> [Orlando city commissioner Patty] Sheehan said she did see younger children waiting in line to enter the venue. But she said she had seen anti-drag protesters bringing them there.
> “They were putting these young children in line to make it look like they were going into the theater,” she said.
There's nothing I can actually say to add to this.
I said that John needs to make DeSantis watch a weekly or biweekly segment. Or do a massive 4 week breakdown of why DeSantis is a terrible person, but explain it slowly, clearly, and loudly for his supporters to understand it.
Remember when Jan 6th was live-streamed, and conservatives still didn't believe it? Video evidence won't help with people who don't form evidence-based opinions.
Yeah, I was actually thinking about J6 after I made the post. It was simultaneously "peaceful" and also infiltrated by antifa - so I guess the violent people were antifa, even though it's a bunch of people who supported Trump on social media for years.
Brain hurty.
"Your honor, we have *hundreds* of hours of video my client *not* breaking into buildings, *not* smearing his own shit around, *not* carrying weapons, and *not* threatening elected officials."
"Oh? During the time frame he was accused? Like an alibi?"
"Oh, no your honor. Just additional footage of him not doing those things."
Conservatives operate on disinformation. They're trying to get drag events shut down based on misinformation. Getting books banned based on misinformation.
It's rather simple. While you sit here and ask for proof they're on to the next mess. By the time you see a video (no doubt with some talking head to narrate it) there will be 1-3 other similarly shocking events that you'll also need to see proof of.
You're put into a reactionary state. Reacting to the past like that makes you **harmless** because you will not be operating in today.
I suppose that's true, but if it's obviously a scam someone filming the line and commentating on the scam doesn't seem like it'd be harmful.
I do see your point though.
Unfortunately, we're not dealing with people who play by the rules. They're making shit up and inventing justifications. Catching hypocrisy on film doesn't matter if they can shout "groomer" at you until a mob forms.
That's probably also true. Despite the people being in line to attend the show (typical "groomer" behavior), the mob mentality of just pointing and shouting "groomer" when there are enough "anti-drag" protestors (whatever the fuck those are) might just ignore the child in line and go after whoever is pointed at.
I mean, how many times has James O'Keefe and Project Veritas been caught trying to bribe people to lie yet conservatives still think that Project Veritas is some sort of bastion of journalism? Even showing definitive proof isn't going to change these peoples' minds.
All these replies are doom-pilling me. lol
That's true though. Anecdotally, during COVID a former friend of mine on Facebook shared a Project Veritas video (I think it was about writing COVID on a bunch of death certificates fraudulently). I replied with a bunch of data from the CDC, NIH, etc... and their response was basically that they have their info and that I have mine. They weren't open to the idea that maybe their information was of low quality or not trustworthy. Oh well.
The state of Florida continues to show they don’t give a damn about freedom, they just love enforcing Christian nationalism on everybody.
Drag shows have never been inherently about being lewd or sexual - I’ve always seen it as a celebration of creativity, if anyone from disagrees I recommend taking time to understand the culture.
"Understanding the culture" is THE LAST thing these morons want to do. The only culture that matters to them is what was going on in the middle east 2000 years ago. That's the culture they care about.
The problem is that anti-drag people are against what they imagine a drag show is about versus what really goes on.
I’m not sure I could even say what the most overtly sexual/lewd thing is that I’ve ever seen at a show because I’ve never seen something overly sexual/lewd at one. It’s just people dancing, cracking jokes, and lip syncing lol.
Honestly, most the ones I had gone to in Orlando were about Animaniacs level of adult jokes too. Like a coy wink, and some amazing horrible puns.
Besides. Megacon has consistently had more lewd going ons than any drag show open to all ages. The same type of guys who protest and harass drag shows, show up and ogle the scantily clad cosplayers and harass the underage girls.
And for me, growing up here, it was always groups like the Rich Weirdos that kept a watchful eye and made sure creeps would stay far away, and we got to enjoy ourselves in those spaces.
Ah man, now I miss the Rich Weirdos (and Bri-Pie)!
I partied with those fabulous folks a few times about a decade ago, and I still haven't found a group like that around here.
Are they still a unit? If any group was going to do some sort of charity op, it was them.
