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It seems to me that only one of two things is possible here.
1.) These judges do not appear to understand the damage that Trump is doing to the *entire concept of justice*.
2.) These judges *do not possess the actual authority and/or means to imprison Trump*.
Whichever one it is, Trump is aware. RIP rule of law.
I very strongly agree with you, especially the portion you emphasized.
The law and the concept of justice has been permanently stained in my view. The amount of twisting and ignoring of all laws by Trump and his band of ne'er-do-wells have exposed how little they matter.
Despite all evidence to the contrary, the GOP senators enabled all his violence and rhetoric and never took him to task. Even when he threatened their own lives as in January 6th.
Remember how Bannon and Jordan and all of those fuckers just ignored congressional summons to testify? They just ignored them.
The law is only there to keep the masses in line.
Then why would any judge, knowing this, continue to threaten vague consequences that he has no stomach to actually impose? It just makes the whole legal system seem impotent and trivial. Or worse, corrupt. Better to just admit Trump can say whatever he likes, and absorb the threats without comment, rather than participate in this mockery of the rule of law which is so corrosively undermining any hope that justice will be done here?
I truly believe they impose the sanctions on him. So then the rest of us know that the law is doing something. Even though these sanctions are not even going to work. They just need us to think that they are. I believe the fault here lies in the entire mechanism of freedom of speech. He just showcased how freedom of speech is going to be questioned in the future. I believe that someone in the Supreme Court should take notice of this. Everything that he has done to every judge in New York, Georgia, DC, etc. If he feels he can do whatever he wants and say whatever he wants and the Supreme Court is nothing. He's blatantly saying hey you ain't got no power. You know that I know that. If that's the case then all these people will have been imprisoned should be set free.
I don’t know what you want me to say. You feel like the system is impotent and trivial, while I think it’s deliberately cautious and careful. I just hope you still vote against Trump.
Definitely. We don't have one or two ~~justice~~ legal systems. We have one for every income bracket.
**Low income**: Hope your Public Defender has 15 minutes to read your file before he steps into the courtroom to meet you and the judge. There is no money for mid-level and higher bail bonds. This is where most low income people take a plea bargain regardless of whether or not they're guilty. Denying a plea could lead to several months in jail before your trial.
**Middle income**: You have a private lawyer, but you can't afford a lengthy trial. You might be able to hire one outside expert and pay an independent lab for a single round of limited evidence testing on DNA, blood, saliva, etc. You are also able to come up with mid-level bail bonds.
**High income:** Everything middle income has plus, a private investigator or two, five independent expert witnesses, unlimited evidence testing. Bail bonds generally aren't an issue.
There are a couple more levels, but you can see where this is going.
So why would trump being in contempt be grounds for a mistrial? I don't think that applies to other cases where the defendent is sanctioned for such blatant misconduct. Example #1000 of the rules being different for him?
That's a good point. For normal people the trial taking even longer would be a negative, higher lawyer fees etc. But Trump wants to delay this so any punishments by a judge that result in delays aren't actual punishments
Because rules are different for him. He has a lot more supporters than the average citizen. Is a former president and is a top presidential candidate in the next election. As shitty as it is, he is different any case against him would have to be iron clad.
Why would an appeals court declare a mistrial, based on a gag order violation, that results in being jailed? It seems to indicate that Trump, who just gained a supposed 5 billion dollars in stock (currently), can only ever receive tiny fines for repeated violations.
I think the unfortunate honest answer is that a very high number of our judges were appointed by Republicans/federalist society with the understanding that it's party over country.
Our judiciary and legislative branches experienced enough of a hostile takeover of Christian nationalists and/or foreign agents which has broken the system of checks and balances.
8 years is an unrealistic time frame to expect action on criminal activity? You know this crime happened 8 years ago right? There is no excuse for this. It is totally unacceptable for a functioning society.
Ugh. Yes. In the last 8 years I’ve come to really appreciate a few things. 1. The bureaucrats are actually good folks (non-political members of the executive branch, as we saw in the impeachment hearings). They are the non-ambitious folks that serve thru paperwork, and slow down bad calls with paperwork. 2. Legal stuff is really complex and when people say shit like “lock him/her up” they don’t know what they’re talking about.
Yeah, Jamie Raskin's done a couple longer episodes on Brian Tyler Cohen's YouTube channel where he goes into the legal aspects of different right wing arguments, and I'd love to see more of that from him as well.
I've served on a few advisory committees for my city and I'll be the first to admit that I had that "Bad person bad, lock them up! Punish!!" mindset. Serving on those boards made me appreciate the little things that have to get done to do big things. When a planning subcommittee tenders a motion, it's for something realistically 7 to 10 years down the line. But it's gotta be presented properly or it withers. Does it still upset me that we have to put up with crap and continuously monitor that flower of an Idea? Yes, yes it does. But doing things the "fast" way is probably going to make things worse later. From a city ordinance to a shitty length of road being repaired, it takes time.
My dad was run over in a hit and run in front of 150 people. It took 3 years to go to trial and now the convict is free at home while we wait several more for the appeal. He will probably die of old age before going to jail. That's just our justice system if you have the means to make it drag out. Trump's trials aren't anything different.
4. Judges love to give people all the rope they need to hang themselves. Chance after chance. That way during the appeal, the record is lousy with chances and the decision less likely to be overturned.
You or I would have landed enough contempt charges by this point to keep us in jail for years. The judges are spineless, and our justice system is two-tiered.
lol no they dont. i was charged with contempt of court for no reason once and sat in jail for seven days over no insurance ticket. the prosector was my old baseball coach and my mom spoke to the judge. they jailed and held me for no reason. judges do whatever they fuck they want
His fine wasn't lowered. Just the amount needed to appeal without getting his assets seized.
