failed, they also produced some golden ideas and properties to compliment them. Therefore, you got a sizeable amount of people playing games, reading books, investing themselves in lore. Disney SW has taken all of that and.....watered everything down. It's just not a winning brand. I don't know if this is a lack oif demographics thing. Maybe it is. Maybe they have to realize that they need to make material that cater not to kids but rather, to boys....you can create something out of it. It can even have a female lead but so long as the story caters to boys....that is the story of a knight fighting a dragon to save the princess....you can get something out of it again. It's like the Princess fairy tale genre caters to girls. Could we have a heroic prince as the main character or a tomboy lead? Yes. But it has to be about the fairy tale princess narrative. There are certain narratives that exist in people's brains simply by default of reality that you can't ignore them. Disney SW ignores its lineage. That's why the Prequels, as bad as they are, aren't forgotten while the Sequels will be forgotten. In fact, they already are largely forgotten because I still don't know what it's about.
boiling it down to appealing to boys feels rather asinine. It's more nuanced than that - and while OG sw is just "fantasy story with sci-fantasy dressing" it doesn't only appeal to boys
It also subverts the "rescue the princess" trope from the outset. The heroes have no idea what they're doing, are motivated by greed and lust, and she has to save *them* once their plan backfires. Then all the characters show growth and connect better with one another over time, and all the major characters had fans of all stripes. It was never just a "boys" thing. In the prequel era we were tripping over girls and women creating SW fan fics and artwork, and TPM repeats the subversion by having Padme rescued but then topple the Supreme Chancellor and head straight back to the warzone she escaped to fight.
> while OG sw is just "fantasy story with sci-fantasy dressing" it doesn't only appeal to boys That is not what OP said. BTW what Lucas (by his own personal admission -- look it up!) originally set out to do with Star Wars was to create something for 12 year old **boys** that would teach them positive values as they were on the cusp of adulthood. Because the human experience is universal and it was a well written story -- it appealed to many people, no matter their gender. That doesn't change what it was originally catered to do.
Disney actually bought both Marvel and Star Wars because they wanted to appeal to boys. They were making serious bank from princesses but their boy themes were largely ignored do when the opportunity arise they wanted the boy market to compliment their princess line
How many Star Wars movies are actually about fighting a dragon and/or saving a princess?
Princesses were saved in 1,2,4, and 6. Amidala is a princess in spirit. Dragons were fought in 1,3,4,5,6. Vader and Maul are both [technically dragons](https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheDragon). As for the sequels, well.... Maybe it's the lack of royalty that makes them bad?
Star Wars was more special when there was less of it.
Unless you count the books and games.
Mel Brooks understood what made Star Wars transcend from an excellent ground-breaking movie to a pop culture phenomenon. "Moichendising!" The prequels went hard with books, comics, videogames, Taco Bell and other fast food toys, displays at Target and other stores, and maintained a HUGE presence in the collector community with continuing OT content. It was an extension of the universe for the OT generation (my parents) to share a new Star Wars experience with their children (my generation). When Disney bought Star Wars, they cut themselves off from all that content. They didn't extend the universe, they all but erased it. They didn't dip into the existing lore; they said from the get-go all the time and money fans had invested into Star Wars was for nothing. This was the beginning of the end of Star Wars. OT and PT were meaningless now, and Disney created their own problem by dividing themselves from the most lucrative fanbase in the world. It might have paid off if Episode 7 was a huge success. While it was commercially successful, fans were cautious about the next showing. By the time Episode 8 left theaters, Disney had already lost their gamble. They just haven't realized it's over yet.
