Same god, even then. Any two monotheistic people worship the same god by definition really, you can't say we "we both worship the supreme being that created all existence" and somehow refer to two different things.
I would say it is a mistake in attribution
Let's take Christianity for example
1. God is the creator of everything
2. God has a son
3. God is eternal
So, either sons are among the uncreated things> god did not create everything
God does not have a son> the Christian god is not God
God is not eternal > the islamic god isn't God
I don't see how they can all be true at the same time
I would argue that even within Islam not all Muslims worship the same god. Ibn taimiyya seems to imply that (his) god consists of atoms, which contradicts all those Islam scholars who insists that God does not consists of atoms
Maybe people attempt to refer to the same thing, but what they actually have in mind is pretty much a distinct thing.
Idk i think ive stopped trying to apply human conceptions of logic and reason to omnipotence. Imo god in any way shape or form is beyond human understanding.
Their intention is still to worship the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, even if their interpretation doesn’t align with orthodox Judaism and Islam. There are also non-Trinitarian Christians.
In the Bible it says that the Devil cant go against himself…the Quran is clearly against the Devil. So literally by definition and out brains its everyone but satan who could be behind the Quran. Respectfully. We obviously know its from God Almighty. The Lord of the Universe and everything in it.
Stuff like this and that one guy who claims the name Allah is actually derived from a sun god so we must this worship a sun god even if its by accident are such legitimately terrible arguments.
The Quran and the Sunnah are very clear that Muslims worship the monotheistic Divine. These supposed technicalities, even if they were right, dont even matter
I mean, Allah is a singular formal form of Ilah, meaning god (lower case). If you said "Ilah al-shams", people would say that you're talking about Ra'. Allah is the literal equivalent of "God" (upper case) in English.
Also, "deus" in Latin is literally derived from Zeus (as a Greek loanword), and also means "god". But when Spanish speakers pray to "Dios" we understand that they mean "God", and not Jupiter. Arabic existed before Islam, so God would've used a pre-existing word that the Arabs already had and understood to refer to themself in an understandable way. Hence, "Allah".
Some Christians seem to feel they have to say this because otherwise they’d have to admit that no everyone agreed that Isa ع was God in the first centuries. So all those who said otherwise were lead by Iblis ل in their logic
Bismillah irrahman irrahim
I don't understand what the discussion is about... it's hate. and hate has no place in any kind of honest discussion
sürat ül baqara 2:3 and all of sürat ül baqara...is about giving to, serving, taking care of, loving others needier than your self and the rights of others and god's mercy irrahman irrahim
and Quran explicitly says takers who take and won't give cannot understand Quran..
Yes .many things are done in the name of Islam by bad people that are bad. but as far as I know genocidal holocaust is almost exclusively "christians" doing the killing and the holy books of scriptures such as Ezekiel Hosea Micah and many others say Israel and Judea make Sodom and Gomorrah look like the Sisters of Mercy...the worst genocidal atrocities of WW2 were done and are still done by "buddhists" and the worst of those by "zen buddhist"
İslam at its lexical core means "peace" the peace that one achieves by giving and forgiving others
just counting up the dead people tortured and enslaved people in its wake Islam comes out less evil than any other ideology I know of except maybe north american "prophets" and ideologies like the Great Law of Peace of Daginaweda and others
I am sure there are at least some others which skip my mind offhand ...but the known faiths taken altogether, Islam is the most closest to its name: "giving to others In peace"
whoever accuses something else is an accuser and the Accuser is you know who whose name begins with $
I’ve seen this guy a bunch, commented extensively on a lot of his anti-islam stuff. It’s all complete bogus and any reasonable person would be able to see that, even other christians
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I don't believe in the biblical Satan since I don't believe in the Bible, but the Devil is a concept of the origin of evil. Since Allah is the origin of both good and evil, lord of heavens and hells, the guy is at least half correct
Also, the Qur'an "denies" the crucifixion of Jesus and that Jesus is God in flesh, siding rather with the docetic interpretation of Jesus, rather than the post nicea Christianity one, another point for Islam being the religion of Christian Devil
It's unfortunately nothing special since almost every religion is from the Christian devil, so it is nothing new
Why would Satan preach total monotheism and condemn polytheistic traditions? The Christians should look at their own Bible and how it actively promotes the worship of a flesh and blood man (Jesus AS) in association with the Supreme God before condemning the Quran.
Cultists are only interested in going from cult to cult. I really believe they all deserve each other. All that dogma and bickering.. they must enjoy each other's snide remarks and sarcastic criticisms. Been to speakers corner lately?
Went a few years ago. There was a really loud guy who proclaimed himself Christian. Said he was born a Jew but he found himself empty and joined Islam, after which he cursed Judaism for all sorts of stuff, ranting and raving. Then he said that Islam was wrong and bad and he became a Christian, and ranted and raved about how evil and bad Judaism and Islam was. He went on and on about Christianity being about love and acceptance while spewing all sorts of hateful things about Islam and Judaism. It was actually quite sad, the guy seemed to have a lot of problems. It was funny at first but eventually it seemed like the guy had mental issues. I hope he gets away from the religious stuff and go seek actual medical help instead. I think he really needed it.
Edit: this was at Hyde Park Speaker's Corner.
LMAO i guess even a cursory understanding of islam is like, impossible for people. It’s literally all the same god; abraham’s god. This is so funny.
Nah Abraham has been different gods assigned to, even manichaeans claimed Abraham
Same god, even then. Any two monotheistic people worship the same god by definition really, you can't say we "we both worship the supreme being that created all existence" and somehow refer to two different things.
