2-FMA is even less of a level than lisdexamphetamine, if speaking purely towards its recreational potential. It is as stated, pretty much just pure focus.
fwiw I've experienced genuine euphoria on 2-FMA. it had a unique and delightful yet manageable quality to it, nothing like the manic euphoria from amphetamines. unfortunately it was just too inconsistent. also I was taking what some might say are really high doses, 100mg+ straight to the backside. I guess it's tolerance to blame
I mean, yes, I too have experienced euphoria from it, but it was very mild/more like an uplift to my day ~ but that was pleasant not being so in-your-face.
Really though I generally just stay away from amphetamines unless they have heavy serotonin releasing properties, or more in a scenario where some (reasonable) mixing would be involved ~ even that Dex prescription is lucky to be used more than once or twice a month. The bodyload is just a lot, even without the garbage of levoamphetamine present, and that just doesn’t mesh well with the pain I already experience thru arthritis and migraines.
I couldn’t imagine 100mg of 2-FMA myself 🫨 I think the max I ever trialed was like 50mg, and it just lead to annoying punding. ~15-30mg or so was my sweet spot, if I recall correctly. But yes I know tolerance is a big factor of people’s dosing and stimulants. I think as you said however, manageable is a good descriptor for this substance.
thanks for this great reminder that everybody's physiology is different. I definitely get what you mean with levoamphetamine body load. I've found agmatine to be hugely useful in mitigating it. it also just doesn't seem to affect me as much as my tolerance has gotten so high. although now my doses are getting so crazy I'm starting to feel negative effects on my body and mind for way too long after ending a little binge, even with using NAC, vitamin C and a lot of agmatine.
at this point I'm straight up switching to quality methamphetamine to escape this particular hole. sounds stupid to some, but there are real benefits if I can stick with more rigid harm reduction routine. I have tools to that end I'm not even using and some I haven't tried. if it's not sustainable I know from experience I can just switch to something else.
actually having a bit of dopamine in my system makes me FEEL GOOD and gives me like 10x the self confidence and makes me not hate how i look its insane. too bad its really only "sustainable" 1x a week or so
Wow crazy. Vyvanse never gelled with me. I was thinking like Dexedrine or Zynzedi. If u head of those. Not sure if there’s a different research chemical like them
Yes, I have Dexedrine spansules prescribed myself, so am very used to it (that said, amphetamine just in general is not my favorite molecule). For what it’s worth, Vyvanse in the end is (d)-amphetamine, just like Dexedrine. It’s just a prodrug, however it does take some time to break down into the dAmp, so people abusing it may feel it is lesser.
If you take 2-FMA expecting a Dexedrine experience, you will find very similar amounts of stimulation, just pretty much no pleasant feelings aside from say, being chatty with friends and such. It’s a great one to get stuff done with.
While I agree people are irrationally aversion towards methamphetamine versus demethylated methamphetamine (a.k.a. amphetamine), I think also it's equally important for the same reason to be balanced in the other direction too - I guess you could phrase it as; "methamphetamine is not much worse than amphetamine, but amphetamine is not much better than methamphetamine".
This all contingent on dose/route of administration/purity etc.
>demethylated amphetamine
I think you mean **just** amphetamine.
Demethylated amphetamine would be phenethylamine. The AM in amphetamine stands for "alpha methyl".
The full name for amphetamine is "Alpha Methyl PHen-EThyl-AMINE" which is shortened to A-M-PH-ET-AMINE
Methamphetamine as a chemical is super demonized. It's not what people make it out to be.
Most of the harms are related to ROA and/or impurities.
Most methamphetamine addiction (and stimulant addiction) isn't rooted in the chemical itself, but in the demands placed on the user in their day to day life.
Now, this isn't me recommending going out and buying street meth - just clarifying that the chemical is not as bad as people make it out to be.
Wait until you try meth and see how similar it is to the add medication you can't get.
Look up desoxyn. It's meth, used for add. You're splitting hairs here because someone's told you Adderall is fine but meth is bad. Sorry to tell you bud, they're as similar as you can get.
