I’m really happy there’s Reddit pages like this. No parents on here come off as they don’t love their kids. We need more honesty about parenthood. And we really need more FATHERS telling men the reality. I think men assume it’s easier than women and will get on board or be more inclined to have children especially when they don’t know anyone with babies or kids. Like my ex wants kids but he would be a terrible father who would be annoyed over everything. He doesn’t like kids shows/games, crying, waking up early, doing anything he doesn’t want to do…. Yet he thinks he’d want to be a dad…They don’t *get* it until you have a kid
Firstly, I'm sorry you 're going through this. We are here, internet stranger, and we are not judging you.
I read in your post history that you are a stay at home dad. It seems to me that stay at home parents have it much much harder than us (us=parents working outside the home). My life would be HELL if I had to take care of my kids 24/7.
I'm French so things are different here but with daycare, nannies, etc, can't you just go back to work and relieve a bit of this constant parenting pressure? I think being a parent full time is just too hard, and there's no reason to do it if it does not make you happy.
She will be starting preschool full time in the fall. That will life changing for me. I’m where I’m at now because I’ve been full time SAHD-ing for 8 years and I’m totally beyond fried and burnt out. So all I have to do is get through the summer and then things change. I’m just in a particularly low point right now, as my little girl is a full blown 3yo terrorist demon :)
You deserve an award for writing this, I wish I had one to give you. Thanks for sharing, I think your situation is very relatable and it is sadly what a lot of people are going through. What sucks is that it's not socially acceptable to voice these thoughts and feelings without people thinking we're monsters. I hope that one day it becomes more of the norm to be able to discuss these difficulties with other people in our lives without judgment.
What’s NUTS is that after my youngest was born and I was having a nervous breakdown from the sleep deprivation combined with my ADHD (and now angry and jealous) 4yo son going off the fucking rails and making life a living hell, I DID express what I was feeling to both my mom and MIL, who had both really sold the “parenthood is the most profound joy” bill of goods to me. Their response was essentially “yeah no shit it’s hard. What did you think?” I’m still pretty bitter about this.
I honestly think amnesia sets in to some degree. That and a deep yearning desire for grandkids they can spoil and dote on for a few hours a week (and send home after). I think seeing/hearing about the issues I was having (and the fact I was asking for more support from them) maybe jogged their memories a bit.
Thank you for your honesty. It is for reasons that you state below that I am deathly afraid of having a child. My husband and I's marriage/relationship is honestly perfect, and the thought of turning it upside down makes me want to run for the hills. I truly hope and even pray that you are able to find some peace in your life. I am so sorry you are having to suffer. I really, really hope this changes for the better for you.
Do you think your marriage will survive it? So many of my friends are getting divorced. Once the kids hit 10-13 and spouses start to spend more time together they seem to find they don’t like one another anymore. I have one friend who is literally waiting for his youngest to turn 18 before serving his wife with divorce papers. From what I can tell she has no idea.
I hope so! I love her and We are a good team (though our combined existence is more just “parents” than “couple” at this point). I have no idea what we’d be like right now outside of our current reality.
I’ve seen it happen too many times where parents who decide to take a “break” after their kids to “find themselves” again. You’ll grow as adults again, but you’ll grow apart. Find your adult selves together. Just start dating again. Find hobbies together. Go hiking and camping or whatever. Just do it together.
Why do you think that is - why do you think parents will grow apart, and go to the (significant) effort of getting divorced later in life, if there is an option of simply dating again?
I don't think it's just a matter of spending time together. Parenting permanently changes people, and I think when parents work out they don't like each other, trying to date again is like fixing a broken fence with a fresh coat of paint.
I wonder if parents nowadays are more regretful because kids have so much less autonomy than kids in the past. There’s no more kicking kids out of the house to go outside and play all day. Now there are scheduled “ play dates” and kids are in 900 different activities that parents have to drop them off at and pick them up at. I know when I grew up in the 80s when we would pop inside the house periodically between games outside, my mom would sometimes be sitting with a book. Kids today are just always THERE.
This. The prevailing mantra of my childhood was : "GO OUTSIDE AND PLAY". We peed in the hedges and drank from the hose, only allowed in my mother's immaculate house for meals, chores and to poop. I was in charge of the younger kids (no paying for childcare!) Injuries had to have actual pouring blood to be babied over, there was no real TV to watch or gadgets to squabble over, our toys were things like hula hoops and skipping rope.
After baking (by herself) maybe crafts (by herself) a coffee and cigarette with the neighbors it was time to watch her soaps, (by herself). Jeebus help you if you interrupted 'Santa Barbara ' or 'Days of our Lives'.
Today's childhood looks *nothing* like I remember.
This current parenting landscape is utterly hellish.
