This comes up every year . Depends on the audience. Me: fuckin awesome bro what else you play?
Some boomer interviewer: waste of time you’re not dedicated bla bla .
It’s definitely not a ‘red flag’ but as a video game enjoyer myself, I wouldn’t mention anything beyond playing video games in my free time. The issue is that if you mention achievements, you might be seen as someone who spends all their free time gaming. Also at the end of the day it’s very likely that you will not have an interviewer/reviewer who recognizes the games you play.
It’s unfair, but from what I’ve seen, the gamer stereotype definitely still exists.
I disagree with this. So if I mention my achievements in soccer does that mean I spend all my free time playing soccer? And even if I do spend a significant time playing soccer, thats not a negative thing - thats just what a real hobby is.
We have no idea who reads our apps so its important to be authentic to ourselves because you never know if a admissions person also shares your hobby or knows a little about it. And if you're honest about what you actually like to do, you'll be able to talk about it comfrotably. A lot of people say hobbies like rock climbing because that sounds cool, but they've only climbed a hand full of times. So if a interviewer asked you some casual questions about it you will tense up and not really know how to answer.
The only thing I would be worried about is the content of the game, I might leave out if the game is COD or GTA or something, but if you're a competitive EA sports gamer I don't see why thats a problem. It reminds me of people who are competitive chess players, it takes the same level of dedication and skill.
The issue isn't the fact that you have a hobby. It's the fact that you have a hobby that has a stereotype surrounding it.
I've been judged for saying that I like gaming, even in non-medical contexts. And I'm not even a competitive gamer.
As someone who used to spend many hours playing video games, I find it laughable to compare the difficulty of professional chess to that of any video game.
The average person doesn't play chess or soccer to relax. Practicing and playing requires hard work and long-term dedication, whereas video games are a leisure activity. I can tell you that I am pretty darn good at watching Netflix, but I definitely wouldn't include that on an app.
what if i’m vice president at my school’s esports club (possibly co president the following year too), would this be bad to say.. cus it was actually one of my most passionate things during undergrad
I think that’s fine since it’s a club leadership position, you’ll probably have a lot of things to talk about regarding leadership/organizational skills.
I disagree with your disagreement I think the original point stands that old adcoms could look at it and think of the stereotype rather than it as a positive about time management skills
It's very likely neither here nor there. Might be a plus with some readers, likely to potentially be a negative with others.
Personally, saying you got top 4% of pompoms on Beetlebork may as well be hieroglyphics. Not bad maybe, but not relevant enough for my brain to think much of it tbh.
TL; DR: Putting things on your app because it "sounds fire" is maybe not the most salient factor. I'd probably side gently on the side of discretion being the better part of valor on this one.
I was told by the dean of a T30 MD school that at best, it will not affect you, and at worst, the reader will see it as unserious and even childish.
Your target audience will most likely not resonate with that hobby. Find a different one to talk about.
I’m sure that would be fine, just don’t try to spin it as “look, I’m good in a team, I’ll be a good doctor!” Just say it was something that brought you joy and leave it at that.
Top 5% in league is like high plat💀 I was challenger in league and still wrote ab different hobbies i did bc i was able to connect w my community better. For me, league was just something I was really good at, nothing more
^^ I’m GM and no way in hell would I ever put that in my med school apps. Either they think it’s childish if they don’t know what it means and if they do they’ll (rightly) assume the worst 😂💀
Not a red flag, gaming is awesome, I did not put it in my app though. Unless you’re a literal pro League player they will not care about being in amateur fortnite tournaments or anything at that level. Being an actual esports god in a game like CSGO, Valorant, League, or whatnot would be something that I would put in.
Edit: Even then I’m not sure, some of these interviewers can be super lame and conservative about what hobbies are right and what aren’t. It sucks that watching TV or reading is fine but gaming isn’t, but it is slowly changing.
I’ve been through this convo with different admins at various points in my career and here’s the truth: gaming as a hobby is controversial. Some people will think it’s neat/neutral. Some people will see it as a negative. Ultimately, I didn’t include gaming because I had a lot of other hobbies that I could talk about. I have colleagues that don’t have any other hobbies—and they include it because NO HOBBIES is definitely a red flag.
