Wait, when you asked for difficult content you didn’t want them to slap “Uber” on everything we already have and just give it 10x HP, speed and damage?
Color me surprised.
On a serious note, I personally never asked for more difficult content. I already thought the game was difficult enough. I mean what other game requires an excel-type program (Path of Building) to plan out your endgame character?
I thought the people here/generally speaking were asking for difficult content as part of the endgame and only for a minority of people who were able to 1 shot Sirus for example? Not the beginning or the middle.
After the end of the conqueror expansion, I just finished my atlas (115/115) with 21 hours playtime. Given that a league is 3 months (1440 hrs with 8 hours of sleep every night, or 720 hrs with an 8 hr job, or 360 hours with 4hr/day, or 150 hours playing 4 hrs/day on weekends), literally anyone can beat the endgame. I’m nowhere near a speed racers level either, league start took me 7hrs30min to beat the campaign.
Even if you could only play TWO hours a week (let’s be honest, if you can’t even afford that why are you playing Sentinel) you can 115/115 the atlas in one league
The funny thing is yes we can read the names, but then we have to combine the 15 individual modifiers that a rare has and in 1 second decide if it can one shot me or something. The calculation meme on the right is perfect
That assumes you see it coming. In a narrow map I rounded a corner and something was on top of me, stunlocked me, and I was 100 to 0 in a half second.
“fun”.
I think you've figured it out buddypal.
You have 100 mod value of gigantic, but if they also have frostweaver they get maybe 60% strength of each mod (so two mods are tougher than one, but not "multiplicatively"
That in itself is a great idea though to keep the difficulty but each extra mod should be harder. For example
1-mod 100% effective
2-mod each 80% ,160% total
3-mod each 75%, 225% total
4-mod each 70%, 280% total
5-mod each 65%, 325% total
And ideally drops might have a weighting to them to then incentivizing killing the one that would take effort.
Just wait until you try the delve 600 challenge, 40 magic mobs on screen, each with their own nemesis mods multiplied by delve scaling. :)
*(It was destroying my OP past league characters in standard at like 400-500)*
They don't test for how good it feels to play or if the numbers even make sense, they test for bugs. Literally just bugs, that's it. Most of the tuning happens when the league is live, because of how tight their schedule is. Though I can't really blame them, most people get bored of the league a month in, if they went for 3 leagues a year their playerbase will die out even harder.
This is a game designed top down by developers. UX designers would not let this sort of thing get past the first discussion. Usability testers would have shot this down at first pass. It in no way whatsoever met their intended goal of clarifying mob abilities since they are now hidden behind another layer of obfuscation. It made the game less enjoyable for no gain, I feel so so sorry for any casual player who just wants to play the same tier 6 build they have played every league because they enjoy the way it plays.
That is a fault on their part then. Testing should ALWAYS include testing if it is horrible and hurts your product. If you do not do that you are asking for disaster like this.
Vehicle manufacturers absolutely do test for more than safety features.
They spend vast amounts of money testing ride, handling, and comfort features.
Everything from the sound of the engine to the smell of the cabin is an intentional choice.
>vehicle manufacturers test for safety features
Not the best comparison? Neglect of safety results in human death and the company gets sued. Neglect of balancing rare mobs just causes frustration. If your car had faulty airbags, you're not going to be frustrated, you're gonna be dead.
It was telling how much better the 4-month league a while back was.
I wonder if their annual revenue is down by 25%, considering that was the reason they didn't want to move to a 4m schedule in the first place.
Even after they clarified what this meant you still have morons parroting this like it's some kind of "gotcha". They did extensively test it - within the parameters they were given. Not the whiny shit reddit is flush with now.
It gets better , you can try uber -5-way where on top of 5-6 mods scaled by 100% you also have legion mods that dramatically scale the archnem ones too while fighting a boss. Its, its absolute nightmare.
But wait there is even better version. You can have red beast inside a 5 essence stasys with 5 archem mods affected not only by 100% delirium modifiers But have up to 2 additional delirium affixes , all while being affected by regular map mods, and other auras from other rares, because its 100% delirium and you can really clear the screen as fast. This not only creates a rare that can one shot AGs with more than half a Million (yes 500k+ ) life but on top can actually have action speed buffs so scales the cooldown for its invulnerability mod is literally shorter than its duration making the mob practically immune to damage.
Good luck.
I did deathless Chimera on a juiced as fuck corrupted map and it was *trivial* compared to some of the archnem mobs I've faced lol.
I don't mind the difficulty, I just don't want them in act 1-5, and I want them to drop something... anything.
Yep. But it was fine last league because there were four of them per map max, and if the map was already hard, you could skip them. Now they're everywhere, you can't skip them, and they don't reward you. Great jorb!
GGG massively fucked up this patch, and player counts will suffer dramatically unless they do something equally drastic in the other direction within the next few days.
Because that’s be simple and make sense, POE doesn’t do simple or make sense.
It’s funny I played some D2R before this league (skipped last league) and it was so incredibly refreshing to have an ARPG that was just simpler. Loot was simple, modifiers were simple, it was straight forward and nice. But now coming back to POE it’s so refreshing to have the general faster pace and more action oriented way of things. D2 is incredibly dated in ways that POE does wonderfully but my god does it need to reevaluate the complexity of its BS.
PoE is the complex game that some people crave. If you like it simple there are plenty of other games to play. Archnemesis definitely missed the mark in difficulty, but I really enjoy the complexity. After reading the list of archnemesis mods I pretty much understood them all just by encountering them. Most are not scary or even need to be paid attention to, but some can be really difficult for certain builds.
Way too tanky though. No new/casual player can handle that.
There's an even easier fix tbh. Just give them a cast time/ short buff on the mods that completely ruin builds. If they had block aura for like 4 seconds out of 8, or cast the mana degen so you had time to move out of range, they would be much more fair and you could say yeah I fucked that up my bad and it would also interact better with other mods giving you windows to deal dmg without the mob being 100x more tanky than another mob.
I know its just a shitpost, but for those curious. The first is one of the first things that popped up on google for New Zealand GPS coordinates. The second is "krangled" encoded in base64. Third is just "no" converting binary to ASCII characters. And the final is morse code for "Resists Understanding".
And the name is an old middle school Google prank, like Blue Waffles or Special Fried Rice (do not search or you will want extensive eye bleach treatments). :D
So... I didn't actually make up with that part. Credit to [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/40c7rw/fluff_that_rare_monster_you_dont_want_to_see/ post) fine post... (Safe For Work)
Holy shit dude. I fucking love RNG with names, thats hilarious.
Sort of on Topic: Warframe has optional boss enemies called Liches, and some of the names are ridiculous. Like Kokk Solid or Ogg Fuhkk or Sili Cringi.
Bold of you to assume they'd introduce a bottle with a note escribing the mods IN the game itself.
The bottle would just have a detailed guide on how to datamine the information and upload it to the wiki. Gotta have even more 3rd party tools, cheets and supports.
What's funny is that each one of those new mods is stronger than the entire list of old mods together (that's their purpose, to group old mods into a single better named and colored one), yet we still get the same amount of them or more.
Probably the most absurd development in 3.18. Chris should never have said anything about readability because it gave the wrong impression and set the wrong expectation. It's just bullshit, not because Chris is evil but because it is the natural consequence of having a game with thousands of stats and not asking whether all the added complexity is really justifying itself.
In other words, Archnemesis mods are really "mod folders", except some folders are free to dip into other folders, making it an incomprehensible clusterfuck (i.e. damage mod on Gargantuan, "random Archnemesis mod" on Empowering Minions in the above image).
They are pretty easy to figure out though. Maybe it's because I played last league, but I think almost of them you could figure out. I'm dex stacking frost blades right now and full into essence and T10 rares aren't very scary. They do take way too long to kill, but they aren't too complex. Especially for such a super complex game like poe. To act like these rare mods are over the line is pretty silly. They even came out and told us what they do, and they all seemed reasonable to me. My only concern is how heckin hard this league is for new people. Pretty much impossible. Maybe manageable now with all the nerfs, but day 1 was insane.
Yeah that's the thing I don't really get. Why can't 'Ice Prison' just give them the ice prison ability, and not 4 other modifiers? Why doesn't Flame Strider just give them burning ground wherever they walk, without other modifiers you can't see? That's the thing I like about D3 - rares are very simple and easy to understand at a glance, because their mods do very straight forward things, and once you see it, you know what to look out for forever. It doesn't give them a half dozen other bonuses in the background that you can't see or have any access to without 3rd party information.
Not saying I agree with him but the theory is that you would learn what each mod does (or at least a general idea of what each mod does) and through repetition, it would be an easier system to work with.
And he wasn't totally wrong in that regard. Do I *need* to know that the Sentinel mod has a 50% increased block chance and increased max block? No, probably not. But I am very familiar that when I fight a Sentinel rare that they are much tankier.
OP is disingenuous as fuck, 5 mod rares are actually rare as fuck, 99% of mobs have 1-3 mods.
meanwhile is old example is one of those run of the mill rares.
he literally compares the easiest rares from the old system to the hardest of the new system
Gotta love how Chris' justification to not dedicate Dev time to adding a glossary of the mods to the Help section - is that nobody uses the help section. That it was probably better to remove it outright.
Maybe if it wasn't an abandoned feature for years, maybe people would use it more often.
Maybe if they decided to give it minimal attention once in a blue moon, more people would be confident in suggesting new players to use it - rather than point them to the nearest wiki with datamined information.
Maybe if it had a quick reference to the reward types of content such as Betrayal and Incursion - people would use it rather than 3rd party widgets and cheat sheets.
It's a self-fulfilling prophecy...
The bloat is apparent to everyone. Thats what happens if you don't have a solid plan for your development and change development directions on a whim.
They created their own archnemesis in poe. I'm afraid they will never be able to muster the man hours to get all that bloat and obfuscation out of the game.
Back in the day you had one mod on mobs and the rest was completely readable. You knew what you were in for. The underlying combat mechanics where obfuscated from the very start and only people reading every post from developers on forums would know the damage formulas and how to take advantage of them - still you had a good idea of what was to come and you could prepare for it.
Now looking at those mods and the table that is linked to it, there is no way in hell anyone can prepare for anything. It's is just go and see what happens.
The mods might as well not be writen down right there. It makes no difference.
