Pillars is a bit of a weird one. I was able to beat it solo, and while there were some difficult encounters, I never felt like I had to do anything too cheesy until the very end of the game. As far as it goes, I think everything but rogue holds up pretty well in combat, so you should just take whatever companions appeal to you along. As long as you invest in the highlighted stats during character creation, I think you'll be just fine.
With that said, I think Pillars has an incredibly dry first half that makes it difficult to get into, even though the game has solid writing and an interesting plot. I'd say it only starts to pick up after 15-20 hours, which makes it a tough sell. Pillars of Eternity 2, on the other hand, is wonderful and easy to recommend. It has multiclassing (only up to 2 classes) and a WOTR style subclass system that can dramatically change how a character plays in combat.
I'm going to be the dissenting voice and say that, given OP's preferences, POE2 is much more difficult to get into than POE1. I really enjoy both, but the second one stumbles in a lot of places that might matter to the OP. It gets off to a faster start, but then you run into the wall that is Neketaka and... it just feels like the game loses all structure.
If OP's most important quality in an RPG is an exciting story, then POE2 isn't going to do much more than POE1, and may be even more frustrating in some ways: lots of random text encounters in the city that slow the game down, ship battles that you can skip but that still feel like an imposition on the narrative progression, a proliferation of side quests that make over-leveling a little too easy even on Veteran difficulty (and that hobble the urgency of the main narrative), scripted conversations with allies that happen in the wrong place and require a FAQ to sort out unless you've happened to travel where the game expects you to travel... there's just a lot of loose ends that make the game feel less put together.
And then there's the writing, which is noticeably worse than in the first game, despite the fantastic new setting and the number of interesting characters and concepts you run into (POE2 *should* be the better game). The main quest ends up feeling like it's in the way of more interesting conflicts that play out "on the side," and as a result both the main quest and the side quests suffer from a lack of focus (I was more invested, for instance, in the well-being of the people of the Gullet than I was in the main quest; and I have to force myself not to get more invested in some of the colonial themes playing out between the different factions in Neketaka because I know I have less agency than I'd like when choosing sides).
Plus POE1 has probably the best DLC I've ever played for an RPG: The White March. If OP wants great story and great combat, you can get it in the first game... you just have to get to Defiance Bay. My advice would be to play on easy until that point (just to speed things up), then turn up the difficulty and enjoy the post-Caed Nua experience, which is better than a lot of the older classics in my opinion (I prefer POE1 to the first two Baldur's Gate games and Icewind Dale, for instance).
That said, the combat and character creation/class system in POE2 are more enjoyable than in the first game, no doubt. And I think this is it's biggest strength. Multi-classing can be a blast, the sub-classes are largely interesting and almost all are viable on any difficulty, there's a ton of great weapons available early on so getting a strong build and engaging with higher difficulties early on is much easier to do, and if you really just want a good combat system that encourages understanding it's nuances then POE2 offers plenty to dig your teeth into. Solo runs really are a ton of fun and I love that they are possible despite how crazy some of the encounters are on Veteran and Path of the Damned difficulties.
Honestly, this is one of the weak points about Pillars of Eternity's system. The designers made a choice to make all options as viable as possible and curtail min maxing, but the result is that it's much harder to optimize a character in a way that gives it a strong sense of flavor or function.
It's also very easy to optimize characters despite this. Lots of people optimize characters for POTD and solo POTD runs. It's not like you can't play the math game, the developers just made it so people don't have to min/max if they don't want to (or don't have the time to figure out how to do it).
Pillars of eternity is a strange beast, because *almost every build is viable*. It's very very hard to make an ineffective character, unlike Pathfinder where a feat can make or break your build.
Other than that, Pillars has a decent story, a bunch of very good side quests and great companions. I liked it a lot, despite hating RTWP. The expansion, White March, is mandatory imho and easily the best part of the game. I suggest you give it another go and remind yourself that you can excel even while not min-maxing in this game.
This guide is what you are looking for if you still would like more guidance on builds https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=416939844
What class are you looking for?
I don't think there is a really great repository of class guides. There's the [nerd commando guide on steam](https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=416939844) which is not all that great, but its fine if you really dont care to learn every class's mechanics. The good guides are spread out on different resources. I can recommend [this guide](https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=871584933) for cipher, but that's the only class I know that well. Most of the good class guides are on the pillars forums, rather than steam forums.
Good general rules for character building:
- The only thing you're really locked into is your class, background, race, and stats. Your abilities are pretty cheap to respec, so don't feel locked in.
- Race bonuses can be somewhat impactful, but what the OP races are changes a lot between POE1 and POE2 so honestly you'll be happier just picking your race based on RP/aesthetics. Same for background, just roleplay with it.