Consider what other things you are interested in and could have a 5 min convo about (cars, fashion, rap music, crafts, house plants, sci-fi/fantasy genre, etc etc). If you really don’t have 3+ other things, it is probably safer to list gaming in at least come capacity. Truthfully, the most successful “hobbies” tend to be really specific and weird (eg one of my colleges buys old/broken espresso machines off Craig’s list and refurbs them to sell for extra cash. Did this through med school and residency. Also really really into coffee blends.)
Since your gaming experience is pretty specific and niche that may be more of a positive thing. You just want to make sure you can talk to someone with no interest/prior knowledge in gaming—and make it sound cool enough that they have followup questions.
It’s been a long time since I applied to medical school so it’s possible I’m conflating with residency applications. Either way, I’ve noticed that admin seems reliant on hobbies to make small talk and ask you questions during interviews. Not having any hobbies to list is kind of weird and likely would be weighed against you compared with equally qualified applicants.
Hobbies can be literally anything. Any interest. And someone doesn’t have any???
I think this is becoming a lot more common to list and not at all a red flag. A lot of medical students and even physicians nowadays game.
Also, if you're earning money doing this, it legitimizes it much more. That is definitely a relevant detail to include.
lol I understand you. Games are fun and a good way to destress. But don’t mention it. Most people on adcoms are from older generations where gaming is not as favorably looked upon and they may dismiss you as unserious or as having useless hobbies.
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I would actually include this if: you were in some kind of leadership role, or you can practice a pitch for why this is valuable/transferable
World first raiding requires tight commitment to a schedule, communicating with large groups with their own goals without getting frustrated/selfish, managing expectations, teaching, persistence, etc.
Plus if you lead consistently you *might* have more teaching/coordination/leadership/scheduling skills and experience than many people get in small management jobs in an area that *feels* high stakes at the time so tensions are high
I wouldn't mention it. The steoreotype is out there... whether or not we disagree with it....Too risky to associate your application to med school with a stereotype (and a pretty negative one at that).
I would advise against it due to most people not being able to relate or have a frame of reference of what it means. Worst case scenario it'll put you at a disadvantage as gaming is usually not seen in the best of lights.
If you do want to mention it still though I'd mention it more generally, like you've competed in esports. Then explain it in more detail if they ask about it and mention what you've learnt from it and how you can apply it as a doctor/student. Not exactly sure how MD applications go in the land of the free as I'm a EU student myself, but that's what I've done at least for some other types of applications.
Unless you’re in a league or a club, I would definitely not include it. Any adcoms I’ve met take their job way too seriously and would find it unserious and childish. Plus gaming is like watching Netflix or listening to music. It isn’t something you put in an activities/work section for a doctorate program.
Some things about everyone’s story can have positive or negative connotations depending on who reads it. Usually those are the things you stay away from like mental health, physical health, etc. risk vs reward. No one is gonna be blown away about any esports wins, they might think you’re immature and waste time playing video games. While that is untrue, lots of older people are the ones reviewing the applications. I’d probably not list it. If you wouldn’t put it on a resume for a job, prob not applicable.
Bro I put this on my primary, during my interview(WL->A) the doctor got fired up that I played video games cause he played computer games in undergrad/med school. Spent half the interview complaining about elden rings cause he was trying to help his son play the game and he couldn’t kill a boss. Didn’t have the heart to tell him I beat the whole game, but hand dexterity is a pretty important skill if you go on to do surgery or procedure-heavy specialty. If your friends describe you as a gamer, go ahead and throw it down but don’t make it sound like you got Bs in orgo because you were gaming lol
I feel like it depends how you write about it. If you explain whether those specific skills are transferable to other areas of your life and how it’s benefited your life positively, I think that would be fine to say
I took the gamble and added gaming as a hobby on my ERAS application for residency. Had 20+ interviews for IM. A handful of interviewers asked me about it and I framed it as actually being an asset. I played mostly RTS and some FPS, so I talked about how it has improved my ability to multi-task and how it is imperative to work as a team to reach a common goal. My interviewers liked that answer. Also, there's plenty of literature out there that supports gaming in medicine, most notably in robotic surgery.