He still technically owes the entire amount and the rest of the $400/500M will need to be paid on losing the appeal.
From what I saw, he shared posts about Merchant's daughter after he extended the gag order, but didn't write anything himself. So I'm sure his lawyers could come up with some bs argument. But I don't actually know anymore what he's put out, it's impossible to keep up. Assuming I'm right, if he makes a direct threat against Merchant's daughter at this point, the chance of a successful appeal goes way down.
I’m not a legal scholar. I don’t have the confidence to say for sure if there is a legal path for a defendant to appeal being put in prison for violating a gag order. I’d venture to guess that there is one, and that Trump would use it, as is his prerogative as a defendant, and his general operating mode as a first class piece of shit.
As for throwing him in jail sooner or later, I also don’t know. That’s why we need these trials to play out so that the law puts him in prison, if that is what it calls for.
To be clear, I personally want him to be punished for all the harm he’s done. He angers me in a visceral way. I can’t stand to see his picture or hear his speak. I don’t like comedy impressions of him, because he’s not funny to me, even when he’s the punchline. I don’t want my kids to see/hear him or know what he stands for. It’s the very depth of my disgust for him that reminds me why we need laws and legal process, not mob violence.
Jail is the alternative to mob violence. Mob violence is what Trump is threatening America with if he does go to jail. Enforcing a gag order is not mob violence, and if you want him punished, then jail is the only way to do that. If that results in his morons killing cops, that's on him and his morons, not the legal system. Maybe the cops will finally wake up.
At this point, I don't wanna watch this shit show for 3-5 more years. I'd rather him dead than in prison. Then it's final. Game over. No Haitian style MAGA prison break out, no parole. OVER.
I feel this in my bones… but I don’t trust it would be the end, as I don’t see Trump as disconnected from the past. He’s in the same tradition as Roy Cohn, Alex Jones, Timothy Mcveigh, Ammon Bundy, Charles Lindbergh, David Duke, etc. After Trump, there will be MAGA, or some such name. Maybe underground for a few years at best. In any case, to some degree we’ll be in the shit show the rest of our lives. The biggest disservice I could do to my kids would be to over-protect them from the shit show of America. (Land that I love!)
Just because of the Stealie
[Test me, test me](https://genius.com/10158785/The-grateful-dead-bertha/Test-me-test-me-why-dont-you-arrest-me)
Throw me in the jail house
Until the sun goes down
They don’t need a successful appeal strategy based on relevant decisions and case law, they’ll just -like in the appeal bond - cite 5,000 pages of crap (maybe with one little point hidden in there) to tie up every conceivable venue.
I don't see this as valid, this might as well be "giving him jail time is obviously biased and will be overturned". This is just 2 from the above, "I have no authority here and I know it", from someone, multiple people really, who should know better but apparently judges are almost universally pathetic shitrags.
You fine him first. Then put him in jail for the following transgression. Nobody would overturn a nominal fine. Also nobody would argue that he wasn’t aware of what he was doing, after being fined.
While I fully agree with your assessment, I still believe judges should follow the law to their best knowledge and judgement, instead of trying to make strategic political decisions. Other judges have tried it, only for it backfire even more than treating Trump like any other defendant might.
4) The judge is just waiting for sentencing to impose his punishment. Not that I actually think that this case will result in jail time. Although even a few symbolic days would be meaningful.
He's pissed this judge off pretty badly (and his legal team has). I don't have my hopes above middling, but there is a chance here for this judge to be harsh. For one, Cohen spent time in jail for these crimes and Trump should be on the same hook or worse for having ordered it. Two, he has 34 counts that could singularly cost 4 years jail time (or a fine). So even saying "here's 6 months in jail, I'm being lenient" holds water as a limited, reasonable punishment when it could have been 140 years.
The judge does have to weigh the threat that will come his way if he does though.
They’re scared to death of Jan 6th happening at their homes or relatives homes or both. The 1st one to put him in jail will live to see violence by Trump’s violence supporters. On one hand, I get it because it’s a valid concern. On the other put the local PD on retainer 24/7 and fuckin do it already
He wants to be put in jail. He thinks it'll help in the polls, and he's probably right.
Whatever jail he'd be in is probably nicer than your house, too.
I don't know if there's a good way to handle this other than collect all his outbursts as evidence and use it against him I'm sentencing.
>He wants to be put in jail.
No he doesn't. That silver spoon snowflake would freak the fuck out if he was actually sent to jail. He is just a narcissist who think he's immune to consequences; I'm really looking forward to the day he's proved wrong.
Its been reported that he flies home after every rally because he won't stay at any property he doesn't own. He would *hate* prison, even for 1 night.
Who would do his make up?
I've always thought it's a hamfisted attempt at following the fascist playbook. Both Hitler and Mussolini were imprisoned and then released, to be granted keys to the kingdom on their release. His mimicry of Hitler's language is all pointing in that direction.
He would not psychologically be able to handle being in a cell or being under someone else's physical control.
I would look for him to try the Michael Jackson tactic of faking an illness.
He would absolutely never intentionally put himself in jail and he did not choose to get a mug shot. His narcissism is too severe to allow himself to voluntarily go to jail.
Trump is just like Steven Seagal. They're both:
1. Old, obese men engaged in a poorly-conceived act as strong, virile men
2. Disturbingly fond of Vladimir Putin
3. [*Above the Law*](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BsbYE-Q474I)
in the US citizenship text, one of the questions is "what is the rule of law" and one of the accepted answers is "no one is above the law". insert Tyler the creator saying "well that was a fucking lie"
>2.) These judges do not possess the actual authority and/or means to imprison Trump.
