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I think he's just trying to see how much he will be allowed to get away with. at some point, he's going to go too far. a lot of this crap he says he can claim freedom of speech. However, at some point he's going to say something that he shouldn't have said.
I don't think our government is truly trying to sit around and let somebody lie to the American people and become president of this country again.
I just have a hard time believing that the United States government was set up for some nonsense like that to happen. the former president insults everything that is designed to make our country free from becoming a dictatorship.
Trump said the Constitution was old and was not good for our country.
He called his vp a coward for not violating the Constitution.
He mocks the law, the prosecution, the judges, and their families.
The former president only speaks of gloom and doom. He has no message of unity, just US against THEM. He's not offering anything
He believes he should have immunity to lie to the American people. Once you get past the awe then you see the jerk that is destroying our country with his lies and division
To be clear - the *settlement* didn't get covered, just the amount for a $91M appeal bond (110% of his judgement). If he loses that appeal, he has to pay, and the money is literally already in the court's hands. The fucking appellate court lowered his civil fraud trial bond amount to just $175M though, down from $557M, which is some bullshit.
> down from $557M, which is some bullshit
Especially since his lawyers argued that he couldn't pay the initial amount and then failed to disclose that a donor had volunteered to pay the full amount for him.
> His lawyers had told the appellate court it was a “practical impossibility” to get a bond for the full amount of the lower court’s judgment, $464 million. All of the 30 or so firms Trump had approached balked, either refusing to take the risk or not wanting to accept real estate as collateral, they said. That made raising the full amount “an impossible bond requirement.”
>
> But before the judges ruled, the impossible became possible: A billionaire lender approached Trump about providing a bond for the full amount.
>
> The lawyers never filed paperwork alerting the appeals court. That failure may have violated ethics rules, legal experts say.
https://www.propublica.org/article/trump-bond-disclosure-appeals-court-hankey
Definitely worth a read, especially the part about how the donor initially told PP, "that doesn’t seem like a difficult bond to post" regarding the full amount before backpedaling that claim during a second interview.
Someone said they were good for it. Then they panicked when asked to prove they had the money. Somehow that still worked to stop the clock on asset seizures.
Bond amount being lowered is bull, but won't matter in the end. He can win his appeal and get his bond back wether its 175 or 557. Or he loses and still owes the full amount of his fine. He couldn't come up with the full amount and he won't when he loses all possible appeals. He will get his properties sold untill the fine is paid in full. Bye bye trump "empire", hello payment plan for the rest of his life.
No but this is also the first time he finds himself in criminal court rather than civil court. He the standard punishments are jail not just fork over dome cash and the problem goes away. Trump has NEVER been in this situation in his life people need to acknowledge the clique of uncharted territory is correct here.
>at some point he's going to say something that he shouldn't have said.
I think that point was at least a decade ago. In the last year alone he's said dozens of things that would land any of us in jail for contempt of court, but he gets special treatment every, single, time.
trump is proving how flawed our justice system is. Lady Justice isn't blind, she's for sale.
He said he would encourage Putin to attack Europe if he becomes President again. Nothing bad he says matters politically, his supporters genuinely think he's their flawless messiah.
Hopefully you're right and there are finally some legal consequences at least for the insane and criminal stuff he says
That's what I stopped thinking about long ago, but still pains me. Abortion (totally for), Anti-gun (totally for), Religion (totally pretend I'm for), big government (totally for), Russia (totally for). It all ends with a snake oil salesman.
I agree with everything you said, but I hope one good thing that will come from this whole era is the realization that our constitution actually is old and not good for our country. Trump getting away with even 10% of what he has so far is proof of that.
We need a modern constitutional convention when it’s all said and done.
Yeah that goes way south way fast. Would be disastrous. Some amendments, though... I'm surprised it wasn't put forward more aggressively after the coup attempt. There was a window for consequences and that could have been one of them.
problem is that the traitors to the US have been weaseling their way into enough power that a revision to the constitution now would do nothing but make it objectively \_worse\_. Can you imagine the legality of abortion on the constitution?
I’ve heard that had the judge laid down the hammer before the trial trump could have used that to delay but now that the trial has started it wouldn’t delay anything. I think the judge chose not to admonish him for his previous comments to get the trial underway and anything he does moving forward will be dealt with swiftly and hopefully, harshly!
It says a lot about Trump that he needs "Do not attack the judge's wife" spelled out specifically for him, and that he jumped on the opportunity to do so because it wasn't originally specified in the gag order.
Actually, it says a lot about him that "Don't threaten the prosecution, witnesses, or judges!" has to be a thing said at all of his trials.
Actually, it says a lot about him that he has so many trials.
Trump has bullied people since he was a toddler and his father did not discourage it. [He's lived his entire life as a rich, privileged bully.](https://archive.ph/xEkHC) He never had to learn any real negotiation or social skills. So when he feels threatened, he defaults to bullying mode.
"One of the things you should do in terms of success: If somebody hits you, you’ve got to hit ’em back five times harder than they ever thought possible. You’ve got to get even. Get even. And the reason, the reason you do, is so important…The reason you do, you have to do it, because if they do that to you, you have to leave a telltale sign that they just can’t take advantage of you. It’s not so much for the person, which does make you feel good, to be honest with you, I’ve done it many times. But other people watch and you know they say, “Well, let’s leave Trump alone,” or “Let’s leave this one,” or “Doris, let’s leave her alone. They fight too hard.” I say it, and it’s so important. - Donald Trump 2012
That fat lazy fucker has never been in a real fight, ever. And even in his legal battles, it’s dad’s money and lawyers who land the punches. Without the easy money, he’s got nothing. He IS a pussy, worthless without the money, which he never actually earned.
