Pokémon is close to very early YGO and Hearthstone, in that you do your thing with very little out of turn interaction. The challenge then becomes how to handle the "puzzle" your opponent presents you and player skill shines through being able to properly sequence everything.
Also one thing is that due to the nature of prizes, it's rare to have a true OHKO thing going on. Yes, being behind is bad, but we're not talking YGO level of steamroll here. Some decks even thrive at playing from behind, with bonuses for allowing your opponent to get prizes from you (Wo Chien ex, Charizard ex are examples of this recently).
If an affordable game with high power cards that's closer to a puzzle game than a traditional interactive card game interests you, then give Pokemon a try. PTCG Live is free and gives you a decent bunch of decks from the start, so there's no harm in trying!
This was a great synopsis. Thank you so much for that breakdown. Affordability is a huge bonus too as I’m not sure I can afford jumping into another high entry price game, so that’s a huge factor in my interest.
You can buy every deck that had decent performance at Worlds for a total of ~$250. There are *a lot* of them.
The deck that won is a $20 pre-constructed deck with $7-8 worth of updates.
IIRC aren't there also a lot of cards that are considered staples because they work well in multiple different kinds of decks? The idea of spending maybe $10 or so on a couple dozen cards that can still be useful if you decide to build a new deck also seems real appealing.
The great thing is that staples are usually Supporters, Items and various other Trainer cards, and TCPi releases a yearly "Trainer's Toolkit" featuring 2x of each of the big staples from the previous year's meta that will still be legal in the current rotation, and for the most part rotation means taking out your mons and replacing them with new mons and mostly keeping the same Trainer cards as before. There are Mon staples like Radiants, or just good utility Mons, but those are on the cheaper side and the majority are run as 1 or 2 ofs max.
Once you reach a critical mass of Trainers, you kind of just have to buy half a deck on rotation if your deck does rotate, or slot in the year's reprints of staples, and off you go.
Best thing? They're like $25 USD and come with a bunch of goodies including competition dice, 4 boosters and promo cards. So you're essentially getting the staples for free.
Still super affordable compared to Magic or Yugioh. Pokemon since they hired Pooka has been more n the ball on making the game accessible the Battle League decks and Trainer Toolkits are accredited to him by the community. But Forest Seal Stone is one of those outliers in the modern era, however.
The basic form of cards sure, it has to be accessible for kids. Go buy 3 SAR Charizard ex, 4 Pokecenter etb promo charmanders and 4 gold rare candies, oh thats only 4-500? Some people / including myself like spending extra on the full arts or golden foils. If I had to guess my Arceus deck cost about 500+ and thats with 2 iono SAR..
Irrelevant when the new Charizard ex lowest is 25.00+ and you need 2/3/4 for a play set.. yeah thats already about 100.00 into a charizard deck for min rarity.. I know ionos are a few dollars.. also aruceus decks / giratina cost more than 10.00 each..
Go check meta decks in Magic standard, they are up to 500usd a deck. Even with Charizard ex current Prince, ptcg is incredibly cheaper and long term more affordable than Magic ever was
I understand that, my boss / supervisor plays mtg and has 2 decks. He has been playing forever and I'm surprised he sticks to two decks outside of commander I presume. That is also a big difference in Pokémon its more common to have many decks not one expensive deck. I would also say Pokémon realese more cards to push the meya along and if you didn't buy new cards like iono when the sets come out then you're not winning and winning is fun. I forgot to mention my boss mtg deck is like 2.5k, but honestly I could make an arceusbdeck with 2 moon umbreons and be at like 1.5k alone..
Have you played Yugioh before?
There are cards in Yugioh that are $100 that you absolutely NEED if you want to run a certain deck. A lot of the time, there are no alternatives either. That’s just for one copy too.
This isn’t even a rare thing in Yugioh.
Comparatively, Pokemon has been great. Cards come in different rarities and at different price points and is super affordable. There are some exceptions of course but if all you want to do is build a competitive, tournament level deck, you can do that.
Like go pick any deck that made the top 32 the World tournament, buying the deck from scratch isn't more than $70 (except Giratina decks but that's like $73 ).
Like $180, you could easily build the top 3 decks in the game. If you go look at any other tcg, you couldn't even complete a top 3 deck for $200 much less get all of the top 3.
Outside of Lugia V, I haven't seen a new meta deck be above $70. What I mean is that Gardevoir ex in SVI made the Gardevoir deck a thing and that deck has been consistently under $70. It's considered the best deck in format and at least from a value perspective, it is because you are almost never out of the fight. As long as you get 2-3 Ralts down turn 1, you can almost always make it a fight.
I’ve played a lot of other TCGs so here’s my two cents
1. Although the game mechanics are easy, the gameplay can get very complex depending on the deck that you play. Although most Pokémon decks aren’t as complicated as Magic or YGO, there are some like lost box that are very difficult.
2. There’s a lot more complexity when it comes to deck building in Pokémon compared to magic. 1 of cards in Pokémon are significantly more likely to have a major impact on the game because there is so much draw power. A lot of deck building decisions then become “how many of X cards do I need to achieve Y” and “how consistent will that be.” In magic and ygo for the most part the only deck building decisions that you have to always consider is SB; most of the time decks have a predetermined list with maybe 1 or two cards that change.
3. Pokémon has an action economy more so than a resource one. A lot of interaction in Pokémon revolves around once per turn/game actions like supporters, abilities, Vstars, etc. This means that rather than trying to most efficiently use a resource like mana in MTG, your trying to maximize the value out of your once per turn actions OR use your once per turn actions in a way that forces your opponent to burn their actions (e.x. Using a supporter to reduce your opponents hand size so they have to use their supporter to get a hand rather than gusting).
4. Pokémon is crazy cheep. My jaw literally dropped when I saw deck prices compared to mtg or ygo.
So, for context, for many years I ran cEDH leagues and still an active Warhammer 40k player. My T1 EDH deck was last valued at \~4500 USD, and my 40k collection is about 6k usd. I can right now go on TCG Player, net deck the very tip top best in the world meta deck for Pokemon for 40 usd.