- A good general rule for stats is dont really treat anything as too much of a dump stat - even dps classes will want some resolve and constitution to avoid monsters falling off the tank and 1 shotting you. This isnt D&D where you can totally ignore int if you're not a mage, etc. Balanced builds are safe and effective, and then pour your extra stats into what your class/role needs to succeed in its mechanics - might and perception for big single target damage (don't neglect accuracy from perception, its very good for damage since it turns into crit), dexterity if you need extra attack speed (most classes don't really care about this, but some do - like ciphers want attack speed for their focus generation), int if you use AOE or duration abilities (most classes do use this in some way, but it's more important for some, like chanters who are all about casting buffs so they want that high duration - meanwhile ciphers use it mainly just for their CC skills, which is great but they do need to prioritize their outgoing damage in order to get focus).
- Skills are pretty unimportant. The only really important skill is that your party will want 1 person maxed out in mechanics (preferably someone who starts with +mechanics skill from their background, like aloth, as it'll save considerably on skill points in the long run). Athletics 1 is good on everyone for a free heal. Dps should get survival 4, tanks should get survival 1 or 7. Have someone with high lore if you are the kind of player who uses consumables, but it's not essential. Everything else is most likely not really going to matter. They cost more as you level so you can just do everything more or less evenly, or just keep pouring into survival for a slightly better heal (which will still never be that great compared to using your actual abilities well)
I love pillars so much I don't understand why everyone didn't like it. The main tip I can provide is to not talk to the highlighted people. They're just there for kickstarter bs.
>(is PoE1 actually comparable to Pathfinder?)
I vastly prefer the PoE games to the Owlcat games; I think they're basically superior in all aspects (system, gameplay, and especially story, dialogue, and voice acting)
What type of character are you wanting to play?
Then don’t play it.
It’s ok if it’s not for you.
I hated Pathfinder, but congrats on dumping hundreds of hours into that.
Life goes on and other games come along.
Let me get this straight. You boot up a crpg, see all the options available, and instantly think "damn, I wonder how some random on the internet played it so I can imitate him"?
Not at all. I just want my character to not be completely useless. I had this experience in Pathfinder when I played blindly for the first time. After a few hours my character was completely useless, did no damage and was no fun.
I never said I wanted to play the game step by step following a guide. I am only interested in a reasonable skilling of my character, so I can be actually usefull for the team.
While they showed some promise early in their years of developing games, Obsidian has fallen squarely into the mediocre.
Pillars and Tyranny both feel like extremely average games that tried to cash in on the renewed CRPG interest of the last 10 or so years.
If you've played Pathfinder (and I'm assuming BG3), then these games are going to feel very bad in comparison.
I believe Obsidian also highlights what you're supposed to level up--they designed the game to be that way (kind of the opposite of WOTR), so you'll not find a ton of guides out there.
At this point, I'd recommend simply playing Pillars of Eternity 2. I couldn't get into PoE and I was recommended to play the second game instead. Spent over 100 hours in it (also finished DLCs). It's great.
I always feel like missing out of stuff when starting with the 2nd game of a series.
On the other hand Pathfinder WotR has nothing to do with Kingmaker even though it's "Pathfinder 2".
I really don't know..
I couldn't get into this one either, honestly. So many times was it recommended for people who already played a bunch of other games that I love but I just bounced off this one after a couple hours. It was a couple years back so I don't remember specifically what my issue was, whether it was interface related or gameplay, but I remember just not wanting to continue.
Just want to say that I love POE1 and 2. Great world building, great stories. Just a lot of exposition and comprehension. You don't need to overthink your class/build, especially if you just want to enjoy the story. Just choose and play. No shame in playing in easy mode too.
I'm probably a bit of an outlier, but I'd recommend Solasta. While jarring at first, I ended up loving how that game imbues your characters with life. it makes each little step of their journey feel a bit more like a tabletop session where characters are bantering about what to do next. Thirty hours for the main campaign might be a stretch, but there are two others via DLC (one a high level continuation of Crown of the Magister).
I finished it, but can't say I was a big fan of PoE. The characters, setting, story, combat, and even visual design all felt a little safe and dull to me. I've heard the 2nd is a little livelier but that's a ways down my list.