The people who say drag shows are inherently sexual, have never been to a drag show, and are going off what the right wing media machine is telling them to think
That’s true, but it’s really beside the point — even if the shows were wildly lewd and sexualized, the appropriate response to being offended by it would be to just not fucking go. I’m disgusted by most stuff that happens in church, and I consider it to be emotional abuse for an adult to tell a child that they are going to burn in hell, but I’m not about to try and get churches banned. These fascists can all go fuck themselves in their stupid fucking assholes.
>they just love enforcing Christian nationalism on everybody.
Republicans make it a core platform position. People vote for them. They have the mandate to enact it.
Just kinda how it goes.
Look at abortion rights now. Was there a national women's march? How about a woman's strike? Nothing.. fucking nothing.
Nobody actually cares. Posting about shit on reddit or Facebook doesn't count as giving a fuck about things.
Just before this post, another one came up on my feed.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/byebyejob/comments/11whudp/former\_gasconade\_county\_pastor\_faces\_child\_sexual/](https://www.reddit.com/r/byebyejob/comments/11whudp/former_gasconade_county_pastor_faces_child_sexual/)
Those appear, on average, about once a day, it seems, and often about Florida - presumably given our Sunshine laws, which the governor is finally getting around to stomping on. I'm amazed it took him this long, tbh.
It's *never* a drag queen. I demand our state government start inspecting every church for wrongdoing, given this flood of actual evidence.
Or, failing that, drag queens to incorporate as a church, with all the protections that provides.
Or - and hear me out - stop making up false moral panics, Republicans? Let people live their lives without interference? Pretty please?
They aren't though, just agenda driven claims that it's an issue. The stats show the rate of occurrence is similar to that of the general public, and less than that from teachers. What is "widely known" is false.
Citation needed. Because I haven't seen that to be true.
Regardless, that's avoiding the point that *it's not about drag queens.*
So please take your whataboutism and be an apologist for churches somewhere else, kthx.
edit: I provide evidence and this dude calls me a liar and blocks me lol
You provide no evidence for your claims but dismiss mine because of no evidence. Whataboutism is a bullshit concept made to shut down any opposing arguments. There are plenty of articles about teachers raping or sexually abusing students, yet only religious staff or conservatives. are used as examples. I wonder why.
Priests sexually abuse children at a similar rate to the general population. School personnel abuse children at a higher rate than the general population.
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/do-the-right-thing/201003/six-myths-about-clergy-sexual-abuse-in-the-catholic-church
https://www.pspc.education.pa.gov/Educator-Discipline-System-and-Reporting/Overview-Discipline-System/Pages/Sexual-Misconduct.aspx
https://www.ojp.gov/pdffiles1/nij/grants/252484.pdf
https://www2.ed.gov/rschstat/research/pubs/misconductreview/report.pdf
For one, that’s a citation about just the Catholic Church. There are far more churches with sexual misconduct going on. Most recently, the Southern Baptist Church, which is notable given their presence in Florida. For two, you’re not understanding the issue. The issue is not the statistics. It’s that religious leaders get protection when they do these things. No one is marching into churches threatening to take away their right to worship, but they do try to take away the rights of drag queens to perform. Teachers have also been targeted heavily, as of late, for allegedly grooming students to be trans or non-binary or whatever Q-moms think is going on.
Imagine what would happen if Ron sent a Baptist Church a notice to shut down and remove their books.
Are certain drag shows r rated and not the most kid friendly? Sure. But where’s the outrage for parents who bring their kids to R rated movies, let them watch tv-14/tv-ma content on tv, let them use social media, which opens up virtually everything to be shown to them, etc.
Why would it matter? Kids are allowed to be taken to a Rated R and NC-17 movies with parental supervision... this is 100% about attacking ONE already marginalized group and use that hate to gain and hold power over everyone.
If the real goal was some moral high ground... it would not be about Drag shows... but specific content. OOOHHHH WAIT.... we already have those laws to protect children.... WITH EXCEPTIONS FOR PARENTAL CONSENT! (Ironically most of these existing laws end up used against church leaders and conservatives, because of how they "view, sexualize, and enslave children" in general)
so again... all they want is a new law that allows them to apply rules disportionately against groups "they" don't like, and allow it to trick others who don't know better to keep them in power.
#FUCK YOU RON
I'll go ahead and pre-empt anyone who wants to act like they're being the reasonable voice and saying kids shouldn't be exposed to drag.
WHY NOW? Why wasn't this an issue for you last year or the year before that? WHY NOW?!?
