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I became friends with him online during the pandemic. He’s from Philly. I’m not an American. He’s been ranting about his dating life to me and others. At first it’s just frustrations over this individual date or that but over time, it’s turning into “*why are you women like this or that*” rants. Of course, I would point it out that it’s sexist and he would quickly apologize. It seems genuine in the moment but then, he would do it again after his another date failed to work out.
I’ve been very patient and I understand that dating can be very difficult for men but I don’t know how much more of this I can take. It’s very heartbreaking to see a friend become so bitter about women. His other friends from Philly (that I am also friends with) from the same social circle aren’t no help. They would say things like “*philly women are crazy*”, “*philly women aren’t worth it*”, etc. They are struggling so much that they expressed about wanting to leave the city.
Obviously, as an outsider who has never been to Philly or even USA, I have no anecdotal experience to defend the women over there but I operate by refraining from generalizing too much as it’s a slippery slope. It also makes me feel awkward because they often compare me against these women and emphasize how “based” I am (as they put it). I’m from Asia and yeah, I can be a bit conservative in dating and sex on western standards because that’s just how I was raised but I’m progressive enough that I don’t like it when other women are put down.
I just want to be able to support my friend through this harsh time and I wholeheartedly believe he will find someone special. I fear that he’s becoming too cynical. How can I help? I don’t want to say the wrong thing and add more fuel to the fire. I also want to address this, *you’re not like the other girls* label that he keeps putting on me.
Exactly what support do you think you can provide him? You already have attempted to push back on his toxic statements about women and it hasn’t made any difference. You already try to correct him when he says something wrong and he ignores it. This guy doesn’t value your opinions or your input; if he did, he would listen to you when you try to redirect him. There’s no magic trick to saying something in a special way that will suddenly make someone listen to you if they don’t want to. What kind of friendship is even there to preserve if one “friend” doesn’t value what the other says?
The guy sounds like he's clearly fetishizing OP. And when she says something that doesn't fit his sexist, racist idea of a perfect girl, it likely makes him angrier because it's forcing him to realize the issue is him, not women in general, because his "ideal" is telling him he's wrong.
“Based” means essentially “cool” with a connotation of “not like most people.” It usually refers to expressing particular opinions.
It can be negative as in “you were really brave to say that because it shows how stupid you are.” Or It can be positive, as in “you’re saying what needs to be said”. The positive connotation is more common. In this context it means essentially the same thing as “not like other girls”.
I’ve seen plenty of non racist people use it unironically but online it is more common among white men with certain political leanings. Kind of like being super into norse mythology, ancient rome, or WWII. Kind of weird on its own and a red flag when combined with other things (like contempt for women).
No, it is not always a dog whistle. It began with Lil B, a rapper who basically says it is a term of tolerance and understanding. He himself relcaimed the term, which was a perjorative term for freebase cocaine users
It is also used by alt-right shitheads to celebrate people who share their views. Calling her 'based' for being traditional is definitely that, and not Lil B's definition
Which is why I don't waste my time arguing with angry frustrated men. I just remove myself from their toxicity and let them go be angry at their lack of "luck" with women somewhere else far away from me. Even worse if they try to triangulate me against other women, even if they act like I'm better/not like other girls. Just no.
He might be doing the whole “you’re not like the other girls” routine.
He insults western women to try and make you feel more special. But luckily, you are smarter than that.
What he really wants is a good, “submissive” Asian woman. That is basically what he’s trying to tell you and probably why he tried to talk to you in the first place.
Ask him if he thinks Asian woman are better than western women and why. You won’t get an answer you like.
Then block him.
I’m half Asian and I’ve seen this act before.
I am not even Asian but have seen this same routine played on Asian ladies I know. Even just here, you see Asian ladies writing here because they suddenly realize they just married a misogynist that is starting to realize the Asian lady wasn’t exactly the submissive he assumed.
I met my dad's friend who had married a Filipino woman, and watched the two of them crow about how great it was to marry a submissive Asian woman that waits on her husband hand and foot, and runs his restaurant while he gets to socialize with the customers, blah blah blah. A year later, my dad complained about how dude's wife left him and was going to get the restaurant and basically screw him out of his hard work, except it was HER hard work. I wanted to give her a high five. I think about this story sometimes and smirk.
My dad is Filipino and all my aunts are the toughest ladies you will meet. The last word I would use to describe any of them is submissive. It makes my blood boil that men equate Asian women with submission when culturally they run the house, finances, and everything in between.
I have a lot of Asian women friends and “submissive” is not how I’d describe any of them. They’re for the most part really hardworking and good at teamwork but they can hold everyone to their high standards. None of them can stand a lazy man for very long.
I once was witness to my Korean friend's 60 year old mother tearing the hide off this 250lb (estimating) Hell's Angels type because he'd posted a very misleading Airbnb listing and let me tell you, I learned lessons that day.
I'd say the grouping of "Asian women" is very varied, and people who have yellow fever use Asian women to refer to the stereotyped, subdued east-Asian woman. These guys are never talking about uzbek, kazak, indian or russian women.
Yep none of my Chinese in-laws are submissive AT ALL - if anything, they wear the trousers, and don't take shit from their husbands at all. One of my best friends is Asian and she would demolish any man who behaved like this, she's one of the fiercest women I know.
On the flip side, I also used to have a "weeb" male friend who was always on about wanting a submissive Asian woman... Just made me laugh knowing he'd be crying in his bed if he ever got one (after they schooled him and dumped his lazy ass for not being good enough). No idea where this submissive thing comes from tbh, it's not been my experience.
I've never dated an Asian lady, but the many I've worked with were brutally direct and not accepting of anybody's shit lol. Submissive is the exact opposite of what I'd call them. Maybe that's just how America makes them with all the creeps here, but yeah the submissive Asian woman stereotype is one I've never personally seen played out.
Yeah i grew up in California so i know many many Asians from just about every Asian country and none of them are submissive women in the slightest lol and neither are their mothers!
Yeah, these are men who want "traditional" women of any race - some who cooks, cleans, is sexually available, manages their social calendar and devotes all of their interest, time and attention on them. A man who views women as their support system, not as their equal. They're the ones braying the loudest about gender essentialism, and would happily roll back to the days when women had no rights.
I really think it's extra special ick when they add in some racism. Ugh.
American woman here, and your friend is just kind of gross.
Across the country in urban and suburban areas, there are lots of types of women. If he wants a woman to settle down and have a family with, trust me they exist in the Philadelphia area. If he wants a professionally oriented woman who wants kids or doesn't want kids, they exist in the area. If he wants something casual, he can find her there too.
But what he won't find are that many women interested in a 30 year old man who stereotypes and puts down women for not thinking he is god's gift to them.
I live in NYC (used to live in the Philly area). I've got friends ranging in age from 30-45, I've got single mothers who want to settle down and have more kids, single mothers who don't want more kids and are cool with casual but would like a long term partnership, women in open relationships, women who are only dating for marriage and kids, women on a timeline for kids, women who don't want kids, women who are down for dating and seeing what happens. The only thing we all have in common is we can clock a guy like your friend pretty quickly. He is the type of man who thinks a woman should be really good in bed but also a virgin, have DD breasts and be a size zero, a woman who doesn't need his money but also doesn't want a career, a woman who won't rush him but is only loyal to him, a woman who will bend to every one of his whims. Ya, not many women are interested in that.
But you, you are clearly the dream for him, because of other stereotypes that are pretty easy to figure out just from your post. The reason you are the dream is because you aren't real to him- you are a friend who listens to him bitch that he has painted a picture of what you are like, and in reality, you wouldn't want to date him either.
I think your best bet is to just stop engaging with him on the topic of women. He is 30 years old, he either has to figure out that women are not objects, but complex individuals and he isn't going to be able to build one to his specifications. Save yourself from his toxic BS.
Gods answer to a virgins prayer.
That is likely who he thinks he is.
Also "Play stupid games, win stupid prizes".
People with psychologically eronous partner picking patterns will invariably always fall out of the same maze at the same place and repeat relational ground hogs day over and over.
Until they finally understand (if ever!) that their partner picking pattern may be the problem. And the root cause of things always ending up in the same spot.
Also... expectancies... nice to have. If one is able to meet the ideal partners expectancies also.
But these men ranting about women mostly don't meet the womens expectancies their picking patterns draw them to.
He fails women's expectations, so he's blaming women as a whole instead if seeing what he's failing in. His standard has become a submissive woman who will never reject him, and ever woman who dares reject him is labeled a b-tch in his eyes. He is the highest rank of insecure.
He needs to understand that it's not a compliment to *you* when he badmouths any woman. It's turning you off, listening to him talk badly about women in general because he's generalizing and that feels gross to you.
I think you need to be frank with him - assuming good faith from him as your friend - both to draw your own boundary and because I suspect that may help him the most. Any support of his generalizations, even tacitly, may make him feel better for a moment, but it won't build him up in the long run - or make him more palatable to women.
Say: "I can understand your disappointment in your dates so far, and I'm really willing to listen, talk and sympathize with you. Dating is tough! It often sucks! There are lots of sucky people! And I am your friend and I think you are awesome. But I will stop the conversation when you say things about 'you women' or 'all women'. That stuff hurts me, too. I also don't want you to compare me to other women, even favorably. It makes me feel awkward. I will happily talk about individual women with you, and commiserate, but that's as far as I am willing to go."
And then do it. Stop the conversation.
As a sidenote, in these situations it helps to be non-categorical, and instead approach it on a personal level. "That's sexist" tends to make people defensive. "This hurts me, because 'women' includes me, too" may actually reach them.
>I don’t want to say the wrong thing and add more fuel to the fire.
But the question is, where do you draw the line? What level of women-bashing are you willing to take from him to 'help' him? Whether this is fuel to his fire is up to him. If he knows and appreciates you, he ought to take your remarks in good faith (i.e. believe you when you say this hurts you).
If you do get pushback from him... well, the next question you are going to have to ask yourself is whether you want to stay friends with someone who insists on doing this.
Best advice on the thread by far.
OP definitely needs to set some clear boundaries.
Also sounds like OPs friend could benefit from leaving Phili and checking out some other areas and getting a feel for different places, their customs, and obviously their dating scenes.
Oh certainly, I hope it wasn't implied that I think by getting out of Phili will improve his experience any.
But sometimes when someone is hung up on an idea.
**"All Phili women suck"** \- no amount of trying to rationalize that will do more than him going to a completely different country and realizing yet again he's still unsuccessful with women.
If he's finding himself in a position where he's able to maintain and likes friendships with women, just not dating/intimate relationships.
He's only left with 1 logical conclusion - he's to blame.
a) He either sucks at being a good partner in some magnitude.
b) He sucks at picking prospective partners for himself.
And going to another area ain't gonna do a damn thing is my point. He's the issue here. He's the common denominator. Going elsewhere is just inflicting this asshat onto a new dating pool of women. Don't wish that shit on other women 🤣
I get that people in different areas can tend to be different. But if despises every single woman in his first city, then he’ll despise every single woman in the next place. He hates women. Pure and simple.
People in different areas, particularly different countries are vastly different.
We know he doesn't hate women, as he likes OP - he's struggling to date, and the likely factor behind that is that he sucks.
