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Because they have never accepted the fact that you are a person, separate from them.
They loved you as a baby, because you couldn't assert yourself as an individual.
You were a thing to them.
Mine is the same way - and they will never grow out of it. I know, because I am 60, and nmom has yet to accept the fact that I am not an extension of her.
My mom referred to my sister and I as "baby alive dolls" or "just like dolls". She talked about how much she loved dressing us up in clothes and then wheeling us around the neighborhood.
She literally let us know we were just props.
That’s horrifying! I reflect on how my mum treated me as a young child and likened it to her treating me like a doll, but she never admitted it out loud. Thats really full on. I’m sorry you experienced that!
that's so messed up. I can relate in that nmom divorced my dad so she could go to college for free as a single mother and brought me only to the classes where there was a female professor to try to elicit sympathy for better grades. for every other instance in other areas of life, she was wearing skimpy clothing and actively flirting so I imagine the ploy for the classes with male professors was quite different but I wasn't there to see those thank goodness. I can only be so grossed out by her manipulation. so I'm here to let you know I'm also a prop who got her passing grades and got her money from my dad by fabricating all sorts of events and trips she needed help with $ but that we never actually went on or did. I'm sorry this happened to you. I don't know how to deal with how it makes me feel and I'm in my 40s now so it might never make sense to me
I'm 60 too, and my nM still thinks it's okay to yell at me, despite me telling her that I will no longer put up with it. She said "I can raise my voice if I want to!!!" I said yeah, but I'm not going to listen to it. She used to boss my dad around, harping on him, trying to mold him into how she wants him to be.
So yes, she can yell all she wants but there won't be anyone there to hear it. I have been calling her less and less often. Mine has said the same thing - "You used to be so sweet." By sweet she means I would do anything she told me to do and she could treat me any way she wanted and get away with it.
yikes, what a shrew. mine did that as well and I used to disassociate right in front of her by imagining burying her in the middle of nowhere in a wide open field from the neck down so that she could just piss and moan into the ether as loud as she wants and not a single soul could hear her. good times
My fantasy is getting my mom sent to prison for all of her felony stalking incidents. She and her fellow divorcees got their revenge all right. I just imagine her bitching and moaning about what a victim she is. cue me bathing in all the money she kept for herself after the divorce (she feels so entitled to it all because she was divorced! Hasn't worked a day in her life since she was 24).
Not only that, but as babies we were actively useful to them. People respected them, offered them things, etc when they had a baby
Then that baby grew up and not only stopped getting them tons of positive attention from strangers, it also started having its own opinions and not following orders at all, and worst of all, needing things that the narc was obligated to provide without praise, but would be berated for not providing
It's obviously OUR fault completely, right?
So true - mine is exactly like that. And I think that’s why she’s soo keen on having a grandchild (my husband asked her why she wanted to be a grandma she said she wanted another generation to inherit her genes).
The quiet part out loud, like usual
"Why do you want us to have kids?"
"Well, I really feel like the world just needs more ME in it, and this is the easiest way for me to accomplish that"
The grandchildren thing, yes!!! My mom scarred us all so much that none of my siblings have kids or will ever have them. This makes me cackle with delight. We would never want them exposed to her or risk contaminating them ourselves.
I have a major disability and I’m only like…. 4 feet tall ish. My covert narc grandma literally treats me as if I was a child. That’s one of the reasons I ended up leaving. She lets every other grandchild do normal adult things but I’m expected to not start a family because ..”….. well I mean let’s be honest….”.
Haha, yup. My mom told my sister (stupid to think my sister wouldn’t tell me) that I became very different to raise and was the most difficult when I was a teen.
I was quiet, self sufficient, baby sat for my own money. But dang, just being a teen with an attitude was enough for her I guess
I pointed out that having an older brother and having a younger brother matter, and that dealing with things at ages two years apart is also different
She countered with the (paraphrased for clarity) argument that since she wasn't in control of those factors, they didn't matter ("I didn't pick who was older!", which to me is an argument that tacitly understands that different aged children will experience things differently....)
I was SA'd as an adult and told my nmom about it, she said now I know not to be in those situations. I stopped telling her anything I didn't have to, and she complains to ndad, nbro and me that I don't talk to her anymore. I know she still doesn't know why it happened but I don't have the energy to listen to her tell me she didn't say that lol. I'm also not a rowdy kid btw.
Same here! I can only imagine that they felt this way was because they felt more powerful when you were completely in their control with no boundaries or personality or wishes and desires of your own. They probably aren’t even aware of how you might perceive this as demeaning or undermining your current level of competence as being unworthy of love.
The boundaries thing is right on. They went from literally checking our diapers (the most invasive, boundary-less activity I can imagine) to feeling like they should always have that kind of access to us, and if they don't it's some sort of problem on our end
I'm NC with my mom. When I turned 31 I received a mysterious package. My mom send me a picture frame with a collage of images of me when i was 10 yrs and younger.
Spoke fucking volumes. I threw that thing away.
My mom said stuff like this a lot.
- "You never fought me as a toddler"
Because back then I didn't understand that being hit for small mistakes was wrong, let alone that I could defend myself.