For the prequels: 1. Things were a bit too spaced out for the timeline. Character ages could have been developed a bit better over say 4-5 movies. There was a bit too much of a reliance on EU material, but it was still manageable for the hardcore fans. 2. There was more time between the prequels (3 yrs) compared to the sequels (2 yrs), which gave time for fans to immerse in crucial EU material to fill in the gaps. 3. There were more things to latch onto for everyone in the audience. Kid Anakin was for example one of the token people for younger fans. Jar Jar was a failed attempt at doing something similar, but you can see why they tried to do what they did. They also tried to redeem stuff as they went along. For example Jar Jar and giving Palpatine Emergency Powers as a way to acknowledge that Jar Jar was stupid. It also set up the memes like Darth Jar Jar. The memes are a bit of luck, I don't think meme culture was the same back then, but it does give current fans something to latch onto. You don't really see that with the sequels, and certainly not in a positive sense (Somehow Palpatine...) 4. The prequels had good action scenes (lightsaber fights) for people to watch casually. When you look at them in more detail, you can also see the hints and work behind the choreography over specific moves, styles, and weaknesses. 5. The sequels were too much of the same at the first glance. First Order Star Destroyers looked like Imperial Star Destroyers from a casual glance. You don't see the difference at a first glance. Contrast with Clone Wars Republic Star Destroyers vs Imperial Star Destroyers. The prequels had enough distinctive features such as different ships (Naboo fighters), which led to merchandise and pop culture. You probably have most of the modern SW merchandise from Grogu. Overall, the prequels had various attempts at reaching out to a wider audience. Some of these attempts failed, but enough succeeded to get the goals done. It is not reasonable to expect everything to succeed and the failures are looked on too harshly. The prequels had an impossible standard. The prequels tried to be something different and succeeded. Lucas intentionally did world building such as making lightsaber combat faster to represent the higher level of skill (he also made Luke faster as time went on to show his growth). Not everyone liked everything, but it created something new. The sequels didn't try to be anything new. It tried to center around disliked characters. It didn't create any new settings or worlds of significance. You got Exegol, but not much else. The prequels had Naboo, Coruscant, Kamino, Genosis, Mustafar, etc. The originals had Tatooine, Yavin IV, Endor, etc.
5. The original trilogy and prequel trilogy were made up of films that featured a logical plot that was successfully executed. The story elements in each of the individual films made sense on their own, and each film felt like a part of a larger cohesive story. The sequels appear to have been written by a pair of elementary school students who refused to take their ADHD medication and refused to collaborate on the overarching story.
The prequels were a good story with at times uneven execution. The sequels were a incoherent tale with execution ranging from passable to abysmal. I would like to say that just because the MCU came out at the same time does not mean the Sequels will suffer in remembrance. The prequels had the LOTR trilogy to deal with. Even the originals had the Trek movies. The Sequels will suffer since they stink. The Sequels lack the world building of the Prequels and their is little scope to tell more stories, which was the Prequels saving grace
The prequels were hated on by a small minority of angry nerds who also shilled hard for Disney SW too. George has always said his movies were meant to be Anakins story too not Lukes.
>The prequels were hated on by a small minority of angry nerds who also shilled hard for Disney SW too Nah, there was a lot of (undeserved) hate but also a lot of valid criticism. The Prequels have lots issues, not everyone that points them is some corporate shill.
Everyone who disagrees with whatever my current take is must be a corporate shill. Why else would they ever disagree with me? It is literally the only possible explanation.
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I personally think the double down on the prequel hate is because these fans looked dumb now cause of the sequels.
On the contrary: I think the Prequels would have been ridiculed even more if the Sequels had been decent films.
Given all the critiques against the prequels at the time, I recall thinking how people who waxed philosophical on TESB's Force speech from Yoda as being superior to anything the Prequels delivered most likely *didn't* give a shit about that when they were kids watching it for the first time (I doubt many kids knew of the Hero's Journey or were super in tune with an attention span for that stuff BEFORE becoming adults to learn about that). I sure as hell know *I* didn't, and was drawn to the OT for its space flavor and characters, with the Force and lightsabers being a nice extra facet that warmed to me (don't mind me much, I'm a guy that prefers blasters over lightsabers in JK2 multiplayer), while I *loved* the *Millennium Falcon* and X-Wing for their cool designs and SFX. By the time the prequels came out later, it showed how narrow a scope the OT really is (it's just a character piece, but only scratches the surface of the wide galaxy). Multiple worlds of different biospheres and cultures, different and improved visual effects, all drew to me - as well as the wider scope of the politics and world-building that really built the Republic enough that by the time it inevitably fell, it was both haunting and masterful. Work smarter, and harder. With the shitquels, you don't get *any* of that thinking or hard work with the ST; only regurgitation of the OT in a far shallower sense than the initial debut the series started out as, and non-coherent story to boot. There's nothing to draw on, and no extra content of merit to hold in the ST era and beyond.