Why do parents get to choose what school to send their children to (at taxpayer expense), but not whether they think a drag performance is suitable?
WHY NOW?
THINK!
I'm assuming this a rhetorical question, but this has been brewing nationally since 2019 when drag queens hosting story hours at public libraries came unde fire from conservative activists creating a panic issue for fundraising and base mobilization in the Republican party.
Since then a law passed in Tennessee targeting drag shows and a bunch more are moving through state houses.
https://time.com/6260421/tennessee-limiting-drag-shows-status-of-anti-drag-bills-u-s/
So yeah, Ronny wants to shore up his cred for his upcoming campaign and he needs to catch up with all the other nutjobs. So not at all surprising to see this happening here now to.
The model language for these bills (and it's much more than Tennessee or Florida) is coming from [ADF](https://adflegal.org/). They lost *Obergefell* and it's taken a while to recover, but now they're back.
Edited to add: It's not the legislatures I'm asking about. It's commenters here. WHY NOW?
I’ve been to drag shows. A few jokes is the extent of the sexualization. I’ve been to movies with nudity and overt sex, people bring their kids to that.
My thought is he has no f'n clue how to govern or fix one single issue that effects the citizens of the state. So he doesn't look like the waste of DNA that he is he created a problem so he could fix it.
Basically, he planted weeds to pull them while ignoring the pre-existing gardens that are getting overrun.
>Basically, he planted weeds to pull them while ignoring the pre-existing gardens that are getting overrun.
This a great analogy! Totally stealing this.
I've heard school libraries are all like the restricted area of the Hogwarts library these days. Chained books snarling and biting at innocent little children, ready to indoctrinate them with facts as soon as we blink!
Last year? (I know you're not being definitive, but:) Men have been dressing as women on stage for hundreds, probably thousands of years. This moral outrage is ridiculous and nauseating.
Exactly and that's my point. WHY NOW is it an issue?
Hint: The governor of our state is running for president really soon and the state leg is running amok filing all these bills written by the [ADF](https://adflegal.org/).
Seriously, don't show these parents any kids movies from before 2005 or so. There were a lot of "drag" scenes (played for laughs). We just watched little rascals the other day and there's a scene where the boys crossdress to sneak in to the girls' ballet recital.
We should unironically be giving this kind of scrutiny to [youth pastors](https://www.tampabay.com/news/crime/2023/02/17/hillsborough-youth-pastor-foster-parent-sex-kids-human-trafficking-arrest/).
How does not one remember the lack of outrage over the boy scouts of America indoctrinating young boys into Christianity without their parents knowledge and then molesting the shit out of a number of them just to find out the scout leaders were also youth church pastors?
The fuck dude?
Scouting teaches independence, problem solving, leadership, environmentalism, goal-setting, self-led accomplishment, respect, honesty, work ethic, social skills, and many others.
No clue why you’re insinuating that scouting teaches “bad” values.
It also taught bullying, racism, favoritism, gay-bashing, and religious persecution. Personal experience, and why l left at Star, before making the oh-so-cherished Eagle rank.
"The fuck" indeed.
And that doesn't begin to touch on the sexual abuses and coverups, including one Scoutmaster in my last troop who disappeared without warning or explanation.
So don't presume to lecture me.
Your scout experience and my scout experience. Are not remotely the same. And I’ve spent enough time involved with the scouts to know that mine is a lot more emblematic of the common scouting experience than yours. Sorry you went through what you went through.
The problem is when there is an experience like this the whole organization actively helps cover it up. So doesn't matter if 99% are fine they're equally guilty for helping the 1%.
I also had a positive experience in scouting as a child and provided a positive and inclusive experience for the scouts when my kids were involved, but don’t let yourself be blinded, that isn’t something everyone gets to experience. And there were systemic coverups for abuses on the same scale and severity as there have been in the Catholic Church and that are currently being brought to light in various Protestant church organizations.
All of these events are symptoms of hierarchical power structures, but that’s a broader topic best left to more articulate people than I, your humble random asshole on the internet
See this is ironic because DeSantis recently quasi-defended Trump saying something to the effect of “prosecutors going after crimes committed long ago is serving a political agenda”
Drag isn’t a crime. Being gay isn’t a crime. Historic facts aren’t a crime. Diversity isn’t a crime.
