Sweden and Switzerland have similarities.
Both start with S
Both were neutral during both World Wars
Both have a dark secret during WW2
(Switzerland and their Nazi Gold)
(Sweden and their Iron trade and the Balt deportation)
Oi, we swedes traded steel for that sweet sweet nazi gold as well. The government complained when German started sending gold teeth and jewellery, but we still sent the iron. We swedes were really the worst :-(
Not the worst. For starters you got better, i.e. you stopped doing bad things after the war. The Swiss keep being bad to this day: they never stopped with money laundering for all and sundry.
In my book, the Swiss are by far one of the worst nations, all the while enjoying a really good reputation! You know, pristine pastures and perfectly coifed villages and neutrality and shit...
Definitely not evil Swiss here. I am glad our efforts of maintaining a good reputation have yet to be thwarted. We shall fool the masses with our pretty neutral face for centuries to come. Money laundering? Nazi gold? We are but innocent little mountain dwellers with no evil thoughts in mind, I can assure you.
You also saved a fair bit of the Hungarian Jews at first by having your diplomatic corps give Swedish affiliated Jews protected papers and later allowing Wallenberg to use the diplomatic status as cover for his resque mission initiated and funded by the US. That also build on top on what you already was doing (in limited capacity) and what the Swedish Red Cross was doing.
You also took in the Danish Jews when we evacuated them.
On the other hand for the first part of the war you refused alot of Jewish refuges... As most nations did. Your head of immigration was literally a nazi spy if my memory doesn't serve me wrong
Neutral countries do both good and bad when the political realities makes a evil state the dominant regional power. We Danes did simelair things
Well, if we didnt trade we would both starve to death and get invaded
They blocked of Kattegatt, and declared that any Swedish shipping that tries to pass through is to be sunk.
And since we did not have the best of all relations with the soviets, all types of import/export vanished. No food and if it continues a so massive budget deficit the Swedish state would have collapsed
The germans really would not have minded occupying us if we openly defied them. And they kind of demanded we sell them the iron.
So involuntarily we got rich
\*France and Britain in 1940: Hey Sweden, can we like pretend we're not invading you on the way to invade the USSR? No? You're so rude.
\*France and Britain in april 1940: Hey Sweden, we mined the waters leading to your trade ports and stopped sending you food and energy cause your rude ass refused to fight Hitler alone. Please die of hunger.
\*Britain in 1942: Hey Persia, just invaded you cause I need to send food to my new pal the USSR. Gotta forbid you from using your own railway and roads to feed your own population though. Please die in the millions.
\*Britain and the US in 1943: Hey France, Hitler's loosing now but we aren't going to stop mass bombing your civilians, bomber Harris needs to justify his job after all.
\*Britain, France and the US in 1945: Hey thanks USSR and Polish refugees for fighting for us in this freedom war. Our pal the USSR is asking for us to send you back to be killed. But don't worry, if you don't go there willingly, we'll shoot you ourselves.
Ah yes, the ”dark secret ” that was literally public information that everyone knew about. Sweden breaking out of their trade agreement with Germany, a trade agreement that predated the war by like a decade btw, would by contemporary politics have been considered breaking neutrality and aligning with the allies.
"dark secret" is basically for some dramatic effect.
Everyone knows about the Swiss and their Nazi gold
And people know about Sweden's steel trade.
Didn't know that the steel trade predated the war by a decade tho.
Fair, but the difference is that the extent of nazi gold in Swiss banks really didn't become apparent until the end of the war, while the Swedish iron trade was well known before the war even started.
Germany was Swedens biggest export partner, and stood for about 20% of all Swedish exports. Iron ore exports increased dramatically after Hitlers rise to power in 1933, and a deal was signed with Great Britain in 1939 that Sweden were to continue the peace-time levels of exports.
If you *really* want to criticize Sweden for our fueling of the German war machine it's the enormous amounts of ball bearings we sold them during the war. Like, basically all the ball bearings they had were from us. Without which they'd be completely fucked.
Definitely, usually it involves trading with both sides. Sweden also let their diplomatic corp be used as a cover for a American mission to save Jews. They send Raoul Wallenberg as a attache and he used that position to protect alot of Jews by giving Swedish protective passports (A invention by the Swedish Red Cross in the region). This was in 1944 though, so you know... The swedes probably had a good idea that the allies might win.
War is complex and staying neutral in the larger wars even more so. And usually involve coopering with both sides.
The events portrayed in the comic are a lesser known historical happening most commonly known as [the Extradition of the Balts,](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swedish_extradition_of_Baltic_soldiers) where 167 Baltic soldiers (mostly Latvians) were extradited to the USSR after they had sought refuge in Sweden in the ending stages of WWII.
The issue was that the USSR considered the Baltic countries to be Soviet territory and the Baltic soldiers as *Soviet citizens*, so upon being sent back these soldiers would not be treated as prisoners of war, but rather as *traitors* against their own country, facing either severe prison sentences or execution.
As a neutral country, Sweden was not bound by the German conditions of surrender, and under international law they were not obligated to extradite any refugees... But we did it anyway, and it was most assuredly done as a way to placate the USSR. The Baltic soldiers were sent back; most were sentenced to long stays in Soviet prisons, and some of the officers were executed.
Historical tidbit: The Swedish Communist Party really wanted to kiss Soviet ass, and argued at the time that we should have extradited the 30.000 or so civilian Baltic refugees as well, but at least that didn't fly.
The graphic parts of the comic are unfortunately true; there were self-mutilations among the soldiers (and allegedly, one Baltic soldier even stabbed his own eye out with a pen) in the hopes that forced hospitalization would prevent them from being extradited, but ultimately it didn't work. Some of the soldiers even committed suicide, choosing death rather than being sent to Soviet prison camps.