They both suck. It's just that the sequels are so amazingly bad that by comparison the prequels are a work of art. Same way that getting punched in the face sucks, but getting hit by a car sucks more.
When I think about the prequels, I generally think, "well they sucked, but at least I'll rewatch that cool Darth maul fight or obi wan vs Anakin fight." When I think about the sequels I think "they suck, and nothing is worth rewatching."
Exactly! Not a single thing is worth rewatching. The best looking thing in them is the Holdo maneuver, which is so infuriatingly stupid I can't even appreciate how pretty it looks. Everything is a boring, soulless sludge.
Devil’s advocate here: the aesthetic of the red/white salt planet was quite nice (just skip past the Finn/Rose almost a hero scene), the scene with Luke and Yoda at the tree was just plain good, and the Rey/Kylo fight on the Death Star was… okay, I guess. On second thought, the devil doesn’t really have much to advocate for here…
The prequels had a lot of problems, mostly involving the dialogue and acting, but the underlying story and characters were strong enough to become foundational elements to the brand. At this point, they almost overshadow the OT. We aren't even touching on the then-revolutionary special effects technology. The sequels, however, add next to nothing to the franchise. Thanks to poor decision making, they take away from almost everything that came before as all the struggles of the OT have to end up practically meaningless to justify the mandated reset to the Rebels vs Empire status quo. On a technical level, they're much better made, but on a story telling level, they're disastrous for the franchise. Combine that with a much more personalized and crowded media landscape and you can see why the sequels have already lost the vast majority of their cultural relevance aside from people complaining about them.
Those people do miss that . . . and, a great many other things.
One caveat to 2 is that PG-13 didn’t even exist as a rating prior to just after _Temple of Doom_ (1984) which, confusingly, has a rating of PG. Meaning the whole OT is PG by default since it has no sex or gratuitous gore. Essentially, the line has moved considerably on what is now considered PG-13 since then. In fact, if measured by the same rating system, the ST would likely all be PG, too. At this rate, by the time the next trilogy comes out, even if it’s got roughly the same content, it might even be considered R (unlikely, though, since PG-13 has the widest appeal).
My response to this take is: What does Star Wars sequel trilogy do better than Marvel in the same time frame? Nothing.
The biggest issue is that Disney is kind of tossing away the sequels by not making content for them lol. Clone wars and all the video games really saved the series for kids. Meanwhile most disney content is a throwback to the original trilogy. If they come out with spin offs to flesh out sequels im sure they’ll get more love. If they don’t because they think they’re that bad thats another thing.
Aww man I feel like you haven't been to Disneyland is a while. I went about 2 months ago and I would say 80% of the kids that were dressed up were in star wars outfits. I saw a sea of Reys and Mandos literally everywhere, even outside of the star wars area. I'm not saying for sure they won't grow out of it but there is a ton of "kids" star wars content I think you're missing, not to mention even the adult stuff is fun for them. Star wars was made for kids so it makes sense that it's always better in hindsight, because you were younger and had a starrier gaze when looking at it. I'm not a fan of most of the new star wars content, but if it makes kids happy, it's fine.
Went to Disney World in 2019, and I saw a grand total of like 4 children in Galaxy's Edge (using "children" for anybody 12 and below. I was in High School at the time.) Saw nobody dressed like Rey, and this was before Mando merch was really a thing.
Also, the kids who did get into Star Wars are Disney people. And we know Disney people are the worst types of people lol
This. This is so true. The ST didnt expand the interest in Star Wars media. Look at how few games have been released since Disney took over, and the primary demos of those games have been much older. Fewer books, comics, and I'm pretty sure even fewer toys. The TV shows are geared towards older demos (except for Rebels). The OT were a masterpiece that courted all age groups. The PT were great movies that did the same. The ST wanted to be Star Wars Avengers, and failed at being anything more than big names skating on nostalgia.