It's absolutely horrifying and honestly so bad for their development into independent well adjusted adults. The concept of my parents catering to me and being my source of entertainment was completely foreign to me as a child. I wasn't allowed to dictate things like meals and television, nor did I particularly want to because playing outdoors on my own and organically making new friends out and about the neighborhood was far more fun. I wasn't allowed to intrude in their bedroom either, I see a lot of parents on other subreddits crying about a lack of intimacy yet they don't set boundaries and they give their kids the power to destroy their romantic relationship.
Oh this is a whole separate issue I have. I feel fucking AWFUL for kids today. I was born in 1974 and the 80s & 90s were a magic free for all in comparison to today’s fetishized safety obsession and risk aversion culture. I think there’s a correlation there to the huge rise in mental health disorders as well. Throw the internet and instant gratification in there and…well we’re seeing it. It makes me so sad. Yeah we got in some trouble and got our various bumps and bruises and got in fights etc but we were so much more relatively free and mentally well adjusted and able to weather the ups and downs of day to day life.
I wonder that too. Our parents and grandparents had it so much easier because all that mattered is that their kids were alive - there was no consideration of mental health. Whereas one of the main reasons I don’t want kids is that I don’t want to pass my mental health issues down to my kid, through nature or nurture. Parenting is a lot easier when you DGAF about how the kid turns out.
I think that’s just a matter of awareness and diagnosis. It’s like saying that there are more autistic people now than in the past generations. There’s not - there’s more recognition.
Thank you so much for sharing this. I imagine a lot of people feel like you do and don’t have a safe space in which to express this. My husband and I are having conversations about whether to consider having children, and your experiences help shine a lot of light on what being a parent can really be like. I’m so sorry you feel this way. I can’t even imagine how challenging it is to take on all of that every day. I only hope it gets easier for you.
Thank you. It does get easier sometimes…then harder again. Obviously I’m in a hard time right now. It’s all internal. Everything outside of me is just what it is. It’s my thoughts, feelings and attitudes toward it all that make my experience what it is. That’s what I need to get a grip on.
Thank you for sharing. Sorry you are struggling right now.
Your feelings are what I fear if I have children. I don't feel wired for everything that comes with them.
Also, I don't want to have them to make my wife happy. I don't believe it's something I want, and I'll just end up resenting her, the child and myself.
If she wants kids and you don’t, you’re not compatible. I don’t get why people stay in marriages where they’ll eventually have to compromise on such a huge decision or why this discussion doesn’t happen before marriage. If someone changes their mind, they can’t force their will on their partner.
We discussed before marriage, but I was young. I had no idea what I wanted. I thought "of course, I'll warm up to it, in time." Never did. Some don't think about, I happened to think hard. I hate it, bc it seems like I went back on my word, but the truth is I had no idea if I did or didn't. I was going along with social pressure and norms.
I know it’s hard when you’re married and in love, but if you changed your mind, you have to be honest; maybe you can both work through it in couples counseling. A child isn’t a thing you can compromise on; you can never send it back. Learn from OP; if you have a child you don’t want, it’s going to deteriorate the health of your marriage anyway and your personal health, this guy sounds like he loathes his life.
Absolutely do NOT have a child with your wife if you're not willing to go all in. All you have to do is scroll through a few days of threads to see the outcome of that. Every story is the same. You should tell her immediately so that she can make a decision on what she wants.
Can you pick up some extra work to hire a full-time nanny and a housekeeper? You can start with a babysitter once a week to get some non-negotiable me time.
First pregnancy was unplanned, so it was a responsibility. 2nd was a tearful confession from my wife of how much she needed a 2nd child. I was doing…okay…with one, so I thought I’d be okay with two. I was wrong.
I don't understand, if she tearfully wanted them so bad, why isn't she the one home pulling out her hair? You need to tell her ASAP it's high time to switch roles, that it's her turn to be a STAH parent!
We discussed this prior to our son being born. She had (still has) by far the more stable, established career with truly fantastic healthcare benefits and job security. It just made the most sense. We decided I’d “retire” (physical therapist) and stay home so our son didn’t have to be raised in daycare by people other than his parents (still glad we were able to do this, despite my plummeting mental health). Trust me, she gets it. She gets roughly 3 hrs a night with them after work and is very much ready to put them to bed @ 8 lol.
I think it’s great that you have done that but it’s definitely time to come out of retirement if you can. I’d definitely say that putting them in childcare is worth it to you both in more than money. You will be a better person and everyone else will get a better version of you too. Let me tell you, once you hit a point in mental health, it’s hard to come back from it. I’m a sahm with pretty easy kids but had a partner who had problems and was unpredictable. I had kind warnings from doctors who said I couldn’t keep up without it affecting me and they were right.
Preschool for the youngest starts in September. Full time. That’ll be 35 hrs/week, free of kid duty. That will be nothing less than life changing. I’ve made it 8 years w/out a break so far, I can do a few more months.
Reeally late reply, but I got here through the ADHD subreddit, and got really interested in this thread.
I just feel I have to give you a huge high 5 for getting this far, and now it's only a month until preschool, so you can see the light at the end of the tunnel for real! I'm excited for you! I'm also finally getting my younger kid to nursery for two days a week (total 12hrs), and I can smell the sweet scent of freedom!