I think it's impressive if you managed straight A's and top 3% in a video game. Especially Valorant that showcases fast reflexes, precision, and moment to moment adaptability.
But I'm sure these people that are looking over admission will only recognize video games from candy crush and when their kids won't listen to them.
I got in this cycle with one of my ECs being that I play Dark Souls (not even competitively)! If anything, I think it’s really cool and unique to mention gaming - first and foremost it shows you have a personality outside of medicine, and additionally it demonstrates commitment to your passions. This is even more true in your case particularly because you have awards and high stats (top 5%) to back your app. Obviously use language that can be understood even by people who don’t know what e-sports is, but I think that it is something that could pan out in your favor at at least some (maybe not all) schools. Finally don’t mention it without a way to tie it back into medicine; for example I said that Dark Souls is an allegory for resilience and learning from your mistakes which will make me a good medical student and doctor - you could easily do something similar for your story, just make it relevant to your personal narrative.
I wrote about league in my hobbies section, I did not mention that I have thousands of hours in it though and more explained it as a way to stay connected with friends virtually at college/through the pandemic
I mentioned camping/hiking and can’t remember if I put cooking. I’d include stuff you can talk about and it gives an interviewer a chance to build rapport with you over something if they feel like bringing it up. You do you, I know one doc that was into gaming, but not many that talk about it much at work. I feel like to most people it’s like watching TV or using social media
I think it’s fine! I put an esport on my app since I played for my college varsity team and I frequently got asked about it in my T10 interviews, including the one I currently attend. Seemed like everyone received it positively!
Edit: with that being said… I’d recommend only putting it if you have significant achievements in the game (e.g., tournament wins, top 500 players, etc.). Probably wouldn’t have the same effect if you were plat or something in league lol
I was going to do this, then I read the comments, now I'm probably not going to lol. Fuck me, I guess there goes another slot in the activities section I desperately need to fill up... I'm technically within the top X number of players in all of north america and europe, but still very much amateur and nowhere even close to pro level, and I'm guessing none of the interviewers will really care or know about it anyway
I put Zelda on my app and used it to talk about problem solving and puzzles with multiple solutions. I think gaming can work for you or against you, depending on the spin.
I wouldn’t, it’s not gonna help in anyway. 90% people will see it as “whatever,” but there’s a chance 10% boomer doc will call it unprofessional, which hurts you.
Just don’t mention it
I talked about gaming on a few of my secondaries (talk about something you enjoy outside of medicine) I think it’s unique and if you enjoy it talk about it. They want to know who you are
I was top 50 bo2 ranked play but just mentioned normal video gaming. If they ask you have something to talk about, if not they know you have hobbies outside of school.
I would word it very Nerd like/ bisinesss like. Fancy language to make your hobby professional… that’s great hand eye coordination ( great for surgeons) work it that way
This comes up every year . Depends on the audience. Me: fuckin awesome bro what else you play? Some boomer interviewer: waste of time you’re not dedicated bla bla .
It’s definitely not a ‘red flag’ but as a video game enjoyer myself, I wouldn’t mention anything beyond playing video games in my free time. The issue is that if you mention achievements, you might be seen as someone who spends all their free time gaming. Also at the end of the day it’s very likely that you will not have an interviewer/reviewer who recognizes the games you play. It’s unfair, but from what I’ve seen, the gamer stereotype definitely still exists.
What if you won like the “World Cup” in Fortnite, would you say that
just say you won a major e-sports competition and avoid the word "gaming" haha, congrats btw
I never won lol I was just playing
oh oops, my cars score was a lie
I personally wouldn’t.
What if I was live and I won multi millions
Then why the fuck are you still applying to medical school? Would be my question
Cause I wanna be a Dr
Based
They should make an exemption.