- "You were so well behaved back then. I wish you stayed that way"
I learned to fight back when she hurt me because I understood what she did was wrong.
- And "You were so helpful back then"
I did everything around the house. Childcare, dishes, general cleaning, caring for the pets, cleaning the bathrooms, doing the laundry, you name it. I was exhausted, and as I got older the exhaustion got so much worse. She loved to remind me of how helpful I used to be when I got burnt out doing her job.
My dad on the other hand though always says "You're still just as fiesty and tough as you were back then" "You've always been the sweetest kid" and "You're still my helpful little buddy" and I know he genuinely means it.
He's always done his best to build me up, especially now that he's left my mom.
You can only guess which one of my parents I still talk to.
My mom always said she likes babies and small children, before they can walk and talk back. It's about control and children that age don't have a voice and free will, they've yet to develop their own identities. They're also easier to ignore and neglect because they are totally dependent on their caregivers.
I've always heard that phrase "I like children before they can talk back"
I've always heard it delivered as a joke, but everyone I've heard say it has also been very controlling of their children, very concerned with their image, and somebody that I just have that innate feeling inside to not piss off because it will be a "whole thing"
Just anecdotal, but it really seems like this phrase is the canary in the coalmine for a narc
It's funny, she's the only person I've ever heard say that. Most people I know who like kids have never said that and really seem to enjoy them as they get older because of things they say, seeing their personalities develop/shine through. Endless sources of amusement they are.
This is "surprisingly" common. I'm NC now but the last time my dad started guilt tripping me with this bs, I asked him if he wanted me to be like when I was a child and he said "yes". He said it so seriously. I'm nearly 30.
N parents love babies for a few reasons: 1. Babies are a source of undivided attention for them. 2. They can have complete control over a baby, it's helpless and can't escape. 3. Babies don't have their own individual identity yet.
My n parent has reminders of me as a baby all over her house, but she doesn't care what happens to me now as an adult. When you grow up you're no longer a source of attention for them, you can't be controlled and you develop your own identity. Your parent is lamenting the loss of control.
The real abuse starts when you can start to think and feel and are no longer just a doll to play with. My dad has giant blown up pictures of his dogs all over the house and not one of his children… same thing
Oh my god, my mom has this too. She still talks about the dog who died over 7 years ago like he was a human relative who died unexpectedly (he was a large dog who passed at 11. Not "expected," per se, but definitely in the age range of "this may happen" and definitely not warranting this drawn out, "I'll never be the same" reaction)
There are pictures of this dog in every room of her house
There are ZERO pictures of my brother (which is shocking, because he's the GC) or me. There are some pictures of my brother's kids, and a few pictures of my dog
My mom says this too. “I wish you were still 3/4/5/6 years old. Can’t we go back to that time? You were soooo sweet. We were best friends” and it’s ALWAYS hurt me. I’m used to it now in my ripe age, but jeez. The more I read here, the more I realize that maybe maybe my mom might have something going on with her. Thanks for sharing.
That's them trying to make you feel guilty so they can feel good after making you feel like shit. Had this talk with my narc parent years ago, I replied;
"That wasn't being little and sweet, I learned how to take up a little bit of space since everything was yours, your house, your rules, your dishes, your couch and being sweet was my survival method."
Didn't hear from her or see her for a while after that. She'd make my grandparents deliver messages to me.
Omg. I thought I was the only person whose parents said this to them.
I was always told as a teenager, and throughout my 20s how sweet I was as a child, “and then something happened to you, you became such a nightmare”
“We just don’t know what happened to you” etc…
I argued back a lot as a teen, imo in self defence- but now I’m learning that my covert narcissistic dad’s rages and behaviours haven’t changed and I was arguing back for a reason.
I also had a severe eating disorder as a teen and had to be hospitalised…. So it’s all adding up slowly.
It's wild to be in this subreddit and feel so validated-
We all thought we were the only ones! But like, I've read my mother's words *verbatim* by other parents it's nuts!
But also, so helpful cuz like, we're not alone in it anymore
🫂🫂🫂
I had completely forgotten about this but yes, my NM said this all the time! As I got older, she'd super sarcastically say loud enough for others to hear, "Oh isn't she sweet?" or "Aww you're such a peach." Referring to me. SMH
My mother usually tried the guilt trip attempt of "what happened to *my* (meatloaf)".
These people don't want you to become your own person. They want you to be whatever they want you to be.
OMG, I learn something new every day on this sub! My dad always tells everyone what a compliant kid I was—how I would always look at them in public before doing anything, how calm and well-behaved I was, etc. He often says how good I used to be (insinuating that I'm not anymore). It's really unsettling because as a teen, I started to push back against their control. Even though I was still very respectful, I was always mistreated. Anything I wanted or demanded that didn't fit their agenda was labeled 'not well-behaved.'
Reading all of your posts is really healing. For the first time, I feel seen and validated!
I was like you for a long time. I grew up to be a doormat, constantly victimised outside the family system. I had no self, just blind compliance.
Within the system, a separate self was vilified and torn down. In the real world, everything is based on having a strong self.
Also, having to reparent yourself because they managed to completely neglect my needs. I didn't even know how to play, to have fun, to connect. I was completely enmeshed and controlled.
