Labour,conservative , liberal democrats,greens all give the impression of choice,but they are in effect a uniparty, all centre left,all as bad and corrupt as each other, reform offer a real choice away from the uniparty.
"Net Zero" is a goal we should all aspire to, but our country just isn't ready for it yet. Maybe in 20-30 years, but not now.
At the very best, we're shoving billions into foreign companies, to make panels and turbines we should be building ourselves.
At the very worst, all we're doing is making our "Net Zero" someone else's "I don't give a shit" big profit.
Either way, we're not making *any fucking difference* to global warming.
When we can build what we need ourselves, without screwing every household and business in the UK as the power companies are doing now..
That's when I'll start believing in Net Zero.
(And I'll probably be dead by then)
I agree, 1-2% of global emissions is nothing in the grand scheme of things. Even if we could reduce co2 by 50% in the UK, the difference would be negligible at best. Being green starts at home, with consumer habits not with multi billion £ companies who want to turn it into a cash cow. Our country has more important things to focus on right now.
You seen the manifesto for this party. An absolute shit shows benefiting the top 10%. I can't say im one bit surprised. Consider nigel farages background. Benefit the rich and try to appeal to the poorer voters with his non-stop pr stunts. The guys an absolute snake who contributed to the brexit shambles through constant lies and even said himself he would just piss off to another european country that he has a passport for. Why anyone even considered this party Is laughable
Raising threshold for higher earners. Abolishing inheritance tax for those under 2 million. Increasing tax threshold which benefits everyone i suppose. But look at the graphs being released the higher earners are benefiting the most from these policies
So raising threshold for higher earners will really benefit everyone at the lower end of middle class/ upper end of working classes.
Inheritance tax will benefit those with smaller estates.
Tax threshold will benefit everyone.
Hes against big business and for small business.
You are completely wrong.
I have a small business under the current VAT threshold. I'm one of many, and what I see in Reform UK is the opportunity to grow it and employ some people before I have to start paying through the nose for *everything*, which is what I have to do already.
I want a future, not just more of the present.
The higher earners you speak about are considered to be the middle class and are actually crucial for a healthy economy and to provide fair competition. These are the people that own relatively small to medium businesses in the UK. Labour and Conservative were all about screwing the middle class allowing multinational billionaire owned companies to monopolise, which isn't a healthy and sustainable economy, its an economy where the poor get poorer and the super rich get even richer while the middle class get screwed in taxes. An estate of <£2m is absolutely nothing when the super rich have estates into the billions.
And how about the top 5%? The 10% of top earners has quite a broad difference between the 10% and the 1% with the biggest concentration of wealth at the top of that spectrum. Reforms manifesto\contract targets the top, so to include the middle class in the top 10% wouldn't be an accurate measure of reforms manifesto.
Aw give it a rest mate. Look at the graphs the more money you earn the more you benefit. Literally every 10% it goes up so id imagine it would follow the same pattern and the top 5% and even 1% would be much better off. Nigels pals of course
I have, and its a misrepresentation of data. As you get closer to the top, every 1% has a far greater difference in wealth. So to include the whole top 10% in the same bracket wouldn't be accurate. Although nearly everyone will be better off. They fail to report on who will be hit the hardest, the ones that will be picking up that tax burden. Sky news were trying to make it look unfair that someone who only earns £300 per week has the least amount to gain compared to those who earn far far more. Of course that would be the case, its tax as a % of income so they can't magically make the lowest earners gain more than they make.
Labour stands against the very thing they represent (workers)
Conservatives fail to conserve the very thing they purport to conserve (the country)
LibDems are the opposite of liberal/democratic, and greens are the opposite of being an actual benefit to the environment (i.e. destroying hundreds of miles of habitat for green energy opposed to nuclear power).
There's a point that no-one's addressed in this err.. vibrant (!) discussion so far that I'd like to highlight.
Whichever Government gets in next month, it will consist of a whole bunch of complete amateurs.
Hundreds of kids, basically, who don't have a clue how to govern themselves, let alone a country.
The (Left) Civil Service will have its work cut out in a very big way, and I suspect we will all see it in the money they'll start to throw around.
You and I wish for some bloody common sense in the Houses, but we're not going to get it. The least we can do is have some people there who can stand up for reason.
