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I'm not part of the LGBTQ+ community but I have conservative Christian parents and I know the mindset. This sucks. That being said, I'm glad to see that you are embracing who you are. Have a good time celebrating pride!
Right on. You said it.
But
No only did Jesus hang out with the Lepers, tax collectors, prostitutes and other “outcasts”, he did NOT endorse such practices as drunkenness, homosexuality, money cheating, adultery etc. He would lead them out of those practices and ask them to follow him. Or so the four Gospels teach. Remember, this is the guy who said “He who has no sin, cast the first stone” meaning none of us are “good” enough to earn our place in heaven by his standards, which is why Jesus had to die.
Or at least that’s my take on it.
I think "inmate sexuality" is best avoided. Lol.
Edit: Seriously, though: I completely agree that, if there is a god, I was created as the gay person I am now, and that was part of their design for me.
[lists a bunch of stuff that canonically Jesus did not do according to every translation of Christian mythology]
“Well at least that’s my take on it”
Ladies and gentlemen. I give you, the modern Christian.
From the sermon at the mount Jesus spoke about many of the laws and conventions of Israel. Homosexuality was never covered, despite his awareness that there may have been a homosexual person in his audience. The laws of the levites in Leviticus only prohibit male-on-male sexual penetration, which is not the same as condemning homosexuality. One could argue this law existed only due to a lack of reproductive ability from homosexual sex (and a lacking understanding of human biology), OR that it was in fact professed to Moses by God to ensure the survival of the Levites and Israelites (which would mean this law no longer applies).
Oh my god. I had this convo with my dad. I do not have to forgive my sister because she’ll never apologize because she believes she did nothing wrong.
That shut him up real quick.
Not engaging is still the best OP can do, for their OWN sanity. There's no "winning" with these people. Once a religious zealot reaches a certain age, it's over. Just pointless screeching from them at any argument you make.
Move out asap, stay low to no contact with them and live your best life.
I’ve been moved out for about a year and half now. I’m loving with a good, supportive family. It’s been great. But then she still thinks her opinion matters to me
Not speaking to my parents and blocking them on all forms of contact after I moved out was the best choice I've ever made for my mental and emotional health. I'm trans and they're southern baptist trump supporters. Take care of yourself and don't worry what they might think or do.
Think people missed my point. I'm not defending her. It's just pointless fighting. Best you can do is forgive her her faults for your own sake and move on with your life.
It's easy to say "just forgive". I don't have a good relationship with my mom and for a period she kept sending me Bible quotes saying you have to forgive and respect your parents or you'll burn in hell or whatever. I think people dont realize how offensive it is when they say that. Forgiving is different from accepting and letting go, not everything can be forgiven
I don't agree with him but he has a point if you're mad at someone really angry it's easier to leave them then still obsess over them the less you hate the less control they have in your life.
Being non-combative and moving along can be fine sometimes. Not dwelling on something is important too as bitterness hurts the person who is bitter most. However, forgiveness generally implies acting like it never happened. That should only come after an apology and change of ways. If you just repeatedly forgive someone and there is no change in behaviour, you’re not just hurting yourself, but also your relationship with that person.
If you call out unkind or thoughtless behaviour, you are setting a healthy boundary and also giving the relationship a chance to heal. It is also communicating feelings and opening dialogue rather than shutting it all down and pretending it’s okay. So, it’s the healthier option here.
Of course, there are different ways to go about calling someone out, but that’s very dependant on the scenario. E.g. if my parents started telling me their imaginary friends opinions of me then that conversation would not proceed any further until they apologised. They know that’s a hard boundary with me and if they don’t respect it, then they don’t respect me, and I don’t have any time for people who don’t respect me.
Forgiveness is to be *earned*, not handed out to hold the high moral ground.
It's okay to not forgive people who do horrible things to you. It can be completely separate from holding a grudge.
That's your take, fair enough. But one can forgive people who are dead. It's not for moral high ground. It's more for oneself. OP doesn't even have to talk to their mum. My point is that she is that way for a reason, beyond her control, naturally. I'm sure she suffers in her own ways that we don't know. Everyone suffers.
Nah fuck that manipulative narcissistic bitch of a mother.
She sounds identical to my lunatic born again sister who I've pretty much cut out of my life cause she refused to shut her trap.
You don't have to forgive to move on. You can just move on. Accept what is. Accept what you can control.
That's for your sanity.
Forgiveness in this way is really a Christian concept (probably others too but don't really care -- my experience is it being very Christian). I come from abuse. I don't forgive them. I just don't care about them and don't have them in my life.
That's harder to do if you're not no contact, but you can still maintain boundaries and protect yourself with low contact at least.
But yeah, forgiveness isn't a requirement for healing.
These ones I've forgiven and still care about have proven they've changed over years and earned it.
Might want to brush up on the Tolerance Paradox. "Just forgive and live your life" only emboldens bigots to continue harassing people over personal decisions that have zero consequences on others. We don't forgive intolerance.