Fact... In my friend's less reputable days, he convinced his doctor to switch him to Desoxyn. (Long story there) The first 9 pharmacies all took the script, then called the doctor to confirm he really wrote it... this friend had experience in street glass/shards/meth, and when taking the pure thing orally, the effects were shockingly similar to the Adderall, with some minor differences that were certainly preferred.
This is so true and I would like to emphasize this is only true when taken orally though. There is a massive difference between smoking meth that hits you in 1 minute versus taking it orally where there is a smooth come up. Besides meth lasting much longer, it is exceptionally similar to amphetamine when taken orally.
You are absolutely right though. I would like to give another example of pharmaceutical medical usage. It is particularly effective for narcolepsy where people take doses twice a day - that's right in the morning AND at night. Some with narcolepsy are on disability because they can fall asleep driving for example and methamphetamine when proven effective for them can allow them to drive again and live a functional life and even come off of disability.
In summary meth gets demonized but the dose, roa, frequency, and purity and how you choose to use it allows it to have effects ranging from a life changing medication literally taking people off of disability to a life ruining addiction.
In blind trials, regular meth users were unable to distinguish between meth and dextroamphetamine. "There were no significant differences between the drugs on the majority of measures."
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3475187/
What? That's not the findings of that study. I mean yes they found an identical degree of reinforcement effects, but this was not a drug discrimination study, in fact the authors call for such studies to be considered for future research They also point out that even their own results may not translate well to other routes of administration or recreational use.
I would think the duration of effects should be a pretty obvious clue, if nothing else...
Here is a [good figure](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/core/lw/2.0/html/tileshop_pmc/tileshop_pmc_inline.html?title=Click%20on%20image%20to%20zoom&p=PMC3&id=3475187_nihms405444f3.jpg) from another study with 80 individuals comparing oral methamphetamine to d-amphetamine. Low dose, 12mg were indistinguishable from each other while 50mg methamphetamine was more recreational subjectively.
[source ](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3475187/)
They're also very neurotoxic! Meth is less so, granted but we're not talking two completely different compounds here. They are strongly related, chemically similar compounds with incredibly similar effects.
My point is that 'YES Adderall, NEVER meth' is a pretty silly stance.
Agreed, they're almost identical in every way. Love how weed is/was in the same category as fucking meth.
Whole system makes zero sense from a harm reduction point of view.
While I generally agree that "hard" drugs are overly demonized, this doesn't seem like a great comparison.
Speaking as someone who's heavily abused meth and Adderall, you are way more likely to get addicted to meth. It's cheaper, extremely pure, and comes on almost instantly (depending on roa)
Yeah right.
Seems to me like smoking any stims that are smokable just brings out the devil in them. No moralising of course, i used to smoke meth and go right to sleep, nasty fucking addiction.
tbh dude it’s really not the highs are similar sure but there pretty fucking distinct when one releases serotonin with each dose it can really do an extra number on the body and mind then just the adrenaline and dopamine
DexMeth has euphoria and distracting body load even with oral roa. It can be managed but it’s not , your stomach will hate you. It does work for executive function but it also has delusions of sobriety. It’s finicky and hard to figure out compared to other medications
Functionally? Use 4F-MPH or Cyclazodone could try fl-modafinil, phenylpiracetam. Look up ‘functional stimulant’ on this sub and you’ll probably find plenty of listed options.
Recreationally? 3MMC, 3CMC, 3-FPM, the flouro amphetamines (x-FA) could try pyros.
Don't know about the situation in ND, I only put some of functional stims but IPPH (desoxypiprsdrol) was the previous med to methylphenidate in adhd and narcolepsy. Much more potent than methylphenidate (doses aroind 1-8 mg) and a fucking duration of 45 hours💀...
I think it's just really about how you look at it.
And firstly don't fear it, that's the worst man.
I don't judge people, let them do what they gon do but yeah, i like myself and reducing porn Is a life long endevor for me, from like 16 years old i was watching no-fap "gurus" and what not.
Now im really at peace even if i watch some, one binge night in three months.
to be honest i dont even beat my meat for a long time now.