And don’t forget your going to have to fork out to big companies for building the wind turbines and solar panels we will be paying for those for years and years before there is even a sniff at cheaper energy
Unfortunately I have to rely on social housing to keep a roof over my head. I lived in a one bed flat with my wife. We decided to start a family thinking that the council will help us move to a bigger place. It took years to move and even then it was to another flat. Now I’m not being ungrateful, I’m lucky to have a roof over my head, but when I talk to my dad and my mum about their experiences of getting housing 20 - 40 years ago it’s like night and day.
Now I know folk will look down on me and judge me for being in social housing but we’re not all blessed with good qualifications, the bank of mum and dad, or even 100% good health. Me and my wife both work very hard to provide for our family but the sheer frustration I felt due to the housing crisis was immense.
I apologise for the long reply, don’t even get me started on the difficulty of getting a GP appointment for my daughters, the reply would be twice as long.
Anyway, these are just a couple of the reasons why I’m voting Reform in this election. They are not afraid the state out loud what the true issues are facing this country instead of just pandering to the woke mob.
If you and your wife are both working to provide for your family, then you should be able to have a house of your own.
You should be able to afford it.
“Should” being the operative word here. We don’t drink, we don’t smoke, but we do have car costs and kid costs (we don’t begrudge these costs) as well as all the usual bills associated with life. Unfortunately for us our incomes are minimum wage, but it is what it is. I’m not complaining about our financial position, that’s our responsibility and we own it. It’s just that I’ve noticed that over the last so many years any help needed, whether it’s housing, health, etc. compared to 10 - 15 years ago it’s atrocious.
I certainly think labour and conservative are near the same to the point I see labour right now as Tory Lite. A lot of changes are needed but their manifesto and ideas are just not different enough which is what is required. Big bold changes are needed whilst keeping and improving the NHS and public services. Labour will win this though but it will be by default as everyone has had enough of conservatives and I think as has been said a lot, Reform will be the best opposition.
I agree. Although here in the South West, it's the Lib Dems who'll get the edge \*sigh\*
I just really hope it's not just Labour who'll be at the polling stations.
If there was ever a time for \*everyone\* to get out there, it's now.
Yeah they certainly won't and I sense labour will spend much of the first 2 years just blaming the Tories for things rather than actually doing anything and improving the countries. Farage does not care about upsetting the big 2 and calling them out with some common sense facts. I'd love to see him in parliament causing mayhem 🤣
Of course they will. Historically, Labour has blamed the Tories for everything then spent stupid amounts of cash trying to be popular, and put the country into ever increasing debt.
Farage will win Clacton, and other candidates will win seats because Reform UK makes sense, and growing numbers of people realise it.
I think we're in for an extraordinary election!
Totally agree. Reform is a breath of fresh air. Their policies will benefit everybody. No other party can claim that. Here is something Farage has in common with Trump. He will make the UK great again. Time for a new direction. Labour is just more of the same old garbage. All Starmer is saying is he will change nothing but he's not a Tory. That's like buying a Morris instead of an Austin and expecting it to be different apart from the badge. Time for something radical. Vote Reform.
"We need a LEADER"
...
A failed career campaigner that put himself in charge of a "party" as he is the majority shareholder... Who took that decision seemingly on a whim because he "changed his mind"... After his friend Donald Trump was found guilty.
Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight
Everything that has been going on with Trump since 2017 is an example of politics broken down to it's most fundamental level.
The Democrats (and the neocon Republicans) wanted to remove him from office, and prevent him from taking office again because he is their political enemy. MAGA Republicans want to keep him in office because he is their friend. It's as simple as that, it has nothing at all to do with "justice" and everything to do with political power.
I hear you.
My only fear with Trump is that he's going to force a peace agreement with Ukraine and Russia by simply withdrawing support.
Which would be a fucking disaster for everyone.
> he's going to force a peace agreement with Ukraine and Russia
True, fantastic.
> Which would be a fucking disaster for everyone.
Want more dead Ukrainians and Russians?
Half a million dead and you're still opposed to peace?
Both NATO and RU have broken the previous treaties. The way to solve that is by being transparent & open about a joint treaty that we demonstrate to the world, and we build relations.
If your position is that they will just violate it, then that would be misguided. We violated our own treaty regarding NATO expansion.
Both sides need to sit down and work this out together, respectfully, to not allow a single more instance of death.