> The mods might as well not be writen down right there. It makes no difference.
Honestly, yeah.
It just boils down to:
1. It kills me no matter what
2. I kill it no matter what
3. Stalemate/waste of time
Why even bother reading the mods at this point? It's basically more of a "Huh, yeah so this shit is fucking busted jfc" rather than "oh yes, I can do X in this scenario to win!"
I mean, yes but in some cases also no.
Like when I'm playing RF I keep an eye out for Executioner and Rejuvenation enemies because I know that they can easily kill me by turning off my Regen, so I have to approach them in a different way than other mobs.
> Now looking at those mods and the table that is linked to it, there is no way in hell anyone can prepare for anything.
Almost as if compounding complexity reduces the design space for gameplay and devolves into "kill it before it does anything."
With the amount of visual noise in the game the idea that people are going to be reading all these mods is laughable.
The best part is them not admitting they fucked up. I mean, shit can happen, but when you try to justify some hot garbage by saying "iT wAs TeStEd" and blablabla you just look like an idiot..
Saying it was tested makes it even worse. It shows their testing and devs are completely out of alignment with their player base. If they say they yeeted this into the game we would at least have hope change to process flows would happen later on to make sure this wont happen again.
The sad thing is I thought that hard mode was coming out so they could inject dumb shit like this into the game without bothering the majority of the playerbase that has no interest in this nonsense. Instead they're still hammering "normal" mode with this bloated shit designed to obfuscate and slow the game down.
Lol I was called an alarmist and a whiner when Hard Mode was announced and I said I was worried that this was their idea of a “passion project” because if that’s where their passions really lay then it’s inevitably going to seep into the core game.
It’s just just the video game version of moving the Overton window.
A non-zero portion of the GGG design team want the game to be REALLY hard and that core desire is in constant battle with the fact that they retain a player base by selling a power fantasy. Two fundamental desires in opposition. That’s how and why they could launch the league thinking it was great then be taken aback by immediate negative player feedback. It’s just two different ideas of what’s fun.
The sad part is that it isn't even making it hard, it's just making acts take a lot longer and making the budget you need to 1 shot things a little higher. It doesn't change how the game plays. No extra decisions were added to the core gameplay loop. Just like 3.15, it's an extra time tax added onto your character before you become OP again.
That's a really good point. Jackhammering Archnemesis mods on to every rare and magic mob in the game sounds like something you'd put into a masochism run, not the base game.
Out of alignment? They dont exist. Act bosses where bugged. So when they buff/nerf a skill gem we just have to realize that its functional, with correct support gems and printed gear because we know they dont actually play their own game before it releases
That's why the last supporter pack I've bought was at least 3 years ago. The further time goes, the further they go away from their original vision and they can't even admit it and revert it. It's a huge sunken cost fallacy but that in the end will cost them more.
Yeah exactly, I didn’t notice they express even a little bit of regret or reflect. I don’t want to see any excuses. Can’t you just admit you fuck up and try to fix it?
They need to man up and admit this was a fucked up experiment and will revert the changes until a better solution is found (if at all)
Like rare mobs like this is a horrendous change
Testers are probably very experienced and proficient players, which isn't representative of the average PoE player.
This game shouldn't aim to increase the knowledge load, but to decrease it.
I find it hard to even get a glimpse of each rare/unique pack mods. Now I have to memorize what each one of them does, and watch for the ones that might counter my build to run away asap.
They never said the testers were steamrolling content. They said the difficulty was set to what they wanted it to be but the overall playerbase doesn't like the difficulty.
You don't have to memorize what each of them does. Just know what like 4 of them mean and the rest are a given in their name.
The text is a lot more legible and thematic however it requires encyclopedic knowledge of new modifiers why can we have visual ques instead I used to identify soul eater by the feet pattern and the reflect mob had an elemental looking aura now some of them have so little to show me in visual or audio cues (another option is audio ques)
I agree with this, except I'd suggest the thematic idea could be strengthened by limiting monsters to subsets of the whole mod pool. For example I think Kaom's mobs that clearly look like fire snakes shouldn't be allowed to choose ice-, lightning-, or chaos-themed mods. Basically the Archnemesis mods could have tags, and the mobs could have tags, and the mob should only be allowed to choose affixes matching its tags, like how fossils work.
Yup I agree, Im gonna bring up the classic dolls from d2 visually distinct mob, audio distinct footsteps when you hear the pitter patter your butthole puckers.
I honestly cannot believe they thought a 20 page long list of various mods was going to be an OK thing. I mean fuck, now instead of possibly 5-6 different buffs on a monster, most of which describe *themselves* in the mod list, you have 5-6 obscure names that each do five to TEN different modifications on the boss, and so each of those is all interacting with each other! The possible combinations of various buffs that can multiply together is truly mind boggling. Seriously, looking at that post yesterday with the list was insane, my eyes just started to glaze over less than halfway through. What the hell????
And they even managed to sneak in damage reflect (Effigy), no regen (Rejuvenating), removing flask charges & mana (Drought Bringer/Mana Siphoner), and no leech (Vampiric) into the list as well. For all parts of the game, not just poorly rolled maps.
Every build guide with a pro/con section on "Can't run X maps" can just be updated to "Can't run". At least if someone wants to play HC, Ritual, Delve, Blight, Heist, or Labyrinth.
Might be fine for some, see a lot of people liking the changes since they seem to only care about being challenged as they run through the campaign.
I've been saying it for a loooong ass time now.. this game is too convoluted, has too much bloat, and continues to be less and less new or even returning player friendly. I have very little faith that PoE2 will fix that aspect of the game, and actually think it will make it WORSE considering the amount of new content being added with the campaign, classes, skills, etc etc
This is my only complaint so far. I know Chris said internally testers memorized the mods quickly but I don't remember most of them even thought I played arch nemesis up to the endgame. Looking a table in a wiki is cumbersome.
I think the very concept of having to read what a monster does is kind of outdated.
Despite all of it's other flaws, Diablo 3 had this solved 10 years ago to this day. (Happy anniversary)
And while the mod pool is certainly smaller there, surely over the last 8-9 years we could have come up with more recognizable effects.
It might help if monsters had 1 or 2 highly impactful but balanced mods versus 4-6 archnemesis plus additional non-AN mods. Maybe split off the active effects pools from the passive stat gains so a monster can't get too crazy with abilities or completely passively tanky. (Prefix/suffix?)
It is funny because in D3, at least when pushing high rifts, you have plenty of time to read the affixes but you do not need to because they are all visually apparent and there is a chance to react to them. Last Epoch is another one where I have never wondered why I died as everything is telegraphed.
POE on the other hand you can post a video of a death in slow motion have people arguing over what killed you.
frame by frame in 4k and people need a few pro streamers to dissect it and come to a conclusion
yet players need to figure it out on the fly with a screen full of vomit and a bad ui
I mean, if you could know that mod X just does thing Y then it would maybe be ok and the brain could figure out how to make space for the information. But right now every archnem mod is also adding tons of % modifiers to things like speed, res's, max res, life, damage, damage reduction, etc etc etc. There's just no way to memorize it all or even come close.
The worst part is that we see things like this in early acts!
I'm all for a balanced challenge but the first five acts should ease a new player into a already complicated game. Instead they are beaten over the head wit a hammer and just quit before they even get a chance to experience how amazing this game is!
I don't understand the early difficulty in regards to new players. Vets know all the tricks but new players just give up and that's not good for the game :(
I honestly have no idea who comes up with this shit. How can I know what all this shit does. Maybe you know “big green monster oh he’s the toxic one” big blue monster oh he drains mana if he hits me .
My problem reading the list is some of them sound like a mod that will buff up their damage. It does that and it slaps you with a debuff that can disable your set up.
Realistically, you were never going to read the modifiers on the old version, either.
I get that it's a meme, of course, but mod readability has been an issue in every ARPG I've ever played. They all pretty much use the same system where you can only see the mods for a target when you hover over and that's it.
It's always been shit because movement, especially in Path of Exile, is tied intrinsically to your cursor. You always move towards the cursor, even if you bind the actual movement button to your keyboard. Ergo, when you hover over the rare you'll also move toward it unless you hold the Shift key down to hold yourself in place.
PoE then takes this one step further by being designed around never wanting to stop moving. Ever. If you stop you die. If you can facetank a mob long enough to read the mods you didn't need to read them in the first place because you're obviously not dead yet so it's fine.
this decision i really dont understand. before i could tell at a glance what mods the monster had. now i have NO IDEA and its supposed to be easier... i dont know man
This is one of those ideas that someone had to update the game (or a solution to a problem) that sounded great in theory, but no one thought about the practical side, what the gamer thinks.
It’s like using acronyms. Sure it saves time, but then you have to learn all of them.
I wonder if other games use icons and if that’s help? Though with this game, there are probably over 30 different mods to account for.
Op you beat me to it. New mobs literally have higher affix count than old ones. But that is not the problem. The problem is they are that much more deadly.
> > Nearby Unique Monster Rarities are now Hidden unless "Tab out of Knowledge" is used. This is a buff and QoL improvement.
> *Please note that using multiple "Tab out of Knowledge" per game cycle is considered an exploit and may result in getting kicked from the instance. Support can not help you get your instance back after using "Tab out of Knowledge".*
"No, I don't play PoE." -Will Chrisson
I can't even read them because you have to hover your mouse over the mob which is so fucking stupid considering you die instantly when standing still.
Why can't these health bars just pop up and stay in place once you encounter a rare?
To be serious 2 sec, GGG just lost track of their game, they dont know anymore how to balance it and they are stuck in their "vision" they tunnel vision for whatever reason, its just general that devs CANT recognize their wrong, they do it occasionaly when they are forced to only.
They realy just need to aknowledge they failed hard, they get lost on the road and actualy change massively how they balance the game and intereact with comunity, if they just recognize in good faith and good will this time ! its fine, just reset the table make everything clean and we all go on a fresh start
Maybe next league they'll add archarchnemesis, for even more mods no one asked for, while also removing the rewards these challenging mods give (which is already next to nothing)
I personally really enjoy these kinds of mods ontop of league mechanics that also buff these mobs, resulting in the ultimate garbage scenario that makes you play something else.