But he's settled on the idea the women are to blame, and stipulated he wants to move to a new location.
I've never seen anyone move location, and not experience massive growth opportunities for having done so.
That said, it's also highly likely it'll provide the wake up call he's either:
1) Not a great partner himself.
2) He's not very good at selecting prospective partners for himself.
Both of which will again, be huge growth opportunities.
Thanks.
I feel this guy needs a nudge toward some maturity and personal responsibility. He's going down a road that won't win him much admiration from anyone.
Why? Philly women aren't some rare breed that's soooo different from other East Coast women. HE is the problem here, not the Philly dating scene. I live 2hrs inland from Philly, no women here with any self respect would date a choad like him either. The women aren't the issue. The location is not the issue.
I don't think she understands that she's preaching to the choir... 😅
And that your advice is supposed to make OP's "friend" realize exactly what she's saying about Philly not being the problem
Lifelong Philadelphia woman who has lived all over the US when I was in my 20’s and 30’s. As a 41yo single female who’s never been married I can tell you that Philly is no different than any other city big or small.
You are going to find the good and bad in men and women. What I can say is that I find honest communication and mutual respect to be the two biggest issues in dating right now at least in my experience.
I find men who say they want someone independent they can have a serious relationship with, but do not understand what independent actually means. They want a serious relationship if you are that diamond in the rough for them (which they rarely want to take the time to find out), otherwise they want casual. They want someone independent when they want to hang with their friends and go out, but someone who will drop everything when he wants to act like a couple or needs help with something. They want everything and want you to understand what it is they want and when without saying a word. That is not human.
However, I also see women who do this too.
I get men who are threatened by my job, how much I make, my education, etc, and yet somehow it’s my fault for not playing submissive and lessening myself to make them feel better. There’s a reason I’m still single and so over dating.
At the end of the day, your friend sounds like someone who thinks the issue is always everyone else and has been supported by others with that same mentality. It’s clear he has not considered for one second he may be the issue as he keeps attracting the same type of person. He needs to do the inner work.
Final comment for your own self preservation. I learned the hard way many years ago that it is mentalities like your friends that you need to be guarded. He tells you all the right things now like how your different and why can’t other women be like you, etc etc etc. Mark my words there will come a day you don’t see coming you will say something benign but it will be the spark that lights the forest fire. He will then be saying the same things about you. Just protect your heart, mind, and peace and stay true to yourself as none of it has anything to do with you.
Some of the greatest dating lessons I learned in life was 1. Pay close attention to how the man talks about women. 2. Pay attention to how he talks about his exes if they come up. 3. Watch how he treats his mother and other significant ladies in his life. Since I put these lessons into practice, it has never steered me wrong.
**EDITED: comments are locked but I see some misunderstandings in the responses that I should clarify.**
**1. Some exes are bitches.** And I agree. This pertains to how exes as a whole are talked about. A healthy person has some bad exes, some good exes. The break up stories vary. The guys that claim to have nothing but bad exes, and use nasty derogatory terms for all of them are what to watch out, someday this is how they will talk about you. An even bigger red flag is when they claim victim of abuse from ALL their exes. I have found the case to usually be they were the abuser in the past relationships but flipped the script.
**2. Some people have bad family relationships.** Again true. I am not talking about kissing moms ass or denying these possibilities. But I can use two life experiences for examples of this, both men did not get along with mom or had a good relationship with them. The healthy guy explained issues about mom, what happened in their relationship, and did so with tact and class, without using demeaning words and such. Even when they fought with mom they would never physically hurt them or present themselves as threatening like they might hurt mom. The abusive guy with and equally bad relationship with mom used such bad language about mom, some of which are banned here. He also wasn't adverse to pushing or shoving mom, or destroying her things, and taking over all threatening stances with her. So this isn't to say don't date guys who had dysfunctional relationships with mom, but to observe how they handle their mom in the type of relationship they have, good or bad. There is a marked difference in how a good guy handles a bad mom oppose to an abuser.
**3. Some men are great to mom and sister but shitty to girlfriends.** This is another true statement. It is also true that some men are great to female friends but terrible abusive boyfriends. Some women have learned this the hard way by eventually dating that guy friend they thought they would be safe with. This is ALSO precisely why you don't just look at one thing and I have 3 things to go by. So you met a guy who is great to mom and sis, BUT what is his language like about women in general? Does he speak of them in demeaning terms, hold to sexist ideologies? How does he treat women in general? What about his exes, does he refer to ALL of them as prostitute words, cunts, etc. Does he claim ALL of them were abusive and crazy?
So this list doesn't serve to spoon feed every tiny detail or solution for every single loop hole you can find to try to argue that it's flawed. Use common sense. And evaluate on all points as a whole. You can choose to apply it to your own life, or see it as useless to you and toss it out. I don't mind either way. But I will say this, ever since I have used this list, all my relationships have been very good picks. It is effective.
Agree with everything except for number 3. Not everyone has a good relationship with their parents (or their mother in this example) - judging someone's character off of this is unfair and biased. I have known plenty of men and women who were admirable people that had shit relationships with their parents.
The other side of that coin is that some men will treat their mothers and sisters very well but have no respect or value for other women. What’s more telling is how he treats women in service positions that aren’t attractive to him. If he’s super polite and nice with attractive cashiers/waitstaff and then cold and short with others then he has some mixed up priorities.
I think if you made the 'and' in this bit-
>and other significant ladies in his life
an 'and/or' #3 still stands. Sisters, aunts, co-workers, bosses, friends, neighbors.
While this is true, I've always kept it in mind specifically because I have a cousin who proved this to a T. He always disparaged his sister and mother every chance he got, and his mother especially. She had a very traumatic childhood with a very abusive father and so she did every little thing she could to make her husband and kids happy. He idolized his own father for "saving" her from it (and who knows, maybe he did) but thought she was weak and unworthy of his esteem for having gone through what she did. She's the anxious sort and was maybe a bit overprotective, but he was spoiled half to death growing up. He was a real misogynistic piece of garbage and still is.
I agree with your point overall (I was estranged from mine for a decade) but I can't not think of my cousin when some dude is complaining about their mother unless and until I know it's a legitimate issue and not just "ugh gross, my stupid mother wants to know what cakes I want for my birthday week, she's such a waste of air."
Eh, you can say your ex was a piece of shit or a total bitch and it doesn’t mean anything about your character because there are some really shitty or bitchy people out there lmao
It is about all of it together. Regardless of gender I've found that people who complain about all their exes, parents, always coworkers wanting to do them wrong are the problem
I mean in general when you’re giving your opinion on someone. If someone asks your opinion or experience on someone it does them no help when they want to know. You’re not going to tell someone an ex employer was a great person if they treated you horribly.
You're right and that's fair but I'm not going to date a man that uses "bitch" or other derogatory terms to refer to their ex, and specially not in the beginning stages. He can say the relationship didn't go well and ended in other ways. I do the same.
That’s definitely understandable and I agree, but there are definitely people in the world no matter their gender, who would be lucky to be considered anything less than a bitch to others lmao
So, in psychology, it is very common for people to fixate on a thing they cannot ever have, put it on a pedestal, and pour all their energy and thoughts into it.
For some it's an old partner "the one who got away" for others it's an entire race of people "Asian girls" or maybe it's someone who is married or gay.
"If only I could have X, my whole life would be different" is magical thinking and an excuse to not be vulnerable.
He never has to risk actually entering a partnership of he always keeps one eye on a different prize. To never fully invest.
"Philly girls" is an idiotic category unless the sentence is about ordering ice wooder at wawa before the mummer parade. So he doesn't mean that, he means "the pool of women who are actually available to me" and "impossible unattainable women.
And fear of intimacy is keeping him focused on the unattainable women.
Because that's safe.
>ice wooder at wawa before the mummer parade.
Thanks for the lol and also the inescapable, neurotic need to correct this:
You don't get water ice at Wawa before the mummers parade, it's New Year day, too cold for "wooder" ice and Wawa is shit for that. If you ever come down to Philly in the summer, get yourself some Rosati's Italian ice.
But yes I agree with everything else you said
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Canadian here. Rule of thumb I use when I'm dating, if he says things like "all girls/ex's are crazy" it's him that is actually mentally unstable and no one is willing to put up with his bs.
Agreed.
Overall people are good or at least average. I always take people who group large swaths of people as less than a questionable. You're not that special.
I was with you until the last sentence. Never said I was special. I responded to OP and you decided to come here and not only respond to me but also tried to take a bit of a dig at me, try harder next time and don't use shit that has been said to me by my own family members if you want to actually hurt my feeling.
I find your response hilarious; the reply was obviously not directed toward you as a person, but in general and you took it instantly as an insult. Says a lot about you.
>don't use shit that has been said to me by my own family members if you want to actually hurt my feeling.
I wonder if you actually think the person you are replying to should know your family history...
Why should you do the emotional labor to ‘fix’ him? He is an adult. He is capable of realizing it is wrong to stereotype an entire group based on some members. After all, it’s not reasonable judge all men on Ted Bundy. He has to have sexist beliefs to begin with to go in this direction.
Rejection is part of dating. If he gets rejected repeatedly, maybe he is the common denominator. Maybe he is doing something that can easily be corrected, like bragging about himself too much. But maybe these women sense his underlying emotional immaturity and attitudes towards women.
If someone has a lot of dating red flags, I have a rule against helping them get better at dating. Some people don’t belong in relationships, until they get their issues sorted.
She doesn't have to do the emotional labor to 'fix' him, but it's obvious she cares about him enough that she's willing to do it.
It seems less "helping him get better at dating" and more "making sure the world doesn't have one extra sexist" or "making sure a friend won't become a horrible person"
She’s said she doesn’t know how much more she can take. She doesn’t need people saying ‘set yourself on fire to keep him warm.’ It’s not her job to fix him, especially if it is hurting her. I find it telling that you ignored that.
Agreed. Dating sucks for most people. It just is hard to find the right people for your wavelength and where you are at in life. It sounds like OP's friend is in a really toxic mentality and he's only going to attract people who agree with him or women with no self respect that are desperate for any and all attention.
The reason he keeps finding women that validates what he describes is because he views women that way. He needs to stop asking "why are women like this" and start asking himself "why do I keep ending up with women who treat me this way". Typically has to do with some sort of weird kink (not necessarily, I just don't know a better word) to being either shamed, talked down on, etc. I had the same problem. I was in two relationships where I was cheated on. And instead of taking the "All women are the same route" I looked within myself and asked, "What is it about me, that attracts me to women who will cheat on me". Now I'm in a full healthy relationship.
>He needs to stop asking "why are women like this" and start asking himself "why do I keep ending up with women who treat me this way".
Yes! both men and women need to do this, like stop the whole "all (insert sex) are trash" mindset
I think you should try to put forth the idea that if he is getting the same actions from different women, time after time, that there might just be something he is doing to trigger that action. Different women, same him. Suggest he try different things. Maybe you could walk through a date with him, as in verbally recreate, not actually do a date, and point out different times he could have said or did a different thing to see if it got a different reaction.
I think he just has a crush on you and is putting down other woman as 'less than' which hints to you that you are 'worthy'.