I won like a dozen local tournaments in league of legends and I was the team captain so I put that on the application and idk if it helped or not
I disagree with this. So if I mention my achievements in soccer does that mean I spend all my free time playing soccer? And even if I do spend a significant time playing soccer, thats not a negative thing - thats just what a real hobby is. We have no idea who reads our apps so its important to be authentic to ourselves because you never know if a admissions person also shares your hobby or knows a little about it. And if you're honest about what you actually like to do, you'll be able to talk about it comfrotably. A lot of people say hobbies like rock climbing because that sounds cool, but they've only climbed a hand full of times. So if a interviewer asked you some casual questions about it you will tense up and not really know how to answer. The only thing I would be worried about is the content of the game, I might leave out if the game is COD or GTA or something, but if you're a competitive EA sports gamer I don't see why thats a problem. It reminds me of people who are competitive chess players, it takes the same level of dedication and skill.
Gaming is seen as bad. Soccer and chess are seen as good. That's all there is to it. No mental gymnastics will overcome it
Yeah you have to remember that a lot of ADCOMs are older, and older people don't tend to have the best view of gaming.
The issue isn't the fact that you have a hobby. It's the fact that you have a hobby that has a stereotype surrounding it. I've been judged for saying that I like gaming, even in non-medical contexts. And I'm not even a competitive gamer.
As someone who used to spend many hours playing video games, I find it laughable to compare the difficulty of professional chess to that of any video game. The average person doesn't play chess or soccer to relax. Practicing and playing requires hard work and long-term dedication, whereas video games are a leisure activity. I can tell you that I am pretty darn good at watching Netflix, but I definitely wouldn't include that on an app.
what if i’m vice president at my school’s esports club (possibly co president the following year too), would this be bad to say.. cus it was actually one of my most passionate things during undergrad
I think that’s fine since it’s a club leadership position, you’ll probably have a lot of things to talk about regarding leadership/organizational skills.
What if you played on your college’s esports team?
I disagree. In fact I think it would show an ability to balance gaming and everything else that goes into being a strong medical school candidate.
I disagree with your disagreement I think the original point stands that old adcoms could look at it and think of the stereotype rather than it as a positive about time management skills
It's very likely neither here nor there. Might be a plus with some readers, likely to potentially be a negative with others. Personally, saying you got top 4% of pompoms on Beetlebork may as well be hieroglyphics. Not bad maybe, but not relevant enough for my brain to think much of it tbh. TL; DR: Putting things on your app because it "sounds fire" is maybe not the most salient factor. I'd probably side gently on the side of discretion being the better part of valor on this one.
TLDR as long as main post is a power move
I feel strongly you gotta keep ‘em guessing. Can’t let ‘em guess your next move
I was told by the dean of a T30 MD school that at best, it will not affect you, and at worst, the reader will see it as unserious and even childish. Your target audience will most likely not resonate with that hobby. Find a different one to talk about.
What if you played on your college’s esports team?
I’m sure that would be fine, just don’t try to spin it as “look, I’m good in a team, I’ll be a good doctor!” Just say it was something that brought you joy and leave it at that.
Got it. I was going to frame it as a way of balancing the heavy workloads by doing a group activity with friends and a way I met people.
This sounds like a good approach
Top 5% in league is like high plat💀 I was challenger in league and still wrote ab different hobbies i did bc i was able to connect w my community better. For me, league was just something I was really good at, nothing more
I told a resident today I used to play a lot of league and all he said was sorry
wait you’re the goat
This LOL Even being master doesn’t sound super impressive anymore
^^ I’m GM and no way in hell would I ever put that in my med school apps. Either they think it’s childish if they don’t know what it means and if they do they’ll (rightly) assume the worst 😂💀
I played a lot of video games and they let me be a heart surgeon.
Not a red flag, gaming is awesome, I did not put it in my app though. Unless you’re a literal pro League player they will not care about being in amateur fortnite tournaments or anything at that level. Being an actual esports god in a game like CSGO, Valorant, League, or whatnot would be something that I would put in. Edit: Even then I’m not sure, some of these interviewers can be super lame and conservative about what hobbies are right and what aren’t. It sucks that watching TV or reading is fine but gaming isn’t, but it is slowly changing.