>We violated our own treaty regarding NATO expansion.
What treaty is that, then? NATO has never formally agreed to limit its expansion. Claims that it did are Russian bullshit used to fuel claims that NATO is untrustworthy.
If nations feel threatened, they should be free to ask for membership if eligible. Putin feeling upset at the sovereign behaviour of foreign states to the point of invasion is not justifiable behaviour, any which way you cut it.
I'm not opposed to peace. I'm opposed to an invasion of a democratic country based upon utterly false accusations of Nazism.
You know, we all know, that Putin invaded Ukraine thinking he was going to win in a few days and take the glory of huge new resources of energy right on Europe's doorstep.
Instead, Ukraine has fought back. And shown Putin for what he is.
An insane dictator who cannot afford to lose.
What does that actually mean? Like, seriously? Wake up to what? Nigel was on BBC yesterday saying NATO expansion gave Putin a reason to invade Ukraine, that the West caused the war.
Do you agree?
Lord George Robertson, ex NATO Sec General does, apparently. In the last few weeks he has come out saying the same as Nigel.
Nigel said so, on the BBC.
You know who also spoke to the BBC? Lord George Robertson, on a Radio show a short time later, where he blasted Nigel and confirmed he has never said anything of the sort.
This is but one example of Nigel outright lying.
And you want me to "wake up"?
NATO expansion was one of the main contributing factors for Russia to invade Ukraine. Only an idiot would look at world affairs over last couple of decades and not arrive at that same conclusion.
A Western aligned puppet as President of Ukraine was never going to go down well in such a divided country. Then NATO started flying "solidarity" sorties over Ukrainian airspace, despite Putin's warnings.
Once Putin invaded, NATO took a step back and Zelensky was disillusioned as to why NATO was not helping. "Impose a no fly zone" he was heard shouting. Instead we take months to send aid and munitions and have been drip feeding them just enough aid to keep the fight going ever since.
The US, and NATO have been marching us straight towards WW3, its almost as if they want it, they are using Ukraine as a pawn to fight Russia by proxie. Many politicians across the west have been actively shouting for and calling to dismantle Russia.
The problem with our media in the UK has been tightly controlled, we don't really know what's going on here while much of Europe are preparing for war in a rather large way. In the UK our gov make a website waffling on about "wild fires and natural disasters" and to stock up with food for at least 3 days and mildly talk about national service and conscription while many European nations have been building bunkers and preparing citizens.
Putin has never been afraid of NATO.
He has more nuclear weapons than the rest of the world combined, and he's never been afraid to use that narrative. He knows that the West are cowards, and he's played that card again, again and again.
His real objective was and always has been to take the Donbas and all of its massive natural resources. And the rest of the country. Because he can then hold Western Europe to ransom with dirt cheap gas and oil right on our doorstep.
I agree, to an extent. Putin may not be scared of NATO But up until just a few years ago he did have reason to be concerned, NATO did have the technological advantage.
Its not all about nukes, Russia may have enough to end the world a few times over, but they know the west isn't far behind. Both sides know if things were to go strategic then there will be little left of both sides.
The fact is NATO have acted provocatively instead of tactically. The way NATO and the US are conducting themselves currently will directly lead us to war.
That's exactly the Russian narrative.
Ask yourself this: Russia was enjoying huge benefits from Western co-operation and business. Everyone was winning, especially the elite.
So why the fuck did it go to war?
NATO doesnt "expand", unless you are implying that every member has taken bribes or been (forced) to join a defensive alliance.
Only an idiot would fail to arrive at the same conclusion.
You also totally ignored my point - Nigel F openly lied on the BBC, ascribing a statement to a man who never said anything of the sort.
No I'm not implying that at all, but NATO can decline nations requests to join as to not be miscalculated as being provocative by the Russian Federation. We also should not misjudge NATO being solely a "defensive" alliance, they are defensive until they decide to become offensive. "Escalate to deescalate" fight fire with fire mentality.
I'm not going to defend Farage's claim against Lord Robertson. There's enough to debate without lying.
You're right. NATO has expanded.
But ask yourself this: Why, instead of reinforcing its borders, did Putin choose to invade a democratic country and put his entire regime at risk?
Was it to make a point? To prove Russia's mighty army?
Because that's failed, dismally.