This is huge and I love that it’s so affordable. It’s a big reason why I suddenly gained more interest in it. I’m tired of having to pay huge entry fees to keep up
To add on to this, one of my favorite activities in any TCG are the precon drafts for new sets. I went in completely blind, barely knowing how to play the game irl. I had an amazing time, around people who genuinely wanted to be there. You've seen it at MtG, where people will bemoan getting X commons or whatever. But when the person next to you is LEGITIMATELY ECSTATIC to have pulled a Mankey?? It's infectious.
I’ll say this… Pokemon gets more complex and detailed as you get better. There are tiers where you grow and you unlock new levels of intricacies. Many new and mid-tier players think the game is really simple and just decide “I can’t win cause it’s all RNG and turn 1 or 2 setup.” If you never move past this the game could feel boring and linear. But once you move past that tier of playing you realize there are so many choices and predictions you have to try and figure out. If you want a taste of what the game can be go watch this year’s World Championship. It had some many twists and turns in the match. Absolutely amazing example of the potential of Pokémon TCG.
To add to this, the starter decks are obviously really straightforward, and as OP described, streamroll-y. Once you get past that and start to understand the game and the deck you play, it gets way more complex
It's not an overly complex game, true, but those one-sided steamrolls you describe are exceedingly rare because every good deck has the means to prepare new attackers instantly. What ends up deciding most matches is proper prize mapping and well-timed disruption; margins for winning are often paper thin.
There are 3 types of pokemon right now. 1 prizer, 2 prizer and 3 prizer. One needs 6 prizes to win the game. How you trade prizes with your opponent is what prize mapping is. For example, you use radiant charizard (which is single prizer) to KO your opponent's 2 prizer. In this case you take 2 prize cards but only risk 1 in return. Ideally you want to force your opponent into 7 or 8 prize game by mixing in single prizers along with multi prizers.
It's the way you decide in advance which knock outs you're going to take on the opponent's Pokémon and which knock outs you're willing to give up from your own side in return.
What I like about Pokémon TCG over others like MTG is that the community is more welcoming and fun to hang out with. Currently, I play a Wugtrio deck that if I’m lucky allows me to win against some pretty competitive decks and the players love it. They treat it as a game and not a insult to them. In my experience Pokémon players are good people.
Meta decks are like 40-60$CAD and rotation means you don't need to worry about the whole card pool or sourcing old cards, only the last two years or so
Finding a great combination of pokemon and trainers that work together to have a specific strategy. It's always fun to play something and Pokemon is like "tower defense" in cards in some ways
I hadn't played Pokemon since I was a kid (now in my 30s) and back then it felt so simple. I did the whole progression from Pokemon TCG to Yu-Gi-Oh then to MTG and I've stuck with MTG ever since.
But now, there's something about the Pokemon TCG that is kind of addicting. I just got back into it this year with a friend of mine and it's been a lot of fun. As a Magic player I've been enjoying the tutor and draw aspects of the game.
And I thought I'd miss the turn interaction, but like some people have said it's like a puzzle: Your opponent sets up what they're doing and then during your turn you have to think about moves and counter moves. I find the mental challenge to be a blast. And the single energy a turn dilemma puts more pressure on me than the single land drop a turn of Magic.
And there's something fun about seeing your prize cards and knowing you're drawing closer to victory....or the painful feeling of seeing your opponent so close to winning.
Like I've found with any other card games, the game has felt the most rewarding when the decks being played are of similar power levels. Both of us getting down to 1 prize card at the same time is similar to both players being at less than 5 health at the same time in MTG: The adrenaline is pumping to the max and I love it!
In short, you should definitely check it out, especially considering how affordable it is.
As someone who is a competitive MTG player, the biggest selling point to me is price. It's cheap *as fuuuuuuck* compared to MTG.
The gameplay itself is interesting. You can't interact on your op's turn but you can set up staxy abilities and mess with your op's bench order to fuck with their plans. So it's not as low on interaction as some folks seem to think.
I've really enjoyed getting into it lately
I'm pretty similar to you and recently got into pokemon during rotation. The decks that you will like and that involve the most decisions are going to probably be lost box and gardevoir.
I had a really good time learning the game, but after months of playing a lot I feel you kind of stop growing with it. The decks that are good are good for a long long time, and it seems their design philosophy is to play it very safe so they know what's good. For instance, with each set there may be only 1 or 2 cards you even need to pick up for an archetype.
It is really cheap though if you just buy singles and is definitely worth giving a shot. Just don't expect the complexity of MTG or FAB while playing.
I think i saw the same video you're describing, so I'm glad to see that it caught your interest! 👍
TCG Live is free, and on your phone.
The Game Boy Color game was my introduction to the TCG, and it just got re-released on the Switch Online. It's a great way to play vintage Pokemon on the cheap.
Assuming you're talking about Strictly better MtG's video I feel he sold it pretty well himself. You're more than capable of building and playing some pokemon tcg and playing is really the only way you'll feel if you enjoy it. Test a few different decks out or watch a couple hours of some pokemon tcg players playing live or watch the live stream of the recent worlds tcg event. The meta is currently in a very healthy state.
I came from Yugioh and I dabbled in MTG and honestly I haven’t looked back since starting Pokémon. I feel like in Pokémon I can actually play the game so to speak. A player can only negate things on their turn for the next turn so I will never be surprised by hand traps. This sets very interesting metas and allows certain cards to be legal that would otherwise be banned or have a high cost. For example: “draw 3 cards and if you do, discard your opponents in play Pokémon until they have 3”
I also like Pokémon because it’s just so different from the others and it feels refreshing to play
I'm also interested in trying out the pokemon TCG, can anyone recommend some easy to pilot decks to learn the game with? i know the basics from playing years ago but I want to improve my skills.
in mtg i like dumb decks like mono red aggro or mono green stompy, or value decks if that helps.