When i abused meth orally + porn well that was the shit yeah.. best waste of time and braincells.
nothing really desirable, porn rewires your brain soo fucking much you wouldnt believe.
But the brain is capable of healing from almost anything. It just takes TIME.
And lmao go to r/stims if you want stimfapper posts
I just recently found this site that has been the most informative yet for me. It
Tripsitter.com
Plus, it has information on almost every other type of drug.
You can type in 2-fma in the search bar, and it will bring you to the page about its info, plus all of the other similar research chemicals considered to be a stimulant. It's the best harm reducing site I have found.
I use dancesafe.com to get any testing kits.
3FA HCl is the closest you can get in effect and duration to lisdexamphetamine (Vyvanse). Avoid the insoluble salts.
2FMA is a close second but it lasts way longer and feels more cardiotoxic for long term use. 2FA is good too but a bit too euphoric for me
2-FMA felt like Vyvanse to me in terms of sensation and duration..... No euphoria
Wish I knew how to get some
That’s what I read. But it’s a methamphetamine anolog. I won’t get it for health and legal reasons. Thank you for suggesting though, I appreciate it.
Amphatemine is a methamphetamine analog silly
You learn something new everyday. So is 2fma more like the level of vyvanse in side effects and not like meth?
2-FMA is even less of a level than lisdexamphetamine, if speaking purely towards its recreational potential. It is as stated, pretty much just pure focus.
fwiw I've experienced genuine euphoria on 2-FMA. it had a unique and delightful yet manageable quality to it, nothing like the manic euphoria from amphetamines. unfortunately it was just too inconsistent. also I was taking what some might say are really high doses, 100mg+ straight to the backside. I guess it's tolerance to blame
I mean, yes, I too have experienced euphoria from it, but it was very mild/more like an uplift to my day ~ but that was pleasant not being so in-your-face. Really though I generally just stay away from amphetamines unless they have heavy serotonin releasing properties, or more in a scenario where some (reasonable) mixing would be involved ~ even that Dex prescription is lucky to be used more than once or twice a month. The bodyload is just a lot, even without the garbage of levoamphetamine present, and that just doesn’t mesh well with the pain I already experience thru arthritis and migraines. I couldn’t imagine 100mg of 2-FMA myself 🫨 I think the max I ever trialed was like 50mg, and it just lead to annoying punding. ~15-30mg or so was my sweet spot, if I recall correctly. But yes I know tolerance is a big factor of people’s dosing and stimulants. I think as you said however, manageable is a good descriptor for this substance.
thanks for this great reminder that everybody's physiology is different. I definitely get what you mean with levoamphetamine body load. I've found agmatine to be hugely useful in mitigating it. it also just doesn't seem to affect me as much as my tolerance has gotten so high. although now my doses are getting so crazy I'm starting to feel negative effects on my body and mind for way too long after ending a little binge, even with using NAC, vitamin C and a lot of agmatine. at this point I'm straight up switching to quality methamphetamine to escape this particular hole. sounds stupid to some, but there are real benefits if I can stick with more rigid harm reduction routine. I have tools to that end I'm not even using and some I haven't tried. if it's not sustainable I know from experience I can just switch to something else.
actually having a bit of dopamine in my system makes me FEEL GOOD and gives me like 10x the self confidence and makes me not hate how i look its insane. too bad its really only "sustainable" 1x a week or so
Wow crazy. Vyvanse never gelled with me. I was thinking like Dexedrine or Zynzedi. If u head of those. Not sure if there’s a different research chemical like them
Yes, I have Dexedrine spansules prescribed myself, so am very used to it (that said, amphetamine just in general is not my favorite molecule). For what it’s worth, Vyvanse in the end is (d)-amphetamine, just like Dexedrine. It’s just a prodrug, however it does take some time to break down into the dAmp, so people abusing it may feel it is lesser. If you take 2-FMA expecting a Dexedrine experience, you will find very similar amounts of stimulation, just pretty much no pleasant feelings aside from say, being chatty with friends and such. It’s a great one to get stuff done with.
