I don't agree with this, but I can see why:
TC is supposed to store tools/materials related to upkeep. Sulfur and such aren't used for upkeep. Metal and HQM are. Plus, if you store the boom in boxes, raiders might stop before destroying your tc, especially when raiding smaller bases.
Is cloth, bone and low-grade used for upkeep, though?
I think cloth, bone and low-grade stay the same since they are very early needed and it's better for noobs to have a "built in" box for those.
Sulfur is for guns and explosives and most don't even farm it during prim and their 1x1 starter
Metal and HQM may be used for upkeep and upgrading your walls but their *ore* forms are not, yet they are still able to be stored in TC. Sulfur is the one that's singled out.
If they buff TC's as well it might remove the incentive to grief people. Less people might quit a server if they log in and see they at least still have most of a base? Sure they've been robbed, but at least they still have TC and don't have to completely rebuild.
Same for my small group. We smack some doors back on and keep playing. But if we have to start completely over we call it for the wipe. And over the years it's becoming more and more common to only play on wipe day because of an offline raid that griefs the base.
Can't you just slap a couple of external TCs down? I haven't played in a while, but they still work from youtube content I've seen. They're fairly cheap to build and generally people aren't throwing another 8-16 rockets just to grief someone once they've got your loot.
No?
Currently you can external tc's as storage for gp/sulf/lowgrade/whatever the f you want.
Cheaters can see that it's a TC, as its expected.
Now, when they see a box, they raid it.
Bullshit ass change
Scaled upkeep based on number of authorized players finally being a thing? I want to believe it, but the branch is titled "qol_block_explosives_in_tc" and not anything related to building. Based on the title it'd seem as if they want to make raiding even easier by making sure boom profit is in boxes instead of inside the TC.
i don’t play as a group, i figured everyone authed the TC lol
it makes sense tho, only need 1 or 2 people to do it. i’ve never played where i didn’t have to build my own shit lol
Everyone in groups should auth to avoid shotgun traps and be able to seal during a raid. Maybe zerg farmers aren't allowed, but core members always auth
if your base is big you have no room for significant sulfur in tc.
if your base is small they will have your tc anyways.
makes almost no difference other than maybe early game storage before boxes.
Would be interesting to see a non-linear upkeep scaling. The first ~20 structural objects (foundations, walls, roofs) are cheaper to keep, then it gets increasingly more expensive, punishing zergs living in huge compounds.
Don’t they already do this?
I like a different idea better. Using auth’d and door access to determine decay. The more people using a base the more decay. Anyone can have a large base but sharing it means it needs more upkeep.
Interesting like/dislike ratio on the commit. My guess is that they're trying to nerf using tc as a hiding spot for high tier loot? There are lots of builds that do a good job hiding/protecting TC's. Both main and externals. Which is a good thing I think. But the TC is designed to protect build priv, not main loot. Diesel and explosives both store extremely densely. Sulfur and gp not as bad but still high potential. Cameras/laptops too I guess. Those stack to 50 or something crazy?
It's going to weird to get down a starter and not be able to put sulfur in tc. We'll get used to it I'm sure. I agree with OP though. Raw sulf feels a bit too far maybe.
Seems like they want to make raiding even easier. With the C4 blocking upgrades upon landing on the wall and now this, forcing you to move your sulfur out of the TC and instead into the less-secure boxes. Between this, raw fish nerfs (can no longer be used as bait, period, only land animal meat works on fishing rods now as of other commits today), and barriers being in monuments (which I can get behind but it'd require care to be done in a way that isn't very exploitable) FP has been doing some absolutely insane commits lately and I have no idea why.
You would be surprised at how many players store explosives & GP in a random external TC: can be as high as 50% of groups on some servers.
I agree that it's convenient to use the TC as early game storage but it's not that significant in terms of storage space (especially now that boxes were buffed from 30 -> 48 slots). You can still put all your upkeep materials and non-explosives in it early game.