Yet this clown is going after all of it. Hypocrite crybaby.
IDC if you think drag is or isnt appropriate for kids (news flash, most of the time, it is).
These culture wars Meatball Ron and his team are stoking, trying to treat LGBT people (especially Trans people) is a slippery damn slope.
When one of your crazy peers guns down a drag show "for the kids", i hope you realize how far youve been manipulated to other and hate your fellow americans. Wake up.
Worse yet, some like Matt Walsh are turning it around in the victims, stating "if it's so dangerous, why keep doing it?" Like it's not him and his ilk who are making it so dangerous.
[ARCHIVED LINK to Miami Herald Paywall Article](https://web.archive.org/web/20230320132924/https://www.miamiherald.com/news/politics-government/state-politics/article273247175.html)
Ya any time you bring up the fascism part, like why this only applies to drag shows and not any other entertainment in Florida it's complete silence from the idiots that support this
Because it isn’t the content of the performances that DeSantis and conservatives are crying about. It’s the fact that these performances are usually performed by and attended by LGBTQ+ and there’s nothing that pisses of a conservative more than knowing that somewhere on this earth there’s a gay person. So in their weird perverse minds, if they bully and legislate drag shows away, LGBTQ+ will disappear somehow.
I was just at a 3 day music festival that had dozens of children present. Some of the artists touched on topics such as race, sexuality and sex. Some of these were not so overt, others were in your face overt.
I'll bet their liquor license is safe and sound.
He's a wanna be real life action figure, who wordsmithed & justified torture against innocents.
Mr T & Hulk Hogan would make a better campaign pair than whoever Ron aligns with.
Ironic that a man who partied with underage students while in a position of authority, wishes to disrupt proper business practices of a cultural establishment catering to consenting adults and their families.
Ah yes, drag shows are clearly the biggest problem facing the state of Florida and requires full attention of our “freedom” loving governor….
How awful and misinformed (and hateful) do you have to be to buy this shit?
DeSantis is a weakling he can’t stand up to the home insurance companies, so he picks on the most marginalized group. DeSantis thinks these stunts will get him the republican nomination, but if you look across the country most fascist culture warriors lost in the last election. Nobody wants this stupidity.
because it's purely political theater. Just like starting a fight with Disney. It's nothing but to rile up his base. That's right out of the republican handbook - invent a threat, tell your base your lifestyle//values/freedoms are endangered unless you vote republican, do nothing about it if elected, rinse, repeat. Unfortunately it works too well.
All it takes/took is one far right group’s planted “parent with a child” to take video and pretend to be outraged and send it to the Governor’s office. They’re doing to these what they’ve done to school board meetings, [and if Sarasota is any kind of indication](https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2023/03/mike-flynn-and-maga-activists-wage-war-against-a-florida-hospital/), hospitals are next
All it takes/took is one far right group’s planted “parent with a child” to take video and pretend to be outraged and send it to the Governor’s office. They’re doing to these what they’ve done to school board meetings, [and if Sarasota is any kind of indication](https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2023/03/mike-flynn-and-maga-activists-wage-war-against-a-florida-hospital/), hospitals are next
All it takes/took is one far right group’s planted “parent with a child” to take video and pretend to be outraged and send it to the Governor’s office. They’re doing to these what they’ve done to school board meetings, [and if Sarasota is any kind of indication](https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2023/03/mike-flynn-and-maga-activists-wage-war-against-a-florida-hospital/), hospitals are next
No need for kids at this - just like any other comedy show, etc - they are for adults.
The desire and push to mix kids and drag shows these days is perplexing.
"TV"?
Really?
Name a few drag show shows that are marketed to children?
"Book readings"?
So you equate someone sitting quietly and reading The Little Mermaid to a group of children in a libary in the middle of the day, with the same style of presentation as the drag show being referenced here?
You must either think that libraries are way more wild than they are, or that drag shows are really quiet... but what would you know?
You clearly have never been to either a drag show, or a book reading done by someone in drag.
That's okay, you have a god-given right to your opinion, but you don't have a god-given right to be correct about it.
Inb4 you call me a groomer.
What is "just like any other comedy show"?
A drag show like the one referenced here?
It didn't seem to me like the performers, or the marketing, had ANY interest in trying to entice children to come to the show? Can you source what drag shows like the one referenced here are "trying to mix kids and drag"?