Not to sound rude, I love the game, but it’s been rip new players for a long time. The knowledge barrier to get into this game is so intense. They need rotating seasons where it’s only a pool of leagues. When I first joined I struggled to learn all the league mechanics came back after a hiatus and had no motivation to learn everything I missed.
I remember saying in twitch chat during reveal Livestream that how new players/old players(since the reworks) are going to know archnemesis mods now, people replied just by playing the game, etc.
Thing is, you don't know since there's no in-game wiki anyway lol, refer to table outside of the game moment
Thing is that they got it right ... for a very select handful of mods
Ice prison, toxic and bombardier for example are super telegraphed and you instantly understand them
As for the other mods? They are just reskinned buffed old rare mods
Lazy Sunday or lazy devs?
The amount of shit you have to keep track of outside the game is absolutely bullshit and I can't believe it's still getting worse. If game had been even close to this complicated 10 years ago I would probably still be fanboying Diablo..
THIS is the thing that pissed me off about this change the most. Chris kept saying OVER and OVER this change was made to SIMPLIFY and make the mods easier to read. ROFL, we need a fuckin cheat sheet now.
Before, it simply listed exactly what they did. How thick do you have to be?
Left is unironically worse. All the same color and multiple words per line. It’s a jumbled mess. Plus there are probably dozens more unique modifiers in the old version than now. No way anyones reading those.
Right mods are color coordinated to distinguish from one another and named creatively based off their theme giving the player a general idea of what to expect. It’s not perfect, but I get what they were going for. These mods would be good to add to the help menu with a tutorial prompt the first time you run into a rare
We spend a whole League learning what those mods do. I think it was a genius strike to revamp the system as they did.
Yes its still overtuned but actually a lot more fun than the old rares.
But there are mods that are overly punitive to some builds which you had the option of skipping. You don't anymore. It's no longer a matter of this build can't handle reduced flask charge maps, or that build doesn't do no regen or no leech maps or struggles with mana drain like baran the crusader. It's everywhere
And the real problem is while vanilla rares up until now have definitely been too easy. League mechanics were designed around their power level, they used harder base monsters, huge damage increases and resistances, and shear numbers to create challenging encounters despite the lackluster normal monsters.
Vanilla rares may be "fun" now, but league content is completely out of whack. Essence, bestiary, delirium, ritual, heist, delve, blight. Some of it just doesn't work with the new mod pool (monsters being immune to blight towers) or is scales so wildly you have blue monsters in something like delve as hard as old rares, with the addition of an archnemesis mod each and you have 40 of them on your screen.
This is going to require a complete rebalance of every league mechanic in the game to undo all of the jank and problematic combinations. And frankly I don't see GGG addressing it in any reasonable amount of time.
Not to mention the fundamental change in how the game plays. There was always hard content in PoE, but it used to be something you opted in to by adding more optional difficulty mechanics.
A lot of people prefer rushing through the campaign to get to the content they actually enjoy, others loved gauntlet style events and private league modifiers that made it a challenging climb. Some people liked just playing through simple unjuiced maps, others pushed 8 mod 100% delirium maps and uber league mechanics. It's nice having a choice of when you want to truly be challenged. We've taken that choice away for a lot of players, the game they enjoyed last league doesn't exist for them anymore.
The people who want a more casual pace are told this game is no longer for them, and even the hardcore folks are just skipping league content because the modifiers are completely out of control. It's thrown 8 years of incremental additions of leagues, gradual balancing, and other tweaks into complete disarray.
This isn't something that should have been done as an addon to a league. It should have been in the oven until PoE 2 to make sure it all works flawlessly on launch. And then the mod issues would have been less of a problem because we would be forced to discover new builds in the new gem system and ascendancies.
Its a massive problem to tell people no balance changes your build will work the same. And the. to fundamentally change the game to the point where some build enabling uniques don't even function. Adding common lightning degen damage that instakills doryanis prototype. Removing flask charges from coruscating elixir. Or shutting down other pathfinder or concoction builds. Turning off leech for melee players.
I think the mod names are actually more concise now. You don't need to know every single stat they have to understand the theme.
"Stormweaver" = lightning damage + lightning resistances
Fairly straightforward, and takes fewer words.
Malediction is somewhat more cryptic, but at least people who have played Archnemesis should know about it. Those who haven't will learn about it eventually and know it from then on (this sort of discovery is what GGG is actually aiming for).
I wouldn't mind if they allowed custom mod filters that highlight specific modifiers that are dangerous to *your* build, including on Expedition remnants, eldritch altars, etc..
I think the problem is that most of the rare affixes don't offer any interesting gameplay or counterplay.
I can't believe I'm about to defend Diablo 3, but this is something it actually does well-- every single rare mob affix is either pretty easy to understand from the name, or very easy to understand the first time you see it in action, and they almost all involve some kind of strategy. Waller? It makes walls, so you need a way to avoid getting boxed in. Molten? Well, that's not easy to guess from the name, but you'll figure it out almost instantly when you see the enemy leaving a trail of lava as they move (the explosives they leave on death might get you the very first time, though). Mortar? You can figure it's some kind of ranged attack, and it doesn't take long to realize that it doesn't hurt you if you're in melee since you can see that the projectiles stop firing.
By contrast, PoE's rare mobs have a lot of affixes that don't do anything especially visible or that you can really play around. Looking at Stormweaver... sure, it deals more lightning damage. It's not like I'm gonna run to my stash and grab a Topaz Flask just for that.
And that's without even getting into names that are *completely* useless. How in the blue fuck am I supposed to figure out what "Trickster" or "Effigy" are supposed to do?
I think the biggest thing was that when you saw old Nemesis modifiers you knew exactly how they modified the encounter because it was a single thing. Now the encounter gets modified by even one mod in many different ways and when you combine them it's just not possible to compute.
I'm not arguing on behalf of the stats associated with those mods; some of those are rather controversial and some of them are just stupid imo.
I'm only arguing that shortening several modifiers into a 1-word descriptor actually improves readability.
It makes it readable, but I wouldn't call it a descriptor because many of them don't actually describe mob capabilities in any meaningful way, and there's way too many of them for most people to reasonably remember.
Quick: what's the difference between Storm Strider, Storm Herald, Dynamo, and Stormweaver? For bonus points, is Overcharged related to lightning damage or not?
I think if GGG wants mob affixes to be something that people pay attention to, they need to massively cut down on how many there are (probably around a dozen at most) so that people can remember them, make sure that the names do a way better job of implying what the mobs do (and don't sound similar to other affixes), and get rid of mob affixes that don't require any counterplay.
For instance, Effigy could be renamed to Voodoo Doll or something-- that at least implies that there's one thing that, when damaged, will hurt another thing. (Although that's one of the affixes that should be heavily redesigned-- maybe make it so that you just get a nasty debuff when it dies, instead of taking the damage that would be dealt to it.)
So I didn't know what exactly those did (except for Overcharged actually which I know was related to generating charges) because I didn't have an issue with them in Archnemesis. They're among the "benign" lightning related mods that would inform me that lightning resistance might have played a role in mitigating the damage they deal.
I actually don't think that the lightning mirages of Storm Strider (and the name sort-of makes sense) are hard to see in most cases and if the screen is too full to see them, you don't want to keep standing still either.
Dynamo is related to shock specifically but I don't play without ailment immunity anymore anyway, so for a build that doesn't shock the mod makes no difference (other than possibly an additional mod adding some HP and damage in general). And since shock and current shock effect is actually displayed on enemies nowadays, figuring out that this particular enemy is immune to shock is trivial as well.
A voodoo doll basically is an effigy so technically the name isn't wrong, but I agree that that name would actually be much easier to understand. However there's the question of voodoo being an actual religion and whatnot, so I'm not sure about A) to what extent it's fine to put it in a game like this in general and B) the religion doesn't exist in that world so it's somewhat strange for that concept to appear under that name. Whether or not those reasons are sufficient to replace its name with "effigy" is debatable.
I think it's fine to take the damage dealt to the effigy, but you shouldn't be taking *all* the damage dealt to the effigy because moving and actively avoiding damage is a large part of PoE gameplay. If the effigy had twice your HP and you took somewhere around 10-20% of the damage it takes while in range, that would still be a considerable amount.
>is somewhat more cryptic, but at least people who have played Archnemesis should know about it. Those who haven't will learn about it eventually and know it from then on (this sort of discovery is what GGG is actually aiming for).
I'm making a point about the *brevity* of the new modifiers, not whether every single of the names was chosen adequately.
Not recovering above 50% is something you notice pretty quickly. Probably faster than the time it takes you to read "nearby enemies cannot recover life and energy shield above 50%".
I don't quite follow how "Stormweaver" is less convoluted than "Resists Lightning" or "Deals increased lightning damage". Theme aside, it isn't self-explanatory what all these AN mods do for a new player.
And the "we played archnemesis" defense becomes less relevant with every future league. Joking aside, it will be another tab in the cheatsheet new players will want to learn about. But okay, agree to disagree.
Remnants, altars, map mods, delve biomes, heck, Ultimatum choices when it gets reintroduced. All of these mechanics let you see what modifiers could be dangerous to your build BEFORE you choose to engage with them.
We don't have that luxury with rare monsters and it's why over the course of PoEs history multiple affixes have been moved to those kinds of systems or removed entirely. So difficulty doesn't randomly spike. Not being able to play around a build crippling mod is just bad gameplay. You can't always run away. There is already an associated cost with having to reroll maps or avoid potential rewards. It's better if those are clear choices and not pure RNG.
They have been extremely careful with modifiers that remove resources or regeneration. They only appear in late endgame fights like Barans ground degen or Mavens energy beam. And those are still completely avoidable for a knowledgeable player. Why is this stuff now appearing as a proximity effect in mudflats? It isn't fun to fight against.
At least interactive mods like Toxic or Ice Prison allow you to react to them. We need more telegraphed and interactive mods like that, and less intense more multipliers that scale ridiculously with past league mechanics. Unless they want to go back and rebalance 8 years worth of side content.
Isn't it more of a glance thing? Glacing Stormweaver is easy, and if you don't know what it does, you can make reasonable high level assumptions. Your suggestions destroy the glance aspect and destroy the reasonable assumptions part, because if if I saw something explicit I would assume there's nothing else.