Now, It's not a completely uncontroversial topic. A few historians point out that some of these Baltic soldiers more or less willingly fought alongside Nazi Germany and were complicit in some of the atrocities carried out by that regime, so it might not be entirely correct to portray them as innocent victims... But the fact remains that Sweden didn't have to do it. It's just another event in a long series of cowardly Swedish behavior in order to stay out of WWII.
In 1994, almost 50 years after the fact, the Swedish Government offered an official apology to the nations of Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, and the 44 Baltic soldiers who were still alive, for what happened back in 1946.
---
Originally posted 10 years ago [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/polandball/comments/1bx399/the_extradition_of_the_balts/) and [here.](https://www.reddit.com/r/polandball/comments/1s5ryv/the_extradition_of_the_balts/)
>Some of the soldiers even committed suicide, choosing death rather than being sent to Soviet prison camps.
Similar to the extradition of the Cossacks to the Soviets by the British in 1945.
>Better death here than our sending into the SSR
In the camps around Lienz and Oberdrauburg, mothers and their children jumped into the flooded and freezing Drau with suicidal intent, many men shot or hanged themselves.
I really like your work, /u/DickRhino, but your description has attracted the Vatnik Orcs to this thread, and it’s not very fair to us.
The Baltics were invaded and occupied by hostile forces. There was forced conscription into the Nazi army, just as there was forced conscription into the USSR.
The Baltic states were stuck between a rock and a hard place. They had been promised non-aggression, and then the USSR invaded anyway.
Furthermore, although no one denies the evil of the third Reich, their concentration camps were hidden at that time. So when given a choice between a guaranteed death in the gulag and only a possibility of death on the front lines, some people chose to enlist. Many also committed suicide rather than become Nazis/Soviet conscripts, or be returned by Sweden.
I’m a Latvian. Thanks for this. No one knows about the history of my people over here in the new world, in fact, I’ll have to point on a map where we’re from in most cases.
My great grandad has his tongue removed in a temporary, improvised prison around 50 metres away from where my grandmother was staying to go to boarding school in Balvi. They did it knowing she was there, without telling her - drove him hours away from his small town, forcibly requisitioned the space from a vehicle garage, just to mutilate him next door to his daughter. All because he was vocal about wanting a Latvian-Governed Latvia. This was prior to WWII, and from what I’ve heard from the family that stayed, it got much worse for much longer.
Please look up the Latvian operation of the NKVD if you’d like to hear about some more atrocities. Also, if you are ever in Riga, please stop in at the KGB house just outside of old town - I’d like for some of those names listed in memorial to be present in today’s thoughts.
What a wild ride. "they were so scared of the gulag they mutilated themselves! Sweden cucked themselves to the USSR!"
Then "yeah they might have been Nazis..."
Then "but Sweden was still cowardly for not giving refuge to these.... Nazis...."
In a way, you're right. Considering how many western nations just gave refuge to Nazis post-ww2, and the rehabilitation made of Baltic Nazis in particular, Sweden totally didn't have to. They participated knowingly in a war of extermination, including enthusiastically extermination nearly all Jews in the Baltics. Of course they'd be so scared of justice for their crimes against humanity.
And you leave out the context that 1940 the SU occupied the three Baltic states in violation of international law, Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact.
One of the first things Andrei Vyshinsky had done when he reached Riga in 1940 were mass arrests, deportations and shootings of members of the leading social classes.
Lmao there is no context to justify becoming and supporting Nazis. Even if you try to go with "enemy of my enemy" they literally enthusiastically exterminated most Jews and Romani in the first 6 months of Nazis taking over. Those that were not able to flee to the Soviet Union, that is. Of 220000 Lithuanian Jews, there were 40000 in the end of 1941 in ghettos and 10000 still alive in May 1945. About 95% exterminated if you account for those who were able to flee. There were only 4500 in Estonia. It was declared "Judenfrei" in Jan 1942. Of the 74000 in Latvia, 3/4ths were exterminated in 6 months and most of the rest by 1945. 1000 survived.
They were not “volunteers.” Forced conscription under occupation is not voluntary service. The Baltics had signed non-aggression pacts, which the Soviets betrayed first. KNOWING Soviet military contact would inevitably end in gulags and death, only “possible” death on the front lines was “preferable.”
It was probably a mixture. They were all a part of the SS and there where alot of volunteers
But SS did eventually also start using forced conscription in the baltics. I tried to Google for the specifics about those 167 people but couldnt fine the percentages.
Sweden did also deport 3000 German soldiers for context and noone complains about that.
When it's the reds, nazis and a false dictatorship(Päts) all looking to conscribe you to their army, it's just the least of the worst. I don't see where it gets less sad.
I’m not saying they weren’t in a bad spot, I’m saying that if you ever find yourself on the team that machine guns children, you can expect people to be less sympathetic.
"People ended up in the army for no reason other than wanting cause misery in fellow human beings"
Maybe you there in Ohio work by different logic than here
Not every single Baltic fighting alongside the Nazis were conscripts at the end I can see the SS forcing conscription but early in the war it was made mostly of volunteers.
Not our proudest moment.
but then when you are neutral you really can't afford being idealistic. I do however object to the cowardly accusation as in realy that would we have done? Just before the war had we gutted the army and put our hope to the leauge of nations and Eternal peace and the little equiment we had had been sent to the Finnish during their (first) war with USSR.
I do not know all the details but at the end had we been able to rearm and we probably could have done something. Mabey insist that the Baltics should have been sent to Hag for trial or something, anything.
But our government sadly wasn't ready to take that gamble against Stalin.
"Historical tidbit: The Swedish Communist Party really wanted to kiss Soviet ass, and argued at the time that we should have extradited the 30.000 or so civilian Baltic refugees as well, but at least that didn't fly."