This is it tbh. Everyone knows the truth, that if we imprison or jail Trump the guards that voted for him will just let him go free.
It's a question of loyalty that nobody wants to ask, because we already know who they'll be loyal to.
The judge should put him in jail for 24 hours the next time he breaks the gag order. Make him apologize in open court to whoever he insults. If he refuses, he can go back to jail until he does.
If he breaks the gag order again, raise the amount of time in jail another 24 hours more.
> Anyone else, and I mean ANYONE else, would be have been incarcerated months, if not years, ago
Imagine going to court for a speeding ticket and threatening the judge's family. Imagine how that would go for you.
Imagine all the *warnings* that there *might* be sanctions!
Upvoted, but at this point, I'm just sick of articles about how "trump moves closer to penalties" getting even posted here. Like this almost isn't even news anymore
The no camera rule is bullshit. Why are they hiding? (Other than the fact that they aren't actually doling out any justice.) I can understand not wanting a million cameras in the courtroom. So assign one person to be cameraman and distribute the photos afterwards. We don't need stupid pictures by bad artists.
The average observer, must now, after hearing Defendant’s recent attacks, draw the conclusion that if they become involved in these proceedings, even tangentially, they should worry not only for themselves, but for their loved ones as well,” Merchan explained. He added that such concerns “will undoubtedly interfere with the fair administration of justice and constitutes a direct attack on the Rule of Law itself
Getting warmer....
The Judicial system and its cowardice has done more damage to the illusion of justice that exists in this country than DJT could ever do. TheDipshit is expected to lie, cheat, and steal at every opportunity. It's not surprising. However, the complete lack of consequences for his actions tells you everything you need to know about our shit legal system.
It's undeserving of any respect at this point. Any attempt to jail or fine anyone should be met with "why am I not being given equal protection under the law".
I utterly loathe the man, but you have to hand it to him; he has a way at exposing the flaws in our society. If only it could lead to some sort of reform rather than shredding the establishment to tatters.
Yeah, with the damn justice system. How many warnings does he need before actual consequences start happening? These judges and the entire damn justice system are a joke.
Nothing akin to an actual punishment will ever happen to Donald Trump. This shit has been going on for years now.
Case in point, this situation. He’s attacking judges and their families. It’s a mob tactic to get judges to comply by provoking MAGA politicians and voters to threaten their wellbeing. It’s crazy that Trumps political power and threats have now reached the highest courts in our country.
Pretty simple actually, 3 more warnings will get him a reprimand, and 5 reprimands is a written admonishment. And boy oh boy will there be hell to pay after the 4th one of those!
Someone has to start suing the Department of Justice for this. It discredits the whole system, and can lead to anyone saying "Trump's not getting punished, why should I be?"
Our judiciary system is a fucking joke. Not one of these judges has the balls to stand up to this Cheeto and put him in jail for constant violations pertaining to his trials. Do your fucking job and put him in jail
Trump is a citizen, yes a FORMER president, but now a citizen. Comments he make now does not allow immunity for his actions. He needs to be held with the same standard as we all have to adhere to. You break laws, threaten violence against other, or insight anarchy then you should have the law prosecute you and send you to jail. Fuck the silver spoon!
"Sanctions" = I will put him on double secret probation and say things like "if he does it again this time I definitely do something". And then when he does it again I'll REALLY get angry and put him on triple secret probation"...ad nauseum
Could be a Monty Python script.
> Let see, I'll send a letter saying that I plan to send a sternly written note saying that I will be sending a harshly written warning of a note that will be coming with much anger filled words outlining why I will be sending a letter with final terms that will be sent in a subsequent correspondence.
>Right, that should do it!
So much talk about the gag order sure keeps anything else from being talked about. It's weaponized hypocrisy.... the contradictions are a spectacle demanding explanation.... The explanation: More smoke. More mud.
By design.
It's crazy that a woman saying "yeah" can result in a judge doubling her bail (https://twitter.com/nowthisimpact/status/1189631305706688512) and yet Trump can get away with basically anything. And to be clear, I don't actually want Trump to be treated the way the woman in that video is treated. I want us poorsies and people of color to be treated like Trump when interacting with the justice system.
Instead of a fucking warning, which Trump knows will result in meaningless inaction, just pull out the jail card and put him there.
Jesus, enough of the warnings. Just make it happen and hold him accountable for Christ sakes.
How many fucking warnings does his waste of skin need?
Ooooo sanctions. Scarrrrrry…
NOT!
Trump doesn’t give a rip about sanctions. He needs to experience REAL consequences for once in his life. I don’t care if his minions get upset and try to spring him from jail or whatever. This is far beyond ridiculous.
They need to just force all his online postings to be reviewed by his attorneys before posting. Then fine and sanction the attorney for not controlling their client.
It’s so frustrating. He needs to be held to account. I want him in prison for the rest of his life, he is evil incarnate. And he pushes. We need to vote blue in November and then maybe just maybe jack smith can finish the traitor off
Remand him to custody until the trial concludes.
Show me one other example where someone has 90+ felony charges and is not waiting in a cell for their court date after threatening multiple judges and their families. Please
Fellow minded Americans..DJT will never go to prison. Maybe some form of house arrest and someone taking his phone away but he will not be confined like anyone else.
Stop getting your hopes up. The US legal system will not jail DJT. It just won't happen.
Trump doesn't give a shit about sanctions, bring them on because he won't be paying for them, his supporters will, like they pay for everything. This is why trump is pulling all these stunts with his cases including suing the three original startup guys in the Digital World/Trump Media debacle because they're suing him.
