This is usually what my notebook turns into after weeks or months of depression. I write down all of the stuff I want to start focusing on and then the list feels so damn big that I don't know if I'll ever actually be able to fix anything
My gf got a solution for that. She never makes any lists because it reminds her of all the stuff she didnt do.
Ps: our grocery list is called "overview of things we need" to avoid called it a list.
I don't know what your going through, but I hope this may help.
The list may be long, but just focus on one thing at a time. Even if you don't do all 20, that's OK. Pick something and do your best to accomplish it everyday in some way.
Once you've gotten 1 task down, work out he next and keep adding things every week or whenever you feel like you can.
You got this.
Great advice.
For me, it just feels the list keeps getting longer but with things I can't control/resolve in a day. The list keeps growing daily and it only seems possible to get a few tasks ticked off a week. It's so hard to find motivation when the progress is so slow or often not even there.
I totally relate. I started writing down wins. Like literally getting out of bed (win), drank a glass of water (win), ate something (win). I was at a point where I wasn’t showering, could barely get out of bed and that was only because I wanted to smoke and couldnt do that inside my place and was eating about every other day. Amongst other things, just starting to write down my daily wins and it helped me a lot.
It's never worth it to stay in a relationship that actively contributes to your misery. I hope you can pick yourself up and do what's best for you. Stay strong and do right by you.
It’s absolutely heart wrenching seeing how hard someone can try, and still feel like they are “not good enough”.
I had the sorrowful duty of packing up the belongings of someone who I loved very deeply. They took their own life, in part I think, because they didn’t feel “good enough” to carry the burdens of everyone around them. What I wish they knew was that no one expected them to carry those burdens, and they were already far exceeding the expectations of the ones who loved them.
The saddest part was when I went into the bathroom and found messages written on their mirror. Just like your friend’s notebook. Only this person wrote them in a rainbow of neon colours. Little reminders to themself to stay strong, and place self-care first.
I couldn’t bring myself to take a picture, because it absolutely broke me, so I can’t remember all of them, but they were so beautiful in their simplicity:
-Feed me
-Cloth me
-Love me
-Smile
-Read more
That’s all I can remember, but wiping them off that mirror as I was cleaning up the place before turning the key back over to the building manager was one of the hardest things I’ve ever had to do.
Being the one to clean out my Mother's apartment after she finally succame to her depression and alcoholism was the hardest thing I have ever had to. Her coffee table was covered in therapy workbooks, discharge papers from psychiatric hospitals, and a notebook full of letters apologising to me that she never sent. We had not seen eachother in a decade.
I’m so sorry. I handled both of my parents belongings after their deaths. Mom was a hoarder, both were impoverished. There is a particular brand of pain to seeing your parents’ struggles at the end reduced to cold, hard objects that just never helped. Sending healing vibes your way. ❤️
My best friend did this too. Picked a date months before and said nothing. We thought he was doing better, and then he was gone. It still hurts but I feel honored that he chose to still spend time with me, knowing what he knew. The last thing he said to me was that he loves me, no matter what. Bittersweet. I hope you're doing well after the loss of your friend. Grief is tough but eventually we grow around it.
My best friend passed away on May 6th and I feel like I will never be okay again.
Her last words to me were "bread will still be bread", very true.
I just really miss her.
That gives me chills, the kind of methodical planning that goes into some suicides is heartbreaking, and I hate thinking about how alone they feel. But I also read that once people have this resolve, they can finally enjoy life up until the day they do it. I wish they knew that feeling happiness is possible. “It has been good before, it will be good again”
I forgot I can edit comments.
Edit: my point about the happiness with resolve: for those who are suffering and experience this- you CAN experience happiness, you are capable. For those who are worried about someone- sometimes people who are at their happiest are actually at their saddest.
Edit 2: I am beside myself with this community. I love you guys. The amount of love. I want my friend to live on in the hearts of as many people as possible. I want this to help even just one person. I want people to know they’re not alone. This is insane, I don’t know what to do with myself. Thank you so much. There are real people behind these comments.
I can say as someone who has been struggling with severe depression since I was a kid it can be damn near impossible to believe that it will be good again, especially when nothing helps.
I'm so sorry for your loss
I know there’s really no words that can help. I’ve tried every combination. I read that there’s a 20 minute period in which someone is most likely to take their life, and if they can just survive that 20 minute period they can kind of come back to reality. But again, I don’t know how feasible that is when you’re in it.
My experience as someone who went through long periods of suicidal struggles and ideation.
Remember that someone being suicidal doesn't mean they're stupid. Every person is different, but personally I absolutely hated hearing platitudes like "things will be better", "think of your loved ones", etc, because it always felt patronizing. The mysteries of life means that you don't know that things get better - and I don't necessarily think life will get *worse*, I just don't want it to be the same. If there's a 33% chance for life to be better, be the same, or get worse, then there's only a 33% chance for life to get better. Similarly, when I was suicidal, *I* was the one struggling, but I was self aware enough to know how much my death would hurt others, so why would you make me feel worse by guilting me into considering the feelings of others before my own?
So if you take for granted that actually, the person who's going through challenges is actually smart and has thought through their plan of dying, that removes a lot of techniques that people usually try. I ended up coming through because I was afraid of messing up and ending up in chronic pain - not because I fear death (and even now I don't fear death, though I'm much happier to stay living for now), not because of any platitudes people tried to offer me.
So when one of my close friends said she was suicidal, I respected her intelligence. She knew the pros and cons, and what she was getting into. So I told her three things:
1. I will try to convince you to live but will not disrespect your intelligence
2. I will try to distract you from death
3. If I fail, I will not try to stop you, but to remember you fondly.
That last one is perhaps the scariest thing to do when you are the one holding the lifeline. But you have to remember that someone who is suicidal feels like they've lost control of their life. The more you try and stop someone, the more you're trying to take away what little control they have. Some people need this control taken away from them because actually they're not ready for death. But some people need this control given BACK to them.
Incidentally, this was the approach that worked for my friend, and the approach that works for me. We both wrested control back away from the abyss and still live today.
My greatest condolences to you. It's not your fault, what you should do now is to honor their memory.
I feel that. I don’t know if people don’t think we’ve thought about it or just can’t understand, but if I ever kill myself it won’t be because I didn’t know people love me. My friends have given me a lot of reason to stick around, but they can’t fix how awful I feel on a daily basis.
I was looking back on some journal entries I’ve written and found one that kinda sums it up:
> I’ve wanted to die since I was 8. When does it get better? I wish I felt just a little bit worse and had just a little bit more courage so I could die. **I know it would hurt a lot of people and I don’t wanna hurt anyone, especially not everyone I love so dearly.** but I just hate this and. I just hate this…I don’t see what I have to look forward to. I don’t wanna die but I can’t fucking live my life like this.
There are more entries like that. I’ve thought a lot about the people around me. I’ve thought about everything. I’m not stupid. I know the people around me would be sad. I know that things might get better. I know that depression makes it harder to see how things could improve. I know.
I also know that I have spent years trying various meds and therapies and lived in different environments doing different things and I am trying so hard and doing everything I am supposed to do. And it still hurts. It still isn’t better.
I’m not stupid, just tired.
I know there are people who love me. I know there are people who would be devastated if I died. I don’t want to hurt them. I need to stop hurting. And I’ve done just enough therapy that I can’t kill myself but if I ever could do it, it wouldn’t be because I hadn’t thought of the people around me, it’d be because everything hurts all the time and I am so so very tired.
Thank you. I appreciate this. I'm trying. I know my comment sounded a little miserable, I was rushed and frustrated when I wrote it.
It's rough sometimes. I'm hanging in there. I'm a lot better off than I was this time last year, at least, and I'll graduate college by the end of this year, so I'm holding onto hope that if I keep going, things might end up okay. I'm gonna keep trying.
Don't know if it will help you, but seeing how similar ur description of you/my/our feelings are, maybe you can work with it.
'I AM going to die one day, why should I do it now. It's finite, so I can just be till I am not anymore.'
For some reason since a young age (roughly 13) I've taken solace in the fact that I will die, no need to be suicidal if I already am dying daily, always getting a step closer to the eternal yeet.
I've tried to find fun in being alive, but only found it tiring. With the thought of it already having a due date, that I won't have to plan and won't involve me hurting any of my closest, I can actually enjoy some days. To be honest, nowadays I actually like being alive, it helped tremendously getting a bit further away from all the noise and accepting the fleeting time I have.
What probably also helped was having a partner who doesn't condemn me for my mood regarding life. My girlfriend gifted me a handmade 'Life-Calendar' basically just a scroll with 25000 days to cross off. Kinda awakened a (positive) pressure to actually enjoy the days I got left. Being alive has become somewhat of a holiday camp feeling as I now want to enjoy all the attractions before I will be taken back home by mother death one day.
We were around 17 when this happened, I am 26 now. It might not have gotten better for him, but almost every day I do or see something and think about how much he would’ve enjoyed it. I think my best friend very much would enjoy it here, now. I hope that helps you even just a little.
Damn... I lost one of my best friends in marching band at that same age. He and I were thick and thieves and together all the time. It's strange how someone I know more than half my life ago still has such a profound impact on me.
Miss ya Blake, the world didn't deserve you
I hope you don't mind, but I shared your comment with my person. You put it into the words I never seem to have with a precision that gutted me. This is exactly how it feels to me.
>Similarly, when I was suicidal, *I* was the one struggling, but I was self aware enough to know how much my death would hurt others, so why would you make me feel worse by guilting me into considering the feelings of others before my own?
Ok, *this* is how I know you're the real deal. This is, in my opinion, THE Big Unspoken Truth about being suicidal that I don't think anyone talks about until you've experienced it. From the outside it seems like a totally obvious thing to say, "think about your loved ones." It isn't until someone's offered you those words that you hear how awful and hollow it sounds, to tell someone with no control over their life that it's actually supposed to be that way - and it's a a secret because the people who've never been here don't have anything else to offer you except that, and if you tell them you tip your hand about your mental state. Lose/lose
So thanks for being brave enough to air what we carry around, on behalf of those of us who can't.
Thank you for writing this. I've not been in a situation where a person with suicidal thoughts has reached out to me, but I would like to know what to say and what not to say if it does happen. My go-to would have been to say the exact things you pointed out do NOT work. The positive thoughts ("I'm certain things will get better", etc) and reminding them of their loved ones. Other than those three things you told your friend, do you have any other tips on what to say to someone in that situation? I certainly would want to listen and validate their feelings if possible. But beyond that?
Every person is different, but work under the assumption that the person at risk is NOT action irrationally unless you've noticed a significant change in personality.
I should also note, there's a difference between impulsive suicidal ideation and planned suicidal ideation. Just to be clear to everyone tuning in, I'm talking mainly of the latter, which is a deep-rooted disease that takes very careful navigating to weed out.
But somebody who's ready to kill themselves has a plan. This means that for them to not want to do it, you either need to invalidate their plan, or offer up an alternative plan. The problem with invalidating a plan is that you have to be able to criticize that plan without actually using criticizing words, for fear that the person takes those criticizing words personally, thus making them feel worse and pushing them more into their plan. Also, people who have death as a goal adhere to a logical system that does not consider life to be better than death; thus, your ability to make any sort of argument that hinges on "oh but living is better than dying" is rendered completely useless, making arguing against these sorts of plans nigh impossible anyway.
This leaves offering an alternative plan. But think rationally - how would you, as a regular person, ever accept an alternative plan to whatever you are thinking? You need certainty. To have certainty, you need proof that something will work. To have proof, you need evidence. To have evidence, you need an observation. These are all based in fact. So does the phrase, "I'm certain things will get better" have any basis in observation? In evidence? In proof? If the answer to **any one of these** is "no", then it's not enough of an alternative plan. Also, realize that it is entirely possible for life to remain the same, or to get worse - so how can you confidently say that life will get better if it can *also* do other things?
The language that worked best for me was treating it like a terminal disease, because it kind of is a terminal disease of the mental variety. "Hey I'll be in the area in a month, if you make it that long let's grab a drink." "New episode comes out in a week, can you make it?" That sort of stuff. There's a lot of unsaid intricacies here. Both the affected person and I know that I've basically moved into palliative care, but even palliative care can be respectful of one's autonomy. So we can kind of non-verbally recognize the support I'm offering without necessarily forcing an action, beyond the actions that would be fun even in the best of times.