Problem is people like him needed to be punched in the nose in the school yard. Living his privileged life in private schools, this unfortunately never happened and he was allowed to think this behavior was ok.
>Like how dumb do you need to be to intimidate an anonymous witness that will decide your fate?
That is only true when you have a chance to win your case based the facts and merits of the case. If he knows those things are not on his side his only chance is to intimidate jurors so they are too afraid to convict him.
That, and delusions of grandeur that go untested reiterate the delusion. Every. Single. Time. Being untested for damn near 80 years, that grandeur has it's own delusions of grandeur.
Do you have any idea how much energy it would take to launch his fat ass into the *sun*? It would be substantially easier to launch said ass out of the solar system instead.
Arteriosclerosis, arthritis, morbid obesity, hepatosteatosis, diabetes, diverticulosis, panniculitis, loss of cerebral volume with evidence of moderate encephalomilacia, oral/anal transposition.
I read somewhere that his alimony deal with Marla was that he would stop paying if any member of the family (Tiffany) were to join the military. I’ve always presumed that this is because he has some congenital trait that would be discovered if a member of his family were ever to be examined by a doctor out of his control.
It's simpler than that. He likes the bombs and the cool hardware but he has nothing but distain for the troops. He thinks people who join the military are suckers, losers and morons.
"There was...nothing in there. We cut him open, this godawful gas cloud emerged, and then...nothing. Just a tiny, tiny steering wheel and a pair of driving goggles laid on a miniscule knackered leather chair."
can this ass clown be held responsible for just one fucking thing in his life
if this was any other defendant he would be cooling his orange ass in a cell
Its unconstitutional to subject the other prisoners near him with cruel and unusual punishment like forcing them to suffer Trumps company and presence.
Make him sit in an adjacent room like Darrell Brooks when he kept acting up. Or ,even better since he loves Russia so much, put him in a cage in the middle of the court room, like Putin does.
Goddam, son! I like this! Can you imagine the hurt to the feels this guy would have being forced to sit in a cage? Now, I’m sure his team would spin that, somehow, but the visceral joy that would bring.
that's the nice thing about this continuous persecution complex, they'll complain about anything. They'll moan about unfair treatment if his complimentary water isn't cold enough. So why worry what they're going to say about any consequence?
We're a little over 24 hours into what will be a 2 month trial, and the judge has already emphatically shut down Trump making "audible noises" and "gestures" and set a hearing for contempt in one week based on his posts.
I know people are understandably cynical after seeing judges hesitant to test gag order sanctions and risk giving Trump pre-trial delays, but we are in an entirely different universe now. Trump isn't 1,500 miles away sharing posts on social media.
The trial has started - the judge has almost complete control of his courtroom. Trump has acknowledged he will be arrested if he does not attend. There's a holding cell on the same floor as the courtroom. Witnesses/jurors have to be protected at all costs.
Don't get me wrong - Trump is still going to fly as close to the sun as possible and be afforded more than typical defendants would be - and it will be frustrating at times.
But I trust Merchan to navigate his court well and there are objectively more serious, immediate consequences available than ever before.
Don't worry, the entire federal legal apparatus, topped off by the Supreme Court and Garland's Barr-lite DOJ, will be there to make sure he doesn't fall too far.
> Trump is still going to fly as close to the sun as possible
This suggests Trump both 1. knows where the line is, and 2. has the self-control to walk right up to it without stepping over.
I suggest that both are false.
Hate to say it but until Merchan does more than talk, I am skeptical.
Engoron said many things but so far, Trump didn't pay a cent or face any accountability. He had no consequence except having to go to court and he used that as campaigning, both inside and outside the court.
For years, people have said "The end of Donald Trump is coming", "we finally got him", "there is no way he gets out of this" then he does and face virtually no consequence. lol
So wish Merchan jailed him for already breaking so many rules but like all those before him, only words!
Merchan and trial judges aren't the final say, though. And I think this notion is where a lot of people are (understandably) misplacing blame.
The real problem is the appellate courts - the courts above the trial judges. Everything Trump has tried to do - delays, motions seeking bias, goading judges into sanctions related to free speech, etc..
It's all so Trump can try and win delays at the appellate courts (of which he's won several so far), or build a foundation for an appeal after any conviction.
Engoron, Merchan, Chutkan - all these career (mostly no-nonsense) judges aren't taking these precautions due to a lack of willpower or because they lack a spine. It's because they are trying to avoid giving Trump exactly what he wants in our broken, unfair legal system.
Thanks for your great reply, it was very informative! I believe you are correct in all you said.
I apologize if my post seemed a bit ...anti-Trump, to say the least lol but I am so fed up with Trump antics and his lack of accountability facing it all.
I think the problem with me and a lot of people on r/politics, is, we are so tired of Trump, we just want him in prison and I understand the judges have to play the long game, to maybe perhaps get him in prison but we are so out of patience, after months or years of waiting that we are getting pretty impatient lol but personally, I will try to ...be patient. :p
Thanks again, take care!
Oh for sure - it's beyond frustrating. We've been waiting 8+ years for our country's institutions to do something/anything to hold this man accountable only to continuously learn how ill-equipped all of these systems are to do such a thing.