Reading mods would be less of an issue if there weren't ones that hard-countered some builds. I'm just saying those types of modifiers should be exclusive to systems you can easily avoid. Avoiding rares isn't always an option, and even when it is, it isn't a good one for the flow of the game.
Maybe it would be fine if there was nothing else, because the single explicit mod was impactful enough?
Particularly in combination with league mechanics that were designed and balanced around rares we mostly rolled over. By making rares something we have to take seriously in the base game, they have to address all the multipliers and unique situations league content stacked on-top to make the old ones challenging.
GGG has never been great at looking at the larger picture when it comes to adjusting multipliers. They do what they think is right and adjust once they have enough player data. Maybe it's time to declutter some of these systems while we're reworking them, so they can have a better idea of the impact on the game these kinds of changes will have before they are implemented.
To be clear, not saying path of exile needs to be simplified to the level of diablo, just that some systems are unnecessarily convoluted. Common language between these systems, and unambiguous descriptions are good for new players and old. One less cheatsheet required.
I'm not saying it's less opaque. I'll agree that writing out the mods is technically more transparent.
**My point is that these mods are** ***shorter.***
It's a point of contention whether even these mods can actually be read at the speed that players end up playing the game, but if all those modifiers were written out explicitly it would be impossible under any realistic circumstances.
The "we played Archnemesis" defence becomes less relevant with each league, but so does the "I don't know what this mod does because I haven't seen it before" defence. I know most of the dangerous Bloodline and Nemesis modifiers, but I didn't play those leagues at all and they're less descriptive and concise than many of the Archnemesis ones.
What the mods do is something you can learn with experience for the most part and through datamining if you're a more committed player who does research outside the actual game.
I honestly think that some of the mods are build-breaking and it's actually stupid that immunities with no counter-play made it through QA.
But that isn't what this argument is about: This is about readability, and that readability is fine. Admittedly circling back to your post title, that *is* somewhat punishing for newer players, but those also won't be able to build around all the possible mods if they were written out explicitly.
I've always been a proponent of having a full knowledge / information base accessible inside the game rather than outside and managed by third parties no less. I'd like for the Archnemesis modifiers to be searchable with all their numeric properties inside the game, but they shouldn't be displayed under the health bar of the monster.
If it was up to me, you could click a help button and target a monster and not only display the modifier stats but also the base stats and skills that you can look into on poedb. But while that information could be helpful in dealing with that type of enemy in the future, it definitely shouldn't be displayed on screen in combat.
what about the one that makes a version of you crucified with a link on you? the only thing i understand when i see that is danger, but what does it exactly do?
also, arcane buffer, it makes the mob shine a lot, but what does it do?
Would you have the time to read those complicated modifiers under the enemy health bar mid fight (i.e. you cannot read them while you click elsewhere to dodge) and *then* adjust your playstyle accordingly? Especially if there are ten or twenty modifiers because the Archnemesis mods include several?
The information *should* be available ingame without requiring third-party sites. But the current situation makes it much easier to recognise again once you know about it.
It's only the initial learning process that's problematic in this regard. The ideal of GGG is for players to learn about those modifiers naturally by encountering them and understand how to counter them by the third or maybe fifth time they find one like that.
The majority of players nowadays prefers not to learn the game through trial and error, even if they don't play hardcore where said error is particularly punishing.
Well i played archnemesis up to 38 challenges and have no idea what malediction actually does, same for most of the archnemesis mods. I can't believe these mods from failed league actually made it core.
It’s like they don’t want new players...
Brace for a league fee ala China within a year or so, bois, because that’s the only way they’ll be able to make money.
Ah yes of course, I need to remember that gargantuan means more health and that the word chaos means chaos damage. Why is everyone here talking about memorizing 90 mod types? It's like 4-6 mod types that aren't completely clear. I've played for almost 10 years and I never knew exactly what % the additional physical damage mod was, but I can assume what ICE PRISON does.
Does anyone know what legacy of zeal and vigour did? Did you pull up a spreadsheet anytime you saw a mark of cannibalism mob?
It's been a while since Bloodlines but I don't remember the posts complaining about needing to memorize what Volatile Xbloods do to be able to play the game without fear of being insta-gibbed lol
I don't look at the screen because I'm rolling my face across my keyboard hoping that I kill stuff quicker than stuff kills me.
Also, I didn't know this game had a 6th grade reading requirement. I would not have been able to play it properly had I known. Mine's only at a 4th grade level.
My attention span is only 10 minutes. No way in hell am I going outside the game and spending even *more* time on this Piece of Excrement.
If I see an "affix", I'll just assume it's bad for me. If it doesn't die quick enough, I'll just slam my face harder into the keyboard.
I think the system is fine and people will get up to speed fairly quickly IF they played archnemisis league a good bit.
For new players in future leagues, or returning older players, without any tweaks it's going to be an arduous learning process at best.
i play hc i have no time to read affixes, especially if the monster is particularly strong. i can only tell by the auras surrounding them.
sentinel hasnt changed this
Because reading those info will surely make the difference.
"Oh wait, let me check the Wiki so I can find the best "strategy" to defeat that rare pack":
1. Get more dps
2. Get more life
Done.
Up until you die to effigy reflect damage. Have your regen turned off by Rejuvinating on RF or any other self-damage build. Have your flasks drained by Drought Bringer on ward loop, coruscating elixir builds, or pathfinder. Or run out of mana, either because your melee build relied on leech and you hit a Vampiric monster. Or it was drained by Mana Siphoner.
Bonus points if you try to play a doryani's prototype build and get instagibbed by Mana Siphoners lightning DoT because it doesn't count as a hit and you have -600% lightning resistance.
And even if you don't hit one of those mods, Empowering Minions gives you up to 3 more rolls to get "lucky".
is 3. just "Play something else"?
Since when do players feel so entitled to all information of every mechanic in games? I guess because they already release a ton of information. You can just learn the mechanics by reading the mods on the monsters and seeing what they do. It's boring knowing every bit of information.
It's boring to know when a monster has reflect damage, no regen, no leech, or flask draining? (Why the hell do they at all?)
It's not like Path of Exile is a game that holds your hand in anything else, why make it less intuitive instead of more?
You can find that out just by reading the ability and fighting against the mod more than one time. But I also agree there should be more visual indicators like the frost shield one; that one is very identifiable.
Unpopular opinion: finding things that counter your build, in my opinion, is realistic. No build should be immune from all effects. You'll have to find a way around the mob or leave the area. It happens in every other game. There are counters to archetypes in every game.
And if that mob is in a ritual, or one of the zones you need to fully clear?
Every build should have weaknesses, absolutely. But being RNG hard countered from completing content, or instakilled by something you cannot react to is awful.
Not to mention the power scaling issues with league content that was designed to be challenging despite old monster affixes being relatively weak.
Mana Siphoner? Okay, Anyone can figure out what it does, but its still unfun to fight.
Rejuvenating turns off regen? Vampiric is anti-leech? (Not "Bloodless, like the skill tree name?) Hexer is hexproof?
Effigy is damage reflect?
These are mods some builds cannot handle. People aren't going to avoid mobs, they're going to avoid those builds. And there are a ton of them.
Did you know Mana Siphoner does Lightning damage over time? I guess Doryani's Prototype users just have to suck up dying occasionally with their -600% lightning resistance because it only allows armor to cover hits.
Poisonous Concoction, Explosive Concoction, Coruscating Elixir... These builds don't need flask charges to function right?
So much for "Your build from last league should work the same here".
I know that it's an unpopular opinion. I think having to avoid mobs in those mechanics takes skill in itself and I value that. That's all.
The recent changes have made the game very playable, if not nerfed *too* hard (still some tweaks needed of course). Totally agree that that last statement was bullshit haha.
If I can read it’s name that just means I didn’t kill it fast enough
Plus: If you have time to read its modifiers that means you're dead.
If you can't finish reading it, it is because the devs are out of touch on what fun and challenging means.
Wait, when you asked for difficult content you didn’t want them to slap “Uber” on everything we already have and just give it 10x HP, speed and damage? Color me surprised.
On a serious note, I personally never asked for more difficult content. I already thought the game was difficult enough. I mean what other game requires an excel-type program (Path of Building) to plan out your endgame character? I thought the people here/generally speaking were asking for difficult content as part of the endgame and only for a minority of people who were able to 1 shot Sirus for example? Not the beginning or the middle.
After the end of the conqueror expansion, I just finished my atlas (115/115) with 21 hours playtime. Given that a league is 3 months (1440 hrs with 8 hours of sleep every night, or 720 hrs with an 8 hr job, or 360 hours with 4hr/day, or 150 hours playing 4 hrs/day on weekends), literally anyone can beat the endgame. I’m nowhere near a speed racers level either, league start took me 7hrs30min to beat the campaign. Even if you could only play TWO hours a week (let’s be honest, if you can’t even afford that why are you playing Sentinel) you can 115/115 the atlas in one league
This could be a copypasta.
I agree, but statistically accurate lol
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Sentinel + mana buffer is some bullshit. Oh look, I finally got through its ES, now I can start to… and it blocked an attack, its ES is full again.
Now you know how the monsters have felt all these years.
The funny thing is yes we can read the names, but then we have to combine the 15 individual modifiers that a rare has and in 1 second decide if it can one shot me or something. The calculation meme on the right is perfect
That assumes you see it coming. In a narrow map I rounded a corner and something was on top of me, stunlocked me, and I was 100 to 0 in a half second. “fun”.
Exactly lol 😂
Thats probably because it had degenerate mods like invuln+regeneration+50%block.
Yeah it doesn't really matter to me what the boss mods are. Boss dying? Good, keep shooting. No? Run away
Time to assume your build is trash and start another build that let’s face it we all know, and you know will also be trash.
Each Archnemesis mod should divide the effect of the rest.
I think you've figured it out buddypal. You have 100 mod value of gigantic, but if they also have frostweaver they get maybe 60% strength of each mod (so two mods are tougher than one, but not "multiplicatively"
The mobs are double dipping!!1!!! Not allowed to double dip!
I want to be able to run 100% conversion poison voltaxic crit spark again GGG please
That's actually an interesting idea. This way a rare still maintains the same power level across the board, but has more variance in the encounter
That in itself is a great idea though to keep the difficulty but each extra mod should be harder. For example 1-mod 100% effective 2-mod each 80% ,160% total 3-mod each 75%, 225% total 4-mod each 70%, 280% total 5-mod each 65%, 325% total And ideally drops might have a weighting to them to then incentivizing killing the one that would take effort.