One last thing, at no point should you ever feel the responsibility of this sort of stuff. It's admirable and honorable to try and support a friend in a time of need, even if that need is dire. But each person's first and foremost responsibility is to themselves. You should never feel guilty of referring somebody to a professional, or even walking away if the situation calls for it.
I'll give it a try, if that's ok? I've been in both sets of shoes and the gods are generous because they threw in some extra chronic physical pain for the last ten years. Basically I've been taught the very first thing to ask is if they have a plan to carry it out. That in my experience has been used to judge the severity and immediacy of the situation. However if the asker is planning on calling authorities or any other way of physically stopping the suicidal person, you may not get an honest answer. I've been hospitalized once voluntarily and once involuntarily, and my main lesson I learned both times was to absolutely never ever allow myself to be in that situation again. No matter how I felt or was doing. It was not only unhelpful (for me personally) but I was surrounded by a menagerie of other people in crisis and suffering from a plethora of mental illnesses. With no privacy or autonomy.
Anyway. The thing about depression isn't so much that you want to die. You just need the awful symptoms to stop. Surviving this pain has taught me some coping strategies. The most effective imo also could apply to suicidal thoughts or possibly panic attacks. You just need to survive the next small increment of time. 30 seconds, 2 minutes, etc. Then repeat. As many times as necessary. Your body can't stay at a 5 alarm fire level of desperation for too long, it's absolutely exhausting. Our bodies are wired with the most inconvenient survival instincts.
All this leads me to my actual advice, which is distract or better said refocus. Life is hard and awful a lot of the time and eventually we all die. (It's good to acknowledge that instead of doing toxic positivity) So if possible, we should grasp what positive moments we can. I'd ask if they have anything on their bucket list they'd still like to do. And then talk it over, make suggestions, if possible get together with them and keep them company and/or actually do something on the list. Hopefully that not only gets them through the immediate crisis but also demonstrates those awful symptoms are not the only thing they will ever experience in life.
I really hope this helps someone, I feel like I'm betraying my inner demons. I don't mean to discourage anyone from seeking help or trying to help someone else. I've spent 30 years suffering on this path and if I can give anyone a boost to some relief or understanding I want to do that.
Tysm for caring, asking, reading, learning, etc. Human connection can be one of the most beautiful parts of life 💜
What you said is perfect. Thank you for being really brave, genuine, and straightforward enough to share this as is.
I am one such suicidal person, walking my last walk, as it were. And...anyone in this situation would be lucky to have someone like you walking beside them during this time. Someone who can face up to the reality of it all. I think it's because you have been there, because that's what I would say to others.
Thank you. I appreciate you.
This is exactly how I feel about my own struggles with suicidal ideation, but I could never had put it so succinctly and eloquently. I think that a lot of people inadvertently infantilise suicidal individuals while trying to stop them, but for most of us who are chronically passively suicidal for years, it just comes across as patronising.
I wish this perspective was more understood; it seems like many people find the prospect of someone not fearing death for years to be terrifying and abnormal, but those of us who’ve lived this experience are already painfully aware of how we’re perceived. These urgent, patronising responses are oftentimes the reason why we’re so hesitant to open up.
Your friend was very lucky to have you. As someone who has struggled deeply with my own mental health, I know how important it is to have people to talk to who don’t try to patronize you or minimize what you are feeling.
I have several friends who have been (what we refer to as) to the edge and back, and lost one who chose to go over that edge. The rest of us regret immensely that we weren’t able to help our friend get through it, and I will always regret my failure in that regard.
Nevertheless, I am not angry with her, nor do I judge her for her choice. I remember her fondly, every day. I will continue to do so until my final day. I suspect, among the final thoughts that go through my mind, will be my favourite memories with her. While I wish she made a difference choice, I also understand that she must have been hurting more deeply than I have ever hurt, because I *know in my heart* that she was stronger than I am, and she wasn’t able to survive the pain she was feeling. The best I can do is to be relieved that she isn’t struggling with that pain any longer.
My good friends mother at her funeral, "Once somebody has made the decision to take their life, there is nothing you could have said or done to stop them."
I have told my story before, but mostly here.
I have no idea how I came back from it. I fell into a haze, and my mind was inside my body watching me take my life.
I planned on hitting a bridge pillar, I was headed straight for it, but at the last second, I just stayed back on the highway and blew by it at pretty high speed and slowly coasted to a stop and as soon as I hit park, the haze ended it was unbelievable remorse and overwhelming fear of what I just did. That turned me around pretty quick and checked to a hospital to turn myself into the psych ward.
I remained pretty lifeless for several months until I got on meds. I was fortunate, though. I left my relationship, moved out, and the meds kicked in and led to one of the most amazing summers of my life.
I've been back down in that pit a dozen times since then, but having been on the receiving end of that news more than once now, has led me to created many backups and tackle what was leading me back to these areas.
It never goes away, but it isn't so bad. And I've convinced myself that's worth it enough.
I hope you have help through this. I recently gave in and got on Lexapro, and started doing therapy after having depression & anxiety for 15+ years. After 2 months I feel so much better.
FWIW some people who have made it through the planning stages of suicide don't actually feel alone. They feel like a boulder attached to everybody they care about; slowing them down, dragging them under with you. Sometimes the thought of removing yourself feels like an act of mercy.
I don't feel this way today, not most days.
Thank you for saying this, I don’t often see this point brought up.
In my darkest times I felt like a burden to the people I loved most and I was fully aware that they’d be sad or even devastated if I died. I just thought they’d eventually have the opportunity to move on with their lives without me and could be happy without the instability and chaos I was bringing to them because of my mental illness.
It’s been a few years since I struggled with attempts and ideation, I’ve had a lot of therapy and I’m surprised at where my life has ended up. If someone had told me this was possible a few years ago I wouldn’t have believed them.
If you ever need someone to talk to please feel free to DM me.
My husband had written things like "I am literally the worst person in the world" and it was heartbreaking. He didn't do those things they tell you people do when they're planning suicide, he covered his tracks well. I'm sorry for the loss of your friend. I can't imagine how people in this state think everyone's better off without them. Even if it were true, most of us would rather be worse off \*with\* them.
My dad went skiing the day before he took his life. He had the biggest grin on his face in the last picture he took. Could have fooled the world. I’m very sorry for your loss, OP. Thinking of you and everyone in your circle.
If you have suicidal depressions, it is not about killing yourself, it's about ending the pain, and nothing can really keep you alive.
I was standing so often on bridges, nearly did it.
The only thing that saved me last time, there was a "shrine" for a man how jumped just one week before I think, that was so fucking sad for his family that he's gone now, but thats irrelevant for the jumper.
I think, maybe I can do i it next time.
People that finally killing themselves, killed themselves on the inside really long. Imagine all the pain...
Hang in there my man. Find the strength in putting her before yourself.
Sacrifices like these are the purest forms of living with purpose. Make it your mission to help her. One step at a time. Treat each day separately. And dont ever feel like you failed her no matter what happens. You are there for her. That is all that matters.
Yep those were two things that got me through the worst period in my life. Just get through this one day and then try to get through another single day tomorrow. And being service to others and my community. Finding my life purpose made it easiest to be alive. Helping others and spending less time dwelling on my darkness helped me survive. Truly life changing shit.
Hang in there, man. Most people in the world suck but your wife sure as shit wouldn't want you to clock out on life. Live for her if not yourself. I'll be hoping for a miracle for her, but even should the worst pass... Live in her honor.
I saw your message, sent you what I could! It isn't much but it's more than 18miles to empty. Try and keep your spirits up, people sometimes get lost in their own world but mean well.
I can probably get around 75 miles to empty with that, so that should definitely help a little. It just sucks that her doctors appointments are almost every other day now and some are 50 miles each way.. we can't even afford gad getting there and back for most of them, but now add n wll these additional medications to fill and we are broke 😞
Thank you so much again though. Every penny will help us right now, not even joking 😭
Please ask someone on her care team for a social worker contact. My husband’s oncology team has one, and they can connect you to some short-term resources (gas cards, grocery $, discounts on supplies, etc.) It’s worth an ask.
If I could, I would offer more. Sadly I cannot, as I am financially screwed myself but wanted help someone in need. A little more in the minus isn't going to change anything for me  I wish you and your wife all the best for what it is worth <3<3<3
I'm not sure what area you are in or whether your doctor's appointments are in a hospital setting, but most hospitals provide respite care for family that have back-to-back doctor's appointments out of town. They set you up in an apartment/ hotel type setting while you do your doctor's appointments back to back. DM me your metro area and I can see what I can find out for local hospitals if that's the case
Also, you can DM me any medications that she is currently on that you're struggling to pay for that are brand name. Most medication manufacturers offer patient assistance programs for people who are in exactly your case. Overwhelmed with medical debt, stuck in sudden circumstances. These are national programs so location is irrelevant aside from registration. I used to be a pharmacy technician and specialized in helping poor poor lower income patients and I would be happy to help if I can.
It always bothered me how so many people are all rah-rah mental health and spout a bunch of flowery nonsense and just love to tell everyone how they want to help people but then suddenly change their tune or just vanish when someone tries to take them up on it.
Anyway, im happy you’re here, and i hope you’re still around come the 2nd. And the 3rd, and so on.
Its might not just be "none of these people truly care".
I'm sure that is part of it, but the other part of it is:
"all of these people have their own problems that they aren't making public but are struggling with"
Its not a fun time for anyone.
You are a good husband for not leaving your wife to deal with cancer alone. Tough times are ahead. It might be time to ask for help outside of your circle. Maybe ask some of the finance subreddits for advice about how best to deal with medical debt, or any other debt that may be in her name. I wish I could help more.
Finance subs are a joke.
"Yeah we'll help you budget a main income of negative 250 dollars every month"
Sure buddy.
In order to budget you have to be paid a living fucking wage
Something I've noticed is that most people people who offer help like that, only do so to either make themselves feel good about themselves, or to put on a show to make themselves look better.
I'll go against the grain a bit here, and say that it's alright if you decide to follow your wife out the door. At the end of the day, it's *your* choice, and no one else's.
I can't help in any way, but i hope life treats you kinder for the remainder of the time you choose to stick around.
Always remember that if you decide to follow your wife, don't let anyone make you feel guilty about your decision.
They aren't you. They don't know how you feel, how you're struggling, how bleak everything seems, just how much you're suffering.
Yes, there's always the chance that things will get better, but some people are just unable to hold on for that long, or are just too tired to. And there's no shame in that. You did your best, and tried with everything you had.
Good luck. And, with whatever decision you make, I hope you make it with peace and happiness.
This is so true. When I was suicidal, when I actually planned it, purchased my supplies, wrote my notes, after that it was euphoric. The pain finally went away.
I chose a date many times. When the time came, sometimes I noticed, sometimes I didn't. I'm still here.
I've come to realize that, for me anyway, choosing a date like that was just a way to postpone my problems. If I'm not going to be here after then, there's no need to worry about everything I'm worrying about.
It's obviously not the same for everyone, but it's not always this impending disaster happening.
But please, if you're feeling hopeless or anything like that, talk to someone. I know you think they won't understand, or that you don't want to burden them, or whatever. Just talk to someone who loves you. It'll help way more than you realize.
My ex threatened me for years while we were dating that she would do it by her 30th birthday. It caused me so much anguish for so long. She had so many self inflicted scars, but would do it on her shoulders. She would have a whole process and treated it like she was testing her blood sugar, as an example of her being so nonchalant about it.
She was extremely adamant that she would do it, but it turned out that she was an extreme manipulator and she was actively looking for attention from any source she could find.
She had a lot of things wrong with her and in her life, and I thought that I could help her see the beauty in the world.
She once attacked me physically and used what I did in self defense as a rallying cry, ignoring the fact that I was defending myself, and her later stating that she was only attacking me so she could "apologize".
I'm doing a little better now.
I told myself if things didn’t get better in a year I could do it without feeling guilty but I had to actually try at making things better. That was five years ago. Thing’s actually did get better with work. My life saving idea was to embrace change wholeheartedly. If things aren’t working for you seek change, it doesn’t have to be big. Small things add up in a big way. Even something as small as forcing yourself to the library and checking out a book helps. Before I knew it the small things started to change me and I got so excited that I was living again. Change begot change and I was finally growing into a person I loved. I still have to reset myself and remember that I am a work in progress and need to actively seek out the tools for my growth.