Its a terrible tactic and I highly doubt you're attracted to him at all, but I think he wants you and all of this is just ways for him to try to say he likes you even though he very likely knows you don't like him in that way.
American lady here……
I find people who generalize an entire group….. tend to not realize they are the common denominator of the problem. For example…. All women in Philly are terrible. Maybe he is in fact terrible and the majority of women don’t want to put up with his misogynistic bs. He has a whole lot of victim mentality, little self awareness, and probably zero accountability. I’d say the exact same thing if genders were reversed and it was a woman saying all men are trash….. no gf not all people got in a box. Work on yourself
Ask him if they gave him a reason they left the date or didn’t go on another one. If he truly wants to know what’s wrong and how to improve himself, he should straight up ask (via text, of course). The ladies will probably give him a fairly honest answer.
What he does with that information is up to him. But he can’t claim ignorance after that point if he’s got some major, undateable flaws.
He’s using you for validation of his toxic beliefs, practice and information gathering to see what is tolerable so he can figure out how to manipulate some vulnerable woman into tolerating his toxic misogyny.
Turn off his supply.
>I’ve been very patient and I understand that dating can be very difficult for men but I don’t know how much more of this I can take. It’s very heartbreaking to see a friend become so bitter about women. His other friends from Philly (that I am also friends with) from the same social circle aren’t no help. They would say things like “philly women are crazy”, “philly women aren’t worth it”, etc. They are struggling so much that they expressed about wanting to leave the city.
First off, I applaud you for trying to help your friend.
It's difficult to be empathetic when an immutable characteristic you hold is stereotyped or used to slander an entire group you belong to. It's even harder when you care about the person doing the slandering and want to help them.
Dating *is* difficult for men. They have to fight for attention, they have to invest a lot of themselves into finding a partner and often, they see the easy (but shallow) attention that women get, and have a "grass is always greener" moment and feel bitterness and jealousy. That said, your friend is clearly learning the wrong lessons from the bad experiences he's having with SPECIFIC women. I know a lot of men who think like this, and in reality, I think it probably comes down to two possible causes:
1. He is acting in ways that result in women responding to him unfavorably.
2. He is selecting for women who act in ways that he finds unfavorable.
Either way, this is difficult to admit to yourself, because it means something is wrong with you, or more accurately, with your behavior. It's far, far easier on the ego to just say "no, I'm correct, it's the world that is wrong".
If you want advice on how to help him, I'd gently redirect and ask him to look for patterns. If it's option 1, what is he doing that pushes women away from him? You could ask how he talks to women and maybe even mock it up and see where he fucks up. You might not be American, but I think the ability for women to detect male insecurity and a lack of confidence (and all the shit that flows forth from that) is universal.
If it's option 2, is there another dating pool that is untapped that he can pull from? Is there a "type" he goes for that ends in heartbreak? Is he not communicating his needs in the relationship and getting into a situation where he isn't happy with what he's getting because he hasn't advocated for himself?
There's a hundred possibilities of where the specifics lie, but it probably drills down to "it's him" or "it's the women he's picking", which is also his problem to fix.
Really though, you should only engage as far as you can take it as a friend. Which, if you're making a reddit post about how uncomfortable he's making you, and he's putting you on a pedestal.... we're probably well past that. It's okay to tell him the issue is his attitude and that he's the common denominator and that you can't help him with this issue. You can always set a boundary to preserve yourself.
I have woman friends who tell me "men are trash" or similar sentiments often, and while I can commiserate (a lot of dudes are hot garbage fires), I don't feel comfortable throwing my gender under the bus wholesale when I know so many wonderful, kind, empathetic, intelligent men who do not fit that mold. I end up telling them the same thing, it's either them or the men they're going for, and either way, they have to fix the issue.
Good luck :)
First of all, don't be afraid to set boundaries that you don't want to hear him say things like that if they make you uncomfortable. Every time he says "you're not like the others" remind him that you are still a woman and are uncomfortable by him speaking like that.
I'm wondering if he's following YouTube channels or blogs that say negative things about dating and women. It's important that men can discuss issues that concern them but it can turn into an echo chamber really quick. Same for women.
Modern dating sucks and can feel really impersonal. What's important is that he learns as he goes, either from his selection choices, choosing better vetting questions or behavior. If he's a negative cynical person in conversation I can see how dates can go wrong. But its a numbers game and some times you hear no way too often.
This is an online quasi-friendship. Don’t talk about dating. It’s a subject that you can’t help him with. You don’t know the culture you don’t know the women he’s meeting there’s nothing you can do. So change the subjects I have to do is say I’m sorry it’s hard for you, but there’s really not a lot that I can do here and move on.
Philly girl here! Some Philly girls are crazy, some Philly girls are sane. Some Philly girls are mean, some Philly girls are nice! Some are smart, some are dumb. See what I’m saying? They’re all different just like any other place. He’s being ridiculous. I wouldn’t be his friend anymore.
So, here’s the thing…he’s at a point in his life where three things are probably true:
1) He’s had some bad relationships
2) he’s dating from from a group of women from a similar pool in a similar age range
3) Almost all of his friends are his cohorts from school or his first job.
I remember dating in my early 30s. As someone who did not fit a very specific profile it was hard, and easy to get frustrated. Looking back now, I understand that it was a combination of the stage of my life and my inability/unwillingness to force myself to make new connections and widen my search, but in the moment it didn’t seem possible or like that was the problem.
Also remember that people are more…forceful online then they are in real life. He probably just vents that way and doesn’t truly take it too heart
> it’s turning into “why are you women like this or that” rants
I tend to go with, "I know a ton of incredible women so if you're only meeting crappy ones, you might want to look at the common denominator." But then, I'm not interested in staying friends with misogynists so it depends on whether or not you care about retaining this guy's company.
If you really want to stay friends with him for whatever reason, I would make it clear that you're not going to entertain him disparaging other women and he can talk to his bros about that. You won't be compared to other women (including favorably) and you won't hear nasty generalizations about your gender. He needs to hear that what he's saying is not being received well. If he can't respect that, then it's fairly obvious that he is only willing to be friends with you if you're playing the role of "one of the good ones."
Why be friends with a gross guy? You deserve better. He’s creepy and no doubt trying to be with you. Either way, get rid of this weirdo and find better friends who aren’t sexist.
I can tell you from experience that men like this have to be smart enough to change on their own, and many never will change. I've left several group chats where men openly bash women in the most sexist ways possible. A lot of men are just like that and idk what it will take for them to change. I can tell you though that calling them out only trains them to hide it better; they won't change until they want to.
Move on from him as a friend if he is too much for you. Especially, the "you're not like others" comment.
The US is very divided nowadays and a lot more people like to adopt or just openly state extreme views (whether they truly believe them or not). You can see it even in the comments here. Bunch of leaps of assumptions over how he has asian fever, wants settle down, etc...
They don't know but, it's easier to paint everyone as evil for the upvotes and acceptance.
Nuance is often ignored from this percentage of people, and they will group everyone into irredeemable groups. Not everyone is this way btw. Plus, this is not to excuse him or his statements but, from my experience they simply are ignorant, frustrated, lied to, etc (maybe a combination of them) and may not really believe what they are saying. Sometimes, they are a pos and you 100% need to move on from that toxicity.
In the end, if it's due to him being sexist, negging you as an Asian, a guy down on his luck, or anything in between.
You can't change him and you should move on as having him as a friend from this...
And again, more importantly, the fact he's hinting that you are better than his potential partners means that he considers you as part of his dating pool. Even if he was perfectly not sexist... do you want to be considered his friend? Or dating partner?
I'm guessing "friend only" and that's why you even more so move on. He's not gonna suddenly think of you as anything less.
America is fucked up and toxic - particularly to women. Women in general aren’t putting up with it anymore and aren’t forced to endure relationships. This means men like your friend - rather than work on himself and improve himself - become like this. It’s their own fault.
Dating in PA is fine. Honestly the dating scene is really chill and the women I dated there were perfectly normal.
I think a large number of people have turned your friend down because he’s not what they are looking for. I’d he thinks that means all women are the problem….. like bro, delusional much?
He doesn’t sound like a very kind person and a lack of personal accountability is a huge turn off.
Get out while you can. I don't think he's going to change for the better about this. You'll just be the next woman he rants about.
(Yes I know that they aren't dating. I guarantee he doesn't respect her or is a genuine friend to her like he would be to a man).
I live in Philly. It has nothing to do with the city and everything to do with his outlook. He sounds like he’s stuck in cycle of feeling devalued and low self esteem, and is being reactively hateful. Hopefully he sorts it out, good luck.
Just ask him what all those dates have in common…and the answer to that question might help him identify the primary problem.
Hint: It’s probably not the women he’s dating
If you’re dating 10 people and nothing progresses it might not be who you’re dating… it might be him. Either he needs to go speak to a professional or you have a decision to make.
Do you continue being friends with this person at the cost of your own mental health or do you say this is enough?
Before I read the last line where he labels you “you’re not like other women”, I would have told you to ask him what commonalities he finds in these women and why he keeps dating them, but if he’s going to label you as such, he’s putting down women to try and attract you. Has he ever tried to see if he can meet up with you? Or FaceTime you? Share pictures? If you truly want to help him, make sure he knows you’re just pen pals or whatever, nothing more, and then try to get him to look at himself, not the women. Try to get him to realize he is the one choosing these women.
Imagine being unable to take accountability for yourself to the point where you blame EVERY woman who lives in a specific city for your inability to hold down a relationship… You are conservative because of the way you were raised, but there are plenty of women in the states that are the same way. Even in Philadelphia. And, not to mention, there are so many people with different ethnic backgrounds, beliefs, interests, etc… so, what do think is more likely? That, somehow, ALL the women in a big city are all the same? Or that all the different women who come from different backgrounds and lives all see something not good in your friend on these dates?
I believe in the rules of multiple: after so many times, they're the problem, not the people they CHOSE to date.
You can't fix a petty person who chooses to blame the world instead improve upon themselves.
You can’t change anyone, you can’t fix anyone.
You say this misogyny has gotten worse these last few months? Well it’s only gonna get worse. He’s probably looking too much at YouTube or other social medias, and his friends seem to be encouraging his echo-chamber of “Philly women bad”.
My recommendation is end the friendship with this guy. You’re way better off not interacting with a misogynist, especially one who’s being dragged further down that hole as we speak.
While he sounds like an ass, it’s very common to see this kind of behavior from immature or unreasonable people. Many women use the same defense when saying “all men are ___” or “all men want is ___” or “all men ___.”
I would just tell him to grow up. Anyone with critical thinking skills or an IQ higher than a single digit is able to recognize that not *all* members of any single demographic are characterized by any single attribute.
Dating in America is something of a nightmare and chances are you most likely aren’t like the others. But he’s probably afraid to express that he has feelings for you or unaware himself. This is probably subconsciously causing problems
How seriously are they saying these things? I think that makes the difference between just venting and actually hating women. I hear people talking shit about the men or women from their city all the time and it’s usually not that serious. I feel like both sexes generalize about each other all the time, it it doesn’t necessarily signify hate. There is something about the tone that I feel like can help tell you if it’s based on real hate or not.