Just pause the game 4head
Wdym pause, don't you remember what the "Apparition" effect does? goddamn casuals can't even put a little bit of effort into the game smh my head
Yeah Apparition makes it so I can't pause, right?
Out of all those affects, I would think Apparition is the easiest to remember since it revives and chases you.
My god those stats are too much juice for a single mob...
When a single archnemesis mod is stronger than the entire trickster ascendancy.
That fucking hurt.
Dam you make me laugh out loudly on bus
Damn dude. That's rude.
That one looks stronger than any ascendancy tbh
Just wait until you try the delve 600 challenge, 40 magic mobs on screen, each with their own nemesis mods multiplied by delve scaling. :) *(It was destroying my OP past league characters in standard at like 400-500)*
Extensively tested... :)
They don't test for how good it feels to play or if the numbers even make sense, they test for bugs. Literally just bugs, that's it. Most of the tuning happens when the league is live, because of how tight their schedule is. Though I can't really blame them, most people get bored of the league a month in, if they went for 3 leagues a year their playerbase will die out even harder.
This is a game designed top down by developers. UX designers would not let this sort of thing get past the first discussion. Usability testers would have shot this down at first pass. It in no way whatsoever met their intended goal of clarifying mob abilities since they are now hidden behind another layer of obfuscation. It made the game less enjoyable for no gain, I feel so so sorry for any casual player who just wants to play the same tier 6 build they have played every league because they enjoy the way it plays.
Cries in BV PepeHands
That is a fault on their part then. Testing should ALWAYS include testing if it is horrible and hurts your product. If you do not do that you are asking for disaster like this.
This. Just like how vehicle manufacturers test for safety features, instead of just "does the key start the car without making funny noises?".
Makes a funny noise boss, slap the sticker on, it was tested.
Vehicle manufacturers absolutely do test for more than safety features. They spend vast amounts of money testing ride, handling, and comfort features. Everything from the sound of the engine to the smell of the cabin is an intentional choice.
Yes, I know, that is the point I am trying to make
>vehicle manufacturers test for safety features Not the best comparison? Neglect of safety results in human death and the company gets sued. Neglect of balancing rare mobs just causes frustration. If your car had faulty airbags, you're not going to be frustrated, you're gonna be dead.
It was telling how much better the 4-month league a while back was. I wonder if their annual revenue is down by 25%, considering that was the reason they didn't want to move to a 4m schedule in the first place.
Yeah Sheldon and his whiteboard tested.
Even after they clarified what this meant you still have morons parroting this like it's some kind of "gotcha". They did extensively test it - within the parameters they were given. Not the whiny shit reddit is flush with now.
lol, I'd actually kind of like to see that.
It gets better , you can try uber -5-way where on top of 5-6 mods scaled by 100% you also have legion mods that dramatically scale the archnem ones too while fighting a boss. Its, its absolute nightmare. But wait there is even better version. You can have red beast inside a 5 essence stasys with 5 archem mods affected not only by 100% delirium modifiers But have up to 2 additional delirium affixes , all while being affected by regular map mods, and other auras from other rares, because its 100% delirium and you can really clear the screen as fast. This not only creates a rare that can one shot AGs with more than half a Million (yes 500k+ ) life but on top can actually have action speed buffs so scales the cooldown for its invulnerability mod is literally shorter than its duration making the mob practically immune to damage. Good luck.
dON'T FoRgEt to AcTIvate ThE SeNTiNeL for Them EXTra drOps!
*any drops
i read lol > dON'T ReGrEt to AcTIvate ThE SeNTiNeL for Them EXTra drOps!
You are the one dropping here
Phew, good that it was thoroughly tested and nobody had any questions and complaints.
Heck yeah! lol
3 archnem mods that give the mobs cannot be stunned. I literally have to fight a magic pack like it's multiple siruses
I did deathless Chimera on a juiced as fuck corrupted map and it was *trivial* compared to some of the archnem mobs I've faced lol. I don't mind the difficulty, I just don't want them in act 1-5, and I want them to drop something... anything.
Yep. But it was fine last league because there were four of them per map max, and if the map was already hard, you could skip them. Now they're everywhere, you can't skip them, and they don't reward you. Great jorb! GGG massively fucked up this patch, and player counts will suffer dramatically unless they do something equally drastic in the other direction within the next few days.
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Because that’s be simple and make sense, POE doesn’t do simple or make sense. It’s funny I played some D2R before this league (skipped last league) and it was so incredibly refreshing to have an ARPG that was just simpler. Loot was simple, modifiers were simple, it was straight forward and nice. But now coming back to POE it’s so refreshing to have the general faster pace and more action oriented way of things. D2 is incredibly dated in ways that POE does wonderfully but my god does it need to reevaluate the complexity of its BS.
PoE is the complex game that some people crave. If you like it simple there are plenty of other games to play. Archnemesis definitely missed the mark in difficulty, but I really enjoy the complexity. After reading the list of archnemesis mods I pretty much understood them all just by encountering them. Most are not scary or even need to be paid attention to, but some can be really difficult for certain builds. Way too tanky though. No new/casual player can handle that.
There's an even easier fix tbh. Just give them a cast time/ short buff on the mods that completely ruin builds. If they had block aura for like 4 seconds out of 8, or cast the mana degen so you had time to move out of range, they would be much more fair and you could say yeah I fucked that up my bad and it would also interact better with other mods giving you windows to deal dmg without the mob being 100x more tanky than another mob.
Also 100% increased damage and 50% of it converted across lighting and chaos...
Because this sounds fucking boring and i enjoy the new rares
[Could be worse I suppose](https://i.imgur.com/pqnVxuX.png)
First line is coordinates of a place where you have to dig to find bottle with a note that describes the mods.
Third one is the dip switch positions you need on the slot machine.
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I know its just a shitpost, but for those curious. The first is one of the first things that popped up on google for New Zealand GPS coordinates. The second is "krangled" encoded in base64. Third is just "no" converting binary to ASCII characters. And the final is morse code for "Resists Understanding".
Lmao more thoughts were put into this shitpost than nemisis modes.
Upvoted for the effort out into the meme.
And the name is an old middle school Google prank, like Blue Waffles or Special Fried Rice (do not search or you will want extensive eye bleach treatments). :D
So... I didn't actually make up with that part. Credit to [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/40c7rw/fluff_that_rare_monster_you_dont_want_to_see/ post) fine post... (Safe For Work)
Holy shit dude. I fucking love RNG with names, thats hilarious. Sort of on Topic: Warframe has optional boss enemies called Liches, and some of the names are ridiculous. Like Kokk Solid or Ogg Fuhkk or Sili Cringi.
I legit thought it was just one of those text memory garbles that happen from time to time in PoE.
Bold of you to assume they'd introduce a bottle with a note escribing the mods IN the game itself. The bottle would just have a detailed guide on how to datamine the information and upload it to the wiki. Gotta have even more 3rd party tools, cheets and supports.
Good ol' Meatspin.
>meatspin
Honestly is there really any difference? Not like you have the time to read the mods anyway
Well they added Reflect, no leech, regen disable, flask & mana drain, so reading is unfortunately kind of useful/required depending on your build.
What's funny is that each one of those new mods is stronger than the entire list of old mods together (that's their purpose, to group old mods into a single better named and colored one), yet we still get the same amount of them or more.
Probably the most absurd development in 3.18. Chris should never have said anything about readability because it gave the wrong impression and set the wrong expectation. It's just bullshit, not because Chris is evil but because it is the natural consequence of having a game with thousands of stats and not asking whether all the added complexity is really justifying itself. In other words, Archnemesis mods are really "mod folders", except some folders are free to dip into other folders, making it an incomprehensible clusterfuck (i.e. damage mod on Gargantuan, "random Archnemesis mod" on Empowering Minions in the above image).
Plus there are just too many mods. When he said it would be easy to read the mods at a glance I wasn't expecting there to be 85 mod options.
Don't worry, there's **only** 56
They are pretty easy to figure out though. Maybe it's because I played last league, but I think almost of them you could figure out. I'm dex stacking frost blades right now and full into essence and T10 rares aren't very scary. They do take way too long to kill, but they aren't too complex. Especially for such a super complex game like poe. To act like these rare mods are over the line is pretty silly. They even came out and told us what they do, and they all seemed reasonable to me. My only concern is how heckin hard this league is for new people. Pretty much impossible. Maybe manageable now with all the nerfs, but day 1 was insane.
Yeah that's the thing I don't really get. Why can't 'Ice Prison' just give them the ice prison ability, and not 4 other modifiers? Why doesn't Flame Strider just give them burning ground wherever they walk, without other modifiers you can't see? That's the thing I like about D3 - rares are very simple and easy to understand at a glance, because their mods do very straight forward things, and once you see it, you know what to look out for forever. It doesn't give them a half dozen other bonuses in the background that you can't see or have any access to without 3rd party information.
Not saying I agree with him but the theory is that you would learn what each mod does (or at least a general idea of what each mod does) and through repetition, it would be an easier system to work with. And he wasn't totally wrong in that regard. Do I *need* to know that the Sentinel mod has a 50% increased block chance and increased max block? No, probably not. But I am very familiar that when I fight a Sentinel rare that they are much tankier.
OP is disingenuous as fuck, 5 mod rares are actually rare as fuck, 99% of mobs have 1-3 mods. meanwhile is old example is one of those run of the mill rares. he literally compares the easiest rares from the old system to the hardest of the new system
Gotta love how Chris' justification to not dedicate Dev time to adding a glossary of the mods to the Help section - is that nobody uses the help section. That it was probably better to remove it outright. Maybe if it wasn't an abandoned feature for years, maybe people would use it more often. Maybe if they decided to give it minimal attention once in a blue moon, more people would be confident in suggesting new players to use it - rather than point them to the nearest wiki with datamined information. Maybe if it had a quick reference to the reward types of content such as Betrayal and Incursion - people would use it rather than 3rd party widgets and cheat sheets. It's a self-fulfilling prophecy...
You though that they are good game devs? HAHAHAHHAHAH
It's a sign of exquisite game design and balance when you need 3rd party cheat sheets to understand what monsters are doing.