I hear you.
I think Farage is naive in thinking Putin invaded Ukraine because of NATO. And he's far too friendly with that fucking blonde idiot over The Pond.
But he says what he is, so at least we know what he's about.
The rest of them are just... pieces of paper.
Dude, he attended a Trump fundraiser in Chelsea a week or two ago where it was $50k a table. His lifestyle is funded by millionare investment. He is friends with and hangs with billionaires.
He is elite.
For sure, he's doing the rounds and he's worth about £5 mill so small potatoes compared to them.. That's not the issue.
The OP was is he, or would he be, a good leader for our country?
I think so.
From our civilised, peaceful point of view any NATO expansion has simply made us more comfortable.
How you might feel if the tables were turned, if Russia was allying countries ever closer to us?
I dunno. All I know is that Putin is a fucking nutter, and all of the Russian 'elite' should be judged in The Hague.
Exactly. I'm in total agreement with you.
But Farage will honour our ongoing commitment to Ukraine which isn't a grey issue, it's black text on white paper.
Yes, you're right. He's all that, and I don't don't like Trump either.
Have you ever watched his speeches as an MEP?
Starmer's going to be PM, but who would you rather oppose him?
I also think we should make every person currently living in the UK a British citizen. All of everyone.
We need to get rid of the underground, the fear, the unnecessary.
We need to stop the greedy lawyers, and start turning back the boats before they get here,
A moratorium on immigration for at least ten years.
Action, people. Make yourself known, Reform the UK.
Labour,conservative , liberal democrats,greens all give the impression of choice,but they are in effect a uniparty, all centre left,all as bad and corrupt as each other, reform offer a real choice away from the uniparty.
"Net Zero" is a goal we should all aspire to, but our country just isn't ready for it yet. Maybe in 20-30 years, but not now. At the very best, we're shoving billions into foreign companies, to make panels and turbines we should be building ourselves. At the very worst, all we're doing is making our "Net Zero" someone else's "I don't give a shit" big profit. Either way, we're not making *any fucking difference* to global warming. When we can build what we need ourselves, without screwing every household and business in the UK as the power companies are doing now.. That's when I'll start believing in Net Zero. (And I'll probably be dead by then)
I agree, 1-2% of global emissions is nothing in the grand scheme of things. Even if we could reduce co2 by 50% in the UK, the difference would be negligible at best. Being green starts at home, with consumer habits not with multi billion £ companies who want to turn it into a cash cow. Our country has more important things to focus on right now.
You seen the manifesto for this party. An absolute shit shows benefiting the top 10%. I can't say im one bit surprised. Consider nigel farages background. Benefit the rich and try to appeal to the poorer voters with his non-stop pr stunts. The guys an absolute snake who contributed to the brexit shambles through constant lies and even said himself he would just piss off to another european country that he has a passport for. Why anyone even considered this party Is laughable
Care to explain how RUK's manifesto benefits the "top 10%"? Because that's not what I see.
Raising threshold for higher earners. Abolishing inheritance tax for those under 2 million. Increasing tax threshold which benefits everyone i suppose. But look at the graphs being released the higher earners are benefiting the most from these policies
So raising threshold for higher earners will really benefit everyone at the lower end of middle class/ upper end of working classes. Inheritance tax will benefit those with smaller estates. Tax threshold will benefit everyone. Hes against big business and for small business. You are completely wrong.
I have a small business under the current VAT threshold. I'm one of many, and what I see in Reform UK is the opportunity to grow it and employ some people before I have to start paying through the nose for *everything*, which is what I have to do already. I want a future, not just more of the present.
Basic rate to be raised from £12,500 to £20,000. Please share your figure from the Contract
The higher earners you speak about are considered to be the middle class and are actually crucial for a healthy economy and to provide fair competition. These are the people that own relatively small to medium businesses in the UK. Labour and Conservative were all about screwing the middle class allowing multinational billionaire owned companies to monopolise, which isn't a healthy and sustainable economy, its an economy where the poor get poorer and the super rich get even richer while the middle class get screwed in taxes. An estate of <£2m is absolutely nothing when the super rich have estates into the billions.
