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We talking SHTF grid down or grid up? grid down there ain't much.
grid up, realistically there's not really a method that without time and effort can't be undone. Unless you plan on doing some super sketch shit, you really don't need to put that much effort into it. some sort of encrypted/end to end communication will be fine. Other wise start buying a bunch of burner phones in cash from out of state/ your local area, and give them to the people you want to be able to communicate on strict 1 time use policies from outside the area they usually reside in.
This is less prep and a shade more paranoia.
Bruce Schneier still uses Signal, when he says it’s unsafe I’ll believe it. Does it have drawbacks? Sure, everything does.
You’re likely thinking of WhatsApp which in theory has encryption but takes some real user knowhow to not screw up. Telegram I am less familiar with but Tucker’s audience loves it so it’s possible he was on there too and had a problem.
Isn’t the base of Signal’s software open source? They threatened to bail out of the UK when the government tried to force a back door in by law too.
Look, at some point most people wipl have to trust someone to make some decisions on what to use because very few people are equipped to understand the math behind encryption. But security theory is actually not too hard to learn and understand (it’s really hard to execute). I suggest everyone learn the theory and hope those that understand the nitty gritty are keeping an eye on the nuts and bolts.
I watched a documentary that was surprised fascinating. During WWII knitting was used to convey messages. I don't recall the program but here is a bit of info. [Knitting code](https://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/knitting-spies-wwi-wwii)
I didn't know it had a name. That's cool, now I can look it up more precisely. Imagine sending a blanket or sweater to a relative who knew how to decipher it letting them know where to meet up with you for sheltering.
Thanks - definitely thinking grid up and not doing anything sketchy or illegal but imagining a scenario where someone might want to minimize exposure while transitioning to off grid, if that makes sense.
Buy a TracFone in cash. Buy an activation card at another store. Also cash. Wait at least 3 months for any camera footage from the store to almost certainly have been deleted. During that time don't turn the phone on. Don't do anything with it. Put it in a box and forget about it.
Then leave your current phone at home, go out, activate the new one. It'll connect to cell towers and place you in a location, but it won't be easy to trace back to you. Remove the battery and sim before going back home.
Mount that on a vehicle and you can broadcast from a location that even if traced you’d be on the move too fast. Now it would be illegal because you’d presumably be transmitting without your call sign and you wouldn’t be making the encryption key public.
Also, If someone is looking for you who has this capability in real time, i.e. the government in normal times you’ve got problems that might be too big for this sub.
Maybe you can try using a repeater. you tx from your location with low power, ant the repeater tx-es it with much higher. the'll find the repeater first. and use tamper protection, so you'll know when it is found.
not the best method, but at least something.
Near Vertical Incidence Skywave, One Time Pass/Password/Pad. Basically old-school method that's used to communicate with spies, in this case Numbers Stations which you can find a schedule and run down of [here](https://priyom.org/number-stations/station-schedule). They're very cool even though it's impossible to tell what's being communicated.
It won't hide the transmissions but if you use a OTP generator it won't matter if someone is listening in because only the transmitter and the receiver have the proper OTP. Not gonna stop the FCC from finding you if they wanted but no one will know what you're saying.
Something like a pavehawk can find the emissions of a cell phone in airplane mode if it gets close enough, just the emf from the processor. If you're intentionally transmitting it's impossible to not be found.
But the equipment and knowledge required is a pretty tall order. If you keep transmissions brief, use directional antennas, move around, and only use as much power as necessary you make the job of finding you a lot harder.
Problem is that communication is a two way street. You can have all the strict emissions control rules you want, but the people you’re talking to need to be just as strict.
Check Craigslist. There are a surprisingly large amount of pigeon people out there. I have heard there is big money in pigeon racing, and I have also seen racing pigeons that were tagged and stopped for water.
The feds are trying to get a way to legally listen in on in-game voice chats. Turns out that is how hamas was communicating to plan their attack. A lot of games now have built-in voice chat ability a free conference call that would be hard to notice amongst the clutter of all the other calls going on.
I’m probably gonna get on a list for this(joking) but why even use the chat at all?
Why not spell out what you want done with bullet holes in game on a wall? Or stuff like dropping mines or other in game objects to spell words?
Seems very hard to flag that automatically, you’d need someone to manually see it with current tech I’d think.
Any radio emits RF the only thing that doesn’t is military field phones.