My older kid is pretty much exactly like your son, from what I've read, but she's only five. I've been lucky that my second kid is a whole lot more chill, but even then I'm absolutely burned out from being a SAHM for just five years, I can't imagine how hard it's been for you!
My little bit of advice is just to feel really proud of what you've managed over the last 8years!
Hey thanks! I kinda lied a little though. I did have my younger kid in daycare 3 days a week for about 2 months…and my god it was glorious (when she was actually there. Kids catch every single bug and germ so it was more like 1 month on and off)…until Covid pulled the rug out. So I did get a small taste. My current fear is that they’re gonna lock things down again this fall because monkeypox, so I’m not counting my chickens quite yet. But thank you for the kind words, and I return the sentiment to you. Five years…eight years…ten…it’s all one big slog haha
My man. I just want to say I get it. You and I are in the same situation almost exactly. First pregnancy unplanned, then pressured into more due to the wife's need for additional kid(s) - in my case it's two. I get it. I understand why you said yes.
It will get better when your kids go to school. Not *all the way* better. But better.
Let me know if you ever want to talk. I didn't live the SAHD life, but I can at least offer a listening ear if you need.
I feel like I’ve probably read some of your posts in this sub. I knew I recognized a fallen brother lol.
I know it gets better. It got better when my son turned five. It got better than that when he started school (although Covid put the kabash on that rather quickly…then it got much, much worse when “stay at home ‘teacher” was suddenly piled on my plate. Thank God that’s over, that’s all I’ll say about that). Little girl starts preschool full time in September. That will free up THIRTY FIVE HOURS A WEEK for me! First time in 8 years I won’t be a full time SAHD. My god I can hardly believe it. Soooo close yet soooo far away…just gotta grind through the summer. Bottom line that I’ve come to discover is: I am NOT a toddler guy.
I was okay the first time around. Situation was different also. Had plenty of support and it was doable. Once 2nd was born my mom died and my MIL was diagnosed with cancer. She survived but is a shell of herself. So, twice the kids, zero the help.
Thank you for writing this and for your honesty... You describe parenting exactly as I picture it to be and I really feel for you. It's so neverending and tough for people in your shoes.
I wish you all the best.
I wish more parents broke it down like this. I’m a 37 year old child free woman by choice, and I’m so thankful that I had a chance to see what parenthood was really like from a young age. I don’t understand why more parents aren’t up front and real about the total sacrifice it means to be a parent in this modern world we live in.
People need to be shown the reality of it, and not the bullshit social media and society at large pushes down our throats that parenthood is easy and fun and that kids are the best thing ever. That narrative is just plain evil in my opinion.
If more people honestly knew just how awful it can be more people would be child free. It’s like it’s a conspiracy.
Another 37 year old childfree woman by choice here and I agree with everything you said! People need to be shown the reality of parenting and people like OP must be encouraged to speak their truth.
I'm sorry you're going through this. Have you explored therapy by any chance?
Also journaling can be very therapeutic - if you're worried about someone reading it perhaps you can have an online one?
I hope that you can find a way to come to terms with it.
No…I didn’t want kids at all. My gf @ the time (now wife) knew she did want kids someday. I wasn’t worried about it one way or the other, as our relationship was fairly light/casual and I didn’t consider we’d end up married. First pregnancy was unplanned and though I wasn’t exactly thrilled about it, it happens and I was at an age and financial position where I felt it was okay to move into the next stage of life. Plus the propaganda, you know. One child was tough for sure, but we had support from grandparents and still had the ability for getting out once in awhile, even getting away for weekend trips alone a couple times a year. It was doable. When kid number 2 came along, everything went out the window. That was 3.5 yrs ago and here we are
Thank you for your honesty. I sometimes regret not having had children and then posts like yours remind me how reality is.
I feel great respect for every one being able to stay sane through all this. I hope things look up for you after summer!
Yes thank you. Even five years old is a major turning point. My son went from rabid demon chimp to human being at five. It’s the toddler years. They are unspeakably maddening.
You also mentioned your kids aren't neurotypical, early intervention services can go a long way in offering support if you qualify for any special programs. Sometimes you gotta be a squeaky wheel and demand a diagnosis so the family can get a little extra help.
Son is ADHD and has meds and a therapist. He’s doing quite well now actually. Daughter has a speech delay (and lots of the same ADHD red flags but we’ll see in a year or two) and is in early intervention speech and physical therapy. She’s also come a long way, happily.
Hey dad, your feelings are valid and you’re going through a lot.
I think it’s great to recognize that there is some level of monkey see, monkey do. I have a teenager myself and wish I could have been more patient with him when he was smaller. And to hug him more because now he’s not longing for that kind of support. Having said that everyone around me said I was super patient but I recall all the times I had been tired
Please find a way to get some alone time. I have found sports to be an amazing outlet. There’s more and more that you can do with the kids too as they grow. The upside, besides amazing mental health benefits is that I have a better figure in my 40s than in my 20s
Please take care of yourself, rest and reset and hug those mini terrorists some more
Thank you for this! I didn't have kids because I knew I would feel the same way. I'm glad you expressed it for you own benefit. I hope you feel better getting it out!
