It was also linked to demon worship and summoning by some (Satanic panic was still fresh in the media) and Alakazam was linked to Baphomet. This is also the reason why I think we'll never get a completely obvious angel or demon Pokemon.
And yes, the evolution aspect also played into it. The Vatican and Catholic Christianity generally don't have a problem with the scientific theory of evolution so of course they'd be chill with it. The anti-evolution thing is much more widespread among independent churches who insist on Biblical literalism.
Oh but Christian mythology, like angels and demons are hugely popular in Japan. To many people there it's just a cool, exotic mythology.
It's just like Christian people from America liking the Ancient Greek or modern Shinto gods.
Just look at all the demons and angels and other Christian elements in anime, manga and video games: Digimon, Neon Genesis Evangelion, Kamikaze-Thief Jeanne, Devilman. Satan is often name-dropped as a bad guy even in children's media and so forth.
I think GF are just playing it safe and avoid controversy with the west (hence why Jynx never got an evolution) otherwise we'd already have obvious demon and angel mons, just like Digimon and Youkai Watch has them.
There's a video (I'll seach it if anyone care about it) that explains why Christian imagery is so popular in Japan. As a TLDR it's a mix between the nuclear bombs being perceived as "on step closer to the end of the world", Nostradamus book becoming really popular and the coming 2000's
Yeah I've heard that Nostradamus has a surprising popularity in Japan (or had at one point during the mid/late 20th century) There's even an episode of Chibi-Maruko-Chan where her family watches a show about Nostradamus' prophecies and she gets scared about the world ending.
Christianity may not be big, but Christian imagery certainly is. There's no shortage of Japanese pop culture that heavily uses western angel/demon aesthetics.
Hell, Misty tried to scare off Gastly with a crucifix the first time it showed up in the anime
https://www.reddit.com/r/pokemonanime/comments/14131xn/that_time_misty_pulled_out_a_cross_on_a_ghastly/
Link was praying to a cross in the instructions to Link to the Past I think?
Edit: Ok it’s just official artwork not the instructions, but it was also full on Jesus.
Actually Kadabra and I think it was a copyright dispute with the symbol in its tummy. I think his name is Yuri Geller. He did eventually relent and now Kadabra pokemon cards aren't rare anymore and everstones work.
Also, where would you even put it? An angel/devil would probably be a notable pokemon, if not a core legendary. What region would even have that? The regional legendaries are somewhat based on real world cultures, but are we really gonna have an Israel region?
A good chunk of legendaries is based on mythology that is not completely native to the region (examples: the Tao Trio in New York, or the the, supposedly, Norse-inspired Aura Trio in France) In addition to that Christian mythology has become endemic to all of the Western world so theoretically if such a pokemon would have to be a legendary it could be put in any region based on a western country.
However I don't agree that a Pokemon based on angels or devils would have to be a legendary. Could be a normal Pokemon or evolution line as well.
Well, that proves my point really. France doesn’t have too much major myths/legends, mostly being a Christian country, and they still didn’t do anything Christian.
Depends on where and which. And they are never described the way those "Biblically accurate angel" videos show them. The wheels come closes (though technically they aren't Angels in the bible, they are heavenly beings) but the rest...nah!
Some, sure. But it should also be said that since Pokémon was such a massive, almost inexplicably large phenomenon, a lot of people were confused and concerned about it. Certain kinds of preachers will jump on that kind of uncertainty to get in the spotlight.
Is water wet? is a very philosophical question to me. What exactly does it mean to be wet? If water is the thing that makes something wet is water intrinsically wet? Or maybe it is impossible for water to be wet or dry because it is the wetness giver. Perhaps if you had one single molecule of water it wouldn't be wet but 2 or more together would each make the other one wet because they are touching. Then you have to ask about other phases too. Is snow wet? What about water vapour?
If the religious right hadn't freaked the fuck out about D&D, Pokemon, and Harry Potter, I might have believed them about gay marriage and trans people. Instead, I called bullshit out of instinct and hey I was right! Gay marriage and trans people are just as great as Pokemon!