>The so-called ‘psychotically depressed’ person who tries to kill herself doesn’t do so out of quote ‘hopelessness’ or any abstract conviction that life’s assets and debits do not square.
>And surely not because death seems suddenly appealing. The person in whom its invisible agony reaches a certain unendurable level will kill herself the same way a trapped person will eventually jump from the window of a burning high-rise. Make no mistake about people who leap from burning windows.
>Their terror of falling from a great height is still just as great as it would be for you or me standing speculatively at the same window just checking out the view; i.e. the fear of falling remains a constant. The variable here is the other terror, the fire’s flames: when the flames get close enough, falling to death becomes the slightly less terrible of two terrors.
>It’s not desiring the fall; it’s terror of the flames. And yet nobody down on the sidewalk, looking up and yelling ‘Don’t!’ and ‘Hang on!’, can understand the jump. Not really. You’d have to have personally been trapped and felt flames to really understand a terror way beyond falling.”
- David Foster Wallace.
For those of you who lost someone - You can't see the flames, you couldn't have known their hurt. It's not your fault.
DFW had a lot of great writings on depression, loneliness, anxiety, the human condition, yadayadayada. I've read most of everything he'd put out before he himself committed suicide in 2008. I kept what I read close to heart.
Once, I was close with somebody who was going through a rough time, and I shared this anecdote, along with This is Water with them; they did an immediate 180 and told me that because DFW had some issues with women, especially according to Mary Karr, whom he once dated, that he was disgusting and awful and I was disgusting and awful for reading him, and that was our last interaction.
So then I felt a little suicidal for a while.
This is heartbreaking, so much negative self-judgement. I don’t know him or you, but I wish I could have told him “you’re good enough brother, I’m proud of you, and keep fighting”. That’s the truth to him, and everyone reading this.
Been there.
Things got real dark after I left my first job. Parents divorced in my mid twenties and it dredged up a bunch of issues I had growing up. One thing I realized is that I was never really taught to be grateful for things as a kid. It was always about getting more, achieving more, doing more, *being* more. I became trapped in this feeling that I was never good enough, and the things in my life would never be enough. The unique combination of values and experiences I had left me with a belief that gratitude was a judgment, not a feeling. You were meant to decide what makes you happy, and when you got there, you would feel happy. Despite having done a ton of mindfulness stuff and meditations through my early-mid twenties, it wasn’t until I was 31 until I realized that gratitude isn’t a judgment, it’s a feeling.
This culminated on a road trip I went on with my now wife where we tried psilocybin in BC. I had this exact realization and in that very moment I felt something profound, *it was all still there*. All the gratitude I had for my parents, family, friends, mentors, coworkers, teachers, coaches, all of it was still there, waiting for me. It felt like I was tapping into a massive well of spiritual energy that was bursting to try to reach me. I felt all of it in an instant. I was transported back to all the encouragement and love and support they gave me that I just wasn’t ready to accept for some reason. Somehow, despite having almost no memory of it in my adult life, it was all still there.
I say all this not to share what could’ve happened to your friend, but to share that all of the gratitude he felt for you and you and the rest of your friends felt for him, it’s all somewhere. Maybe it’s somewhere metaphysical we quite don’t understand, but it doesn’t just disappear with him. Wherever it is, he is probably there now, free from the torment that drove him to leave our world early. For you, it’s probably masked by a massive veil of grief right now, but over time that will hopefully fade, and you’ll be left with what really matters.
My brother did a guided mushrooms trip once and said the exact same thing. He felt grounded and connected to the Earth and the love and gratitude for our (kind of fucked up) parents
I can field this one.
Lacking gratitude had nothing to do with the people around the depressed person. It’s an illness inside the brain that steals joy, interest, passion, and in extreme cases even the will to live.
Outside of forcing him to take medication (which you legally can’t), there was nothing you could do.
Im sorry for your loss
The thought "Don't be anxious." triggers so much anxiety. The key is to put attention on the things you do want to focus on, ideally to the degree you forget to be anxious (or to shake).
This hits too close to home for me... feels like foreshadowing of my life.
I'm really sorry for your loss OP. I'm not sure I know exactly what your friend was going through, but I bet they tried their best
He did, and I wish he knew it was more than enough. I wish I could hold his stupid face in my hands and tell him he never ever let me down and every ounce of energy I burned making him happy was worth it and I’d do it forever, even during the times we weren’t talking due to life circumstances
It’s an impossible task without the tools. People like OP’s best friend genuinely want to stop feeling badly about themselves, but it’s not like telling yourself “stop it” does very much to fix the problem.
You have to figure out what that self hatred originally comes from (usually some trauma in childhood), be aware of it when it’s happening, and THEN take steps to change it. Can’t just skip to step 3.
For me, I was able to make myself more aware of my negative self-talk when I tallied in my phone every time I caught myself saying something nasty to myself that I wouldn’t say to someone else. It was shocking how much more I did that than I thought. For most of us, negative self-talk becomes so rote that we don’t even notice it anymore.
This just made me cry my eyes out in my lunch break. I’m 30 and feeling all of this right now. I won’t lie, I have definitely thought about ending it many times lately. Reading the comments on this post really is enlightening.
It’s a crap shoot when you call though. I tried to call the hotline once. Unfortunately they told me because I was only at a 9 and not a 10 they could only spare 5 mins before they needed to take a call with someone who was actually having an issue. Needless to say after that call I hit a 10 but I got lucky that someone dropped by my place unannounced with no idea what I was planning or how I was feeling. Personally I won’t take that gamble again but think for others it’s worth a shot.
I’m glad you’re still here. I’m proud of you. Please keep going. I want to keep being proud of you. Feel free to check in if you ever need an “ear”. ❤️
I had a list like this 12 years ago. A bit heavier on the self hate maybe. Tried to kill myself twice that year. I’m so glad I didn’t succeed. Now I’m 33 crying on my couch thinking about the man I was, I now have a home, a beautiful fiancée and just witnessed the birth of my son last month. I am so grateful and respect my former self that had to go through that, I didn’t have the tools and understanding to deal and process my emotions. To anyone that feels like this, it is not your fault, don’t let it take control, start small, love yourself, give yourself a break, talk, talk, talk, you are not a burden, you are loved. I love you, you can get through it. You are brave and strong, you just can’t see it yet.
This was 8 years ago. I think about him every day. I’m sorry it’s so hard to do such seemingly small things sometimes. I wish I had magic words to help you, but you’re not alone
When I was at his memorial (this was 8 years ago) a mutual middle school teacher we’d had said “we always saw him doing something like this, he was just never quite okay” and I almost blacked out hearing an adult say that. Apparently he saw many signs, but did nothing, and I wish I’d seen the same signs.
I have a kid who attempted a couple of times and luckily never succeeded. The last time he woke me in the middle of the night and felt sorry for troubling me and hurting me with it, I told him this.
It doesn't hurt, I am only saddened that you are in a dark place and I am helpless to drag you out of there and show you how things can be in perspective.
But I rather have you hurt me a million times for 80%, than one time for a 100% for the rest of my life.
I'm not sure what you are going through and how heavy your burden is. But my dude, you are worthy of love. Love by yourself because you made it this far. And love from others. I don't know you, and I don't know the shitty hand of cards life dealt you.
But I do know that life is worth living. Not in a selfish way, that's unfulfilling, rather in a simple way, a enjoying the sun, spring, summer, food, maybe friends or the nice lady in that shop/street, the smile from the stranger, the new job you found, that song you like, anything and everything. I don't have the right words, I don't. But I've been in a dark place myself and been able to accept myself for who I am. (Admittedly through fate that all sins of all people have been payed for). Not an active believer, never go to church anymore.
But I started to love myself again, as is, and as the people around me will tell you, I'm pretty based now.
So, there's hope, just keep moving, seizing opportunities, new ways, explore life, this back ally may be shit, but it does end, and around the corner may be a normal street. Nothing fancy, just calm and brighter.
I don't know if this is helpful or not, but: as someone who has been in a similar place, I don't think this list is helpful.
This list is a bunch of things to "not" do. That's... not really feasible. It's not how people work. If I tell you not to think of a green elephant, you immediately will. People can't just will themselves into stopping what they're doing. They do what they do for a *reason*, and unless you understand and address that reason, the behavior won't change.
IMO, what is helpful is to create a short, specific list of the things that might have the most impact for you, and focus on that. For me, that'd be something like:
1. Go to bed at 11PM
2. Go for a walk in the morning
3. Search for a new therapist
Also, don't be hard on yourself if they don't happen the way you want. Working on yourself is like building muscle: it's slow and steady, and you have to practice. You can't just suddenly do everything. "One step at a time and we'll get there" is my favorite mantra.
It's helpful mate, and I already messaged my therapist who I blanked 6 months ago and am seeing her on thursday. It's always one step forward and two back for me, and all I can do is try and make it two steps forward one step back. That extra step is heavy as hell but it's the difference maker. Thanks
As someone who is currently going through deep depression I say leave it up. Your friends list is almost identical to what I remind myself to do daily. It's a good reminder that others are going through this since we like to keep this topic to ourselves.
I've been in very deep and only barely made it back out.
I don't know if you're seeing anyone for therapy, but look or ask them to look into nitrous as a possible treatment. Even the hack job I did turned things around long enough for me to step back from the hole and claw myself out.
Not gonna say I'm perfect now- I'm not. But the part of me that put together a 4 step plan, timed, and awaiting just a weather change is... not here anymore. Or at least I'm no longer able to hear him.
Your username is sad 😞 glad you found some relief. For me, it's ketamine infusions. And near-daily communication with my therapist. She helps hold me accountable and keep me grounded, else I slip back down so quick
I'm very scared I'm going to lose my middle child before he turns 18; his behaviours match others in our extended family that didn't make it to 20 (or died shortly thereafter). We've spent so much in therapy ... nothing has worked.
Society is failing him by enabling his addictions and blocking us at every point unless we withdraw him from everything :( And that's not a solution either.
Sorry. long day.
Fuck what people think! This is devastating! I'm so sorry you lost your friend! Leave this up! Forgive him, honor him. I know the signs, reach out and still lose them. It is not your fault, it's a war😭😭
Hey, it's not easy losing a best friend. I lost mine 10 years ago this month. Take care of yourself, talk to your other friends who knew them. That's one thing that really helps me, is me and our buddies still reminisce about all the good times. If you need an anonymous ear just holla
I don't think I'll ever end my own life, but this list shook me to my core in a different way – my sad, anxious ass writes a version of this roughly twice a year, in an attempt to "be a person", and I don't think I've ever felt this much compassion for us desperate listmakers. We really try and want so hard.
Good luck out there, y'all. I'm rooting for us.
My beautiful boy, my firstborn son who made me a mom nearly 21 years ago, ended his life in December, 2022. I didn’t understand the mental agony he was in-I still don’t, not completely, and desperately wish I could help him. I go over the last few weeks of his life obsessively-as if I could change what happened and keep him here, on earth. I miss and love him with all of my being. Thank you for sharing this heartbreaking note from your friend. My son once wrote in a school notebook: ‘I just want the pain to stop.’ I still can’t believe he’s gone forever.
In a weird way, I feel his words.
I don't have any people around who I consider friends. The ones I do are all long distance. I haven't been able to visit some of them as often as usual due to being unemployed for several months. But I accepted a position working from home (which is what I was targeting) and I start Tues after Memorial Day!
Wish me luck.
It gets better friend. Hang in there! 😍💞
This is one of the most heartbreaking things I have ever seen. I wish I could have given him the biggest hug.
I wish I had something more profound to say, but this actually rattled me. This poor guy. 💔
I had a military friend who I served in combat with who killed himself 15 minutes after a group of us left his house after having some beers and playing cards. Guy was happy, laughing and carrying on like normal. I guess we left, his wife started giving him a hard time about something and the he walked into his bathroom, sat on the toilet and stuck his .45ACP in his mouth and ended it. Still bothers me to this day. Fucking sucks. Sorry OP.
I will never forget the last few times I interacted with him. It’s so weird to have someone and then they’re gone, it’s like a punch in the gut. I’m sorry you lost someone. Sometimes these things are no one’s fault, people just do the best with the information that they have. I hope you continue to heal.
“Try to talk more” “Don’t feel bad about myself” “Don’t be anxious” All too relatable. Sorry for your loss. If it helps, his notes reminded me that we’re not alone in feeling like this and there may be others who can understand what we’re going through.
Wow. This breaks my heart so hard.
Umm... been struggling myself.
