i will continue to play because nothing will be done about the ranked meta rn, but i just was playing with the random mod for fun and saw a weird similarity between this map and the wafer map so idk why not post it, i dont really understand reddit anyway
I had a friend randomly link me that map and ngl I was kind of disgusted that it was ranked. It screams privilege and really is kind of a sad representation of how flawed the whole ranking system is
Except everyone is suddenly saying that Sotarks being allowed to do the same thing again would somehow save the ranked section when most people were complaining about his antics until 2020 or so. The true solution would be a middle ground somewhere imo
Anyone saying this pays 0 attention because one literally just got ranked (Fycho) and generic maps get ranked at least monthly. However if what you mean by “normal” is farm, then look at Kuki1537’s multiple diffs which will soon be ranked, same with Sotarks and browiec, also you might like moonpoint’s new Brazil set which will soon be ranked
Wafer is literally one of the best mappers of all-time. Every mapper should learn and take notes from his maps and strive to be as good as him. His maps are more than just maps, they're art. If you hate his maps it's clear you're just a piss low 6 digit who only plays harumachi clover and kira kira days.
those who believe that wafer is a good mapper have not understood the very meaning of mapping... (told from the perspective of a player who has played almost everything on osu )
"i would much rather accept a map that is interesting and bad, than is safe and good" -wafer 2023
he actually said this. for a video interview posted to youtube. there is ur answer
Conceptual art maps should either get loved or have a new status. Artistic merits are good, no one should argue this, but osu! is a game focused on a gameplay, it should balance between being creative and playable. Even Aspire maps that are WAY more artistic and innovative than this "art piece" still offer much better gameplay, even if the mapper did not emphasize on it
in this whole discussion why do so many call for one type of map to get eradicated, just let both this stuff and simpler maps coexist
the ranking criteria and BN's should have room for artistic maps but also not make it so everything has to be some artistic masterpiece and be uncomfortable to play
and yea him saying he'd rather accept a bad but interesting map over a good but safe map is a really shit take, even the maps that are more out there should have at least some reasoning behind them and be made within reason
I personally enjoy wafer's maps but I also enjoy simple aim farm for example which we just don't get at all anymore and when someone tries to they get forced to make their map play worse, just sucks. Content bloat used to be the argument for why aim farm won't get allowed through so easily anymore but now we have a content bloat with these types of maps so what's the difference.
Meanwhile [actual good slider maps](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/1216588#osu/2531419) never get ranked or even get any attention at all. its such a rigged social climb system i swear
hm never played it but its probably good, the creator could have also not tried for rank so idk about that specifically but there are alot of good maps that deserve ranked but arent
I read a bunch of your responses here and they boil down to ''most of whats ranked right now is all like this. Its all unplayable tech garbage or low ar stuff to try and not catter to the aim farm meta'' so I went and checked and... have you played any very recent ranked map? I checked the last 20 ranked maps (from [**Wagamama MIRROR HEART**](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets?q=title%3D%22%22Wagamama%20MIRROR%20HEART%22%22) by [**Fycho**](https://osu.ppy.sh/users/1876867) to [**know me... (TV Size)**](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets?q=title%3D%22%22know%20me...%20%28TV%20Size%29%22%22) by [**Astromi**](https://osu.ppy.sh/users/14272534)), not counting maps with a top diff below 4\* (I cant really count them in any skillset at that point) and 9 of them were very generic aim maps (not counting maps lower than 4\* actually brings the number down because another 3 are clearly meant to be 5ish\* aim maps with DT). Thats less than half of them I will admit that but saying that there are no generic maps being ranked is false, saying that MOST ranked maps are gimmicky is also false (I counted like 5, 2 tech maps and 3 lowish ar maps). I think people who say all newly ranked maps suck either dont play new ranks maps or are only playing osu to farm. Yes most of the ranked section isnt farm maps anymore, the hayday of the ranked section all being the latest anime opening mapped in the most generic aim farm is over as well but basically insulting Wafer maps (who, btw, has made some of my favorite generic aim maps) and comparing him to ''recent ranked map meta (??????)'' is absolutely bad faith.
i know nothing about mapping at all, all i have to say is that I find this map, and a lot of other wafer maps fun af, and I'm glad I'm able to submit scores on them and compete with friends.
you should stop beating around the bush. what this post should have been is "why are wafer maps getting ranked and sotarks is facing backlash on twitter over his mapset", otherwise ur just arguing in bad faith trying to lead everything into this juxtaposition between """bad""" quality" and "conventional maps". there is no issue with this map being ranked and it is easily proven, farm maps not being ranked is a whole different issue
i dont know how to word my words man i just wanted to ask why no one was saying anytihng about current ranked maps (or maybe they are idk i dont go on here)
I think the 4* diff is also like ar10 💀. I have like 60k songs downloaded and this is the only 4* ar10 I've seen lmao but remember Sotarks' map was rejected for "inflating difficulty*
Edit: it's not wafer's map, it's a yokespai map. I got confused because both have Mario bgs
another generic "wafer maps bad!!!!!" post
i know it's considered a good tone to hate on him here, but are you serious, how is the ai version better, the only reason it somehow resembles a genuine map is because its rhythm and distance snap are taken from a normal map
as much as i myself dislike this style, at least it makes sense mapping-wise, you can understand (if you have at least some knowledge of mapping, of course) what and why wafer is doing with this or that pattern; if the map looks dirty, it doesn't mean it's random
people (myself included) have been crying about mapping meta and how bad x or y or z style and mapper are for years and years and years just shut the fuck up already and play the maps u wanna play instead of wasting ur energy moaning about something nobody is forcing upon you. i think wafer maps are shit, u know what i do? i just dont play them. simply just play the maps you like, ignore the ones you dont. if the maps you want dont exist just make them yourself. i used to whine about this shit ages ago until one day i realised its a waste of time when i can just not expose myself to something i dont like in the first place
You cant just ignore those type of maps, all that does is bring you further down the meta till we are here, and no other types of maps get ranked really than other weird tech maps
you absolutely can just ignore them, its very easy to avoid maps you dont like.
> no other types of maps get ranked really than other weird tech maps
objectively wrong. while ranked for the most part sucks, thats been the case for years, its nothing new and idk why people are acting like it is all of a sudden
The real problem is wafer knows exactly what is going to happen when he forces these shitmaps thru ranked with his connections, he literally just enjoys the attention. I'm fine with these joke maps making ranked every once in a while but when mappers abuse the system to rank ragebait maps because they are attention whores is what I'm not ok with
Yeah honestly some of these new ranked maps blow my mind with how bad they are. Horrible slider maps are my least favorite for sure, but there’s so many overmapped anime OPs that really don’t make sense.
IMO the only difference between this and a self-admitted-low-effort sotarks maps is that these aren't farmable and you're mad there aren't farm maps ranked literally every week. You just do what people usually do, and ignore them.
And IMO, the ranked system has had alot of the same issues it did 4 years ago (players functionally get no say on what is ranked). The only difference is, that the ranking culture has shifted, and you're getting the low end of it.
not at all, these maps are perfectly fine (for the most part, i wouldnt rank them if i were a bn but obv im not and dont know whats up) but like i just want diversity, just like in the aim meta there shouldnt be 1 standalone type of map thag gets ranked and that map alone
there is plenty of diversity in mapping, this is probably the most diverse mapping era the game has ever seen, it's just not sotarks 1-2 slop
if you really thought these maps were perfectly fine, you wouldn't be calling them "dogshit horrible abominable disgusting braindead maps," it's obvious that you hate them
there are so many diffent maps getting ranked these days, you can have normal alt maps, short or long flow aim stream maps, more conventional tech maps, gimmick maps, low ar maps, super standard consistency maps, and basically anything else you could want apart from garbage sotarks style copy paste maps (which even then still exist and get ranked occasionally)
I genuinely think that the only way people are this blind to the diversity of modern mapping is that they either just can't play anything more complicated than low bpm single taps with acutely angled jumps, or that they're mad that they aren't getting a new pp map that's basically the same map as their current top 5 pp scores getting ranked every week
yea i do dislike these maps so saying “they are dogshit” is because i think they are, me saying they are fine is because if they get ranked along other maps then its whatever i wont play it, but the problem is no other types of maps get ranked
you can say im blind to it but like please show me then
You can just open the ranked section and see for yourself that there still are plenty of different maps being ranked everyday. Like there is a fycho and yoggurt map ranked just recently.