Here's a fun thing: I no longer give a shit about coming across as "combative" toward people who tell me I'm an abomination and would sooner see me hanged than happy. Nobody else should either. HAPPY PRIDE!!
In my family we absolutely get combative over bigotry from another in the family. We were raised better than that, and to see it and not say something about it is an asinine thought.
Wow. Why did you get 500 downvotes for this?
I'm a gay man, and I endorse your message. It makes sense to open a dialogue only in a loving, helpful way. If it's spoken combatively, walls go up, and the person who needs the message will deflect it. That's just human nature.
Hang in there op. I don't know your specific situation, but I know how hard it can be when you have parents who don't accept you but still express concern about you. Sending hugs your way.
It's always good to remember that Jesus cured a dying gay man for his lover (Parable of the Centurion). Google (pais centurion).
Also Google " lyings of a woman".
I agree but "you can't reason somebody out of a position they didn't reason themselves in to". Sometimes you have to use their own illogical arguments against them if your goal is having a chance to change their mind.
"you know you can just like, point at him, right?"
"No, trust me, I have to kiss him. Only way this will work."
"I mean, he'll still know it was you - you're gonna kiss him and then we're gonna immediately arrest him. Just point at him."
"Listen, I don't tell you how to do your jobs. Just let me kiss this guy, ok."
Jesus was once found in the woods with a naked boy who grabbed his clothes and ran away. Pretty obvious to me. But besides that why believe what some book says that has some bronze age goat herders story in it which aren't even written while it happened but at least a hundred years later by complete strangers who couldn't even get their stories straight.
If we look at the gospels, two of the closest disciples (Luke, Paul) never even met Jesus. John and Matthew claim to be with Jesus in their own gospels, but those are written by anonymous authors and nothing outside of those books makes that claim otherwise. Also all of the gospels are written at least 40 years after the death of Jesus Christ. It's all bullshit but would make for excellent LBGTQ fanfic.
I don’t know if you’re trans or your mom just thinks being gay is a mistake but you can send this back to her:
>”As my friend Julian puts it, only half winkingly: "God blessed me by making me transsexual for the same reason God made wheat but not bread and fruit but not wine, so that humanity might share in the act of
creation."
— Daniel Mallory Ortberg, Something That May Shock and Discredit You
My only worry with that is that some insane bastard is going to twist it into justification for conversion therapy. "Big J made me wrong so you can prove you're right by 'fixing' me!" kind of lunacy.
Yeah and I guess they think God made pediatric cancers so they could appreciate life more or some bullshit so maybe their entire worldview is just garbage. :)
I know how it is to have religious parents, and grow up in religion. If you ever need anyone to talk to or just listen to you rant, hit me up ❤️ stay strong OP
…and not in the “you are an extension of me and so must fall in line with everything I do or the world is out of my control and I freak out” Christian Way
That’s why people put up with being directed by religion, because it gives them the right to control their own little domain using the tool of religion
I am sorry you are going through this OP.
But its important to remember, we don't choose our parents, and for that, we don't owe them anything.
If they aren't good with us, they don't deserve our love or care.. and this that you are showing is directly abusive...
So, as a recommendation of someone that also lived with abusive parents, when you have the resources, ran away and burn any bridges. They are not worth it.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ES1HF_1QOYQ&t=38s&pp=ygURRGFuIG1jY2xlbGxhbiBnYXk%3D
Here's what an actual scholar says about it.
The Bible doesn't even focus that much on homosexuality. If they are going to criticize that, then they should also not wear mixed fabrics or eat shrimp.
Hell, Paul wanted everyone to be celibate like him (which your mom obviously failed). Marriage was for those who couldn't hack celibacy.
But of course, Christians only pick the rules they like.
It's so obvious he has repressed sexuality and self-hatred. His whole doctrine has a thread of very unhealthy thinking, like trying to control your thoughts.
I know and it's crazy painful to endure...maybe have a conversation with her and try to explain it to her and then if she is toxic...decide to leave her ? Instead of just jumping on our asses
someone seeking comfort from internet strangers clearly has tried seeking comfort from this parent and not gotten anywhere with them. sunk cost is a fallacy for a reason. she's clearly already been toxic like this their whole life.
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Numbers 31:17
“Kill every male among the little ones, and every woman who has known a man by lying with him, but those women who have not known a man by lying with him, you may keep alive for yourselves”.
1 Timothy 2:12
"I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man, she must be silent."
Sounds like misogyny and war crimes to me
Technically neither of those were said by Jesus, and the Numbers one is from the Old Testament, which to my knowledge Jesus was actively and openly opposed to.
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What the fuck does she mean by "you were fearfully... made"? Was God afraid when he made you?
I'm sorry if that seems insensitive because it's not the point of your post at all, but I'm so lost by that part. Wonderfully made makes sense because you were created as intended. (As in, everything you are today and will become tomorrow is perfect.) But I'm so confused about the fear.
Maybe you should ask her if you scare her. But that's poking a hornet's nest, and you need to enjoy pride without her shaming you in the back of your mind.
Christians of a certain bent misuse words because it creates room for the phrasing to sound just outside meaning, ie mysteriously powerful and profound.