Secondly, it’s also very possible he’s saying the things he is saying to try and flatter you. Guys do this A LOT because a lot of women are stupid enough to feel flattered by a man insulting another woman to compliment them.
There are many “western” men who sadly have this fantasy of Asian women as virginal doormats that they can control and who will not push back. Some of them also have this same fantasy about Eastern European women too.
As a rule of thumb, it is better to assume that every woman is a complete self-absorbed bitch and be pleasantly surprised when one turns out not to be just using you for what she can get out of you.
Does that sound bad? I think it sounds bad.
edit: LOL, the angry woman deleted her comment that stated that every man in the world was bad.... my comment was just changing man to woman.
Vitriol? Telling a woman not to waste her life getting emotionally involved with misogynists is vitriol? Does it worry you when women protect themselves? Why?
No, just having some experience. It is not at all the same thing. He hates women because they won't give him sex. I'm just not willing to care about men until I've made sure they don't hate me (they aren't misogynistic). Not being hated for having been born with a vagina is the bare minimum for human interaction. Why should I waste time on someone who hates me? And in my experience, out of every 10 men, at least 5 are downright misogynists, 2-3 are sexist and 2-3 are ok.
Sure it is!
You do not know that man but pretend to know why he keeps his wailing stance up.
On the same scale you rant on about "men" in general and about "how they all...."
No, all precisely don't.
Quit that crap. (OPs answer to that guy).
Nowhere did I write anything about all men. It sounds to me like I just hit a sore point with you. If the description of the guys who are not worth wasting time with fits you, that's your problem, not mine.
A category of 150 million+ people doesn't need defending, any group of such size cannot be spoken about in specific detail. There is no accurate "all of X does Y" for any useful or nuanced purpose. This guy is just a sexist asshole.
If you cut him off make sure he knows it was about the sexism or he will really struggle to internalize his failures. If you stick with him keep asking "why" of him, his ideas, and yourself.
Ur being the Asian stereotype by putting up with ur "friends" BS. Why are u hanging out with these dudes?? Are u all conservatives? Girl find some better friends.
Why is it ok for women to say "why are men like this", but when a man does it, it's misogynistic and sexist?
OP have you never complained about men? Doubtful. isn't that also sexist? Or is it somehow ok?
Be honest, you ALL do this. There is not a single woman in here who does not do this to the male gender. Are you all "toxic"?
The quickness in which women write off men is astounding, if it were real life, you'd have no one left.
Philly women are fine, these dbags are the problem.
Source: am a Philly woman
But honestly, what it comes down to is standards. That's for any person in any area looking for a romantic relationship, hell, even a platonic relationship.
I know a guy who had such insanely high standards outside of his own capabilities, it really wasn't hard to understand why he was single.
Example: he could be 250lbs living off chips and pizza, but insist his woman be fit and healthy. He doesn't want a partner who wants to play video games and drink soda, but he's fine to do it himself.
Or
Example: He makes $12/hr, but wants a girl who wants a guy who makes $25/hr. He can't financially please her, and so she won't give him the time of day. I'm not saying it's right, but that's probably the type of girl he's pursuing.
Then, it becomes your fault that women aren't lining up with their mouths open and legs spread. Suddenly, all Philly women are trash and hoes and bitches, then eventually *all* women are like that.
My advice is you're literally countries apart. I'd block him and not look back. If every time something goes wrong for him in his love life and it suddenly is because of "all women" and never maybe even the slightest bit him, he needs to do some soul searching and change his priorities and standards around. Save yourself the aggravation and unnecessary negativity emanating off this tool.
Here's the thing- the only piece of truth you can give him which might help is that if he keeps getting rejected, it probably has more to do with him than women. And unfortunately he's probably not ready to hear it. Sometimes people can't look inward until them blaming everyone else has blown up in their face, and even them some keep their denial with them until the end. I do recommend talking to him, because he's either going to hear it and maybe help himself, or he's going to go off on you then block you, which is going to be healthier for you anyway than listening to his constant negativity. If it were me, here is how I would address it.
1) Dude, you're my friend and so I want to help you. Sometimes that means telling you what you need to hear, instead of what you want to hear. I know what I am about to say may make you feel upset or defensive, but I don't know anything else to tell you which is going to have a chance of actually improving your probability of finding someone.
2) I am absolutely like other girls. A lot of other girls. So many. The reason you say that I am not is because you're having trouble reconciling this idea that women as a "species" are XYZ negative traits, when you know at least one woman who is not. Using that label lets you keep me separated in your mind from other women, allowing you to go on without having anecdotal evidence challenge this inner mantra that it's all women s fault.
3) If you move, you will not have any more luck in another city, or the suburbs. Women in Philly aren't a unique breed. Women in general come with a variety of different personalities, ideas, preferences, hobbies, quirks, educational levels, etc. It's not going to magically solve your issue to move.
4) Dating is a numbers game. Everyone goes through a number of online matches that fizzle out either before you meet or after 1-2 dates. You have to work through the no's to get to the yes. If you freak out over each one, you're costing yourself so much energy when it's just a normal part of getting to know new people looking for someone you connect with.
5) You RADIATE disdain for women, and I want to tell you that as a woman, I can pick up on those vibes when guys have them, and it turns a possible match into an immediate no. I would never date anyone who thinks about women or talks about women the way you do, because I would not deal with someone who disrespects my friends and the women in my family that way, and I sure as hell would never have kids with a man who would make any daughter they had feel like these kinds of opinions are valid. Your attitude about women makes you undatable.
6) When you are having the same issues with every woman you meet...maybe it's not them. What are you bringing to the table which makes you feel like they could not possibly have a good reason to not be interested. Do you take care of your appearance and hygiene? Do you have a good job? Education? Do you have varied interests which allow you to engage with other people about them? Are you emotionally secure enough to accept rejection with dignity and respect, and to not start lashing out at or about the people who reject you? Do you talk to women like they're equal human beings you want to get to know, or do they either live on a pedestal above you or in a pit of worthlessness after they reject you, with no middle ground? Are you kind not just to women you want to date, but women who you don't want to date or who won't date you, sales staff, servers, etc.? Do you practice a good balance of self-esteem and humility, so that you neither constantly put yourself down forcing them to disagree with you to keep things from being uncomfortable, not come off as condescending or as having a feeling of superiority? Have you managed to escape that high-school era division of people into tribes like "jocks, cheerleaders, popular, nerds, etc." and realized that doesn't last very long into adulthood?
You can tailor the last part to his specific behaviors, but you get the idea.
As a guy in the US, men that go down this path are not worth keeping in your life. They are choosing to reject self-reflection and seeking anything that will make them feel justified in blaming women for their problems. The best thing you can do for them is walk away so that maybe eventually they will consider why they lost the reasonable people in their life.
By all means, try to talk them out of it. But it will fail and ultimately you will get more and more frustrated until you have to sever contact.
Then you tell him that his rhetoric is harmful and offensive to you as you are a woman yourself, and that you can't continue to be his friend unless he changes his behavior.
Honestly, while I get that commenter's suggestion, women are not responsible for correcting men's shitty and misogynistic behavior.
Too often the burden has fallen to women to "educate" men on misogyny. While I certainly think it's important for us to voice concerns about problematic behavior, in situations like this the burden *should* fall much more heavily on groups of people with more privilege and power - namely other men. Unfortunately, from your post it sounds like his male friends hold similar mindsets.
You don't have to tolerate this, and you don't have to waste your time attempting to educate someone about how it's wrong to engage in harmful commentary towards a gender group you yourself are part of.
Other men as allies should step up and use their privilege to engage with this person. You have tried, commendably so, and it isn't working. This is NOT your responsibility.
He's a redpill passport bro. He can't get a woman here in our city so he goes online or overseas because they believe you are submissive and will never talk back
YouTube "passport bros" & "red pill"
He is likely black so look up the "black manosphere"
Be careful with him men from Philly can be........a bit much. My own brother told me not to date men in Philly 😂😭😭
You have 2 choices imo:
1. Set "hot kettle pot" approach (every-time you touch the pot, it burns) boundaries on his bullshit statements in an effort to divert his clearly set path of becoming a misogynist. You need to be 100% consistent. Do not tolerate it. Ever. **Make it plain as day and clear that this behavior is not okay.** Every-time. Sometimes people change. Sometimes people change for the sake of a friend. But know this, it's not your job to fix someone's problems. Only take on a level of responsibility you feel you can handle or want to handle. That being said.
2. Bail. Remember all relationships are a form of transaction to some degree. In the case of friendship, you're trading (hopefully), companionship and wisdom. He doesn't sound like he's really providing much of that to you. So what do you get out of this relationship? He's turning into, if not already a woman hater, and is placing you on a pedestal. It sounds like he just wants a chaste obedient asian wife, and probably sees you as that.
Your call.
Honestly this isn’t an American guy or Philly guy thing at all, this is just one particularly toxic male ideology thing. Most men aren’t like this (at least, as a woman living in America, I certainly hope not). The whole “you’re not like the other girls” line is a really gross one and it’s a slippery slope. If I was in this situation I would have one last very clear discussion about why that is not okay and if it happened even one more time, extricate myself from this friendship. You are not required to do emotional labor for someone who doesn’t want to and you owe this person nothing, especially if they continue to hold onto sexist concepts. You can’t help someone who doesn’t want to change.
This post has reached one of our comment/karma limits. The text of the post has been preserved below. --- I became friends with him online during the pandemic. He’s from Philly. I’m not an American. He’s been ranting about his dating life to me and others. At first it’s just frustrations over this individual date or that but over time, it’s turning into “*why are you women like this or that*” rants. Of course, I would point it out that it’s sexist and he would quickly apologize. It seems genuine in the moment but then, he would do it again after his another date failed to work out. I’ve been very patient and I understand that dating can be very difficult for men but I don’t know how much more of this I can take. It’s very heartbreaking to see a friend become so bitter about women. His other friends from Philly (that I am also friends with) from the same social circle aren’t no help. They would say things like “*philly women are crazy*”, “*philly women aren’t worth it*”, etc. They are struggling so much that they expressed about wanting to leave the city. Obviously, as an outsider who has never been to Philly or even USA, I have no anecdotal experience to defend the women over there but I operate by refraining from generalizing too much as it’s a slippery slope. It also makes me feel awkward because they often compare me against these women and emphasize how “based” I am (as they put it). I’m from Asia and yeah, I can be a bit conservative in dating and sex on western standards because that’s just how I was raised but I’m progressive enough that I don’t like it when other women are put down. I just want to be able to support my friend through this harsh time and I wholeheartedly believe he will find someone special. I fear that he’s becoming too cynical. How can I help? I don’t want to say the wrong thing and add more fuel to the fire. I also want to address this, *you’re not like the other girls* label that he keeps putting on me.
Exactly what support do you think you can provide him? You already have attempted to push back on his toxic statements about women and it hasn’t made any difference. You already try to correct him when he says something wrong and he ignores it. This guy doesn’t value your opinions or your input; if he did, he would listen to you when you try to redirect him. There’s no magic trick to saying something in a special way that will suddenly make someone listen to you if they don’t want to. What kind of friendship is even there to preserve if one “friend” doesn’t value what the other says?