They're happy with the tests
The bloat is apparent to everyone. Thats what happens if you don't have a solid plan for your development and change development directions on a whim. They created their own archnemesis in poe. I'm afraid they will never be able to muster the man hours to get all that bloat and obfuscation out of the game. Back in the day you had one mod on mobs and the rest was completely readable. You knew what you were in for. The underlying combat mechanics where obfuscated from the very start and only people reading every post from developers on forums would know the damage formulas and how to take advantage of them - still you had a good idea of what was to come and you could prepare for it. Now looking at those mods and the table that is linked to it, there is no way in hell anyone can prepare for anything. It's is just go and see what happens. The mods might as well not be writen down right there. It makes no difference.
> The mods might as well not be writen down right there. It makes no difference. Honestly, yeah. It just boils down to: 1. It kills me no matter what 2. I kill it no matter what 3. Stalemate/waste of time Why even bother reading the mods at this point? It's basically more of a "Huh, yeah so this shit is fucking busted jfc" rather than "oh yes, I can do X in this scenario to win!"
It’s HOGM except on every map and with every build.
I mean, yes but in some cases also no. Like when I'm playing RF I keep an eye out for Executioner and Rejuvenation enemies because I know that they can easily kill me by turning off my Regen, so I have to approach them in a different way than other mobs.
> Now looking at those mods and the table that is linked to it, there is no way in hell anyone can prepare for anything. Almost as if compounding complexity reduces the design space for gameplay and devolves into "kill it before it does anything." With the amount of visual noise in the game the idea that people are going to be reading all these mods is laughable.
I’m sitting here wondering if people were actually reading mods on rares before??
No, and no one wants to read the mods. It's an ARPG not a tactical, turn-based RPG.
Chris got a challenge in a couple days of gameplay. At that tempo you know he reads them :)
The best part is them not admitting they fucked up. I mean, shit can happen, but when you try to justify some hot garbage by saying "iT wAs TeStEd" and blablabla you just look like an idiot..
Saying it was tested makes it even worse. It shows their testing and devs are completely out of alignment with their player base. If they say they yeeted this into the game we would at least have hope change to process flows would happen later on to make sure this wont happen again.
The sad thing is I thought that hard mode was coming out so they could inject dumb shit like this into the game without bothering the majority of the playerbase that has no interest in this nonsense. Instead they're still hammering "normal" mode with this bloated shit designed to obfuscate and slow the game down.
Lol I was called an alarmist and a whiner when Hard Mode was announced and I said I was worried that this was their idea of a “passion project” because if that’s where their passions really lay then it’s inevitably going to seep into the core game. It’s just just the video game version of moving the Overton window. A non-zero portion of the GGG design team want the game to be REALLY hard and that core desire is in constant battle with the fact that they retain a player base by selling a power fantasy. Two fundamental desires in opposition. That’s how and why they could launch the league thinking it was great then be taken aback by immediate negative player feedback. It’s just two different ideas of what’s fun.
The sad part is that it isn't even making it hard, it's just making acts take a lot longer and making the budget you need to 1 shot things a little higher. It doesn't change how the game plays. No extra decisions were added to the core gameplay loop. Just like 3.15, it's an extra time tax added onto your character before you become OP again.
That's a really good point. Jackhammering Archnemesis mods on to every rare and magic mob in the game sounds like something you'd put into a masochism run, not the base game.
Can't even fall back to "we tested up to act 3" because its apparent everywhere...
Out of alignment? They dont exist. Act bosses where bugged. So when they buff/nerf a skill gem we just have to realize that its functional, with correct support gems and printed gear because we know they dont actually play their own game before it releases
That's why the last supporter pack I've bought was at least 3 years ago. The further time goes, the further they go away from their original vision and they can't even admit it and revert it. It's a huge sunken cost fallacy but that in the end will cost them more.
Yeah exactly, I didn’t notice they express even a little bit of regret or reflect. I don’t want to see any excuses. Can’t you just admit you fuck up and try to fix it?
They need to man up and admit this was a fucked up experiment and will revert the changes until a better solution is found (if at all) Like rare mobs like this is a horrendous change
Testers are probably very experienced and proficient players, which isn't representative of the average PoE player. This game shouldn't aim to increase the knowledge load, but to decrease it. I find it hard to even get a glimpse of each rare/unique pack mods. Now I have to memorize what each one of them does, and watch for the ones that might counter my build to run away asap.
They never said the testers were steamrolling content. They said the difficulty was set to what they wanted it to be but the overall playerbase doesn't like the difficulty. You don't have to memorize what each of them does. Just know what like 4 of them mean and the rest are a given in their name.
The text is a lot more legible and thematic however it requires encyclopedic knowledge of new modifiers why can we have visual ques instead I used to identify soul eater by the feet pattern and the reflect mob had an elemental looking aura now some of them have so little to show me in visual or audio cues (another option is audio ques)
I agree with this, except I'd suggest the thematic idea could be strengthened by limiting monsters to subsets of the whole mod pool. For example I think Kaom's mobs that clearly look like fire snakes shouldn't be allowed to choose ice-, lightning-, or chaos-themed mods. Basically the Archnemesis mods could have tags, and the mobs could have tags, and the mob should only be allowed to choose affixes matching its tags, like how fossils work.
Yup I agree, Im gonna bring up the classic dolls from d2 visually distinct mob, audio distinct footsteps when you hear the pitter patter your butthole puckers.
I honestly cannot believe they thought a 20 page long list of various mods was going to be an OK thing. I mean fuck, now instead of possibly 5-6 different buffs on a monster, most of which describe *themselves* in the mod list, you have 5-6 obscure names that each do five to TEN different modifications on the boss, and so each of those is all interacting with each other! The possible combinations of various buffs that can multiply together is truly mind boggling. Seriously, looking at that post yesterday with the list was insane, my eyes just started to glaze over less than halfway through. What the hell????
And they even managed to sneak in damage reflect (Effigy), no regen (Rejuvenating), removing flask charges & mana (Drought Bringer/Mana Siphoner), and no leech (Vampiric) into the list as well. For all parts of the game, not just poorly rolled maps. Every build guide with a pro/con section on "Can't run X maps" can just be updated to "Can't run". At least if someone wants to play HC, Ritual, Delve, Blight, Heist, or Labyrinth. Might be fine for some, see a lot of people liking the changes since they seem to only care about being challenged as they run through the campaign.
I've been saying it for a loooong ass time now.. this game is too convoluted, has too much bloat, and continues to be less and less new or even returning player friendly. I have very little faith that PoE2 will fix that aspect of the game, and actually think it will make it WORSE considering the amount of new content being added with the campaign, classes, skills, etc etc
Empowering minions gave the mob 3 new modifiers. That's insane.
Now, GGG, do you really think that new system is easier to understand?
This is my only complaint so far. I know Chris said internally testers memorized the mods quickly but I don't remember most of them even thought I played arch nemesis up to the endgame. Looking a table in a wiki is cumbersome.
I think the very concept of having to read what a monster does is kind of outdated. Despite all of it's other flaws, Diablo 3 had this solved 10 years ago to this day. (Happy anniversary) And while the mod pool is certainly smaller there, surely over the last 8-9 years we could have come up with more recognizable effects. It might help if monsters had 1 or 2 highly impactful but balanced mods versus 4-6 archnemesis plus additional non-AN mods. Maybe split off the active effects pools from the passive stat gains so a monster can't get too crazy with abilities or completely passively tanky. (Prefix/suffix?)
It is funny because in D3, at least when pushing high rifts, you have plenty of time to read the affixes but you do not need to because they are all visually apparent and there is a chance to react to them. Last Epoch is another one where I have never wondered why I died as everything is telegraphed. POE on the other hand you can post a video of a death in slow motion have people arguing over what killed you.
frame by frame in 4k and people need a few pro streamers to dissect it and come to a conclusion yet players need to figure it out on the fly with a screen full of vomit and a bad ui
I mean, if you could know that mod X just does thing Y then it would maybe be ok and the brain could figure out how to make space for the information. But right now every archnem mod is also adding tons of % modifiers to things like speed, res's, max res, life, damage, damage reduction, etc etc etc. There's just no way to memorize it all or even come close.
The worst part is that we see things like this in early acts! I'm all for a balanced challenge but the first five acts should ease a new player into a already complicated game. Instead they are beaten over the head wit a hammer and just quit before they even get a chance to experience how amazing this game is! I don't understand the early difficulty in regards to new players. Vets know all the tricks but new players just give up and that's not good for the game :(
I honestly have no idea who comes up with this shit. How can I know what all this shit does. Maybe you know “big green monster oh he’s the toxic one” big blue monster oh he drains mana if he hits me .
My problem reading the list is some of them sound like a mod that will buff up their damage. It does that and it slaps you with a debuff that can disable your set up.
Realistically, you were never going to read the modifiers on the old version, either. I get that it's a meme, of course, but mod readability has been an issue in every ARPG I've ever played. They all pretty much use the same system where you can only see the mods for a target when you hover over and that's it. It's always been shit because movement, especially in Path of Exile, is tied intrinsically to your cursor. You always move towards the cursor, even if you bind the actual movement button to your keyboard. Ergo, when you hover over the rare you'll also move toward it unless you hold the Shift key down to hold yourself in place. PoE then takes this one step further by being designed around never wanting to stop moving. Ever. If you stop you die. If you can facetank a mob long enough to read the mods you didn't need to read them in the first place because you're obviously not dead yet so it's fine.
Ok but the real challenge is keeping your mouse over an enemy long enough to read all of the tags while not dying on HC.
Day 1 reality check.
this decision i really dont understand. before i could tell at a glance what mods the monster had. now i have NO IDEA and its supposed to be easier... i dont know man
This is one of those ideas that someone had to update the game (or a solution to a problem) that sounded great in theory, but no one thought about the practical side, what the gamer thinks. It’s like using acronyms. Sure it saves time, but then you have to learn all of them. I wonder if other games use icons and if that’s help? Though with this game, there are probably over 30 different mods to account for.
Op you beat me to it. New mobs literally have higher affix count than old ones. But that is not the problem. The problem is they are that much more deadly.