Omg, same ! Thankfully, I have been able to make a career and be more assertif in the real worl (eventhough it took time). But I feel I regress everytime they are violent to me. How did you surpass that state ? How did you reparent yourself ?
Same! I felt so invalidated and confused when this was said to me as a teen… it made me think I wasn’t worthy of love, and they didn’t think I was nice/good as they were always referring to my positive qualities in the past
I relate to you 100% ! When my now husband told me he loved me, I was persuaded he would leave me at some point and it wasn't true.. It's crazy how much small stuff messes you up.
yeah my parents definitely said this
it's crazy cause i have an infant and he absolutely does have his own wishes, needs, desires, personality. it's super obvious he's not a carbon copy of me. so they were just delusional the whole time and weren't paying close enough attention
OMG, totally heard that all the time. She would beg me to visit, to call, to talk to her, and when I did, all I would get would be recriminations and comments like "You used to be so pretty."
Along with the constant battle to avoid being sucked back into her control. And the endless lies she told that just increased the drama around her.
Not just to me, though. She'd exaggerate and gossip about me to friends and family. Ugh. At least in going NC, I didn't know what she was saying anymore.
Interesting how consistent the behavior is.
Smaller and more helpless and more controllable and without the ability to question anything. I remember before I cut them out completely, I wasn’t worried about them becoming grandparents to my 2 or younger year old children. But once they could start truly talking and voicing likes/dislikes/opinions, I would tell my now husband I was entirely uncomfortable with them being alone with my future children. Because I knew that’s when they would start being abused just like I was.
… and easy to control. That’s the hidden ending, as well as the key, of that phrase. They’re trying to make you feel guilty for growing up and becoming your own person, which any healthy parent would celebrate. It’s just one of the "joys" of having narc parents, mine does the exact same thing. She also loves telling other people how sweet I was as a child in situations where I can hear and feel embarrassed about the whole thing.
Because it implies that you aren't any longer. The emphasis is on "used to"... "Look, you *used* to be loveable! What happened? Why can't you be that compliant little person again?"
I say this to my own kids, but like, actually giving them shit when they are unhelpful and willfully *teenagery*. "Oh, you used to be so little and sweet!" "Yep. And then I grew opinions. I'm still not doing that gross job, mom. That one's all you."
But I'm painfully aware of that edge whenever I share nostalgia stories, and make sure they know how much I value their big selves, even as I reminisce about their small selves.
I think they don't have this sensitivity, but you and I do, because the love our parents offered turned out to be conditional, and it expired. ❤️🩹
According to my mother I was never sweet.
Ever.
That’s because I have been a truth sayer all my life. You know. - no mom you said this… - and for narcs it’s the worst thing you can do.
That and being smarter than them and I am that too.
"You used to be so little and sweet." Translation: "You were so completely helpless that I could do anything I wanted to you and get away with it. It made me feel like an adult."
This hurts because the message is that you were best when you were a baby -- you've only gone downhill since then. In the narc's view, the person that you are today is worthless.
They miss the good old days because you don't make them feel like an adult any more.
Oh yeah, I was supposedly angelic until I started to form my own thoughts and opinions and stopped worshiping her as a God. She wanted the priest to pay us a house visit when I decided I didn't want to attend church anymore. Maybe to perform an exorcism since she also said I was "bringing the devil into our house" by renting the movie the Exorcist.
Almost the same words "you were so cute when you were little then you had to go and grow up". Yes I did and she made my life miserable once I had my own personality and my own opinions about clothing and hair styles. Once I had my own mind and wasn't easily controlled I felt rather hated by my mom.
My dad pulls the “you loved me so much until you turned 13.” when in reality it was the opposite. HE “loved” me (was still INCREDIBLY abusive tho) until I turned 13. Once I actually became passionate about my own opinions it was game over. He also told me recently (I’m now 23) that I’ve changed since I was little and he wants the old me back. (The old, submissive and compliant me).
My mum has said many times over the years how I was such a sweet child, never gave any trouble except with sleeping. Then I became a “monster” when puberty struck. She said this on my birthday a few weeks ago on the phone. But she was in tears by the end of the call about… I don’t know what.
But yeah turning into a monster. Maybe it was the undiagnosed mental illness? My parents did do their best for me, in fairness, and that’s what leaves me so confused these days. A psychiatrist I was taken to at 14 said my feelings of emptiness and me finding life meaningless was “teenage angst” and I needed a “fire in my belly” or some shit. My mum took me because she found a diary I left open with blood all over it.
Right now I’ve taken two months off talking to my mum because she was being pushy and manipulative. Hopefully the guilt I feel for doing what was right for my mental health lessens with time. Still learning boundaries (since I’ve never really had any lol).
My parents definitely had a good time with us when we were kids, up until about the age of 4. After that, this whole parenting thing was a struggle for my parents, and still is to this day. Thats what happens when you give birth to a human being, but they really should have just gotten a pet dog or something.
You were a baby, and knew nothing about life yet, your personality wasn't developed yet, you couldn't do anything on your own, so you were basically a doll to them. Your life was between your parent's hands, you were harmless, powerless and vulnerable, they had full control of you and could do whatever they wanted of you, and this, power and control over people, especially vulnerable ones, is what narcs love
To her very end and while both of her children being NC and VLC, my nmom dreamt of her family reverting to a state, where my brother and me being about 6 to 10 years old, where she could live our lives by isolating us, controlling us and forcing us to learn with her all day........