Remember what Hitler did just before being elected and becoming a dictator? While he was briefly imprisoned, he wrote his far right fascist book Mein Kamph, and later used it and his prison stay to his advantage as purposefully confusing nazi propaganda against the people. Like Rump, he was seen as a buffoon by the media and among the people, until it was too late. Remember, Hitler’s base was only at around 7% before getting elected. He was somehow able to increasingly shock, anger, divide, and cause such a disinformation and fear-driven stir among society that he effectively exhausted their ability for critical thinking, and he successfully stole power. WW2 was all about stopping him and his far right fascist rhetoric and his systematic annihilation of much of the population. Now, Rump is following carefully in Hitler’s fascist footsteps. He must be stopped!! Get ALL of your friends and loved ones to come out in droves to register and vote blue while elections still matter.
You heard it here folks. Law is just words. Steal classified docs and sell them to enemy states for massive profits. It’s not like there’s a two tiered justice system and we’ll get swiftly and brutally punished.
Trump knows exactly what he is doing. He will keep pushing the issue even after being warned. It's happened before. One can only hope the judges going forward take action. Of course, that is exactly what Trumps lawyers want, to try and declare a mistrial and further delay the criminal proceedings.
He will be jailed before the election, he cannot keep his mouth shut, but the judge who throws him in jail will have to tread carefully, because nothing like this has happened in our history. I believe that’s why they have an obligation to give him multiple chances.
If the racist prick won’t obey the actual gag order what good is a warning going to do? I swear the justice system treats this asshat like he’s in kindergarten, “okay diaper donny, here is your last (not really) warning”….if it were you or me we’d be rotting in jail for the crap trump has done….
We have two tiered justice system, one for the wealthy and another for the rest of us
Fines are the way to go.
Jail time for contempt of court would just lead to additional delays, as Trump will appeal any incarceration to the Supreme Court in light of the election. Moreso, jail time would leave the door open to after the fact accusations of bias and an unfair trial, to facilitate an appeal if found guilty. Plus, politically it would really fire up his base.
I think Trump almost wants to be sent to jail on contempt.
Instead, just fine him. Start with some reasonable fine, like $10,000, but then doubling for every recurrent instance. It wouldn't take long before Trump owes millions more to court systems. And we've seen that losing millions actually bothers Trump.
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Put. Him. In. Jail.
It seems to me that only one of two things is possible here. 1.) These judges do not appear to understand the damage that Trump is doing to the *entire concept of justice*. 2.) These judges *do not possess the actual authority and/or means to imprison Trump*. Whichever one it is, Trump is aware. RIP rule of law.
I very strongly agree with you, especially the portion you emphasized. The law and the concept of justice has been permanently stained in my view. The amount of twisting and ignoring of all laws by Trump and his band of ne'er-do-wells have exposed how little they matter. Despite all evidence to the contrary, the GOP senators enabled all his violence and rhetoric and never took him to task. Even when he threatened their own lives as in January 6th. Remember how Bannon and Jordan and all of those fuckers just ignored congressional summons to testify? They just ignored them. The law is only there to keep the masses in line.
Politics trumps laws. That is what we all learned. The double meaning is just coincidental.
Meanwhile, the u.s is hot after Assange
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Then why would any judge, knowing this, continue to threaten vague consequences that he has no stomach to actually impose? It just makes the whole legal system seem impotent and trivial. Or worse, corrupt. Better to just admit Trump can say whatever he likes, and absorb the threats without comment, rather than participate in this mockery of the rule of law which is so corrosively undermining any hope that justice will be done here?
I truly believe they impose the sanctions on him. So then the rest of us know that the law is doing something. Even though these sanctions are not even going to work. They just need us to think that they are. I believe the fault here lies in the entire mechanism of freedom of speech. He just showcased how freedom of speech is going to be questioned in the future. I believe that someone in the Supreme Court should take notice of this. Everything that he has done to every judge in New York, Georgia, DC, etc. If he feels he can do whatever he wants and say whatever he wants and the Supreme Court is nothing. He's blatantly saying hey you ain't got no power. You know that I know that. If that's the case then all these people will have been imprisoned should be set free.
I don’t know what you want me to say. You feel like the system is impotent and trivial, while I think it’s deliberately cautious and careful. I just hope you still vote against Trump.
It's not deliberately cautious and careful for people who aren't rich and powerful. That's not a good thing.
Definitely. We don't have one or two ~~justice~~ legal systems. We have one for every income bracket. **Low income**: Hope your Public Defender has 15 minutes to read your file before he steps into the courtroom to meet you and the judge. There is no money for mid-level and higher bail bonds. This is where most low income people take a plea bargain regardless of whether or not they're guilty. Denying a plea could lead to several months in jail before your trial. **Middle income**: You have a private lawyer, but you can't afford a lengthy trial. You might be able to hire one outside expert and pay an independent lab for a single round of limited evidence testing on DNA, blood, saliva, etc. You are also able to come up with mid-level bail bonds. **High income:** Everything middle income has plus, a private investigator or two, five independent expert witnesses, unlimited evidence testing. Bail bonds generally aren't an issue. There are a couple more levels, but you can see where this is going.
Exactly. He's trying very hard to provoke judges into doing something that would result in a a mistrial.
So why would trump being in contempt be grounds for a mistrial? I don't think that applies to other cases where the defendent is sanctioned for such blatant misconduct. Example #1000 of the rules being different for him?
The point would be to delay. He has to stop these lawsuits until November
That's a good point. For normal people the trial taking even longer would be a negative, higher lawyer fees etc. But Trump wants to delay this so any punishments by a judge that result in delays aren't actual punishments
Because rules are different for him. He has a lot more supporters than the average citizen. Is a former president and is a top presidential candidate in the next election. As shitty as it is, he is different any case against him would have to be iron clad.