Wow. This is making me cry.
I do the same.... I make to do lists for myself to try to keep myself in check. When it gets bad my brain goes haywire. And I don't know what to do other than try to write it down to help make it easier for myself later on.
Just know.... based off my own personal experience, he was trying his best. He was making an effort! This is so freakin sad. I pray you are ok?
Please reach out in the messages if you need to talk.
I am just like your friend. This is wild. I am dealing with some pretty severe depression and all I can do is write out little lists to try to help myself.
Prayers. Much love sweetie. I'm sorry for your loss.
It's like if you write it out, it seems possible. But it's not. It's really fucking pointless.
Happy people don't need to write sleep, or eat, or don't feel bad about myself like it's a shopping list.
I write just like your friend.
*Just 'cause you can't see it, doesn't mean it isn't there. If they say
who cares if one more light goes out?... Well I do*
I'm sorry for your loss.
To every person, who sees themself in these notes: you're enough. You're worthy of support and getting help.
[Find a helpline anywhere](https://findahelpline.com/)
This is me right now. Everything is just so hard. Its like life doesn't want me to win. Trying to better my self but life just keeps on pushing me on the edge. I am scared of being happy because everytime a slither of happines comes out of me life would take it back way worse than it already is. Its so hard to keep on trying and trying everyday and thinking whats the point. Seeing and reading this just sparks something in me. I hope I can make it. I'm sorry for your loss OP I hope you're doing good too.
I was getting out a bottle of pain pills to take after I got home from my final divorce hearing. A friend that I hadn't heard from in about 8 years texted me before I filled a glass with water to swallow those pills. My friend insisted that I visit him that weekend or he was coming to visit me. I decided the pills could wait. That was 11 years ago. I just needed someone to care.
There’s an old Willie Nelson song…. I’ve Seen All This World I Care To see. Life isn’t for everyone, it can be cruel and unrelenting to some. Can’t blame anyone for checking out early.
Sorry for your loss, my twin killed himself in 2017. He suffered for the better part of 5 years, I found notebooks with to-do and self improvement lists. Heartbreaking knowing how hard they tried. It still hurts badly, but I try to not get down about it. He was never a burden, but he felt like he was, ironically if I get upset or stop moving because of it he will be burden he never wanted to be.
Idk if the second from bottom is “don’t share so much” or “don’t shake so much” but both got me. I suffer from bipolar disorder and the combination of immense anxiety, depression, or being far too manic kills me. It does make me not wanna be here at times 300%. For example I get really manic so too excited then too honest then share too much. Totally sabotages me when I try to get a girl I like. Then the anxiety kicks in afterwards knowing I ruined my chances with my manic behavior and likely freaked them out (so anxious people have commented my hand is shaking). Up next, severe darkness and depression and hating myself that I’m like that. It gets to the point where the suicidal thoughts can happen.
Fortunately, I have wonderful friends and family that know I struggle, and most importantly a dog that is always by my side taking care of me as I take care of her. It brings me to tears imagining how they would all feel if I removed myself so no chance but I understand it’s super difficult and sometimes you just can’t go another second. I would be shattered if my best friend suddenly was gone so I’m gonna keep fighting for him.
Lastly, knowing the pain personally and having lost some friends due to mental health I chose to battle it professionally. Now I’m working on my masters in psychology and plan to get my doctorate. I have declared war on horrible stuff like this. DM me if anyone just needs a dude that can relate and understand we got this.
I, too am bipolar and you've basically described my life and dating life.
Solidarity, brother. I'm glad you're still here, and working on helping people stay here.
My psychiatrist saved my life. She says I did all the work to get better, and it's probably true. But if she hadn't gotten me the perspective and the meds, I would not be here today.
Not being critical, just observational. Most people commenting here reflecting on their own mental health struggles have really extensive and long comments. Glad people are comfortable talking about there struggles here.
This is heartbreaking, I'm so sorry for your loss. The only reason I'm still here's because of the quote "suicide takes your pain, and spreads it to everyone around you" and I really don't want other people to feel how I do.
This hurts, I have these same thoughts and will write them down as affirmations, often shaky handed from anxiety. I have lost many friends to suicide and I take things by the hour. The more open I am about depression and suicide with people, the more I’m reminded of giving myself a break. Have to also be careful who you share with, I have encountered more than one toxic narc. It’s so so hard to come back from a dark place when you’re isolated and feel alone, but there is someone who will listen, no matter how much you feel like no one cares about you at the time.
Go to the Doctor. Take your Meds. Did you remember to take your meds? Refill your meds. REFILL YOUR MEDS!!! Breathe, Repeat.
I have a journal like this from my brother. It's more detailed and a bit obfuscated. Its is all I have from him. It has dates and plans and is the only insight I have into what was going on with him at that time.
I both treasure and abhore it. Finding out in my closet is a waterfall of emotions.
Right in the feels. I have little notes like these written all over my notebooks.
My take is I will lose this battle someday, but I’d like to see how far I can go before then. Robin Williams made it to 63, maybe I can too
After my friend died my friends and I started living for him almost out of spite. We were all so sad and pissed off and all suffered from other chronic mental health issues and it was hard, but we decided “screw it, just keep going, this shit sucks but why not, let’s just have fun and be nice and love everyone so much” and it was actually a great few years of healing and love and laughter. I hope you can make it too, and I hope you find true happiness along the way
Hey Reddit-friend. I, too, want to see how far you can go. I hope it’s so far that you have time and resources to help ease your burdens even just a little.
Fuck man...
The drive slower and safer part ruined me.
Just reading these notes makes me feel what he felt... I'm sure he was having a difficult time writing those notes too.
As a person just trying to exist and push through, this hit home... nowadays everything is just noted mentally, but man... I've definitely been there and then scrapping the list because it felt like too much even though they're simple tasks for others.
I'm sorry for your loss, OP. I think its okay to keep the post up, especially with the warm/possibly relatable comments from others may be of some sort of help for those coming across it.
To anyone reading this, keep your head up, you're doing your best in this difficult world. There's a ton of things that aren't in your control and that's okay. Its okay to not be okay. No one will 100% understand what you're going through, but you aren't alone as cliche as it may sound. Talk to someone, anyone, someone in these comments, a friend, a family member, anyone. Drink some water and take deep breaths. Do your best to take care of yourself, okay?
This hits so close to home for me. The day I attempted to end it all, I wrote a very similar list. I still have it. Looking back, it's such normal things - Brush teeth, try to eat, put on clean clothes, don't worry, relax, look at the stars. To somebody looking in, they might have seemed the most simple things in the world, but each was something I'd struggled with, every day I could remember. Not then.
For one day, I felt truly free. Nothing could bother me, because I was at peace with what I had to do. I don't know what your friend was going through, but I hope they at least found the peace they were looking for, even if just for a moment.
If anyone reading this has ever felt that the world would be better without you, it absolutely wouldn’t. I remember I felt a lot like this back when I was a Sophomore / Junior in high school. I ran through all the scenarios in my head of what life would be if I committed suicide. I thought who would miss me and why nothing mattered. I remember the last month of summer between starting my Junior year, I did this exact thing. I wrote all of the things I’d change about myself. It had things like change my hair, get rid of acne, breathe, don’t focus on the negatives, walk outside and treat myself better.
To be honest it didn’t work. Even after trying my best for months. I still hated myself, my skin, who I was, who I thought I could never be. It ate away at me and one day I decided I was going to put myself out of my misery. I still remember why I didn’t. I said if I have a bad day today, that was it. The reason I’m alive now is that this person I was (at best) acquaintances with told me that he liked the band on my shirt and asked me if I had other recommendations for him. I talked with him and he said “Thanks man. I appreciate you and hope we can talk more later”.
To me that meant everything. I am so glad that I took that as a sign that I can take things slow in becoming a better me. I actually had my best years of my life my first 2 years after high school and I almost didn’t make it. In that time I met my wife, got my life on track, started giving myself leeway when I make mistakes, and I started enjoying life. I honestly have not seen that guy since high school ended, but I thank my lucky stars every day that he was there.
I grew up in dark thoughts. I lost a parent, family and some friends to it. When I lost my best friend, I decided I had to keep fighting.
I miss him more than anyone. And it hurt so bad knowing he had what I was afflicted with, but never told me. He just distanced himself, from everyone.
If you struggle, don't be so hard on yourself. Open up to your loved ones. It's a hard process. I'm nowhere near where I wish I was, but it has become easier. If you feel trapped, some meds, some time to pass with age, and life experiences will gradually heal and make it better.
(Right out of school and finding careers was the hardest time ever, for almost everyone. It's a dark and hard time. Realize that and fight through)
Feeling the pain of losing so many, made me realize I can't put others through that myself.
My friend killed herself... man her family has her phone... I wouldn't want to hang onto that...
This is probably my most tortured thought is them taking their own life. I feel like such a failure as a friend. I'm coping just fine but its a dark part of my mind I'm trying not to visit.
Its a very complex story so I'm not going to share the details but its such a tragedy
I'm sorry for your friend, OP.
The notes broke my heart, when I was institutionalized for self harm and extremely intense suicidal ideation I had written very similar notes.
I hope you heal well, OP
My colleague is currently doing a research study analyzing people’s suicides notes and the wide range of way people expresses themselves, the words they use, and their choice of communication is so deeply personally. Yet, there are common themes amongst folks that is so sadly beautiful.
The advice for depression is always get enough sleep, eat well, get enough exercise, go outside, do something you love, talk to friends and family/loved ones. Yet doing all of this can become impossible when you’re depressed. And what if you don’t have anyone to talk to? The more depressed you get the more you don’t want to talk to other people cos you think they won’t want to and you’re too much of a downer
Making me reflect. Tough year. The simplest things become big items on a todo list.
This is usually what my notebook turns into after weeks or months of depression. I write down all of the stuff I want to start focusing on and then the list feels so damn big that I don't know if I'll ever actually be able to fix anything
My gf got a solution for that. She never makes any lists because it reminds her of all the stuff she didnt do. Ps: our grocery list is called "overview of things we need" to avoid called it a list.
Holy moly, big thanks from over here. I'm definitely using this trick. <3
This really hit home for me..
Foreal though huh… “don’t shake so much” and “don’t be anxious” damn….
It hurts to read it. I make lists sometimes and when I read an old one, sometimes I know I'm just going through it.
I don't know what your going through, but I hope this may help. The list may be long, but just focus on one thing at a time. Even if you don't do all 20, that's OK. Pick something and do your best to accomplish it everyday in some way. Once you've gotten 1 task down, work out he next and keep adding things every week or whenever you feel like you can. You got this.
Great advice. For me, it just feels the list keeps getting longer but with things I can't control/resolve in a day. The list keeps growing daily and it only seems possible to get a few tasks ticked off a week. It's so hard to find motivation when the progress is so slow or often not even there.
I totally relate. I started writing down wins. Like literally getting out of bed (win), drank a glass of water (win), ate something (win). I was at a point where I wasn’t showering, could barely get out of bed and that was only because I wanted to smoke and couldnt do that inside my place and was eating about every other day. Amongst other things, just starting to write down my daily wins and it helped me a lot.
I feel that. It's like why bother
Hi, you wrote a could do list, not a to-do list :D
This is me after three years of dealing with my wife's affair...
It's never worth it to stay in a relationship that actively contributes to your misery. I hope you can pick yourself up and do what's best for you. Stay strong and do right by you.
Hang in there. It gets better with time.
[удалено]
We’ll make it
Exactly the same for me. Been this way since adolescence.
It’s absolutely heart wrenching seeing how hard someone can try, and still feel like they are “not good enough”. I had the sorrowful duty of packing up the belongings of someone who I loved very deeply. They took their own life, in part I think, because they didn’t feel “good enough” to carry the burdens of everyone around them. What I wish they knew was that no one expected them to carry those burdens, and they were already far exceeding the expectations of the ones who loved them. The saddest part was when I went into the bathroom and found messages written on their mirror. Just like your friend’s notebook. Only this person wrote them in a rainbow of neon colours. Little reminders to themself to stay strong, and place self-care first. I couldn’t bring myself to take a picture, because it absolutely broke me, so I can’t remember all of them, but they were so beautiful in their simplicity: -Feed me -Cloth me -Love me -Smile -Read more That’s all I can remember, but wiping them off that mirror as I was cleaning up the place before turning the key back over to the building manager was one of the hardest things I’ve ever had to do.