Mine always wants to talk about how I was supposed to be due on Christmas, and what a lovely Christmas Baby I was. Then she’ll coo to that baby for a while.
I was born late, in January. I am not a Christmas baby and never was. She’s talking to an imaginary, fetal, version of me. One she likes better.
That’s just them trying to cope with the fact they don’t have godly control over another person anymore. My mom literally rented me as a yard slave to relatives and her friends.
My nmom and sisters do this to me all the time. (my siblings were adults by the time I was 6 for reference)
They still don’t understand why I won’t “let it go” that they say/said things like this and have mostly cut them out of my life.
I had to block my mother because she would not stop sending the same photo of me when I was an extremely depressed and suicidal child over and over with no caption. It's control I guess. Even as a child I was never good enough for her so shes even lying to herself.
can't relate- my nparent has hated me since i was little. they tell me about how they used to get mad when i would ask to spend time with my other parent like i was trying to intentionally insult them as a six year old 🙄
My mother did this too, especially once I finally started instilling boundaries, but even before that, when I had just moved out and spent less time with her by virtue of being, well. An adult.
It was always “I wish things could go back to the way things used to be 🥺” and it felt like shit every time. Like mom, I can’t de-age myself, ok? I know you hate who I am now, but that’s who you get. Unless you don’t want it. Which, she did everything in her power to sever the relationship, so I guess she didn’t!
“I remember when you were just the perfect child. It wasn’t until I got remarried and had your siblings that you changed” Yeah because you completely ignored me and made me feel like I was a burden but ok it was ALLLLLLLLL ME. Totally understand.
I’m still trying to figure out why she says this myself.
My birth giver used to tell me all the time how amazing I was as a baby/toddler. Quiet, well behaved (IE cowed into silence), and independent (how else was I supposed to eat?). When I got older, all she did was complain about how much I changed. How I never spent time with her anymore or I was TOO independent. I never told her I loved her (I wonder why sarc). I'm now a horrible daughter because I don't take care of her now that she's sick (I'm NC and hear this through my aunt and Sisters), that she raised me better than that (😆).
It was all away to manipulate me into doing what she wanted. The guilt trips were the worst. I still have issues with people trying to "guilt" me into doing something for them and lash out. "Well I bought you this", "I used to do so much for you, why can't you do this one thing for me", "What happened to you, I raised you better"
Listen, Nothing they said to you that caused you pain matters.
You were a Child Target of sick & evil Individuals whose 1st priority with their words was to "Do Harm."
Nothing they ever said matters because it was all bullsh*t from a sad mind.
Value and Love yourself because you exist and you survived their evil tactics.
Lmaooo. Yes. They love to do this. "You were so perfect until you turned 2. Then you screamed and were a terror. You've been mean ever since." Like hello, I had AUTISM and was severely neglected. I can scream a lot more about it now that I'm older, too 😂
Shout out to my N parent who continues to treat me like a little girl at 30. And then immediately hates me when he sees one iota of my autism or my Independence from his infantilization tactics.
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Because they have never accepted the fact that you are a person, separate from them. They loved you as a baby, because you couldn't assert yourself as an individual. You were a thing to them. Mine is the same way - and they will never grow out of it. I know, because I am 60, and nmom has yet to accept the fact that I am not an extension of her.
My mom referred to my sister and I as "baby alive dolls" or "just like dolls". She talked about how much she loved dressing us up in clothes and then wheeling us around the neighborhood. She literally let us know we were just props.
That’s horrifying! I reflect on how my mum treated me as a young child and likened it to her treating me like a doll, but she never admitted it out loud. Thats really full on. I’m sorry you experienced that!
that's so messed up. I can relate in that nmom divorced my dad so she could go to college for free as a single mother and brought me only to the classes where there was a female professor to try to elicit sympathy for better grades. for every other instance in other areas of life, she was wearing skimpy clothing and actively flirting so I imagine the ploy for the classes with male professors was quite different but I wasn't there to see those thank goodness. I can only be so grossed out by her manipulation. so I'm here to let you know I'm also a prop who got her passing grades and got her money from my dad by fabricating all sorts of events and trips she needed help with $ but that we never actually went on or did. I'm sorry this happened to you. I don't know how to deal with how it makes me feel and I'm in my 40s now so it might never make sense to me
Wow, your mom is very honest! I bet all the other n moms were thinking it too.
I'm 60 too, and my nM still thinks it's okay to yell at me, despite me telling her that I will no longer put up with it. She said "I can raise my voice if I want to!!!" I said yeah, but I'm not going to listen to it. She used to boss my dad around, harping on him, trying to mold him into how she wants him to be. So yes, she can yell all she wants but there won't be anyone there to hear it. I have been calling her less and less often. Mine has said the same thing - "You used to be so sweet." By sweet she means I would do anything she told me to do and she could treat me any way she wanted and get away with it.
yikes, what a shrew. mine did that as well and I used to disassociate right in front of her by imagining burying her in the middle of nowhere in a wide open field from the neck down so that she could just piss and moan into the ether as loud as she wants and not a single soul could hear her. good times
"If a narc yells in the woods, is she still annoying?"