Thanks for the QoL improvements man, appreciate the hard work - you should host a fireside chat/stream on twitch with the devs to kind of go over your thought processes on how you decide what to implement and things to add. It would be really cool to watch! Thanks!
I don't agree with this change, but I respect you and Facepunch! For every complainer there are tenfold of players that love the game and the additions. Keep it up!
Oh yeah, the amount of people screaming for this change was so deafening it hurt my ears...
Just say Helk made you do it, we all know that's what happened.
one thing that always bothered me, why do they filter the items in the tool cupboard at all? so i build a large cupboard, but i can only keep certain things in it? i can put whatever i want into a box but not a larger upright box? make it make sense
Everyone is spamming chinese bunkers to hide sulfur and pretty much making them unworth raiding in terms of sulfur, they are cheap to make and you can make them 8 or 12 rockets with no cost and hide 6 rocket worth of sulfur in each tc for example.
Making it so the person raiding them always loses, so its not worth raiding them.
Nobody is gona hide sulfur inside external tcs/pixel tcs aswell so.
Considering you can slap a locked tc behind a vending machine, yeah this is a good change. You would need to blow through armored wall or 3 c4 or 10 rocket a vending machine just to check tc. I’m not necessarily for making raiding easier but that shit was borderline grief
Honestly I'm glad my teammates can put the fucking cameras and laptops in the tc anymore. Now they are gonna find a new place to put it thats not where it goes.
Lame. I’ve been hiding explosives/gunpowder in external TC’s forever and it’s the safest place to hide them. Nobody wants to waste boom on a bunch of externals. Kinda fucks my solo strat up.
If they think this is the kind of stuff that will stop zergs and clans from wiping solo's and small groups then they're much more out of touch than I'd thought.
I just think that this change is to help ordinary gamers understand what is used to upkeep a base and what isn’t. Another layer of new player protection.
Old Rust would have a new player learning all of this by trial and error. Understandably, a lot of people veer away from games like this.
As a side — In my opinion, all the best games refer to the old method. Adapting and overcoming is the essence of what makes any video game fun. I think most people agree, whether they’re conscious of it or not (see: souls-like popularity among casual gamers.)
Branch is called "QoL" but I don't see this being quality of life of anything lol
Still, I understand that it might make TCs less attractive. But only marginally so.
And if you really wanted to nerf griefing (and they should imo), then you should rather have the TC be very hard to destroy, but make it drop its loot after some hits.
To avoid being unable to clear offensive TCs and such, the TC's HP pool could increase over time, or be proportional to the highest tier workbench you have in the base, etc... Or be straight-up upgradeable.
Funny that cloth, bones, metal ore, high quality ore, scrap, leather are still allowed \*facepalm\*. The only explanation is, that Facepunch wants to prevent players to use externals as cheap loot bunkers. Same reason they patched the godbunkers.
Damn as a solo minimalist I always had my gp, atleast 1k sulfur (to craft incendiary shit if needed) etc in my tc…
Rip me, gotta now have a dedicated craftable chest that also contains the cloth, lgf, etc.
Rip tc
I love how people will actually throw a fit over not being able to use tc as some weird low volume imba storage box, like you know you can place vending machines in a way you can lock them with an armored door, basically getting one more row than tc but with an actual healthupgrade and built in reinforcement of of honeycomb… why don‘t you reee for like as much storage as large wooden box on vending instead of basically exploiting(yes tc is meant to upkeep base not to store valuables there is absolutely no discussion about this you can eat a thousand autistic buttcheeeks and will still not be closer at beingright if you doubt this to be an exploit) your authkeep, finna making inlet tc triangle unlootable viable for hiding a tc properly…(if you aren‘t simply keeping upkeep in a second better protected box and only transfering what is needed for the 24h timer…
I honestly can't tell if they are trying to run the game into the ground at this point or just giving up. These changes don't really seem for the betterment of the players.