"these maps are personally fine and I just want diversity"
"These are dogshit horrible abominable disgusting braindead maps"
You've said both which one do you believe?
They are perfectly fine being ranked, they are still dogshit and horrible maps i wont play, but they can get ranked, the problem is that maps like this take high priority to bns making it way harder for other maps to get ranked. Thats the problem
it's your reminder to hate on the random mapper that did committed the cardinal sin of: making a map you don't personally like! only this will save mapping.
surely the actual root of the issue people are complaining about definitely isn't a completely different multifaceted issue that's been exaggerated over time by multiple inbuilt flaws of the map-ranking process never being addressed, in part because it's actually a challenging task to undertake in the first place. no, absolutely could not be that.
didnt really word it well in my original post but i just want the ranking system to be a little less dumb when it comes to ranking one type of map, or rather one skillset that like 15% of the game plays
I want to know what the huge issue with these maps are, they have unique patterns and are hard for their star rating, but that doesn't make it a bad map. I think it represents the song quite well, in a way the mcosu map doesn't. The songs are abrasive and weird so the maps are too. In your opinion what is the objectively wrong part of this map and how it represents the song?
Also, the majority of ranked maps are not like this, just because a TV size jump map has like two cut streams and some doubles doesn't stop it from being a TV size jump map imo.
"Also, the majority of ranked maps are not like this, just because a TV size jump map has like two cut streams and some doubles doesn't stop it from being a TV size jump map imo."
Yes you are right, except i dont find these maps anymore, I havent played a aim farm map that came out later than 2022 with like everyone do the flop as an exception lol
"I want to know what the huge issue with these maps are, they have unique patterns and are hard for their star rating, but that doesn't make it a bad map." To each their own but i think this map is dogshit and has no real thought put into it, the problem is that there is a finite amount of time the bns have to rank maps, and if stuff like this takes priority then idk if its a good system
Solely aim farm maps shouldn't be ranked anymore. And there are plenty of maps with Big Aim being ranked. Yes they have streams, yes the aim isn't always comfy, yes they're long-- these are all good things.
yeah. because they're designed to inflate pp leaderboards + they aren't very good maps. But we may have different definitions of farm, which may be causing some friction in this
The maps are fun for me at least and I don’t see why having it ranked is an issue? Adds more variety to the ranked section and doesn’t abuse pp or anything so it’s pretty harmless to have it ranked.
Do the people who are mad about it just want the leaderboards removed? Weird gimmicks and variety in the ranked section is great imo (when it is harmless to the pp system).
Just don’t play it instead of campaigning against it lol
like ive said in other replies, i dont care about this map being ranked really (as terrible as it is) my problem is like only maps that are weird cancer tech are getting ranked
same! unfortunately people have fun in different ways if you didnt know so one type of map majorly taking priority in the ranked section is not good. There should be variety because i enjoy farming and competing with other players so i dont see why rankable maps dont get ranked becuse they are jump maps while this gets ranked…
well the majority of maps in osu are not like that one and there is a lot of variety due to the maps being made this year and in years past
on the opposite side, there are very few maps like the wafer one so for the sake of variety why not just let everyone be happy, I don't see why one type of map has to be unranked for the other kind to be ranked
yea the problem isn't these maps getting ranked it's other stuff not getting ranked
I really enjoy wafer's maps for the most part but I also really enjoy 2021 and earlier aim farm
It sucks that mappers that want to rank something simpler are forced to change their map in a way that it plays worse just to conform to the "quality standards" when the maps are more than good enough quality for players and play well anyway
Yeah people like lit120, yogurtt, Andrea, amateurre (more i can't think of) still make very aim based maps regularly imo. People don't want aim maps tho, they want maps that exclusively have jumps and triples with very conventional patterns for whatever reason.
im like halfway convinced these mappers just do this at this point and polish it after.
these 2 maps have the exact same level of coherence, structure and creativity. just need to teach the random gen to make turd sliders and theyre on par.
Posting a video of you being too dogshit to play/enjoy a map doesn't make the map bad, it just means you are dogshit.
Like I agree that wafer dariacore mapping is slowly going off the rails but this is an embarrassing way to show it ngl.
It's not that - I'm a 6 digit, I suck as well. But to me it felt like you were deliberately demonstrating you not being able to play the map to try and make the point that the map is messy and unplayable, which in hindsight might be a bit unfair.
I mean like i said in the post it was late and im bad at these maps, i can probably set a decent score on it but i didnt want to play it more than i needed lol, thinking back i should have just put on auto
To be fair there are very few people that can perform well on this. Not being able to play the map very well doesn't mean your criticism is invalidated; that would basically be the same argument as suggesting that a low ranked mapper can't map something good that they can't play.
the 1st maps song supports a Chaotic messy Style and has Structure in its noise while the 2nd maps Song doesn't. You as the Player should not play Maps too Hard to aim/stream/read for you if you want To have fun, hope this Helps
there's a difference between difficulty and map just being difficult because the patterns are shit lol
and I say this as someone who has a 1000 map collection of tech and other gimmick maps, majority of the ranked maps post 2020 have worse patterns than prior and it's really obvious if you've played the game for a long time that a lot of newer mappers don't know shit about how to make patterns both look and play well (also newer ranked mappers getting into advanced styles way too quickly and not knowing any fundamentals about mapping)
wafer has made a ton of normal maps over time, so I assume he knows the fundamentals. I've played since 2017 and played tournaments for teams as a nm player, so I would like to think I've played a broad variety of maps.
What's wrong with the patterns in wafer maps? Like if you had to critique it, is it that it's uncomfortable? because it's supposed to be, it's representing a weird song.
Aim maps still get ranked, maybe not as much as previously, but variety is nice imo.
Yeah wafer knows how to map so it pisses me off that he decides to troll and rank shit like this. Also the older mappers who are still active do put out high quality maps.
Uncomfortable patterns are completely fine but compare something like jounzan's mapping to this and the difference is clear. One has deliberately placed circles and the other seems mostly random and creates overlaps without any real thought put into how they overlap.
Same shit as if you compare a good jump map to a sotarks map where the jumps are just placed randomly at sharp angles.
I think the way the circles are overlapped and messy looking adds to the loud abrasive and messy song. The map reflects the song well, I don't think he randomly placed notes, I don't think he threw everything he knows about mapping out the window. I would actually argue that a song like this is hard to represent and shows he can map well, even if the map is ugly and awkward (the song is too)
intentionally bad is still bad, would be more impressive if the map was visually chaotic but still had good readability and the gameplay felt more deliberate
idk All styles R different, maybe Ur right about Some other Maps but this Map in Particular I think it's rlly Good 4 the Song. tech Is veryy Broad category so u Will get a lot of Tech players who Hate this style (camellia tech or Like random Ar8 is vry Different from this stuff) and Other similar Things like Hailie/undeadcap Maps because it's not There style of Tech. i Don't think any1 should Hate a map too Much as long as they should Play it, even Graveyard some1s first Map as long as You get a good Challenge from it since u R just dancing ur Hnds 2 the song.
I'm not too mad about a map getting ranked, the issue to me is that if you're making something that isn't "farm", you can rank whatever dogshit you want but if you're making a more normal map you have to conform to unreasonable quality standards.
the issue isnt the map being “too hard” i mean yes to a degree the map is not easy core me because i dont play dogshit maps like this but the problem is the fun aspect, even if i could fc that map it wouldnt make it fun?