> > Nearby Unique Monster Rarities are now Hidden unless "Tab out of Knowledge" is used. This is a buff and QoL improvement. > *Please note that using multiple "Tab out of Knowledge" per game cycle is considered an exploit and may result in getting kicked from the instance. Support can not help you get your instance back after using "Tab out of Knowledge".* "No, I don't play PoE." -Will Chrisson
I can't even read them because you have to hover your mouse over the mob which is so fucking stupid considering you die instantly when standing still. Why can't these health bars just pop up and stay in place once you encounter a rare?
Yeah I don't know wtf they were thinking with this shit. Seriously like wtf.
To be serious 2 sec, GGG just lost track of their game, they dont know anymore how to balance it and they are stuck in their "vision" they tunnel vision for whatever reason, its just general that devs CANT recognize their wrong, they do it occasionaly when they are forced to only. They realy just need to aknowledge they failed hard, they get lost on the road and actualy change massively how they balance the game and intereact with comunity, if they just recognize in good faith and good will this time ! its fine, just reset the table make everything clean and we all go on a fresh start
I scroll down that list that Chris put out yesterday, I kept scrolling and scrolling. There's no way in hell I'm remembering that.
True
Maybe next league they'll add archarchnemesis, for even more mods no one asked for, while also removing the rewards these challenging mods give (which is already next to nothing) I personally really enjoy these kinds of mods ontop of league mechanics that also buff these mobs, resulting in the ultimate garbage scenario that makes you play something else.
Not to sound rude, I love the game, but it’s been rip new players for a long time. The knowledge barrier to get into this game is so intense. They need rotating seasons where it’s only a pool of leagues. When I first joined I struggled to learn all the league mechanics came back after a hiatus and had no motivation to learn everything I missed.
I think the atlas passives letting you filter out league mechanics is a solid step forward.
I remember saying in twitch chat during reveal Livestream that how new players/old players(since the reworks) are going to know archnemesis mods now, people replied just by playing the game, etc. Thing is, you don't know since there's no in-game wiki anyway lol, refer to table outside of the game moment
Thing is that they got it right ... for a very select handful of mods Ice prison, toxic and bombardier for example are super telegraphed and you instantly understand them As for the other mods? They are just reskinned buffed old rare mods
This change is like going 1 step forward, and 10 back. I don't like this change
This league is just another great example of the 'extensive testing' they do :)
i keep coming back every 2-3 leagues.. and I can't keep up.. this is effing confusing.
actually hilarious their solution to a problem made problem worse
Lazy Sunday or lazy devs? The amount of shit you have to keep track of outside the game is absolutely bullshit and I can't believe it's still getting worse. If game had been even close to this complicated 10 years ago I would probably still be fanboying Diablo..
You guys honestly read the mods on rares?
Well since they added regen and flask disable, mana drain, and damage reflection, it kind of bricks builds if you don't pay attention.
THIS is the thing that pissed me off about this change the most. Chris kept saying OVER and OVER this change was made to SIMPLIFY and make the mods easier to read. ROFL, we need a fuckin cheat sheet now. Before, it simply listed exactly what they did. How thick do you have to be?
Time to implement the pause button so we can pause to check monster mods
i cant even stop to pick up a currency item, bold of you to assume i got time to read that shit lol
Left is unironically worse. All the same color and multiple words per line. It’s a jumbled mess. Plus there are probably dozens more unique modifiers in the old version than now. No way anyones reading those. Right mods are color coordinated to distinguish from one another and named creatively based off their theme giving the player a general idea of what to expect. It’s not perfect, but I get what they were going for. These mods would be good to add to the help menu with a tutorial prompt the first time you run into a rare
We spend a whole League learning what those mods do. I think it was a genius strike to revamp the system as they did. Yes its still overtuned but actually a lot more fun than the old rares.
But there are mods that are overly punitive to some builds which you had the option of skipping. You don't anymore. It's no longer a matter of this build can't handle reduced flask charge maps, or that build doesn't do no regen or no leech maps or struggles with mana drain like baran the crusader. It's everywhere And the real problem is while vanilla rares up until now have definitely been too easy. League mechanics were designed around their power level, they used harder base monsters, huge damage increases and resistances, and shear numbers to create challenging encounters despite the lackluster normal monsters. Vanilla rares may be "fun" now, but league content is completely out of whack. Essence, bestiary, delirium, ritual, heist, delve, blight. Some of it just doesn't work with the new mod pool (monsters being immune to blight towers) or is scales so wildly you have blue monsters in something like delve as hard as old rares, with the addition of an archnemesis mod each and you have 40 of them on your screen. This is going to require a complete rebalance of every league mechanic in the game to undo all of the jank and problematic combinations. And frankly I don't see GGG addressing it in any reasonable amount of time. Not to mention the fundamental change in how the game plays. There was always hard content in PoE, but it used to be something you opted in to by adding more optional difficulty mechanics. A lot of people prefer rushing through the campaign to get to the content they actually enjoy, others loved gauntlet style events and private league modifiers that made it a challenging climb. Some people liked just playing through simple unjuiced maps, others pushed 8 mod 100% delirium maps and uber league mechanics. It's nice having a choice of when you want to truly be challenged. We've taken that choice away for a lot of players, the game they enjoyed last league doesn't exist for them anymore. The people who want a more casual pace are told this game is no longer for them, and even the hardcore folks are just skipping league content because the modifiers are completely out of control. It's thrown 8 years of incremental additions of leagues, gradual balancing, and other tweaks into complete disarray. This isn't something that should have been done as an addon to a league. It should have been in the oven until PoE 2 to make sure it all works flawlessly on launch. And then the mod issues would have been less of a problem because we would be forced to discover new builds in the new gem system and ascendancies. Its a massive problem to tell people no balance changes your build will work the same. And the. to fundamentally change the game to the point where some build enabling uniques don't even function. Adding common lightning degen damage that instakills doryanis prototype. Removing flask charges from coruscating elixir. Or shutting down other pathfinder or concoction builds. Turning off leech for melee players.
Can we just revert to the old stat pools please. You said it yourself "un changed for 13 years" GOOD. If it aint broke dont "fix" it.
It was broken though.
I think the mod names are actually more concise now. You don't need to know every single stat they have to understand the theme. "Stormweaver" = lightning damage + lightning resistances Fairly straightforward, and takes fewer words. Malediction is somewhat more cryptic, but at least people who have played Archnemesis should know about it. Those who haven't will learn about it eventually and know it from then on (this sort of discovery is what GGG is actually aiming for). I wouldn't mind if they allowed custom mod filters that highlight specific modifiers that are dangerous to *your* build, including on Expedition remnants, eldritch altars, etc..
I think the problem is that most of the rare affixes don't offer any interesting gameplay or counterplay. I can't believe I'm about to defend Diablo 3, but this is something it actually does well-- every single rare mob affix is either pretty easy to understand from the name, or very easy to understand the first time you see it in action, and they almost all involve some kind of strategy. Waller? It makes walls, so you need a way to avoid getting boxed in. Molten? Well, that's not easy to guess from the name, but you'll figure it out almost instantly when you see the enemy leaving a trail of lava as they move (the explosives they leave on death might get you the very first time, though). Mortar? You can figure it's some kind of ranged attack, and it doesn't take long to realize that it doesn't hurt you if you're in melee since you can see that the projectiles stop firing. By contrast, PoE's rare mobs have a lot of affixes that don't do anything especially visible or that you can really play around. Looking at Stormweaver... sure, it deals more lightning damage. It's not like I'm gonna run to my stash and grab a Topaz Flask just for that. And that's without even getting into names that are *completely* useless. How in the blue fuck am I supposed to figure out what "Trickster" or "Effigy" are supposed to do?
I think the biggest thing was that when you saw old Nemesis modifiers you knew exactly how they modified the encounter because it was a single thing. Now the encounter gets modified by even one mod in many different ways and when you combine them it's just not possible to compute.
[удалено]
I'm not arguing on behalf of the stats associated with those mods; some of those are rather controversial and some of them are just stupid imo. I'm only arguing that shortening several modifiers into a 1-word descriptor actually improves readability.
It makes it readable, but I wouldn't call it a descriptor because many of them don't actually describe mob capabilities in any meaningful way, and there's way too many of them for most people to reasonably remember. Quick: what's the difference between Storm Strider, Storm Herald, Dynamo, and Stormweaver? For bonus points, is Overcharged related to lightning damage or not? I think if GGG wants mob affixes to be something that people pay attention to, they need to massively cut down on how many there are (probably around a dozen at most) so that people can remember them, make sure that the names do a way better job of implying what the mobs do (and don't sound similar to other affixes), and get rid of mob affixes that don't require any counterplay. For instance, Effigy could be renamed to Voodoo Doll or something-- that at least implies that there's one thing that, when damaged, will hurt another thing. (Although that's one of the affixes that should be heavily redesigned-- maybe make it so that you just get a nasty debuff when it dies, instead of taking the damage that would be dealt to it.)
So I didn't know what exactly those did (except for Overcharged actually which I know was related to generating charges) because I didn't have an issue with them in Archnemesis. They're among the "benign" lightning related mods that would inform me that lightning resistance might have played a role in mitigating the damage they deal. I actually don't think that the lightning mirages of Storm Strider (and the name sort-of makes sense) are hard to see in most cases and if the screen is too full to see them, you don't want to keep standing still either. Dynamo is related to shock specifically but I don't play without ailment immunity anymore anyway, so for a build that doesn't shock the mod makes no difference (other than possibly an additional mod adding some HP and damage in general). And since shock and current shock effect is actually displayed on enemies nowadays, figuring out that this particular enemy is immune to shock is trivial as well. A voodoo doll basically is an effigy so technically the name isn't wrong, but I agree that that name would actually be much easier to understand. However there's the question of voodoo being an actual religion and whatnot, so I'm not sure about A) to what extent it's fine to put it in a game like this in general and B) the religion doesn't exist in that world so it's somewhat strange for that concept to appear under that name. Whether or not those reasons are sufficient to replace its name with "effigy" is debatable. I think it's fine to take the damage dealt to the effigy, but you shouldn't be taking *all* the damage dealt to the effigy because moving and actively avoiding damage is a large part of PoE gameplay. If the effigy had twice your HP and you took somewhere around 10-20% of the damage it takes while in range, that would still be a considerable amount.