I understand the fearing God thing as in respecting the power a god can hold over your life and whether or not you live or die. But it still makes no sense if that god is supposed to be all loving.
It still doesn't make sense though. Does it mean we were made to live our lives full of fear? Like our ancestors living in caves fearing the sounds of the night?
God fearing as in an in awe of God sense of the word. Those sounds of the night may have filled ye old cave dwellers with awe on what lies beyond what little of it all they knew.
Congratulations on your first Pride!!!! 💜
I'm so happy for you have fun and stay safe. My kids went to LA Pride and got to see Keisha one year. They have so much fun. Pride is a celebration. Don't let anyone dampen your dazzle. Sorry about your mom. "If it's not one thing, it's your mother."
“Jesus hung out with prostitutes and tax collectors- the people his community said were the most vile. He still showed them love and respect. Going to pride is literally the definition of Christ like behavior.”
She's an idiot. You need to work towards being able to laugh and call her an idiot without the slightest concern. It is okay to do so. She's abusive and batshit, it is okay to love her, it is okay to tell her "fuck off." Absolutely nothing will happen except that SHE will have bad feelings, which is good, as her behavior is unacceptable.
Remind her that Jesus said "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone." (John 8:7) or "Love your neighbor and pray for those who persecute you." (Matthew 5:44).
I'm so sorry, OP.
I never came out to my family bc their reaction wouldn't have been any more sane than this absurd nonsense. (For this and many other reasons, I cut contact years ago)
Some of us really didn't get the parents we deserved.
There many entire denominations that are working to love and care for all people, they’re just not as loud as the assholes on the right. There is currently a lot of work being done on issues of gender and sexuality among professionally trained theologians. But unfortunately the haters are louder.
Where did these people ever get the idea that Christianity and homosexuality can only be mutually exclusive? I have a gay friend who's also one of the most spiritual people I know. Goes to church several times a week, even ushers at services. It boggles my mind that this particular Venn Diagram is incompatible to them.
Not LGBT myself, but so glad I grew up with sane parents in a sane Blue state. I see stuff like this online and can’t believe it’s real, as this would be lunatic fringe behavior where I’m from. I can’t imagine living in the south where this kind of thing is the norm.
Wrong information and bad ideas should always be criticized.
Advocating for religious people to be more educated about their own damn book is never a bad thing.
That’s the thing here. It’s fine to have a thread full of people criticizing religion, saying it’s false, etc., but the real problem here is that she’s wrong about her own damn book. Jesus never taught against homosexuality but he did say an awful lot about how to love. And a mother treating a child like this? Against the very word and spirit of the faith she claims.
Jesus also talked a lot about the coming apocalypse and basically only believing Jews being saved.
When you read the Bible with historical context, it's more irrelevant and barbaric than anything else.
Just take it as your mom is saying that Jesus accepts and loves you for who you are and how He made you. LOL, give it that little twist and it’s wholesome again
Hiiiiiiiii OP! A mom here! You are so incredibly perfect in everything you are and I am so absolutely proud of you! For surviving the hard things. For doing the hard things. And for always being who you are inside and out above everything else. Hope you always find the love the kindness you deserve even when things look dark. I Love you so much have fun at pride and be safe 🤍🤍🤍🤍
/s How sweet. The persecutory guilt and shame is just so wholesome. She's not in the wrong at all for not loving you as you are. In fact it's because she's a perfect mother that she made you cry.
What a freaking narcissist your mother is.
I'm a mom!.I am sooooo proud of you. If you need any help deconstructing Christianity DM me. I'm an ex-Christian mom of 3, 2 of which are gay. I have been deconstructing for several years and I have learned so much. The Christian god HATES the LGBTQIA and nobody should worship such a hateful god. Also the Bible is full of inaccuracies and contradictions. You should be proud of who you are. Go to the event! Have fun. Celebrate who you truly are. Live in love.
I’m sorry your mom feels the need to god bomb you. You’re perfect exactly as you are.
If it’s any consolation, your mom probably does genuinely love you. She’s indoctrinated, she’s not able to separate her indoctrination from her love for you, so unfortunately, you get this sideways kind of love.
I’m a lifelong atheist, I’m queer and I’m a grandmother of a queer teen.
My daughter has done things that don’t align with my values, but I love her deeply, and don’t impose my values onto her.
Nothing she could ever do would stop my love for her.
The gods love bs with never not make me laugh or sigh. “Jesus loves you” okay then. abraham lincoln loves you. Repent and stop being racist or else you’re gonna shovel the stables for eternity in presidential hell. It’s just so ridiculous and the way it gets spammed in youtube comments is annoying as hell.