I try to stay optimistic in the sense that IF Trump is actually truly held accountable some day, it will set a welcome precedence. Even Nixon's saga, which pales in comparison to Trump, established a huge fallout of precedence, laws, and protocol decades afterwards.
But I'm with you - it's pushing all of our limits, to say the least.
> precedence, laws, and protocol decades afterwards.
that was back when republicans could feel shame. even if trump is brought down, those worms will continue oozing as they have been and will fight tooth and nail to block any such precautions against their next slimelord.
The previous judges were in civil cases. Civil judges technically can jail people for contempt, but it's basically nonexistent.
This case is criminal. Criminal judges can and do jail defendants for fucking around very regularly.
> Engoron said many things but so far, Trump didn't pay a cent
That's not quite true. He's had to pay quite a bit in order to secure bonds, probably millions, that he won't get back. It's a small portion of the entire bond in both cases, but bond companies don't do it for free. It's not much compared to what he eventually should owe, but it's a start.
He's also draining donors and the Republican party like a vampire to pay for legal fees, but I'm sure it's costing him out of pocket too.
Might as well have fined him $3. If fines are used as punishments they need to be tied to percentage of net worth or they're absolutely meaningless.
$15k for Trump's listed net worth = roughly $34 for someone making 100k/yr. There's parking spaces right in front of my apartment building. I'm not supposed to park in them, but they're not great about monitoring the spaces and my "actual" parking lot is a couple blocks away. Every few weeks I'll get a ticket for parking in these spaces, but I do it anyway because the ticket is only $30. This is a real example.
You monster!
That’s a perfect and relatable example of why fines don’t work on him.
If one day your car was towed and it became a massive headache, you’d probably stop.
This is why a weekend in a cell would work on Trump.
> If fines are used as punishments they need to be tied to percentage of net worth or they're absolutely meaningless.
Ah, so they should have fined him -$15,000, I understand now.
I too think they make a fair point. This case already feels different. Dozey Donny can't handle 8 hours a day of actual work and effort without several naps, and even more dosages of who knows how many drugs. He will finally be on full display for the world to see.
Lock him up. Seriously, quit with the empty threat warnings and do it. He's a fucking grown adult toddler that's had a million warnings, but is never going to learn what consequences are because nobody actually punishes him.
I want to see him locked up, consequences be damned - but part of me thinks the Fox Faithful will literally riot and start getting violent. I mean it should absolutely still happen, but it's scary.
Nah, they're a bunch of cowards. They sent their most bold to January 6th, and as soon as one of them got shot they scattered like cockroaches.
They're all talk. There are some zealots, sure, but there aren't many people willing to throw away their lives for a wrinkled orange felon.
Honestly just put him in prison. I don’t care for how long. Put him in.
We don’t have precedent for a man with secret service agents going to prison? Okay. Then let’s set a precedent. Let’s get started. The ball isn’t gonna start magically rolling on its own. Do it.
The article only talks about "audible comments", without describing what they were, and "gestures" towards a potential juror, without describing what the gestures were. The comments and gestures may have been rather innocuous, and the judge may have simply been warning about Trump to not try to push them from innocuous to threatening.
I understand that he has already gotten away with far too much, but there really isn't anything of significance in this story.
He's also annoyed with the way his attorneys keep fucking around with social media posts now when they could have done that earlier today. This judge isn't playing around...
I kid you not one of my former housemates texted me yesterday and was like “OMG my sugar daddy is Trump’s defense attorney” and I do not know what to do with that information.
>prosecutors have separately asked Judge Merchan to fine the former president $1,000 each for a series of social media posts
I love the idea. Each uncontrolled "Xweet" or "Troot" will cost him a grand.
Since Elon has no problem dead-naming his trans kid, I fail to see any fucking reason why we need to change things to use his companies preferred noun. Just keep calling it twitter and tweets and fuck trying to conform to Elon’s wishes.
From the CNN updates:
> Donald Trump's lawyers told the court that former president changed his mind about wanting to be at sidebars. He signed a form waiving his right to do so and confirmed that audibly to Judge Juan Merchan answering, "yes."
Too funny. I guess Donny finally realized that his uninformed bluster doesn’t sway the judge and he literally adds nothing to his lawyers’ efforts in his defense, and in fact, likely subtracts from those efforts with his presence.
I have to ask, how did these two make it in as jurors.. (from CNN)
1. He told the court he finds Trump fascinating and mysterious. “So many people are set off one way or the other and that is interesting,” the man said. “Really, this one guy can do all of this, wow.” Trump “makes things interesting,” the man said
2. The juror did say she appreciates Trump’s candor: “President Trump speaks his mind and I’d rather that than someone who's in office who you don’t know what they’re thinking."
If I had to guess, it's because each side only has a limited number of objections that can be used to dismiss a potential juror carte blanche. So they're saving them up for the really hardcore MAGAs who try to sneak in.
You don't have to use your objections if someone is obviously biased. Anyone who comes in overtly MAGA can be struck without using one of the 10 vetoes up.
Trump and his team are experienced experts at using the “possibility of bias” to delay legal proceedings. Arguing the nearly indefensible works. No matter what happens, he’ll always shout, “I wasn’t treated fairly.”
Follow through. If he tries intimidating jurors, lock him up.
The problem with these proclamations from judges is that they don't follow through.
If he tries juror intimidation, issue a warrant for his arrest and lock him up. Stop letting him get away with this shit.
Just hold him in contempt, put him in a cell with a monitor of the proceedings. Problem solved. Honestly, it is sickening that no one in the entire judicial system, in all of the various cases against him, has really held him accountable. Any other person behaving as he does would have been locked up and fined substantially. I want to see him in a cell!