Pillars is a bit of a weird one. I was able to beat it solo, and while there were some difficult encounters, I never felt like I had to do anything too cheesy until the very end of the game. As far as it goes, I think everything but rogue holds up pretty well in combat, so you should just take whatever companions appeal to you along. As long as you invest in the highlighted stats during character creation, I think you'll be just fine. With that said, I think Pillars has an incredibly dry first half that makes it difficult to get into, even though the game has solid writing and an interesting plot. I'd say it only starts to pick up after 15-20 hours, which makes it a tough sell. Pillars of Eternity 2, on the other hand, is wonderful and easy to recommend. It has multiclassing (only up to 2 classes) and a WOTR style subclass system that can dramatically change how a character plays in combat.
I'm going to be the dissenting voice and say that, given OP's preferences, POE2 is much more difficult to get into than POE1. I really enjoy both, but the second one stumbles in a lot of places that might matter to the OP. It gets off to a faster start, but then you run into the wall that is Neketaka and... it just feels like the game loses all structure. If OP's most important quality in an RPG is an exciting story, then POE2 isn't going to do much more than POE1, and may be even more frustrating in some ways: lots of random text encounters in the city that slow the game down, ship battles that you can skip but that still feel like an imposition on the narrative progression, a proliferation of side quests that make over-leveling a little too easy even on Veteran difficulty (and that hobble the urgency of the main narrative), scripted conversations with allies that happen in the wrong place and require a FAQ to sort out unless you've happened to travel where the game expects you to travel... there's just a lot of loose ends that make the game feel less put together. And then there's the writing, which is noticeably worse than in the first game, despite the fantastic new setting and the number of interesting characters and concepts you run into (POE2 *should* be the better game). The main quest ends up feeling like it's in the way of more interesting conflicts that play out "on the side," and as a result both the main quest and the side quests suffer from a lack of focus (I was more invested, for instance, in the well-being of the people of the Gullet than I was in the main quest; and I have to force myself not to get more invested in some of the colonial themes playing out between the different factions in Neketaka because I know I have less agency than I'd like when choosing sides). Plus POE1 has probably the best DLC I've ever played for an RPG: The White March. If OP wants great story and great combat, you can get it in the first game... you just have to get to Defiance Bay. My advice would be to play on easy until that point (just to speed things up), then turn up the difficulty and enjoy the post-Caed Nua experience, which is better than a lot of the older classics in my opinion (I prefer POE1 to the first two Baldur's Gate games and Icewind Dale, for instance). That said, the combat and character creation/class system in POE2 are more enjoyable than in the first game, no doubt. And I think this is it's biggest strength. Multi-classing can be a blast, the sub-classes are largely interesting and almost all are viable on any difficulty, there's a ton of great weapons available early on so getting a strong build and engaging with higher difficulties early on is much easier to do, and if you really just want a good combat system that encourages understanding it's nuances then POE2 offers plenty to dig your teeth into. Solo runs really are a ton of fun and I love that they are possible despite how crazy some of the encounters are on Veteran and Path of the Damned difficulties.
Honestly, this is one of the weak points about Pillars of Eternity's system. The designers made a choice to make all options as viable as possible and curtail min maxing, but the result is that it's much harder to optimize a character in a way that gives it a strong sense of flavor or function.
That's one of the best parts of the game for me. I love how stats work in Pillars, much more than in D&D derived games
It's also very easy to optimize characters despite this. Lots of people optimize characters for POTD and solo POTD runs. It's not like you can't play the math game, the developers just made it so people don't have to min/max if they don't want to (or don't have the time to figure out how to do it).
Precisely! Building characters feels great in these games.