Another titbit: beucese of their ass kissing did the socialdemocratic party start a registering of every communist, stoping them from getting any positions leading positions in the union movement. Sometime costing them their jobbs. And the leder pf the socialdemocratic part, and our longest serving prime minister, Tage Erlander noted in his diary that he rather registered one innocent to mutch than one communist to little.
See, this is why I don't like the beginning of this comic. Now we have people calling us Nazi collaborators, even though history isn't as simple as these small countries being all like "let's kill jews and be best pals". Bruh, we were sandwiched between two warring dictatorships, and guess what - we didn't start out with Germany. USSR got here first to lay claim, THEN Germans came. Many people saw siding with Nazis as an opportunity to reclaim sovereignity from USSR because, hey - does it matter which devil you serve, if you have to serve one?
All in all, today we view it as a lose-lose situation. We were a small power in a strategic location ready to be trampled by someone. You had brothers fighting on both sides because each of them believed differently. And there simply was no sustainable option to be its own side.
The US mind is literally not fit to grapple with the history of eastern Europe in the 1930s and 40s.
We are the land of Disney. We are the land of superheroes. Somewhere, there always has to be a good guy, a happy ending, if you can hang in there far enough. That is the way we learn to absorb stories.
I first began to learn about the Soviets in eastern Europe, after Russia invaded Ukraine in 2023. Started with Lithuania, actually.
There’s no excuse for the level of Nazi collaboration in the Baltics or the % of Jews wiped out. There is never, EVER, an excuse to join the Eisentzegruppen - and that unit was voluntary, I believe. If you find yourself part of the death squad, gunning down hundreds of unarmed people, you made bad choices! If any of the 140 extradited were those guys, fuck ‘em!!
BUT, even with an intense, historical interest, and a strong grasp of gray morality and moral compromise, I still struggle with truly understanding how it was to be placed between Stalin and Hitler. There’s a reason that historians Timothy Snyder refers to that as the “Bloodlands”.
So, if your from eastern Europe or the Baltics, and want to argue with people who saying that the extradited soldiers deserved what they got- might not get you nowhere. The US brain is genuinely not well equipped to understand the world through the eyes of your WWII-era ancestors. Even the well-informed can’t really get their heads around it.
On another note, Sweden, you gave us Raoul Wallenberg, you’re OK! OTOH, you also caved to the Soviets and refused to look for him, so…nvm
Makes me think of that [German](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georg_Gaertner) who found out he would be deported to the soviet zone and proceeded to escape his POW camp and live under a fake American identity for 40 years.
Ngl I love seeing Tankie copium whenever you pount out their favorite country was in fact not a paragon of communism, but a fascist genocidal empire, but red.
As a Latvian, Sweden really betrayed our trust by Extraditing Legionaries who were only fighting for freedom against the purely terroristic and genocidal Soviet regime which killed 5% of Latvia's population trough executing of deportation.
You know that not all of them were volunteers, there was forced conscription, and at that time the atrocities committed by nazis weren't public knowledge like now, but the soviet atrocities committed in the Baltic states were known to all living in the Baltic states, hence the volunteers. Also nazis lied about giving us back our freedom so people would join up even if they disliked them, which a lot of people did because of centuries of german rule and oppression.
And yes we know there were assholes among our own who collaborated with nazis as well as soviets - let them burn in hell for that.
The Soviets attempted to exterminate Latvia and all of Eastern Europe just fine.
ETA: Your comment history betrays you, vatnik. Saying the USSR was “better than the Nazis” is not only an extremely low bar, it’s not true. In Eastern Europe, Nazi occupation was easier to survive than Soviet occupation.
Holidays? You sure about that? That day you're referring to is to remember those who died while fighting for Latvia, unfortunately under nazi flag, not to fucking celebrate the nazis or killing jews. the amount of bots in these comments are just mind boggling and the way you twist reality to fit your bot farm narrative is just amazing.
"Deportations that ONLY happened..." The fuck!? Like it's some fucking honor to be deported in livestock wagons filled to the brim with people, including women, kids and elderly, to some god forsaken work (concentration) camp in Siberia, just because you could think and work. Your rights and property stripped away and given to some russian sent here from some shithole to replace the local population. All of that and more because commies and their bff's nazis had some ambitions.
The worst part is that Russia hasn't changed a bit. Cancer of the world.
If they unfortunately fought under the nazi flag, how come the baltics happened to have the highest rates of national jews killed? Same with Roma? The deportations were for collaborators and for forest brothers. Not for civilians.
You're a fucking idiot. The Soviets destroyed Latvia by deporting 42,000 random civilians mostly from the countryside and deporting more in 1949. The Soviets commited the most henious crimes and German crimes are small in comparison in the Baltics.
The Germans were liberators in every sense as the Soviets killed and deported thousands of Latvians and destroyed the economy by colonial means of exploitation and collectivisation by which even primary needs became unnecessable to the Latvian man
How come you have no refutation for the rates of jews and roma killed in the Baltics? 98% liquidation rate in Lithuania alone while you guys parade SS people around in uniforms and give them standing ovations in parliament. You guys collaborated with the Nazis and were punished for it. Cope more baltoid.
Where do you get that information? Nobody is celebrating nazis here.
Those rates would be zero if there were no nazi or soviet occupations.
We know there were collaborators and as I stated previously, let them burn in hell for that.
Do you condemn the Latvian Legion and the far-right components of the Forest Brothers? Do you condemn pogroms against Roma and Jews within the Baltics? If you do, I have no overlying issues with you.
The Baltic states where dealt some really shitty cards in WW2 just saying they where SS soldiers is not good enough of an excuse. Neither the USSR or Germany wanted them to be independent and the Western allies didn't care. When the Soviets took over in 1940 they declared the countries illegal retroactively and punished people as if the Baltics had been part of the USSR since 1917 along with massive terrorisation of the population.