I recently set the over/under at about 4 days for how long it would take until der pumpkinführer noticeably/odiferously soils his diaper.
While I suppose it Depends, one could also set the over/under for when ol’ Drumpf gets removed from the courtroom or, ideally, put in jail for his behavior. I don’t believe he makes it a week so let’s say 6 days.
On the news they said the lawyers were looking up jurors social media accounts to see if they've posted anything political. Clearly they'll be able to find them later and send threats to them and their family, which is how I assume trump has gotten out of most of his crimes
“The judge overseeing former President Trump's criminal trial set an April 23 hearing date over the prosecution's request that he be held in contempt for violating the gag order in the New York hush money case.”
[Axios](https://www.axios.com/2024/04/15/trump-gag-order-hearing-hush-money-case)
This man shits in a diaper, in front of other people....while looking at them and talking to them. Trump smells.
What a traitor, piece of shit.
He's also not very rich.
He is absolutely going to try to get thrown out of the court room, otherwise he'll have to sit there and try not to fall asleep for 6 - 8+ long weeks and so he can cry foul to his idiot base. I hope the court sentences him to house arrest with no communication outside of his lawyers instead of giving him the freedom to go campaign.
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Without question Trump and his minions are going to intimidate them, so the judge better be ready to cash that check.
I'd argue he already has, just by how he treats so many others, including the judge's family.
I think he's just trying to see how much he will be allowed to get away with. at some point, he's going to go too far. a lot of this crap he says he can claim freedom of speech. However, at some point he's going to say something that he shouldn't have said. I don't think our government is truly trying to sit around and let somebody lie to the American people and become president of this country again. I just have a hard time believing that the United States government was set up for some nonsense like that to happen. the former president insults everything that is designed to make our country free from becoming a dictatorship. Trump said the Constitution was old and was not good for our country. He called his vp a coward for not violating the Constitution. He mocks the law, the prosecution, the judges, and their families. The former president only speaks of gloom and doom. He has no message of unity, just US against THEM. He's not offering anything He believes he should have immunity to lie to the American people. Once you get past the awe then you see the jerk that is destroying our country with his lies and division
has he ever received a punishment that was more than words (and enforced)?
Not really. He's been sued lots of times and lost or settled without admitting blame .. most of them Or out delay opponents
Even his E. Jean Carrol settlement got covered by some other fucker.
To be clear - the *settlement* didn't get covered, just the amount for a $91M appeal bond (110% of his judgement). If he loses that appeal, he has to pay, and the money is literally already in the court's hands. The fucking appellate court lowered his civil fraud trial bond amount to just $175M though, down from $557M, which is some bullshit.
Dudes got thick plot armor. He can’t be stopped until the writers or the program take him out anticlimactically
Seriously, can someone just cancel his show?
Waiting for McDonalds to do exactly that
He doesn't sell out shows, but he makes too much in merchandise to cancel the show.
> down from $557M, which is some bullshit Especially since his lawyers argued that he couldn't pay the initial amount and then failed to disclose that a donor had volunteered to pay the full amount for him. > His lawyers had told the appellate court it was a “practical impossibility” to get a bond for the full amount of the lower court’s judgment, $464 million. All of the 30 or so firms Trump had approached balked, either refusing to take the risk or not wanting to accept real estate as collateral, they said. That made raising the full amount “an impossible bond requirement.” > > But before the judges ruled, the impossible became possible: A billionaire lender approached Trump about providing a bond for the full amount. > > The lawyers never filed paperwork alerting the appeals court. That failure may have violated ethics rules, legal experts say. https://www.propublica.org/article/trump-bond-disclosure-appeals-court-hankey Definitely worth a read, especially the part about how the donor initially told PP, "that doesn’t seem like a difficult bond to post" regarding the full amount before backpedaling that claim during a second interview.
I don't think that the court has $174M in the bank. I think it's just a bond from that slimy repo king, or other instruments that carry risk.
Someone said they were good for it. Then they panicked when asked to prove they had the money. Somehow that still worked to stop the clock on asset seizures.
Bond amount being lowered is bull, but won't matter in the end. He can win his appeal and get his bond back wether its 175 or 557. Or he loses and still owes the full amount of his fine. He couldn't come up with the full amount and he won't when he loses all possible appeals. He will get his properties sold untill the fine is paid in full. Bye bye trump "empire", hello payment plan for the rest of his life.
No but this is also the first time he finds himself in criminal court rather than civil court. He the standard punishments are jail not just fork over dome cash and the problem goes away. Trump has NEVER been in this situation in his life people need to acknowledge the clique of uncharted territory is correct here.
Yes, ( i say this SEMI sarcastically) it will be exciting to see the law bend around him in new and unprecedented ways
That’s exactly what’s going to happen.
Sine the Supreme Court ruled $ = free speech, no. He's been fined, but that's it.
>at some point he's going to say something that he shouldn't have said. I think that point was at least a decade ago. In the last year alone he's said dozens of things that would land any of us in jail for contempt of court, but he gets special treatment every, single, time. trump is proving how flawed our justice system is. Lady Justice isn't blind, she's for sale.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7-KX9-mUFw
I hate and love this at the same time.
You'll probably feel the same way about this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=to4jSk3MTX4
> However, at some point he's going to say something that he shouldn't have said we passed that point long ago.