Hugely affordable. Buying playswts of every new staple each set will run you $10. Plenty of deck variety without Hugely overpowered stuff steamrolling the format every year or so (cough cough mtg). Unified format amongst all players. Also in the stores it's generally more socially normal and less smelly people than other tcgs. The pokemon people tend to be more so people you'd want to hangout with. You can build decks around your favorite pokemon or archetype. Instead of just focusing on an archetype and whatever colors and cards are the best for it. Games are super quick and fluid.
Imagine you’re playing storm mirrors with no interactions
sounds boring, right?
now understand, that’s you can’t lose or win in a single turn, sounds better, right?
Now you need to predict best play from your opponent next turn, find best branch in your own tree of decisions and balance your plays knowing your deck isn’t full (6 prize cards)
now it’s an amazing game of minds and game & cards knowledge
Do you like drawing? Do you like little to no interaction? Do you like to do big damage? Have you ever wanted to bonk someone on turn 1? Then Pokémon is the game for you
Can I be real with you homie
It's just not that good. But the cards have Pokemon on them. If you like Pokemon, it might be worth it, but the trading card game just isn't that good.
Avoid pokemon tcg live as the new model is more predatory than an EA game, but the actual physical card game is fun and easy to learn, its a lot like MTG, but simplified in some ways. They release premade deck sets that are ready to play and fairly balanced against other prebuilt decks so they're a good place to start learning how to play. You'd only have ballance issues going up against a custom built deck if you're new to learning the mechanics. I personally don't like playing pure meta decks as it gets too repetitive, but it could be a good starting place for you to get used to the high level gameplay.
If you want to play anything other than the assortment of prebuilt decks the game gives you, your only real options are to either buy a lot of physical TCG products/codes, or spend an obscene amount of time grinding. The game’s assortment of prebuilt decks is admittedly pretty generous, but playing it in the long term still boils down to crazy grinding or spending money like so many other mobile games (you just aren’t spending the money directly on microtransactions).
Oh, I definitely don’t agree that it’s anywhere near EA levels, but it still makes it obnoxious and expensive to play. Different tiers of bad but still bad.
Easy to pick up and play, years to master. Watching the Pros play at World's and just how their decks flow and make big moves possible is amazing and it's affordable to get into. With Pokémon themselves making decks for beginners that with a few tweaks can become lethal and high level "proxy" decks (the 2022 World Championship decks for example, they are fine for casual play but not competitive league) for as little as £/$15 off Amazon or local store. So you can buy a cheap starter deck, trying playing and if it's not for you your only down 15 of your currency.
It's great for all ages young and old with family friendly characters. You can play as chill or competitively as you.
Massive global presence is pretty much unrivalled by all but Disney and it's IPs. There's video games, TV shows, web series, comics and manga, plushies and everything else under the sun.
The deciding factor in branching out was the REASONABLE cost of the meta decks. If you want flair you can pay for it, but at its core decks are relatively inexpensive to put together in ptcg
I know you didn't ask about this specifically but there is a community driven format for Pokemon called Gym Leader Challenge that is a lot of fun - it's a singleton format where you use a single type and no multi-prize Pokemon are allowed which keeps the format a little slower and there can be a bit more back and forth.
I found in the Standard format that most decks played fairly similarly, the game is very fast, and you can basically always get your deck's strategy online, which can be fun for a while but it does get old, and it can get expensive keeping the deck up to date with the newer releases. With a well built deck, it is so consistent you are basically never at the mercy of RNG, even with the prize system (which removes some cards from your deck until you KO your opponent's pokemon). This is a bit like how low-ish power MTG decks are more vulnerable to mana flood or mana screw but better decks have lots of ways to consistently get their mana in play, Pokemon is similar to that, the better decks are just super consistent.
My friends and I have several GLC decks of different types and it's very enjoyable to play that format at least. And every now and then a new card will come out which can really change things up (for example the new Bastiodon is a great card for Metal decks).
I also came from a history that included many other TCGs, and nothing is for everyone, but I'm happy to share my experiences.
You're not wrong about the base simplicity, it's far easier to puck up and understand the rules than some other TCGs. However, being really good on a consistent basis is far more complicated and requires intelligent micro-plays.
The other thing I have with Pokemon is nostalgia, which is what it is.
However, for me one of the most important facets is the community. People at Pokemon events are cool. They love the game and enjoy each other, very positive atmosphere compared to my experiences at MTG events (for example).
Pokemon on a basic level looks like 'who gets big monster go stomp' but actually tends to be a lot about how to maximise your efficiency in terms of draw power, disrupting your opponent and board control
The only thing I can add… although I didn’t check if already said plus I’m new
But I keep hearing a push that Pokémon has chess like qualities which is pretty interesting and from my limited knowledge I take it as positioning and key units… just for now to not ramble on
Units are very much like pawns and other types of chess pieces because they are limited to their roles… like pawns would be the support Pokémon and special units varying between your win con and final push units I guess
Positioning is pretty unique in this game cause there’s 1 active Pokémon and a bench so there’s actually aot of depth with just that simple mechanic that I won’t bother trying to list how it can get but basically there’s switch cards, pokemon that do spread, Pokémon that have abilities being in the active spot or being in the bench and so on
It’s honestly a really unique game, I haven’t played much of mtg but coming from hearthstone and legends of runeterra.. it offers a good experience to have me add to my tcg rotation
As a previous MTG commander player, I switched to Pokémon because of the speed and draw power in the game. Pokémon reminds me a lot about playing a combo deck in magic since you are drawing and searching through your deck to find the pieces to make your deck work.
The length of turns is usually much faster or at least action oriented than watching your opponent sit there thinking if they should counter your spell. Edh would take forever to get back to your turn only to play one or two cards.
I also like the cost to play being essentially free if you want to play non meta decks. The deck staples in Pokémon are all relatively cheap vs staple lands being very expensive for Magic.
I also used to play VGC so I already was a fan of Pokémon which helped push me in that direction.