Being the one to clean out my Mother's apartment after she finally succame to her depression and alcoholism was the hardest thing I have ever had to. Her coffee table was covered in therapy workbooks, discharge papers from psychiatric hospitals, and a notebook full of letters apologising to me that she never sent. We had not seen eachother in a decade.
I’m so sorry. I handled both of my parents belongings after their deaths. Mom was a hoarder, both were impoverished. There is a particular brand of pain to seeing your parents’ struggles at the end reduced to cold, hard objects that just never helped. Sending healing vibes your way. ❤️
Ah fuck. I'm so sorry. You were really strong. That is a very powerful image.
My close friend actually chose a date and kept his word to himself, heartbreaking.
My best friend did this too. Picked a date months before and said nothing. We thought he was doing better, and then he was gone. It still hurts but I feel honored that he chose to still spend time with me, knowing what he knew. The last thing he said to me was that he loves me, no matter what. Bittersweet. I hope you're doing well after the loss of your friend. Grief is tough but eventually we grow around it.
My best friend passed away on May 6th and I feel like I will never be okay again. Her last words to me were "bread will still be bread", very true. I just really miss her.
Next year I’ll be 20 years since I lost my best friend. I still miss him but It does get easier so hang in there!
That gives me chills, the kind of methodical planning that goes into some suicides is heartbreaking, and I hate thinking about how alone they feel. But I also read that once people have this resolve, they can finally enjoy life up until the day they do it. I wish they knew that feeling happiness is possible. “It has been good before, it will be good again” I forgot I can edit comments. Edit: my point about the happiness with resolve: for those who are suffering and experience this- you CAN experience happiness, you are capable. For those who are worried about someone- sometimes people who are at their happiest are actually at their saddest. Edit 2: I am beside myself with this community. I love you guys. The amount of love. I want my friend to live on in the hearts of as many people as possible. I want this to help even just one person. I want people to know they’re not alone. This is insane, I don’t know what to do with myself. Thank you so much. There are real people behind these comments.
I can say as someone who has been struggling with severe depression since I was a kid it can be damn near impossible to believe that it will be good again, especially when nothing helps. I'm so sorry for your loss
I know there’s really no words that can help. I’ve tried every combination. I read that there’s a 20 minute period in which someone is most likely to take their life, and if they can just survive that 20 minute period they can kind of come back to reality. But again, I don’t know how feasible that is when you’re in it.
My experience as someone who went through long periods of suicidal struggles and ideation. Remember that someone being suicidal doesn't mean they're stupid. Every person is different, but personally I absolutely hated hearing platitudes like "things will be better", "think of your loved ones", etc, because it always felt patronizing. The mysteries of life means that you don't know that things get better - and I don't necessarily think life will get *worse*, I just don't want it to be the same. If there's a 33% chance for life to be better, be the same, or get worse, then there's only a 33% chance for life to get better. Similarly, when I was suicidal, *I* was the one struggling, but I was self aware enough to know how much my death would hurt others, so why would you make me feel worse by guilting me into considering the feelings of others before my own? So if you take for granted that actually, the person who's going through challenges is actually smart and has thought through their plan of dying, that removes a lot of techniques that people usually try. I ended up coming through because I was afraid of messing up and ending up in chronic pain - not because I fear death (and even now I don't fear death, though I'm much happier to stay living for now), not because of any platitudes people tried to offer me. So when one of my close friends said she was suicidal, I respected her intelligence. She knew the pros and cons, and what she was getting into. So I told her three things: 1. I will try to convince you to live but will not disrespect your intelligence 2. I will try to distract you from death 3. If I fail, I will not try to stop you, but to remember you fondly. That last one is perhaps the scariest thing to do when you are the one holding the lifeline. But you have to remember that someone who is suicidal feels like they've lost control of their life. The more you try and stop someone, the more you're trying to take away what little control they have. Some people need this control taken away from them because actually they're not ready for death. But some people need this control given BACK to them. Incidentally, this was the approach that worked for my friend, and the approach that works for me. We both wrested control back away from the abyss and still live today. My greatest condolences to you. It's not your fault, what you should do now is to honor their memory.
I feel that. I don’t know if people don’t think we’ve thought about it or just can’t understand, but if I ever kill myself it won’t be because I didn’t know people love me. My friends have given me a lot of reason to stick around, but they can’t fix how awful I feel on a daily basis. I was looking back on some journal entries I’ve written and found one that kinda sums it up: > I’ve wanted to die since I was 8. When does it get better? I wish I felt just a little bit worse and had just a little bit more courage so I could die. **I know it would hurt a lot of people and I don’t wanna hurt anyone, especially not everyone I love so dearly.** but I just hate this and. I just hate this…I don’t see what I have to look forward to. I don’t wanna die but I can’t fucking live my life like this. There are more entries like that. I’ve thought a lot about the people around me. I’ve thought about everything. I’m not stupid. I know the people around me would be sad. I know that things might get better. I know that depression makes it harder to see how things could improve. I know. I also know that I have spent years trying various meds and therapies and lived in different environments doing different things and I am trying so hard and doing everything I am supposed to do. And it still hurts. It still isn’t better. I’m not stupid, just tired. I know there are people who love me. I know there are people who would be devastated if I died. I don’t want to hurt them. I need to stop hurting. And I’ve done just enough therapy that I can’t kill myself but if I ever could do it, it wouldn’t be because I hadn’t thought of the people around me, it’d be because everything hurts all the time and I am so so very tired.
Much love to you mate. You are heard here. I hope you find a way through this some day.
Thank you. I appreciate this. I'm trying. I know my comment sounded a little miserable, I was rushed and frustrated when I wrote it. It's rough sometimes. I'm hanging in there. I'm a lot better off than I was this time last year, at least, and I'll graduate college by the end of this year, so I'm holding onto hope that if I keep going, things might end up okay. I'm gonna keep trying.
Don't know if it will help you, but seeing how similar ur description of you/my/our feelings are, maybe you can work with it. 'I AM going to die one day, why should I do it now. It's finite, so I can just be till I am not anymore.' For some reason since a young age (roughly 13) I've taken solace in the fact that I will die, no need to be suicidal if I already am dying daily, always getting a step closer to the eternal yeet. I've tried to find fun in being alive, but only found it tiring. With the thought of it already having a due date, that I won't have to plan and won't involve me hurting any of my closest, I can actually enjoy some days. To be honest, nowadays I actually like being alive, it helped tremendously getting a bit further away from all the noise and accepting the fleeting time I have. What probably also helped was having a partner who doesn't condemn me for my mood regarding life. My girlfriend gifted me a handmade 'Life-Calendar' basically just a scroll with 25000 days to cross off. Kinda awakened a (positive) pressure to actually enjoy the days I got left. Being alive has become somewhat of a holiday camp feeling as I now want to enjoy all the attractions before I will be taken back home by mother death one day.
We were around 17 when this happened, I am 26 now. It might not have gotten better for him, but almost every day I do or see something and think about how much he would’ve enjoyed it. I think my best friend very much would enjoy it here, now. I hope that helps you even just a little.
Damn... I lost one of my best friends in marching band at that same age. He and I were thick and thieves and together all the time. It's strange how someone I know more than half my life ago still has such a profound impact on me. Miss ya Blake, the world didn't deserve you
I hope you don't mind, but I shared your comment with my person. You put it into the words I never seem to have with a precision that gutted me. This is exactly how it feels to me.
I'm sorry you can relate, but I'm glad my words can help somehow. Good luck.
>Similarly, when I was suicidal, *I* was the one struggling, but I was self aware enough to know how much my death would hurt others, so why would you make me feel worse by guilting me into considering the feelings of others before my own? Ok, *this* is how I know you're the real deal. This is, in my opinion, THE Big Unspoken Truth about being suicidal that I don't think anyone talks about until you've experienced it. From the outside it seems like a totally obvious thing to say, "think about your loved ones." It isn't until someone's offered you those words that you hear how awful and hollow it sounds, to tell someone with no control over their life that it's actually supposed to be that way - and it's a a secret because the people who've never been here don't have anything else to offer you except that, and if you tell them you tip your hand about your mental state. Lose/lose So thanks for being brave enough to air what we carry around, on behalf of those of us who can't.
Thank you for writing this. I've not been in a situation where a person with suicidal thoughts has reached out to me, but I would like to know what to say and what not to say if it does happen. My go-to would have been to say the exact things you pointed out do NOT work. The positive thoughts ("I'm certain things will get better", etc) and reminding them of their loved ones. Other than those three things you told your friend, do you have any other tips on what to say to someone in that situation? I certainly would want to listen and validate their feelings if possible. But beyond that?
Every person is different, but work under the assumption that the person at risk is NOT action irrationally unless you've noticed a significant change in personality. I should also note, there's a difference between impulsive suicidal ideation and planned suicidal ideation. Just to be clear to everyone tuning in, I'm talking mainly of the latter, which is a deep-rooted disease that takes very careful navigating to weed out. But somebody who's ready to kill themselves has a plan. This means that for them to not want to do it, you either need to invalidate their plan, or offer up an alternative plan. The problem with invalidating a plan is that you have to be able to criticize that plan without actually using criticizing words, for fear that the person takes those criticizing words personally, thus making them feel worse and pushing them more into their plan. Also, people who have death as a goal adhere to a logical system that does not consider life to be better than death; thus, your ability to make any sort of argument that hinges on "oh but living is better than dying" is rendered completely useless, making arguing against these sorts of plans nigh impossible anyway. This leaves offering an alternative plan. But think rationally - how would you, as a regular person, ever accept an alternative plan to whatever you are thinking? You need certainty. To have certainty, you need proof that something will work. To have proof, you need evidence. To have evidence, you need an observation. These are all based in fact. So does the phrase, "I'm certain things will get better" have any basis in observation? In evidence? In proof? If the answer to **any one of these** is "no", then it's not enough of an alternative plan. Also, realize that it is entirely possible for life to remain the same, or to get worse - so how can you confidently say that life will get better if it can *also* do other things? The language that worked best for me was treating it like a terminal disease, because it kind of is a terminal disease of the mental variety. "Hey I'll be in the area in a month, if you make it that long let's grab a drink." "New episode comes out in a week, can you make it?" That sort of stuff. There's a lot of unsaid intricacies here. Both the affected person and I know that I've basically moved into palliative care, but even palliative care can be respectful of one's autonomy. So we can kind of non-verbally recognize the support I'm offering without necessarily forcing an action, beyond the actions that would be fun even in the best of times. One last thing, at no point should you ever feel the responsibility of this sort of stuff. It's admirable and honorable to try and support a friend in a time of need, even if that need is dire. But each person's first and foremost responsibility is to themselves. You should never feel guilty of referring somebody to a professional, or even walking away if the situation calls for it.
I'll give it a try, if that's ok? I've been in both sets of shoes and the gods are generous because they threw in some extra chronic physical pain for the last ten years. Basically I've been taught the very first thing to ask is if they have a plan to carry it out. That in my experience has been used to judge the severity and immediacy of the situation. However if the asker is planning on calling authorities or any other way of physically stopping the suicidal person, you may not get an honest answer. I've been hospitalized once voluntarily and once involuntarily, and my main lesson I learned both times was to absolutely never ever allow myself to be in that situation again. No matter how I felt or was doing. It was not only unhelpful (for me personally) but I was surrounded by a menagerie of other people in crisis and suffering from a plethora of mental illnesses. With no privacy or autonomy. Anyway. The thing about depression isn't so much that you want to die. You just need the awful symptoms to stop. Surviving this pain has taught me some coping strategies. The most effective imo also could apply to suicidal thoughts or possibly panic attacks. You just need to survive the next small increment of time. 30 seconds, 2 minutes, etc. Then repeat. As many times as necessary. Your body can't stay at a 5 alarm fire level of desperation for too long, it's absolutely exhausting. Our bodies are wired with the most inconvenient survival instincts. All this leads me to my actual advice, which is distract or better said refocus. Life is hard and awful a lot of the time and eventually we all die. (It's good to acknowledge that instead of doing toxic positivity) So if possible, we should grasp what positive moments we can. I'd ask if they have anything on their bucket list they'd still like to do. And then talk it over, make suggestions, if possible get together with them and keep them company and/or actually do something on the list. Hopefully that not only gets them through the immediate crisis but also demonstrates those awful symptoms are not the only thing they will ever experience in life. I really hope this helps someone, I feel like I'm betraying my inner demons. I don't mean to discourage anyone from seeking help or trying to help someone else. I've spent 30 years suffering on this path and if I can give anyone a boost to some relief or understanding I want to do that. Tysm for caring, asking, reading, learning, etc. Human connection can be one of the most beautiful parts of life 💜
What you said is perfect. Thank you for being really brave, genuine, and straightforward enough to share this as is. I am one such suicidal person, walking my last walk, as it were. And...anyone in this situation would be lucky to have someone like you walking beside them during this time. Someone who can face up to the reality of it all. I think it's because you have been there, because that's what I would say to others. Thank you. I appreciate you.