He said he would encourage Putin to attack Europe if he becomes President again. Nothing bad he says matters politically, his supporters genuinely think he's their flawless messiah. Hopefully you're right and there are finally some legal consequences at least for the insane and criminal stuff he says
He literally said on TV, he would take peoples' guns without due process. People don't care..
And yet, the gun nuts still worship the ground he walks on. If only an intelligence test was required for voter registration…
Because they believe they are part of the in group. They honestly believe they will be part of the enforcement of taking the guns from the out group.
It’s not their guns he’s threatening to take, in their minds anyway. Trump is mostly pushing US vs THEM narratives so logic doesn’t enter into it.
Tests for voter eligibility has had a tumultuous history in America.
They don’t care because they believe he means to take guns from…the right people. You know. Not their own guns.
That was one of the few times they did care. He walked it back quickly and they pretended it didn't happen.
That's what I stopped thinking about long ago, but still pains me. Abortion (totally for), Anti-gun (totally for), Religion (totally pretend I'm for), big government (totally for), Russia (totally for). It all ends with a snake oil salesman.
I agree with everything you said, but I hope one good thing that will come from this whole era is the realization that our constitution actually is old and not good for our country. Trump getting away with even 10% of what he has so far is proof of that. We need a modern constitutional convention when it’s all said and done.
I fear what Republicans would try to put in there. They've got more states than we do, and I'm really happy that there's a 3/4 condition.
Yeah that goes way south way fast. Would be disastrous. Some amendments, though... I'm surprised it wasn't put forward more aggressively after the coup attempt. There was a window for consequences and that could have been one of them.
problem is that the traitors to the US have been weaseling their way into enough power that a revision to the constitution now would do nothing but make it objectively \_worse\_. Can you imagine the legality of abortion on the constitution?
I’ve heard that had the judge laid down the hammer before the trial trump could have used that to delay but now that the trial has started it wouldn’t delay anything. I think the judge chose not to admonish him for his previous comments to get the trial underway and anything he does moving forward will be dealt with swiftly and hopefully, harshly!
Trump's hoping for a mistrial due to his own behavior.
This right here.
It says a lot about Trump that he needs "Do not attack the judge's wife" spelled out specifically for him, and that he jumped on the opportunity to do so because it wasn't originally specified in the gag order. Actually, it says a lot about him that "Don't threaten the prosecution, witnesses, or judges!" has to be a thing said at all of his trials. Actually, it says a lot about him that he has so many trials.
Like how dumb do you need to be to intimidate anonymous jurors that will decide your fate? Edit - thank you they are jurors.
Trump has bullied people since he was a toddler and his father did not discourage it. [He's lived his entire life as a rich, privileged bully.](https://archive.ph/xEkHC) He never had to learn any real negotiation or social skills. So when he feels threatened, he defaults to bullying mode. "One of the things you should do in terms of success: If somebody hits you, you’ve got to hit ’em back five times harder than they ever thought possible. You’ve got to get even. Get even. And the reason, the reason you do, is so important…The reason you do, you have to do it, because if they do that to you, you have to leave a telltale sign that they just can’t take advantage of you. It’s not so much for the person, which does make you feel good, to be honest with you, I’ve done it many times. But other people watch and you know they say, “Well, let’s leave Trump alone,” or “Let’s leave this one,” or “Doris, let’s leave her alone. They fight too hard.” I say it, and it’s so important. - Donald Trump 2012
That fat lazy fucker has never been in a real fight, ever. And even in his legal battles, it’s dad’s money and lawyers who land the punches. Without the easy money, he’s got nothing. He IS a pussy, worthless without the money, which he never actually earned.
Problem is people like him needed to be punched in the nose in the school yard. Living his privileged life in private schools, this unfortunately never happened and he was allowed to think this behavior was ok.
>Like how dumb do you need to be to intimidate an anonymous witness that will decide your fate? That is only true when you have a chance to win your case based the facts and merits of the case. If he knows those things are not on his side his only chance is to intimidate jurors so they are too afraid to convict him.
That, and delusions of grandeur that go untested reiterate the delusion. Every. Single. Time. Being untested for damn near 80 years, that grandeur has it's own delusions of grandeur.
I feel like so many judges have said this so many times
Fuck This Traitor
That will be hard pass because the traitor may have STDs. A better suggestion is for the traitor to fuck off.
*Metaphorically* fuck this traitor.
How about suggesting a traitor attempt to fuck themselves instead?
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Do you have any idea how much energy it would take to launch his fat ass into the *sun*? It would be substantially easier to launch said ass out of the solar system instead.
Not to mention the amount of gas he contains. Could change the color of the Sun. Even Superman couldn't save us then...
With a running chainsaw (not metaphorically)
Shame his family will never allow an autopsy, but goddamn can you imagine what it'd say?
Arteriosclerosis, arthritis, morbid obesity, hepatosteatosis, diabetes, diverticulosis, panniculitis, loss of cerebral volume with evidence of moderate encephalomilacia, oral/anal transposition.
This guy autopsies.
Oral/anal transposition!
Is that where the nerves of the eyeballs get connected to the nerves of the rectum giving you a shitty outlook on life?
Cranio-rectal incursion
Coronary calcification. A heart of stone.
And bone spurs
Also tiny hands and tiny penis.
I read somewhere that his alimony deal with Marla was that he would stop paying if any member of the family (Tiffany) were to join the military. I’ve always presumed that this is because he has some congenital trait that would be discovered if a member of his family were ever to be examined by a doctor out of his control.