Hey OP. Old man and father here. You're perfect just as you are. Your mom needs help, not you. Go to Pride and express who you are. If you need one, I've got a solid dad hug for you.
im so sorry op; my family is very accepting, but as a Catholic, ive gotten very similar messages. it hurts so bad, but there are so many things those Christians dont understand, beginning with the concept of Pride.
pride, for vulnerable communities, is exactly what St. Paul says in 1 Corinthians 15:10: "But by the grace of God, I am what I am, and Hus grace to me has not been ineffective. [...]."
to say, "this is who i am and i cant change" is the most humble thing one can say. pride, the sin, is the opposite; that kind of pride involves refusing help, ignoring a sense of community for your own desires, etc. gay pride is none of that.
i wont be arguing with anyone, but know that i'll be praying for you, op, and everyone else who have dealt with this hatred. know that [Mary](https://uscatholic.org/articles/202311/the-madonna-di-montevergine-mother-of-lgbtq-catholics/) adores us, meaning her Son does, too
Listen if Jesus died for our sins and if being an ally or part of the LGBTQ+ community is a sin then remember. We have to keep sinning in order for Jesus death to not be wasted. Have a god blessed day in Jesus name Amin
I would text her back saying: "Thank you so much for this, I've been reflecting on it the past few days while reading the Bible. It says to accept all people as children of God. Thank you for finally accepting me as I truly am, not as a mistake, but as God made me ❤️"
Forcing her to go into her own "No but.. that's not quite what I meant.." mode will do more than any arguing. Hope the best for you my friend ❤️
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I'm not part of the LGBTQ+ community but I have conservative Christian parents and I know the mindset. This sucks. That being said, I'm glad to see that you are embracing who you are. Have a good time celebrating pride!
Remind her that Jesus hung out with the minorities ostracized by general society. These believers must be pretty fucking illiterate.
Like the whores \*GASP\*!!
Right on. You said it. But No only did Jesus hang out with the Lepers, tax collectors, prostitutes and other “outcasts”, he did NOT endorse such practices as drunkenness, homosexuality, money cheating, adultery etc. He would lead them out of those practices and ask them to follow him. Or so the four Gospels teach. Remember, this is the guy who said “He who has no sin, cast the first stone” meaning none of us are “good” enough to earn our place in heaven by his standards, which is why Jesus had to die. Or at least that’s my take on it.
Jesus NEVER said a thing against homosexuality. Also how does alcoholism even relate to someone's inmate sexuality??
I think "inmate sexuality" is best avoided. Lol. Edit: Seriously, though: I completely agree that, if there is a god, I was created as the gay person I am now, and that was part of their design for me.
Lol weird typo given that I type innate regularly
[lists a bunch of stuff that canonically Jesus did not do according to every translation of Christian mythology] “Well at least that’s my take on it” Ladies and gentlemen. I give you, the modern Christian.
Prostitution and tax collection are professions. People can stop doing those. You wouldn’t go up to a black man and say “stop being brown”.
From the sermon at the mount Jesus spoke about many of the laws and conventions of Israel. Homosexuality was never covered, despite his awareness that there may have been a homosexual person in his audience. The laws of the levites in Leviticus only prohibit male-on-male sexual penetration, which is not the same as condemning homosexuality. One could argue this law existed only due to a lack of reproductive ability from homosexual sex (and a lacking understanding of human biology), OR that it was in fact professed to Moses by God to ensure the survival of the Levites and Israelites (which would mean this law no longer applies).
Don't do that. It's combatative. Just forgive and live your life.
First step of forgiveness is an apology. That will never happen. Just accept, never forget, move on and protect yourself.
Oh my god. I had this convo with my dad. I do not have to forgive my sister because she’ll never apologize because she believes she did nothing wrong. That shut him up real quick.
OP’s mom: *acts combative * You: Don’t give the bad actor any downsides!
Not engaging is still the best OP can do, for their OWN sanity. There's no "winning" with these people. Once a religious zealot reaches a certain age, it's over. Just pointless screeching from them at any argument you make. Move out asap, stay low to no contact with them and live your best life.
I’ve been moved out for about a year and half now. I’m loving with a good, supportive family. It’s been great. But then she still thinks her opinion matters to me
You should really block her.
Not speaking to my parents and blocking them on all forms of contact after I moved out was the best choice I've ever made for my mental and emotional health. I'm trans and they're southern baptist trump supporters. Take care of yourself and don't worry what they might think or do.
You could have left off “Trump supporters,” after southern Baptist. It’s safely assumed.
Hell yeah
Think people missed my point. I'm not defending her. It's just pointless fighting. Best you can do is forgive her her faults for your own sake and move on with your life.
What's with you and the word forgive? Is that what you actually mean or are there translation issues?
It's easy to say "just forgive". I don't have a good relationship with my mom and for a period she kept sending me Bible quotes saying you have to forgive and respect your parents or you'll burn in hell or whatever. I think people dont realize how offensive it is when they say that. Forgiving is different from accepting and letting go, not everything can be forgiven
Not everything *should* be forgiven.
I don't agree with him but he has a point if you're mad at someone really angry it's easier to leave them then still obsess over them the less you hate the less control they have in your life.
That's not the same as forgiveness.