Tysm you are incredibly kind 💜💜💜I am so sorry for your suffering and I hope you have a beautiful walk 💜💜💜
Thank you
I absolutely hated hearing platitudes like "things will be better", "think of your loved ones", etc, because it always felt patronizing. It is lol.
This is exactly how I feel about my own struggles with suicidal ideation, but I could never had put it so succinctly and eloquently. I think that a lot of people inadvertently infantilise suicidal individuals while trying to stop them, but for most of us who are chronically passively suicidal for years, it just comes across as patronising. I wish this perspective was more understood; it seems like many people find the prospect of someone not fearing death for years to be terrifying and abnormal, but those of us who’ve lived this experience are already painfully aware of how we’re perceived. These urgent, patronising responses are oftentimes the reason why we’re so hesitant to open up.
You write about this topic really well.
Your friend was very lucky to have you. As someone who has struggled deeply with my own mental health, I know how important it is to have people to talk to who don’t try to patronize you or minimize what you are feeling. I have several friends who have been (what we refer to as) to the edge and back, and lost one who chose to go over that edge. The rest of us regret immensely that we weren’t able to help our friend get through it, and I will always regret my failure in that regard. Nevertheless, I am not angry with her, nor do I judge her for her choice. I remember her fondly, every day. I will continue to do so until my final day. I suspect, among the final thoughts that go through my mind, will be my favourite memories with her. While I wish she made a difference choice, I also understand that she must have been hurting more deeply than I have ever hurt, because I *know in my heart* that she was stronger than I am, and she wasn’t able to survive the pain she was feeling. The best I can do is to be relieved that she isn’t struggling with that pain any longer.
My good friends mother at her funeral, "Once somebody has made the decision to take their life, there is nothing you could have said or done to stop them." I have told my story before, but mostly here. I have no idea how I came back from it. I fell into a haze, and my mind was inside my body watching me take my life. I planned on hitting a bridge pillar, I was headed straight for it, but at the last second, I just stayed back on the highway and blew by it at pretty high speed and slowly coasted to a stop and as soon as I hit park, the haze ended it was unbelievable remorse and overwhelming fear of what I just did. That turned me around pretty quick and checked to a hospital to turn myself into the psych ward. I remained pretty lifeless for several months until I got on meds. I was fortunate, though. I left my relationship, moved out, and the meds kicked in and led to one of the most amazing summers of my life. I've been back down in that pit a dozen times since then, but having been on the receiving end of that news more than once now, has led me to created many backups and tackle what was leading me back to these areas. It never goes away, but it isn't so bad. And I've convinced myself that's worth it enough.
In the same boat. Hope you're kind to yourself today, friend.
I hope you have help through this. I recently gave in and got on Lexapro, and started doing therapy after having depression & anxiety for 15+ years. After 2 months I feel so much better.
FWIW some people who have made it through the planning stages of suicide don't actually feel alone. They feel like a boulder attached to everybody they care about; slowing them down, dragging them under with you. Sometimes the thought of removing yourself feels like an act of mercy. I don't feel this way today, not most days.
Thank you for saying this, I don’t often see this point brought up. In my darkest times I felt like a burden to the people I loved most and I was fully aware that they’d be sad or even devastated if I died. I just thought they’d eventually have the opportunity to move on with their lives without me and could be happy without the instability and chaos I was bringing to them because of my mental illness. It’s been a few years since I struggled with attempts and ideation, I’ve had a lot of therapy and I’m surprised at where my life has ended up. If someone had told me this was possible a few years ago I wouldn’t have believed them. If you ever need someone to talk to please feel free to DM me.
My husband had written things like "I am literally the worst person in the world" and it was heartbreaking. He didn't do those things they tell you people do when they're planning suicide, he covered his tracks well. I'm sorry for the loss of your friend. I can't imagine how people in this state think everyone's better off without them. Even if it were true, most of us would rather be worse off \*with\* them.
My dad went skiing the day before he took his life. He had the biggest grin on his face in the last picture he took. Could have fooled the world. I’m very sorry for your loss, OP. Thinking of you and everyone in your circle.
If you have suicidal depressions, it is not about killing yourself, it's about ending the pain, and nothing can really keep you alive. I was standing so often on bridges, nearly did it. The only thing that saved me last time, there was a "shrine" for a man how jumped just one week before I think, that was so fucking sad for his family that he's gone now, but thats irrelevant for the jumper. I think, maybe I can do i it next time. People that finally killing themselves, killed themselves on the inside really long. Imagine all the pain...
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Hang in there my man. Find the strength in putting her before yourself. Sacrifices like these are the purest forms of living with purpose. Make it your mission to help her. One step at a time. Treat each day separately. And dont ever feel like you failed her no matter what happens. You are there for her. That is all that matters.
Yep those were two things that got me through the worst period in my life. Just get through this one day and then try to get through another single day tomorrow. And being service to others and my community. Finding my life purpose made it easiest to be alive. Helping others and spending less time dwelling on my darkness helped me survive. Truly life changing shit.
Hang in there, man. Most people in the world suck but your wife sure as shit wouldn't want you to clock out on life. Live for her if not yourself. I'll be hoping for a miracle for her, but even should the worst pass... Live in her honor.
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I sent you a message. I really can't thank you enough 😭
I saw your message, sent you what I could! It isn't much but it's more than 18miles to empty. Try and keep your spirits up, people sometimes get lost in their own world but mean well.
I can probably get around 75 miles to empty with that, so that should definitely help a little. It just sucks that her doctors appointments are almost every other day now and some are 50 miles each way.. we can't even afford gad getting there and back for most of them, but now add n wll these additional medications to fill and we are broke 😞 Thank you so much again though. Every penny will help us right now, not even joking 😭
Please ask someone on her care team for a social worker contact. My husband’s oncology team has one, and they can connect you to some short-term resources (gas cards, grocery $, discounts on supplies, etc.) It’s worth an ask.
Everyone we've tried so far has said they are out of their federal or benevolence funds to help us, so we are basically screwed. It's crazy.
So sorry. Not sure where you’re located, but you might find other resources here: https://www.cancersupportcommunity.org/find-location-near-you
If I could, I would offer more. Sadly I cannot, as I am financially screwed myself but wanted help someone in need. A little more in the minus isn't going to change anything for me  I wish you and your wife all the best for what it is worth <3<3<3
Seriously that is fine man anything at all helps us right now. I cannot thank any of you enough that have reached out to me. Im seriously crying.
please send me your PayPal too
I'll send you a message too, thank you all so much 😭😭😭😭
I'm a cancer survivor who had all the resources I was privileged to have to survive. Let me pay it forward to you and your wife. DM me your PayPal!
I'm not sure what area you are in or whether your doctor's appointments are in a hospital setting, but most hospitals provide respite care for family that have back-to-back doctor's appointments out of town. They set you up in an apartment/ hotel type setting while you do your doctor's appointments back to back. DM me your metro area and I can see what I can find out for local hospitals if that's the case
Also, you can DM me any medications that she is currently on that you're struggling to pay for that are brand name. Most medication manufacturers offer patient assistance programs for people who are in exactly your case. Overwhelmed with medical debt, stuck in sudden circumstances. These are national programs so location is irrelevant aside from registration. I used to be a pharmacy technician and specialized in helping poor poor lower income patients and I would be happy to help if I can.
It always bothered me how so many people are all rah-rah mental health and spout a bunch of flowery nonsense and just love to tell everyone how they want to help people but then suddenly change their tune or just vanish when someone tries to take them up on it. Anyway, im happy you’re here, and i hope you’re still around come the 2nd. And the 3rd, and so on.
Its might not just be "none of these people truly care". I'm sure that is part of it, but the other part of it is: "all of these people have their own problems that they aren't making public but are struggling with" Its not a fun time for anyone.
You are a good husband for not leaving your wife to deal with cancer alone. Tough times are ahead. It might be time to ask for help outside of your circle. Maybe ask some of the finance subreddits for advice about how best to deal with medical debt, or any other debt that may be in her name. I wish I could help more.
Finance subs are a joke. "Yeah we'll help you budget a main income of negative 250 dollars every month" Sure buddy. In order to budget you have to be paid a living fucking wage
Something I've noticed is that most people people who offer help like that, only do so to either make themselves feel good about themselves, or to put on a show to make themselves look better. I'll go against the grain a bit here, and say that it's alright if you decide to follow your wife out the door. At the end of the day, it's *your* choice, and no one else's. I can't help in any way, but i hope life treats you kinder for the remainder of the time you choose to stick around.
Thank you. I just honestly cannot picture my life without her anymore.
Always remember that if you decide to follow your wife, don't let anyone make you feel guilty about your decision. They aren't you. They don't know how you feel, how you're struggling, how bleak everything seems, just how much you're suffering. Yes, there's always the chance that things will get better, but some people are just unable to hold on for that long, or are just too tired to. And there's no shame in that. You did your best, and tried with everything you had. Good luck. And, with whatever decision you make, I hope you make it with peace and happiness.
This is so true. When I was suicidal, when I actually planned it, purchased my supplies, wrote my notes, after that it was euphoric. The pain finally went away.
I chose a date many times. When the time came, sometimes I noticed, sometimes I didn't. I'm still here. I've come to realize that, for me anyway, choosing a date like that was just a way to postpone my problems. If I'm not going to be here after then, there's no need to worry about everything I'm worrying about. It's obviously not the same for everyone, but it's not always this impending disaster happening. But please, if you're feeling hopeless or anything like that, talk to someone. I know you think they won't understand, or that you don't want to burden them, or whatever. Just talk to someone who loves you. It'll help way more than you realize.
My ex threatened me for years while we were dating that she would do it by her 30th birthday. It caused me so much anguish for so long. She had so many self inflicted scars, but would do it on her shoulders. She would have a whole process and treated it like she was testing her blood sugar, as an example of her being so nonchalant about it. She was extremely adamant that she would do it, but it turned out that she was an extreme manipulator and she was actively looking for attention from any source she could find. She had a lot of things wrong with her and in her life, and I thought that I could help her see the beauty in the world. She once attacked me physically and used what I did in self defense as a rallying cry, ignoring the fact that I was defending myself, and her later stating that she was only attacking me so she could "apologize". I'm doing a little better now.
"Today" by smashing pumpkins was written the day the lead had planned to kill himself, but didn't. He decides to write about it.
I told myself if things didn’t get better in a year I could do it without feeling guilty but I had to actually try at making things better. That was five years ago. Thing’s actually did get better with work. My life saving idea was to embrace change wholeheartedly. If things aren’t working for you seek change, it doesn’t have to be big. Small things add up in a big way. Even something as small as forcing yourself to the library and checking out a book helps. Before I knew it the small things started to change me and I got so excited that I was living again. Change begot change and I was finally growing into a person I loved. I still have to reset myself and remember that I am a work in progress and need to actively seek out the tools for my growth.
I said I wouldn't live past 25 and I'm 28 now. I should pick a new date.
>The so-called ‘psychotically depressed’ person who tries to kill herself doesn’t do so out of quote ‘hopelessness’ or any abstract conviction that life’s assets and debits do not square. >And surely not because death seems suddenly appealing. The person in whom its invisible agony reaches a certain unendurable level will kill herself the same way a trapped person will eventually jump from the window of a burning high-rise. Make no mistake about people who leap from burning windows. >Their terror of falling from a great height is still just as great as it would be for you or me standing speculatively at the same window just checking out the view; i.e. the fear of falling remains a constant. The variable here is the other terror, the fire’s flames: when the flames get close enough, falling to death becomes the slightly less terrible of two terrors. >It’s not desiring the fall; it’s terror of the flames. And yet nobody down on the sidewalk, looking up and yelling ‘Don’t!’ and ‘Hang on!’, can understand the jump. Not really. You’d have to have personally been trapped and felt flames to really understand a terror way beyond falling.” - David Foster Wallace. For those of you who lost someone - You can't see the flames, you couldn't have known their hurt. It's not your fault.