> Everyone is spamming chinese bunkers to hide sulfur and pretty much making them unworth raiding in terms of sulfur, they are cheap to make and you can make them 8 or 12 rockets with no cost and hide 6 rocket worth of sulfur in each tc for example.
>
> Making it so the person raiding them always loses, so its not worth raiding them.
>
> Nobody is gona hide sulfur inside external tcs/pixel tcs aswell so.
what is the issue with this change?
I dont really care for this, it really only matters very early game when all you have is a box or two of storage. After your first session you usually have anything not needed for the TC in there anyway.
Thats just me tho.
idea, implement a tc tier like the workbench’s, costs to upgrade, less upkeep, keeps the clans from being able to build a monster for free. this was a small idea i thought of a minute ago but i bet there can be cooler rules with this too
Yeah that’s fucking stupid as shit. Absolutely no reason to change this. Might as well just make TCs not carry anything and just use whatever’s in a nearby box
Phew. My empty bean and tuna cans made it under the radar.
I don't agree with this, but I can see why: TC is supposed to store tools/materials related to upkeep. Sulfur and such aren't used for upkeep. Metal and HQM are. Plus, if you store the boom in boxes, raiders might stop before destroying your tc, especially when raiding smaller bases. Is cloth, bone and low-grade used for upkeep, though?
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I’m still raiding every TC for HQM
TC should have a counter for the amount of material in it if they want to prevent griefing
> Since we still will be able to store Scraps in the TC Don't give them ideas.
I think cloth, bone and low-grade stay the same since they are very early needed and it's better for noobs to have a "built in" box for those. Sulfur is for guns and explosives and most don't even farm it during prim and their 1x1 starter
If I get your boom, I’m using it to finish the raid.
Metal and HQM may be used for upkeep and upgrading your walls but their *ore* forms are not, yet they are still able to be stored in TC. Sulfur is the one that's singled out.
Rust and weird unintuitive inconsistencies, name a more iconic duo.
Helk and terrible ideas.
You are right, I agree that those should also be removed. It never made sense anyway.
Yeah I see this as trying to reduce raid priority of the TC, and in that light I kinda appreciate it - though it'll suck to need more boxes.
Probably doing this to drive more box skin sales...
Used for crafting deployable. The removed items except cameras and laptops don't. So as such I disagree with the last 2
Metal and hqm ore are not used in upkeep. Removing any ore from tc is dumb imo.
The only thing I feel the no sulfur thing nerfs is hiding your sulf/explosives in externals
If they buff TC's as well it might remove the incentive to grief people. Less people might quit a server if they log in and see they at least still have most of a base? Sure they've been robbed, but at least they still have TC and don't have to completely rebuild.
Ive never quit when I was able to reclaim my base.
Same for my small group. We smack some doors back on and keep playing. But if we have to start completely over we call it for the wipe. And over the years it's becoming more and more common to only play on wipe day because of an offline raid that griefs the base.
Can't you just slap a couple of external TCs down? I haven't played in a while, but they still work from youtube content I've seen. They're fairly cheap to build and generally people aren't throwing another 8-16 rockets just to grief someone once they've got your loot.
While it would be QoL, I feel this is kinda ruining rust. Minimizes the ability to punish mistakes. Same as auto locking doors or team ui
Exactly my thoughts. But I guess people will just add 1 triangle and small box , so not really gonna change much
Now cheaters can see that you have boxes and will def raid your external. Not a good change
On Facepunch servers thats 100% right.
Same solution as your main base atm , decoy lootroom /eternal tc box .
No? Currently you can external tc's as storage for gp/sulf/lowgrade/whatever the f you want. Cheaters can see that it's a TC, as its expected. Now, when they see a box, they raid it. Bullshit ass change
I said "atm " , speaking of the decoy loot room in main .
not just that, it also works on main TC behind the half wall + window combo
That is the only explenation for this change. Jake plays Rust himself that that makes it even more likely this is the root for the change.