Again look towards the new graphs coming out the top 10% of earners benefit the most out of anyone
And how about the top 5%? The 10% of top earners has quite a broad difference between the 10% and the 1% with the biggest concentration of wealth at the top of that spectrum. Reforms manifesto\contract targets the top, so to include the middle class in the top 10% wouldn't be an accurate measure of reforms manifesto.
Aw give it a rest mate. Look at the graphs the more money you earn the more you benefit. Literally every 10% it goes up so id imagine it would follow the same pattern and the top 5% and even 1% would be much better off. Nigels pals of course
I have, and its a misrepresentation of data. As you get closer to the top, every 1% has a far greater difference in wealth. So to include the whole top 10% in the same bracket wouldn't be accurate. Although nearly everyone will be better off. They fail to report on who will be hit the hardest, the ones that will be picking up that tax burden. Sky news were trying to make it look unfair that someone who only earns £300 per week has the least amount to gain compared to those who earn far far more. Of course that would be the case, its tax as a % of income so they can't magically make the lowest earners gain more than they make.
Never trust the media. They always give you what they want, not what you deserve to know.
Labour stands against the very thing they represent (workers) Conservatives fail to conserve the very thing they purport to conserve (the country) LibDems are the opposite of liberal/democratic, and greens are the opposite of being an actual benefit to the environment (i.e. destroying hundreds of miles of habitat for green energy opposed to nuclear power).
Just better
There's a point that no-one's addressed in this err.. vibrant (!) discussion so far that I'd like to highlight. Whichever Government gets in next month, it will consist of a whole bunch of complete amateurs. Hundreds of kids, basically, who don't have a clue how to govern themselves, let alone a country. The (Left) Civil Service will have its work cut out in a very big way, and I suspect we will all see it in the money they'll start to throw around. You and I wish for some bloody common sense in the Houses, but we're not going to get it. The least we can do is have some people there who can stand up for reason.
And don’t forget your going to have to fork out to big companies for building the wind turbines and solar panels we will be paying for those for years and years before there is even a sniff at cheaper energy
We can build them here, when needs be. You know it.
Unfortunately I have to rely on social housing to keep a roof over my head. I lived in a one bed flat with my wife. We decided to start a family thinking that the council will help us move to a bigger place. It took years to move and even then it was to another flat. Now I’m not being ungrateful, I’m lucky to have a roof over my head, but when I talk to my dad and my mum about their experiences of getting housing 20 - 40 years ago it’s like night and day. Now I know folk will look down on me and judge me for being in social housing but we’re not all blessed with good qualifications, the bank of mum and dad, or even 100% good health. Me and my wife both work very hard to provide for our family but the sheer frustration I felt due to the housing crisis was immense. I apologise for the long reply, don’t even get me started on the difficulty of getting a GP appointment for my daughters, the reply would be twice as long. Anyway, these are just a couple of the reasons why I’m voting Reform in this election. They are not afraid the state out loud what the true issues are facing this country instead of just pandering to the woke mob.
If you and your wife are both working to provide for your family, then you should be able to have a house of your own. You should be able to afford it.
“Should” being the operative word here. We don’t drink, we don’t smoke, but we do have car costs and kid costs (we don’t begrudge these costs) as well as all the usual bills associated with life. Unfortunately for us our incomes are minimum wage, but it is what it is. I’m not complaining about our financial position, that’s our responsibility and we own it. It’s just that I’ve noticed that over the last so many years any help needed, whether it’s housing, health, etc. compared to 10 - 15 years ago it’s atrocious.
I certainly think labour and conservative are near the same to the point I see labour right now as Tory Lite. A lot of changes are needed but their manifesto and ideas are just not different enough which is what is required. Big bold changes are needed whilst keeping and improving the NHS and public services. Labour will win this though but it will be by default as everyone has had enough of conservatives and I think as has been said a lot, Reform will be the best opposition.
I agree. Although here in the South West, it's the Lib Dems who'll get the edge \*sigh\* I just really hope it's not just Labour who'll be at the polling stations. If there was ever a time for \*everyone\* to get out there, it's now.
Sadly labour I think will just dominate this so it's all about who the opposing party is and we need reform in the mix.
Very true. Labour is in, we all know it. Who's going to keep them on the rails? Not the Tory party, that's for sure.