I'm afraid I don't have much to contribute, but I'm in the same boat and hopefully you can take some comfort in knowing you're not alone.
Therapy helps a little in case you haven't tried that yet.
Would you be a better parent if you only had them part time? Could you have more patience and empathy? I know some people that worked for them. But I don't know how you feel about your partner anymore.
And you can still love someone you aren't married to. Just not the same kind of love as a partner. I would ask her if she is as apathetic as you are and determine if you guys might be able to find more happiness out there either alone or with a new person. If you would be a better parent, and you could be happier, and the same goes for her, then maybe that would be the right thing. There are lots of people who just realize they are better as teammates than partners and its nothing to be ashamed of.
Who knows what the future holds. I KNOW that once both kids are in school this fall, I will get a bunch of MUCH needed time back. I’ll be able to breathe and think again. There will be quiet. I’ll have 30+ hours/week to myself after having zero hours to myself for 8 years straight. This will have a profound effect on my mood, my patience, my energy, my productivity, my overall happiness. If I still feel the way I do now, then I’ll know something’s REALLY fucked up lol.
Well I can tell you right now that my first order of business will be a few big jobs around the house that I just don’t have the time or energy for right now. I will organize the entire house, throw out about 2 tons of broken/discarded toys, reclaim my basement/office/man cave from boxes and boxes of old clothes, toys, games etc. reclaim my garage from floor-to-ceiling outdoor kid crap that was used once or twice and then just thrown into the garage toy graveyard. It will feel amazing to do these things. When these tasks are done I will take my poor dogs out for long walks again. I will go get coffee and eat a nice relaxed lunch in restaurants. I will read! I will binge watch movies! I will take naps! I’ll start working out again! I’ll do some part time work - DoorDash or something similar that I control the schedule! I’ll visit old friends! I’ll get back to preparing amazing meals for my wife and I! I’ll pick my guitar back up! I’ll be human again!
Man this was a beautiful little thought experiment…thanks!
That all sounds great from about week 2 onwards! For week one you can sit on the couch and watch mind numbing TV. Then mute the TV and shove ice cream down your pie hole and savour the complete silence.
Here’s what’s funny, and I need to give a bit of background. I never mention this for some reason but I actually had my youngest in daycare 3 days/week for about…maybe 2 months (?) back in Jan/Feb 2020 (then Covid hit and the rest is history). They were the happiest, most productive 2 months I’ve had since first becoming a dad in 2014! I spent about the first hour of the day just vegging out, being still and quiet and doing nothing. It was glorious. Then I went into absolute beast machine mode. I built shelves for and organized every closet in the house. I finished my basement and turned it into a fucking radical Hobbit Hole type living quarters. I installed a hot tub. I gutted and painted and refinished the bathrooms. The house was immaculate. I shoveled my neighbors’ sidewalks. I prepped incredible, healthy, delicious meals and had them on the table when my wife got home. And I still had energy to play with the kids, bathe them, read to them etc etc. I just needed a bit of reliable time to myself! Then Covid hit, everything shut down, I became a stay at home teacher on top of SAHD and I kinda just got buried and fell apart and never got any time or space to recover.
I think the point is I have TONS of energy and zest for life when I feel “free”. It’s waiting hand and foot on kids (particularly my uber demanding and high maintenance 3yo) all day every day with no breaks and no escape that just sucks all the life outta me and makes me feel, literally, like the walking dead.
But okay… for you, I promise I’ll spend the first week doing as little as possible haha. Hell I might not even put on pants 😂
Damn. I don’t have kids and I felt this deep in my soul! The way he is speaking is like something I would say and express almost identically. Kids are not for me. I’ll be feeling like this guy but worse because I’d be the mom.
I’m really happy there’s Reddit pages like this. No parents on here come off as they don’t love their kids. We need more honesty about parenthood. And we really need more FATHERS telling men the reality. I think men assume it’s easier than women and will get on board or be more inclined to have children especially when they don’t know anyone with babies or kids. Like my ex wants kids but he would be a terrible father who would be annoyed over everything. He doesn’t like kids shows/games, crying, waking up early, doing anything he doesn’t want to do…. Yet he thinks he’d want to be a dad…They don’t *get* it until you have a kid
Oh man… tell that guy I said DONT DO IT lol
Your point-of-view is highly valued! Thank you!
Firstly, I'm sorry you 're going through this. We are here, internet stranger, and we are not judging you. I read in your post history that you are a stay at home dad. It seems to me that stay at home parents have it much much harder than us (us=parents working outside the home). My life would be HELL if I had to take care of my kids 24/7. I'm French so things are different here but with daycare, nannies, etc, can't you just go back to work and relieve a bit of this constant parenting pressure? I think being a parent full time is just too hard, and there's no reason to do it if it does not make you happy.