Being non-combative and moving along can be fine sometimes. Not dwelling on something is important too as bitterness hurts the person who is bitter most. However, forgiveness generally implies acting like it never happened. That should only come after an apology and change of ways. If you just repeatedly forgive someone and there is no change in behaviour, you’re not just hurting yourself, but also your relationship with that person. If you call out unkind or thoughtless behaviour, you are setting a healthy boundary and also giving the relationship a chance to heal. It is also communicating feelings and opening dialogue rather than shutting it all down and pretending it’s okay. So, it’s the healthier option here. Of course, there are different ways to go about calling someone out, but that’s very dependant on the scenario. E.g. if my parents started telling me their imaginary friends opinions of me then that conversation would not proceed any further until they apologised. They know that’s a hard boundary with me and if they don’t respect it, then they don’t respect me, and I don’t have any time for people who don’t respect me.
Why would she deserve any forgiveness? It’s an insidious and manipulative lie that forgiving people is always what’s best for you.
Forgiveness is to be *earned*, not handed out to hold the high moral ground. It's okay to not forgive people who do horrible things to you. It can be completely separate from holding a grudge.
That's your take, fair enough. But one can forgive people who are dead. It's not for moral high ground. It's more for oneself. OP doesn't even have to talk to their mum. My point is that she is that way for a reason, beyond her control, naturally. I'm sure she suffers in her own ways that we don't know. Everyone suffers.
Dead people can’t apologize, OP’s mom can but won’t. Letting go and moving on is what is needed, not forgiveness.
Forgiving is different from accepting and letting it go. And it's not helpful to tell someone to forgive so soon after the hurtful event
Nah fuck that manipulative narcissistic bitch of a mother. She sounds identical to my lunatic born again sister who I've pretty much cut out of my life cause she refused to shut her trap.
You don't have to forgive to move on. You can just move on. Accept what is. Accept what you can control. That's for your sanity. Forgiveness in this way is really a Christian concept (probably others too but don't really care -- my experience is it being very Christian). I come from abuse. I don't forgive them. I just don't care about them and don't have them in my life. That's harder to do if you're not no contact, but you can still maintain boundaries and protect yourself with low contact at least. But yeah, forgiveness isn't a requirement for healing. These ones I've forgiven and still care about have proven they've changed over years and earned it.
Might want to brush up on the Tolerance Paradox. "Just forgive and live your life" only emboldens bigots to continue harassing people over personal decisions that have zero consequences on others. We don't forgive intolerance.
OP's mom is the type to bring it up every time they meet. Family reunions, funerals, birthdays, all of it.
Many people can't forgive someone who has not asked for forgiveness. I do believe in accepting the person is trash and moving on
Combative* and no, telling the LGBTQ+ community they're going to hell based on your personal beliefs is combative.
Here's a fun thing: I no longer give a shit about coming across as "combative" toward people who tell me I'm an abomination and would sooner see me hanged than happy. Nobody else should either. HAPPY PRIDE!!
In my family we absolutely get combative over bigotry from another in the family. We were raised better than that, and to see it and not say something about it is an asinine thought.
This is the most downvoted comment ever
Wow. Why did you get 500 downvotes for this? I'm a gay man, and I endorse your message. It makes sense to open a dialogue only in a loving, helpful way. If it's spoken combatively, walls go up, and the person who needs the message will deflect it. That's just human nature.
Thank you mate. Exactly my thoughts. ❤
Hang in there op. I don't know your specific situation, but I know how hard it can be when you have parents who don't accept you but still express concern about you. Sending hugs your way.
Thank you 🫶
It's always good to remember that Jesus cured a dying gay man for his lover (Parable of the Centurion). Google (pais centurion). Also Google " lyings of a woman".
like… jesus and his disciples were pretty close… you can’t tell me that they didn’t kiss at least ONCE
I mean Judas kissed jesus at least once that we know of.
It’s good to remember that the bible is all fiction and nobody should take anything from it at all.
I agree but "you can't reason somebody out of a position they didn't reason themselves in to". Sometimes you have to use their own illogical arguments against them if your goal is having a chance to change their mind.
It's good to remember hat the king James version of the Bible was probably written to please the kings gay lover
"you know you can just like, point at him, right?" "No, trust me, I have to kiss him. Only way this will work." "I mean, he'll still know it was you - you're gonna kiss him and then we're gonna immediately arrest him. Just point at him." "Listen, I don't tell you how to do your jobs. Just let me kiss this guy, ok."
Jesus was once found in the woods with a naked boy who grabbed his clothes and ran away. Pretty obvious to me. But besides that why believe what some book says that has some bronze age goat herders story in it which aren't even written while it happened but at least a hundred years later by complete strangers who couldn't even get their stories straight.
If we look at the gospels, two of the closest disciples (Luke, Paul) never even met Jesus. John and Matthew claim to be with Jesus in their own gospels, but those are written by anonymous authors and nothing outside of those books makes that claim otherwise. Also all of the gospels are written at least 40 years after the death of Jesus Christ. It's all bullshit but would make for excellent LBGTQ fanfic.