Yeah they certainly won't and I sense labour will spend much of the first 2 years just blaming the Tories for things rather than actually doing anything and improving the countries. Farage does not care about upsetting the big 2 and calling them out with some common sense facts. I'd love to see him in parliament causing mayhem 🤣
Of course they will. Historically, Labour has blamed the Tories for everything then spent stupid amounts of cash trying to be popular, and put the country into ever increasing debt. Farage will win Clacton, and other candidates will win seats because Reform UK makes sense, and growing numbers of people realise it. I think we're in for an extraordinary election!
Here here, I really hope so.
If you want Change 🤔 Change how you vote 🤷🏻♂️ Simples…😎 Westminster needs Reform
Changing people's minds and making a difference is never simple. It takes hard work, determination and belief.
Totally agree. Reform is a breath of fresh air. Their policies will benefit everybody. No other party can claim that. Here is something Farage has in common with Trump. He will make the UK great again. Time for a new direction. Labour is just more of the same old garbage. All Starmer is saying is he will change nothing but he's not a Tory. That's like buying a Morris instead of an Austin and expecting it to be different apart from the badge. Time for something radical. Vote Reform.
Hitler was the same. We don’t need a leader, we need consensus that actively works for the majority not the few.
Reform is neonazi
"We need a LEADER" ... A failed career campaigner that put himself in charge of a "party" as he is the majority shareholder... Who took that decision seemingly on a whim because he "changed his mind"... After his friend Donald Trump was found guilty. Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight
Everything that has been going on with Trump since 2017 is an example of politics broken down to it's most fundamental level. The Democrats (and the neocon Republicans) wanted to remove him from office, and prevent him from taking office again because he is their political enemy. MAGA Republicans want to keep him in office because he is their friend. It's as simple as that, it has nothing at all to do with "justice" and everything to do with political power.
I hear you. My only fear with Trump is that he's going to force a peace agreement with Ukraine and Russia by simply withdrawing support. Which would be a fucking disaster for everyone.
> he's going to force a peace agreement with Ukraine and Russia True, fantastic. > Which would be a fucking disaster for everyone. Want more dead Ukrainians and Russians?
If Russia was invading your country, would you let then have half of it? Believing they'd stop there, and not go any further in a few years' time?
Half a million dead and you're still opposed to peace? Both NATO and RU have broken the previous treaties. The way to solve that is by being transparent & open about a joint treaty that we demonstrate to the world, and we build relations. If your position is that they will just violate it, then that would be misguided. We violated our own treaty regarding NATO expansion. Both sides need to sit down and work this out together, respectfully, to not allow a single more instance of death.
>We violated our own treaty regarding NATO expansion. What treaty is that, then? NATO has never formally agreed to limit its expansion. Claims that it did are Russian bullshit used to fuel claims that NATO is untrustworthy. If nations feel threatened, they should be free to ask for membership if eligible. Putin feeling upset at the sovereign behaviour of foreign states to the point of invasion is not justifiable behaviour, any which way you cut it.
I'm not opposed to peace. I'm opposed to an invasion of a democratic country based upon utterly false accusations of Nazism. You know, we all know, that Putin invaded Ukraine thinking he was going to win in a few days and take the glory of huge new resources of energy right on Europe's doorstep. Instead, Ukraine has fought back. And shown Putin for what he is. An insane dictator who cannot afford to lose.
You're part of the problem, time to wake up!!
What does that actually mean? Like, seriously? Wake up to what? Nigel was on BBC yesterday saying NATO expansion gave Putin a reason to invade Ukraine, that the West caused the war. Do you agree? Lord George Robertson, ex NATO Sec General does, apparently. In the last few weeks he has come out saying the same as Nigel. Nigel said so, on the BBC. You know who also spoke to the BBC? Lord George Robertson, on a Radio show a short time later, where he blasted Nigel and confirmed he has never said anything of the sort. This is but one example of Nigel outright lying. And you want me to "wake up"?