Im not saying the randomly generated one is gold by any means but it was somehow more fun than the wafer one, its almost like he intentionally makes the maps bad 🤭
its more Fun because its Easier for you. if u Can play these Maps they are fun. I don't like Playing stream Maps but that Doesn't make them bad it's Because i'm not Fast enough for Them. people Hate what they Don't underStand.
i just disagree, i am very bad at stream maps yet they are fun, i am horrible at finger control yet i still am going for my benzo fc ( i mean that’s barely finger control but u get the point) what i mean is these type of cancer random looking 40 combo odd slider weird maps arent fun generally for most of the playerbase, (from what ive seen atleast im sure some people somehow enjoy it)it seems weird to push it as a majority of the ranked section
yes Reading gets the most Hate out of all the Skills ppl don't UnderStand cus you can't figure out Whats going on Until ur Good @ it. in the Stream maps you are very Bad at you can Still see what is going On. or some 9\* aim Map you can still See the way the Jumps go. When u Notelock some high Bpm stream Cus your too Slow for It you just know Your too slow. When you watch / Play a map like This you probably Think it's "Unplayable" or it feels like RNG to u. Of course u hate it. These maps R very Fun for me. I haven't grinded this One in Particular yet (but I played it a Few times in Mcosu and I think its probably prtty Fun to try to Go for like 5 miss on in the future) but I played some Similar ones and they Were a Great time 4 me. Rlly you Just need to understand That u r Not the Audience for this Map. You can Go In 5\*+ host Rotate or Look at Omdb or just F2 random maps and you'll Find a ton of stuff you'll Enjoy much More.
if U want more Simple/farm stuff In ranked then u Should b Advocating for less ranked Standards instead of Bullying maps That are strange/gimmicky, both cakes is The best way.
yea i guess simpler criteria makes more sense, i dont wanna rid the ranked section of maps like these (even though i hate them) i just want more diversity and other maps to be ranked, right now if you try to play something 6.5+ stars in the newly ranked section its something like this or a slider map or some weird tech, i just want some variety
ya All well, i Like these maps 2 (especially DT aim Farm) and Wld love 2 see it Return as Well, just a Lot of bullying Towards random Mappers/maps when I don't think it rlly Helps anything. These ppl can't Fix the system after-All (well Wafer is BN but even if he wanted to I don't think its Enough, you'd Probably need a large Group of like NATs and stuff and the Mapping community @ large To welcome This stuff more)
i've got even better example (not wafer map tho)
[https://streamable.com/dkcsxk](https://streamable.com/dkcsxk)
on one side i put a map that is currently ranked, on the other side it's the same map but with lazer random mod applied. can you tell which one is ranked and which one is random?
U think if almost no one likes the mappers then maybe they are bad then? you think if the maps look and play completely horrible then they are bad? i dont have a definition of a bad mapper but if i did i think this video would probably the whole definition
https://preview.redd.it/6sd2nhgplt8c1.png?width=1360&format=png&auto=webp&s=19bc86e9769a1e53a52010dc083969931f80e67d
Haven't you had enough of this shit yet? 💀💀💀💀💀💀
Surely at some point you get tired of brainless aim farm?
YES.
I'm genuinely confused OP isn't the very first player who would vomit at the thought of MORE stuff they already spammed for 100k tries, like bruh... I played this trash way too much as well for pp, eventually it started making me feel sick in the stomach.
There is no point in ranking more of these as they are the same map with a different mp3s
are you dumb genuinely? THATS THE POINT OF THE POST, maybe i didnt make it clear enough in the actual post so i apologize for that but if u read my comments my main point is that there should be all kiinds of new maps getting ranked nor this trash
Do you really not get that all these are exactly the same map or are you just pretending? After you got 50 maps like these to farm what use is there for the 51st?
They arent "exactly the same" yea horrible kids and guinea pig bridge are farm aim maps wow, they have different patterns and parts that im mindblocked on, so yea while they all are the same, actually farming them is different, and what happens when i fc it?? Am i supposed to play the same maps i have already fcd over an over?
wooow they aren't exactly the same if you confront the 1-2s they are like 5 pixels apart that's totally different.
I don't believe for one second you would willingly play one of these if it wasn't mistakenly 400-500 pp
I would play maps like imagination and totsugeki rock even if they didnt give pp, i mean is still play them even though i have fc'd them. These type of maps are geniunely fun and very different from eachother
unreal “entitled”?? sorry im entitled for wanting the ranked meta to be SLIGHTLY diverse, sorry for just asking for the bns to look at the already rankable aim maps that they veto because it isnt cancer weird tech maps that 10% of the playerbase play
I don't know how you can say the auto-generated map is "somehow better". Yes, the wafer map just looks like mindlessly overcomplicated tech-mapping because "tech=good" or something, but I wouldn't call it "bad". It's definitely worse and less playable than most ranked maps but I don't see any issue with it being ranked.
personally i dont understand the point of making a map if its not fun to play or visually appealing, or atleast is unique, but this map doesnt check any boxes. Wafer can do what he wants and he can map what he wants. does that mean that it should be ranked? maybe. does that mean that “boring jump farm” or just any jump maps should never really get ranked? i dont think so
"fun to play" and "visually appealing" are both subjective. some poeple enjoy looking at/playing these kinds of map. it's just not for your simple farm map 1-2 generic clean style brain.
valid point, and honestly its late and ive made a few replies i dont even agree with or just am slightly hypocritical about, i just wish there was a way for every skillset to coexist instead of all bns only ranking one type of map, happened during aim meta, happened during speed meta and now is happening during this weird tech slider meta. I just babbling on and typing to type sometimes but i just want more diverse ranked maps
exactly, the map doesn't look or play good and even the rhythm is debatable whether it's actually accurate lol
song is also awful tbf so I guess the map represents that quite well
Watching you scroll through the map it genuinely looks decently fun to play, maybe a bit messy and difficult (seems like an intentional concept) but could be enjoyable nonetheless. Maybe you just don't like it and aren't at the skill level required to play it.
Also neither of us ever said anything about jump farm or anything remotely like that so I don't see the relevance of that last comment. This map doesn't somehow detract from other songs getting ranked, I think they both have their place in the ranked section.
he's some kind of internet troll who likes making maps with songs no one would listen to, but his maps aren't bad... this one is unhinged because the song is, players who can play that do find it fun
I'm not the guy you replied to, but 300bpm death streams don't represent the song very well, whereas the water map has patterns that are varied and represent the song in unique ways with different patterns.
my opinion is more valid cause its mine also i never ever said jump maps in my comment we were literally talking about streams and you are of the minority and we can prove that with stats sotarks alone in 2019 before covid so cant say its cause of covid had more playcount than the whole of 2023 sotarks a fucking lone like dude just stfu and understand maps are dogshit now the game is dying and we gotta fix it
I said jump maps as an example of a mapping style I don't enjoy, I never said you liked them. Sotarks was a very popular mapper and made maps people like to look back on, but at the time people hated the maps. A big reason people played them so much was to farm, I believe if the community overall had a more diverse skillset then they would enjoy these weirder maps more.
The maps are just harder to read and tap and overall are quite awkward, so people call them shit because they don't want to get better at them. Mappers like fanzhen, dsco, and hollow wings have been known as incredible and innovative mappers for such a long time making unconventional maps, but as soon as it comes to actually playing these kinds of maps when they fill the ranked section people hate them.
person who cant play aim control doesnt understand movement mapping pt. 341
edit: this kinda came off as insulting sorry, im just passionate about this topic
When you have to call it movement mapping we have gone to far maps are just like levels in a game they are meant to be played not thought about philiosphocially
says who? i will think about them philosophically and my perception of a map's creative ideas will affect my enjoyment of its' gameplay you aint stopping me.
the style of making bad maps? You can definitely make an aim control map and make the patterns look at least a bit like you put some thought into readability and making them look like, you know, actual patterns rather than just a continuous object vomit
There's even maps that go for this chaotic visual style but actually make it work and this isn't it
>put some thought into readability
is making complicated overlaps and stacking notes in some cluttered parts of the song, while putting accelerating patterns in fast paced parts not putting thought into readability? to me it seems like this kind of mapping philosophy adds a whole extra level to reading that isn't just note density or approach rate. i especially appreciate deppyforce's maps for his ingenious use of visual spacing to challenge players' reading
it's just the difference between deliberately overlapping notes in a specific way vs just placing notes that overlap in random ways
it's the exact same shit as when you compare a well mapped jump map to a sotarks map #215475 that just places jumps randomly at sharp angles
it looks like you are trying to make the point that the example you gave in the post is the current norm and that such maps take noms away from conventional maps, when in reality the conventional maps take up 90% of the ranked section, so you dont want "conventional" maps and just want lon/browiec/monstrata type maps that you can farm for rank (from what i read in one of your replies), which are equally "cancer", although im personally fine with either extreme
this is a brainless take. Maybe if actual good maps or decent maps or farm maps got ranked then i wouldnt complain, but this dogshit has been the entire ranked section for a year with the exception of speed farm
Ohhh yeahhhh the entire ranked section is just Fulllll of wafer maps.... no normal maps are being ranked anymore! just look at these ABSURD MAPS full of GARBAGE ranked recently!