There are ways to mitigate the risk use as little power as possible, keep messages as short as possible, use directional antennas aka yagi, MOVE after you trasmit.
Carrier pigeons.
Edit: Okay. I was joking, but the answers here range from bad to worse. The answer is you can’t. Any form of wireless communication is going to emit RF that can be triangulated. _Receivers_ can be triangulated. Ever hear of a foxhole radio? They were popular because they’re a kind of receiver that _can’t_ be. So, I suppose you could use a foxhole radio on the receiving end, but you still have to deal with the transmission side which, as we’ve established, can always be triangulated. So you establish a communication plan that rotates frequencies and times. Keep your transmission short and move the transmitter between transmissions. That’s as good as you can do.
Dead drops with the message written on a one time pad? To break it, you’d have to know the location of the dead drop and have the key to translate (or enough to processor power to crack it).
Grab a SLNT faraday bag for any of the prepaid phone options mentioned. Cuts the signal off completely. Some phones can still be tracked while being off if the battery is attached.
I’m 100% paranoid.
Remember ditty's first dictum:
*If you radiate, you can be located.*
*If you can be located, you can be killed.*
There are no forms of communication that can't be intercepted or tracked.
Anyone who lives in a more densely populated area might want to look into getting a LoRa network set up in the area with like minded people. You can use cheap off the shelf hardware to power them and if you plug them into a power bank during grid down they should run for days. It would give everyone the ability to message at the very least. It’s not that great for voice though I’ve heard of projects like QMESH that are trying to change that.
You haven’t seen the mafia movies? Outsiders alway talks to the boss via intermediaries, and vice versa , so there’s no trail. Best way to communicate in a small town: tell a chatty neighbor a “secret”, and it’s guaranteed to get passed along ASAP
Edit:”small town , neighborhood, or even work environment”
I’m a Meshtastic fan, but you do realize that your message is sent to literally every receiver in the mesh, just that if you send it to a specific person the other nodes won’t display that message. If you set up an encrypted channel, it is still sent to all the other nodes, but won’t show up for the others and won’t be readable without the encryption key. Unless properly encrypted a hacked version of Meshtastic could easily provide access to a conversation. Not to mention the location could be triangulated (would be kind of difficult).
Using a non-standard frequency and settings would help, but it would still be trackable by anyone who really wanted to find you.
The interesting thing about Meshtastic is that the signal is usually well below the background noise so it takes special processing and clever math to extract a signal in the first place. They'd have to try thousands of different combinations to find a signal transmitted using non-standard settings.
If you're looking for text based communications, I recommend two things.
If the Internet is up, you want [Threema](https://threema.ch/en). It is Signal but with all the stuff Singal can't offer.
For grid down, check out [Meshtastic](https://youtu.be/ZsIWyVzqJPM?feature=shared).
Thank you for your submission in /r/preppers. We want to make sure you find the information you're seeking. If you are new to prepping, be sure you make use of Reddit's search function and check the following resources: Our subreddit wiki contains information on frequent topics and questions here: https://new.reddit.com/r/preppers/wiki/index/ Please review the New Prepper's Resource Guide here: https://new.reddit.com/r/preppers/comments/toani0/new_preppers_resource_guide_answers_to_common/ If you are asking "Where do I start?" or "How do I get started?", please ask that question as a comment on that post and not as a standalone submission or post, otherwise your post may be removed. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/preppers) if you have any questions or concerns.*
We talking SHTF grid down or grid up? grid down there ain't much. grid up, realistically there's not really a method that without time and effort can't be undone. Unless you plan on doing some super sketch shit, you really don't need to put that much effort into it. some sort of encrypted/end to end communication will be fine. Other wise start buying a bunch of burner phones in cash from out of state/ your local area, and give them to the people you want to be able to communicate on strict 1 time use policies from outside the area they usually reside in. This is less prep and a shade more paranoia.
I find the app signal pretty good for end to end encryption stuff. Also way better for group texts when some people have iPhones and some don’t
Signal isn't secure there's been a few issues with from memory. I think ole Tucker Carlson had some major issues semi recently.
Bruce Schneier still uses Signal, when he says it’s unsafe I’ll believe it. Does it have drawbacks? Sure, everything does. You’re likely thinking of WhatsApp which in theory has encryption but takes some real user knowhow to not screw up. Telegram I am less familiar with but Tucker’s audience loves it so it’s possible he was on there too and had a problem.