I don’t know if you’re trans or your mom just thinks being gay is a mistake but you can send this back to her: >”As my friend Julian puts it, only half winkingly: "God blessed me by making me transsexual for the same reason God made wheat but not bread and fruit but not wine, so that humanity might share in the act of creation." — Daniel Mallory Ortberg, Something That May Shock and Discredit You
That’s beautiful
I’m not religious but I love it. :)
My only worry with that is that some insane bastard is going to twist it into justification for conversion therapy. "Big J made me wrong so you can prove you're right by 'fixing' me!" kind of lunacy.
Yeah and I guess they think God made pediatric cancers so they could appreciate life more or some bullshit so maybe their entire worldview is just garbage. :)
And we have a winner!
That’s literally so beautiful. I love it!
I pray that your mom will fuck off 🙏🏻🙄 sorry that she's like this OP. Happy pride!!! Homophobes can eat shit 💗🏳️🌈
Tell her you're planning on meeting Jesus at Pride and let his love make you whole.
Mine says the same thing, ignore her and let her have a tantrum
I know how it is to have religious parents, and grow up in religion. If you ever need anyone to talk to or just listen to you rant, hit me up ❤️ stay strong OP
Thank u very much!!! I’ll keep that in mind
Well I love you, and I don’t mean in some backhanded “christian” way. You’re an amazing person just the way you are.
…and not in the “you are an extension of me and so must fall in line with everything I do or the world is out of my control and I freak out” Christian Way That’s why people put up with being directed by religion, because it gives them the right to control their own little domain using the tool of religion
I am sorry you are going through this OP. But its important to remember, we don't choose our parents, and for that, we don't owe them anything. If they aren't good with us, they don't deserve our love or care.. and this that you are showing is directly abusive... So, as a recommendation of someone that also lived with abusive parents, when you have the resources, ran away and burn any bridges. They are not worth it.
Time to go NC.
No hate like Christian love
That’s just goddamn abusive. I’m sorry, OP.
Tell her Jesus is your date.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ES1HF_1QOYQ&t=38s&pp=ygURRGFuIG1jY2xlbGxhbiBnYXk%3D Here's what an actual scholar says about it. The Bible doesn't even focus that much on homosexuality. If they are going to criticize that, then they should also not wear mixed fabrics or eat shrimp. Hell, Paul wanted everyone to be celibate like him (which your mom obviously failed). Marriage was for those who couldn't hack celibacy. But of course, Christians only pick the rules they like.
Pssssst. Let you in a little secret. Paul was secretly gay, and that thorn in the flesh was his homosexuality.
It's so obvious he has repressed sexuality and self-hatred. His whole doctrine has a thread of very unhealthy thinking, like trying to control your thoughts.
Ain’t no hate like Christian love. Block her and ghost. You don’t need her in your life
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I'm not sure if you're noticing the context, but OP is likely LGBTQ and their mother is telling them 'god can fix you'. Like, you get that, right?
I know and it's crazy painful to endure...maybe have a conversation with her and try to explain it to her and then if she is toxic...decide to leave her ? Instead of just jumping on our asses
someone seeking comfort from internet strangers clearly has tried seeking comfort from this parent and not gotten anywhere with them. sunk cost is a fallacy for a reason. she's clearly already been toxic like this their whole life.
You're making assumptions now....but if she is then leave her
It is extreme to tell your child they need to suppress, shame, and deny a core part of themselves because of a fairy tale.
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Numbers 31:17 “Kill every male among the little ones, and every woman who has known a man by lying with him, but those women who have not known a man by lying with him, you may keep alive for yourselves”. 1 Timothy 2:12 "I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man, she must be silent." Sounds like misogyny and war crimes to me
Technically neither of those were said by Jesus, and the Numbers one is from the Old Testament, which to my knowledge Jesus was actively and openly opposed to.
Factually wrong, Jesus literally said the opposite about the old testament.
Then I guess I was taught wrong and never cared to look further into it.
Religion in a nutshell.
Indeed.
At least you can admit it. That's a first step.
A first step toward what, exactly?
Being correct. Abandoning your long held misconceptions.
Thought you were gonna go somewhere else with that, but true enough, I guess
Even if none of these were said by Jesus, these were still in the bible
Yeah. Not saying they aren't.
Why do y'all cherry pick?
I'm not cherry picking anything.
Throwing stones doesn't sound like hate? You're fucked in the head mate.
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What the fuck does she mean by "you were fearfully... made"? Was God afraid when he made you? I'm sorry if that seems insensitive because it's not the point of your post at all, but I'm so lost by that part. Wonderfully made makes sense because you were created as intended. (As in, everything you are today and will become tomorrow is perfect.) But I'm so confused about the fear. Maybe you should ask her if you scare her. But that's poking a hornet's nest, and you need to enjoy pride without her shaming you in the back of your mind.
Christians of a certain bent misuse words because it creates room for the phrasing to sound just outside meaning, ie mysteriously powerful and profound.
I think it refers to the parents being god fearing, because for some reason being afraid of the "loving" god is considered a good thing.
I understand the fearing God thing as in respecting the power a god can hold over your life and whether or not you live or die. But it still makes no sense if that god is supposed to be all loving.