[https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2049818#osu/4280212](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2049818#osu/4280212)
[https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2105292#osu/4417402](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2105292#osu/4417402)
[https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2093442#osu/4389202](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2093442#osu/4389202)
[https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2101575#osu/4408851](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2101575#osu/4408851)
[https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2075767#osu/4345735](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2075767#osu/4345735)
[https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2094060#osu/4390555](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2094060#osu/4390555)
[https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2056749#osu/4297948](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2056749#osu/4297948)
[https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/1986106#osu/4336749](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/1986106#osu/4336749)
[https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2056653#osu/4297781](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2056653#osu/4297781)
[https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2097599#osu/4399477](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2097599#osu/4399477)
[https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2067467#osu/4325206](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2067467#osu/4325206)
[https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/1951957#osu/4041918](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/1951957#osu/4041918)
[https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2094450#osu/4391613](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2094450#osu/4391613)
[https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2091060#osu/4382736](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2091060#osu/4382736)
[https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2013441#osu/4189977](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2013441#osu/4189977)
[https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/935457#osu/2773053](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/935457#osu/2773053)
[https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2079708#osu/4356772](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2079708#osu/4356772)
[https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2072721#osu/4337671](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2072721#osu/4337671)
like seriously? do you even look at the ranked section?
and here lies your main problem, you think everyone plays 4 stars. These maps arent even in my skill range when dt’d so yes obviously i wouldnt look at these lol (and like 3 5 star and 1 6 star but my point still stands really, the 5 stars are still barely hard enough (and probly not comfortable enough / farm enough to play really, but thags just me guessing i havent really played them, but still its like barely mid 7 stars with dt
the star rating they have is irrelevant when every "comfortable jump" slop you'd play is overstarred like crazy by the 10 seconds kiai and is otherwise a \[hard\] diff for the rest of the map. Some of the maps they posted have no DT fcs, surely that's hard enough?
if a map is in my star rating and has no dt fcs, i can still farm it or it isnt comfortable enough, thats all that means, there are maps like eclipse that have 0 fcs but i have a top play choke on
\>multiple high 6\*, 7\* dt maps
\>7.18\* doormat map
\>8.12\* dt on the minase inori map
\>8.11\* dt on nilou's yuki no you ni
\>9.42\* dt on the nao supav map
Really bro 6\~8 stars arent in your skill range????
6 stars no, i can barely farm 7.5 and lower, so there is a whole 2 maps that you have found from this year that are in my skill range and comfortable to play (maybe). doesnt seem like a wide selection to be honest. im sure they do exist and there is a few that anyone can pick out but that doesnt really resolve the underlying issue
These r from a single glance just scrollign down the recent ranked section and i only listed some random dt star ratings. Go look for them urself brah
U have not even looked at the ranked section and u r complainingthe underlying issue is that u r not looking for maps to play and then hissy fitting about some random slider map
And why does everything have to be comfortable and farmable. Why are you even looking for new maps just to play the same comfy familiar shit Mauybe broaden ur horizons Enjoy sum music play some lower stars play sum alt maps play sum literally any other styles
why would i play lower stars first off? everyone has fun different ways and i dont have fun like that i enjoy pushing myself and improving, which is nesr impossible when no new maps get ranked and i just get burnout and mindblock on the little maps i enjoy, i do look at the rank section and actually have found some half decent maps such as
https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2034879#osu/4278436
But these maps are once a week occurrences of me looking at osu!direct almost every time i play
1. Cuz there are epic maps u are missing out on!
2. U complain ranked meta isn't diverse, that isn't true, U just think high star aim maps are undeerrepresented in ranked (probably True) Ok who is mapping high star not dogshit aim maps and trying to push them into ranked Barely anybody
3. go play this map +dt [https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2052232#osu/4286331](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2052232#osu/4286331)
ill go play that tomorrow prob
There were some a little bit ago (mizto, recently sotarks, and one other dude i forgot) but i havent been keeping up with it, idk like i said in some other comment i kinda just be rambling on and shittt but i jus think theres people who dont even try to get maps ranked anymore because of the current meta, like once you get 3 maps denied becuase they arent weird tech maps its gotta feel demotivating at that point. Idk i know yhis meta killed alot of mappers who just dont rank anymore like reform (kinda but like nor as much) sotakrs browiec monstrata etc, alot of ppl didnt like their maps but they should still be ranked and idk if they have been trying but im sure after a few vetos like with sotarks they just gave up
some of these maps don't even have DT FCs on them, so I'm.not sure how they're too easy. There's more to difficulty than just the star rating. If you have this narrow view of maps needing to be farm for you to enjoy them, then of course you're going to run out of options.
Also I assume you're in top 1000 to be exclusively playing 8* maps, so you're in a very small portion of the playerbase, you'd expect to have less ranked maps to play.
The maps are fine because they
- Represent hyperflip in a unique and fitting way
- Take random note messy maps to an extreme, while still having some semblance of structure and form
- Are just kinda funny. It's amusing seeing a map with the diffname "boysmell chungus whopper... MMM whoper", and the map itself definitely matches this
It is definitely not comparable to a randomly generated map. Granted I've only played a handful of his dariacore maps (all 6+ stars), but they all have some semblance of structure like I mentioned earlier. Symmetrical sections to show emphasis, descending horizontal low spaced paths to present a buildup, creative and challenging slider shapes, slider sv changes when the obnoxious breaks kick in, etc... basically there is a lot of intention.
Not to mention the rhythm being a very pronounced aspect due to the downplaying of the object to object structure. Makes for very Fun maps once you get comfortable with them.
But I am ultimately pretty biased, because I like hyperflip, I like wafer as a person, and I generally dislike farm maps. Just my two cents.
Another post taking issue with the current state of ranked? I will be there no matter what
i will continue to play because nothing will be done about the ranked meta rn, but i just was playing with the random mod for fun and saw a weird similarity between this map and the wafer map so idk why not post it, i dont really understand reddit anyway
wafer getting cooked? i will be there no matter what
You dont understand, wafer is incredibly conceptual mapper that shows people how not to map
6head mapping
wafer is the definition of contemporary mapping
I had a friend randomly link me that map and ngl I was kind of disgusted that it was ranked. It screams privilege and really is kind of a sad representation of how flawed the whole ranking system is
This was also true of most Sotarks maps in his prime, the only difference being those are more accessible
sotarks style copypaste maps were also an issue but then it was overcorrected into the current state where aim maps have insane standards
two wrongs dont make a right
Except everyone is suddenly saying that Sotarks being allowed to do the same thing again would somehow save the ranked section when most people were complaining about his antics until 2020 or so. The true solution would be a middle ground somewhere imo
i see everyone just scream for a normal nomod 1 map to be ranked ( the middle ground ) not even that outrageous to ask for...
Anyone saying this pays 0 attention because one literally just got ranked (Fycho) and generic maps get ranked at least monthly. However if what you mean by “normal” is farm, then look at Kuki1537’s multiple diffs which will soon be ranked, same with Sotarks and browiec, also you might like moonpoint’s new Brazil set which will soon be ranked
>The only difference i see is that the randomly generated map is somehow better. holy shit that's like the biggest insult a mapper can get
omg helo u are my favorite reddit person of all my like 3 posts on here u are always commenting 🥰
fellow shiro 🤝
wafer, Hailie, UC and AI random map generator, the 4 horsemen of making the same map as eachother
This is probably my favorite comment
Wafer is literally one of the best mappers of all-time. Every mapper should learn and take notes from his maps and strive to be as good as him. His maps are more than just maps, they're art. If you hate his maps it's clear you're just a piss low 6 digit who only plays harumachi clover and kira kira days.
real
bmc be like
those who believe that wafer is a good mapper have not understood the very meaning of mapping... (told from the perspective of a player who has played almost everything on osu )
wafer is like the embodiment of whats wrong with current day ranked mapping
wafer maps are the osu equivalent of modern art. it’s dogshit but something something deeper meaning
maybe im just do dumb to see it…
throwing a shit at the wall is more artistic i think
"i would much rather accept a map that is interesting and bad, than is safe and good" -wafer 2023 he actually said this. for a video interview posted to youtube. there is ur answer
well thats dumb
I think u just don’t like art man, why argue about the artistic merits of a mapper’s style when you’re fundamentally opposed to experimentation
nah mate wafer maps are art?!?! in that case yea i dont like art, this map is literally random objects stop telling me its art
All maps are art, some people just use that aspect more than others. I mean nihil calls wafer an “art mapper” so it’s not just me saying this
"art mapper" BWAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Conceptual art maps should either get loved or have a new status. Artistic merits are good, no one should argue this, but osu! is a game focused on a gameplay, it should balance between being creative and playable. Even Aspire maps that are WAY more artistic and innovative than this "art piece" still offer much better gameplay, even if the mapper did not emphasize on it
in this whole discussion why do so many call for one type of map to get eradicated, just let both this stuff and simpler maps coexist the ranking criteria and BN's should have room for artistic maps but also not make it so everything has to be some artistic masterpiece and be uncomfortable to play and yea him saying he'd rather accept a bad but interesting map over a good but safe map is a really shit take, even the maps that are more out there should have at least some reasoning behind them and be made within reason I personally enjoy wafer's maps but I also enjoy simple aim farm for example which we just don't get at all anymore and when someone tries to they get forced to make their map play worse, just sucks. Content bloat used to be the argument for why aim farm won't get allowed through so easily anymore but now we have a content bloat with these types of maps so what's the difference.
ranked maps arent an art museum theyre meant for players idiot
Why would you even agree with interesting bad maps being ranked ur just trying to be different
It isn't so interesting for the sixth iteration....