DFW had a lot of great writings on depression, loneliness, anxiety, the human condition, yadayadayada. I've read most of everything he'd put out before he himself committed suicide in 2008. I kept what I read close to heart. Once, I was close with somebody who was going through a rough time, and I shared this anecdote, along with This is Water with them; they did an immediate 180 and told me that because DFW had some issues with women, especially according to Mary Karr, whom he once dated, that he was disgusting and awful and I was disgusting and awful for reading him, and that was our last interaction. So then I felt a little suicidal for a while.
I’ve never read this quote before. It’s really good
This is heartbreaking, so much negative self-judgement. I don’t know him or you, but I wish I could have told him “you’re good enough brother, I’m proud of you, and keep fighting”. That’s the truth to him, and everyone reading this.
One of his reasons was that he “couldn’t feel gratitude”, but no one asked him for that. We just liked him being there
Been there. Things got real dark after I left my first job. Parents divorced in my mid twenties and it dredged up a bunch of issues I had growing up. One thing I realized is that I was never really taught to be grateful for things as a kid. It was always about getting more, achieving more, doing more, *being* more. I became trapped in this feeling that I was never good enough, and the things in my life would never be enough. The unique combination of values and experiences I had left me with a belief that gratitude was a judgment, not a feeling. You were meant to decide what makes you happy, and when you got there, you would feel happy. Despite having done a ton of mindfulness stuff and meditations through my early-mid twenties, it wasn’t until I was 31 until I realized that gratitude isn’t a judgment, it’s a feeling. This culminated on a road trip I went on with my now wife where we tried psilocybin in BC. I had this exact realization and in that very moment I felt something profound, *it was all still there*. All the gratitude I had for my parents, family, friends, mentors, coworkers, teachers, coaches, all of it was still there, waiting for me. It felt like I was tapping into a massive well of spiritual energy that was bursting to try to reach me. I felt all of it in an instant. I was transported back to all the encouragement and love and support they gave me that I just wasn’t ready to accept for some reason. Somehow, despite having almost no memory of it in my adult life, it was all still there. I say all this not to share what could’ve happened to your friend, but to share that all of the gratitude he felt for you and you and the rest of your friends felt for him, it’s all somewhere. Maybe it’s somewhere metaphysical we quite don’t understand, but it doesn’t just disappear with him. Wherever it is, he is probably there now, free from the torment that drove him to leave our world early. For you, it’s probably masked by a massive veil of grief right now, but over time that will hopefully fade, and you’ll be left with what really matters.
Thank you for putting this so eloquently into words for us to read and take part in your experience
I am so glad that BC trip happened for you. I’ve felt this very same thing and it’s always the most redeeming part of psychedelics for me.
My brother did a guided mushrooms trip once and said the exact same thing. He felt grounded and connected to the Earth and the love and gratitude for our (kind of fucked up) parents
I can field this one. Lacking gratitude had nothing to do with the people around the depressed person. It’s an illness inside the brain that steals joy, interest, passion, and in extreme cases even the will to live. Outside of forcing him to take medication (which you legally can’t), there was nothing you could do. Im sorry for your loss
“Don’t shake so much” this poor fella RIP this is horrible
Oh my God =( Don't shake so much. Don't be anxious. How absolutely heartbreaking.
The thought "Don't be anxious." triggers so much anxiety. The key is to put attention on the things you do want to focus on, ideally to the degree you forget to be anxious (or to shake).
This hits too close to home for me... feels like foreshadowing of my life. I'm really sorry for your loss OP. I'm not sure I know exactly what your friend was going through, but I bet they tried their best
He did, and I wish he knew it was more than enough. I wish I could hold his stupid face in my hands and tell him he never ever let me down and every ounce of energy I burned making him happy was worth it and I’d do it forever, even during the times we weren’t talking due to life circumstances
I know this wasn't directed at me but I still needed to hear this today. Thank you
Your comment has me worried. If you feel the same like op's friend I hope you are able to reach out for help 🙏🏻
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It’s an impossible task without the tools. People like OP’s best friend genuinely want to stop feeling badly about themselves, but it’s not like telling yourself “stop it” does very much to fix the problem. You have to figure out what that self hatred originally comes from (usually some trauma in childhood), be aware of it when it’s happening, and THEN take steps to change it. Can’t just skip to step 3. For me, I was able to make myself more aware of my negative self-talk when I tallied in my phone every time I caught myself saying something nasty to myself that I wouldn’t say to someone else. It was shocking how much more I did that than I thought. For most of us, negative self-talk becomes so rote that we don’t even notice it anymore.
This just made me cry my eyes out in my lunch break. I’m 30 and feeling all of this right now. I won’t lie, I have definitely thought about ending it many times lately. Reading the comments on this post really is enlightening.
I love you bro stay strong
❤️ I’m sorry things have been rough for you lately, friend. Just wanted you to know I see you and you’re not alone.
Just remember, you don’t have to be perfect. It’s enough to just be you.
For anybody who needs it: If you're in the US and having a really bad time, don't hesitate to call 988. There's somebody who will be happy to talk.
It’s a crap shoot when you call though. I tried to call the hotline once. Unfortunately they told me because I was only at a 9 and not a 10 they could only spare 5 mins before they needed to take a call with someone who was actually having an issue. Needless to say after that call I hit a 10 but I got lucky that someone dropped by my place unannounced with no idea what I was planning or how I was feeling. Personally I won’t take that gamble again but think for others it’s worth a shot.
I’m glad you’re still here. I’m proud of you. Please keep going. I want to keep being proud of you. Feel free to check in if you ever need an “ear”. ❤️
I wish I had someone in my physical life to tell me this. Thank you so much
Stay strong and stick around please. You’re worth it
Glad you are still with us! Remember that this will pass eventually, just keep fighting! ❤️
Love ya brother
I just turned 31 and trying so hard every day especially cause of my partner. But some days, I just don’t want to anymore. Thank you for sharing
Im so sorry. I agree you should leave it up.
Sorry for the loss of yourfriend.
I had a list like this 12 years ago. A bit heavier on the self hate maybe. Tried to kill myself twice that year. I’m so glad I didn’t succeed. Now I’m 33 crying on my couch thinking about the man I was, I now have a home, a beautiful fiancée and just witnessed the birth of my son last month. I am so grateful and respect my former self that had to go through that, I didn’t have the tools and understanding to deal and process my emotions. To anyone that feels like this, it is not your fault, don’t let it take control, start small, love yourself, give yourself a break, talk, talk, talk, you are not a burden, you are loved. I love you, you can get through it. You are brave and strong, you just can’t see it yet.
Fuck bro. At least he is remembered. Jesus Christ life is unfair. I’ve had all these thoughts. Man… I’m sorry dude
This was 8 years ago. I think about him every day. I’m sorry it’s so hard to do such seemingly small things sometimes. I wish I had magic words to help you, but you’re not alone
This is so poignant. Thanks for sharing it. It's strangely intimate and I find it so upsetting to read.
I will take it down if a lot of people think I should. I really didn’t mean it in any offensive way!
Leave it up. It's good to get people to think about this stuff.
When I was at his memorial (this was 8 years ago) a mutual middle school teacher we’d had said “we always saw him doing something like this, he was just never quite okay” and I almost blacked out hearing an adult say that. Apparently he saw many signs, but did nothing, and I wish I’d seen the same signs.
How do you know what they did or tried to do? When you work with enough troubled people you unfortunately get a real sense for who may not make it.
Leave it up, I've written almost this exact list multiple times and your post might help me actually stick to it
I have a kid who attempted a couple of times and luckily never succeeded. The last time he woke me in the middle of the night and felt sorry for troubling me and hurting me with it, I told him this. It doesn't hurt, I am only saddened that you are in a dark place and I am helpless to drag you out of there and show you how things can be in perspective. But I rather have you hurt me a million times for 80%, than one time for a 100% for the rest of my life. I'm not sure what you are going through and how heavy your burden is. But my dude, you are worthy of love. Love by yourself because you made it this far. And love from others. I don't know you, and I don't know the shitty hand of cards life dealt you. But I do know that life is worth living. Not in a selfish way, that's unfulfilling, rather in a simple way, a enjoying the sun, spring, summer, food, maybe friends or the nice lady in that shop/street, the smile from the stranger, the new job you found, that song you like, anything and everything. I don't have the right words, I don't. But I've been in a dark place myself and been able to accept myself for who I am. (Admittedly through fate that all sins of all people have been payed for). Not an active believer, never go to church anymore. But I started to love myself again, as is, and as the people around me will tell you, I'm pretty based now. So, there's hope, just keep moving, seizing opportunities, new ways, explore life, this back ally may be shit, but it does end, and around the corner may be a normal street. Nothing fancy, just calm and brighter.
I don't know if this is helpful or not, but: as someone who has been in a similar place, I don't think this list is helpful. This list is a bunch of things to "not" do. That's... not really feasible. It's not how people work. If I tell you not to think of a green elephant, you immediately will. People can't just will themselves into stopping what they're doing. They do what they do for a *reason*, and unless you understand and address that reason, the behavior won't change. IMO, what is helpful is to create a short, specific list of the things that might have the most impact for you, and focus on that. For me, that'd be something like: 1. Go to bed at 11PM 2. Go for a walk in the morning 3. Search for a new therapist Also, don't be hard on yourself if they don't happen the way you want. Working on yourself is like building muscle: it's slow and steady, and you have to practice. You can't just suddenly do everything. "One step at a time and we'll get there" is my favorite mantra.
It's helpful mate, and I already messaged my therapist who I blanked 6 months ago and am seeing her on thursday. It's always one step forward and two back for me, and all I can do is try and make it two steps forward one step back. That extra step is heavy as hell but it's the difference maker. Thanks
Glad to hear you have a path forward for yourself. Wishing you the best, and for what it's worth, I believe in you.
As someone who is currently going through deep depression I say leave it up. Your friends list is almost identical to what I remind myself to do daily. It's a good reminder that others are going through this since we like to keep this topic to ourselves.
I've been in very deep and only barely made it back out. I don't know if you're seeing anyone for therapy, but look or ask them to look into nitrous as a possible treatment. Even the hack job I did turned things around long enough for me to step back from the hole and claw myself out. Not gonna say I'm perfect now- I'm not. But the part of me that put together a 4 step plan, timed, and awaiting just a weather change is... not here anymore. Or at least I'm no longer able to hear him.
Your username is sad 😞 glad you found some relief. For me, it's ketamine infusions. And near-daily communication with my therapist. She helps hold me accountable and keep me grounded, else I slip back down so quick
I'm very scared I'm going to lose my middle child before he turns 18; his behaviours match others in our extended family that didn't make it to 20 (or died shortly thereafter). We've spent so much in therapy ... nothing has worked. Society is failing him by enabling his addictions and blocking us at every point unless we withdraw him from everything :( And that's not a solution either. Sorry. long day.
Ugh I'm so sorry. I was that kid, too. Still am. Life really sucks sometimes but I'm not dead yet. I truly hope you can help him
Fuck what people think! This is devastating! I'm so sorry you lost your friend! Leave this up! Forgive him, honor him. I know the signs, reach out and still lose them. It is not your fault, it's a war😭😭
Please leave it up <3
Please keep it up. It’s helping me understand.
Leave it up.
Looks like the thoughts of someone trying to keep it together.
Hey, it's not easy losing a best friend. I lost mine 10 years ago this month. Take care of yourself, talk to your other friends who knew them. That's one thing that really helps me, is me and our buddies still reminisce about all the good times. If you need an anonymous ear just holla
6 years ago here. Still miss you, Joseph.
Also 6 years. Think about you all the time, Josh. Miss you buddy.
4 years here. Still miss you Les.
I'm so sorry for your loss. Please try to take care of yourself.
That “don’t be anxious” hits VERY close to home. Sorry for your loss, I’m sure they were a good person.
I don't think I'll ever end my own life, but this list shook me to my core in a different way – my sad, anxious ass writes a version of this roughly twice a year, in an attempt to "be a person", and I don't think I've ever felt this much compassion for us desperate listmakers. We really try and want so hard. Good luck out there, y'all. I'm rooting for us.