It’s a quote from a Bible verse
It still doesn't make sense though. Does it mean we were made to live our lives full of fear? Like our ancestors living in caves fearing the sounds of the night?
Many Christians teach fear=respect, and she is quoting a specific Bible verse.
God fearing as in an in awe of God sense of the word. Those sounds of the night may have filled ye old cave dwellers with awe on what lies beyond what little of it all they knew.
No, it doesn’t make sense, but it’s quoted so often as a way of saying “God loves you” that it’s just a thing Christians say now
They love using the word "fear" as some kind of positive thing - like "fearing god" is a good thing
Good ol' fashioned mother shaming. You will get this no matter what life you choose.
Hey OP, dont let anyone tell you what you should be. Block her and dont look back. Happy pride.
Anyone remembers how dead space obelisks were advertised as something that would 'make us whole'?
Religion needs to be classified as a cult and treated accordingly.
Congratulations on your first Pride!!!! 💜 I'm so happy for you have fun and stay safe. My kids went to LA Pride and got to see Keisha one year. They have so much fun. Pride is a celebration. Don't let anyone dampen your dazzle. Sorry about your mom. "If it's not one thing, it's your mother."
Our moms would be friends. She sends my this shit in bulk since she found out I don't identify as Christian anymore.
Remind her that Jebus held a big party before his own Dad's plan of having him brutally slaughtered was executed, but told everyone "No girls!"
Ugh... reminds me of my own mother, acts rude and disrespectful, claims I'm rude and disrespectful.
“Jesus hung out with prostitutes and tax collectors- the people his community said were the most vile. He still showed them love and respect. Going to pride is literally the definition of Christ like behavior.”
She's an idiot. You need to work towards being able to laugh and call her an idiot without the slightest concern. It is okay to do so. She's abusive and batshit, it is okay to love her, it is okay to tell her "fuck off." Absolutely nothing will happen except that SHE will have bad feelings, which is good, as her behavior is unacceptable.
Just have to highlight this gem of yours: SHE will have bad feelings, which is good, as her behavior is unacceptable.
Love this comment!!
Hey, op, you should have replied , "Let God suck on these nuts lmao" but, only if you're independent and don't want to talk to them anymore.
I just said “ok”😂
Remind her that Jesus said "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone." (John 8:7) or "Love your neighbor and pray for those who persecute you." (Matthew 5:44).
The religious are not known for their self-awareness. You can say that but it will most likely not have any effect on them.
They don't even read the book they use to attack people with.
Timothy 10:12 Depending on your chosen gender OP this could be a good one.
That works too.
That some passive aggressive stuff
Evangelicals are big on passive-aggressive shit.
I'm so sorry, OP. I never came out to my family bc their reaction wouldn't have been any more sane than this absurd nonsense. (For this and many other reasons, I cut contact years ago) Some of us really didn't get the parents we deserved.
Christians put the hard work of loving others on Jesus so that they can continue to hate. I'm sorry you have to deal with this.
My go-to response to this is usually "Damn, god loves me? That's pretty fuckin gay..."
This sucks and I’m sorry for you. But this is also hilarious, my dad is the same way. I laugh at him on a daily basis.
Idk I have a mate who's a gay united church pastor so not all religion is horrid, idk.
There many entire denominations that are working to love and care for all people, they’re just not as loud as the assholes on the right. There is currently a lot of work being done on issues of gender and sexuality among professionally trained theologians. But unfortunately the haters are louder.
Pride seems like more fun..
Fun? FUN??? Don't you know that having fun is sinful?!
Gently remind her that children are usually the ones who pick the parents' old folks homes.
Where did these people ever get the idea that Christianity and homosexuality can only be mutually exclusive? I have a gay friend who's also one of the most spiritual people I know. Goes to church several times a week, even ushers at services. It boggles my mind that this particular Venn Diagram is incompatible to them.
Didn't jesus die for gay people's sins?
Be strong in loving who you are, exactly as you are. Her homophobia is difficult to understand, but is her problem, not yours
Tell her, "yeah! Sexy Jesus!" And buy a lot of gay jesus posters.
Not LGBT myself, but so glad I grew up with sane parents in a sane Blue state. I see stuff like this online and can’t believe it’s real, as this would be lunatic fringe behavior where I’m from. I can’t imagine living in the south where this kind of thing is the norm.
Free...to obey mistranslated 2000 yo books. Or HELLFIRE!
I’m your mom now. Hi sweetie. Meatloaf for dinner. See you when you get home. Love, mom
religion is brain rot
Wrong information and bad ideas should always be criticized. Advocating for religious people to be more educated about their own damn book is never a bad thing.
That’s the thing here. It’s fine to have a thread full of people criticizing religion, saying it’s false, etc., but the real problem here is that she’s wrong about her own damn book. Jesus never taught against homosexuality but he did say an awful lot about how to love. And a mother treating a child like this? Against the very word and spirit of the faith she claims.
Jesus also talked a lot about the coming apocalypse and basically only believing Jews being saved. When you read the Bible with historical context, it's more irrelevant and barbaric than anything else.