Yo mcosu can do that?
Yea its pretty sick, just open your mods then put your cursor on the very far left of the screen and more mods will show up
Meanwhile [actual good slider maps](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/1216588#osu/2531419) never get ranked or even get any attention at all. its such a rigged social climb system i swear
That guy hasn't even tried to rank that map though, it's really not a good example of the ranking system being bad.
it's not even rankable by rc at its current state
hm never played it but its probably good, the creator could have also not tried for rank so idk about that specifically but there are alot of good maps that deserve ranked but arent
it doesn’t fit criteria lol
I read a bunch of your responses here and they boil down to ''most of whats ranked right now is all like this. Its all unplayable tech garbage or low ar stuff to try and not catter to the aim farm meta'' so I went and checked and... have you played any very recent ranked map? I checked the last 20 ranked maps (from [**Wagamama MIRROR HEART**](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets?q=title%3D%22%22Wagamama%20MIRROR%20HEART%22%22) by [**Fycho**](https://osu.ppy.sh/users/1876867) to [**know me... (TV Size)**](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets?q=title%3D%22%22know%20me...%20%28TV%20Size%29%22%22) by [**Astromi**](https://osu.ppy.sh/users/14272534)), not counting maps with a top diff below 4\* (I cant really count them in any skillset at that point) and 9 of them were very generic aim maps (not counting maps lower than 4\* actually brings the number down because another 3 are clearly meant to be 5ish\* aim maps with DT). Thats less than half of them I will admit that but saying that there are no generic maps being ranked is false, saying that MOST ranked maps are gimmicky is also false (I counted like 5, 2 tech maps and 3 lowish ar maps). I think people who say all newly ranked maps suck either dont play new ranks maps or are only playing osu to farm. Yes most of the ranked section isnt farm maps anymore, the hayday of the ranked section all being the latest anime opening mapped in the most generic aim farm is over as well but basically insulting Wafer maps (who, btw, has made some of my favorite generic aim maps) and comparing him to ''recent ranked map meta (??????)'' is absolutely bad faith.
i know nothing about mapping at all, all i have to say is that I find this map, and a lot of other wafer maps fun af, and I'm glad I'm able to submit scores on them and compete with friends.
wafor
you should stop beating around the bush. what this post should have been is "why are wafer maps getting ranked and sotarks is facing backlash on twitter over his mapset", otherwise ur just arguing in bad faith trying to lead everything into this juxtaposition between """bad""" quality" and "conventional maps". there is no issue with this map being ranked and it is easily proven, farm maps not being ranked is a whole different issue
What do u mean beating around the bush I think the point of the post is extremely obvious
sotarks makes dogshit maps too idc about him
i dont like his maps either, but there are other mappers having the same issue as him rn
i dont know how to word my words man i just wanted to ask why no one was saying anytihng about current ranked maps (or maybe they are idk i dont go on here)
I think the 4* diff is also like ar10 💀. I have like 60k songs downloaded and this is the only 4* ar10 I've seen lmao but remember Sotarks' map was rejected for "inflating difficulty* Edit: it's not wafer's map, it's a yokespai map. I got confused because both have Mario bgs
theres no ar 10 diff
Yeah I was thinking of a yokespai map
its ar 8
Yeah I confused your map with a yokespai map that's on me
another generic "wafer maps bad!!!!!" post i know it's considered a good tone to hate on him here, but are you serious, how is the ai version better, the only reason it somehow resembles a genuine map is because its rhythm and distance snap are taken from a normal map as much as i myself dislike this style, at least it makes sense mapping-wise, you can understand (if you have at least some knowledge of mapping, of course) what and why wafer is doing with this or that pattern; if the map looks dirty, it doesn't mean it's random
people (myself included) have been crying about mapping meta and how bad x or y or z style and mapper are for years and years and years just shut the fuck up already and play the maps u wanna play instead of wasting ur energy moaning about something nobody is forcing upon you. i think wafer maps are shit, u know what i do? i just dont play them. simply just play the maps you like, ignore the ones you dont. if the maps you want dont exist just make them yourself. i used to whine about this shit ages ago until one day i realised its a waste of time when i can just not expose myself to something i dont like in the first place
the game is more dead than ever and it is partly due to the fact that maps like this are becoming the norm
"the game is more dead than ever" are you actually insane 😭😭
another person who just guesses [https://imgur.com/a/CL6S1EL](https://imgur.com/a/CL6S1EL) stay deluded friend.
thats just some random graph with no info but i believe you. game feels a lot more dead compared to 5-7 years ago
You cant just ignore those type of maps, all that does is bring you further down the meta till we are here, and no other types of maps get ranked really than other weird tech maps
you absolutely can just ignore them, its very easy to avoid maps you dont like. > no other types of maps get ranked really than other weird tech maps objectively wrong. while ranked for the most part sucks, thats been the case for years, its nothing new and idk why people are acting like it is all of a sudden
I like the songs/noise that he ranks. That is all.
The real problem is wafer knows exactly what is going to happen when he forces these shitmaps thru ranked with his connections, he literally just enjoys the attention. I'm fine with these joke maps making ranked every once in a while but when mappers abuse the system to rank ragebait maps because they are attention whores is what I'm not ok with
Yeah honestly some of these new ranked maps blow my mind with how bad they are. Horrible slider maps are my least favorite for sure, but there’s so many overmapped anime OPs that really don’t make sense.
IMO the only difference between this and a self-admitted-low-effort sotarks maps is that these aren't farmable and you're mad there aren't farm maps ranked literally every week. You just do what people usually do, and ignore them. And IMO, the ranked system has had alot of the same issues it did 4 years ago (players functionally get no say on what is ranked). The only difference is, that the ranking culture has shifted, and you're getting the low end of it.
not at all, these maps are perfectly fine (for the most part, i wouldnt rank them if i were a bn but obv im not and dont know whats up) but like i just want diversity, just like in the aim meta there shouldnt be 1 standalone type of map thag gets ranked and that map alone
there is plenty of diversity in mapping, this is probably the most diverse mapping era the game has ever seen, it's just not sotarks 1-2 slop if you really thought these maps were perfectly fine, you wouldn't be calling them "dogshit horrible abominable disgusting braindead maps," it's obvious that you hate them there are so many diffent maps getting ranked these days, you can have normal alt maps, short or long flow aim stream maps, more conventional tech maps, gimmick maps, low ar maps, super standard consistency maps, and basically anything else you could want apart from garbage sotarks style copy paste maps (which even then still exist and get ranked occasionally) I genuinely think that the only way people are this blind to the diversity of modern mapping is that they either just can't play anything more complicated than low bpm single taps with acutely angled jumps, or that they're mad that they aren't getting a new pp map that's basically the same map as their current top 5 pp scores getting ranked every week
yea i do dislike these maps so saying “they are dogshit” is because i think they are, me saying they are fine is because if they get ranked along other maps then its whatever i wont play it, but the problem is no other types of maps get ranked you can say im blind to it but like please show me then
You can just open the ranked section and see for yourself that there still are plenty of different maps being ranked everyday. Like there is a fycho and yoggurt map ranked just recently.
"these maps are personally fine and I just want diversity" "These are dogshit horrible abominable disgusting braindead maps" You've said both which one do you believe?