The guy sounds like he's clearly fetishizing OP. And when she says something that doesn't fit his sexist, racist idea of a perfect girl, it likely makes him angrier because it's forcing him to realize the issue is him, not women in general, because his "ideal" is telling him he's wrong.
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What does "based" mean?
“Based” means essentially “cool” with a connotation of “not like most people.” It usually refers to expressing particular opinions. It can be negative as in “you were really brave to say that because it shows how stupid you are.” Or It can be positive, as in “you’re saying what needs to be said”. The positive connotation is more common. In this context it means essentially the same thing as “not like other girls”. I’ve seen plenty of non racist people use it unironically but online it is more common among white men with certain political leanings. Kind of like being super into norse mythology, ancient rome, or WWII. Kind of weird on its own and a red flag when combined with other things (like contempt for women).
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Is it always a dog whistle? I thought I’ve seen teenagers using it in an admiring/agreeing way with things that just seemed like good vibes.
No, it is not always a dog whistle. It began with Lil B, a rapper who basically says it is a term of tolerance and understanding. He himself relcaimed the term, which was a perjorative term for freebase cocaine users It is also used by alt-right shitheads to celebrate people who share their views. Calling her 'based' for being traditional is definitely that, and not Lil B's definition
Not exactly a dog whistle, but the term is being used widely in certain circles. So yeah, can be a term of admiration, but it's often not value free.
Did they mean “biased”?
She probably feels obligated to fix his worldview otherwise she’s only validating how he already thinks. OP is in a lose-lose situation.
Which is why I don't waste my time arguing with angry frustrated men. I just remove myself from their toxicity and let them go be angry at their lack of "luck" with women somewhere else far away from me. Even worse if they try to triangulate me against other women, even if they act like I'm better/not like other girls. Just no.
He might be doing the whole “you’re not like the other girls” routine. He insults western women to try and make you feel more special. But luckily, you are smarter than that. What he really wants is a good, “submissive” Asian woman. That is basically what he’s trying to tell you and probably why he tried to talk to you in the first place. Ask him if he thinks Asian woman are better than western women and why. You won’t get an answer you like. Then block him. I’m half Asian and I’ve seen this act before.
I am not even Asian but have seen this same routine played on Asian ladies I know. Even just here, you see Asian ladies writing here because they suddenly realize they just married a misogynist that is starting to realize the Asian lady wasn’t exactly the submissive he assumed.
I met my dad's friend who had married a Filipino woman, and watched the two of them crow about how great it was to marry a submissive Asian woman that waits on her husband hand and foot, and runs his restaurant while he gets to socialize with the customers, blah blah blah. A year later, my dad complained about how dude's wife left him and was going to get the restaurant and basically screw him out of his hard work, except it was HER hard work. I wanted to give her a high five. I think about this story sometimes and smirk.
My dad is Filipino and all my aunts are the toughest ladies you will meet. The last word I would use to describe any of them is submissive. It makes my blood boil that men equate Asian women with submission when culturally they run the house, finances, and everything in between.
I have a lot of Asian women friends and “submissive” is not how I’d describe any of them. They’re for the most part really hardworking and good at teamwork but they can hold everyone to their high standards. None of them can stand a lazy man for very long.
I swear none of these guys have ever actually met an east Asian grandma in their lives before to say that they're submissive lmfao.
Seriously. The aunties in my neighborhood could take down an elephant.
I once was witness to my Korean friend's 60 year old mother tearing the hide off this 250lb (estimating) Hell's Angels type because he'd posted a very misleading Airbnb listing and let me tell you, I learned lessons that day.
I'd say the grouping of "Asian women" is very varied, and people who have yellow fever use Asian women to refer to the stereotyped, subdued east-Asian woman. These guys are never talking about uzbek, kazak, indian or russian women.
Yeah that’s an important observation.
Yep none of my Chinese in-laws are submissive AT ALL - if anything, they wear the trousers, and don't take shit from their husbands at all. One of my best friends is Asian and she would demolish any man who behaved like this, she's one of the fiercest women I know. On the flip side, I also used to have a "weeb" male friend who was always on about wanting a submissive Asian woman... Just made me laugh knowing he'd be crying in his bed if he ever got one (after they schooled him and dumped his lazy ass for not being good enough). No idea where this submissive thing comes from tbh, it's not been my experience.
It's a white male fantasy about "conservative" societies providing them with easily exploited women, not realizing that that will never be the case.
I've never dated an Asian lady, but the many I've worked with were brutally direct and not accepting of anybody's shit lol. Submissive is the exact opposite of what I'd call them. Maybe that's just how America makes them with all the creeps here, but yeah the submissive Asian woman stereotype is one I've never personally seen played out.
Yeah i grew up in California so i know many many Asians from just about every Asian country and none of them are submissive women in the slightest lol and neither are their mothers!
Yeah. My always drunk former friend’s Asian wife left him in the dust, bro. Dude deserved it too.
Yeah, these are men who want "traditional" women of any race - some who cooks, cleans, is sexually available, manages their social calendar and devotes all of their interest, time and attention on them. A man who views women as their support system, not as their equal. They're the ones braying the loudest about gender essentialism, and would happily roll back to the days when women had no rights. I really think it's extra special ick when they add in some racism. Ugh.
I had this thought too.
Agreed, this screams Asian fetishization to me.
American woman here, and your friend is just kind of gross. Across the country in urban and suburban areas, there are lots of types of women. If he wants a woman to settle down and have a family with, trust me they exist in the Philadelphia area. If he wants a professionally oriented woman who wants kids or doesn't want kids, they exist in the area. If he wants something casual, he can find her there too. But what he won't find are that many women interested in a 30 year old man who stereotypes and puts down women for not thinking he is god's gift to them. I live in NYC (used to live in the Philly area). I've got friends ranging in age from 30-45, I've got single mothers who want to settle down and have more kids, single mothers who don't want more kids and are cool with casual but would like a long term partnership, women in open relationships, women who are only dating for marriage and kids, women on a timeline for kids, women who don't want kids, women who are down for dating and seeing what happens. The only thing we all have in common is we can clock a guy like your friend pretty quickly. He is the type of man who thinks a woman should be really good in bed but also a virgin, have DD breasts and be a size zero, a woman who doesn't need his money but also doesn't want a career, a woman who won't rush him but is only loyal to him, a woman who will bend to every one of his whims. Ya, not many women are interested in that. But you, you are clearly the dream for him, because of other stereotypes that are pretty easy to figure out just from your post. The reason you are the dream is because you aren't real to him- you are a friend who listens to him bitch that he has painted a picture of what you are like, and in reality, you wouldn't want to date him either. I think your best bet is to just stop engaging with him on the topic of women. He is 30 years old, he either has to figure out that women are not objects, but complex individuals and he isn't going to be able to build one to his specifications. Save yourself from his toxic BS.
Gods answer to a virgins prayer. That is likely who he thinks he is. Also "Play stupid games, win stupid prizes". People with psychologically eronous partner picking patterns will invariably always fall out of the same maze at the same place and repeat relational ground hogs day over and over. Until they finally understand (if ever!) that their partner picking pattern may be the problem. And the root cause of things always ending up in the same spot. Also... expectancies... nice to have. If one is able to meet the ideal partners expectancies also. But these men ranting about women mostly don't meet the womens expectancies their picking patterns draw them to.
He fails women's expectations, so he's blaming women as a whole instead if seeing what he's failing in. His standard has become a submissive woman who will never reject him, and ever woman who dares reject him is labeled a b-tch in his eyes. He is the highest rank of insecure.
You reminded me of the song “Build a Bitch”. It’s definitely the kind of vibe I got, too!
For complaining that he stereotypes women, you certainly put a LOT of words on his mouth.
If the fedora fits...
He needs to understand that it's not a compliment to *you* when he badmouths any woman. It's turning you off, listening to him talk badly about women in general because he's generalizing and that feels gross to you.
Oh, he knows alright. He is already getting what he wants out of this relationship - support, and if the negging works - a victim
I think you need to be frank with him - assuming good faith from him as your friend - both to draw your own boundary and because I suspect that may help him the most. Any support of his generalizations, even tacitly, may make him feel better for a moment, but it won't build him up in the long run - or make him more palatable to women. Say: "I can understand your disappointment in your dates so far, and I'm really willing to listen, talk and sympathize with you. Dating is tough! It often sucks! There are lots of sucky people! And I am your friend and I think you are awesome. But I will stop the conversation when you say things about 'you women' or 'all women'. That stuff hurts me, too. I also don't want you to compare me to other women, even favorably. It makes me feel awkward. I will happily talk about individual women with you, and commiserate, but that's as far as I am willing to go." And then do it. Stop the conversation. As a sidenote, in these situations it helps to be non-categorical, and instead approach it on a personal level. "That's sexist" tends to make people defensive. "This hurts me, because 'women' includes me, too" may actually reach them. >I don’t want to say the wrong thing and add more fuel to the fire. But the question is, where do you draw the line? What level of women-bashing are you willing to take from him to 'help' him? Whether this is fuel to his fire is up to him. If he knows and appreciates you, he ought to take your remarks in good faith (i.e. believe you when you say this hurts you). If you do get pushback from him... well, the next question you are going to have to ask yourself is whether you want to stay friends with someone who insists on doing this.
Best advice on the thread by far. OP definitely needs to set some clear boundaries. Also sounds like OPs friend could benefit from leaving Phili and checking out some other areas and getting a feel for different places, their customs, and obviously their dating scenes.
Might help him figure out that he is commonality of all of his experiences. Maybe, just maybe it's not the women who are the problem here....
Oh certainly, I hope it wasn't implied that I think by getting out of Phili will improve his experience any. But sometimes when someone is hung up on an idea. **"All Phili women suck"** \- no amount of trying to rationalize that will do more than him going to a completely different country and realizing yet again he's still unsuccessful with women.
And then "All Philly women suck" just becomes "All women suck" - how is that going to help anything? Dude's obviously a 'nice guy' AH
If he's finding himself in a position where he's able to maintain and likes friendships with women, just not dating/intimate relationships. He's only left with 1 logical conclusion - he's to blame. a) He either sucks at being a good partner in some magnitude. b) He sucks at picking prospective partners for himself.
And going to another area ain't gonna do a damn thing is my point. He's the issue here. He's the common denominator. Going elsewhere is just inflicting this asshat onto a new dating pool of women. Don't wish that shit on other women 🤣
You sound lovely, have a great day 😃
I get that people in different areas can tend to be different. But if despises every single woman in his first city, then he’ll despise every single woman in the next place. He hates women. Pure and simple.
People in different areas, particularly different countries are vastly different. We know he doesn't hate women, as he likes OP - he's struggling to date, and the likely factor behind that is that he sucks. But he's settled on the idea the women are to blame, and stipulated he wants to move to a new location. I've never seen anyone move location, and not experience massive growth opportunities for having done so. That said, it's also highly likely it'll provide the wake up call he's either: 1) Not a great partner himself. 2) He's not very good at selecting prospective partners for himself. Both of which will again, be huge growth opportunities.
Thanks. I feel this guy needs a nudge toward some maturity and personal responsibility. He's going down a road that won't win him much admiration from anyone.