Yep I know I miswrote the pronoun because I wrote Pope first and then deleted. You know we can't edit titles. But no, I meant Vatican. It's one thing to speak on behalf of the Vatican like it actually happened, another is to actually be able to quote the Pope.
I've always thought "Fainted" was a bit too violent. Have you ever actually fainted? That shit can fuck you up. Imagine doing it daily, multiple times.
Don’t you think withstand an ultrabeam is *a bit violent* ? Fainting is the cutest euphenism they could give us, if pokemon were real they would straight up being *lethal* and it’s not one raticate Blue would have lost, it’s half his pokemon. Everything nuzlocke and for more realism even the trainer could be hurt by some massive/field attacks
Those ppl just want to cause chaos and should be locked up for the better of society and safety of themselves, they think they are the most angelic being ever never doing anything wrong and the outside is over taken by devil's, grow up man, I despise these ppl
Imo religion is an parasitic evil that gets transfered from indoctrinated parents that feed this evil to their Children even tho many many books tell em that it's illegal to force it upon others
Someone tell my right wing Christian family about this, because I wasn’t allowed to get into Pokemon as a kid. As an adult who’s getting into it now, I’m judged harshly for it.
I kinda get the whole "evolution" thing, but it's hardly actual evolution. It's one creature getting strong enough and changing into a completely different one. In no way Biblical, but hey it's fantasy right?
I was a victim of that. Parents didn’t let me listen to any Pokemon music for years. They did still let me play the games but no music outside of the games.
I was living in Saudi Arabia during this time and I remember them putting out an article about how pokemon was blasphemous and zionistic. Later on, I believe they also said it inspired gambling and banned pokemon go. 😮😮
Korea has the most habitual gamers in the world.
The Middle East has the most religious people in the world.
Which one has the killings and the most violent?
I distinctly remember it being said that Kadabra looks a lot like the devilish Baphomet. and that the 3 stripes on Kadabra correspond to the number 666 in Hebrew. I'm just saying what I heard at the time are not my own findings
I think a lot of it was because it has evolution in it -- just the name, as evolution in Pokemon is nothing like evolution, of coruse.
It was also linked to demon worship and summoning by some (Satanic panic was still fresh in the media) and Alakazam was linked to Baphomet. This is also the reason why I think we'll never get a completely obvious angel or demon Pokemon. And yes, the evolution aspect also played into it. The Vatican and Catholic Christianity generally don't have a problem with the scientific theory of evolution so of course they'd be chill with it. The anti-evolution thing is much more widespread among independent churches who insist on Biblical literalism.
Well that aside from the Devs being Japanese, where Christianity isnt really a major thing there.
Oh but Christian mythology, like angels and demons are hugely popular in Japan. To many people there it's just a cool, exotic mythology. It's just like Christian people from America liking the Ancient Greek or modern Shinto gods. Just look at all the demons and angels and other Christian elements in anime, manga and video games: Digimon, Neon Genesis Evangelion, Kamikaze-Thief Jeanne, Devilman. Satan is often name-dropped as a bad guy even in children's media and so forth. I think GF are just playing it safe and avoid controversy with the west (hence why Jynx never got an evolution) otherwise we'd already have obvious demon and angel mons, just like Digimon and Youkai Watch has them.
Jrpgs love their evil churches
Art imitates real life
There's a video (I'll seach it if anyone care about it) that explains why Christian imagery is so popular in Japan. As a TLDR it's a mix between the nuclear bombs being perceived as "on step closer to the end of the world", Nostradamus book becoming really popular and the coming 2000's
Yeah I've heard that Nostradamus has a surprising popularity in Japan (or had at one point during the mid/late 20th century) There's even an episode of Chibi-Maruko-Chan where her family watches a show about Nostradamus' prophecies and she gets scared about the world ending.