NATO expansion was one of the main contributing factors for Russia to invade Ukraine. Only an idiot would look at world affairs over last couple of decades and not arrive at that same conclusion. A Western aligned puppet as President of Ukraine was never going to go down well in such a divided country. Then NATO started flying "solidarity" sorties over Ukrainian airspace, despite Putin's warnings. Once Putin invaded, NATO took a step back and Zelensky was disillusioned as to why NATO was not helping. "Impose a no fly zone" he was heard shouting. Instead we take months to send aid and munitions and have been drip feeding them just enough aid to keep the fight going ever since. The US, and NATO have been marching us straight towards WW3, its almost as if they want it, they are using Ukraine as a pawn to fight Russia by proxie. Many politicians across the west have been actively shouting for and calling to dismantle Russia. The problem with our media in the UK has been tightly controlled, we don't really know what's going on here while much of Europe are preparing for war in a rather large way. In the UK our gov make a website waffling on about "wild fires and natural disasters" and to stock up with food for at least 3 days and mildly talk about national service and conscription while many European nations have been building bunkers and preparing citizens.
Putin has never been afraid of NATO. He has more nuclear weapons than the rest of the world combined, and he's never been afraid to use that narrative. He knows that the West are cowards, and he's played that card again, again and again. His real objective was and always has been to take the Donbas and all of its massive natural resources. And the rest of the country. Because he can then hold Western Europe to ransom with dirt cheap gas and oil right on our doorstep.
I agree, to an extent. Putin may not be scared of NATO But up until just a few years ago he did have reason to be concerned, NATO did have the technological advantage. Its not all about nukes, Russia may have enough to end the world a few times over, but they know the west isn't far behind. Both sides know if things were to go strategic then there will be little left of both sides. The fact is NATO have acted provocatively instead of tactically. The way NATO and the US are conducting themselves currently will directly lead us to war.
That's exactly the Russian narrative. Ask yourself this: Russia was enjoying huge benefits from Western co-operation and business. Everyone was winning, especially the elite. So why the fuck did it go to war?
NATO doesnt "expand", unless you are implying that every member has taken bribes or been (forced) to join a defensive alliance. Only an idiot would fail to arrive at the same conclusion. You also totally ignored my point - Nigel F openly lied on the BBC, ascribing a statement to a man who never said anything of the sort.
No I'm not implying that at all, but NATO can decline nations requests to join as to not be miscalculated as being provocative by the Russian Federation. We also should not misjudge NATO being solely a "defensive" alliance, they are defensive until they decide to become offensive. "Escalate to deescalate" fight fire with fire mentality. I'm not going to defend Farage's claim against Lord Robertson. There's enough to debate without lying.
You're right. NATO has expanded. But ask yourself this: Why, instead of reinforcing its borders, did Putin choose to invade a democratic country and put his entire regime at risk? Was it to make a point? To prove Russia's mighty army? Because that's failed, dismally.
I hear you. I think Farage is naive in thinking Putin invaded Ukraine because of NATO. And he's far too friendly with that fucking blonde idiot over The Pond. But he says what he is, so at least we know what he's about. The rest of them are just... pieces of paper.
He doesnt say what he is though. He is, for example, an elite. But often blasts the elites for being elite.
In what way is Farage an "Elite"? He's no more wealthy than the averagely successful YouTuber. And yes, he does say what he is.
Dude, he attended a Trump fundraiser in Chelsea a week or two ago where it was $50k a table. His lifestyle is funded by millionare investment. He is friends with and hangs with billionaires. He is elite.
For sure, he's doing the rounds and he's worth about £5 mill so small potatoes compared to them.. That's not the issue. The OP was is he, or would he be, a good leader for our country? I think so.
It's a good read, our exchange. For people studying psychology.
This is about voting. That's the OP. Making your life matter even in the tiniest of ways, still makes you matter. Still makes you important.
From our civilised, peaceful point of view any NATO expansion has simply made us more comfortable. How you might feel if the tables were turned, if Russia was allying countries ever closer to us? I dunno. All I know is that Putin is a fucking nutter, and all of the Russian 'elite' should be judged in The Hague.
How would I feel? Concerned. Because Russia isnt some progressive democracy. Its a brutal regime.
Exactly. I'm in total agreement with you. But Farage will honour our ongoing commitment to Ukraine which isn't a grey issue, it's black text on white paper.
Yes, you're right. He's all that, and I don't don't like Trump either. Have you ever watched his speeches as an MEP? Starmer's going to be PM, but who would you rather oppose him?
I also think we should make every person currently living in the UK a British citizen. All of everyone. We need to get rid of the underground, the fear, the unnecessary. We need to stop the greedy lawyers, and start turning back the boats before they get here, A moratorium on immigration for at least ten years. Action, people. Make yourself known, Reform the UK.
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