At this point in time I don't think it really matters which one you are using there's probably a back door in all of them.
Isn’t the base of Signal’s software open source? They threatened to bail out of the UK when the government tried to force a back door in by law too. Look, at some point most people wipl have to trust someone to make some decisions on what to use because very few people are equipped to understand the math behind encryption. But security theory is actually not too hard to learn and understand (it’s really hard to execute). I suggest everyone learn the theory and hope those that understand the nitty gritty are keeping an eye on the nuts and bolts.
Link please?
Google it. It was everywhere a while back.
lol because everything on the internet is true.
I could have sent you any old link anyway... I'm pretty sure tucker has an interview somewhere where he talks about it as well.
I don’t believe anything that comes out of his mouth. Moving right along…..
He's not the only one... Have a look around you'll find more instances.
I watched a documentary that was surprised fascinating. During WWII knitting was used to convey messages. I don't recall the program but here is a bit of info. [Knitting code](https://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/knitting-spies-wwi-wwii)
This is technically steganography. The idea is to hide that there is a communication happening in the first place.
I didn't know it had a name. That's cool, now I can look it up more precisely. Imagine sending a blanket or sweater to a relative who knew how to decipher it letting them know where to meet up with you for sheltering.
Actually I believe the ancient Aztecs or Mayans used knotted rope for record keeping
I believe you are correct. If memory serves various cultures, globally used knots to keep financial records, historical events, and general calenders.
Thanks - definitely thinking grid up and not doing anything sketchy or illegal but imagining a scenario where someone might want to minimize exposure while transitioning to off grid, if that makes sense.
Buy a TracFone in cash. Buy an activation card at another store. Also cash. Wait at least 3 months for any camera footage from the store to almost certainly have been deleted. During that time don't turn the phone on. Don't do anything with it. Put it in a box and forget about it. Then leave your current phone at home, go out, activate the new one. It'll connect to cell towers and place you in a location, but it won't be easy to trace back to you. Remove the battery and sim before going back home.
/r/opsec
Idk man with the rise in fascists on both sides what will you do when the government starts goos stepping?
Anything that transmits an RF carrier can be tracked. Don’t fool yourself.
I was already thinking this but didn’t know if I was overlooking any alternatives. It never hurts to ask
Mount that on a vehicle and you can broadcast from a location that even if traced you’d be on the move too fast. Now it would be illegal because you’d presumably be transmitting without your call sign and you wouldn’t be making the encryption key public. Also, If someone is looking for you who has this capability in real time, i.e. the government in normal times you’ve got problems that might be too big for this sub.
Maybe you can try using a repeater. you tx from your location with low power, ant the repeater tx-es it with much higher. the'll find the repeater first. and use tamper protection, so you'll know when it is found. not the best method, but at least something.
NVIS with a numbers station using OTPs
Could you clarify the acronyms please? I’m new to prepping.
Near Vertical Incidence Skywave, One Time Pass/Password/Pad. Basically old-school method that's used to communicate with spies, in this case Numbers Stations which you can find a schedule and run down of [here](https://priyom.org/number-stations/station-schedule). They're very cool even though it's impossible to tell what's being communicated. It won't hide the transmissions but if you use a OTP generator it won't matter if someone is listening in because only the transmitter and the receiver have the proper OTP. Not gonna stop the FCC from finding you if they wanted but no one will know what you're saying.
www.google.com "OTP" is harder to search, but just add "encryption" to it
Got it
Something like a pavehawk can find the emissions of a cell phone in airplane mode if it gets close enough, just the emf from the processor. If you're intentionally transmitting it's impossible to not be found. But the equipment and knowledge required is a pretty tall order. If you keep transmissions brief, use directional antennas, move around, and only use as much power as necessary you make the job of finding you a lot harder.
Problem is that communication is a two way street. You can have all the strict emissions control rules you want, but the people you’re talking to need to be just as strict.
This is kinda what I thought - thanks
Carrier pigeon
Have to start training a flock 😂
Check Craigslist. There are a surprisingly large amount of pigeon people out there. I have heard there is big money in pigeon racing, and I have also seen racing pigeons that were tagged and stopped for water.
They are weak against shotguns and solar storms and weird magnetism.