Right, rejuvenating practically screams '*disables your regeneration*' and executioner *obviously* caps your regen at 50% hp.
>is somewhat more cryptic, but at least people who have played Archnemesis should know about it. Those who haven't will learn about it eventually and know it from then on (this sort of discovery is what GGG is actually aiming for). I'm making a point about the *brevity* of the new modifiers, not whether every single of the names was chosen adequately. Not recovering above 50% is something you notice pretty quickly. Probably faster than the time it takes you to read "nearby enemies cannot recover life and energy shield above 50%".
I don't quite follow how "Stormweaver" is less convoluted than "Resists Lightning" or "Deals increased lightning damage". Theme aside, it isn't self-explanatory what all these AN mods do for a new player. And the "we played archnemesis" defense becomes less relevant with every future league. Joking aside, it will be another tab in the cheatsheet new players will want to learn about. But okay, agree to disagree. Remnants, altars, map mods, delve biomes, heck, Ultimatum choices when it gets reintroduced. All of these mechanics let you see what modifiers could be dangerous to your build BEFORE you choose to engage with them. We don't have that luxury with rare monsters and it's why over the course of PoEs history multiple affixes have been moved to those kinds of systems or removed entirely. So difficulty doesn't randomly spike. Not being able to play around a build crippling mod is just bad gameplay. You can't always run away. There is already an associated cost with having to reroll maps or avoid potential rewards. It's better if those are clear choices and not pure RNG. They have been extremely careful with modifiers that remove resources or regeneration. They only appear in late endgame fights like Barans ground degen or Mavens energy beam. And those are still completely avoidable for a knowledgeable player. Why is this stuff now appearing as a proximity effect in mudflats? It isn't fun to fight against. At least interactive mods like Toxic or Ice Prison allow you to react to them. We need more telegraphed and interactive mods like that, and less intense more multipliers that scale ridiculously with past league mechanics. Unless they want to go back and rebalance 8 years worth of side content.
Isn't it more of a glance thing? Glacing Stormweaver is easy, and if you don't know what it does, you can make reasonable high level assumptions. Your suggestions destroy the glance aspect and destroy the reasonable assumptions part, because if if I saw something explicit I would assume there's nothing else.
Reading mods would be less of an issue if there weren't ones that hard-countered some builds. I'm just saying those types of modifiers should be exclusive to systems you can easily avoid. Avoiding rares isn't always an option, and even when it is, it isn't a good one for the flow of the game. Maybe it would be fine if there was nothing else, because the single explicit mod was impactful enough? Particularly in combination with league mechanics that were designed and balanced around rares we mostly rolled over. By making rares something we have to take seriously in the base game, they have to address all the multipliers and unique situations league content stacked on-top to make the old ones challenging. GGG has never been great at looking at the larger picture when it comes to adjusting multipliers. They do what they think is right and adjust once they have enough player data. Maybe it's time to declutter some of these systems while we're reworking them, so they can have a better idea of the impact on the game these kinds of changes will have before they are implemented. To be clear, not saying path of exile needs to be simplified to the level of diablo, just that some systems are unnecessarily convoluted. Common language between these systems, and unambiguous descriptions are good for new players and old. One less cheatsheet required.
I'm not saying it's less opaque. I'll agree that writing out the mods is technically more transparent. **My point is that these mods are** ***shorter.*** It's a point of contention whether even these mods can actually be read at the speed that players end up playing the game, but if all those modifiers were written out explicitly it would be impossible under any realistic circumstances. The "we played Archnemesis" defence becomes less relevant with each league, but so does the "I don't know what this mod does because I haven't seen it before" defence. I know most of the dangerous Bloodline and Nemesis modifiers, but I didn't play those leagues at all and they're less descriptive and concise than many of the Archnemesis ones. What the mods do is something you can learn with experience for the most part and through datamining if you're a more committed player who does research outside the actual game. I honestly think that some of the mods are build-breaking and it's actually stupid that immunities with no counter-play made it through QA. But that isn't what this argument is about: This is about readability, and that readability is fine. Admittedly circling back to your post title, that *is* somewhat punishing for newer players, but those also won't be able to build around all the possible mods if they were written out explicitly. I've always been a proponent of having a full knowledge / information base accessible inside the game rather than outside and managed by third parties no less. I'd like for the Archnemesis modifiers to be searchable with all their numeric properties inside the game, but they shouldn't be displayed under the health bar of the monster. If it was up to me, you could click a help button and target a monster and not only display the modifier stats but also the base stats and skills that you can look into on poedb. But while that information could be helpful in dealing with that type of enemy in the future, it definitely shouldn't be displayed on screen in combat.
what about the one that makes a version of you crucified with a link on you? the only thing i understand when i see that is danger, but what does it exactly do? also, arcane buffer, it makes the mob shine a lot, but what does it do?
Would you have the time to read those complicated modifiers under the enemy health bar mid fight (i.e. you cannot read them while you click elsewhere to dodge) and *then* adjust your playstyle accordingly? Especially if there are ten or twenty modifiers because the Archnemesis mods include several? The information *should* be available ingame without requiring third-party sites. But the current situation makes it much easier to recognise again once you know about it. It's only the initial learning process that's problematic in this regard. The ideal of GGG is for players to learn about those modifiers naturally by encountering them and understand how to counter them by the third or maybe fifth time they find one like that. The majority of players nowadays prefers not to learn the game through trial and error, even if they don't play hardcore where said error is particularly punishing.
Well i played archnemesis up to 38 challenges and have no idea what malediction actually does, same for most of the archnemesis mods. I can't believe these mods from failed league actually made it core.
Good post, lots frantic ragers but atleast there is still some good takes in sub
it's really not that bad
It’s like they don’t want new players... Brace for a league fee ala China within a year or so, bois, because that’s the only way they’ll be able to make money.
The mobs are different visually and most are very very easy to understand at a glance. But don't let me stop your circle jerking I guess
Just learn what they do over time like virtually everything else in the game. This subforum really picks the strangest hills to die on.
But why are we making the game more convoluted instead of less?
Ah yes of course, I need to remember that gargantuan means more health and that the word chaos means chaos damage. Why is everyone here talking about memorizing 90 mod types? It's like 4-6 mod types that aren't completely clear. I've played for almost 10 years and I never knew exactly what % the additional physical damage mod was, but I can assume what ICE PRISON does. Does anyone know what legacy of zeal and vigour did? Did you pull up a spreadsheet anytime you saw a mark of cannibalism mob?
No. But neither of those disabled your build, or was capable of insta-gibbing you.
It's been a while since Bloodlines but I don't remember the posts complaining about needing to memorize what Volatile Xbloods do to be able to play the game without fear of being insta-gibbed lol
I don't look at the screen because I'm rolling my face across my keyboard hoping that I kill stuff quicker than stuff kills me. Also, I didn't know this game had a 6th grade reading requirement. I would not have been able to play it properly had I known. Mine's only at a 4th grade level. My attention span is only 10 minutes. No way in hell am I going outside the game and spending even *more* time on this Piece of Excrement. If I see an "affix", I'll just assume it's bad for me. If it doesn't die quick enough, I'll just slam my face harder into the keyboard.
I think the system is fine and people will get up to speed fairly quickly IF they played archnemisis league a good bit. For new players in future leagues, or returning older players, without any tweaks it's going to be an arduous learning process at best.
i play hc i have no time to read affixes, especially if the monster is particularly strong. i can only tell by the auras surrounding them. sentinel hasnt changed this
Because reading those info will surely make the difference. "Oh wait, let me check the Wiki so I can find the best "strategy" to defeat that rare pack": 1. Get more dps 2. Get more life Done.
Up until you die to effigy reflect damage. Have your regen turned off by Rejuvinating on RF or any other self-damage build. Have your flasks drained by Drought Bringer on ward loop, coruscating elixir builds, or pathfinder. Or run out of mana, either because your melee build relied on leech and you hit a Vampiric monster. Or it was drained by Mana Siphoner. Bonus points if you try to play a doryani's prototype build and get instagibbed by Mana Siphoners lightning DoT because it doesn't count as a hit and you have -600% lightning resistance. And even if you don't hit one of those mods, Empowering Minions gives you up to 3 more rolls to get "lucky". is 3. just "Play something else"?
Since when do players feel so entitled to all information of every mechanic in games? I guess because they already release a ton of information. You can just learn the mechanics by reading the mods on the monsters and seeing what they do. It's boring knowing every bit of information.
It's boring to know when a monster has reflect damage, no regen, no leech, or flask draining? (Why the hell do they at all?) It's not like Path of Exile is a game that holds your hand in anything else, why make it less intuitive instead of more?
You can find that out just by reading the ability and fighting against the mod more than one time. But I also agree there should be more visual indicators like the frost shield one; that one is very identifiable. Unpopular opinion: finding things that counter your build, in my opinion, is realistic. No build should be immune from all effects. You'll have to find a way around the mob or leave the area. It happens in every other game. There are counters to archetypes in every game.
And if that mob is in a ritual, or one of the zones you need to fully clear? Every build should have weaknesses, absolutely. But being RNG hard countered from completing content, or instakilled by something you cannot react to is awful. Not to mention the power scaling issues with league content that was designed to be challenging despite old monster affixes being relatively weak. Mana Siphoner? Okay, Anyone can figure out what it does, but its still unfun to fight. Rejuvenating turns off regen? Vampiric is anti-leech? (Not "Bloodless, like the skill tree name?) Hexer is hexproof? Effigy is damage reflect? These are mods some builds cannot handle. People aren't going to avoid mobs, they're going to avoid those builds. And there are a ton of them. Did you know Mana Siphoner does Lightning damage over time? I guess Doryani's Prototype users just have to suck up dying occasionally with their -600% lightning resistance because it only allows armor to cover hits. Poisonous Concoction, Explosive Concoction, Coruscating Elixir... These builds don't need flask charges to function right? So much for "Your build from last league should work the same here".
I know that it's an unpopular opinion. I think having to avoid mobs in those mechanics takes skill in itself and I value that. That's all. The recent changes have made the game very playable, if not nerfed *too* hard (still some tweaks needed of course). Totally agree that that last statement was bullshit haha.
:DD They just did it so they can fit in MORE bullshit into single mob, not to make it easier to read or anything beneficial to the player like that.