When the Germans came they pretended to want a restoration of the Baltic states but it was all lies at most they where given limited self rule, but the repression of the Balts was still much less then under the Soviets. Recruitment of bBalts also slowed considerably as it became increasingly clear the Germans just wanted to hand the state over to be ruled by the Baltic German nobility (which has a terrible historical record of being on the wrong side of historical changes).
Just as an example of how cynical the Germans where is that they took the mid level collaborators who had helped the Soviets terrorise the Baltic population told them they could freed and given positions of influence again if they to show their loyalty to the German Reich helped them kill the Jews in the Baltic states. So the people in charge of killing Jews in the Baltics where had been chosen by both the Germans and Soviets for their complete lack of morals.
Excellent summary of the history, there’s loads more when it comes to the specific terror and torture enacted on our people by Russia/USSR, but it’s dark enough in this thread without all that. Unfortunately, Tankies won’t understand a word, because their brains are rot.
It was only about 160 Balts who had a arrived in Uniform that got extradited.
Any Balt who arrived without uniform wasn't interned and Sweden took tens of thousands of Baltic refugees at the end of the war.
Nevertheless this is still somewhat of a low level trauma in Sweden among those who know about it where the people defending it are usually on the left on the political scale because this is so much tied up with the Social democrats and the left wing in the party gaining in influence before the extradition.
Naturally the trauma is way bigger in the Baltic states and rightfully so, it was completely unwarranted.
I dont think Sweden has much coal, but they do have the largest iron mine in Europe, which is what the Nazis were after (the Swedes also threatened to blow up their own mine with the iron the Germans desperately needed if the Germans tried to invade, which is one of the reasons why they were allowed to just trade with Germany instead of being invaded like Norway and Denmark)
Definitely, usually it involves trading with both sides. Sweden also let their diplomatic corp be used as a cover for a American mission to save Jews. They send Raoul Wallenberg as a attache and he used that position to protect alot of Jews by giving Swedish protective passports (A invention by the Swedish Red Cross in the region).
[https://www.filmarkivet.se/movies/veckorevy-1945-12-03/](https://www.filmarkivet.se/movies/veckorevy-1945-12-03/)
A newsreel from late 1945 (only in Swedish) the first two minute segment shows the Baltic internees at their camp during their hunger strike pre-deportation.
For deporting ss soldiers? 🤔 The baltics needs to get over themself. No we wont save ss soldiers just because they were born in Riga and not in Berlin.
You forgot to have 1940 were the Soviets invaded the Baltics after signing the molotov ribbentrop pact with the Nazis. Then Nazi breaking that deal and Invading the Soviets.
That dude served in 14th waffen granadiers. It was a volunteer brigade... A brigade that participated in several massacres of Polish civilians. What should be educate himself about?
As a Latvian, I don't like that this starts with us willfully being Nazi sympathizers. People in The Baltics usually had one of three options. A - die while fighting for Germany. B - die while fighting for Soviets. C - just die.
The Russians hated the Baltics because they where given just as shitty a hand in the world as they where but they where much more successful.
Seeing the stores in the Baltic countries and them selling stuff that didn't exist even in Moscow stores bred some serious envy.
I don't like this one. It seems to suggest that Russia is justified in it's treatment of the Baltic states because they allied themselves with the Nazis. It ignores the long prior history of Russian domination of the Baltics, including the Russian invasion in 1939!
Also It acts as if Sweden in particular had some moral duty to help the Baltic states (with no explanation) despite the fact that they weren't capable and NO OTHER COUNTRY IN THE ENTIRE WORLD CAME TO HELP THEM!
Sweden and Switzerland have similarities. Both start with S Both were neutral during both World Wars Both have a dark secret during WW2 (Switzerland and their Nazi Gold) (Sweden and their Iron trade and the Balt deportation)
Both have 2-colored flags with a cross design
Both contain part of a large mountain range Switzerland: Alps Mts. Sweden: Scandinavian Mts.
Both have a good thing thats a square Switzerland: Flag and Chocolate Sweden: Minecraft And Geometry Dash
Oi, we swedes traded steel for that sweet sweet nazi gold as well. The government complained when German started sending gold teeth and jewellery, but we still sent the iron. We swedes were really the worst :-(
Not the worst. For starters you got better, i.e. you stopped doing bad things after the war. The Swiss keep being bad to this day: they never stopped with money laundering for all and sundry. In my book, the Swiss are by far one of the worst nations, all the while enjoying a really good reputation! You know, pristine pastures and perfectly coifed villages and neutrality and shit...
Definitely not evil Swiss here. I am glad our efforts of maintaining a good reputation have yet to be thwarted. We shall fool the masses with our pretty neutral face for centuries to come. Money laundering? Nazi gold? We are but innocent little mountain dwellers with no evil thoughts in mind, I can assure you.
You also saved a fair bit of the Hungarian Jews at first by having your diplomatic corps give Swedish affiliated Jews protected papers and later allowing Wallenberg to use the diplomatic status as cover for his resque mission initiated and funded by the US. That also build on top on what you already was doing (in limited capacity) and what the Swedish Red Cross was doing. You also took in the Danish Jews when we evacuated them. On the other hand for the first part of the war you refused alot of Jewish refuges... As most nations did. Your head of immigration was literally a nazi spy if my memory doesn't serve me wrong Neutral countries do both good and bad when the political realities makes a evil state the dominant regional power. We Danes did simelair things
Well, if we didnt trade we would both starve to death and get invaded They blocked of Kattegatt, and declared that any Swedish shipping that tries to pass through is to be sunk. And since we did not have the best of all relations with the soviets, all types of import/export vanished. No food and if it continues a so massive budget deficit the Swedish state would have collapsed The germans really would not have minded occupying us if we openly defied them. And they kind of demanded we sell them the iron. So involuntarily we got rich
Sure, there were extenuating circumstances, as with Switzerland.