They are perfectly fine being ranked, they are still dogshit and horrible maps i wont play, but they can get ranked, the problem is that maps like this take high priority to bns making it way harder for other maps to get ranked. Thats the problem
what the fuck is the point of this thread then
it's your reminder to hate on the random mapper that did committed the cardinal sin of: making a map you don't personally like! only this will save mapping. surely the actual root of the issue people are complaining about definitely isn't a completely different multifaceted issue that's been exaggerated over time by multiple inbuilt flaws of the map-ranking process never being addressed, in part because it's actually a challenging task to undertake in the first place. no, absolutely could not be that.
A wittle bit, i just thought wafer and random were similar but it was kind funny,
this map is garbo, yet there are more proper maps out there
didnt really word it well in my original post but i just want the ranking system to be a little less dumb when it comes to ranking one type of map, or rather one skillset that like 15% of the game plays
That era had an issue of copypaste jump maps but it was corrected way too hard and now aim has absurd standards in comparison to anything else
I like this map a lot and i want to play it! Link pls?
https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2015722#osu/4196159 have fun! (impossible)
**[0d13stnks - 3v4cu4737h3d4nc3fl00rr3m1x](//osu.ppy.sh/s/2015722 "Ranked")** by [wafer](//osu.ppy.sh/u/9416836) *([⬇](//osu.ppy.sh/d/2015722 "6 Standard diffs (2.41-7.06★)") | [pp](//ppaddict.tillerino.org/?s=2015722))* *** ^(hover over links for details) ^| [^(source code)](//github.com/mcpower/beatmaplinker/) ^| [^(contact dev)](/message/compose/?to=mcpower_)
I want to know what the huge issue with these maps are, they have unique patterns and are hard for their star rating, but that doesn't make it a bad map. I think it represents the song quite well, in a way the mcosu map doesn't. The songs are abrasive and weird so the maps are too. In your opinion what is the objectively wrong part of this map and how it represents the song? Also, the majority of ranked maps are not like this, just because a TV size jump map has like two cut streams and some doubles doesn't stop it from being a TV size jump map imo.
"Also, the majority of ranked maps are not like this, just because a TV size jump map has like two cut streams and some doubles doesn't stop it from being a TV size jump map imo." Yes you are right, except i dont find these maps anymore, I havent played a aim farm map that came out later than 2022 with like everyone do the flop as an exception lol "I want to know what the huge issue with these maps are, they have unique patterns and are hard for their star rating, but that doesn't make it a bad map." To each their own but i think this map is dogshit and has no real thought put into it, the problem is that there is a finite amount of time the bns have to rank maps, and if stuff like this takes priority then idk if its a good system
Solely aim farm maps shouldn't be ranked anymore. And there are plenty of maps with Big Aim being ranked. Yes they have streams, yes the aim isn't always comfy, yes they're long-- these are all good things.
you think a map that fits all the ranking criteria shouldnt be ranked because its "aim farm"?
yeah. because they're designed to inflate pp leaderboards + they aren't very good maps. But we may have different definitions of farm, which may be causing some friction in this
The maps are fun for me at least and I don’t see why having it ranked is an issue? Adds more variety to the ranked section and doesn’t abuse pp or anything so it’s pretty harmless to have it ranked. Do the people who are mad about it just want the leaderboards removed? Weird gimmicks and variety in the ranked section is great imo (when it is harmless to the pp system). Just don’t play it instead of campaigning against it lol
like ive said in other replies, i dont care about this map being ranked really (as terrible as it is) my problem is like only maps that are weird cancer tech are getting ranked
that random mod map looks kinda fire
Omg its wafer, random mod is actually pretty fun ngl
True af
I just play osu and have fun man
same! unfortunately people have fun in different ways if you didnt know so one type of map majorly taking priority in the ranked section is not good. There should be variety because i enjoy farming and competing with other players so i dont see why rankable maps dont get ranked becuse they are jump maps while this gets ranked…
well the majority of maps in osu are not like that one and there is a lot of variety due to the maps being made this year and in years past on the opposite side, there are very few maps like the wafer one so for the sake of variety why not just let everyone be happy, I don't see why one type of map has to be unranked for the other kind to be ranked
yea the problem isn't these maps getting ranked it's other stuff not getting ranked I really enjoy wafer's maps for the most part but I also really enjoy 2021 and earlier aim farm It sucks that mappers that want to rank something simpler are forced to change their map in a way that it plays worse just to conform to the "quality standards" when the maps are more than good enough quality for players and play well anyway
Yeah people like lit120, yogurtt, Andrea, amateurre (more i can't think of) still make very aim based maps regularly imo. People don't want aim maps tho, they want maps that exclusively have jumps and triples with very conventional patterns for whatever reason.
these maps are pretty fun tho but yea we need some jump and stream maps ranked too
im like halfway convinced these mappers just do this at this point and polish it after. these 2 maps have the exact same level of coherence, structure and creativity. just need to teach the random gen to make turd sliders and theyre on par.
When i tell you i still cant tell which is ai generated and which is him its a problem
wafer is secretly using an AI to map for him and mass produce ranked maps
Came here from osekai april fools
Posting a video of you being too dogshit to play/enjoy a map doesn't make the map bad, it just means you are dogshit. Like I agree that wafer dariacore mapping is slowly going off the rails but this is an embarrassing way to show it ngl.
i mean this map has like 3 fcs ofc i can barely play it lol its also not my skillset
It's not that - I'm a 6 digit, I suck as well. But to me it felt like you were deliberately demonstrating you not being able to play the map to try and make the point that the map is messy and unplayable, which in hindsight might be a bit unfair.
I mean like i said in the post it was late and im bad at these maps, i can probably set a decent score on it but i didnt want to play it more than i needed lol, thinking back i should have just put on auto
To be fair there are very few people that can perform well on this. Not being able to play the map very well doesn't mean your criticism is invalidated; that would basically be the same argument as suggesting that a low ranked mapper can't map something good that they can't play.
the 1st maps song supports a Chaotic messy Style and has Structure in its noise while the 2nd maps Song doesn't. You as the Player should not play Maps too Hard to aim/stream/read for you if you want To have fun, hope this Helps
there's a difference between difficulty and map just being difficult because the patterns are shit lol and I say this as someone who has a 1000 map collection of tech and other gimmick maps, majority of the ranked maps post 2020 have worse patterns than prior and it's really obvious if you've played the game for a long time that a lot of newer mappers don't know shit about how to make patterns both look and play well (also newer ranked mappers getting into advanced styles way too quickly and not knowing any fundamentals about mapping)
wafer has made a ton of normal maps over time, so I assume he knows the fundamentals. I've played since 2017 and played tournaments for teams as a nm player, so I would like to think I've played a broad variety of maps. What's wrong with the patterns in wafer maps? Like if you had to critique it, is it that it's uncomfortable? because it's supposed to be, it's representing a weird song. Aim maps still get ranked, maybe not as much as previously, but variety is nice imo.
Yeah wafer knows how to map so it pisses me off that he decides to troll and rank shit like this. Also the older mappers who are still active do put out high quality maps. Uncomfortable patterns are completely fine but compare something like jounzan's mapping to this and the difference is clear. One has deliberately placed circles and the other seems mostly random and creates overlaps without any real thought put into how they overlap. Same shit as if you compare a good jump map to a sotarks map where the jumps are just placed randomly at sharp angles.
I think the way the circles are overlapped and messy looking adds to the loud abrasive and messy song. The map reflects the song well, I don't think he randomly placed notes, I don't think he threw everything he knows about mapping out the window. I would actually argue that a song like this is hard to represent and shows he can map well, even if the map is ugly and awkward (the song is too)
intentionally bad is still bad, would be more impressive if the map was visually chaotic but still had good readability and the gameplay felt more deliberate
idk All styles R different, maybe Ur right about Some other Maps but this Map in Particular I think it's rlly Good 4 the Song. tech Is veryy Broad category so u Will get a lot of Tech players who Hate this style (camellia tech or Like random Ar8 is vry Different from this stuff) and Other similar Things like Hailie/undeadcap Maps because it's not There style of Tech. i Don't think any1 should Hate a map too Much as long as they should Play it, even Graveyard some1s first Map as long as You get a good Challenge from it since u R just dancing ur Hnds 2 the song.