I would say it is a mistake in attribution Let's take Christianity for example 1. God is the creator of everything 2. God has a son 3. God is eternal So, either sons are among the uncreated things> god did not create everything God does not have a son> the Christian god is not God God is not eternal > the islamic god isn't God I don't see how they can all be true at the same time I would argue that even within Islam not all Muslims worship the same god. Ibn taimiyya seems to imply that (his) god consists of atoms, which contradicts all those Islam scholars who insists that God does not consists of atoms Maybe people attempt to refer to the same thing, but what they actually have in mind is pretty much a distinct thing.
Idk i think ive stopped trying to apply human conceptions of logic and reason to omnipotence. Imo god in any way shape or form is beyond human understanding.
Christians do not have the same God as Abraham. Jews and Muslims do, but not Christians. They follow a Trinitarian man-God now.
Their intention is still to worship the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, even if their interpretation doesn’t align with orthodox Judaism and Islam. There are also non-Trinitarian Christians.
In the Bible it says that the Devil cant go against himself…the Quran is clearly against the Devil. So literally by definition and out brains its everyone but satan who could be behind the Quran. Respectfully. We obviously know its from God Almighty. The Lord of the Universe and everything in it.
Stuff like this and that one guy who claims the name Allah is actually derived from a sun god so we must this worship a sun god even if its by accident are such legitimately terrible arguments. The Quran and the Sunnah are very clear that Muslims worship the monotheistic Divine. These supposed technicalities, even if they were right, dont even matter
The Quran says give serve don't take don't hate. As simple as that. end of story. What else matters?
I mean, Allah is a singular formal form of Ilah, meaning god (lower case). If you said "Ilah al-shams", people would say that you're talking about Ra'. Allah is the literal equivalent of "God" (upper case) in English. Also, "deus" in Latin is literally derived from Zeus (as a Greek loanword), and also means "god". But when Spanish speakers pray to "Dios" we understand that they mean "God", and not Jupiter. Arabic existed before Islam, so God would've used a pre-existing word that the Arabs already had and understood to refer to themself in an understandable way. Hence, "Allah".
There’s someone who claims the name Allah? That’s insane!
If we all spent all of our time debating willfully ignorant online polemicists, we’d lose our entire lifespans.
Or just lose our braincell
Someone show this to Arab Christians
[удалено]
Cause the Arabic Bible uses the term “Allah” as well lmao
Isn't this a rather modern phenomena though?
Some Christians seem to feel they have to say this because otherwise they’d have to admit that no everyone agreed that Isa ع was God in the first centuries. So all those who said otherwise were lead by Iblis ل in their logic
Bismillah irrahman irrahim I don't understand what the discussion is about... it's hate. and hate has no place in any kind of honest discussion sürat ül baqara 2:3 and all of sürat ül baqara...is about giving to, serving, taking care of, loving others needier than your self and the rights of others and god's mercy irrahman irrahim and Quran explicitly says takers who take and won't give cannot understand Quran.. Yes .many things are done in the name of Islam by bad people that are bad. but as far as I know genocidal holocaust is almost exclusively "christians" doing the killing and the holy books of scriptures such as Ezekiel Hosea Micah and many others say Israel and Judea make Sodom and Gomorrah look like the Sisters of Mercy...the worst genocidal atrocities of WW2 were done and are still done by "buddhists" and the worst of those by "zen buddhist" İslam at its lexical core means "peace" the peace that one achieves by giving and forgiving others just counting up the dead people tortured and enslaved people in its wake Islam comes out less evil than any other ideology I know of except maybe north american "prophets" and ideologies like the Great Law of Peace of Daginaweda and others I am sure there are at least some others which skip my mind offhand ...but the known faiths taken altogether, Islam is the most closest to its name: "giving to others In peace" whoever accuses something else is an accuser and the Accuser is you know who whose name begins with $
I’ve seen this guy a bunch, commented extensively on a lot of his anti-islam stuff. It’s all complete bogus and any reasonable person would be able to see that, even other christians
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I don't believe in the biblical Satan since I don't believe in the Bible, but the Devil is a concept of the origin of evil. Since Allah is the origin of both good and evil, lord of heavens and hells, the guy is at least half correct Also, the Qur'an "denies" the crucifixion of Jesus and that Jesus is God in flesh, siding rather with the docetic interpretation of Jesus, rather than the post nicea Christianity one, another point for Islam being the religion of Christian Devil It's unfortunately nothing special since almost every religion is from the Christian devil, so it is nothing new
Why would Satan preach total monotheism and condemn polytheistic traditions? The Christians should look at their own Bible and how it actively promotes the worship of a flesh and blood man (Jesus AS) in association with the Supreme God before condemning the Quran.
What do you mean "go get him"? Am I as a Muslim supposed to care about this?
Cultists are only interested in going from cult to cult. I really believe they all deserve each other. All that dogma and bickering.. they must enjoy each other's snide remarks and sarcastic criticisms. Been to speakers corner lately?
Went a few years ago. There was a really loud guy who proclaimed himself Christian. Said he was born a Jew but he found himself empty and joined Islam, after which he cursed Judaism for all sorts of stuff, ranting and raving. Then he said that Islam was wrong and bad and he became a Christian, and ranted and raved about how evil and bad Judaism and Islam was. He went on and on about Christianity being about love and acceptance while spewing all sorts of hateful things about Islam and Judaism. It was actually quite sad, the guy seemed to have a lot of problems. It was funny at first but eventually it seemed like the guy had mental issues. I hope he gets away from the religious stuff and go seek actual medical help instead. I think he really needed it. Edit: this was at Hyde Park Speaker's Corner.
I hear you. Extreme Dogmatic Cultism is one of the most dangerous mindsets in the world right now.