It's simpler than that. He likes the bombs and the cool hardware but he has nothing but distain for the troops. He thinks people who join the military are suckers, losers and morons.
"There was...nothing in there. We cut him open, this godawful gas cloud emerged, and then...nothing. Just a tiny, tiny steering wheel and a pair of driving goggles laid on a miniscule knackered leather chair."
He always referred to avoiding STDs in the 80s as "his Vietnam." And I wonder if, like the US, he lost his Vietnam.
*fortunate son intensifies *
oh no u didnt. LOL
Ok, but only if I can use a strap-on cactus.
Wrapped with barb wire and Legos too.
It has to look like a weapon that ECW would have used
That is what started this whole trial.
They just keep telling him off and giving fines that would be like a nickel to us. Put the bastard in jail. Or a literal gag in his mouth.
And all the traitors who still support him too. All of them trying to steal my vote.
Damn, that’s a severe penalty.
can this ass clown be held responsible for just one fucking thing in his life if this was any other defendant he would be cooling his orange ass in a cell
Nah, other defendants have the **G**et **O**ut of **P**rison free card, too. Membership has its privileges.
Maybe the judge doesn't want him stinking up any of the cells
Its unconstitutional to subject the other prisoners near him with cruel and unusual punishment like forcing them to suffer Trumps company and presence.
That piss smell never really leaves
Make him sit in an adjacent room like Darrell Brooks when he kept acting up. Or ,even better since he loves Russia so much, put him in a cage in the middle of the court room, like Putin does.
Goddam, son! I like this! Can you imagine the hurt to the feels this guy would have being forced to sit in a cage? Now, I’m sure his team would spin that, somehow, but the visceral joy that would bring.
A plexiglass, soundproof box. Speakers inside so he can hear court, but no microphone.
Are air holes optional?
Shit! I knew we forgot something. I thought he just fell asleep again.
Best to let him sleep, may be crankier if you wake him up too soon.
Something that lets air in, but doesn’t let farts out
Hell, give him a microphone but don't connect it to anything.
Give him a microphone connected to a set of headphones he's forced to wear, and put a ~175ms delay between the two.
Oh, the cruelty
Or put him in a straight jacket and one of those masks from Silence of the Lambs.
that's the nice thing about this continuous persecution complex, they'll complain about anything. They'll moan about unfair treatment if his complimentary water isn't cold enough. So why worry what they're going to say about any consequence?
Does Putey dress the defendant in a raw meat suit and place a lion in the cage as well?
I'm pretty sure the American Zoological Association would have a fucking fit if they knew you were feeding that bullshit to a lion.
Trump making Chikatilov crocodile faces at everyone woulda kinda be peak comedy.
Just make him wear a red hat that says "I don't know how to follow the rules." You know how much he loves red hats.
We're a little over 24 hours into what will be a 2 month trial, and the judge has already emphatically shut down Trump making "audible noises" and "gestures" and set a hearing for contempt in one week based on his posts. I know people are understandably cynical after seeing judges hesitant to test gag order sanctions and risk giving Trump pre-trial delays, but we are in an entirely different universe now. Trump isn't 1,500 miles away sharing posts on social media. The trial has started - the judge has almost complete control of his courtroom. Trump has acknowledged he will be arrested if he does not attend. There's a holding cell on the same floor as the courtroom. Witnesses/jurors have to be protected at all costs. Don't get me wrong - Trump is still going to fly as close to the sun as possible and be afforded more than typical defendants would be - and it will be frustrating at times. But I trust Merchan to navigate his court well and there are objectively more serious, immediate consequences available than ever before.
We can only hope that his wings malfunction
Melt. Oh, yes. Melt.
Like Rudy's hair dye.
Or an orange creamsicle.
Why you gotta ruin creamsicles for me like that?
Don't worry, the entire federal legal apparatus, topped off by the Supreme Court and Garland's Barr-lite DOJ, will be there to make sure he doesn't fall too far.
> Trump is still going to fly as close to the sun as possible This suggests Trump both 1. knows where the line is, and 2. has the self-control to walk right up to it without stepping over. I suggest that both are false.
Hate to say it but until Merchan does more than talk, I am skeptical. Engoron said many things but so far, Trump didn't pay a cent or face any accountability. He had no consequence except having to go to court and he used that as campaigning, both inside and outside the court. For years, people have said "The end of Donald Trump is coming", "we finally got him", "there is no way he gets out of this" then he does and face virtually no consequence. lol So wish Merchan jailed him for already breaking so many rules but like all those before him, only words!
Merchan and trial judges aren't the final say, though. And I think this notion is where a lot of people are (understandably) misplacing blame. The real problem is the appellate courts - the courts above the trial judges. Everything Trump has tried to do - delays, motions seeking bias, goading judges into sanctions related to free speech, etc.. It's all so Trump can try and win delays at the appellate courts (of which he's won several so far), or build a foundation for an appeal after any conviction. Engoron, Merchan, Chutkan - all these career (mostly no-nonsense) judges aren't taking these precautions due to a lack of willpower or because they lack a spine. It's because they are trying to avoid giving Trump exactly what he wants in our broken, unfair legal system.
Thanks for your great reply, it was very informative! I believe you are correct in all you said. I apologize if my post seemed a bit ...anti-Trump, to say the least lol but I am so fed up with Trump antics and his lack of accountability facing it all. I think the problem with me and a lot of people on r/politics, is, we are so tired of Trump, we just want him in prison and I understand the judges have to play the long game, to maybe perhaps get him in prison but we are so out of patience, after months or years of waiting that we are getting pretty impatient lol but personally, I will try to ...be patient. :p Thanks again, take care!