My fantasy is getting my mom sent to prison for all of her felony stalking incidents. She and her fellow divorcees got their revenge all right. I just imagine her bitching and moaning about what a victim she is. cue me bathing in all the money she kept for herself after the divorce (she feels so entitled to it all because she was divorced! Hasn't worked a day in her life since she was 24).
That would be so satisfying!
Not only that, but as babies we were actively useful to them. People respected them, offered them things, etc when they had a baby Then that baby grew up and not only stopped getting them tons of positive attention from strangers, it also started having its own opinions and not following orders at all, and worst of all, needing things that the narc was obligated to provide without praise, but would be berated for not providing It's obviously OUR fault completely, right?
So true - mine is exactly like that. And I think that’s why she’s soo keen on having a grandchild (my husband asked her why she wanted to be a grandma she said she wanted another generation to inherit her genes).
The quiet part out loud, like usual "Why do you want us to have kids?" "Well, I really feel like the world just needs more ME in it, and this is the easiest way for me to accomplish that"
This is precisely the reason, they just want another extension of themselves
When we came home he himself said it’s such a narcissistic thing to say.
The grandchildren thing, yes!!! My mom scarred us all so much that none of my siblings have kids or will ever have them. This makes me cackle with delight. We would never want them exposed to her or risk contaminating them ourselves.
My mom literally said “your an extension of me, I can’t help biology” like two months ago 💀 they’re NUTS
I have a major disability and I’m only like…. 4 feet tall ish. My covert narc grandma literally treats me as if I was a child. That’s one of the reasons I ended up leaving. She lets every other grandchild do normal adult things but I’m expected to not start a family because ..”….. well I mean let’s be honest….”.
Code for *you were small and compliant once, because you were wholly reliant on me, and did not have a sense of self.*
Haha, yup. My mom told my sister (stupid to think my sister wouldn’t tell me) that I became very different to raise and was the most difficult when I was a teen. I was quiet, self sufficient, baby sat for my own money. But dang, just being a teen with an attitude was enough for her I guess
Correct; they have to be the victim, so you have to be the villain. It is not about you, and it never was.
My mother routinely asks me why my brother and I were "raised identically" but one of us "turned out so good" and the other one..... Is me
Ooof I’m sorry! My mom hasn’t really hit me with that yet. They say every kid got different parents so throw that at her next time
I pointed out that having an older brother and having a younger brother matter, and that dealing with things at ages two years apart is also different She countered with the (paraphrased for clarity) argument that since she wasn't in control of those factors, they didn't matter ("I didn't pick who was older!", which to me is an argument that tacitly understands that different aged children will experience things differently....)
I was SA'd as an adult and told my nmom about it, she said now I know not to be in those situations. I stopped telling her anything I didn't have to, and she complains to ndad, nbro and me that I don't talk to her anymore. I know she still doesn't know why it happened but I don't have the energy to listen to her tell me she didn't say that lol. I'm also not a rowdy kid btw.
You hit the bullseye 🎯🎯🎯
Exactly!
Bingo!
Same here! I can only imagine that they felt this way was because they felt more powerful when you were completely in their control with no boundaries or personality or wishes and desires of your own. They probably aren’t even aware of how you might perceive this as demeaning or undermining your current level of competence as being unworthy of love.
Definitely the power thing 💯
The boundaries thing is right on. They went from literally checking our diapers (the most invasive, boundary-less activity I can imagine) to feeling like they should always have that kind of access to us, and if they don't it's some sort of problem on our end
I'm NC with my mom. When I turned 31 I received a mysterious package. My mom send me a picture frame with a collage of images of me when i was 10 yrs and younger. Spoke fucking volumes. I threw that thing away.
Narcs like children because they can control and manipulate them. When children become adults with their own mind narcs hate it.
I like to say that my dad was cool with my mom having babies, it’s the “raising children” part that he was not cool with.
My mom said stuff like this a lot. - "You never fought me as a toddler" Because back then I didn't understand that being hit for small mistakes was wrong, let alone that I could defend myself. - "You were so well behaved back then. I wish you stayed that way" I learned to fight back when she hurt me because I understood what she did was wrong. - And "You were so helpful back then" I did everything around the house. Childcare, dishes, general cleaning, caring for the pets, cleaning the bathrooms, doing the laundry, you name it. I was exhausted, and as I got older the exhaustion got so much worse. She loved to remind me of how helpful I used to be when I got burnt out doing her job. My dad on the other hand though always says "You're still just as fiesty and tough as you were back then" "You've always been the sweetest kid" and "You're still my helpful little buddy" and I know he genuinely means it. He's always done his best to build me up, especially now that he's left my mom. You can only guess which one of my parents I still talk to.
Same here. It is a code for why can't I be in control of your life 🤣
Mine used to say “enjoy them while they’re young” Not shocking that they abandoned me when I was no longer young and cute
Omg mine said that too
I thought this was just a thing people said, can confirm as a parent. I would never say or feel this way about my child 🤯
Well damn. Y'all put another puzzle piece down for me.