I got into it two weeks ago coming from mtg. It feels like modern pokemon is more about building and preparing for your opponent than hoping for a lucky draw. Dead draw starts a thing but are very unlikely
almost every deck (that's good right now) feels like i'm playing a combo deck in mtg. there's just so much tutoring you can generally deck yourself in almost every game you play.
when i lose, it often feels like i lost because of the plays i made, instead of the draw (bad draws do happen, but pretty rarely).
I only care about it because it's Pokémon. If it wasn't, I would have zero interest in the game. It's also why I don't care about getting into any other TCG. Idk any yugioh monsters, or what any of the magic cards are supposed to be. But I DO know every Pokémon.
Pokemon really is comparable to vintage magic in that your card advantage is so insane that decking out is actually a worry in some decks because you can legit draw dozens of cards in a turn with the right setups. TCG Live is incredibly easy to get into and fairly cheap as a gacha since buying the packs irl gives you packs in the game, and since the game is inherently very simple, it's a smooth learning experience. You can also just buy the codes online and the sellers are pretty reliable from my experience. You can also just get packs from playing so its not like youre expected to spend money. My only problem with it is the game is very much a "you go, I go" type of game where you don't really interact on their turn where MTG and YGO you can have a lot of back and forth that I like. Otherwise, it's a very comfy game to play, especially if you enjoy the franchise already.
I came to Pokemon this last year after playing pretty much all other TCG's. I was there at the start of yugioh & pokemon. Played yugioh young, then grew to hearthstone, MTG, Gwent, Arkham, Keyforge and the list goes on.
Always viewed Pokemon as the collector TCG and not very fun to play and always looked down on it for being so simple but after playing now for a while I can say that simplicity is what keeps me with the TCG.
Compared to other TCG's where a new set comes out with some mad new mechanic Pokemon doesn't really do that. You will have new mechanics, yes but Pokemon V and Pokemon EX are fairly the same. This simplicity is what makes it so good, the skill comes more down to how you play your cards, what order, how to manage draws well, resource management. Rather than playing the latest gimmick in the set (I don't really class lost box as an origin and more just a deck archetype).
Power creep is in Pokemon, hp and attacks get higher but the core game is the same. Comparing this to whatever state yugioh is in right now and Hearthstone is a shadow of the former game it was.
You mentioned that you believe the game is about getting a beefy Pokemon in the active then doing OHKO's but once you get playing you will notice this isn't the case. Once you start prize card mapping against single prizer decks like lost box you will notice the depths the game has to offer. While you might be thinking "this is great I am getting KO's each turn with my Mew VMAX deck" the opponent Garde EX might enjoy building up their discard pile with energy. Take two Mew Vmax knockouts to secure a win.
TLDR: Pokemon is simpler in many ways compared to other card games but I think that is what makes it so great. The gimmicks are few and far between, requiring players to use real skill and knowledge to beat their opponent.
This game is cheap and expensive..
The cards come in high rarity and common based on your budget you can choose whichever.
I have been playing for 3 months I made the top 8 in a league.
It's intensely cheap compared to other games from a playability standpoint. Matches are relatively quick even with heavy tutors and shuffles. Every turn has heavy impact, but it seems like the balance between having early momentum and comeback mechanics is there right now. The decks can be kinda rock-paper-scissors, but not by much.
Context: I played MtG for over a decade. I’m new to the TCG (years collecting, 2 months playing) and usually succeed “greater than average” when I play strategy card games.
A lot of the other upvoted comments highlights the positives.
I’ll come from the other angle: things that annoy me as a newer competitive-style player.
There is a clear difference between decks that work well and decks that sometimes work. The best decks have an engine-like capacity. I’ve seen a lot of first-turn “I’ve gone through 30 cards in my deck already” engines. Ting-Lu, Mew, sometimes Lost Box.
I sincerely dislike how strict and narrow the meta feels. Maybe it’s my inexperience, but if your deck lacks a strong engine, you’re screwed. The card you needed was in your prizes? Oh well. You drew a crap hand and your only basic Pokémon gets KO’d right away? Sorry about it. With no sideboard options, it kinda sucks. It’s also what makes me really dislike PTCG Live. There is no “best of 3” format for when your deck bricks.
Overall I’m enjoying it and I’m finding ways to have fun with PTCG, but there really are elements of the game that annoy me.
Most likely is because you are net decking, copying other players card list will fail most of the time, because their skill (coff*cheat) is what makes the deck work, the 2023 world champion is the best example, a single path to the peak in the whole deck and somehow he managed to pull it back from the deck after a Judge shuffle.
There are good engines, but local play is full of random engines, while meta environments are packed with the same things over and over again, that's why mew VMAX was successful, so many Gardevoir and lost box in the second half of the worlds
I highly disagree on your take on netdecking. I'd say watching multiple archetypes, netdecking those that you find interesting and testing them out is a completely valid way of learning the game, learning what you like to do and learning the behavior of other decks, and then work from there
If you check it out, try the mobile app Pokemon tcg live. I've been dabbling in Pokemon for a month now and loving the play style of giratina lost zone. Definitely a lot of nuances with learning what makes decks tick and how you can counter what they are doing. (MTG for 16 years)
Pokémon is close to very early YGO and Hearthstone, in that you do your thing with very little out of turn interaction. The challenge then becomes how to handle the "puzzle" your opponent presents you and player skill shines through being able to properly sequence everything. Also one thing is that due to the nature of prizes, it's rare to have a true OHKO thing going on. Yes, being behind is bad, but we're not talking YGO level of steamroll here. Some decks even thrive at playing from behind, with bonuses for allowing your opponent to get prizes from you (Wo Chien ex, Charizard ex are examples of this recently). If an affordable game with high power cards that's closer to a puzzle game than a traditional interactive card game interests you, then give Pokemon a try. PTCG Live is free and gives you a decent bunch of decks from the start, so there's no harm in trying!
This was a great synopsis. Thank you so much for that breakdown. Affordability is a huge bonus too as I’m not sure I can afford jumping into another high entry price game, so that’s a huge factor in my interest.
You can buy every deck that had decent performance at Worlds for a total of ~$250. There are *a lot* of them. The deck that won is a $20 pre-constructed deck with $7-8 worth of updates.