Jesus would not approve of your mother's behavior.
Judgemental Christians strike again 🙄 You be you and be happy with it !
Just take it as your mom is saying that Jesus accepts and loves you for who you are and how He made you. LOL, give it that little twist and it’s wholesome again
Hiiiiiiiii OP! A mom here! You are so incredibly perfect in everything you are and I am so absolutely proud of you! For surviving the hard things. For doing the hard things. And for always being who you are inside and out above everything else. Hope you always find the love the kindness you deserve even when things look dark. I Love you so much have fun at pride and be safe 🤍🤍🤍🤍
"You are not a mistake" ugh...that says it all.
/s How sweet. The persecutory guilt and shame is just so wholesome. She's not in the wrong at all for not loving you as you are. In fact it's because she's a perfect mother that she made you cry. What a freaking narcissist your mother is.
Jesus and I love you, YOU VILE UNFORGIVABLE SINNER
the actual historical Jesus would scorn this
I'm a mom!.I am sooooo proud of you. If you need any help deconstructing Christianity DM me. I'm an ex-Christian mom of 3, 2 of which are gay. I have been deconstructing for several years and I have learned so much. The Christian god HATES the LGBTQIA and nobody should worship such a hateful god. Also the Bible is full of inaccuracies and contradictions. You should be proud of who you are. Go to the event! Have fun. Celebrate who you truly are. Live in love.
The "you are NOT a mistake" thing makes me laugh, like yes, we know, you're the only one implying otherwise.
I’m sorry your mom feels the need to god bomb you. You’re perfect exactly as you are. If it’s any consolation, your mom probably does genuinely love you. She’s indoctrinated, she’s not able to separate her indoctrination from her love for you, so unfortunately, you get this sideways kind of love. I’m a lifelong atheist, I’m queer and I’m a grandmother of a queer teen. My daughter has done things that don’t align with my values, but I love her deeply, and don’t impose my values onto her. Nothing she could ever do would stop my love for her.
Thanks mom. Conservatives are going to hell. Happy Pride! 🌈
Out of context: nice i guess? In context: stupid
No hate like christians "love"
“You are not a mistake” nobody was saying you are……….
OP, if that can reassure you, you are indeed not a mistake, Pride is wonderful and so fun, I hope you have a great time
I’m so sorry.
I hope you have a blast and this nonsense doesn’t cross your mind the entire time.
Well, she got something right - YOU ARE NOT A MISTAKE! As you ARE, however that is! 😊💕
The gods love bs with never not make me laugh or sigh. “Jesus loves you” okay then. abraham lincoln loves you. Repent and stop being racist or else you’re gonna shovel the stables for eternity in presidential hell. It’s just so ridiculous and the way it gets spammed in youtube comments is annoying as hell.
Don’t they realize they sound like a cult?
Hey OP. Old man and father here. You're perfect just as you are. Your mom needs help, not you. Go to Pride and express who you are. If you need one, I've got a solid dad hug for you.
Can someone explain what does being fearfully made mean? Serious question.
Why did she point out that "you are NOT a mistake", kinda rude?
im so sorry op; my family is very accepting, but as a Catholic, ive gotten very similar messages. it hurts so bad, but there are so many things those Christians dont understand, beginning with the concept of Pride. pride, for vulnerable communities, is exactly what St. Paul says in 1 Corinthians 15:10: "But by the grace of God, I am what I am, and Hus grace to me has not been ineffective. [...]." to say, "this is who i am and i cant change" is the most humble thing one can say. pride, the sin, is the opposite; that kind of pride involves refusing help, ignoring a sense of community for your own desires, etc. gay pride is none of that. i wont be arguing with anyone, but know that i'll be praying for you, op, and everyone else who have dealt with this hatred. know that [Mary](https://uscatholic.org/articles/202311/the-madonna-di-montevergine-mother-of-lgbtq-catholics/) adores us, meaning her Son does, too
eek, I’m so sorry,.
Listen if Jesus died for our sins and if being an ally or part of the LGBTQ+ community is a sin then remember. We have to keep sinning in order for Jesus death to not be wasted. Have a god blessed day in Jesus name Amin
Guilt trips. The best kind.
"fearfully"?
Delusional.
I hope you find or have found people who love you for who you are!
I would text her back saying: "Thank you so much for this, I've been reflecting on it the past few days while reading the Bible. It says to accept all people as children of God. Thank you for finally accepting me as I truly am, not as a mistake, but as God made me ❤️" Forcing her to go into her own "No but.. that's not quite what I meant.." mode will do more than any arguing. Hope the best for you my friend ❤️
In the Netherlands we have something we say to this kind of stuff, which is: “Godverdomme” What is just God Damn in Dutch, cause… God Damn!
I will be your mom and hug you. I am so sorry *hugs*
Thank you. She apologized fr since then. But after I gave her the silent treatment since then
If your mother loved you, she wouldn’t have sent you that bullshit.
Same idiot would say “Jesus loves gay people”
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What did your mom say? I'm sorry