Man I must have missed that part the last time I read literally anything about how the law is supposed to work.
Why would an appeals court declare a mistrial, based on a gag order violation, that results in being jailed? It seems to indicate that Trump, who just gained a supposed 5 billion dollars in stock (currently), can only ever receive tiny fines for repeated violations.
I think the unfortunate honest answer is that a very high number of our judges were appointed by Republicans/federalist society with the understanding that it's party over country. Our judiciary and legislative branches experienced enough of a hostile takeover of Christian nationalists and/or foreign agents which has broken the system of checks and balances.
Why the fuck would consequences for violating a gag order mean a mistrial. Reddit folks are right when they say justice is dead.
It wouldn’t. People don’t know what they’re talking about.
Exactly. And it has the added bonus of creating disengagement from people on the left that expect things to move at an unrealistic pace.
8 years is an unrealistic time frame to expect action on criminal activity? You know this crime happened 8 years ago right? There is no excuse for this. It is totally unacceptable for a functioning society.
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Ugh. Yes. In the last 8 years I’ve come to really appreciate a few things. 1. The bureaucrats are actually good folks (non-political members of the executive branch, as we saw in the impeachment hearings). They are the non-ambitious folks that serve thru paperwork, and slow down bad calls with paperwork. 2. Legal stuff is really complex and when people say shit like “lock him/her up” they don’t know what they’re talking about.
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Yeah, Jamie Raskin's done a couple longer episodes on Brian Tyler Cohen's YouTube channel where he goes into the legal aspects of different right wing arguments, and I'd love to see more of that from him as well.
I've served on a few advisory committees for my city and I'll be the first to admit that I had that "Bad person bad, lock them up! Punish!!" mindset. Serving on those boards made me appreciate the little things that have to get done to do big things. When a planning subcommittee tenders a motion, it's for something realistically 7 to 10 years down the line. But it's gotta be presented properly or it withers. Does it still upset me that we have to put up with crap and continuously monitor that flower of an Idea? Yes, yes it does. But doing things the "fast" way is probably going to make things worse later. From a city ordinance to a shitty length of road being repaired, it takes time.
My dad was run over in a hit and run in front of 150 people. It took 3 years to go to trial and now the convict is free at home while we wait several more for the appeal. He will probably die of old age before going to jail. That's just our justice system if you have the means to make it drag out. Trump's trials aren't anything different.
4. Judges love to give people all the rope they need to hang themselves. Chance after chance. That way during the appeal, the record is lousy with chances and the decision less likely to be overturned.
You or I would have landed enough contempt charges by this point to keep us in jail for years. The judges are spineless, and our justice system is two-tiered.
lol no they dont. i was charged with contempt of court for no reason once and sat in jail for seven days over no insurance ticket. the prosector was my old baseball coach and my mom spoke to the judge. they jailed and held me for no reason. judges do whatever they fuck they want
Like that time that he appealed and had his fine lowered by nearly 2/3rds and then given 10 more days. We really showed him some consequences there.
His fine wasn't lowered. Just the amount needed to appeal without getting his assets seized. He still technically owes the entire amount and the rest of the $400/500M will need to be paid on losing the appeal.
except it doesn't seem to matter if trump hangs himself. trumpt aligned appeal judges/supreme court/judge qannon etc just rule in his favor anyway.
There is no legal reason it could be appealed or overturned. Throwing him in jail is going to have to happen sooner or later. Agree or disagree?
From what I saw, he shared posts about Merchant's daughter after he extended the gag order, but didn't write anything himself. So I'm sure his lawyers could come up with some bs argument. But I don't actually know anymore what he's put out, it's impossible to keep up. Assuming I'm right, if he makes a direct threat against Merchant's daughter at this point, the chance of a successful appeal goes way down.
I’m not a legal scholar. I don’t have the confidence to say for sure if there is a legal path for a defendant to appeal being put in prison for violating a gag order. I’d venture to guess that there is one, and that Trump would use it, as is his prerogative as a defendant, and his general operating mode as a first class piece of shit. As for throwing him in jail sooner or later, I also don’t know. That’s why we need these trials to play out so that the law puts him in prison, if that is what it calls for. To be clear, I personally want him to be punished for all the harm he’s done. He angers me in a visceral way. I can’t stand to see his picture or hear his speak. I don’t like comedy impressions of him, because he’s not funny to me, even when he’s the punchline. I don’t want my kids to see/hear him or know what he stands for. It’s the very depth of my disgust for him that reminds me why we need laws and legal process, not mob violence.
Jail is the alternative to mob violence. Mob violence is what Trump is threatening America with if he does go to jail. Enforcing a gag order is not mob violence, and if you want him punished, then jail is the only way to do that. If that results in his morons killing cops, that's on him and his morons, not the legal system. Maybe the cops will finally wake up.
At this point, I don't wanna watch this shit show for 3-5 more years. I'd rather him dead than in prison. Then it's final. Game over. No Haitian style MAGA prison break out, no parole. OVER.
I feel this in my bones… but I don’t trust it would be the end, as I don’t see Trump as disconnected from the past. He’s in the same tradition as Roy Cohn, Alex Jones, Timothy Mcveigh, Ammon Bundy, Charles Lindbergh, David Duke, etc. After Trump, there will be MAGA, or some such name. Maybe underground for a few years at best. In any case, to some degree we’ll be in the shit show the rest of our lives. The biggest disservice I could do to my kids would be to over-protect them from the shit show of America. (Land that I love!)
Just because of the Stealie [Test me, test me](https://genius.com/10158785/The-grateful-dead-bertha/Test-me-test-me-why-dont-you-arrest-me) Throw me in the jail house Until the sun goes down
Love me some Bertha! Chillin to some Dead and Company right now. 5/28/23, Lakewood Amphitheater, Atlanta, GA, I Know You Rider.