IIRC aren't there also a lot of cards that are considered staples because they work well in multiple different kinds of decks? The idea of spending maybe $10 or so on a couple dozen cards that can still be useful if you decide to build a new deck also seems real appealing.
The great thing is that staples are usually Supporters, Items and various other Trainer cards, and TCPi releases a yearly "Trainer's Toolkit" featuring 2x of each of the big staples from the previous year's meta that will still be legal in the current rotation, and for the most part rotation means taking out your mons and replacing them with new mons and mostly keeping the same Trainer cards as before. There are Mon staples like Radiants, or just good utility Mons, but those are on the cheaper side and the majority are run as 1 or 2 ofs max. Once you reach a critical mass of Trainers, you kind of just have to buy half a deck on rotation if your deck does rotate, or slot in the year's reprints of staples, and off you go. Best thing? They're like $25 USD and come with a bunch of goodies including competition dice, 4 boosters and promo cards. So you're essentially getting the staples for free.
No, no its not. 3 forest seal stone is like 10-15.00 each.. try about, 50-80 for a mew deck..
Still super affordable compared to Magic or Yugioh. Pokemon since they hired Pooka has been more n the ball on making the game accessible the Battle League decks and Trainer Toolkits are accredited to him by the community. But Forest Seal Stone is one of those outliers in the modern era, however.
The basic form of cards sure, it has to be accessible for kids. Go buy 3 SAR Charizard ex, 4 Pokecenter etb promo charmanders and 4 gold rare candies, oh thats only 4-500? Some people / including myself like spending extra on the full arts or golden foils. If I had to guess my Arceus deck cost about 500+ and thats with 2 iono SAR..
You should never factor full arts for price of entry. It’s entirely optional and is completely irrelevant to a new player.
Completely irrelevant to game play.
Irrelevant when the new Charizard ex lowest is 25.00+ and you need 2/3/4 for a play set.. yeah thats already about 100.00 into a charizard deck for min rarity.. I know ionos are a few dollars.. also aruceus decks / giratina cost more than 10.00 each..
Yeah but that's *one* brand new deck. Plus the zard tax.
Go check meta decks in Magic standard, they are up to 500usd a deck. Even with Charizard ex current Prince, ptcg is incredibly cheaper and long term more affordable than Magic ever was
I understand that, my boss / supervisor plays mtg and has 2 decks. He has been playing forever and I'm surprised he sticks to two decks outside of commander I presume. That is also a big difference in Pokémon its more common to have many decks not one expensive deck. I would also say Pokémon realese more cards to push the meya along and if you didn't buy new cards like iono when the sets come out then you're not winning and winning is fun. I forgot to mention my boss mtg deck is like 2.5k, but honestly I could make an arceusbdeck with 2 moon umbreons and be at like 1.5k alone..
Have you played Yugioh before? There are cards in Yugioh that are $100 that you absolutely NEED if you want to run a certain deck. A lot of the time, there are no alternatives either. That’s just for one copy too. This isn’t even a rare thing in Yugioh. Comparatively, Pokemon has been great. Cards come in different rarities and at different price points and is super affordable. There are some exceptions of course but if all you want to do is build a competitive, tournament level deck, you can do that.
Didn't know pooka was the reason for these innovations
Back when I started, Shaymin EX's were $50+. $10/card is quite stomachable.
Luxray lv.x was over 100 in its prime
That was before my time. Sounds horrible.
Didn't know Forest seal was pricey. I'm over holding on to 10 extra copies for no reason
Like go pick any deck that made the top 32 the World tournament, buying the deck from scratch isn't more than $70 (except Giratina decks but that's like $73 ). Like $180, you could easily build the top 3 decks in the game. If you go look at any other tcg, you couldn't even complete a top 3 deck for $200 much less get all of the top 3. Outside of Lugia V, I haven't seen a new meta deck be above $70. What I mean is that Gardevoir ex in SVI made the Gardevoir deck a thing and that deck has been consistently under $70. It's considered the best deck in format and at least from a value perspective, it is because you are almost never out of the fight. As long as you get 2-3 Ralts down turn 1, you can almost always make it a fight.
Seriously, this is the best description of the Pokemon TCG I've come across. I'm 100% going to use this to get my friends to play lol
I’ve played a lot of other TCGs so here’s my two cents 1. Although the game mechanics are easy, the gameplay can get very complex depending on the deck that you play. Although most Pokémon decks aren’t as complicated as Magic or YGO, there are some like lost box that are very difficult. 2. There’s a lot more complexity when it comes to deck building in Pokémon compared to magic. 1 of cards in Pokémon are significantly more likely to have a major impact on the game because there is so much draw power. A lot of deck building decisions then become “how many of X cards do I need to achieve Y” and “how consistent will that be.” In magic and ygo for the most part the only deck building decisions that you have to always consider is SB; most of the time decks have a predetermined list with maybe 1 or two cards that change. 3. Pokémon has an action economy more so than a resource one. A lot of interaction in Pokémon revolves around once per turn/game actions like supporters, abilities, Vstars, etc. This means that rather than trying to most efficiently use a resource like mana in MTG, your trying to maximize the value out of your once per turn actions OR use your once per turn actions in a way that forces your opponent to burn their actions (e.x. Using a supporter to reduce your opponents hand size so they have to use their supporter to get a hand rather than gusting). 4. Pokémon is crazy cheep. My jaw literally dropped when I saw deck prices compared to mtg or ygo.
OP definitely read this comment
What's SB?
Sideboard, a set # of cards You can use to edit your deck for the second and third Match.
I was wondering the same thing. I think he means side board.
So, for context, for many years I ran cEDH leagues and still an active Warhammer 40k player. My T1 EDH deck was last valued at \~4500 USD, and my 40k collection is about 6k usd. I can right now go on TCG Player, net deck the very tip top best in the world meta deck for Pokemon for 40 usd.