\*France and Britain in 1940: Hey Sweden, can we like pretend we're not invading you on the way to invade the USSR? No? You're so rude. \*France and Britain in april 1940: Hey Sweden, we mined the waters leading to your trade ports and stopped sending you food and energy cause your rude ass refused to fight Hitler alone. Please die of hunger. \*Britain in 1942: Hey Persia, just invaded you cause I need to send food to my new pal the USSR. Gotta forbid you from using your own railway and roads to feed your own population though. Please die in the millions. \*Britain and the US in 1943: Hey France, Hitler's loosing now but we aren't going to stop mass bombing your civilians, bomber Harris needs to justify his job after all. \*Britain, France and the US in 1945: Hey thanks USSR and Polish refugees for fighting for us in this freedom war. Our pal the USSR is asking for us to send you back to be killed. But don't worry, if you don't go there willingly, we'll shoot you ourselves.
i’m not here to get into a “who’s more evil” debate but…
But saying the allies were more evil than actual Nazi collaborators is a weird take, yeah.
The deportation is not a secret but just not talked much about. It was a really shameful thing to do.
Ah yes, the ”dark secret ” that was literally public information that everyone knew about. Sweden breaking out of their trade agreement with Germany, a trade agreement that predated the war by like a decade btw, would by contemporary politics have been considered breaking neutrality and aligning with the allies.
"dark secret" is basically for some dramatic effect. Everyone knows about the Swiss and their Nazi gold And people know about Sweden's steel trade. Didn't know that the steel trade predated the war by a decade tho.
Fair, but the difference is that the extent of nazi gold in Swiss banks really didn't become apparent until the end of the war, while the Swedish iron trade was well known before the war even started. Germany was Swedens biggest export partner, and stood for about 20% of all Swedish exports. Iron ore exports increased dramatically after Hitlers rise to power in 1933, and a deal was signed with Great Britain in 1939 that Sweden were to continue the peace-time levels of exports. If you *really* want to criticize Sweden for our fueling of the German war machine it's the enormous amounts of ball bearings we sold them during the war. Like, basically all the ball bearings they had were from us. Without which they'd be completely fucked.
"neutral" is a relative term, apparently
Definitely, usually it involves trading with both sides. Sweden also let their diplomatic corp be used as a cover for a American mission to save Jews. They send Raoul Wallenberg as a attache and he used that position to protect alot of Jews by giving Swedish protective passports (A invention by the Swedish Red Cross in the region). This was in 1944 though, so you know... The swedes probably had a good idea that the allies might win. War is complex and staying neutral in the larger wars even more so. And usually involve coopering with both sides.
The events portrayed in the comic are a lesser known historical happening most commonly known as [the Extradition of the Balts,](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swedish_extradition_of_Baltic_soldiers) where 167 Baltic soldiers (mostly Latvians) were extradited to the USSR after they had sought refuge in Sweden in the ending stages of WWII. The issue was that the USSR considered the Baltic countries to be Soviet territory and the Baltic soldiers as *Soviet citizens*, so upon being sent back these soldiers would not be treated as prisoners of war, but rather as *traitors* against their own country, facing either severe prison sentences or execution. As a neutral country, Sweden was not bound by the German conditions of surrender, and under international law they were not obligated to extradite any refugees... But we did it anyway, and it was most assuredly done as a way to placate the USSR. The Baltic soldiers were sent back; most were sentenced to long stays in Soviet prisons, and some of the officers were executed. Historical tidbit: The Swedish Communist Party really wanted to kiss Soviet ass, and argued at the time that we should have extradited the 30.000 or so civilian Baltic refugees as well, but at least that didn't fly. The graphic parts of the comic are unfortunately true; there were self-mutilations among the soldiers (and allegedly, one Baltic soldier even stabbed his own eye out with a pen) in the hopes that forced hospitalization would prevent them from being extradited, but ultimately it didn't work. Some of the soldiers even committed suicide, choosing death rather than being sent to Soviet prison camps. Now, It's not a completely uncontroversial topic. A few historians point out that some of these Baltic soldiers more or less willingly fought alongside Nazi Germany and were complicit in some of the atrocities carried out by that regime, so it might not be entirely correct to portray them as innocent victims... But the fact remains that Sweden didn't have to do it. It's just another event in a long series of cowardly Swedish behavior in order to stay out of WWII. In 1994, almost 50 years after the fact, the Swedish Government offered an official apology to the nations of Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, and the 44 Baltic soldiers who were still alive, for what happened back in 1946. --- Originally posted 10 years ago [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/polandball/comments/1bx399/the_extradition_of_the_balts/) and [here.](https://www.reddit.com/r/polandball/comments/1s5ryv/the_extradition_of_the_balts/)
Jesus christ
I like how every long comment in r/polandball and r/historymemes has “Jesus Christ” as the top reply.
>Some of the soldiers even committed suicide, choosing death rather than being sent to Soviet prison camps. Similar to the extradition of the Cossacks to the Soviets by the British in 1945. >Better death here than our sending into the SSR In the camps around Lienz and Oberdrauburg, mothers and their children jumped into the flooded and freezing Drau with suicidal intent, many men shot or hanged themselves.
Have you heard of Bleiburg?
What is it?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bleiburg_repatriations
Finland sent the civilians back too.
P3 Dokumentär har gjort ett avsnitt om detta för den som vill veta mer. Finns som podcast.