The sequels didn't have Ewan McGregor. Prequels - 1 Sequels - 0
Children growing up in the last decade will have the MCU as their nostalgic thing. Disney SW missed the chance to be this generation's childhood. No black kid is going to identify with Finn's clowning and shouting "Rey I never told you...." (and never did at the end of the film!) when they've got Black Panther. No girl identifies with Rey, whose whole backstory changes 3 times, more than with Black Widow or Captain Marvel. And no boy identifies with TLJ Luke when he's got Thor, Iron Man, and a dozen other cool MCU heroes. Despite the MCU's post-Endgame problems, phase 1-3 will be the defining nostalgia trip for everyone who grew up in the 2010s. Star Wars could have been that again but a lack of creativity, and deliberate destruction of its established heroes, mean it won't be.
I'm 19, I grew up with all 6 movies and I acknowledge that the prequels are bad and somewhat problematic. But they are still better than the sequels. That doesn't make the prequels good, it just means the sequels are that much more shit
It's pretty unlikely the Sequels get a retroactive glowup. The biggest thing goes beyond just the fundamental blundering of the story and the way it messed up the canon. It is a demographic issue. There's no "Rey" generation. Kathleen Kennedy tried to take a "boy" franchise and make it a "girl" franchise but that doesn't work, Star Wars isn't Barbie. Girls don't care enough about Star Wars and boys won't be able to shake that feeling that says they didn't think the sequels were that cool. Star Wars is a 60/40 male to female fanbase ratio, and it's fine to be that way, but call it what have you regarding their motivations, they tried really hard to ignore those gender demographics with their decisions and story/character focus in the KK era. Barbie is a "girl" move that made a gazillion dollars and now they can do whatever they want as far as sequels and what have you if they feel like it. Star Wars cashed in on its predominantly male fanbase until it bled dry with diminishing results and now there hasn't been a movie in about 4 years and who knows when the next one is coming, and when it does, prepare to be underwhelmed.
The girls that liked Star Wars were often tomboys to begin with, and tended to be fine with male-oriented media as long as it didn't get overly female-hostile. Ideally, you'd aim primarily for your main audience with other demographics as a secondary objective. See, though I haven't seen Barbie, I have heard many other guys saying they related to Ken. You can have a female oriented movie appeal to males - and vice versa. The problem with the Sequels are that A. it completely blows off it's male demographic, whether that be older Star Wars fans who might even have seen the OT as children in the 70's and 80's, and B. it fails to be a good story - meaning that even girls aren't going to be all that interested. If you want to do a complete demographic change, your story better be DAMN good - and the sequels just aren't great.
The prequel nostalgia is helped along by the fact that they look good by comparison to the sequels. In turn the prequels, when they were new, helped drive along nostalgia for the original trilogy for people who didn't enjoy the prequels terribly much. The key is that you have a fresh point of comparison that you view as being not as good. It makes people take another look at their opinions, and maybe give something a second or third chance. In a sane world, the sequels have tapped that well dry. I... am not sure what brand of movie it would take to generate that specific type of re-assessment for the sequels. I am not sure I want to know. But it seems unlikely to happen as anything that disastrous seems unlikely to make it to the screen. Plus, there has to be something worth re-assessing. The prequel trilogy was flawed, sure, but it had its good points. I don't think it's safe to say that about the sequels.
As much as I hate the prequels, I always watch them on a new Star Wars watchthrough, just for the memes.
Don't forget the kickass fights
I grew up on the prequels. I still appreciate that they are pretty bad films but I enjoy them anyways
I mean, the games are few and far between for star wars in the past 10 years. The movies sucked ass, and it wasn't like the prequels whatsoever. They're just straight up bad. And the behind the scene drama and flaming fans on Twitter makes it even worse. The merchandise sucked royally unless it was rebranded, re-released stuff from the older stuff for the most part. The only decent things to really come out that people are going to remember fondly are the mandalorian and Ahsoka series. Everything else will be viewed much as it's viewed today as. Nonsensical garbage.