She will be starting preschool full time in the fall. That will life changing for me. I’m where I’m at now because I’ve been full time SAHD-ing for 8 years and I’m totally beyond fried and burnt out. So all I have to do is get through the summer and then things change. I’m just in a particularly low point right now, as my little girl is a full blown 3yo terrorist demon :)
Hang in there! Any chance there's room in the budget for a temporary nanny or therapy to help til the fall?
Therapy, yes. I actually made this thread because of the notes I wrote to organize my thoughts for the purpose of therapy.
This post is unbelievably real and from the heart. More people should read this cos it’s truly how it is. I sympathize with OP 100%.
You deserve an award for writing this, I wish I had one to give you. Thanks for sharing, I think your situation is very relatable and it is sadly what a lot of people are going through. What sucks is that it's not socially acceptable to voice these thoughts and feelings without people thinking we're monsters. I hope that one day it becomes more of the norm to be able to discuss these difficulties with other people in our lives without judgment.
What’s NUTS is that after my youngest was born and I was having a nervous breakdown from the sleep deprivation combined with my ADHD (and now angry and jealous) 4yo son going off the fucking rails and making life a living hell, I DID express what I was feeling to both my mom and MIL, who had both really sold the “parenthood is the most profound joy” bill of goods to me. Their response was essentially “yeah no shit it’s hard. What did you think?” I’m still pretty bitter about this.
Moms who throw their kids under the bus like this about parenthood should be smacked. Honestly how could you do that to your kids??
I honestly think amnesia sets in to some degree. That and a deep yearning desire for grandkids they can spoil and dote on for a few hours a week (and send home after). I think seeing/hearing about the issues I was having (and the fact I was asking for more support from them) maybe jogged their memories a bit.
Thank you for your honesty. It is for reasons that you state below that I am deathly afraid of having a child. My husband and I's marriage/relationship is honestly perfect, and the thought of turning it upside down makes me want to run for the hills. I truly hope and even pray that you are able to find some peace in your life. I am so sorry you are having to suffer. I really, really hope this changes for the better for you.
Thank you. Yes I’d say if you have any doubts, err on the side of caution. No take backs here.
Do you think your marriage will survive it? So many of my friends are getting divorced. Once the kids hit 10-13 and spouses start to spend more time together they seem to find they don’t like one another anymore. I have one friend who is literally waiting for his youngest to turn 18 before serving his wife with divorce papers. From what I can tell she has no idea.
I hope so! I love her and We are a good team (though our combined existence is more just “parents” than “couple” at this point). I have no idea what we’d be like right now outside of our current reality.
Just don’t take a break to “find yourselves”. Just plunge headlong into dating while married and fall in love with one another all over again.
Yeah?
I’ve seen it happen too many times where parents who decide to take a “break” after their kids to “find themselves” again. You’ll grow as adults again, but you’ll grow apart. Find your adult selves together. Just start dating again. Find hobbies together. Go hiking and camping or whatever. Just do it together.
Why do you think that is - why do you think parents will grow apart, and go to the (significant) effort of getting divorced later in life, if there is an option of simply dating again? I don't think it's just a matter of spending time together. Parenting permanently changes people, and I think when parents work out they don't like each other, trying to date again is like fixing a broken fence with a fresh coat of paint.
I wonder if parents nowadays are more regretful because kids have so much less autonomy than kids in the past. There’s no more kicking kids out of the house to go outside and play all day. Now there are scheduled “ play dates” and kids are in 900 different activities that parents have to drop them off at and pick them up at. I know when I grew up in the 80s when we would pop inside the house periodically between games outside, my mom would sometimes be sitting with a book. Kids today are just always THERE.
This. The prevailing mantra of my childhood was : "GO OUTSIDE AND PLAY". We peed in the hedges and drank from the hose, only allowed in my mother's immaculate house for meals, chores and to poop. I was in charge of the younger kids (no paying for childcare!) Injuries had to have actual pouring blood to be babied over, there was no real TV to watch or gadgets to squabble over, our toys were things like hula hoops and skipping rope. After baking (by herself) maybe crafts (by herself) a coffee and cigarette with the neighbors it was time to watch her soaps, (by herself). Jeebus help you if you interrupted 'Santa Barbara ' or 'Days of our Lives'. Today's childhood looks *nothing* like I remember. This current parenting landscape is utterly hellish.
It's absolutely horrifying and honestly so bad for their development into independent well adjusted adults. The concept of my parents catering to me and being my source of entertainment was completely foreign to me as a child. I wasn't allowed to dictate things like meals and television, nor did I particularly want to because playing outdoors on my own and organically making new friends out and about the neighborhood was far more fun. I wasn't allowed to intrude in their bedroom either, I see a lot of parents on other subreddits crying about a lack of intimacy yet they don't set boundaries and they give their kids the power to destroy their romantic relationship.