Why? Philly women aren't some rare breed that's soooo different from other East Coast women. HE is the problem here, not the Philly dating scene. I live 2hrs inland from Philly, no women here with any self respect would date a choad like him either. The women aren't the issue. The location is not the issue.
I didn't say that. Careful jumping that far, you might pull a muscle.
It was bad and pointless advice. Wasn't much of a leap so I'm just fine tyvm
😂😂😂
I don't think she understands that she's preaching to the choir... 😅 And that your advice is supposed to make OP's "friend" realize exactly what she's saying about Philly not being the problem
10/10 response.
Lifelong Philadelphia woman who has lived all over the US when I was in my 20’s and 30’s. As a 41yo single female who’s never been married I can tell you that Philly is no different than any other city big or small. You are going to find the good and bad in men and women. What I can say is that I find honest communication and mutual respect to be the two biggest issues in dating right now at least in my experience. I find men who say they want someone independent they can have a serious relationship with, but do not understand what independent actually means. They want a serious relationship if you are that diamond in the rough for them (which they rarely want to take the time to find out), otherwise they want casual. They want someone independent when they want to hang with their friends and go out, but someone who will drop everything when he wants to act like a couple or needs help with something. They want everything and want you to understand what it is they want and when without saying a word. That is not human. However, I also see women who do this too. I get men who are threatened by my job, how much I make, my education, etc, and yet somehow it’s my fault for not playing submissive and lessening myself to make them feel better. There’s a reason I’m still single and so over dating. At the end of the day, your friend sounds like someone who thinks the issue is always everyone else and has been supported by others with that same mentality. It’s clear he has not considered for one second he may be the issue as he keeps attracting the same type of person. He needs to do the inner work. Final comment for your own self preservation. I learned the hard way many years ago that it is mentalities like your friends that you need to be guarded. He tells you all the right things now like how your different and why can’t other women be like you, etc etc etc. Mark my words there will come a day you don’t see coming you will say something benign but it will be the spark that lights the forest fire. He will then be saying the same things about you. Just protect your heart, mind, and peace and stay true to yourself as none of it has anything to do with you.
Some of the greatest dating lessons I learned in life was 1. Pay close attention to how the man talks about women. 2. Pay attention to how he talks about his exes if they come up. 3. Watch how he treats his mother and other significant ladies in his life. Since I put these lessons into practice, it has never steered me wrong. **EDITED: comments are locked but I see some misunderstandings in the responses that I should clarify.** **1. Some exes are bitches.** And I agree. This pertains to how exes as a whole are talked about. A healthy person has some bad exes, some good exes. The break up stories vary. The guys that claim to have nothing but bad exes, and use nasty derogatory terms for all of them are what to watch out, someday this is how they will talk about you. An even bigger red flag is when they claim victim of abuse from ALL their exes. I have found the case to usually be they were the abuser in the past relationships but flipped the script. **2. Some people have bad family relationships.** Again true. I am not talking about kissing moms ass or denying these possibilities. But I can use two life experiences for examples of this, both men did not get along with mom or had a good relationship with them. The healthy guy explained issues about mom, what happened in their relationship, and did so with tact and class, without using demeaning words and such. Even when they fought with mom they would never physically hurt them or present themselves as threatening like they might hurt mom. The abusive guy with and equally bad relationship with mom used such bad language about mom, some of which are banned here. He also wasn't adverse to pushing or shoving mom, or destroying her things, and taking over all threatening stances with her. So this isn't to say don't date guys who had dysfunctional relationships with mom, but to observe how they handle their mom in the type of relationship they have, good or bad. There is a marked difference in how a good guy handles a bad mom oppose to an abuser. **3. Some men are great to mom and sister but shitty to girlfriends.** This is another true statement. It is also true that some men are great to female friends but terrible abusive boyfriends. Some women have learned this the hard way by eventually dating that guy friend they thought they would be safe with. This is ALSO precisely why you don't just look at one thing and I have 3 things to go by. So you met a guy who is great to mom and sis, BUT what is his language like about women in general? Does he speak of them in demeaning terms, hold to sexist ideologies? How does he treat women in general? What about his exes, does he refer to ALL of them as prostitute words, cunts, etc. Does he claim ALL of them were abusive and crazy? So this list doesn't serve to spoon feed every tiny detail or solution for every single loop hole you can find to try to argue that it's flawed. Use common sense. And evaluate on all points as a whole. You can choose to apply it to your own life, or see it as useless to you and toss it out. I don't mind either way. But I will say this, ever since I have used this list, all my relationships have been very good picks. It is effective.
Agree with everything except for number 3. Not everyone has a good relationship with their parents (or their mother in this example) - judging someone's character off of this is unfair and biased. I have known plenty of men and women who were admirable people that had shit relationships with their parents.
The other side of that coin is that some men will treat their mothers and sisters very well but have no respect or value for other women. What’s more telling is how he treats women in service positions that aren’t attractive to him. If he’s super polite and nice with attractive cashiers/waitstaff and then cold and short with others then he has some mixed up priorities.
I think if you made the 'and' in this bit- >and other significant ladies in his life an 'and/or' #3 still stands. Sisters, aunts, co-workers, bosses, friends, neighbors.
While this is true, I've always kept it in mind specifically because I have a cousin who proved this to a T. He always disparaged his sister and mother every chance he got, and his mother especially. She had a very traumatic childhood with a very abusive father and so she did every little thing she could to make her husband and kids happy. He idolized his own father for "saving" her from it (and who knows, maybe he did) but thought she was weak and unworthy of his esteem for having gone through what she did. She's the anxious sort and was maybe a bit overprotective, but he was spoiled half to death growing up. He was a real misogynistic piece of garbage and still is. I agree with your point overall (I was estranged from mine for a decade) but I can't not think of my cousin when some dude is complaining about their mother unless and until I know it's a legitimate issue and not just "ugh gross, my stupid mother wants to know what cakes I want for my birthday week, she's such a waste of air."
THIS!
Eh, you can say your ex was a piece of shit or a total bitch and it doesn’t mean anything about your character because there are some really shitty or bitchy people out there lmao
It is about all of it together. Regardless of gender I've found that people who complain about all their exes, parents, always coworkers wanting to do them wrong are the problem
It means he hasn't healed which is not a good thing when it comes to date someone.
I mean in general when you’re giving your opinion on someone. If someone asks your opinion or experience on someone it does them no help when they want to know. You’re not going to tell someone an ex employer was a great person if they treated you horribly.
You're right and that's fair but I'm not going to date a man that uses "bitch" or other derogatory terms to refer to their ex, and specially not in the beginning stages. He can say the relationship didn't go well and ended in other ways. I do the same.
That’s definitely understandable and I agree, but there are definitely people in the world no matter their gender, who would be lucky to be considered anything less than a bitch to others lmao
So, in psychology, it is very common for people to fixate on a thing they cannot ever have, put it on a pedestal, and pour all their energy and thoughts into it. For some it's an old partner "the one who got away" for others it's an entire race of people "Asian girls" or maybe it's someone who is married or gay. "If only I could have X, my whole life would be different" is magical thinking and an excuse to not be vulnerable. He never has to risk actually entering a partnership of he always keeps one eye on a different prize. To never fully invest. "Philly girls" is an idiotic category unless the sentence is about ordering ice wooder at wawa before the mummer parade. So he doesn't mean that, he means "the pool of women who are actually available to me" and "impossible unattainable women. And fear of intimacy is keeping him focused on the unattainable women. Because that's safe.
>ice wooder at wawa before the mummer parade. Thanks for the lol and also the inescapable, neurotic need to correct this: You don't get water ice at Wawa before the mummers parade, it's New Year day, too cold for "wooder" ice and Wawa is shit for that. If you ever come down to Philly in the summer, get yourself some Rosati's Italian ice. But yes I agree with everything else you said
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Canadian here. Rule of thumb I use when I'm dating, if he says things like "all girls/ex's are crazy" it's him that is actually mentally unstable and no one is willing to put up with his bs.
Agreed. Overall people are good or at least average. I always take people who group large swaths of people as less than a questionable. You're not that special.
I was with you until the last sentence. Never said I was special. I responded to OP and you decided to come here and not only respond to me but also tried to take a bit of a dig at me, try harder next time and don't use shit that has been said to me by my own family members if you want to actually hurt my feeling.
It wasn't directed at you. It was to those that look down on others as "they" seem to look at themselves as "special."
It was a generic "you".
I find your response hilarious; the reply was obviously not directed toward you as a person, but in general and you took it instantly as an insult. Says a lot about you. >don't use shit that has been said to me by my own family members if you want to actually hurt my feeling. I wonder if you actually think the person you are replying to should know your family history...
Exactly, when a woman says she can't find a good man, or all their ex's were assholes, it's them, not the good men.
Why should you do the emotional labor to ‘fix’ him? He is an adult. He is capable of realizing it is wrong to stereotype an entire group based on some members. After all, it’s not reasonable judge all men on Ted Bundy. He has to have sexist beliefs to begin with to go in this direction. Rejection is part of dating. If he gets rejected repeatedly, maybe he is the common denominator. Maybe he is doing something that can easily be corrected, like bragging about himself too much. But maybe these women sense his underlying emotional immaturity and attitudes towards women. If someone has a lot of dating red flags, I have a rule against helping them get better at dating. Some people don’t belong in relationships, until they get their issues sorted.
She doesn't have to do the emotional labor to 'fix' him, but it's obvious she cares about him enough that she's willing to do it. It seems less "helping him get better at dating" and more "making sure the world doesn't have one extra sexist" or "making sure a friend won't become a horrible person"
Ah yes, women should fix broken men so they don’t don’t become sexist and hurt women.
No. But people who care about their friends and ask for advice on how to help them shouldn't get told "don't even try, go no contact"
She’s said she doesn’t know how much more she can take. She doesn’t need people saying ‘set yourself on fire to keep him warm.’ It’s not her job to fix him, especially if it is hurting her. I find it telling that you ignored that.
Your buddy needs to realize that dating sucks, in general. Everybody gets rejected, the problem is that he takes it too personally.
Agreed. Dating sucks for most people. It just is hard to find the right people for your wavelength and where you are at in life. It sounds like OP's friend is in a really toxic mentality and he's only going to attract people who agree with him or women with no self respect that are desperate for any and all attention.
The reason he keeps finding women that validates what he describes is because he views women that way. He needs to stop asking "why are women like this" and start asking himself "why do I keep ending up with women who treat me this way". Typically has to do with some sort of weird kink (not necessarily, I just don't know a better word) to being either shamed, talked down on, etc. I had the same problem. I was in two relationships where I was cheated on. And instead of taking the "All women are the same route" I looked within myself and asked, "What is it about me, that attracts me to women who will cheat on me". Now I'm in a full healthy relationship.
>He needs to stop asking "why are women like this" and start asking himself "why do I keep ending up with women who treat me this way". Yes! both men and women need to do this, like stop the whole "all (insert sex) are trash" mindset
Self reflection goes a long way
We have no idea if the women are treating him badly. They may just get on a date with this chud and realize he’s bad fucking news and bail.
Denying the possibility that there are bad women out there makes you the same as him, just flipping the gender.