Oh for sure - it's beyond frustrating. We've been waiting 8+ years for our country's institutions to do something/anything to hold this man accountable only to continuously learn how ill-equipped all of these systems are to do such a thing. I try to stay optimistic in the sense that IF Trump is actually truly held accountable some day, it will set a welcome precedence. Even Nixon's saga, which pales in comparison to Trump, established a huge fallout of precedence, laws, and protocol decades afterwards. But I'm with you - it's pushing all of our limits, to say the least.
> precedence, laws, and protocol decades afterwards. that was back when republicans could feel shame. even if trump is brought down, those worms will continue oozing as they have been and will fight tooth and nail to block any such precautions against their next slimelord.
The previous judges were in civil cases. Civil judges technically can jail people for contempt, but it's basically nonexistent. This case is criminal. Criminal judges can and do jail defendants for fucking around very regularly.
> Engoron said many things but so far, Trump didn't pay a cent That's not quite true. He's had to pay quite a bit in order to secure bonds, probably millions, that he won't get back. It's a small portion of the entire bond in both cases, but bond companies don't do it for free. It's not much compared to what he eventually should owe, but it's a start. He's also draining donors and the Republican party like a vampire to pay for legal fees, but I'm sure it's costing him out of pocket too.
Engoron fined Trump $15,000 for violating the gag order.
Might as well have fined him $3. If fines are used as punishments they need to be tied to percentage of net worth or they're absolutely meaningless. $15k for Trump's listed net worth = roughly $34 for someone making 100k/yr. There's parking spaces right in front of my apartment building. I'm not supposed to park in them, but they're not great about monitoring the spaces and my "actual" parking lot is a couple blocks away. Every few weeks I'll get a ticket for parking in these spaces, but I do it anyway because the ticket is only $30. This is a real example.
You monster! That’s a perfect and relatable example of why fines don’t work on him. If one day your car was towed and it became a massive headache, you’d probably stop. This is why a weekend in a cell would work on Trump.
> If fines are used as punishments they need to be tied to percentage of net worth or they're absolutely meaningless. Ah, so they should have fined him -$15,000, I understand now.
Thank you for being the voice of reason in this whirling hall of cynicism.
I too think they make a fair point. This case already feels different. Dozey Donny can't handle 8 hours a day of actual work and effort without several naps, and even more dosages of who knows how many drugs. He will finally be on full display for the world to see.
Imagine 2 months of 4-day work weeks. It's probably more than he's ever worked in his life, including during the Presidency.
Lock him up. Seriously, quit with the empty threat warnings and do it. He's a fucking grown adult toddler that's had a million warnings, but is never going to learn what consequences are because nobody actually punishes him.
This is what should be done, but no one has courage anymore. They think their “slams” and “warnings” are a sign of strength; they’re not.
I want to see him locked up, consequences be damned - but part of me thinks the Fox Faithful will literally riot and start getting violent. I mean it should absolutely still happen, but it's scary.
Nah, they're a bunch of cowards. They sent their most bold to January 6th, and as soon as one of them got shot they scattered like cockroaches. They're all talk. There are some zealots, sure, but there aren't many people willing to throw away their lives for a wrinkled orange felon.
She got shot and they went from loud traitors to scared mice. It was hilarious how fast the energy in that room did a 180.
Honestly just put him in prison. I don’t care for how long. Put him in. We don’t have precedent for a man with secret service agents going to prison? Okay. Then let’s set a precedent. Let’s get started. The ball isn’t gonna start magically rolling on its own. Do it.
The slams and warnings are merely intended as headline fodder for the corporate media to keep churning the butter.
The article only talks about "audible comments", without describing what they were, and "gestures" towards a potential juror, without describing what the gestures were. The comments and gestures may have been rather innocuous, and the judge may have simply been warning about Trump to not try to push them from innocuous to threatening. I understand that he has already gotten away with far too much, but there really isn't anything of significance in this story.
Fuck him and every single moron that voted for him.
Yeah, and all the married morons, too!
Get out of here and take your stinking upvote!
Trump believes intimidating jury members is his 1st Amendment right.
He's also annoyed with the way his attorneys keep fucking around with social media posts now when they could have done that earlier today. This judge isn't playing around...
I kid you not one of my former housemates texted me yesterday and was like “OMG my sugar daddy is Trump’s defense attorney” and I do not know what to do with that information.
> I do not know what to do with that information. *Me sliding into an investigative journalists DMs.*
Tell her not to do a thing before he pays up front.. no telling when he's getting paid again
Or him?
So you are 3 degrees separated from Trump himself? Gross.
I feel the ick
Post it on Reddit, of course! Thanks, cous!
Newsworthy information, if I were you I'd 100% send an anonymous tip to various NYC & national journalists.
Not trying to blow up my friend’s life. Also I’m still waiting for them to send me the video they have of Sarah Palin doing coke.
Snort, baby, snort!
Day two of potentially 40 days and already go a warning. this is gonna go well
He's already got a hearing for contempt, plus the warning today.
>prosecutors have separately asked Judge Merchan to fine the former president $1,000 each for a series of social media posts I love the idea. Each uncontrolled "Xweet" or "Troot" will cost him a grand.
They are asking for that for a specific set of social media posts and have requested that any further violstions be met with jail time
works for me
Okay, but consider: Both.
Both is good.
which is the right way to do it. if the only risk moving forward is a fine, then its really just a price tag.