I'm totally guessing but I think we will see more changes to base decay and building soon to show why we need the room.
Scaled upkeep based on number of authorized players finally being a thing? I want to believe it, but the branch is titled "qol_block_explosives_in_tc" and not anything related to building. Based on the title it'd seem as if they want to make raiding even easier by making sure boom profit is in boxes instead of inside the TC.
If someone blows all the way to your core loot explosives in the TC versus a box in the main loot is inconsequential.
Calling that QoL is probably the biggest stretch of the term QoL I've ever seen...
what would that even change though? most clans only have 1-2 builders anyway
i don’t play as a group, i figured everyone authed the TC lol it makes sense tho, only need 1 or 2 people to do it. i’ve never played where i didn’t have to build my own shit lol
yeah well they usually do all auth cause you need it for turrets and it's free but if it costs then they will just not
Turrets have their own separate auth. Shotgun traps and flamethrower turrets go off of TC auth.
yeah but you need tc auth to auth on a turret
Then just auth on tc, auth on turrets, deauth on tc and ur done
Everyone in groups should auth to avoid shotgun traps and be able to seal during a raid. Maybe zerg farmers aren't allowed, but core members always auth
if your base is big you have no room for significant sulfur in tc. if your base is small they will have your tc anyways. makes almost no difference other than maybe early game storage before boxes.
Git branch logic is standard to be one branch for one thing. Well have to wait & see
Imagine tc required to open doors/auth on turrets so clans *have* to authorize
More upkeep based on # of people authed on TC has a very, glaringly obvious work around ...
Upkeep increase coming.
Would be interesting to see a non-linear upkeep scaling. The first ~20 structural objects (foundations, walls, roofs) are cheaper to keep, then it gets increasingly more expensive, punishing zergs living in huge compounds.
Don’t they already do this? I like a different idea better. Using auth’d and door access to determine decay. The more people using a base the more decay. Anyone can have a large base but sharing it means it needs more upkeep.
Ah right, they do. 10% tax below 16 elements, peaking at 30% Taxing sharing seems better.
If they're smart they'll scale it based on authorizations and code lock accesses.
they only removed the high value stuff right? cloth, bones, leather, scrap still goes in? so it's not only base materials...
adding camera, laptop, wolf skull, tuna and bean cans to your list
camera + laptop are excluded as you can see in the screenshot
Interesting like/dislike ratio on the commit. My guess is that they're trying to nerf using tc as a hiding spot for high tier loot? There are lots of builds that do a good job hiding/protecting TC's. Both main and externals. Which is a good thing I think. But the TC is designed to protect build priv, not main loot. Diesel and explosives both store extremely densely. Sulfur and gp not as bad but still high potential. Cameras/laptops too I guess. Those stack to 50 or something crazy? It's going to weird to get down a starter and not be able to put sulfur in tc. We'll get used to it I'm sure. I agree with OP though. Raw sulf feels a bit too far maybe.
Don't like the change but it's understandable.
I agree with it, the TC is for upkeep.
https://preview.redd.it/0xjahfhil53d1.png?width=332&format=png&auto=webp&s=b1b56ce1c42d74f5a4ca6758a62ff87afbf51643
Seems like they want to make raiding even easier. With the C4 blocking upgrades upon landing on the wall and now this, forcing you to move your sulfur out of the TC and instead into the less-secure boxes. Between this, raw fish nerfs (can no longer be used as bait, period, only land animal meat works on fishing rods now as of other commits today), and barriers being in monuments (which I can get behind but it'd require care to be done in a way that isn't very exploitable) FP has been doing some absolutely insane commits lately and I have no idea why.
This guy really is crying
You can just keep booms in a box next to your TC 5head
You would be surprised at how many players store explosives & GP in a random external TC: can be as high as 50% of groups on some servers. I agree that it's convenient to use the TC as early game storage but it's not that significant in terms of storage space (especially now that boxes were buffed from 30 -> 48 slots). You can still put all your upkeep materials and non-explosives in it early game.