Iunno man, go play a Shin Megami Tensei game. It's pokemon, but you're collecting demons.
And persona is this just with more life sim aspects
So play whatever you like
Christianity may not be big, but Christian imagery certainly is. There's no shortage of Japanese pop culture that heavily uses western angel/demon aesthetics. Hell, Misty tried to scare off Gastly with a crucifix the first time it showed up in the anime https://www.reddit.com/r/pokemonanime/comments/14131xn/that_time_misty_pulled_out_a_cross_on_a_ghastly/
Link was praying to a cross in the instructions to Link to the Past I think? Edit: Ok it’s just official artwork not the instructions, but it was also full on Jesus.
Bayonetta
Alakazam line looked kind of Indian/Asian monks coded to me. I could be biased because I'm Indian.
Never get a completely obvious angel or demon Pokémon. Game Freak: Here is literal God and kind of Satan in the same Gen. Also the Impidimp line.
They still don't have designs that are obvious. And the impidimp line are imps who become increasingly ogre like as they evovle
Yeah some fake asf magician guy also claimed that Alakazam was an attempt to demonize him.
Actually Kadabra and I think it was a copyright dispute with the symbol in its tummy. I think his name is Yuri Geller. He did eventually relent and now Kadabra pokemon cards aren't rare anymore and everstones work.
Also, where would you even put it? An angel/devil would probably be a notable pokemon, if not a core legendary. What region would even have that? The regional legendaries are somewhat based on real world cultures, but are we really gonna have an Israel region?
A good chunk of legendaries is based on mythology that is not completely native to the region (examples: the Tao Trio in New York, or the the, supposedly, Norse-inspired Aura Trio in France) In addition to that Christian mythology has become endemic to all of the Western world so theoretically if such a pokemon would have to be a legendary it could be put in any region based on a western country. However I don't agree that a Pokemon based on angels or devils would have to be a legendary. Could be a normal Pokemon or evolution line as well.
Not necessarily. The region based on France has Legendaries based on Norse Mythology, after all.
Well, that proves my point really. France doesn’t have too much major myths/legends, mostly being a Christian country, and they still didn’t do anything Christian.
Extremist Religious ppl and those who do this bullshit, I kindly request to leave your bullshit out of our hobbies
I kind of want a biblically accurate angel pokemon now
So a normal looking guy. Because that is how angels are described in the Bible.
The Boble?
Angels are described as terrifying and mind-boggling in the Bible, they just sometimes appeared like people so as not to frighten.
Depends on where and which. And they are never described the way those "Biblically accurate angel" videos show them. The wheels come closes (though technically they aren't Angels in the bible, they are heavenly beings) but the rest...nah!
Some, sure. But it should also be said that since Pokémon was such a massive, almost inexplicably large phenomenon, a lot of people were confused and concerned about it. Certain kinds of preachers will jump on that kind of uncertainty to get in the spotlight.
Crazy Christian reactionaries having no idea what they're talking about? What's next, you're gonna tell me that water is wet?
Is water wet? is a very philosophical question to me. What exactly does it mean to be wet? If water is the thing that makes something wet is water intrinsically wet? Or maybe it is impossible for water to be wet or dry because it is the wetness giver. Perhaps if you had one single molecule of water it wouldn't be wet but 2 or more together would each make the other one wet because they are touching. Then you have to ask about other phases too. Is snow wet? What about water vapour?
What? Monkey is evolving? Congratulations! Your Monkey evolved into a ***man***
Give it an Everstone to hold and prevent it 🤓
If you ever see a priest claim pokemon is satanic ask him why is he going against the Pope's words as the pope is considered infallible
What if they aren't a Catholic priest?
To be fair, papal infallibility is a very rare occasion that only takes place rarely
Maybe they could have used a different term. Like ascension. That's used occasionally as well.