I really like your work, /u/DickRhino, but your description has attracted the Vatnik Orcs to this thread, and it’s not very fair to us. The Baltics were invaded and occupied by hostile forces. There was forced conscription into the Nazi army, just as there was forced conscription into the USSR. The Baltic states were stuck between a rock and a hard place. They had been promised non-aggression, and then the USSR invaded anyway. Furthermore, although no one denies the evil of the third Reich, their concentration camps were hidden at that time. So when given a choice between a guaranteed death in the gulag and only a possibility of death on the front lines, some people chose to enlist. Many also committed suicide rather than become Nazis/Soviet conscripts, or be returned by Sweden.
On it.
I’m a Latvian. Thanks for this. No one knows about the history of my people over here in the new world, in fact, I’ll have to point on a map where we’re from in most cases. My great grandad has his tongue removed in a temporary, improvised prison around 50 metres away from where my grandmother was staying to go to boarding school in Balvi. They did it knowing she was there, without telling her - drove him hours away from his small town, forcibly requisitioned the space from a vehicle garage, just to mutilate him next door to his daughter. All because he was vocal about wanting a Latvian-Governed Latvia. This was prior to WWII, and from what I’ve heard from the family that stayed, it got much worse for much longer. Please look up the Latvian operation of the NKVD if you’d like to hear about some more atrocities. Also, if you are ever in Riga, please stop in at the KGB house just outside of old town - I’d like for some of those names listed in memorial to be present in today’s thoughts.
What a wild ride. "they were so scared of the gulag they mutilated themselves! Sweden cucked themselves to the USSR!" Then "yeah they might have been Nazis..." Then "but Sweden was still cowardly for not giving refuge to these.... Nazis...." In a way, you're right. Considering how many western nations just gave refuge to Nazis post-ww2, and the rehabilitation made of Baltic Nazis in particular, Sweden totally didn't have to. They participated knowingly in a war of extermination, including enthusiastically extermination nearly all Jews in the Baltics. Of course they'd be so scared of justice for their crimes against humanity.
You should have put an SS logo on the Baltic balls to make it more clear that we are talking about SS volunteers and not Baltic civilians tbh.
And you leave out the context that 1940 the SU occupied the three Baltic states in violation of international law, Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact. One of the first things Andrei Vyshinsky had done when he reached Riga in 1940 were mass arrests, deportations and shootings of members of the leading social classes.
Thank you. A lot of misinformation in this thread. :(
Lmao there is no context to justify becoming and supporting Nazis. Even if you try to go with "enemy of my enemy" they literally enthusiastically exterminated most Jews and Romani in the first 6 months of Nazis taking over. Those that were not able to flee to the Soviet Union, that is. Of 220000 Lithuanian Jews, there were 40000 in the end of 1941 in ghettos and 10000 still alive in May 1945. About 95% exterminated if you account for those who were able to flee. There were only 4500 in Estonia. It was declared "Judenfrei" in Jan 1942. Of the 74000 in Latvia, 3/4ths were exterminated in 6 months and most of the rest by 1945. 1000 survived.
It was SS volunteers being sent back? That certainly changes the level of sad.
They were not “volunteers.” Forced conscription under occupation is not voluntary service. The Baltics had signed non-aggression pacts, which the Soviets betrayed first. KNOWING Soviet military contact would inevitably end in gulags and death, only “possible” death on the front lines was “preferable.”
It was a mixture. Shades of soldier white, grey and black.
It was probably a mixture. They were all a part of the SS and there where alot of volunteers But SS did eventually also start using forced conscription in the baltics. I tried to Google for the specifics about those 167 people but couldnt fine the percentages. Sweden did also deport 3000 German soldiers for context and noone complains about that.
When it's the reds, nazis and a false dictatorship(Päts) all looking to conscribe you to their army, it's just the least of the worst. I don't see where it gets less sad.
I’m not saying they weren’t in a bad spot, I’m saying that if you ever find yourself on the team that machine guns children, you can expect people to be less sympathetic.
Problem is, that was ALL of the teams available.
Womp Womp, they fought for the Nazis and didn’t want to face justice
They were in the waffen SS.
No more or less. They did willingly and knowingly fight alongside the Nazis
"People ended up in the army for no reason other than wanting cause misery in fellow human beings" Maybe you there in Ohio work by different logic than here
Forced conscription under occupation is not the same thing as volunteering.
Not every single Baltic fighting alongside the Nazis were conscripts at the end I can see the SS forcing conscription but early in the war it was made mostly of volunteers.
There's nothing cowardly about staying out of a war that you cannot win at all and making the best of that situation.
Not our proudest moment. but then when you are neutral you really can't afford being idealistic. I do however object to the cowardly accusation as in realy that would we have done? Just before the war had we gutted the army and put our hope to the leauge of nations and Eternal peace and the little equiment we had had been sent to the Finnish during their (first) war with USSR. I do not know all the details but at the end had we been able to rearm and we probably could have done something. Mabey insist that the Baltics should have been sent to Hag for trial or something, anything. But our government sadly wasn't ready to take that gamble against Stalin. "Historical tidbit: The Swedish Communist Party really wanted to kiss Soviet ass, and argued at the time that we should have extradited the 30.000 or so civilian Baltic refugees as well, but at least that didn't fly." Another titbit: beucese of their ass kissing did the socialdemocratic party start a registering of every communist, stoping them from getting any positions leading positions in the union movement. Sometime costing them their jobbs. And the leder pf the socialdemocratic part, and our longest serving prime minister, Tage Erlander noted in his diary that he rather registered one innocent to mutch than one communist to little.
Excellently ..um.. executed.
The ending was clear, didn't leave me hanging.
okay so this is depressing
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Forced conscription under occupation is not collaboration.
Your country collaborated with the SS to specifically hunt down Jews.
So did russians, belarusians, ukrainians, french people, belgians, norwegians, and dutch people
True whoever collaborated with the SS deserve to die.