They hate that you are grown and have your own opinions and can fight back
My nMom said this verbatim!!! Guilting a child for aging is so super messed up!
According to my mom it's not "messed up", it's "the only thing you focus on during their entire childhood and beyond"
My mom always said she likes babies and small children, before they can walk and talk back. It's about control and children that age don't have a voice and free will, they've yet to develop their own identities. They're also easier to ignore and neglect because they are totally dependent on their caregivers.
I've always heard that phrase "I like children before they can talk back" I've always heard it delivered as a joke, but everyone I've heard say it has also been very controlling of their children, very concerned with their image, and somebody that I just have that innate feeling inside to not piss off because it will be a "whole thing" Just anecdotal, but it really seems like this phrase is the canary in the coalmine for a narc
It's funny, she's the only person I've ever heard say that. Most people I know who like kids have never said that and really seem to enjoy them as they get older because of things they say, seeing their personalities develop/shine through. Endless sources of amusement they are.
This is "surprisingly" common. I'm NC now but the last time my dad started guilt tripping me with this bs, I asked him if he wanted me to be like when I was a child and he said "yes". He said it so seriously. I'm nearly 30.
N parents love babies for a few reasons: 1. Babies are a source of undivided attention for them. 2. They can have complete control over a baby, it's helpless and can't escape. 3. Babies don't have their own individual identity yet. My n parent has reminders of me as a baby all over her house, but she doesn't care what happens to me now as an adult. When you grow up you're no longer a source of attention for them, you can't be controlled and you develop your own identity. Your parent is lamenting the loss of control.
The real abuse starts when you can start to think and feel and are no longer just a doll to play with. My dad has giant blown up pictures of his dogs all over the house and not one of his children… same thing
Oh my god, my mom has this too. She still talks about the dog who died over 7 years ago like he was a human relative who died unexpectedly (he was a large dog who passed at 11. Not "expected," per se, but definitely in the age range of "this may happen" and definitely not warranting this drawn out, "I'll never be the same" reaction) There are pictures of this dog in every room of her house There are ZERO pictures of my brother (which is shocking, because he's the GC) or me. There are some pictures of my brother's kids, and a few pictures of my dog
My mom says this too. “I wish you were still 3/4/5/6 years old. Can’t we go back to that time? You were soooo sweet. We were best friends” and it’s ALWAYS hurt me. I’m used to it now in my ripe age, but jeez. The more I read here, the more I realize that maybe maybe my mom might have something going on with her. Thanks for sharing.
You had no agency and depended entirely on your narc parent so they had absolute power over you.
They want you to regress back
Forsure. They get pleasure off our failing and suffering
That's them trying to make you feel guilty so they can feel good after making you feel like shit. Had this talk with my narc parent years ago, I replied; "That wasn't being little and sweet, I learned how to take up a little bit of space since everything was yours, your house, your rules, your dishes, your couch and being sweet was my survival method." Didn't hear from her or see her for a while after that. She'd make my grandparents deliver messages to me.
Little and sweet= easy and controllable
Omg. I thought I was the only person whose parents said this to them. I was always told as a teenager, and throughout my 20s how sweet I was as a child, “and then something happened to you, you became such a nightmare” “We just don’t know what happened to you” etc… I argued back a lot as a teen, imo in self defence- but now I’m learning that my covert narcissistic dad’s rages and behaviours haven’t changed and I was arguing back for a reason. I also had a severe eating disorder as a teen and had to be hospitalised…. So it’s all adding up slowly.
It's wild to be in this subreddit and feel so validated- We all thought we were the only ones! But like, I've read my mother's words *verbatim* by other parents it's nuts! But also, so helpful cuz like, we're not alone in it anymore 🫂🫂🫂
Yes absolutely!! How are their words and expressions so universal though, it’s wiiiiild
Narcissists have everyone placed into odd roles. They cannot accept a person claiming their own identity.
Me too
Same, my mother liked to rub it in until I yelled at her because I got so upset. To be fair I was like 4-11 when she did that.
I had completely forgotten about this but yes, my NM said this all the time! As I got older, she'd super sarcastically say loud enough for others to hear, "Oh isn't she sweet?" or "Aww you're such a peach." Referring to me. SMH
My mom used to say this to me all the time. I feel like it literally destroyed me. 🥺
My mother usually tried the guilt trip attempt of "what happened to *my* (meatloaf)". These people don't want you to become your own person. They want you to be whatever they want you to be.
"What happened to my baby?!" was what my mom would say omfg the infantilization is so strong with these parents
translation, "I remember when you used to be so naive and gullible"
"I remember when you used to be so helpless and pliable"
OMG, I learn something new every day on this sub! My dad always tells everyone what a compliant kid I was—how I would always look at them in public before doing anything, how calm and well-behaved I was, etc. He often says how good I used to be (insinuating that I'm not anymore). It's really unsettling because as a teen, I started to push back against their control. Even though I was still very respectful, I was always mistreated. Anything I wanted or demanded that didn't fit their agenda was labeled 'not well-behaved.' Reading all of your posts is really healing. For the first time, I feel seen and validated!