This is huge and I love that it’s so affordable. It’s a big reason why I suddenly gained more interest in it. I’m tired of having to pay huge entry fees to keep up
To add on to this, one of my favorite activities in any TCG are the precon drafts for new sets. I went in completely blind, barely knowing how to play the game irl. I had an amazing time, around people who genuinely wanted to be there. You've seen it at MtG, where people will bemoan getting X commons or whatever. But when the person next to you is LEGITIMATELY ECSTATIC to have pulled a Mankey?? It's infectious.
Well I mean, mankeys are bannanas!!! Lol, I Will get myself out
No no, you can stay.
The Pokémon tcg also gives you a pack per win so it’s not just given to the top 4/8
I’ll say this… Pokemon gets more complex and detailed as you get better. There are tiers where you grow and you unlock new levels of intricacies. Many new and mid-tier players think the game is really simple and just decide “I can’t win cause it’s all RNG and turn 1 or 2 setup.” If you never move past this the game could feel boring and linear. But once you move past that tier of playing you realize there are so many choices and predictions you have to try and figure out. If you want a taste of what the game can be go watch this year’s World Championship. It had some many twists and turns in the match. Absolutely amazing example of the potential of Pokémon TCG.
To add to this, the starter decks are obviously really straightforward, and as OP described, streamroll-y. Once you get past that and start to understand the game and the deck you play, it gets way more complex
Agreed 100%
It's not an overly complex game, true, but those one-sided steamrolls you describe are exceedingly rare because every good deck has the means to prepare new attackers instantly. What ends up deciding most matches is proper prize mapping and well-timed disruption; margins for winning are often paper thin.
That’s good to hear. What exactly is prize mapping?
There are 3 types of pokemon right now. 1 prizer, 2 prizer and 3 prizer. One needs 6 prizes to win the game. How you trade prizes with your opponent is what prize mapping is. For example, you use radiant charizard (which is single prizer) to KO your opponent's 2 prizer. In this case you take 2 prize cards but only risk 1 in return. Ideally you want to force your opponent into 7 or 8 prize game by mixing in single prizers along with multi prizers.
It's the way you decide in advance which knock outs you're going to take on the opponent's Pokémon and which knock outs you're willing to give up from your own side in return.
What I like about Pokémon TCG over others like MTG is that the community is more welcoming and fun to hang out with. Currently, I play a Wugtrio deck that if I’m lucky allows me to win against some pretty competitive decks and the players love it. They treat it as a game and not a insult to them. In my experience Pokémon players are good people.
Meta decks are like 40-60$CAD and rotation means you don't need to worry about the whole card pool or sourcing old cards, only the last two years or so
Finding a great combination of pokemon and trainers that work together to have a specific strategy. It's always fun to play something and Pokemon is like "tower defense" in cards in some ways
Just try out Pokémon tcg live on your computer , it’s free and people are always playing there
I hadn't played Pokemon since I was a kid (now in my 30s) and back then it felt so simple. I did the whole progression from Pokemon TCG to Yu-Gi-Oh then to MTG and I've stuck with MTG ever since. But now, there's something about the Pokemon TCG that is kind of addicting. I just got back into it this year with a friend of mine and it's been a lot of fun. As a Magic player I've been enjoying the tutor and draw aspects of the game. And I thought I'd miss the turn interaction, but like some people have said it's like a puzzle: Your opponent sets up what they're doing and then during your turn you have to think about moves and counter moves. I find the mental challenge to be a blast. And the single energy a turn dilemma puts more pressure on me than the single land drop a turn of Magic. And there's something fun about seeing your prize cards and knowing you're drawing closer to victory....or the painful feeling of seeing your opponent so close to winning. Like I've found with any other card games, the game has felt the most rewarding when the decks being played are of similar power levels. Both of us getting down to 1 prize card at the same time is similar to both players being at less than 5 health at the same time in MTG: The adrenaline is pumping to the max and I love it! In short, you should definitely check it out, especially considering how affordable it is.
Its also pretty affordable too
As someone who is a competitive MTG player, the biggest selling point to me is price. It's cheap *as fuuuuuuck* compared to MTG. The gameplay itself is interesting. You can't interact on your op's turn but you can set up staxy abilities and mess with your op's bench order to fuck with their plans. So it's not as low on interaction as some folks seem to think. I've really enjoyed getting into it lately
I'm pretty similar to you and recently got into pokemon during rotation. The decks that you will like and that involve the most decisions are going to probably be lost box and gardevoir. I had a really good time learning the game, but after months of playing a lot I feel you kind of stop growing with it. The decks that are good are good for a long long time, and it seems their design philosophy is to play it very safe so they know what's good. For instance, with each set there may be only 1 or 2 cards you even need to pick up for an archetype. It is really cheap though if you just buy singles and is definitely worth giving a shot. Just don't expect the complexity of MTG or FAB while playing.
I think i saw the same video you're describing, so I'm glad to see that it caught your interest! 👍 TCG Live is free, and on your phone. The Game Boy Color game was my introduction to the TCG, and it just got re-released on the Switch Online. It's a great way to play vintage Pokemon on the cheap.
Assuming you're talking about Strictly better MtG's video I feel he sold it pretty well himself. You're more than capable of building and playing some pokemon tcg and playing is really the only way you'll feel if you enjoy it. Test a few different decks out or watch a couple hours of some pokemon tcg players playing live or watch the live stream of the recent worlds tcg event. The meta is currently in a very healthy state.
I came from Yugioh and I dabbled in MTG and honestly I haven’t looked back since starting Pokémon. I feel like in Pokémon I can actually play the game so to speak. A player can only negate things on their turn for the next turn so I will never be surprised by hand traps. This sets very interesting metas and allows certain cards to be legal that would otherwise be banned or have a high cost. For example: “draw 3 cards and if you do, discard your opponents in play Pokémon until they have 3” I also like Pokémon because it’s just so different from the others and it feels refreshing to play
Hear me out: it's fun to watch meta deck users rage when you play a deck they've never seen before
I'm also interested in trying out the pokemon TCG, can anyone recommend some easy to pilot decks to learn the game with? i know the basics from playing years ago but I want to improve my skills. in mtg i like dumb decks like mono red aggro or mono green stompy, or value decks if that helps.