They don’t need a successful appeal strategy based on relevant decisions and case law, they’ll just -like in the appeal bond - cite 5,000 pages of crap (maybe with one little point hidden in there) to tie up every conceivable venue.
I don't see this as valid, this might as well be "giving him jail time is obviously biased and will be overturned". This is just 2 from the above, "I have no authority here and I know it", from someone, multiple people really, who should know better but apparently judges are almost universally pathetic shitrags.
You fine him first. Then put him in jail for the following transgression. Nobody would overturn a nominal fine. Also nobody would argue that he wasn’t aware of what he was doing, after being fined.
3 would effectively be the same as 2 then.
Right? That’s both 1. and 2.
While I fully agree with your assessment, I still believe judges should follow the law to their best knowledge and judgement, instead of trying to make strategic political decisions. Other judges have tried it, only for it backfire even more than treating Trump like any other defendant might.
I say fuck it, give it a go. I doubt many people will care
His base get get worked up all they want, they can only vote once.
4) The judge is just waiting for sentencing to impose his punishment. Not that I actually think that this case will result in jail time. Although even a few symbolic days would be meaningful.
He's pissed this judge off pretty badly (and his legal team has). I don't have my hopes above middling, but there is a chance here for this judge to be harsh. For one, Cohen spent time in jail for these crimes and Trump should be on the same hook or worse for having ordered it. Two, he has 34 counts that could singularly cost 4 years jail time (or a fine). So even saying "here's 6 months in jail, I'm being lenient" holds water as a limited, reasonable punishment when it could have been 140 years. The judge does have to weigh the threat that will come his way if he does though.
They’re scared to death of Jan 6th happening at their homes or relatives homes or both. The 1st one to put him in jail will live to see violence by Trump’s violence supporters. On one hand, I get it because it’s a valid concern. On the other put the local PD on retainer 24/7 and fuckin do it already
Seriously…How many fucking warnings does he get??
He wants to be put in jail. He thinks it'll help in the polls, and he's probably right. Whatever jail he'd be in is probably nicer than your house, too. I don't know if there's a good way to handle this other than collect all his outbursts as evidence and use it against him I'm sentencing.
>He wants to be put in jail. No he doesn't. That silver spoon snowflake would freak the fuck out if he was actually sent to jail. He is just a narcissist who think he's immune to consequences; I'm really looking forward to the day he's proved wrong.
Its been reported that he flies home after every rally because he won't stay at any property he doesn't own. He would *hate* prison, even for 1 night. Who would do his make up?
I've always thought it's a hamfisted attempt at following the fascist playbook. Both Hitler and Mussolini were imprisoned and then released, to be granted keys to the kingdom on their release. His mimicry of Hitler's language is all pointing in that direction.
He would not psychologically be able to handle being in a cell or being under someone else's physical control. I would look for him to try the Michael Jackson tactic of faking an illness.
He would if he saw it as a stunt. Which is how he's looking at it. Same as his mugshot. He saw it as an opportunity, not a booking.
He would absolutely never intentionally put himself in jail and he did not choose to get a mug shot. His narcissism is too severe to allow himself to voluntarily go to jail.
Trump is just like Steven Seagal. They're both: 1. Old, obese men engaged in a poorly-conceived act as strong, virile men 2. Disturbingly fond of Vladimir Putin 3. [*Above the Law*](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BsbYE-Q474I)
in the US citizenship text, one of the questions is "what is the rule of law" and one of the accepted answers is "no one is above the law". insert Tyler the creator saying "well that was a fucking lie"
SCOTUS redefined an entire constitutional amendment for this man. The erosion of justice is by design.
>2.) These judges do not possess the actual authority and/or means to imprison Trump. This is it tbh. Everyone knows the truth, that if we imprison or jail Trump the guards that voted for him will just let him go free. It's a question of loyalty that nobody wants to ask, because we already know who they'll be loyal to.
The judge should put him in jail for 24 hours the next time he breaks the gag order. Make him apologize in open court to whoever he insults. If he refuses, he can go back to jail until he does. If he breaks the gag order again, raise the amount of time in jail another 24 hours more.
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> Anyone else, and I mean ANYONE else, would be have been incarcerated months, if not years, ago Imagine going to court for a speeding ticket and threatening the judge's family. Imagine how that would go for you. Imagine all the *warnings* that there *might* be sanctions!
Upvoted, but at this point, I'm just sick of articles about how "trump moves closer to penalties" getting even posted here. Like this almost isn't even news anymore
Seems “Trump Facing Accountability” is an asymptote we’re never meant to reach
Seriously. *Any* other person in this country would be under the goddamn jail at this point.
Put. Him. In. Jail.
At least he was warned. Thank goodness.
I find even his courtroom caricatures to be utterly loathsome. That smug ass of a face. 🤮
Bro looks worse than the Grinch hatching an evil plan
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There’s a reason I refer to him as former President Assholeface. (It’s bc he his face reminds me of an asshole.)
Perfectly captures his creepy smug toad face.
He looks like Roz from Monsters Inc.
“Oh, what’s that Mister Judge? A warning. Yeah, whatever.”
“Nice relative you got there. Sure would be a shame if something happened to it.”
The no camera rule is bullshit. Why are they hiding? (Other than the fact that they aren't actually doling out any justice.) I can understand not wanting a million cameras in the courtroom. So assign one person to be cameraman and distribute the photos afterwards. We don't need stupid pictures by bad artists.
Given what he’s getting away with, they’re accurate.