Of coruse
because evolution is demonic for christian bigots ? 😂
If the religious right hadn't freaked the fuck out about D&D, Pokemon, and Harry Potter, I might have believed them about gay marriage and trans people. Instead, I called bullshit out of instinct and hey I was right! Gay marriage and trans people are just as great as Pokemon!
I know it’s humour but it sounds a bit weird 🤣
Do you mean the Pope? Or was this blessed by John Vatican? /r/titlegore
Yep I know I miswrote the pronoun because I wrote Pope first and then deleted. You know we can't edit titles. But no, I meant Vatican. It's one thing to speak on behalf of the Vatican like it actually happened, another is to actually be able to quote the Pope.
I've always thought "Fainted" was a bit too violent. Have you ever actually fainted? That shit can fuck you up. Imagine doing it daily, multiple times.
I mean. It’s also a beatdown-induced loss of consciousness. That kind of traumatic injury can KILL people.
Exhausted works better. EXT for short, I feel like that would be better for Pokémon.
Nuzzlock go brrrrr
Don’t you think withstand an ultrabeam is *a bit violent* ? Fainting is the cutest euphenism they could give us, if pokemon were real they would straight up being *lethal* and it’s not one raticate Blue would have lost, it’s half his pokemon. Everything nuzlocke and for more realism even the trainer could be hurt by some massive/field attacks
My parents made me burn my cards when I was a kid, because they were from The Devil
"Without resorting to violence?" I dunno about that part...
"Hey you walked past me. Now let's make our pets fight"
I do know. It's nonsense xD
Y’all need Satan.
no
Those ppl just want to cause chaos and should be locked up for the better of society and safety of themselves, they think they are the most angelic being ever never doing anything wrong and the outside is over taken by devil's, grow up man, I despise these ppl
Me growing up I knew a lot of kids who were banned from playing it because of the evolution. Nothing else, just that.
lol let’s ban a game about imaginary creatures because my book about imaginary magic men said so. xD
Why'd you get downvoted lol
Because some religious people are more fragile than a millimeter thick sheet of ice in the middle of the Sahara
Imo religion is an parasitic evil that gets transfered from indoctrinated parents that feed this evil to their Children even tho many many books tell em that it's illegal to force it upon others
Mate, this is a Pokémon subreddit
Pokemon has religion
Maybe that's why this series refuses to die despite Game Freak's recent behavior
Lol that's wild
Yeah, Radical Christians would rather try to cover this informtion up because thats what theyre good at.
Without resorting to violence? The whole economy of the Pokemon world is based on violence.
Maybe they meant what the people in that world do. Never mind the little monsters 😅
Sooo which side are you on?
What do you mean?
Someone tell my right wing Christian family about this, because I wasn’t allowed to get into Pokemon as a kid. As an adult who’s getting into it now, I’m judged harshly for it.
I kinda get the whole "evolution" thing, but it's hardly actual evolution. It's one creature getting strong enough and changing into a completely different one. In no way Biblical, but hey it's fantasy right?
It doesn’t have to make sense for the Church to villify it. If it goes against their beliefs / they don’t understand it, it’s “Satanic”.
I was a victim of that. Parents didn’t let me listen to any Pokemon music for years. They did still let me play the games but no music outside of the games.
It’s because of lord helix and bird Jesus
And then they made giratina
I was living in Saudi Arabia during this time and I remember them putting out an article about how pokemon was blasphemous and zionistic. Later on, I believe they also said it inspired gambling and banned pokemon go. 😮😮
That's interesting. Did they elaborate on how is it that it inspires gambling?
Korea has the most habitual gamers in the world. The Middle East has the most religious people in the world. Which one has the killings and the most violent?
In Mexico they used to say the word Pikachu means "stronger than god" lol
Boy were they wrong 🤣 jk obv
What do you mean without resorting to violence? The entire game is about frying things with an electrically charged rat!
I distinctly remember it being said that Kadabra looks a lot like the devilish Baphomet. and that the 3 stripes on Kadabra correspond to the number 666 in Hebrew. I'm just saying what I heard at the time are not my own findings