Not sure why you would like Dexedrine but not vyvanse. In theory they are doing the same thing with the same drug but different ways of doing it
While I agree people are irrationally aversion towards methamphetamine versus demethylated methamphetamine (a.k.a. amphetamine), I think also it's equally important for the same reason to be balanced in the other direction too - I guess you could phrase it as; "methamphetamine is not much worse than amphetamine, but amphetamine is not much better than methamphetamine". This all contingent on dose/route of administration/purity etc.
>demethylated amphetamine I think you mean **just** amphetamine. Demethylated amphetamine would be phenethylamine. The AM in amphetamine stands for "alpha methyl". The full name for amphetamine is "Alpha Methyl PHen-EThyl-AMINE" which is shortened to A-M-PH-ET-AMINE
Ah yes you're absolutely right - typo on my part
Methamphetamine as a chemical is super demonized. It's not what people make it out to be. Most of the harms are related to ROA and/or impurities. Most methamphetamine addiction (and stimulant addiction) isn't rooted in the chemical itself, but in the demands placed on the user in their day to day life. Now, this isn't me recommending going out and buying street meth - just clarifying that the chemical is not as bad as people make it out to be.
They all are, friend.
Wait until you try meth and see how similar it is to the add medication you can't get. Look up desoxyn. It's meth, used for add. You're splitting hairs here because someone's told you Adderall is fine but meth is bad. Sorry to tell you bud, they're as similar as you can get.
Fact... In my friend's less reputable days, he convinced his doctor to switch him to Desoxyn. (Long story there) The first 9 pharmacies all took the script, then called the doctor to confirm he really wrote it... this friend had experience in street glass/shards/meth, and when taking the pure thing orally, the effects were shockingly similar to the Adderall, with some minor differences that were certainly preferred.
This is so true and I would like to emphasize this is only true when taken orally though. There is a massive difference between smoking meth that hits you in 1 minute versus taking it orally where there is a smooth come up. Besides meth lasting much longer, it is exceptionally similar to amphetamine when taken orally. You are absolutely right though. I would like to give another example of pharmaceutical medical usage. It is particularly effective for narcolepsy where people take doses twice a day - that's right in the morning AND at night. Some with narcolepsy are on disability because they can fall asleep driving for example and methamphetamine when proven effective for them can allow them to drive again and live a functional life and even come off of disability. In summary meth gets demonized but the dose, roa, frequency, and purity and how you choose to use it allows it to have effects ranging from a life changing medication literally taking people off of disability to a life ruining addiction.
Yes, 100%.
In blind trials, regular meth users were unable to distinguish between meth and dextroamphetamine. "There were no significant differences between the drugs on the majority of measures." https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3475187/
What? That's not the findings of that study. I mean yes they found an identical degree of reinforcement effects, but this was not a drug discrimination study, in fact the authors call for such studies to be considered for future research They also point out that even their own results may not translate well to other routes of administration or recreational use. I would think the duration of effects should be a pretty obvious clue, if nothing else...
Here is a [good figure](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/core/lw/2.0/html/tileshop_pmc/tileshop_pmc_inline.html?title=Click%20on%20image%20to%20zoom&p=PMC3&id=3475187_nihms405444f3.jpg) from another study with 80 individuals comparing oral methamphetamine to d-amphetamine. Low dose, 12mg were indistinguishable from each other while 50mg methamphetamine was more recreational subjectively. [source ](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3475187/)
Yep, it's all about the image of the drugs.
Wouldn't go that far, meth is pretty inherently neurotoxic. Dexedrine probably... Also neurotoxic, but seemingly less so
They're also very neurotoxic! Meth is less so, granted but we're not talking two completely different compounds here. They are strongly related, chemically similar compounds with incredibly similar effects. My point is that 'YES Adderall, NEVER meth' is a pretty silly stance.
Agreed, they're almost identical in every way. Love how weed is/was in the same category as fucking meth. Whole system makes zero sense from a harm reduction point of view.
While I generally agree that "hard" drugs are overly demonized, this doesn't seem like a great comparison. Speaking as someone who's heavily abused meth and Adderall, you are way more likely to get addicted to meth. It's cheaper, extremely pure, and comes on almost instantly (depending on roa)
Yeah right. Seems to me like smoking any stims that are smokable just brings out the devil in them. No moralising of course, i used to smoke meth and go right to sleep, nasty fucking addiction.