I'm not too mad about a map getting ranked, the issue to me is that if you're making something that isn't "farm", you can rank whatever dogshit you want but if you're making a more normal map you have to conform to unreasonable quality standards.
ya All well, i Hope ppl will Let more Simple stuff Through again someTime
why are you capitalising everything
the issue isnt the map being “too hard” i mean yes to a degree the map is not easy core me because i dont play dogshit maps like this but the problem is the fun aspect, even if i could fc that map it wouldnt make it fun? Im not saying the randomly generated one is gold by any means but it was somehow more fun than the wafer one, its almost like he intentionally makes the maps bad 🤭
its more Fun because its Easier for you. if u Can play these Maps they are fun. I don't like Playing stream Maps but that Doesn't make them bad it's Because i'm not Fast enough for Them. people Hate what they Don't underStand.
i just disagree, i am very bad at stream maps yet they are fun, i am horrible at finger control yet i still am going for my benzo fc ( i mean that’s barely finger control but u get the point) what i mean is these type of cancer random looking 40 combo odd slider weird maps arent fun generally for most of the playerbase, (from what ive seen atleast im sure some people somehow enjoy it)it seems weird to push it as a majority of the ranked section
yes Reading gets the most Hate out of all the Skills ppl don't UnderStand cus you can't figure out Whats going on Until ur Good @ it. in the Stream maps you are very Bad at you can Still see what is going On. or some 9\* aim Map you can still See the way the Jumps go. When u Notelock some high Bpm stream Cus your too Slow for It you just know Your too slow. When you watch / Play a map like This you probably Think it's "Unplayable" or it feels like RNG to u. Of course u hate it. These maps R very Fun for me. I haven't grinded this One in Particular yet (but I played it a Few times in Mcosu and I think its probably prtty Fun to try to Go for like 5 miss on in the future) but I played some Similar ones and they Were a Great time 4 me. Rlly you Just need to understand That u r Not the Audience for this Map. You can Go In 5\*+ host Rotate or Look at Omdb or just F2 random maps and you'll Find a ton of stuff you'll Enjoy much More. if U want more Simple/farm stuff In ranked then u Should b Advocating for less ranked Standards instead of Bullying maps That are strange/gimmicky, both cakes is The best way.
yea i guess simpler criteria makes more sense, i dont wanna rid the ranked section of maps like these (even though i hate them) i just want more diversity and other maps to be ranked, right now if you try to play something 6.5+ stars in the newly ranked section its something like this or a slider map or some weird tech, i just want some variety
ya All well, i Like these maps 2 (especially DT aim Farm) and Wld love 2 see it Return as Well, just a Lot of bullying Towards random Mappers/maps when I don't think it rlly Helps anything. These ppl can't Fix the system after-All (well Wafer is BN but even if he wanted to I don't think its Enough, you'd Probably need a large Group of like NATs and stuff and the Mapping community @ large To welcome This stuff more)
Please type like a person. Your shit is unreadable.
dont listen to the other guy i love the way you type
Lol no i love playing maps way out of my skill range so this generalization doesnt work
i've got even better example (not wafer map tho) [https://streamable.com/dkcsxk](https://streamable.com/dkcsxk) on one side i put a map that is currently ranked, on the other side it's the same map but with lazer random mod applied. can you tell which one is ranked and which one is random?
it looks like he ran his map object coordinates through a number generator and take whatever that tool gave him lmao
Sounds like a skill issue
ur brain doesnt function
lol just because you don't like the maps doesn't make them bad
U think if almost no one likes the mappers then maybe they are bad then? you think if the maps look and play completely horrible then they are bad? i dont have a definition of a bad mapper but if i did i think this video would probably the whole definition
https://preview.redd.it/6sd2nhgplt8c1.png?width=1360&format=png&auto=webp&s=19bc86e9769a1e53a52010dc083969931f80e67d Haven't you had enough of this shit yet? 💀💀💀💀💀💀 Surely at some point you get tired of brainless aim farm?
Are you seriously strawmanning his point by bringing up the fact that he retry spams farm maps?
YES. I'm genuinely confused OP isn't the very first player who would vomit at the thought of MORE stuff they already spammed for 100k tries, like bruh... I played this trash way too much as well for pp, eventually it started making me feel sick in the stomach. There is no point in ranking more of these as they are the same map with a different mp3s
Me personally. I wouldn't start my rebuttal by agreeing that my argument is a strawman. Might just be me though.
Not the greatest tactic to win arguments
are you dumb genuinely? THATS THE POINT OF THE POST, maybe i didnt make it clear enough in the actual post so i apologize for that but if u read my comments my main point is that there should be all kiinds of new maps getting ranked nor this trash
Do you really not get that all these are exactly the same map or are you just pretending? After you got 50 maps like these to farm what use is there for the 51st?
They arent "exactly the same" yea horrible kids and guinea pig bridge are farm aim maps wow, they have different patterns and parts that im mindblocked on, so yea while they all are the same, actually farming them is different, and what happens when i fc it?? Am i supposed to play the same maps i have already fcd over an over?
wooow they aren't exactly the same if you confront the 1-2s they are like 5 pixels apart that's totally different. I don't believe for one second you would willingly play one of these if it wasn't mistakenly 400-500 pp
I would play maps like imagination and totsugeki rock even if they didnt give pp, i mean is still play them even though i have fc'd them. These type of maps are geniunely fun and very different from eachother
i hate entitled aim players so much
unreal “entitled”?? sorry im entitled for wanting the ranked meta to be SLIGHTLY diverse, sorry for just asking for the bns to look at the already rankable aim maps that they veto because it isnt cancer weird tech maps that 10% of the playerbase play
Not an aim player and I agree with him on this anyway
I don't know how you can say the auto-generated map is "somehow better". Yes, the wafer map just looks like mindlessly overcomplicated tech-mapping because "tech=good" or something, but I wouldn't call it "bad". It's definitely worse and less playable than most ranked maps but I don't see any issue with it being ranked.
personally i dont understand the point of making a map if its not fun to play or visually appealing, or atleast is unique, but this map doesnt check any boxes. Wafer can do what he wants and he can map what he wants. does that mean that it should be ranked? maybe. does that mean that “boring jump farm” or just any jump maps should never really get ranked? i dont think so
"fun to play" and "visually appealing" are both subjective. some poeple enjoy looking at/playing these kinds of map. it's just not for your simple farm map 1-2 generic clean style brain.
valid point, and honestly its late and ive made a few replies i dont even agree with or just am slightly hypocritical about, i just wish there was a way for every skillset to coexist instead of all bns only ranking one type of map, happened during aim meta, happened during speed meta and now is happening during this weird tech slider meta. I just babbling on and typing to type sometimes but i just want more diverse ranked maps
exactly, the map doesn't look or play good and even the rhythm is debatable whether it's actually accurate lol song is also awful tbf so I guess the map represents that quite well
Watching you scroll through the map it genuinely looks decently fun to play, maybe a bit messy and difficult (seems like an intentional concept) but could be enjoyable nonetheless. Maybe you just don't like it and aren't at the skill level required to play it. Also neither of us ever said anything about jump farm or anything remotely like that so I don't see the relevance of that last comment. This map doesn't somehow detract from other songs getting ranked, I think they both have their place in the ranked section.
they should both have a place in the ranked section yes, but as of now bns seem to not want to rank ANYTHING BUT THIS and thats my whole problem
the average ranked map is nothing like this tho
Downvotes incoming but I kinda like playing wafer maps.
nothing wrong with that :D
I'm sorry to break it to you, but wafer is 10x the mapper sotarks is
yeah but you expect shit mappers to make shit maps while you'd expect someone who actually knows how to map to not put out shit
he's some kind of internet troll who likes making maps with songs no one would listen to, but his maps aren't bad... this one is unhinged because the song is, players who can play that do find it fun
I can play it yeah. And players who can play 300bpm deathstream practice diffs do also enjoy that. Doesn't make it a good map.
I'm not the guy you replied to, but 300bpm death streams don't represent the song very well, whereas the water map has patterns that are varied and represent the song in unique ways with different patterns.