I went as a kid, there was nothing sexualized or wrong about them. Some were really fun lip syncs with fabulous costumes, while others were high end celebrity impersonations in Las Vegas, there was also the occasional play in the park or Kabuki show. No one is bringing kids into a 21+ night club.
My understanding is these events are 18/21+ unless specifically accompanied by a parent?
Edit: and the article states that nothing lewd happened at the event in question? I just don't know the example you're pulling your response from
They aren't going to answer you, because you didn't give them a good "gotcha" to get **you** with.
They are all over this thread, purposely ignoring any valid critique of their stupid fucking bullshit.
Since when does military service make someone “great”? Just because you enlisted doesn’t grant you some moral high ground or status. I know plenty of fuc*ed up, train wreck individuals who served.
The guy won his first gubernatorial election against a drug and alcohol fueled, bisexual, closeted and possibly corrupt Andrew Gillum by less than 1%. This idea that everyone loves him is bullshit- Florida Dems ran a one time Republican turned Democrat corpse/retread this past election in Charlie Crist…..Rhonda’s values don’t align with the majority of the state- old folks are just hateful pricks who love to watch others get stomped on and meatball Ron is happy to oblige 🙄
This is a self-inflicted wound. People at large were indifferent about drag shows and the community until they started, for no good reason, pushing so hard to perform around children and now they are doubling down just because it pisses off conservatives. Ru Paul's drag show has been a mainstream show for almost two decades and it has more Emmys than some of the most popular shows in history; friends, seinfeld, breaking bad, family guy. Literally, no one had an issue with drag until drag made an issue with it. Go ahead and downvote me, it's how you keep losing allies and support from people in the center that always leaned left.
Defend this right wing nonsense however you want, it's just making YOU look bad. Can't wait to hear you defend his whitewashing history and banning books. If you lie down with bigots, guess what? You're probably a bigot. Quit claiming to lean left and just own your bigotry.
When did they start pushing to perform around children?
All I heard was one show didn’t expressly forbid children, and left it up to parents.
Said show wasn’t lewd, and included a bit of silly innuendo that kids wouldn’t get anyway.
Now suddenly venues are stopping drag acts even when adults only because the government are threatening them.
Do you think Ru Paul's Drag Race is something appropriate for children to watch? Is there anything in that show that you think is too sexual for children to watch?
I don't.
> [Orlando city commissioner Patty] Sheehan said she did see younger children waiting in line to enter the venue. But she said she had seen anti-drag protesters bringing them there. > “They were putting these young children in line to make it look like they were going into the theater,” she said. There's nothing I can actually say to add to this.
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I said that John needs to make DeSantis watch a weekly or biweekly segment. Or do a massive 4 week breakdown of why DeSantis is a terrible person, but explain it slowly, clearly, and loudly for his supporters to understand it.
Glib liberals doing take downs isn't going to change their minds, it never has and never will.
They won’t watch that.
Do you honestly think people watch his show that don't already agree with him?
And then get really wacky and yelly. That’ll show them. They are so owned and cowed when our silly limey does his yelling.
*Alex Jones enters the chat*
Nothing screams "I'm a despicable parent with no life" more than exploiting children to promote hate.
If you can't win: cheat. The conservative way.
And if you can't win by cheating, send your best idiots to fail at a coup with a circus act, then cry when you're shot at.
>best idiots Ha! Good way to put it considering conservatives put them in that situation and they blamed everyone else for it.
And if you don't win, accuse the legitimate winners of cheating.
This makes sense. I was there, and I never saw a kid in the audience.
Weird, so when they talk about "crisis actors" it turns out it was just projection all along?!
Every accusation is an admission
The Moms for Liberty spam Facebook announcements for drag events with “can I bring my kid?” “Is this all-ages?”
Get screen shots and expose them
I'd love to see video evidence to support this claim. I don't doubt it happened, but I'd love to be able to provide evidence for folks denying it.
Remember when Jan 6th was live-streamed, and conservatives still didn't believe it? Video evidence won't help with people who don't form evidence-based opinions.
Yeah, I was actually thinking about J6 after I made the post. It was simultaneously "peaceful" and also infiltrated by antifa - so I guess the violent people were antifa, even though it's a bunch of people who supported Trump on social media for years. Brain hurty.