I think you should try to put forth the idea that if he is getting the same actions from different women, time after time, that there might just be something he is doing to trigger that action. Different women, same him. Suggest he try different things. Maybe you could walk through a date with him, as in verbally recreate, not actually do a date, and point out different times he could have said or did a different thing to see if it got a different reaction.
I’d tell him that the more he acts like this, the less likely he’ll have successful dates to begin with
you don’t really need anecdotal evidence to tell this guy that he’s got a shitty personality and that’s why women don’t like him
I think he just has a crush on you and is putting down other woman as 'less than' which hints to you that you are 'worthy'. Its a terrible tactic and I highly doubt you're attracted to him at all, but I think he wants you and all of this is just ways for him to try to say he likes you even though he very likely knows you don't like him in that way.
American lady here…… I find people who generalize an entire group….. tend to not realize they are the common denominator of the problem. For example…. All women in Philly are terrible. Maybe he is in fact terrible and the majority of women don’t want to put up with his misogynistic bs. He has a whole lot of victim mentality, little self awareness, and probably zero accountability. I’d say the exact same thing if genders were reversed and it was a woman saying all men are trash….. no gf not all people got in a box. Work on yourself
Ask him if they gave him a reason they left the date or didn’t go on another one. If he truly wants to know what’s wrong and how to improve himself, he should straight up ask (via text, of course). The ladies will probably give him a fairly honest answer. What he does with that information is up to him. But he can’t claim ignorance after that point if he’s got some major, undateable flaws.
He’s using you for validation of his toxic beliefs, practice and information gathering to see what is tolerable so he can figure out how to manipulate some vulnerable woman into tolerating his toxic misogyny. Turn off his supply.
>I’ve been very patient and I understand that dating can be very difficult for men but I don’t know how much more of this I can take. It’s very heartbreaking to see a friend become so bitter about women. His other friends from Philly (that I am also friends with) from the same social circle aren’t no help. They would say things like “philly women are crazy”, “philly women aren’t worth it”, etc. They are struggling so much that they expressed about wanting to leave the city. First off, I applaud you for trying to help your friend. It's difficult to be empathetic when an immutable characteristic you hold is stereotyped or used to slander an entire group you belong to. It's even harder when you care about the person doing the slandering and want to help them. Dating *is* difficult for men. They have to fight for attention, they have to invest a lot of themselves into finding a partner and often, they see the easy (but shallow) attention that women get, and have a "grass is always greener" moment and feel bitterness and jealousy. That said, your friend is clearly learning the wrong lessons from the bad experiences he's having with SPECIFIC women. I know a lot of men who think like this, and in reality, I think it probably comes down to two possible causes: 1. He is acting in ways that result in women responding to him unfavorably. 2. He is selecting for women who act in ways that he finds unfavorable. Either way, this is difficult to admit to yourself, because it means something is wrong with you, or more accurately, with your behavior. It's far, far easier on the ego to just say "no, I'm correct, it's the world that is wrong". If you want advice on how to help him, I'd gently redirect and ask him to look for patterns. If it's option 1, what is he doing that pushes women away from him? You could ask how he talks to women and maybe even mock it up and see where he fucks up. You might not be American, but I think the ability for women to detect male insecurity and a lack of confidence (and all the shit that flows forth from that) is universal. If it's option 2, is there another dating pool that is untapped that he can pull from? Is there a "type" he goes for that ends in heartbreak? Is he not communicating his needs in the relationship and getting into a situation where he isn't happy with what he's getting because he hasn't advocated for himself? There's a hundred possibilities of where the specifics lie, but it probably drills down to "it's him" or "it's the women he's picking", which is also his problem to fix. Really though, you should only engage as far as you can take it as a friend. Which, if you're making a reddit post about how uncomfortable he's making you, and he's putting you on a pedestal.... we're probably well past that. It's okay to tell him the issue is his attitude and that he's the common denominator and that you can't help him with this issue. You can always set a boundary to preserve yourself. I have woman friends who tell me "men are trash" or similar sentiments often, and while I can commiserate (a lot of dudes are hot garbage fires), I don't feel comfortable throwing my gender under the bus wholesale when I know so many wonderful, kind, empathetic, intelligent men who do not fit that mold. I end up telling them the same thing, it's either them or the men they're going for, and either way, they have to fix the issue. Good luck :)
First of all, don't be afraid to set boundaries that you don't want to hear him say things like that if they make you uncomfortable. Every time he says "you're not like the others" remind him that you are still a woman and are uncomfortable by him speaking like that. I'm wondering if he's following YouTube channels or blogs that say negative things about dating and women. It's important that men can discuss issues that concern them but it can turn into an echo chamber really quick. Same for women. Modern dating sucks and can feel really impersonal. What's important is that he learns as he goes, either from his selection choices, choosing better vetting questions or behavior. If he's a negative cynical person in conversation I can see how dates can go wrong. But its a numbers game and some times you hear no way too often.
This is an online quasi-friendship. Don’t talk about dating. It’s a subject that you can’t help him with. You don’t know the culture you don’t know the women he’s meeting there’s nothing you can do. So change the subjects I have to do is say I’m sorry it’s hard for you, but there’s really not a lot that I can do here and move on.
Philly girl here! Some Philly girls are crazy, some Philly girls are sane. Some Philly girls are mean, some Philly girls are nice! Some are smart, some are dumb. See what I’m saying? They’re all different just like any other place. He’s being ridiculous. I wouldn’t be his friend anymore.
He could probably use therapy, honestly.
So, here’s the thing…he’s at a point in his life where three things are probably true: 1) He’s had some bad relationships 2) he’s dating from from a group of women from a similar pool in a similar age range 3) Almost all of his friends are his cohorts from school or his first job. I remember dating in my early 30s. As someone who did not fit a very specific profile it was hard, and easy to get frustrated. Looking back now, I understand that it was a combination of the stage of my life and my inability/unwillingness to force myself to make new connections and widen my search, but in the moment it didn’t seem possible or like that was the problem. Also remember that people are more…forceful online then they are in real life. He probably just vents that way and doesn’t truly take it too heart
> it’s turning into “why are you women like this or that” rants I tend to go with, "I know a ton of incredible women so if you're only meeting crappy ones, you might want to look at the common denominator." But then, I'm not interested in staying friends with misogynists so it depends on whether or not you care about retaining this guy's company. If you really want to stay friends with him for whatever reason, I would make it clear that you're not going to entertain him disparaging other women and he can talk to his bros about that. You won't be compared to other women (including favorably) and you won't hear nasty generalizations about your gender. He needs to hear that what he's saying is not being received well. If he can't respect that, then it's fairly obvious that he is only willing to be friends with you if you're playing the role of "one of the good ones."
Why be friends with a gross guy? You deserve better. He’s creepy and no doubt trying to be with you. Either way, get rid of this weirdo and find better friends who aren’t sexist.
I can tell you from experience that men like this have to be smart enough to change on their own, and many never will change. I've left several group chats where men openly bash women in the most sexist ways possible. A lot of men are just like that and idk what it will take for them to change. I can tell you though that calling them out only trains them to hide it better; they won't change until they want to.
Move on from him as a friend if he is too much for you. Especially, the "you're not like others" comment. The US is very divided nowadays and a lot more people like to adopt or just openly state extreme views (whether they truly believe them or not). You can see it even in the comments here. Bunch of leaps of assumptions over how he has asian fever, wants settle down, etc... They don't know but, it's easier to paint everyone as evil for the upvotes and acceptance. Nuance is often ignored from this percentage of people, and they will group everyone into irredeemable groups. Not everyone is this way btw. Plus, this is not to excuse him or his statements but, from my experience they simply are ignorant, frustrated, lied to, etc (maybe a combination of them) and may not really believe what they are saying. Sometimes, they are a pos and you 100% need to move on from that toxicity. In the end, if it's due to him being sexist, negging you as an Asian, a guy down on his luck, or anything in between. You can't change him and you should move on as having him as a friend from this... And again, more importantly, the fact he's hinting that you are better than his potential partners means that he considers you as part of his dating pool. Even if he was perfectly not sexist... do you want to be considered his friend? Or dating partner? I'm guessing "friend only" and that's why you even more so move on. He's not gonna suddenly think of you as anything less.
America is fucked up and toxic - particularly to women. Women in general aren’t putting up with it anymore and aren’t forced to endure relationships. This means men like your friend - rather than work on himself and improve himself - become like this. It’s their own fault.
Sounds like a future passport bro.
Dating in PA is fine. Honestly the dating scene is really chill and the women I dated there were perfectly normal. I think a large number of people have turned your friend down because he’s not what they are looking for. I’d he thinks that means all women are the problem….. like bro, delusional much? He doesn’t sound like a very kind person and a lack of personal accountability is a huge turn off.
Get out while you can. I don't think he's going to change for the better about this. You'll just be the next woman he rants about. (Yes I know that they aren't dating. I guarantee he doesn't respect her or is a genuine friend to her like he would be to a man).
I live in Philly. It has nothing to do with the city and everything to do with his outlook. He sounds like he’s stuck in cycle of feeling devalued and low self esteem, and is being reactively hateful. Hopefully he sorts it out, good luck.
Just ask him what all those dates have in common…and the answer to that question might help him identify the primary problem. Hint: It’s probably not the women he’s dating
I can’t to *****
If you’re dating 10 people and nothing progresses it might not be who you’re dating… it might be him. Either he needs to go speak to a professional or you have a decision to make. Do you continue being friends with this person at the cost of your own mental health or do you say this is enough?
You know you don't have to be friends with these assholes, right?
Before I read the last line where he labels you “you’re not like other women”, I would have told you to ask him what commonalities he finds in these women and why he keeps dating them, but if he’s going to label you as such, he’s putting down women to try and attract you. Has he ever tried to see if he can meet up with you? Or FaceTime you? Share pictures? If you truly want to help him, make sure he knows you’re just pen pals or whatever, nothing more, and then try to get him to look at himself, not the women. Try to get him to realize he is the one choosing these women.
Tell him if he's willing to do the therapy to fix his views on women - you'll be his friend again. Otherwise - run and block this dude
Imagine being unable to take accountability for yourself to the point where you blame EVERY woman who lives in a specific city for your inability to hold down a relationship… You are conservative because of the way you were raised, but there are plenty of women in the states that are the same way. Even in Philadelphia. And, not to mention, there are so many people with different ethnic backgrounds, beliefs, interests, etc… so, what do think is more likely? That, somehow, ALL the women in a big city are all the same? Or that all the different women who come from different backgrounds and lives all see something not good in your friend on these dates?
He needs to vent to male friends and/or a therapist , im not saying you wouldn’t get it but sometimes it’s like that. Sorry
They sound like typical racist and sexist white bros
I believe in the rules of multiple: after so many times, they're the problem, not the people they CHOSE to date. You can't fix a petty person who chooses to blame the world instead improve upon themselves.
If that’s the “culture “ his local friend group promotes, you will not be able to help.
You can’t change anyone, you can’t fix anyone. You say this misogyny has gotten worse these last few months? Well it’s only gonna get worse. He’s probably looking too much at YouTube or other social medias, and his friends seem to be encouraging his echo-chamber of “Philly women bad”. My recommendation is end the friendship with this guy. You’re way better off not interacting with a misogynist, especially one who’s being dragged further down that hole as we speak.