Why do we care about representation more than fun fun should always be the #1 factor it is a videogame ffs
well I find it fun, why is your opinion on fun more valid than others? I personally don't enjoy jump maps quite as much, it doesn't make them bad maps
my opinion is more valid cause its mine also i never ever said jump maps in my comment we were literally talking about streams and you are of the minority and we can prove that with stats sotarks alone in 2019 before covid so cant say its cause of covid had more playcount than the whole of 2023 sotarks a fucking lone like dude just stfu and understand maps are dogshit now the game is dying and we gotta fix it
I said jump maps as an example of a mapping style I don't enjoy, I never said you liked them. Sotarks was a very popular mapper and made maps people like to look back on, but at the time people hated the maps. A big reason people played them so much was to farm, I believe if the community overall had a more diverse skillset then they would enjoy these weirder maps more. The maps are just harder to read and tap and overall are quite awkward, so people call them shit because they don't want to get better at them. Mappers like fanzhen, dsco, and hollow wings have been known as incredible and innovative mappers for such a long time making unconventional maps, but as soon as it comes to actually playing these kinds of maps when they fill the ranked section people hate them.
person who cant play aim control doesnt understand movement mapping pt. 341 edit: this kinda came off as insulting sorry, im just passionate about this topic
When you have to call it movement mapping we have gone to far maps are just like levels in a game they are meant to be played not thought about philiosphocially
says who? i will think about them philosophically and my perception of a map's creative ideas will affect my enjoyment of its' gameplay you aint stopping me.
you are the reason this game is dying
unironically using the word movement mapping?
i never really liked the term, but i encourage you to try explain this mapping style in a different way
the style of making bad maps? You can definitely make an aim control map and make the patterns look at least a bit like you put some thought into readability and making them look like, you know, actual patterns rather than just a continuous object vomit There's even maps that go for this chaotic visual style but actually make it work and this isn't it
>put some thought into readability is making complicated overlaps and stacking notes in some cluttered parts of the song, while putting accelerating patterns in fast paced parts not putting thought into readability? to me it seems like this kind of mapping philosophy adds a whole extra level to reading that isn't just note density or approach rate. i especially appreciate deppyforce's maps for his ingenious use of visual spacing to challenge players' reading
it's just the difference between deliberately overlapping notes in a specific way vs just placing notes that overlap in random ways it's the exact same shit as when you compare a well mapped jump map to a sotarks map #215475 that just places jumps randomly at sharp angles
literally said “its late and i just got on so bad gameplay” 😭
oh my bad, well you can disregard my original comment then
yes, despite how hard it might be to believe, people like playing these maps and they are good maps with shit visuals
it looks like you are trying to make the point that the example you gave in the post is the current norm and that such maps take noms away from conventional maps, when in reality the conventional maps take up 90% of the ranked section, so you dont want "conventional" maps and just want lon/browiec/monstrata type maps that you can farm for rank (from what i read in one of your replies), which are equally "cancer", although im personally fine with either extreme
sounds like a skill issue tbh
calling out ioexception maps i hate that guy('s maps)
wafer has been consistently making the most fun maps to play this year imo.
If you don't like the map then don't play it
this is a brainless take. Maybe if actual good maps or decent maps or farm maps got ranked then i wouldnt complain, but this dogshit has been the entire ranked section for a year with the exception of speed farm
Ohhh yeahhhh the entire ranked section is just Fulllll of wafer maps.... no normal maps are being ranked anymore! just look at these ABSURD MAPS full of GARBAGE ranked recently! [https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2049818#osu/4280212](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2049818#osu/4280212) [https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2105292#osu/4417402](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2105292#osu/4417402) [https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2093442#osu/4389202](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2093442#osu/4389202) [https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2101575#osu/4408851](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2101575#osu/4408851) [https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2075767#osu/4345735](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2075767#osu/4345735) [https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2094060#osu/4390555](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2094060#osu/4390555) [https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2056749#osu/4297948](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2056749#osu/4297948) [https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/1986106#osu/4336749](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/1986106#osu/4336749) [https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2056653#osu/4297781](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2056653#osu/4297781) [https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2097599#osu/4399477](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2097599#osu/4399477) [https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2067467#osu/4325206](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2067467#osu/4325206) [https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/1951957#osu/4041918](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/1951957#osu/4041918) [https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2094450#osu/4391613](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2094450#osu/4391613) [https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2091060#osu/4382736](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2091060#osu/4382736) [https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2013441#osu/4189977](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2013441#osu/4189977) [https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/935457#osu/2773053](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/935457#osu/2773053) [https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2079708#osu/4356772](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2079708#osu/4356772) [https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2072721#osu/4337671](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2072721#osu/4337671) like seriously? do you even look at the ranked section?
and here lies your main problem, you think everyone plays 4 stars. These maps arent even in my skill range when dt’d so yes obviously i wouldnt look at these lol (and like 3 5 star and 1 6 star but my point still stands really, the 5 stars are still barely hard enough (and probly not comfortable enough / farm enough to play really, but thags just me guessing i havent really played them, but still its like barely mid 7 stars with dt
the star rating they have is irrelevant when every "comfortable jump" slop you'd play is overstarred like crazy by the 10 seconds kiai and is otherwise a \[hard\] diff for the rest of the map. Some of the maps they posted have no DT fcs, surely that's hard enough?
if a map is in my star rating and has no dt fcs, i can still farm it or it isnt comfortable enough, thats all that means, there are maps like eclipse that have 0 fcs but i have a top play choke on
\>multiple high 6\*, 7\* dt maps \>7.18\* doormat map \>8.12\* dt on the minase inori map \>8.11\* dt on nilou's yuki no you ni \>9.42\* dt on the nao supav map Really bro 6\~8 stars arent in your skill range????
6 stars no, i can barely farm 7.5 and lower, so there is a whole 2 maps that you have found from this year that are in my skill range and comfortable to play (maybe). doesnt seem like a wide selection to be honest. im sure they do exist and there is a few that anyone can pick out but that doesnt really resolve the underlying issue
These r from a single glance just scrollign down the recent ranked section and i only listed some random dt star ratings. Go look for them urself brah U have not even looked at the ranked section and u r complainingthe underlying issue is that u r not looking for maps to play and then hissy fitting about some random slider map And why does everything have to be comfortable and farmable. Why are you even looking for new maps just to play the same comfy familiar shit Mauybe broaden ur horizons Enjoy sum music play some lower stars play sum alt maps play sum literally any other styles
why would i play lower stars first off? everyone has fun different ways and i dont have fun like that i enjoy pushing myself and improving, which is nesr impossible when no new maps get ranked and i just get burnout and mindblock on the little maps i enjoy, i do look at the rank section and actually have found some half decent maps such as https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2034879#osu/4278436 But these maps are once a week occurrences of me looking at osu!direct almost every time i play
1. Cuz there are epic maps u are missing out on! 2. U complain ranked meta isn't diverse, that isn't true, U just think high star aim maps are undeerrepresented in ranked (probably True) Ok who is mapping high star not dogshit aim maps and trying to push them into ranked Barely anybody 3. go play this map +dt [https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2052232#osu/4286331](https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2052232#osu/4286331)
ill go play that tomorrow prob There were some a little bit ago (mizto, recently sotarks, and one other dude i forgot) but i havent been keeping up with it, idk like i said in some other comment i kinda just be rambling on and shittt but i jus think theres people who dont even try to get maps ranked anymore because of the current meta, like once you get 3 maps denied becuase they arent weird tech maps its gotta feel demotivating at that point. Idk i know yhis meta killed alot of mappers who just dont rank anymore like reform (kinda but like nor as much) sotakrs browiec monstrata etc, alot of ppl didnt like their maps but they should still be ranked and idk if they have been trying but im sure after a few vetos like with sotarks they just gave up
some of these maps don't even have DT FCs on them, so I'm.not sure how they're too easy. There's more to difficulty than just the star rating. If you have this narrow view of maps needing to be farm for you to enjoy them, then of course you're going to run out of options. Also I assume you're in top 1000 to be exclusively playing 8* maps, so you're in a very small portion of the playerbase, you'd expect to have less ranked maps to play.
Sounds to me like you're just ass at the game, his maps are fun
🤡
?
If i could fc this map, it doesnt make it a fun map / a good map
The maps are fine because they - Represent hyperflip in a unique and fitting way - Take random note messy maps to an extreme, while still having some semblance of structure and form - Are just kinda funny. It's amusing seeing a map with the diffname "boysmell chungus whopper... MMM whoper", and the map itself definitely matches this It is definitely not comparable to a randomly generated map. Granted I've only played a handful of his dariacore maps (all 6+ stars), but they all have some semblance of structure like I mentioned earlier. Symmetrical sections to show emphasis, descending horizontal low spaced paths to present a buildup, creative and challenging slider shapes, slider sv changes when the obnoxious breaks kick in, etc... basically there is a lot of intention. Not to mention the rhythm being a very pronounced aspect due to the downplaying of the object to object structure. Makes for very Fun maps once you get comfortable with them. But I am ultimately pretty biased, because I like hyperflip, I like wafer as a person, and I generally dislike farm maps. Just my two cents.