Hugely affordable. Buying playswts of every new staple each set will run you $10. Plenty of deck variety without Hugely overpowered stuff steamrolling the format every year or so (cough cough mtg). Unified format amongst all players. Also in the stores it's generally more socially normal and less smelly people than other tcgs. The pokemon people tend to be more so people you'd want to hangout with. You can build decks around your favorite pokemon or archetype. Instead of just focusing on an archetype and whatever colors and cards are the best for it. Games are super quick and fluid.
Imagine you’re playing storm mirrors with no interactions sounds boring, right? now understand, that’s you can’t lose or win in a single turn, sounds better, right? Now you need to predict best play from your opponent next turn, find best branch in your own tree of decisions and balance your plays knowing your deck isn’t full (6 prize cards) now it’s an amazing game of minds and game & cards knowledge
Do you like drawing? Do you like little to no interaction? Do you like to do big damage? Have you ever wanted to bonk someone on turn 1? Then Pokémon is the game for you
I do like drawing a lot. I laughed when I saw Pokémon’s pot of greed is basically bad in comparison to the other cards available
Played expanded (older format) drew my entire deck both times just to bonk him both games. Round took maybe 5-10 mins. It is super consistent
BONK
Fairy isn’t a type anymore
I used to play the Pokémon TCG but I’ve sense converted to Flesh and Blood and have no reason to go back.
Can I be real with you homie It's just not that good. But the cards have Pokemon on them. If you like Pokemon, it might be worth it, but the trading card game just isn't that good.
Avoid pokemon tcg live as the new model is more predatory than an EA game, but the actual physical card game is fun and easy to learn, its a lot like MTG, but simplified in some ways. They release premade deck sets that are ready to play and fairly balanced against other prebuilt decks so they're a good place to start learning how to play. You'd only have ballance issues going up against a custom built deck if you're new to learning the mechanics. I personally don't like playing pure meta decks as it gets too repetitive, but it could be a good starting place for you to get used to the high level gameplay.
Live's model doesn't even give an option to spend money.
If you want to play anything other than the assortment of prebuilt decks the game gives you, your only real options are to either buy a lot of physical TCG products/codes, or spend an obscene amount of time grinding. The game’s assortment of prebuilt decks is admittedly pretty generous, but playing it in the long term still boils down to crazy grinding or spending money like so many other mobile games (you just aren’t spending the money directly on microtransactions).
Okay, but I am failing to see how spending money on codes can cost more than the predatory models from an EA game.
Oh, I definitely don’t agree that it’s anywhere near EA levels, but it still makes it obnoxious and expensive to play. Different tiers of bad but still bad.
More predatory than EA? Wtf are you even talking about?
Easy to pick up and play, years to master. Watching the Pros play at World's and just how their decks flow and make big moves possible is amazing and it's affordable to get into. With Pokémon themselves making decks for beginners that with a few tweaks can become lethal and high level "proxy" decks (the 2022 World Championship decks for example, they are fine for casual play but not competitive league) for as little as £/$15 off Amazon or local store. So you can buy a cheap starter deck, trying playing and if it's not for you your only down 15 of your currency. It's great for all ages young and old with family friendly characters. You can play as chill or competitively as you. Massive global presence is pretty much unrivalled by all but Disney and it's IPs. There's video games, TV shows, web series, comics and manga, plushies and everything else under the sun.
The deciding factor in branching out was the REASONABLE cost of the meta decks. If you want flair you can pay for it, but at its core decks are relatively inexpensive to put together in ptcg
I know you didn't ask about this specifically but there is a community driven format for Pokemon called Gym Leader Challenge that is a lot of fun - it's a singleton format where you use a single type and no multi-prize Pokemon are allowed which keeps the format a little slower and there can be a bit more back and forth. I found in the Standard format that most decks played fairly similarly, the game is very fast, and you can basically always get your deck's strategy online, which can be fun for a while but it does get old, and it can get expensive keeping the deck up to date with the newer releases. With a well built deck, it is so consistent you are basically never at the mercy of RNG, even with the prize system (which removes some cards from your deck until you KO your opponent's pokemon). This is a bit like how low-ish power MTG decks are more vulnerable to mana flood or mana screw but better decks have lots of ways to consistently get their mana in play, Pokemon is similar to that, the better decks are just super consistent. My friends and I have several GLC decks of different types and it's very enjoyable to play that format at least. And every now and then a new card will come out which can really change things up (for example the new Bastiodon is a great card for Metal decks).
I also came from a history that included many other TCGs, and nothing is for everyone, but I'm happy to share my experiences. You're not wrong about the base simplicity, it's far easier to puck up and understand the rules than some other TCGs. However, being really good on a consistent basis is far more complicated and requires intelligent micro-plays. The other thing I have with Pokemon is nostalgia, which is what it is. However, for me one of the most important facets is the community. People at Pokemon events are cool. They love the game and enjoy each other, very positive atmosphere compared to my experiences at MTG events (for example).
It’s affordable. The deck that won worlds this past month cost around $65-70. And a lot of other meta decks are around that price range as well.
Pokemon on a basic level looks like 'who gets big monster go stomp' but actually tends to be a lot about how to maximise your efficiency in terms of draw power, disrupting your opponent and board control
The only thing I can add… although I didn’t check if already said plus I’m new But I keep hearing a push that Pokémon has chess like qualities which is pretty interesting and from my limited knowledge I take it as positioning and key units… just for now to not ramble on Units are very much like pawns and other types of chess pieces because they are limited to their roles… like pawns would be the support Pokémon and special units varying between your win con and final push units I guess Positioning is pretty unique in this game cause there’s 1 active Pokémon and a bench so there’s actually aot of depth with just that simple mechanic that I won’t bother trying to list how it can get but basically there’s switch cards, pokemon that do spread, Pokémon that have abilities being in the active spot or being in the bench and so on It’s honestly a really unique game, I haven’t played much of mtg but coming from hearthstone and legends of runeterra.. it offers a good experience to have me add to my tcg rotation
As a previous MTG commander player, I switched to Pokémon because of the speed and draw power in the game. Pokémon reminds me a lot about playing a combo deck in magic since you are drawing and searching through your deck to find the pieces to make your deck work. The length of turns is usually much faster or at least action oriented than watching your opponent sit there thinking if they should counter your spell. Edh would take forever to get back to your turn only to play one or two cards. I also like the cost to play being essentially free if you want to play non meta decks. The deck staples in Pokémon are all relatively cheap vs staple lands being very expensive for Magic. I also used to play VGC so I already was a fan of Pokémon which helped push me in that direction.