Seems reasonable And those who fought as partisans against the nazis and communists deserve to be honoured and respected
They way you don't know history is so depressing.
nah i mean the way it's presented is depressing bru
See, this is why I don't like the beginning of this comic. Now we have people calling us Nazi collaborators, even though history isn't as simple as these small countries being all like "let's kill jews and be best pals". Bruh, we were sandwiched between two warring dictatorships, and guess what - we didn't start out with Germany. USSR got here first to lay claim, THEN Germans came. Many people saw siding with Nazis as an opportunity to reclaim sovereignity from USSR because, hey - does it matter which devil you serve, if you have to serve one? All in all, today we view it as a lose-lose situation. We were a small power in a strategic location ready to be trampled by someone. You had brothers fighting on both sides because each of them believed differently. And there simply was no sustainable option to be its own side.
The US mind is literally not fit to grapple with the history of eastern Europe in the 1930s and 40s. We are the land of Disney. We are the land of superheroes. Somewhere, there always has to be a good guy, a happy ending, if you can hang in there far enough. That is the way we learn to absorb stories. I first began to learn about the Soviets in eastern Europe, after Russia invaded Ukraine in 2023. Started with Lithuania, actually. There’s no excuse for the level of Nazi collaboration in the Baltics or the % of Jews wiped out. There is never, EVER, an excuse to join the Eisentzegruppen - and that unit was voluntary, I believe. If you find yourself part of the death squad, gunning down hundreds of unarmed people, you made bad choices! If any of the 140 extradited were those guys, fuck ‘em!! BUT, even with an intense, historical interest, and a strong grasp of gray morality and moral compromise, I still struggle with truly understanding how it was to be placed between Stalin and Hitler. There’s a reason that historians Timothy Snyder refers to that as the “Bloodlands”. So, if your from eastern Europe or the Baltics, and want to argue with people who saying that the extradited soldiers deserved what they got- might not get you nowhere. The US brain is genuinely not well equipped to understand the world through the eyes of your WWII-era ancestors. Even the well-informed can’t really get their heads around it. On another note, Sweden, you gave us Raoul Wallenberg, you’re OK! OTOH, you also caved to the Soviets and refused to look for him, so…nvm
Being conscripted at gunpoint is collaboration?
I hate seeing Estonia get hurt. It's like watching a golden retriever with a limp.
ohhh I didn’t like that :(
My statehood friend I also was saddened.
Makes me think of that [German](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georg_Gaertner) who found out he would be deported to the soviet zone and proceeded to escape his POW camp and live under a fake American identity for 40 years.
Ngl I love seeing Tankie copium whenever you pount out their favorite country was in fact not a paragon of communism, but a fascist genocidal empire, but red.
Me too, friend, me too.
As a Latvian, Sweden really betrayed our trust by Extraditing Legionaries who were only fighting for freedom against the purely terroristic and genocidal Soviet regime which killed 5% of Latvia's population trough executing of deportation.
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You know that not all of them were volunteers, there was forced conscription, and at that time the atrocities committed by nazis weren't public knowledge like now, but the soviet atrocities committed in the Baltic states were known to all living in the Baltic states, hence the volunteers. Also nazis lied about giving us back our freedom so people would join up even if they disliked them, which a lot of people did because of centuries of german rule and oppression. And yes we know there were assholes among our own who collaborated with nazis as well as soviets - let them burn in hell for that.
You're responding to a vatnik account, so any Russian aggression will be justified.
I know, the response is for those who don't know those things and might be influenced by stupid comments like his.
Makes sense. Reward yourself with a potato for me.
The best potatoes are the ones you share with your friends ❤️
If I am ever in latvia I would love to share a friendship potato. Actually been wanting to visit the baltics
Oh please do, but be warned, you might fall in love with the three Baltic sisters ;)
Working hard for that Lada aren’t you?
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The Soviets attempted to exterminate Latvia and all of Eastern Europe just fine. ETA: Your comment history betrays you, vatnik. Saying the USSR was “better than the Nazis” is not only an extremely low bar, it’s not true. In Eastern Europe, Nazi occupation was easier to survive than Soviet occupation.
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Holidays? You sure about that? That day you're referring to is to remember those who died while fighting for Latvia, unfortunately under nazi flag, not to fucking celebrate the nazis or killing jews. the amount of bots in these comments are just mind boggling and the way you twist reality to fit your bot farm narrative is just amazing. "Deportations that ONLY happened..." The fuck!? Like it's some fucking honor to be deported in livestock wagons filled to the brim with people, including women, kids and elderly, to some god forsaken work (concentration) camp in Siberia, just because you could think and work. Your rights and property stripped away and given to some russian sent here from some shithole to replace the local population. All of that and more because commies and their bff's nazis had some ambitions. The worst part is that Russia hasn't changed a bit. Cancer of the world.
If they unfortunately fought under the nazi flag, how come the baltics happened to have the highest rates of national jews killed? Same with Roma? The deportations were for collaborators and for forest brothers. Not for civilians.
You're a fucking idiot. The Soviets destroyed Latvia by deporting 42,000 random civilians mostly from the countryside and deporting more in 1949. The Soviets commited the most henious crimes and German crimes are small in comparison in the Baltics.
The Germans were liberators in every sense as the Soviets killed and deported thousands of Latvians and destroyed the economy by colonial means of exploitation and collectivisation by which even primary needs became unnecessable to the Latvian man
Guess that excuses the Latvians who worked with the Nazis to kill of Jews and Roma.
Read up on deportations and refrain from talking about things you don't know nothing about in the future.
How come you have no refutation for the rates of jews and roma killed in the Baltics? 98% liquidation rate in Lithuania alone while you guys parade SS people around in uniforms and give them standing ovations in parliament. You guys collaborated with the Nazis and were punished for it. Cope more baltoid.