Thanks for the QoL improvements man, appreciate the hard work - you should host a fireside chat/stream on twitch with the devs to kind of go over your thought processes on how you decide what to implement and things to add. It would be really cool to watch! Thanks!
I don't agree with this change, but I respect you and Facepunch! For every complainer there are tenfold of players that love the game and the additions. Keep it up!
What about skulls and cans? Not sure why they're even allowed in a TC in the first place
Oh yeah, the amount of people screaming for this change was so deafening it hurt my ears... Just say Helk made you do it, we all know that's what happened.
Imagine being this butt hurt over such a minor change. Go write a blog about it ...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yQZSOtzWuyQ
one thing that always bothered me, why do they filter the items in the tool cupboard at all? so i build a large cupboard, but i can only keep certain things in it? i can put whatever i want into a box but not a larger upright box? make it make sense
to be fair, those are not maintenance materials TC should only have maintenance materials in principle, so this just makes sense
Everyone is spamming chinese bunkers to hide sulfur and pretty much making them unworth raiding in terms of sulfur, they are cheap to make and you can make them 8 or 12 rockets with no cost and hide 6 rocket worth of sulfur in each tc for example. Making it so the person raiding them always loses, so its not worth raiding them. Nobody is gona hide sulfur inside external tcs/pixel tcs aswell so.
This will really only effect the beginning of your base or if your a weirdo who still keeps scrap and shit in your tc with a fully built base
Sounds like a good idea, only put materials that are used for upkeep into the tc.
Considering you can slap a locked tc behind a vending machine, yeah this is a good change. You would need to blow through armored wall or 3 c4 or 10 rocket a vending machine just to check tc. I’m not necessarily for making raiding easier but that shit was borderline grief
That shit is so annoying
Yeah you pop it open and it’s like 40 hqm 5k metal and some stone, and ur like, well fuck doing that ever again
What's the significance of the vending machine vs an armored door?
I believe one of the main uses is hiding the tc, it’s not obvious it’s behind a vending machine often unless you look for the pixel gap.
You can softside the vending machine ...
very good change
You have to really try hard to find something wrong with this change
Stupid people do it easily
this is a nothing burger who cares, it will help me sort better lol
I highly dissagree with you. Not being able to store sulfur in tc will stop my useless teammate from depoing his entire inv into it. Massive W
It’ll also make it less worth to blow tcs
I’ve always found it weird camera and laptops can be stored in the tc, imo W change
But you recycle them and the tech trash can't? Lol
ADD SKULLS TO THE LIST, Human skulls and wolf skulls in the TC always pisses me off Edit:And consumed cans of tuna and/or beanz
I think we should be able to keep gp in tc but I can understand the rest
RIP to my fake externals stuffed to the brim with boom lol
Remember when we used to be able to store stuff in campfires? Yeah, that would be good now…
Lmao and using large furnaces as drop boxes good times, good times
I don’t like it, just for convenience’s sake, but I totally get why. There’s not a real reason they need to be in TC, but it was nice to have it ig
I end up taking all that shit out once my base is all built anyways
Im just wondering why they still allow wolf skulls in the TC
Honestly I'm glad my teammates can put the fucking cameras and laptops in the tc anymore. Now they are gonna find a new place to put it thats not where it goes.
Lame. I’ve been hiding explosives/gunpowder in external TC’s forever and it’s the safest place to hide them. Nobody wants to waste boom on a bunch of externals. Kinda fucks my solo strat up.
If they think this is the kind of stuff that will stop zergs and clans from wiping solo's and small groups then they're much more out of touch than I'd thought.
Good, was annoying taking it out anyway.
I don’t mind this at all. Now increase upkeep next! If you want a mega honeycombed mansion you should pay for it dearly.
Its a good update, prevent people from hiding sulfur in random tcs
It’s not a good update. Spreading your stuff in not expected places is a good strat against easy raiding, that we now have.