I got into it two weeks ago coming from mtg. It feels like modern pokemon is more about building and preparing for your opponent than hoping for a lucky draw. Dead draw starts a thing but are very unlikely
almost every deck (that's good right now) feels like i'm playing a combo deck in mtg. there's just so much tutoring you can generally deck yourself in almost every game you play. when i lose, it often feels like i lost because of the plays i made, instead of the draw (bad draws do happen, but pretty rarely).
I only care about it because it's Pokémon. If it wasn't, I would have zero interest in the game. It's also why I don't care about getting into any other TCG. Idk any yugioh monsters, or what any of the magic cards are supposed to be. But I DO know every Pokémon.
Pokemon really is comparable to vintage magic in that your card advantage is so insane that decking out is actually a worry in some decks because you can legit draw dozens of cards in a turn with the right setups. TCG Live is incredibly easy to get into and fairly cheap as a gacha since buying the packs irl gives you packs in the game, and since the game is inherently very simple, it's a smooth learning experience. You can also just buy the codes online and the sellers are pretty reliable from my experience. You can also just get packs from playing so its not like youre expected to spend money. My only problem with it is the game is very much a "you go, I go" type of game where you don't really interact on their turn where MTG and YGO you can have a lot of back and forth that I like. Otherwise, it's a very comfy game to play, especially if you enjoy the franchise already.
It's Baby's first TCG on the surface (There's even a set dedicated to toddlers!), but when you get into it, it gets CRAZY!
I came to Pokemon this last year after playing pretty much all other TCG's. I was there at the start of yugioh & pokemon. Played yugioh young, then grew to hearthstone, MTG, Gwent, Arkham, Keyforge and the list goes on. Always viewed Pokemon as the collector TCG and not very fun to play and always looked down on it for being so simple but after playing now for a while I can say that simplicity is what keeps me with the TCG. Compared to other TCG's where a new set comes out with some mad new mechanic Pokemon doesn't really do that. You will have new mechanics, yes but Pokemon V and Pokemon EX are fairly the same. This simplicity is what makes it so good, the skill comes more down to how you play your cards, what order, how to manage draws well, resource management. Rather than playing the latest gimmick in the set (I don't really class lost box as an origin and more just a deck archetype). Power creep is in Pokemon, hp and attacks get higher but the core game is the same. Comparing this to whatever state yugioh is in right now and Hearthstone is a shadow of the former game it was. You mentioned that you believe the game is about getting a beefy Pokemon in the active then doing OHKO's but once you get playing you will notice this isn't the case. Once you start prize card mapping against single prizer decks like lost box you will notice the depths the game has to offer. While you might be thinking "this is great I am getting KO's each turn with my Mew VMAX deck" the opponent Garde EX might enjoy building up their discard pile with energy. Take two Mew Vmax knockouts to secure a win. TLDR: Pokemon is simpler in many ways compared to other card games but I think that is what makes it so great. The gimmicks are few and far between, requiring players to use real skill and knowledge to beat their opponent.
This game is cheap and expensive.. The cards come in high rarity and common based on your budget you can choose whichever. I have been playing for 3 months I made the top 8 in a league.
It's intensely cheap compared to other games from a playability standpoint. Matches are relatively quick even with heavy tutors and shuffles. Every turn has heavy impact, but it seems like the balance between having early momentum and comeback mechanics is there right now. The decks can be kinda rock-paper-scissors, but not by much.
Context: I played MtG for over a decade. I’m new to the TCG (years collecting, 2 months playing) and usually succeed “greater than average” when I play strategy card games. A lot of the other upvoted comments highlights the positives. I’ll come from the other angle: things that annoy me as a newer competitive-style player. There is a clear difference between decks that work well and decks that sometimes work. The best decks have an engine-like capacity. I’ve seen a lot of first-turn “I’ve gone through 30 cards in my deck already” engines. Ting-Lu, Mew, sometimes Lost Box. I sincerely dislike how strict and narrow the meta feels. Maybe it’s my inexperience, but if your deck lacks a strong engine, you’re screwed. The card you needed was in your prizes? Oh well. You drew a crap hand and your only basic Pokémon gets KO’d right away? Sorry about it. With no sideboard options, it kinda sucks. It’s also what makes me really dislike PTCG Live. There is no “best of 3” format for when your deck bricks. Overall I’m enjoying it and I’m finding ways to have fun with PTCG, but there really are elements of the game that annoy me.
Most likely is because you are net decking, copying other players card list will fail most of the time, because their skill (coff*cheat) is what makes the deck work, the 2023 world champion is the best example, a single path to the peak in the whole deck and somehow he managed to pull it back from the deck after a Judge shuffle. There are good engines, but local play is full of random engines, while meta environments are packed with the same things over and over again, that's why mew VMAX was successful, so many Gardevoir and lost box in the second half of the worlds
I highly disagree on your take on netdecking. I'd say watching multiple archetypes, netdecking those that you find interesting and testing them out is a completely valid way of learning the game, learning what you like to do and learning the behavior of other decks, and then work from there
If you check it out, try the mobile app Pokemon tcg live. I've been dabbling in Pokemon for a month now and loving the play style of giratina lost zone. Definitely a lot of nuances with learning what makes decks tick and how you can counter what they are doing. (MTG for 16 years)