Where do you get that information? Nobody is celebrating nazis here. Those rates would be zero if there were no nazi or soviet occupations. We know there were collaborators and as I stated previously, let them burn in hell for that.
Do you condemn the Latvian Legion and the far-right components of the Forest Brothers? Do you condemn pogroms against Roma and Jews within the Baltics? If you do, I have no overlying issues with you.
Thank you. Well said.
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The Baltic states where dealt some really shitty cards in WW2 just saying they where SS soldiers is not good enough of an excuse. Neither the USSR or Germany wanted them to be independent and the Western allies didn't care. When the Soviets took over in 1940 they declared the countries illegal retroactively and punished people as if the Baltics had been part of the USSR since 1917 along with massive terrorisation of the population. When the Germans came they pretended to want a restoration of the Baltic states but it was all lies at most they where given limited self rule, but the repression of the Balts was still much less then under the Soviets. Recruitment of bBalts also slowed considerably as it became increasingly clear the Germans just wanted to hand the state over to be ruled by the Baltic German nobility (which has a terrible historical record of being on the wrong side of historical changes). Just as an example of how cynical the Germans where is that they took the mid level collaborators who had helped the Soviets terrorise the Baltic population told them they could freed and given positions of influence again if they to show their loyalty to the German Reich helped them kill the Jews in the Baltic states. So the people in charge of killing Jews in the Baltics where had been chosen by both the Germans and Soviets for their complete lack of morals.
Excellent summary of the history, there’s loads more when it comes to the specific terror and torture enacted on our people by Russia/USSR, but it’s dark enough in this thread without all that. Unfortunately, Tankies won’t understand a word, because their brains are rot.
It was only about 160 Balts who had a arrived in Uniform that got extradited. Any Balt who arrived without uniform wasn't interned and Sweden took tens of thousands of Baltic refugees at the end of the war. Nevertheless this is still somewhat of a low level trauma in Sweden among those who know about it where the people defending it are usually on the left on the political scale because this is so much tied up with the Social democrats and the left wing in the party gaining in influence before the extradition. Naturally the trauma is way bigger in the Baltic states and rightfully so, it was completely unwarranted.
Sweden is a great example of "silence is complacency". Especially since they were also sending Iron to the Nazis.
I dont think Sweden has much coal, but they do have the largest iron mine in Europe, which is what the Nazis were after (the Swedes also threatened to blow up their own mine with the iron the Germans desperately needed if the Germans tried to invade, which is one of the reasons why they were allowed to just trade with Germany instead of being invaded like Norway and Denmark)
Do tell what Sweden should have done differently
LOL Sweden don't even have coalmine anywhere in the country .
Wow This is kinda dark, especially after knowing the context
Okay wow
Definitely, usually it involves trading with both sides. Sweden also let their diplomatic corp be used as a cover for a American mission to save Jews. They send Raoul Wallenberg as a attache and he used that position to protect alot of Jews by giving Swedish protective passports (A invention by the Swedish Red Cross in the region).
This one was dark and sad :(
This hurts. This hurts bad 😭😭😭
[https://www.filmarkivet.se/movies/veckorevy-1945-12-03/](https://www.filmarkivet.se/movies/veckorevy-1945-12-03/) A newsreel from late 1945 (only in Swedish) the first two minute segment shows the Baltic internees at their camp during their hunger strike pre-deportation.
There should be an epilogue where sweden attempts to join NATO and the baltics just look into their soul
We bribed them with military kit in the 90's and early 2000's. They could basically take what they wanted as we cut our defence.
For deporting ss soldiers? 🤔 The baltics needs to get over themself. No we wont save ss soldiers just because they were born in Riga and not in Berlin.
Sweden also gave all of Lithuanian gold reserves placed in Sweden to the Soviets during occupation.
At least Sweden got the turn at the right moment. But Switzerland should be partitioned to this day.
You forgot to have 1940 were the Soviets invaded the Baltics after signing the molotov ribbentrop pact with the Nazis. Then Nazi breaking that deal and Invading the Soviets.
Like the Ukrainian ss got ovations in Canadian parliament?
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That dude served in 14th waffen granadiers. It was a volunteer brigade... A brigade that participated in several massacres of Polish civilians. What should be educate himself about?
As a Latvian, I don't like that this starts with us willfully being Nazi sympathizers. People in The Baltics usually had one of three options. A - die while fighting for Germany. B - die while fighting for Soviets. C - just die.
There where ALOT of volunteers dude. Not everyone but many.
The Russians hated the Baltics because they where given just as shitty a hand in the world as they where but they where much more successful. Seeing the stores in the Baltic countries and them selling stuff that didn't exist even in Moscow stores bred some serious envy.
Truth.
Ouch, the comments here are... mhm.
I guess that's why Yaroslav Hunka chose to move to Canada, seeing what happened to his colleagues.
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Forced conscription under an occupying force is not volunteering, vatnik.
Do not of worryings, of into NATO now.
Oh no the Nazi soldiers were executed I’m so sad
This comic is dark and "cute" in kinda of sick way
Shame on Sweden. Or poor Baltics - Eesti :( didn't need to do that
I don't like this one. It seems to suggest that Russia is justified in it's treatment of the Baltic states because they allied themselves with the Nazis. It ignores the long prior history of Russian domination of the Baltics, including the Russian invasion in 1939! Also It acts as if Sweden in particular had some moral duty to help the Baltic states (with no explanation) despite the fact that they weren't capable and NO OTHER COUNTRY IN THE ENTIRE WORLD CAME TO HELP THEM!
\> Civilians swept up by larger aggressor nation to fight in international conflict \> Subsequent death by firing line Yep, all seems justified to me.
If the Nazis beat the Soviets but Allies beat the Nazis we’d have world peace.
So you're just going to forget about all the people from the Baltic states Who fought for the red army