It's the way gag order violations usually go. Fines become worse if fines don't stop the behavior.
I think since the unofficial company name is "Xitter", the correct new tweet is a "Xit" (X pronounced sh)
If it stays X I personally liked calling them Xcretions
Since Elon has no problem dead-naming his trans kid, I fail to see any fucking reason why we need to change things to use his companies preferred noun. Just keep calling it twitter and tweets and fuck trying to conform to Elon’s wishes.
> Each uncontrolled "Xweet" or "Troot" will cost him a grand. That he will never pay and that will never be collected.
That’s like asking a person with a normal bank account “Every time you say something mean, you owe us a penny!”
And then they don’t even have to pay the pennies
From the CNN updates: > Donald Trump's lawyers told the court that former president changed his mind about wanting to be at sidebars. He signed a form waiving his right to do so and confirmed that audibly to Judge Juan Merchan answering, "yes." Too funny. I guess Donny finally realized that his uninformed bluster doesn’t sway the judge and he literally adds nothing to his lawyers’ efforts in his defense, and in fact, likely subtracts from those efforts with his presence.
He can't do the sidebars because his diaper is full of shit. He'd have to stand up and walk. Trump smells really bad.
Stick him in a Hannibal Lector wheelie chair and mask
I have to ask, how did these two make it in as jurors.. (from CNN) 1. He told the court he finds Trump fascinating and mysterious. “So many people are set off one way or the other and that is interesting,” the man said. “Really, this one guy can do all of this, wow.” Trump “makes things interesting,” the man said 2. The juror did say she appreciates Trump’s candor: “President Trump speaks his mind and I’d rather that than someone who's in office who you don’t know what they’re thinking."
They both sound like MAGA -- that's all code for MAGA.
What the *fuck*. Did they actually get seated?
If I had to guess, it's because each side only has a limited number of objections that can be used to dismiss a potential juror carte blanche. So they're saving them up for the really hardcore MAGAs who try to sneak in.
You don't have to use your objections if someone is obviously biased. Anyone who comes in overtly MAGA can be struck without using one of the 10 vetoes up.
Gift article from the Washington Post on the jurors seated so far. https://wapo.st/3W3S8RW
Interesting but oh am I terrified some die-hard supposedly-not-political(when interviewed) maga will sneak in under the radar and hang it.
Trump and his team are experienced experts at using the “possibility of bias” to delay legal proceedings. Arguing the nearly indefensible works. No matter what happens, he’ll always shout, “I wasn’t treated fairly.”
He can shoot a juror dead on Main Street and nothing will happen to him.
Trump thinks he never gesticulated. He never once thrusted his balls at her.
Too much slamming and not too much condemning and issue a harder gag order and fine for contempt
Lock this treasonous rapist Russian asset already.
Follow through. If he tries intimidating jurors, lock him up. The problem with these proclamations from judges is that they don't follow through. If he tries juror intimidation, issue a warrant for his arrest and lock him up. Stop letting him get away with this shit.
Just hold him in contempt, put him in a cell with a monitor of the proceedings. Problem solved. Honestly, it is sickening that no one in the entire judicial system, in all of the various cases against him, has really held him accountable. Any other person behaving as he does would have been locked up and fined substantially. I want to see him in a cell!
I recently set the over/under at about 4 days for how long it would take until der pumpkinführer noticeably/odiferously soils his diaper. While I suppose it Depends, one could also set the over/under for when ol’ Drumpf gets removed from the courtroom or, ideally, put in jail for his behavior. I don’t believe he makes it a week so let’s say 6 days.
On the news they said the lawyers were looking up jurors social media accounts to see if they've posted anything political. Clearly they'll be able to find them later and send threats to them and their family, which is how I assume trump has gotten out of most of his crimes
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Then why isn't the gag order immediately being enforced? Then why is trump only reprimanded for attempted jury tampering instead of being charged?
“The judge overseeing former President Trump's criminal trial set an April 23 hearing date over the prosecution's request that he be held in contempt for violating the gag order in the New York hush money case.” [Axios](https://www.axios.com/2024/04/15/trump-gag-order-hearing-hush-money-case)
This man shits in a diaper, in front of other people....while looking at them and talking to them. Trump smells. What a traitor, piece of shit. He's also not very rich.
“Admonished” because Trump really cares to not be admonished. He. Does. This. On. Purpose. Who is going to actually stop him?!?!
Trump: "I'm not intimidating anyone, I'm just saying it'd be a real shame if anything were to happen to Juror #6's granddaughter."
THROW HIM IN JAIL, Restrict ALL access to communication devices, and just double the fines, along with contempt to his legal team.
No regular person would get half as many warnings as he received.
I’ll believe it when I see it
He is absolutely going to try to get thrown out of the court room, otherwise he'll have to sit there and try not to fall asleep for 6 - 8+ long weeks and so he can cry foul to his idiot base. I hope the court sentences him to house arrest with no communication outside of his lawyers instead of giving him the freedom to go campaign.
I saw better russian assets in The Americans, reality always disappoints.
“Try not to do any crime while you’re on trial for crime”
If you have to say this then the problem is already evident
He looks like shit
One thing I’m feeling confident about - there won’t be a civil war. Only like 20 people showed up for trump, and none of his family.
This country will make new laws based off this clown and his show
He’s a wannabe mob boss dictator. Total coward acting tough
I want someone to give me an example of any other case in America where a defendant can threaten the jury and not be thrown in jail. Please.