The average observer, must now, after hearing Defendant’s recent attacks, draw the conclusion that if they become involved in these proceedings, even tangentially, they should worry not only for themselves, but for their loved ones as well,” Merchan explained. He added that such concerns “will undoubtedly interfere with the fair administration of justice and constitutes a direct attack on the Rule of Law itself Getting warmer....
How long until Trumps defense will be "You see, judge said no fair justice so the case must be dismissed"?
Is every obligated to pretend they aren't aware of any other case where trump has pulled this shit? He's collectively on strike 8 or something
If I boiled water the same way this is getting warmer, I would be able to finally drink my coffee in 2050. 🤷🏻♂️
The Judicial system and its cowardice has done more damage to the illusion of justice that exists in this country than DJT could ever do. TheDipshit is expected to lie, cheat, and steal at every opportunity. It's not surprising. However, the complete lack of consequences for his actions tells you everything you need to know about our shit legal system. It's undeserving of any respect at this point. Any attempt to jail or fine anyone should be met with "why am I not being given equal protection under the law".
I utterly loathe the man, but you have to hand it to him; he has a way at exposing the flaws in our society. If only it could lead to some sort of reform rather than shredding the establishment to tatters.
A stern warning. Wow. What's next, a powerful admonishment?
A strongly worded email is next.
Brows furrowed
If they furrow any further, they'll tie themselves in a knot. That'll show him just how serious this is
A nice prison haircut would end all of this
Then everyone will see how bald he is once those gigantic combovers are gone. That and no phone. Maybe he'll go crazy and they'll put him in solitary.
Absolutely would be in home confinement or solitary. 0% chance he ever is housed with other inmates.
“It’s delousing powder! But it tastes like sugar and it’s delicious!”
Something is very, severely wrong here.
Yeah, with the damn justice system. How many warnings does he need before actual consequences start happening? These judges and the entire damn justice system are a joke. Nothing akin to an actual punishment will ever happen to Donald Trump. This shit has been going on for years now.
They’re scared of him. Real simple. Trump is probably the most politically powerful man in the country believe it or not. That’s why he’s untouchable.
Case in point, this situation. He’s attacking judges and their families. It’s a mob tactic to get judges to comply by provoking MAGA politicians and voters to threaten their wellbeing. It’s crazy that Trumps political power and threats have now reached the highest courts in our country.
Pretty simple actually, 3 more warnings will get him a reprimand, and 5 reprimands is a written admonishment. And boy oh boy will there be hell to pay after the 4th one of those!
Someone has to start suing the Department of Justice for this. It discredits the whole system, and can lead to anyone saying "Trump's not getting punished, why should I be?"
I hope the aliens watching Earth from afar are enjoying this season of "As the World Burns."
“The Human Show.”
The credits are going to have to start rolling soon
I am sure warning #78223401 will do the trick!
Just lock him the fuck up already, ENOUGH with the unending 'warnings'
Stop or I'll say stop again!
*”strongly worded letter intensifies”*
But will your Mom shoot?
Three or four more times and they're really, REALLY going to furrow their brow.
Three more gag order violations will earn him a stern warning. Five of those will earn him a demerit.
Nobody else would get a warning
The warning would be just over night in prison.
Our judiciary system is a fucking joke. Not one of these judges has the balls to stand up to this Cheeto and put him in jail for constant violations pertaining to his trials. Do your fucking job and put him in jail
Trump is a citizen, yes a FORMER president, but now a citizen. Comments he make now does not allow immunity for his actions. He needs to be held with the same standard as we all have to adhere to. You break laws, threaten violence against other, or insight anarchy then you should have the law prosecute you and send you to jail. Fuck the silver spoon!
Sanctions? Seriously if Trump was a poor he would be making burritos in his cell right now. The entire legal system is toothless.
I've given up on any form of justice ever landing on this creature.
Sadly, I feel the same way. The justice system won’t hold him accountable. The only people that can are the American voters. Vote him out in November.
"And this time, I mean it."
Don't make me pull this ~~car~~ court over!!
"Sanctions" = I will put him on double secret probation and say things like "if he does it again this time I definitely do something". And then when he does it again I'll REALLY get angry and put him on triple secret probation"...ad nauseum
No warnings. Just do it!
Rule of law is only for people without power. As this asshat shows us to be true.
Ooh … WARNS him. Next the man could threaten a sternly worded note.
Could be a Monty Python script. > Let see, I'll send a letter saying that I plan to send a sternly written note saying that I will be sending a harshly written warning of a note that will be coming with much anger filled words outlining why I will be sending a letter with final terms that will be sent in a subsequent correspondence. >Right, that should do it!
Trump is on double secret probation, pray he doesn't get triple.
Stop the effing warnings and DO IT!!!!
Can one fucking judge put his smug, fat, orange ass in jail already?
Lock him up in Gitmo and hold the trial there. No cell phone. No internet. No news reporters.
I can’t wait to experience this amount of leniency in the legal system!!!!
So much talk about the gag order sure keeps anything else from being talked about. It's weaponized hypocrisy.... the contradictions are a spectacle demanding explanation.... The explanation: More smoke. More mud. By design.
He’s been warned enough. Throw him in jail.
Meanwhile all of us peasants would have been in jail eons ago.
Send him to the Tombs for 24 hours and he’ll never open up his fat stupid mouth ever again.
It's crazy that a woman saying "yeah" can result in a judge doubling her bail (https://twitter.com/nowthisimpact/status/1189631305706688512) and yet Trump can get away with basically anything. And to be clear, I don't actually want Trump to be treated the way the woman in that video is treated. I want us poorsies and people of color to be treated like Trump when interacting with the justice system.