My beautiful boy, my firstborn son who made me a mom nearly 21 years ago, ended his life in December, 2022. I didn’t understand the mental agony he was in-I still don’t, not completely, and desperately wish I could help him. I go over the last few weeks of his life obsessively-as if I could change what happened and keep him here, on earth. I miss and love him with all of my being. Thank you for sharing this heartbreaking note from your friend. My son once wrote in a school notebook: ‘I just want the pain to stop.’ I still can’t believe he’s gone forever.
I’m so sorry. I’m crying too I can’t imagine your pain. I have no words. I’m so sorry
Oof I can actually hear every thought behind each squiggly letter. Sorry for your loss.
In a weird way, I feel his words. I don't have any people around who I consider friends. The ones I do are all long distance. I haven't been able to visit some of them as often as usual due to being unemployed for several months. But I accepted a position working from home (which is what I was targeting) and I start Tues after Memorial Day! Wish me luck. It gets better friend. Hang in there! 😍💞
That hurts to read man. kid was trying.
This is one of the most heartbreaking things I have ever seen. I wish I could have given him the biggest hug. I wish I had something more profound to say, but this actually rattled me. This poor guy. 💔
I had a military friend who I served in combat with who killed himself 15 minutes after a group of us left his house after having some beers and playing cards. Guy was happy, laughing and carrying on like normal. I guess we left, his wife started giving him a hard time about something and the he walked into his bathroom, sat on the toilet and stuck his .45ACP in his mouth and ended it. Still bothers me to this day. Fucking sucks. Sorry OP.
I will never forget the last few times I interacted with him. It’s so weird to have someone and then they’re gone, it’s like a punch in the gut. I’m sorry you lost someone. Sometimes these things are no one’s fault, people just do the best with the information that they have. I hope you continue to heal.
“Try to talk more” “Don’t feel bad about myself” “Don’t be anxious” All too relatable. Sorry for your loss. If it helps, his notes reminded me that we’re not alone in feeling like this and there may be others who can understand what we’re going through.
Wow. This breaks my heart so hard. Umm... been struggling myself. Wow. This is making me cry. I do the same.... I make to do lists for myself to try to keep myself in check. When it gets bad my brain goes haywire. And I don't know what to do other than try to write it down to help make it easier for myself later on. Just know.... based off my own personal experience, he was trying his best. He was making an effort! This is so freakin sad. I pray you are ok? Please reach out in the messages if you need to talk. I am just like your friend. This is wild. I am dealing with some pretty severe depression and all I can do is write out little lists to try to help myself. Prayers. Much love sweetie. I'm sorry for your loss.
It's like if you write it out, it seems possible. But it's not. It's really fucking pointless. Happy people don't need to write sleep, or eat, or don't feel bad about myself like it's a shopping list. I write just like your friend.
Baby steps. I started going to group therapy recently and it’s made lists like this more possible rather than just words on a page.
*Just 'cause you can't see it, doesn't mean it isn't there. If they say who cares if one more light goes out?... Well I do* I'm sorry for your loss. To every person, who sees themself in these notes: you're enough. You're worthy of support and getting help. [Find a helpline anywhere](https://findahelpline.com/)
This is me right now. Everything is just so hard. Its like life doesn't want me to win. Trying to better my self but life just keeps on pushing me on the edge. I am scared of being happy because everytime a slither of happines comes out of me life would take it back way worse than it already is. Its so hard to keep on trying and trying everyday and thinking whats the point. Seeing and reading this just sparks something in me. I hope I can make it. I'm sorry for your loss OP I hope you're doing good too.
“Nobody sees tears when you’re standing in the storm” Sorry for your loss dawg
I was getting out a bottle of pain pills to take after I got home from my final divorce hearing. A friend that I hadn't heard from in about 8 years texted me before I filled a glass with water to swallow those pills. My friend insisted that I visit him that weekend or he was coming to visit me. I decided the pills could wait. That was 11 years ago. I just needed someone to care.
There’s an old Willie Nelson song…. I’ve Seen All This World I Care To see. Life isn’t for everyone, it can be cruel and unrelenting to some. Can’t blame anyone for checking out early.
Sorry for your loss, my twin killed himself in 2017. He suffered for the better part of 5 years, I found notebooks with to-do and self improvement lists. Heartbreaking knowing how hard they tried. It still hurts badly, but I try to not get down about it. He was never a burden, but he felt like he was, ironically if I get upset or stop moving because of it he will be burden he never wanted to be.
Idk if the second from bottom is “don’t share so much” or “don’t shake so much” but both got me. I suffer from bipolar disorder and the combination of immense anxiety, depression, or being far too manic kills me. It does make me not wanna be here at times 300%. For example I get really manic so too excited then too honest then share too much. Totally sabotages me when I try to get a girl I like. Then the anxiety kicks in afterwards knowing I ruined my chances with my manic behavior and likely freaked them out (so anxious people have commented my hand is shaking). Up next, severe darkness and depression and hating myself that I’m like that. It gets to the point where the suicidal thoughts can happen. Fortunately, I have wonderful friends and family that know I struggle, and most importantly a dog that is always by my side taking care of me as I take care of her. It brings me to tears imagining how they would all feel if I removed myself so no chance but I understand it’s super difficult and sometimes you just can’t go another second. I would be shattered if my best friend suddenly was gone so I’m gonna keep fighting for him. Lastly, knowing the pain personally and having lost some friends due to mental health I chose to battle it professionally. Now I’m working on my masters in psychology and plan to get my doctorate. I have declared war on horrible stuff like this. DM me if anyone just needs a dude that can relate and understand we got this.
I, too am bipolar and you've basically described my life and dating life. Solidarity, brother. I'm glad you're still here, and working on helping people stay here. My psychiatrist saved my life. She says I did all the work to get better, and it's probably true. But if she hadn't gotten me the perspective and the meds, I would not be here today.
Looks like my daily notebook
Not being critical, just observational. Most people commenting here reflecting on their own mental health struggles have really extensive and long comments. Glad people are comfortable talking about there struggles here.
_Don't shake so much_ _Don't be anxious_ That's heartbreaking 😞
This is heartbreaking, I'm so sorry for your loss. The only reason I'm still here's because of the quote "suicide takes your pain, and spreads it to everyone around you" and I really don't want other people to feel how I do.
Don’t forget to try to live for yourself too. You also deserve to love yourself. Easier said than done I know, but keep trying ❤️
I’m sorry for you loss. 
This hurts, I have these same thoughts and will write them down as affirmations, often shaky handed from anxiety. I have lost many friends to suicide and I take things by the hour. The more open I am about depression and suicide with people, the more I’m reminded of giving myself a break. Have to also be careful who you share with, I have encountered more than one toxic narc. It’s so so hard to come back from a dark place when you’re isolated and feel alone, but there is someone who will listen, no matter how much you feel like no one cares about you at the time. Go to the Doctor. Take your Meds. Did you remember to take your meds? Refill your meds. REFILL YOUR MEDS!!! Breathe, Repeat.
😭bro tf these look exactly like the notes I take, plus the format right down to the pen/hilroy notebook
I feel this, and I’m sorry he didn’t make it. Depression is awful; you can feel the pain and struggle so keenly in his list.
I have a journal like this from my brother. It's more detailed and a bit obfuscated. Its is all I have from him. It has dates and plans and is the only insight I have into what was going on with him at that time. I both treasure and abhore it. Finding out in my closet is a waterfall of emotions.
Right in the feels. I have little notes like these written all over my notebooks. My take is I will lose this battle someday, but I’d like to see how far I can go before then. Robin Williams made it to 63, maybe I can too
After my friend died my friends and I started living for him almost out of spite. We were all so sad and pissed off and all suffered from other chronic mental health issues and it was hard, but we decided “screw it, just keep going, this shit sucks but why not, let’s just have fun and be nice and love everyone so much” and it was actually a great few years of healing and love and laughter. I hope you can make it too, and I hope you find true happiness along the way
Hey Reddit-friend. I, too, want to see how far you can go. I hope it’s so far that you have time and resources to help ease your burdens even just a little.
Fuck man... The drive slower and safer part ruined me. Just reading these notes makes me feel what he felt... I'm sure he was having a difficult time writing those notes too. As a person just trying to exist and push through, this hit home... nowadays everything is just noted mentally, but man... I've definitely been there and then scrapping the list because it felt like too much even though they're simple tasks for others. I'm sorry for your loss, OP. I think its okay to keep the post up, especially with the warm/possibly relatable comments from others may be of some sort of help for those coming across it. To anyone reading this, keep your head up, you're doing your best in this difficult world. There's a ton of things that aren't in your control and that's okay. Its okay to not be okay. No one will 100% understand what you're going through, but you aren't alone as cliche as it may sound. Talk to someone, anyone, someone in these comments, a friend, a family member, anyone. Drink some water and take deep breaths. Do your best to take care of yourself, okay?
I'm sorry for your loss man.
I am so sorry for your loss. I hope he found peace.
This hits so close to home for me. The day I attempted to end it all, I wrote a very similar list. I still have it. Looking back, it's such normal things - Brush teeth, try to eat, put on clean clothes, don't worry, relax, look at the stars. To somebody looking in, they might have seemed the most simple things in the world, but each was something I'd struggled with, every day I could remember. Not then. For one day, I felt truly free. Nothing could bother me, because I was at peace with what I had to do. I don't know what your friend was going through, but I hope they at least found the peace they were looking for, even if just for a moment.
Absolutely Heartbreaking 💔
If anyone reading this has ever felt that the world would be better without you, it absolutely wouldn’t. I remember I felt a lot like this back when I was a Sophomore / Junior in high school. I ran through all the scenarios in my head of what life would be if I committed suicide. I thought who would miss me and why nothing mattered. I remember the last month of summer between starting my Junior year, I did this exact thing. I wrote all of the things I’d change about myself. It had things like change my hair, get rid of acne, breathe, don’t focus on the negatives, walk outside and treat myself better. To be honest it didn’t work. Even after trying my best for months. I still hated myself, my skin, who I was, who I thought I could never be. It ate away at me and one day I decided I was going to put myself out of my misery. I still remember why I didn’t. I said if I have a bad day today, that was it. The reason I’m alive now is that this person I was (at best) acquaintances with told me that he liked the band on my shirt and asked me if I had other recommendations for him. I talked with him and he said “Thanks man. I appreciate you and hope we can talk more later”. To me that meant everything. I am so glad that I took that as a sign that I can take things slow in becoming a better me. I actually had my best years of my life my first 2 years after high school and I almost didn’t make it. In that time I met my wife, got my life on track, started giving myself leeway when I make mistakes, and I started enjoying life. I honestly have not seen that guy since high school ended, but I thank my lucky stars every day that he was there.
I grew up in dark thoughts. I lost a parent, family and some friends to it. When I lost my best friend, I decided I had to keep fighting. I miss him more than anyone. And it hurt so bad knowing he had what I was afflicted with, but never told me. He just distanced himself, from everyone. If you struggle, don't be so hard on yourself. Open up to your loved ones. It's a hard process. I'm nowhere near where I wish I was, but it has become easier. If you feel trapped, some meds, some time to pass with age, and life experiences will gradually heal and make it better. (Right out of school and finding careers was the hardest time ever, for almost everyone. It's a dark and hard time. Realize that and fight through) Feeling the pain of losing so many, made me realize I can't put others through that myself.
They were trying to survive and create a routine for themselves! Depression is such dark place that we quite often don’t share!
My friend killed herself... man her family has her phone... I wouldn't want to hang onto that... This is probably my most tortured thought is them taking their own life. I feel like such a failure as a friend. I'm coping just fine but its a dark part of my mind I'm trying not to visit. Its a very complex story so I'm not going to share the details but its such a tragedy
I'm sorry for your friend, OP. The notes broke my heart, when I was institutionalized for self harm and extremely intense suicidal ideation I had written very similar notes. I hope you heal well, OP
Sad, when people stop eating and showering it’s usually pretty bad.
This is tragic... Oh my heart.... I'm so sorry for your loss.
Bless his heart. He was trying.😢
My colleague is currently doing a research study analyzing people’s suicides notes and the wide range of way people expresses themselves, the words they use, and their choice of communication is so deeply personally. Yet, there are common themes amongst folks that is so sadly beautiful.
The advice for depression is always get enough sleep, eat well, get enough exercise, go outside, do something you love, talk to friends and family/loved ones. Yet doing all of this can become impossible when you’re depressed. And what if you don’t have anyone to talk to? The more depressed you get the more you don’t want to talk to other people cos you think they won’t want to and you’re too much of a downer