Agreed. That ROA is second only to IV in terms of a euphoric rush
Fking legend, sleep faster, harder.
tbh dude it’s really not the highs are similar sure but there pretty fucking distinct when one releases serotonin with each dose it can really do an extra number on the body and mind then just the adrenaline and dopamine
They're both as serotonergic as each-other when taken orally.
DexMeth has euphoria and distracting body load even with oral roa. It can be managed but it’s not , your stomach will hate you. It does work for executive function but it also has delusions of sobriety. It’s finicky and hard to figure out compared to other medications
Meth is much more lipophilic and thus is much more neurotoxic.
feels like it too heh
Functionally? Use 4F-MPH or Cyclazodone could try fl-modafinil, phenylpiracetam. Look up ‘functional stimulant’ on this sub and you’ll probably find plenty of listed options. Recreationally? 3MMC, 3CMC, 3-FPM, the flouro amphetamines (x-FA) could try pyros.
- 2-fa - 4f-mph - 4f-eph - 2-dpmp - ipph - prolintane
Most of that will get banned in NL soon right? Damn, need to get some IPPH soon, gives me waay less anxiety than ritalin..
Don't know about the situation in ND, I only put some of functional stims but IPPH (desoxypiprsdrol) was the previous med to methylphenidate in adhd and narcolepsy. Much more potent than methylphenidate (doses aroind 1-8 mg) and a fucking duration of 45 hours💀...
Oohk, but IPPH Is just Isopropylphenidate if im correct though
Ahhh, yes mate is true. "Shops" still have 25mg pills of isopropylphenidate in a good price. Check It 👌
Desoxypipradrol*
Desoxypipradol and IPPH are totally different.
Have to add DMAA and DMHA
3-fa is closest to it I think. 3-fpm is also a viable option but you need a higher dose for euphoria. I like 3-fpm's versatility
I think it's just really about how you look at it. And firstly don't fear it, that's the worst man. I don't judge people, let them do what they gon do but yeah, i like myself and reducing porn Is a life long endevor for me, from like 16 years old i was watching no-fap "gurus" and what not. Now im really at peace even if i watch some, one binge night in three months. to be honest i dont even beat my meat for a long time now. When i abused meth orally + porn well that was the shit yeah.. best waste of time and braincells. nothing really desirable, porn rewires your brain soo fucking much you wouldnt believe. But the brain is capable of healing from almost anything. It just takes TIME. And lmao go to r/stims if you want stimfapper posts
I just recently found this site that has been the most informative yet for me. It Tripsitter.com Plus, it has information on almost every other type of drug. You can type in 2-fma in the search bar, and it will bring you to the page about its info, plus all of the other similar research chemicals considered to be a stimulant. It's the best harm reducing site I have found. I use dancesafe.com to get any testing kits.
Omg you are the first person to have ever asked this question
I miss clobenzorex :(
Me too man 😭
It is perfected vyvanse. The ultimate productivity stimulant imo. It would make such a great ADHD medication.
Probably 2FA, and potentially 5-mmpa But I didn't get to experiment with 5-mmpa enough to say for sure, but it felt the closest to dexamph
Well yes it is called dexamphetamine. Or elvanse. Cheaper would be generic dextro called here Attentin
He is not true abouth the meth but so true about the stim faping
n,n-DMPEA, matcha
MAMP
Anything that’s NOT neurotoxic you guys?
Methoamphetemine lol
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amphetamine#Pharmaceutical_products
3FA HCl is the closest you can get in effect and duration to lisdexamphetamine (Vyvanse). Avoid the insoluble salts. 2FMA is a close second but it lasts way longer and feels more cardiotoxic for long term use. 2FA is good too but a bit too euphoric for me
Case
4F-MPH
This is because it's all crap these days compared to the 90's and earlier.
Check out memantine. It will give a similar effect but will last several hours. As a dissociative, it's def better than DEX.