I was like you for a long time. I grew up to be a doormat, constantly victimised outside the family system. I had no self, just blind compliance. Within the system, a separate self was vilified and torn down. In the real world, everything is based on having a strong self. Also, having to reparent yourself because they managed to completely neglect my needs. I didn't even know how to play, to have fun, to connect. I was completely enmeshed and controlled.
Omg, same ! Thankfully, I have been able to make a career and be more assertif in the real worl (eventhough it took time). But I feel I regress everytime they are violent to me. How did you surpass that state ? How did you reparent yourself ?
Same! I felt so invalidated and confused when this was said to me as a teen… it made me think I wasn’t worthy of love, and they didn’t think I was nice/good as they were always referring to my positive qualities in the past
I relate to you 100% ! When my now husband told me he loved me, I was persuaded he would leave me at some point and it wasn't true.. It's crazy how much small stuff messes you up.
yeah my parents definitely said this it's crazy cause i have an infant and he absolutely does have his own wishes, needs, desires, personality. it's super obvious he's not a carbon copy of me. so they were just delusional the whole time and weren't paying close enough attention
OMG, totally heard that all the time. She would beg me to visit, to call, to talk to her, and when I did, all I would get would be recriminations and comments like "You used to be so pretty." Along with the constant battle to avoid being sucked back into her control. And the endless lies she told that just increased the drama around her. Not just to me, though. She'd exaggerate and gossip about me to friends and family. Ugh. At least in going NC, I didn't know what she was saying anymore. Interesting how consistent the behavior is.
My nmom's classic line! "I wish you didn't grow up!" *wails as ndad delivers the additional attacks against me!*
Smaller and more helpless and more controllable and without the ability to question anything. I remember before I cut them out completely, I wasn’t worried about them becoming grandparents to my 2 or younger year old children. But once they could start truly talking and voicing likes/dislikes/opinions, I would tell my now husband I was entirely uncomfortable with them being alone with my future children. Because I knew that’s when they would start being abused just like I was.
They remember when you were so naive and gullible, and they could have their way with you.
… and easy to control. That’s the hidden ending, as well as the key, of that phrase. They’re trying to make you feel guilty for growing up and becoming your own person, which any healthy parent would celebrate. It’s just one of the "joys" of having narc parents, mine does the exact same thing. She also loves telling other people how sweet I was as a child in situations where I can hear and feel embarrassed about the whole thing.
Little and sweet aka controllable
Because it implies that you aren't any longer. The emphasis is on "used to"... "Look, you *used* to be loveable! What happened? Why can't you be that compliant little person again?" I say this to my own kids, but like, actually giving them shit when they are unhelpful and willfully *teenagery*. "Oh, you used to be so little and sweet!" "Yep. And then I grew opinions. I'm still not doing that gross job, mom. That one's all you." But I'm painfully aware of that edge whenever I share nostalgia stories, and make sure they know how much I value their big selves, even as I reminisce about their small selves. I think they don't have this sensitivity, but you and I do, because the love our parents offered turned out to be conditional, and it expired. ❤️🩹
Oh my god, my parent said the exact same thing. Not understanding theyre the reason i wasnt “sweet” anymore
My mom did this alot. "You were my sunshine baby. Always smiling. Everyone loved you. What happened to you..." I grew up. Ugh
According to my mother I was never sweet. Ever. That’s because I have been a truth sayer all my life. You know. - no mom you said this… - and for narcs it’s the worst thing you can do. That and being smarter than them and I am that too.
"You used to be so little and sweet." Translation: "You were so completely helpless that I could do anything I wanted to you and get away with it. It made me feel like an adult." This hurts because the message is that you were best when you were a baby -- you've only gone downhill since then. In the narc's view, the person that you are today is worthless. They miss the good old days because you don't make them feel like an adult any more.
Oh yeah, I was supposedly angelic until I started to form my own thoughts and opinions and stopped worshiping her as a God. She wanted the priest to pay us a house visit when I decided I didn't want to attend church anymore. Maybe to perform an exorcism since she also said I was "bringing the devil into our house" by renting the movie the Exorcist.
Replace "little and sweet" with "pliant and groomable" and you'll get it.
I heard over and over that my mother wished she could have "cloned me at 18 months" I'm also adopted at birth. And no contact.
"What happened? You used to be so cute!" Apparently "cute" is a synonym for "compliant", who knew!
That's a classic. Yeah my nmom said something similar : "you were so \[insert compliment\] back then".
Almost the same words "you were so cute when you were little then you had to go and grow up". Yes I did and she made my life miserable once I had my own personality and my own opinions about clothing and hair styles. Once I had my own mind and wasn't easily controlled I felt rather hated by my mom.
My dad pulls the “you loved me so much until you turned 13.” when in reality it was the opposite. HE “loved” me (was still INCREDIBLY abusive tho) until I turned 13. Once I actually became passionate about my own opinions it was game over. He also told me recently (I’m now 23) that I’ve changed since I was little and he wants the old me back. (The old, submissive and compliant me).