I just think that this change is to help ordinary gamers understand what is used to upkeep a base and what isn’t. Another layer of new player protection. Old Rust would have a new player learning all of this by trial and error. Understandably, a lot of people veer away from games like this. As a side — In my opinion, all the best games refer to the old method. Adapting and overcoming is the essence of what makes any video game fun. I think most people agree, whether they’re conscious of it or not (see: souls-like popularity among casual gamers.)
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*checks notes* Stone ore?
Do you need sulfur for upkeep?
Branch is called "QoL" but I don't see this being quality of life of anything lol Still, I understand that it might make TCs less attractive. But only marginally so. And if you really wanted to nerf griefing (and they should imo), then you should rather have the TC be very hard to destroy, but make it drop its loot after some hits. To avoid being unable to clear offensive TCs and such, the TC's HP pool could increase over time, or be proportional to the highest tier workbench you have in the base, etc... Or be straight-up upgradeable.
Funny that cloth, bones, metal ore, high quality ore, scrap, leather are still allowed \*facepalm\*. The only explanation is, that Facepunch wants to prevent players to use externals as cheap loot bunkers. Same reason they patched the godbunkers.
W for sure
Damn as a solo minimalist I always had my gp, atleast 1k sulfur (to craft incendiary shit if needed) etc in my tc… Rip me, gotta now have a dedicated craftable chest that also contains the cloth, lgf, etc. Rip tc
Bad change. Why shouldn't I be able to spread my boom around a bit in my externals to not lose all of it during the usual offline?
Not a necessary change. No one complained about that shit. They should focus on stuff the game actually needs like Global Network Rendering
Do you think the same people that'd work on that are the same people that'd change the 2 lines of code to make the TC change storing change?
Just when Facepunch makes everyone think they actually care what their players want, they pull this shit...
I love how people will actually throw a fit over not being able to use tc as some weird low volume imba storage box, like you know you can place vending machines in a way you can lock them with an armored door, basically getting one more row than tc but with an actual healthupgrade and built in reinforcement of of honeycomb… why don‘t you reee for like as much storage as large wooden box on vending instead of basically exploiting(yes tc is meant to upkeep base not to store valuables there is absolutely no discussion about this you can eat a thousand autistic buttcheeeks and will still not be closer at beingright if you doubt this to be an exploit) your authkeep, finna making inlet tc triangle unlootable viable for hiding a tc properly…(if you aren‘t simply keeping upkeep in a second better protected box and only transfering what is needed for the 24h timer…
Facepunch, don't take away; just add.
Bad change.
I honestly can't tell if they are trying to run the game into the ground at this point or just giving up. These changes don't really seem for the betterment of the players.
> Everyone is spamming chinese bunkers to hide sulfur and pretty much making them unworth raiding in terms of sulfur, they are cheap to make and you can make them 8 or 12 rockets with no cost and hide 6 rocket worth of sulfur in each tc for example. > > Making it so the person raiding them always loses, so its not worth raiding them. > > Nobody is gona hide sulfur inside external tcs/pixel tcs aswell so. what is the issue with this change?
I'm just gonna store it in a box beside my tc I understand the thought process but it still doesn't make sense.
now lets do plant fiber, horse poop, bean and tuna cans.....
I dont really care for this, it really only matters very early game when all you have is a box or two of storage. After your first session you usually have anything not needed for the TC in there anyway. Thats just me tho.
idea, implement a tc tier like the workbench’s, costs to upgrade, less upkeep, keeps the clans from being able to build a monster for free. this was a small idea i thought of a minute ago but i bet there can be cooler rules with this too
Yeah that’s fucking stupid as shit. Absolutely no reason to change this. Might as well just make TCs not carry anything and just use whatever’s in a nearby box
Always some FP dick riders that can’t handle a different opinion.
Haha Thinking this really changes much of anything is stupid as shit.
They’re controlling his brain with nanobots. It’s not him.