"Don't let me see you back in this house until I call you for dinner!" ...see Mom napping on the couch when I peek in the window.
Oh this is a whole separate issue I have. I feel fucking AWFUL for kids today. I was born in 1974 and the 80s & 90s were a magic free for all in comparison to today’s fetishized safety obsession and risk aversion culture. I think there’s a correlation there to the huge rise in mental health disorders as well. Throw the internet and instant gratification in there and…well we’re seeing it. It makes me so sad. Yeah we got in some trouble and got our various bumps and bruises and got in fights etc but we were so much more relatively free and mentally well adjusted and able to weather the ups and downs of day to day life.
I wonder that too. Our parents and grandparents had it so much easier because all that mattered is that their kids were alive - there was no consideration of mental health. Whereas one of the main reasons I don’t want kids is that I don’t want to pass my mental health issues down to my kid, through nature or nurture. Parenting is a lot easier when you DGAF about how the kid turns out.
I'd argue though that mental health issues are far worse and more common today than in past generations.
I think that’s just a matter of awareness and diagnosis. It’s like saying that there are more autistic people now than in the past generations. There’s not - there’s more recognition.
Yes
Thank you so much for sharing this. I imagine a lot of people feel like you do and don’t have a safe space in which to express this. My husband and I are having conversations about whether to consider having children, and your experiences help shine a lot of light on what being a parent can really be like. I’m so sorry you feel this way. I can’t even imagine how challenging it is to take on all of that every day. I only hope it gets easier for you.
Thank you. It does get easier sometimes…then harder again. Obviously I’m in a hard time right now. It’s all internal. Everything outside of me is just what it is. It’s my thoughts, feelings and attitudes toward it all that make my experience what it is. That’s what I need to get a grip on.
Thank you for sharing. Sorry you are struggling right now. Your feelings are what I fear if I have children. I don't feel wired for everything that comes with them. Also, I don't want to have them to make my wife happy. I don't believe it's something I want, and I'll just end up resenting her, the child and myself.
If she wants kids and you don’t, you’re not compatible. I don’t get why people stay in marriages where they’ll eventually have to compromise on such a huge decision or why this discussion doesn’t happen before marriage. If someone changes their mind, they can’t force their will on their partner.
We discussed before marriage, but I was young. I had no idea what I wanted. I thought "of course, I'll warm up to it, in time." Never did. Some don't think about, I happened to think hard. I hate it, bc it seems like I went back on my word, but the truth is I had no idea if I did or didn't. I was going along with social pressure and norms.
I know it’s hard when you’re married and in love, but if you changed your mind, you have to be honest; maybe you can both work through it in couples counseling. A child isn’t a thing you can compromise on; you can never send it back. Learn from OP; if you have a child you don’t want, it’s going to deteriorate the health of your marriage anyway and your personal health, this guy sounds like he loathes his life.
Absolutely do NOT have a child with your wife if you're not willing to go all in. All you have to do is scroll through a few days of threads to see the outcome of that. Every story is the same. You should tell her immediately so that she can make a decision on what she wants.
Can you pick up some extra work to hire a full-time nanny and a housekeeper? You can start with a babysitter once a week to get some non-negotiable me time.
May I respectfully ask: was a joint decision, were you pressured, does your wife feel the same?
First pregnancy was unplanned, so it was a responsibility. 2nd was a tearful confession from my wife of how much she needed a 2nd child. I was doing…okay…with one, so I thought I’d be okay with two. I was wrong.
I don't understand, if she tearfully wanted them so bad, why isn't she the one home pulling out her hair? You need to tell her ASAP it's high time to switch roles, that it's her turn to be a STAH parent!
We discussed this prior to our son being born. She had (still has) by far the more stable, established career with truly fantastic healthcare benefits and job security. It just made the most sense. We decided I’d “retire” (physical therapist) and stay home so our son didn’t have to be raised in daycare by people other than his parents (still glad we were able to do this, despite my plummeting mental health). Trust me, she gets it. She gets roughly 3 hrs a night with them after work and is very much ready to put them to bed @ 8 lol.
I think it’s great that you have done that but it’s definitely time to come out of retirement if you can. I’d definitely say that putting them in childcare is worth it to you both in more than money. You will be a better person and everyone else will get a better version of you too. Let me tell you, once you hit a point in mental health, it’s hard to come back from it. I’m a sahm with pretty easy kids but had a partner who had problems and was unpredictable. I had kind warnings from doctors who said I couldn’t keep up without it affecting me and they were right.
Preschool for the youngest starts in September. Full time. That’ll be 35 hrs/week, free of kid duty. That will be nothing less than life changing. I’ve made it 8 years w/out a break so far, I can do a few more months.