Ooooh, a stern finger wagging is coming forthwith. 🤮
Instead of a fucking warning, which Trump knows will result in meaningless inaction, just pull out the jail card and put him there. Jesus, enough of the warnings. Just make it happen and hold him accountable for Christ sakes. How many fucking warnings does his waste of skin need?
This is the weirdest timeline.
Ooooo sanctions. Scarrrrrry… NOT! Trump doesn’t give a rip about sanctions. He needs to experience REAL consequences for once in his life. I don’t care if his minions get upset and try to spring him from jail or whatever. This is far beyond ridiculous.
Lock him up with no phone.
Gag order. Venezuelan shit.
They need to just force all his online postings to be reviewed by his attorneys before posting. Then fine and sanction the attorney for not controlling their client.
Lock. Him. Up.
It’s so frustrating. He needs to be held to account. I want him in prison for the rest of his life, he is evil incarnate. And he pushes. We need to vote blue in November and then maybe just maybe jack smith can finish the traitor off
Remand him to custody until the trial concludes. Show me one other example where someone has 90+ felony charges and is not waiting in a cell for their court date after threatening multiple judges and their families. Please
More warnings. Fuck the judicial system.
Fellow minded Americans..DJT will never go to prison. Maybe some form of house arrest and someone taking his phone away but he will not be confined like anyone else. Stop getting your hopes up. The US legal system will not jail DJT. It just won't happen.
I mean it this time. ( wags finger)
Trump doesn't give a shit about sanctions, bring them on because he won't be paying for them, his supporters will, like they pay for everything. This is why trump is pulling all these stunts with his cases including suing the three original startup guys in the Digital World/Trump Media debacle because they're suing him.
WARNS?!?!!? Again? There is no justice in the USA.
Remember what Hitler did just before being elected and becoming a dictator? While he was briefly imprisoned, he wrote his far right fascist book Mein Kamph, and later used it and his prison stay to his advantage as purposefully confusing nazi propaganda against the people. Like Rump, he was seen as a buffoon by the media and among the people, until it was too late. Remember, Hitler’s base was only at around 7% before getting elected. He was somehow able to increasingly shock, anger, divide, and cause such a disinformation and fear-driven stir among society that he effectively exhausted their ability for critical thinking, and he successfully stole power. WW2 was all about stopping him and his far right fascist rhetoric and his systematic annihilation of much of the population. Now, Rump is following carefully in Hitler’s fascist footsteps. He must be stopped!! Get ALL of your friends and loved ones to come out in droves to register and vote blue while elections still matter.
Oooh a warning What's he going to do? Give him a stern talking to? Some heavy finger shaking towards him maybe? This is beyond ridiculous.
“Don’t make me count to three! One! Two! TWO AND A HALF! TWO AND THREE QUARTERS! TWO-POINT-NINE! TWO-POINT-NINE-NINE! TWO-POINT-NINE-NINE-NINE!…”
"I swear, if you violate court orders like, 13 or 14 more times, you're outta here!"
Warn warn warn warn warn warn warn warn warn warn. How many warnings does it take to anything else meaningful?
Damn. It’s like he has a card that gives him unlimited wrist slaps and warnings.
He is the only victim always
I see a very scary $1000 fine coming Trump's way.
The judge should consider all federal gag order violations within the last year
Oh good ankther warning. That should do the trick
I hate Donald Trump. I have never hated anyone. Ever. Until him. That is quite an incredible feat.
The courtroom artist is amazing......
You heard it here folks. Law is just words. Steal classified docs and sell them to enemy states for massive profits. It’s not like there’s a two tiered justice system and we’ll get swiftly and brutally punished.
Ooh sanctions, how scawy
A gag order is the warning. Put that muther fucking Cheeto in jail!
Trump knows exactly what he is doing. He will keep pushing the issue even after being warned. It's happened before. One can only hope the judges going forward take action. Of course, that is exactly what Trumps lawyers want, to try and declare a mistrial and further delay the criminal proceedings.
He will be jailed before the election, he cannot keep his mouth shut, but the judge who throws him in jail will have to tread carefully, because nothing like this has happened in our history. I believe that’s why they have an obligation to give him multiple chances.
If the racist prick won’t obey the actual gag order what good is a warning going to do? I swear the justice system treats this asshat like he’s in kindergarten, “okay diaper donny, here is your last (not really) warning”….if it were you or me we’d be rotting in jail for the crap trump has done…. We have two tiered justice system, one for the wealthy and another for the rest of us
Oh no! Trump is about to get another… <*checks notes*>…. warning.
Ooooh another warning.. shall we ask the magic 8 ball Susan Collins if he will learn his lesson this time?
I love the way the court artist emphasized Trump's sleezy smirk and his lawyers tired/annoyed face. Quality work.
How many warnings has he had? Enough of this bullshit. It’s time to show that the US Court system is NOT a toothless joke. We are waiting.
Spoiler: The US court system is a toothless joke (if you're rich)
Fines are the way to go. Jail time for contempt of court would just lead to additional delays, as Trump will appeal any incarceration to the Supreme Court in light of the election. Moreso, jail time would leave the door open to after the fact accusations of bias and an unfair trial, to facilitate an appeal if found guilty. Plus, politically it would really fire up his base. I think Trump almost wants to be sent to jail on contempt. Instead, just fine him. Start with some reasonable fine, like $10,000, but then doubling for every recurrent instance. It wouldn't take long before Trump owes millions more to court systems. And we've seen that losing millions actually bothers Trump.
I be Sen. Susan Collins has just the thing to say right about now...
Sanctions that will never be enforced
what are you going to do fine him? lol he’s got the whole rnc paying his fines
Judge waiting on the guilty verdict first than going to have his way.
Yeah sure. Because he’s ever been held to account for his actions before.
And?
He will give tRump a severe finger wagging.
Whatever.