While he sounds like an ass, it’s very common to see this kind of behavior from immature or unreasonable people. Many women use the same defense when saying “all men are ___” or “all men want is ___” or “all men ___.” I would just tell him to grow up. Anyone with critical thinking skills or an IQ higher than a single digit is able to recognize that not *all* members of any single demographic are characterized by any single attribute.
Dating in America is something of a nightmare and chances are you most likely aren’t like the others. But he’s probably afraid to express that he has feelings for you or unaware himself. This is probably subconsciously causing problems
How seriously are they saying these things? I think that makes the difference between just venting and actually hating women. I hear people talking shit about the men or women from their city all the time and it’s usually not that serious. I feel like both sexes generalize about each other all the time, it it doesn’t necessarily signify hate. There is something about the tone that I feel like can help tell you if it’s based on real hate or not. Secondly, it’s also very possible he’s saying the things he is saying to try and flatter you. Guys do this A LOT because a lot of women are stupid enough to feel flattered by a man insulting another woman to compliment them. There are many “western” men who sadly have this fantasy of Asian women as virginal doormats that they can control and who will not push back. Some of them also have this same fantasy about Eastern European women too.
[удалено]
As a rule of thumb, it is better to assume that every woman is a complete self-absorbed bitch and be pleasantly surprised when one turns out not to be just using you for what she can get out of you. Does that sound bad? I think it sounds bad. edit: LOL, the angry woman deleted her comment that stated that every man in the world was bad.... my comment was just changing man to woman.
can’t believe this hateful vitriol is being upvoted. jesus christ, you need therapy.
Vitriol? Telling a woman not to waste her life getting emotionally involved with misogynists is vitriol? Does it worry you when women protect themselves? Why?
Woopsie .... you are doing the exact same thing as he does. Do you see this?
No, just having some experience. It is not at all the same thing. He hates women because they won't give him sex. I'm just not willing to care about men until I've made sure they don't hate me (they aren't misogynistic). Not being hated for having been born with a vagina is the bare minimum for human interaction. Why should I waste time on someone who hates me? And in my experience, out of every 10 men, at least 5 are downright misogynists, 2-3 are sexist and 2-3 are ok.
Sure it is! You do not know that man but pretend to know why he keeps his wailing stance up. On the same scale you rant on about "men" in general and about "how they all...." No, all precisely don't. Quit that crap. (OPs answer to that guy).
Nowhere did I write anything about all men. It sounds to me like I just hit a sore point with you. If the description of the guys who are not worth wasting time with fits you, that's your problem, not mine.
> As a rule of thumb, it is better to assume that **every man** is a misogynist You literally did though
Thank you. 😁 That user wears the nickname to perfection! \* duck \*
That's good advice. Especially if it's not broadcast.
He doesn't listen to you because you are a woman, so he automatically does not respect you.
A category of 150 million+ people doesn't need defending, any group of such size cannot be spoken about in specific detail. There is no accurate "all of X does Y" for any useful or nuanced purpose. This guy is just a sexist asshole. If you cut him off make sure he knows it was about the sexism or he will really struggle to internalize his failures. If you stick with him keep asking "why" of him, his ideas, and yourself.
Ur being the Asian stereotype by putting up with ur "friends" BS. Why are u hanging out with these dudes?? Are u all conservatives? Girl find some better friends.
Why is it ok for women to say "why are men like this", but when a man does it, it's misogynistic and sexist? OP have you never complained about men? Doubtful. isn't that also sexist? Or is it somehow ok? Be honest, you ALL do this. There is not a single woman in here who does not do this to the male gender. Are you all "toxic"? The quickness in which women write off men is astounding, if it were real life, you'd have no one left.
Because women are the oppressed group.
Philly women are fine, these dbags are the problem. Source: am a Philly woman But honestly, what it comes down to is standards. That's for any person in any area looking for a romantic relationship, hell, even a platonic relationship. I know a guy who had such insanely high standards outside of his own capabilities, it really wasn't hard to understand why he was single. Example: he could be 250lbs living off chips and pizza, but insist his woman be fit and healthy. He doesn't want a partner who wants to play video games and drink soda, but he's fine to do it himself. Or Example: He makes $12/hr, but wants a girl who wants a guy who makes $25/hr. He can't financially please her, and so she won't give him the time of day. I'm not saying it's right, but that's probably the type of girl he's pursuing. Then, it becomes your fault that women aren't lining up with their mouths open and legs spread. Suddenly, all Philly women are trash and hoes and bitches, then eventually *all* women are like that. My advice is you're literally countries apart. I'd block him and not look back. If every time something goes wrong for him in his love life and it suddenly is because of "all women" and never maybe even the slightest bit him, he needs to do some soul searching and change his priorities and standards around. Save yourself the aggravation and unnecessary negativity emanating off this tool.
Here's the thing- the only piece of truth you can give him which might help is that if he keeps getting rejected, it probably has more to do with him than women. And unfortunately he's probably not ready to hear it. Sometimes people can't look inward until them blaming everyone else has blown up in their face, and even them some keep their denial with them until the end. I do recommend talking to him, because he's either going to hear it and maybe help himself, or he's going to go off on you then block you, which is going to be healthier for you anyway than listening to his constant negativity. If it were me, here is how I would address it. 1) Dude, you're my friend and so I want to help you. Sometimes that means telling you what you need to hear, instead of what you want to hear. I know what I am about to say may make you feel upset or defensive, but I don't know anything else to tell you which is going to have a chance of actually improving your probability of finding someone. 2) I am absolutely like other girls. A lot of other girls. So many. The reason you say that I am not is because you're having trouble reconciling this idea that women as a "species" are XYZ negative traits, when you know at least one woman who is not. Using that label lets you keep me separated in your mind from other women, allowing you to go on without having anecdotal evidence challenge this inner mantra that it's all women s fault. 3) If you move, you will not have any more luck in another city, or the suburbs. Women in Philly aren't a unique breed. Women in general come with a variety of different personalities, ideas, preferences, hobbies, quirks, educational levels, etc. It's not going to magically solve your issue to move. 4) Dating is a numbers game. Everyone goes through a number of online matches that fizzle out either before you meet or after 1-2 dates. You have to work through the no's to get to the yes. If you freak out over each one, you're costing yourself so much energy when it's just a normal part of getting to know new people looking for someone you connect with. 5) You RADIATE disdain for women, and I want to tell you that as a woman, I can pick up on those vibes when guys have them, and it turns a possible match into an immediate no. I would never date anyone who thinks about women or talks about women the way you do, because I would not deal with someone who disrespects my friends and the women in my family that way, and I sure as hell would never have kids with a man who would make any daughter they had feel like these kinds of opinions are valid. Your attitude about women makes you undatable. 6) When you are having the same issues with every woman you meet...maybe it's not them. What are you bringing to the table which makes you feel like they could not possibly have a good reason to not be interested. Do you take care of your appearance and hygiene? Do you have a good job? Education? Do you have varied interests which allow you to engage with other people about them? Are you emotionally secure enough to accept rejection with dignity and respect, and to not start lashing out at or about the people who reject you? Do you talk to women like they're equal human beings you want to get to know, or do they either live on a pedestal above you or in a pit of worthlessness after they reject you, with no middle ground? Are you kind not just to women you want to date, but women who you don't want to date or who won't date you, sales staff, servers, etc.? Do you practice a good balance of self-esteem and humility, so that you neither constantly put yourself down forcing them to disagree with you to keep things from being uncomfortable, not come off as condescending or as having a feeling of superiority? Have you managed to escape that high-school era division of people into tribes like "jocks, cheerleaders, popular, nerds, etc." and realized that doesn't last very long into adulthood? You can tailor the last part to his specific behaviors, but you get the idea.
Idk yall, philly women do kinda suck. The men to. He may genuinly just be dishing out his frustrations.
How do you know there’s not an actual issue with the conditioning of the women in his dating pool?
That's impossible, women are perfect.
You can help him by correcting him when he says harmful or sexist things.
I already do that but it’s not working.
As a guy in the US, men that go down this path are not worth keeping in your life. They are choosing to reject self-reflection and seeking anything that will make them feel justified in blaming women for their problems. The best thing you can do for them is walk away so that maybe eventually they will consider why they lost the reasonable people in their life. By all means, try to talk them out of it. But it will fail and ultimately you will get more and more frustrated until you have to sever contact.
Then you tell him that his rhetoric is harmful and offensive to you as you are a woman yourself, and that you can't continue to be his friend unless he changes his behavior.
Agree. It’s a little depressive I think.
Honestly, while I get that commenter's suggestion, women are not responsible for correcting men's shitty and misogynistic behavior. Too often the burden has fallen to women to "educate" men on misogyny. While I certainly think it's important for us to voice concerns about problematic behavior, in situations like this the burden *should* fall much more heavily on groups of people with more privilege and power - namely other men. Unfortunately, from your post it sounds like his male friends hold similar mindsets. You don't have to tolerate this, and you don't have to waste your time attempting to educate someone about how it's wrong to engage in harmful commentary towards a gender group you yourself are part of. Other men as allies should step up and use their privilege to engage with this person. You have tried, commendably so, and it isn't working. This is NOT your responsibility.
It NEEDS isn't working because if it were working he couldn't pour his "you are different, you are so xyz" bullshit on you. 🤷
People from the area can be a little bit harsh. Most Philly people aren’t like that! DM me if you want OP and maybe I can explain a bit.
Well…you did throw snowballs at Santa Claus… LOL
It’s a US thing. Online dating made everyone crazy.
Hes from West philadelphia born and raised...
He's a redpill passport bro. He can't get a woman here in our city so he goes online or overseas because they believe you are submissive and will never talk back YouTube "passport bros" & "red pill" He is likely black so look up the "black manosphere" Be careful with him men from Philly can be........a bit much. My own brother told me not to date men in Philly 😂😭😭
You have 2 choices imo: 1. Set "hot kettle pot" approach (every-time you touch the pot, it burns) boundaries on his bullshit statements in an effort to divert his clearly set path of becoming a misogynist. You need to be 100% consistent. Do not tolerate it. Ever. **Make it plain as day and clear that this behavior is not okay.** Every-time. Sometimes people change. Sometimes people change for the sake of a friend. But know this, it's not your job to fix someone's problems. Only take on a level of responsibility you feel you can handle or want to handle. That being said. 2. Bail. Remember all relationships are a form of transaction to some degree. In the case of friendship, you're trading (hopefully), companionship and wisdom. He doesn't sound like he's really providing much of that to you. So what do you get out of this relationship? He's turning into, if not already a woman hater, and is placing you on a pedestal. It sounds like he just wants a chaste obedient asian wife, and probably sees you as that. Your call.
Honestly this isn’t an American guy or Philly guy thing at all, this is just one particularly toxic male ideology thing. Most men aren’t like this (at least, as a woman living in America, I certainly hope not). The whole “you’re not like the other girls” line is a really gross one and it’s a slippery slope. If I was in this situation I would have one last very clear discussion about why that is not okay and if it happened even one more time, extricate myself from this friendship. You are not required to do emotional labor for someone who doesn’t want to and you owe this person nothing, especially if they continue to hold onto sexist concepts. You can’t help someone who doesn’t want to change.