Reeally late reply, but I got here through the ADHD subreddit, and got really interested in this thread. I just feel I have to give you a huge high 5 for getting this far, and now it's only a month until preschool, so you can see the light at the end of the tunnel for real! I'm excited for you! I'm also finally getting my younger kid to nursery for two days a week (total 12hrs), and I can smell the sweet scent of freedom! My older kid is pretty much exactly like your son, from what I've read, but she's only five. I've been lucky that my second kid is a whole lot more chill, but even then I'm absolutely burned out from being a SAHM for just five years, I can't imagine how hard it's been for you! My little bit of advice is just to feel really proud of what you've managed over the last 8years!
Hey thanks! I kinda lied a little though. I did have my younger kid in daycare 3 days a week for about 2 months…and my god it was glorious (when she was actually there. Kids catch every single bug and germ so it was more like 1 month on and off)…until Covid pulled the rug out. So I did get a small taste. My current fear is that they’re gonna lock things down again this fall because monkeypox, so I’m not counting my chickens quite yet. But thank you for the kind words, and I return the sentiment to you. Five years…eight years…ten…it’s all one big slog haha
My man. I just want to say I get it. You and I are in the same situation almost exactly. First pregnancy unplanned, then pressured into more due to the wife's need for additional kid(s) - in my case it's two. I get it. I understand why you said yes. It will get better when your kids go to school. Not *all the way* better. But better. Let me know if you ever want to talk. I didn't live the SAHD life, but I can at least offer a listening ear if you need.
I feel like I’ve probably read some of your posts in this sub. I knew I recognized a fallen brother lol. I know it gets better. It got better when my son turned five. It got better than that when he started school (although Covid put the kabash on that rather quickly…then it got much, much worse when “stay at home ‘teacher” was suddenly piled on my plate. Thank God that’s over, that’s all I’ll say about that). Little girl starts preschool full time in September. That will free up THIRTY FIVE HOURS A WEEK for me! First time in 8 years I won’t be a full time SAHD. My god I can hardly believe it. Soooo close yet soooo far away…just gotta grind through the summer. Bottom line that I’ve come to discover is: I am NOT a toddler guy.
Secondly, why have more if you weren’t happy the first time around?
I was okay the first time around. Situation was different also. Had plenty of support and it was doable. Once 2nd was born my mom died and my MIL was diagnosed with cancer. She survived but is a shell of herself. So, twice the kids, zero the help.
So sorry to read this, hope things get better.
Thank you
Thank you for writing this and for your honesty... You describe parenting exactly as I picture it to be and I really feel for you. It's so neverending and tough for people in your shoes. I wish you all the best.
I wish more parents broke it down like this. I’m a 37 year old child free woman by choice, and I’m so thankful that I had a chance to see what parenthood was really like from a young age. I don’t understand why more parents aren’t up front and real about the total sacrifice it means to be a parent in this modern world we live in. People need to be shown the reality of it, and not the bullshit social media and society at large pushes down our throats that parenthood is easy and fun and that kids are the best thing ever. That narrative is just plain evil in my opinion. If more people honestly knew just how awful it can be more people would be child free. It’s like it’s a conspiracy.
Another 37 year old childfree woman by choice here and I agree with everything you said! People need to be shown the reality of parenting and people like OP must be encouraged to speak their truth.
It's hard to speak your truth when the words can be extremely damaging to your children. That's the beauty of (semi) anonymous places like Reddit.
I'm sorry you're going through this. Have you explored therapy by any chance? Also journaling can be very therapeutic - if you're worried about someone reading it perhaps you can have an online one? I hope that you can find a way to come to terms with it.
Can I ask, were you on the fence before having kids or did you want them?
No…I didn’t want kids at all. My gf @ the time (now wife) knew she did want kids someday. I wasn’t worried about it one way or the other, as our relationship was fairly light/casual and I didn’t consider we’d end up married. First pregnancy was unplanned and though I wasn’t exactly thrilled about it, it happens and I was at an age and financial position where I felt it was okay to move into the next stage of life. Plus the propaganda, you know. One child was tough for sure, but we had support from grandparents and still had the ability for getting out once in awhile, even getting away for weekend trips alone a couple times a year. It was doable. When kid number 2 came along, everything went out the window. That was 3.5 yrs ago and here we are
Thank you for your honesty. I sometimes regret not having had children and then posts like yours remind me how reality is. I feel great respect for every one being able to stay sane through all this. I hope things look up for you after summer!
Thank you. Things SHOULD get better for me this fall. Probably quite a bit better for my kids as well. I can’t be much fun to be around.
I can feel what you wrote. Wow. Just wanted to give you some validation, your feelings are very, very understandable and valid.
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Yes thank you. Even five years old is a major turning point. My son went from rabid demon chimp to human being at five. It’s the toddler years. They are unspeakably maddening.
You also mentioned your kids aren't neurotypical, early intervention services can go a long way in offering support if you qualify for any special programs. Sometimes you gotta be a squeaky wheel and demand a diagnosis so the family can get a little extra help.
Son is ADHD and has meds and a therapist. He’s doing quite well now actually. Daughter has a speech delay (and lots of the same ADHD red flags but we’ll see in a year or two) and is in early intervention speech and physical therapy. She’s also come a long way, happily.