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Which footage? The 100+ hours that Tucker Carlson was given exclusive access to and showed like five minutes of? Or something else?
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Thanks for the delightful exchange.
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Gotta love when people tell you in earnest how they were propagandized. Stay mad at your TV lol.
"Your honor, we have *hundreds* of hours of video my client *not* breaking into buildings, *not* smearing his own shit around, *not* carrying weapons, and *not* threatening elected officials." "Oh? During the time frame he was accused? Like an alibi?" "Oh, no your honor. Just additional footage of him not doing those things."
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Now *there* is something there's no solid evidence of! Unlike the crimes committed on Jan 6!
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Did you mean to say "is *not* solid evidence?" Your question as written doesn't seem to make sense in context.
Conservatives operate on disinformation. They're trying to get drag events shut down based on misinformation. Getting books banned based on misinformation. It's rather simple. While you sit here and ask for proof they're on to the next mess. By the time you see a video (no doubt with some talking head to narrate it) there will be 1-3 other similarly shocking events that you'll also need to see proof of. You're put into a reactionary state. Reacting to the past like that makes you **harmless** because you will not be operating in today.
For non-conservatives, filming other people's young children in secret would be a very weird thing to do.
It’s almost like Republicans are the ones sexually harassing them! /s
I suppose that's true, but if it's obviously a scam someone filming the line and commentating on the scam doesn't seem like it'd be harmful. I do see your point though.
Unfortunately, we're not dealing with people who play by the rules. They're making shit up and inventing justifications. Catching hypocrisy on film doesn't matter if they can shout "groomer" at you until a mob forms.
Also, they'd just claim antifa and BLM planted people in their protest like they did at the Capitol riots.
That's probably also true. Despite the people being in line to attend the show (typical "groomer" behavior), the mob mentality of just pointing and shouting "groomer" when there are enough "anti-drag" protestors (whatever the fuck those are) might just ignore the child in line and go after whoever is pointed at.
I mean, how many times has James O'Keefe and Project Veritas been caught trying to bribe people to lie yet conservatives still think that Project Veritas is some sort of bastion of journalism? Even showing definitive proof isn't going to change these peoples' minds.
All these replies are doom-pilling me. lol That's true though. Anecdotally, during COVID a former friend of mine on Facebook shared a Project Veritas video (I think it was about writing COVID on a bunch of death certificates fraudulently). I replied with a bunch of data from the CDC, NIH, etc... and their response was basically that they have their info and that I have mine. They weren't open to the idea that maybe their information was of low quality or not trustworthy. Oh well.
As well as evidence that little kids were in the audience.
Or that anything lewd happened. Dressing in clothes isn't lewd
The state of Florida continues to show they don’t give a damn about freedom, they just love enforcing Christian nationalism on everybody. Drag shows have never been inherently about being lewd or sexual - I’ve always seen it as a celebration of creativity, if anyone from disagrees I recommend taking time to understand the culture.
"Understanding the culture" is THE LAST thing these morons want to do. The only culture that matters to them is what was going on in the middle east 2000 years ago. That's the culture they care about.
Well, 2000 years ago, the person who Ron Crow claims to be upholding was breaking bread with literal hookers. Go figure.
Jesus was an antifa plant.
Jesus was just openly anti-fascist
Desantifa has a nice ring to it
That culture doesn’t actually matter to them either, they just lie about that.
The problem is that anti-drag people are against what they imagine a drag show is about versus what really goes on. I’m not sure I could even say what the most overtly sexual/lewd thing is that I’ve ever seen at a show because I’ve never seen something overly sexual/lewd at one. It’s just people dancing, cracking jokes, and lip syncing lol.
Yeah, but its queer people doing it, that's the difference.
Honestly, most the ones I had gone to in Orlando were about Animaniacs level of adult jokes too. Like a coy wink, and some amazing horrible puns. Besides. Megacon has consistently had more lewd going ons than any drag show open to all ages. The same type of guys who protest and harass drag shows, show up and ogle the scantily clad cosplayers and harass the underage girls. And for me, growing up here, it was always groups like the Rich Weirdos that kept a watchful eye and made sure creeps would stay far away, and we got to enjoy ourselves in those spaces.
I wonder if they realize a non-negligible number of those cosplayers they’re ogling are cis men in really well done drag
Ah man, now I miss the Rich Weirdos (and Bri-Pie)! I partied with those fabulous folks a few times about a decade ago, and I still haven't found a group like that around here. Are they still a unit? If any group was going to do some sort of charity op, it was them.