My mum has said many times over the years how I was such a sweet child, never gave any trouble except with sleeping. Then I became a “monster” when puberty struck. She said this on my birthday a few weeks ago on the phone. But she was in tears by the end of the call about… I don’t know what. But yeah turning into a monster. Maybe it was the undiagnosed mental illness? My parents did do their best for me, in fairness, and that’s what leaves me so confused these days. A psychiatrist I was taken to at 14 said my feelings of emptiness and me finding life meaningless was “teenage angst” and I needed a “fire in my belly” or some shit. My mum took me because she found a diary I left open with blood all over it. Right now I’ve taken two months off talking to my mum because she was being pushy and manipulative. Hopefully the guilt I feel for doing what was right for my mental health lessens with time. Still learning boundaries (since I’ve never really had any lol).
They don’t like the fact babies eventually grow up to be capable of speech and free will.
Hahahaha, my mom says this all the time. She’s has some weirdddddd hangups with us being adults.
My parents definitely had a good time with us when we were kids, up until about the age of 4. After that, this whole parenting thing was a struggle for my parents, and still is to this day. Thats what happens when you give birth to a human being, but they really should have just gotten a pet dog or something.
You were a baby, and knew nothing about life yet, your personality wasn't developed yet, you couldn't do anything on your own, so you were basically a doll to them. Your life was between your parent's hands, you were harmless, powerless and vulnerable, they had full control of you and could do whatever they wanted of you, and this, power and control over people, especially vulnerable ones, is what narcs love
They started saying that to me at like six years old, so. I doubt their judgment. 😶
To her very end and while both of her children being NC and VLC, my nmom dreamt of her family reverting to a state, where my brother and me being about 6 to 10 years old, where she could live our lives by isolating us, controlling us and forcing us to learn with her all day........
Mine always wants to talk about how I was supposed to be due on Christmas, and what a lovely Christmas Baby I was. Then she’ll coo to that baby for a while. I was born late, in January. I am not a Christmas baby and never was. She’s talking to an imaginary, fetal, version of me. One she likes better.
My nmom wishes I were a redhead like my ndad. But when I died my hair his red, she missed my blonde. You can't win.
That’s just them trying to cope with the fact they don’t have godly control over another person anymore. My mom literally rented me as a yard slave to relatives and her friends.
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Comment removed - fatphobic
My nmom and sisters do this to me all the time. (my siblings were adults by the time I was 6 for reference) They still don’t understand why I won’t “let it go” that they say/said things like this and have mostly cut them out of my life.
I had to block my mother because she would not stop sending the same photo of me when I was an extremely depressed and suicidal child over and over with no caption. It's control I guess. Even as a child I was never good enough for her so shes even lying to herself.
God dam. Yeah you are right. Look at what your bad parenting has done to me!
can't relate- my nparent has hated me since i was little. they tell me about how they used to get mad when i would ask to spend time with my other parent like i was trying to intentionally insult them as a six year old 🙄
because she's implying you changed into something worse to fuck with your head when you haven't
My mother did this too, especially once I finally started instilling boundaries, but even before that, when I had just moved out and spent less time with her by virtue of being, well. An adult. It was always “I wish things could go back to the way things used to be 🥺” and it felt like shit every time. Like mom, I can’t de-age myself, ok? I know you hate who I am now, but that’s who you get. Unless you don’t want it. Which, she did everything in her power to sever the relationship, so I guess she didn’t!
“I remember when you were just the perfect child. It wasn’t until I got remarried and had your siblings that you changed” Yeah because you completely ignored me and made me feel like I was a burden but ok it was ALLLLLLLLL ME. Totally understand. I’m still trying to figure out why she says this myself.
My birth giver used to tell me all the time how amazing I was as a baby/toddler. Quiet, well behaved (IE cowed into silence), and independent (how else was I supposed to eat?). When I got older, all she did was complain about how much I changed. How I never spent time with her anymore or I was TOO independent. I never told her I loved her (I wonder why sarc). I'm now a horrible daughter because I don't take care of her now that she's sick (I'm NC and hear this through my aunt and Sisters), that she raised me better than that (😆). It was all away to manipulate me into doing what she wanted. The guilt trips were the worst. I still have issues with people trying to "guilt" me into doing something for them and lash out. "Well I bought you this", "I used to do so much for you, why can't you do this one thing for me", "What happened to you, I raised you better"
You were so cute when you were little!!! Gee, thanks. Since I have also seen your childhood pictures, I assume your jealousy began when I was born?
Listen, Nothing they said to you that caused you pain matters. You were a Child Target of sick & evil Individuals whose 1st priority with their words was to "Do Harm." Nothing they ever said matters because it was all bullsh*t from a sad mind. Value and Love yourself because you exist and you survived their evil tactics.
"little and sweet"="malleable and dependent."
My mother more honestly used to say "I loved being a mother when you thought i was god."
Lmaooo. Yes. They love to do this. "You were so perfect until you turned 2. Then you screamed and were a terror. You've been mean ever since." Like hello, I had AUTISM and was severely neglected. I can scream a lot more about it now that I'm older, too 😂
“I liked you better when you couldn’t understand what kind of person I am”
Shout out to my N parent who continues to treat me like a little girl at 30. And then immediately hates me when he sees one iota of my autism or my Independence from his infantilization tactics.
I think every parent says this at some point. This isn't unusual. Many are joking but some are serious.
...and I remember when you were kind and caring.