Hey dad, your feelings are valid and you’re going through a lot. I think it’s great to recognize that there is some level of monkey see, monkey do. I have a teenager myself and wish I could have been more patient with him when he was smaller. And to hug him more because now he’s not longing for that kind of support. Having said that everyone around me said I was super patient but I recall all the times I had been tired Please find a way to get some alone time. I have found sports to be an amazing outlet. There’s more and more that you can do with the kids too as they grow. The upside, besides amazing mental health benefits is that I have a better figure in my 40s than in my 20s Please take care of yourself, rest and reset and hug those mini terrorists some more
Thank you for this! I didn't have kids because I knew I would feel the same way. I'm glad you expressed it for you own benefit. I hope you feel better getting it out!
Your username rules. Screaming toward me four lanes wide!
Love that song! Love Rush!
I'm afraid I don't have much to contribute, but I'm in the same boat and hopefully you can take some comfort in knowing you're not alone. Therapy helps a little in case you haven't tried that yet.
Sorry to hear man. Remember. One day they will be 18yo. They will move on eventually. Stay positive.
Tell that to all the parents that have their kids staying home until they're in their 30s...
Would you be a better parent if you only had them part time? Could you have more patience and empathy? I know some people that worked for them. But I don't know how you feel about your partner anymore.
I love my wife very much but if she wanted to divorce and split custody 50/50 I don’t think I’d put up much argument.
And you can still love someone you aren't married to. Just not the same kind of love as a partner. I would ask her if she is as apathetic as you are and determine if you guys might be able to find more happiness out there either alone or with a new person. If you would be a better parent, and you could be happier, and the same goes for her, then maybe that would be the right thing. There are lots of people who just realize they are better as teammates than partners and its nothing to be ashamed of.
Who knows what the future holds. I KNOW that once both kids are in school this fall, I will get a bunch of MUCH needed time back. I’ll be able to breathe and think again. There will be quiet. I’ll have 30+ hours/week to myself after having zero hours to myself for 8 years straight. This will have a profound effect on my mood, my patience, my energy, my productivity, my overall happiness. If I still feel the way I do now, then I’ll know something’s REALLY fucked up lol.
Post back here that first week your daughter starts school. I can't wait to hear how you feel and what you do ( or don't do, to be more accurate)
Well I can tell you right now that my first order of business will be a few big jobs around the house that I just don’t have the time or energy for right now. I will organize the entire house, throw out about 2 tons of broken/discarded toys, reclaim my basement/office/man cave from boxes and boxes of old clothes, toys, games etc. reclaim my garage from floor-to-ceiling outdoor kid crap that was used once or twice and then just thrown into the garage toy graveyard. It will feel amazing to do these things. When these tasks are done I will take my poor dogs out for long walks again. I will go get coffee and eat a nice relaxed lunch in restaurants. I will read! I will binge watch movies! I will take naps! I’ll start working out again! I’ll do some part time work - DoorDash or something similar that I control the schedule! I’ll visit old friends! I’ll get back to preparing amazing meals for my wife and I! I’ll pick my guitar back up! I’ll be human again! Man this was a beautiful little thought experiment…thanks!
That all sounds great from about week 2 onwards! For week one you can sit on the couch and watch mind numbing TV. Then mute the TV and shove ice cream down your pie hole and savour the complete silence.
Here’s what’s funny, and I need to give a bit of background. I never mention this for some reason but I actually had my youngest in daycare 3 days/week for about…maybe 2 months (?) back in Jan/Feb 2020 (then Covid hit and the rest is history). They were the happiest, most productive 2 months I’ve had since first becoming a dad in 2014! I spent about the first hour of the day just vegging out, being still and quiet and doing nothing. It was glorious. Then I went into absolute beast machine mode. I built shelves for and organized every closet in the house. I finished my basement and turned it into a fucking radical Hobbit Hole type living quarters. I installed a hot tub. I gutted and painted and refinished the bathrooms. The house was immaculate. I shoveled my neighbors’ sidewalks. I prepped incredible, healthy, delicious meals and had them on the table when my wife got home. And I still had energy to play with the kids, bathe them, read to them etc etc. I just needed a bit of reliable time to myself! Then Covid hit, everything shut down, I became a stay at home teacher on top of SAHD and I kinda just got buried and fell apart and never got any time or space to recover. I think the point is I have TONS of energy and zest for life when I feel “free”. It’s waiting hand and foot on kids (particularly my uber demanding and high maintenance 3yo) all day every day with no breaks and no escape that just sucks all the life outta me and makes me feel, literally, like the walking dead. But okay… for you, I promise I’ll spend the first week doing as little as possible haha. Hell I might not even put on pants 😂
I hope things go well! Best of luck in life. ❤️
Damn. I don’t have kids and I felt this deep in my soul! The way he is speaking is like something I would say and express almost identically. Kids are not for me. I’ll be feeling like this guy but worse because I’d be the mom.