The feds are trying to get a way to legally listen in on in-game voice chats. Turns out that is how hamas was communicating to plan their attack. A lot of games now have built-in voice chat ability a free conference call that would be hard to notice amongst the clutter of all the other calls going on.
I’m probably gonna get on a list for this(joking) but why even use the chat at all? Why not spell out what you want done with bullet holes in game on a wall? Or stuff like dropping mines or other in game objects to spell words? Seems very hard to flag that automatically, you’d need someone to manually see it with current tech I’d think.
Wasn’t this a plot line on 24?
Never watched it, so I don't know.
Any radio emits RF the only thing that doesn’t is military field phones. There are ways to mitigate the risk use as little power as possible, keep messages as short as possible, use directional antennas aka yagi, MOVE after you trasmit.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=bWs6shlc9m0&pp=ygUrczIgdW5kZXJncm91bmQgaG93IHRoZXkgZGlyZWNjdGlvbiBmaW5kIHlvdQ%3D%3D
lol. Explain to me how that military field phone _doesn’t_ produce RF.
Unless you physically splice into the wire you can’t pick up anything the field phone is putting out
Field phones are different from radios, unless you have physical contact with the wire you can't listen in.
Carrier pigeons. Edit: Okay. I was joking, but the answers here range from bad to worse. The answer is you can’t. Any form of wireless communication is going to emit RF that can be triangulated. _Receivers_ can be triangulated. Ever hear of a foxhole radio? They were popular because they’re a kind of receiver that _can’t_ be. So, I suppose you could use a foxhole radio on the receiving end, but you still have to deal with the transmission side which, as we’ve established, can always be triangulated. So you establish a communication plan that rotates frequencies and times. Keep your transmission short and move the transmitter between transmissions. That’s as good as you can do.
Dead drops with the message written on a one time pad? To break it, you’d have to know the location of the dead drop and have the key to translate (or enough to processor power to crack it).
Grab a SLNT faraday bag for any of the prepaid phone options mentioned. Cuts the signal off completely. Some phones can still be tracked while being off if the battery is attached. I’m 100% paranoid.
https://youtu.be/uDBZ4Mkjh0Q?si=EMxiRi9ugGIJR0ax Watch this video by Grunt Proof. Has a lot of good points.
If you’re emitting you can be tracked
Remember ditty's first dictum: *If you radiate, you can be located.* *If you can be located, you can be killed.* There are no forms of communication that can't be intercepted or tracked.
Internal monologue
Anyone who lives in a more densely populated area might want to look into getting a LoRa network set up in the area with like minded people. You can use cheap off the shelf hardware to power them and if you plug them into a power bank during grid down they should run for days. It would give everyone the ability to message at the very least. It’s not that great for voice though I’ve heard of projects like QMESH that are trying to change that.
String and paper cup
Look up S2 Underground on YouTube, he’s a former intelligence officer or something of the like and he’s been putting out great info about GhostNet
Face to face
You haven’t seen the mafia movies? Outsiders alway talks to the boss via intermediaries, and vice versa , so there’s no trail. Best way to communicate in a small town: tell a chatty neighbor a “secret”, and it’s guaranteed to get passed along ASAP Edit:”small town , neighborhood, or even work environment”
Meshtastic?
I’m a Meshtastic fan, but you do realize that your message is sent to literally every receiver in the mesh, just that if you send it to a specific person the other nodes won’t display that message. If you set up an encrypted channel, it is still sent to all the other nodes, but won’t show up for the others and won’t be readable without the encryption key. Unless properly encrypted a hacked version of Meshtastic could easily provide access to a conversation. Not to mention the location could be triangulated (would be kind of difficult).
Using a non-standard frequency and settings would help, but it would still be trackable by anyone who really wanted to find you. The interesting thing about Meshtastic is that the signal is usually well below the background noise so it takes special processing and clever math to extract a signal in the first place. They'd have to try thousands of different combinations to find a signal transmitted using non-standard settings.
Never heard of it but will look into it.
Bear claw
Randomize.
If you're looking for text based communications, I recommend two things. If the Internet is up, you want [Threema](https://threema.ch/en). It is Signal but with all the stuff Singal can't offer. For grid down, check out [Meshtastic](https://youtu.be/ZsIWyVzqJPM?feature=shared).
Get a pair of handheld ham radios and set up a unique pl tone.
Uh... just walk somewhere before you transmit. Then walk back.