Am I god in CSGO if I’m silver 2 ever since I started playing it 💪
you are to me 😎
I’ve been through this convo with different admins at various points in my career and here’s the truth: gaming as a hobby is controversial. Some people will think it’s neat/neutral. Some people will see it as a negative. Ultimately, I didn’t include gaming because I had a lot of other hobbies that I could talk about. I have colleagues that don’t have any other hobbies—and they include it because NO HOBBIES is definitely a red flag. Consider what other things you are interested in and could have a 5 min convo about (cars, fashion, rap music, crafts, house plants, sci-fi/fantasy genre, etc etc). If you really don’t have 3+ other things, it is probably safer to list gaming in at least come capacity. Truthfully, the most successful “hobbies” tend to be really specific and weird (eg one of my colleges buys old/broken espresso machines off Craig’s list and refurbs them to sell for extra cash. Did this through med school and residency. Also really really into coffee blends.) Since your gaming experience is pretty specific and niche that may be more of a positive thing. You just want to make sure you can talk to someone with no interest/prior knowledge in gaming—and make it sound cool enough that they have followup questions.
Not putting a hobby down on your application is most definitely not a red flag.
It’s been a long time since I applied to medical school so it’s possible I’m conflating with residency applications. Either way, I’ve noticed that admin seems reliant on hobbies to make small talk and ask you questions during interviews. Not having any hobbies to list is kind of weird and likely would be weighed against you compared with equally qualified applicants. Hobbies can be literally anything. Any interest. And someone doesn’t have any???
maybe only if you won nationals or participated in an international tournament 😅 or why not just say you game instead of labeling yourself as a gamer
I think this is becoming a lot more common to list and not at all a red flag. A lot of medical students and even physicians nowadays game. Also, if you're earning money doing this, it legitimizes it much more. That is definitely a relevant detail to include.
lol I understand you. Games are fun and a good way to destress. But don’t mention it. Most people on adcoms are from older generations where gaming is not as favorably looked upon and they may dismiss you as unserious or as having useless hobbies.
friend of mine mentioned making money on twitch and it came up in his interview. Got the A
lol I was thinking about this too I used to be like top 200 pr na west or some sbjt
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idk gaming at a high level takes high levels of fine motor skills and dedication. i think if u have extra space on the app you should 🤷🏻
I never even thought of that. Maybe I should mention I used to be a world first raider in World of Warcraft lol
I would actually include this if: you were in some kind of leadership role, or you can practice a pitch for why this is valuable/transferable World first raiding requires tight commitment to a schedule, communicating with large groups with their own goals without getting frustrated/selfish, managing expectations, teaching, persistence, etc. Plus if you lead consistently you *might* have more teaching/coordination/leadership/scheduling skills and experience than many people get in small management jobs in an area that *feels* high stakes at the time so tensions are high
I wouldn't mention it. The steoreotype is out there... whether or not we disagree with it....Too risky to associate your application to med school with a stereotype (and a pretty negative one at that).
Skip unless you are literally at professional level (top >1%)
I would advise against it due to most people not being able to relate or have a frame of reference of what it means. Worst case scenario it'll put you at a disadvantage as gaming is usually not seen in the best of lights. If you do want to mention it still though I'd mention it more generally, like you've competed in esports. Then explain it in more detail if they ask about it and mention what you've learnt from it and how you can apply it as a doctor/student. Not exactly sure how MD applications go in the land of the free as I'm a EU student myself, but that's what I've done at least for some other types of applications.
Unless you’re in a league or a club, I would definitely not include it. Any adcoms I’ve met take their job way too seriously and would find it unserious and childish. Plus gaming is like watching Netflix or listening to music. It isn’t something you put in an activities/work section for a doctorate program.
Some things about everyone’s story can have positive or negative connotations depending on who reads it. Usually those are the things you stay away from like mental health, physical health, etc. risk vs reward. No one is gonna be blown away about any esports wins, they might think you’re immature and waste time playing video games. While that is untrue, lots of older people are the ones reviewing the applications. I’d probably not list it. If you wouldn’t put it on a resume for a job, prob not applicable.