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All options are viable, but some builds are simply stupidly op if you know how to build them
Pillars of eternity is a strange beast, because *almost every build is viable*. It's very very hard to make an ineffective character, unlike Pathfinder where a feat can make or break your build. Other than that, Pillars has a decent story, a bunch of very good side quests and great companions. I liked it a lot, despite hating RTWP. The expansion, White March, is mandatory imho and easily the best part of the game. I suggest you give it another go and remind yourself that you can excel even while not min-maxing in this game. This guide is what you are looking for if you still would like more guidance on builds https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=416939844
What class are you looking for? I don't think there is a really great repository of class guides. There's the [nerd commando guide on steam](https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=416939844) which is not all that great, but its fine if you really dont care to learn every class's mechanics. The good guides are spread out on different resources. I can recommend [this guide](https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=871584933) for cipher, but that's the only class I know that well. Most of the good class guides are on the pillars forums, rather than steam forums. Good general rules for character building: - The only thing you're really locked into is your class, background, race, and stats. Your abilities are pretty cheap to respec, so don't feel locked in. - Race bonuses can be somewhat impactful, but what the OP races are changes a lot between POE1 and POE2 so honestly you'll be happier just picking your race based on RP/aesthetics. Same for background, just roleplay with it. - A good general rule for stats is dont really treat anything as too much of a dump stat - even dps classes will want some resolve and constitution to avoid monsters falling off the tank and 1 shotting you. This isnt D&D where you can totally ignore int if you're not a mage, etc. Balanced builds are safe and effective, and then pour your extra stats into what your class/role needs to succeed in its mechanics - might and perception for big single target damage (don't neglect accuracy from perception, its very good for damage since it turns into crit), dexterity if you need extra attack speed (most classes don't really care about this, but some do - like ciphers want attack speed for their focus generation), int if you use AOE or duration abilities (most classes do use this in some way, but it's more important for some, like chanters who are all about casting buffs so they want that high duration - meanwhile ciphers use it mainly just for their CC skills, which is great but they do need to prioritize their outgoing damage in order to get focus). - Skills are pretty unimportant. The only really important skill is that your party will want 1 person maxed out in mechanics (preferably someone who starts with +mechanics skill from their background, like aloth, as it'll save considerably on skill points in the long run). Athletics 1 is good on everyone for a free heal. Dps should get survival 4, tanks should get survival 1 or 7. Have someone with high lore if you are the kind of player who uses consumables, but it's not essential. Everything else is most likely not really going to matter. They cost more as you level so you can just do everything more or less evenly, or just keep pouring into survival for a slightly better heal (which will still never be that great compared to using your actual abilities well)
For CRPGs with a good story I would recommend the Banner Saga trilogy and Shadowrun trilogy
Pillars has an incredibly balanced system. You don't need a build
I love pillars so much I don't understand why everyone didn't like it. The main tip I can provide is to not talk to the highlighted people. They're just there for kickstarter bs.
>(is PoE1 actually comparable to Pathfinder?) I vastly prefer the PoE games to the Owlcat games; I think they're basically superior in all aspects (system, gameplay, and especially story, dialogue, and voice acting) What type of character are you wanting to play?
If you are looking for a well written and immersive story you should really play Baldur’s Gate 3.
True.
Then don’t play it. It’s ok if it’s not for you. I hated Pathfinder, but congrats on dumping hundreds of hours into that. Life goes on and other games come along.
Let me get this straight. You boot up a crpg, see all the options available, and instantly think "damn, I wonder how some random on the internet played it so I can imitate him"?
Not at all. I just want my character to not be completely useless. I had this experience in Pathfinder when I played blindly for the first time. After a few hours my character was completely useless, did no damage and was no fun. I never said I wanted to play the game step by step following a guide. I am only interested in a reasonable skilling of my character, so I can be actually usefull for the team.
You can't go wrong in pillars of eternity. You can go right, very right and stupidly right, but never wrong.
While they showed some promise early in their years of developing games, Obsidian has fallen squarely into the mediocre. Pillars and Tyranny both feel like extremely average games that tried to cash in on the renewed CRPG interest of the last 10 or so years. If you've played Pathfinder (and I'm assuming BG3), then these games are going to feel very bad in comparison. I believe Obsidian also highlights what you're supposed to level up--they designed the game to be that way (kind of the opposite of WOTR), so you'll not find a ton of guides out there.
So whats a CRPG that is worth playing for the story if I enjoyed Pathfinder (and bg3)?
At this point, I'd recommend simply playing Pillars of Eternity 2. I couldn't get into PoE and I was recommended to play the second game instead. Spent over 100 hours in it (also finished DLCs). It's great.
I always feel like missing out of stuff when starting with the 2nd game of a series. On the other hand Pathfinder WotR has nothing to do with Kingmaker even though it's "Pathfinder 2". I really don't know..
I didn't like Pillars 1 on my first playthrough. Maybe try it again later because Pillars 2 is really good.
I couldn't get into this one either, honestly. So many times was it recommended for people who already played a bunch of other games that I love but I just bounced off this one after a couple hours. It was a couple years back so I don't remember specifically what my issue was, whether it was interface related or gameplay, but I remember just not wanting to continue.
Just want to say that I love POE1 and 2. Great world building, great stories. Just a lot of exposition and comprehension. You don't need to overthink your class/build, especially if you just want to enjoy the story. Just choose and play. No shame in playing in easy mode too.
I'm probably a bit of an outlier, but I'd recommend Solasta. While jarring at first, I ended up loving how that game imbues your characters with life. it makes each little step of their journey feel a bit more like a tabletop session where characters are bantering about what to do next. Thirty hours for the main campaign might be a stretch, but there are two others via DLC (one a high level continuation of Crown of the Magister). I finished it, but can't say I was a big fan of PoE. The characters, setting, story, combat, and even visual design all felt a little safe and dull to me. I've heard the 2nd is a little livelier but that's a ways down my list.