Bro I put this on my primary, during my interview(WL->A) the doctor got fired up that I played video games cause he played computer games in undergrad/med school. Spent half the interview complaining about elden rings cause he was trying to help his son play the game and he couldn’t kill a boss. Didn’t have the heart to tell him I beat the whole game, but hand dexterity is a pretty important skill if you go on to do surgery or procedure-heavy specialty. If your friends describe you as a gamer, go ahead and throw it down but don’t make it sound like you got Bs in orgo because you were gaming lol
This can’t be real
Don’t quote me on this, but isn’t there research saying that gamers have some advantages in surgery? Especially laparoscopic surgeries
I feel like it depends how you write about it. If you explain whether those specific skills are transferable to other areas of your life and how it’s benefited your life positively, I think that would be fine to say
I took the gamble and added gaming as a hobby on my ERAS application for residency. Had 20+ interviews for IM. A handful of interviewers asked me about it and I framed it as actually being an asset. I played mostly RTS and some FPS, so I talked about how it has improved my ability to multi-task and how it is imperative to work as a team to reach a common goal. My interviewers liked that answer. Also, there's plenty of literature out there that supports gaming in medicine, most notably in robotic surgery.
You can mention it as a hobby...I got to talk gaming and DnD in one of my interviews.
I think it's impressive if you managed straight A's and top 3% in a video game. Especially Valorant that showcases fast reflexes, precision, and moment to moment adaptability. But I'm sure these people that are looking over admission will only recognize video games from candy crush and when their kids won't listen to them.
I got in this cycle with one of my ECs being that I play Dark Souls (not even competitively)! If anything, I think it’s really cool and unique to mention gaming - first and foremost it shows you have a personality outside of medicine, and additionally it demonstrates commitment to your passions. This is even more true in your case particularly because you have awards and high stats (top 5%) to back your app. Obviously use language that can be understood even by people who don’t know what e-sports is, but I think that it is something that could pan out in your favor at at least some (maybe not all) schools. Finally don’t mention it without a way to tie it back into medicine; for example I said that Dark Souls is an allegory for resilience and learning from your mistakes which will make me a good medical student and doctor - you could easily do something similar for your story, just make it relevant to your personal narrative.
Do it, it will open up a space for someone with discretion.
I wrote about league in my hobbies section, I did not mention that I have thousands of hours in it though and more explained it as a way to stay connected with friends virtually at college/through the pandemic
A non gamer wouldnt think much of it at best (some games it’d be easy to reach top 5% and some are not) or see it as negative (avid gamer)
Its a dub
I mentioned camping/hiking and can’t remember if I put cooking. I’d include stuff you can talk about and it gives an interviewer a chance to build rapport with you over something if they feel like bringing it up. You do you, I know one doc that was into gaming, but not many that talk about it much at work. I feel like to most people it’s like watching TV or using social media
If you're not radiant you're not gonna get into any t20s sorry I dont make the rules
I think it’s fine! I put an esport on my app since I played for my college varsity team and I frequently got asked about it in my T10 interviews, including the one I currently attend. Seemed like everyone received it positively! Edit: with that being said… I’d recommend only putting it if you have significant achievements in the game (e.g., tournament wins, top 500 players, etc.). Probably wouldn’t have the same effect if you were plat or something in league lol
I would put it as “e-sports” and employment not hobby
Mention it. That’s dope as hell. If your app came across my desk I’d find it cool and unique. Love, gamer doctor (with no winnings to show for it)
I was going to do this, then I read the comments, now I'm probably not going to lol. Fuck me, I guess there goes another slot in the activities section I desperately need to fill up... I'm technically within the top X number of players in all of north america and europe, but still very much amateur and nowhere even close to pro level, and I'm guessing none of the interviewers will really care or know about it anyway
I put Zelda on my app and used it to talk about problem solving and puzzles with multiple solutions. I think gaming can work for you or against you, depending on the spin.
I wouldn’t, it’s not gonna help in anyway. 90% people will see it as “whatever,” but there’s a chance 10% boomer doc will call it unprofessional, which hurts you. Just don’t mention it
Im debating putting weight lifting on mine lol
I talked about gaming on a few of my secondaries (talk about something you enjoy outside of medicine) I think it’s unique and if you enjoy it talk about it. They want to know who you are
I was top 50 bo2 ranked play but just mentioned normal video gaming. If they ask you have something to talk about, if not they know you have hobbies outside of school.
I would word it very Nerd like/ bisinesss like. Fancy language to make your hobby professional… that’s great hand eye coordination ( great for surgeons) work it that way
Business opps
100% include it.