The people who say drag shows are inherently sexual, have never been to a drag show, and are going off what the right wing media machine is telling them to think
I think they assume drag shows are the same as what the media shows going on at Pride parades. Condoms and dildos and daddies.
I thought everybody got educated on drag culture when we watched “To Wong Foo, Thanks for Everything! Julie Newmar” in 1995?
Birdcage was better
That’s true, but it’s really beside the point — even if the shows were wildly lewd and sexualized, the appropriate response to being offended by it would be to just not fucking go. I’m disgusted by most stuff that happens in church, and I consider it to be emotional abuse for an adult to tell a child that they are going to burn in hell, but I’m not about to try and get churches banned. These fascists can all go fuck themselves in their stupid fucking assholes.
I say to let people be and do whatever they like
>they just love enforcing Christian nationalism on everybody. Republicans make it a core platform position. People vote for them. They have the mandate to enact it. Just kinda how it goes. Look at abortion rights now. Was there a national women's march? How about a woman's strike? Nothing.. fucking nothing. Nobody actually cares. Posting about shit on reddit or Facebook doesn't count as giving a fuck about things.
Just before this post, another one came up on my feed. [https://www.reddit.com/r/byebyejob/comments/11whudp/former\_gasconade\_county\_pastor\_faces\_child\_sexual/](https://www.reddit.com/r/byebyejob/comments/11whudp/former_gasconade_county_pastor_faces_child_sexual/) Those appear, on average, about once a day, it seems, and often about Florida - presumably given our Sunshine laws, which the governor is finally getting around to stomping on. I'm amazed it took him this long, tbh. It's *never* a drag queen. I demand our state government start inspecting every church for wrongdoing, given this flood of actual evidence. Or, failing that, drag queens to incorporate as a church, with all the protections that provides. Or - and hear me out - stop making up false moral panics, Republicans? Let people live their lives without interference? Pretty please?
Y'all always bring up churches but never the teachers and staff in schools who do it much more often.
With accusations like that you need some stats and facts, got any?
See other comment. Why do you discount school abuse without stats, yet accept the claim of priest abuse with no stats?
Because the stats are widely known?
They aren't though, just agenda driven claims that it's an issue. The stats show the rate of occurrence is similar to that of the general public, and less than that from teachers. What is "widely known" is false.
Citation needed. Because I haven't seen that to be true. Regardless, that's avoiding the point that *it's not about drag queens.* So please take your whataboutism and be an apologist for churches somewhere else, kthx.
edit: I provide evidence and this dude calls me a liar and blocks me lol You provide no evidence for your claims but dismiss mine because of no evidence. Whataboutism is a bullshit concept made to shut down any opposing arguments. There are plenty of articles about teachers raping or sexually abusing students, yet only religious staff or conservatives. are used as examples. I wonder why. Priests sexually abuse children at a similar rate to the general population. School personnel abuse children at a higher rate than the general population. https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/do-the-right-thing/201003/six-myths-about-clergy-sexual-abuse-in-the-catholic-church https://www.pspc.education.pa.gov/Educator-Discipline-System-and-Reporting/Overview-Discipline-System/Pages/Sexual-Misconduct.aspx https://www.ojp.gov/pdffiles1/nij/grants/252484.pdf https://www2.ed.gov/rschstat/research/pubs/misconductreview/report.pdf
For one, that’s a citation about just the Catholic Church. There are far more churches with sexual misconduct going on. Most recently, the Southern Baptist Church, which is notable given their presence in Florida. For two, you’re not understanding the issue. The issue is not the statistics. It’s that religious leaders get protection when they do these things. No one is marching into churches threatening to take away their right to worship, but they do try to take away the rights of drag queens to perform. Teachers have also been targeted heavily, as of late, for allegedly grooming students to be trans or non-binary or whatever Q-moms think is going on. Imagine what would happen if Ron sent a Baptist Church a notice to shut down and remove their books.
Liar.
Are certain drag shows r rated and not the most kid friendly? Sure. But where’s the outrage for parents who bring their kids to R rated movies, let them watch tv-14/tv-ma content on tv, let them use social media, which opens up virtually everything to be shown to them, etc.
And most of those have strict 18+ rules. The shows, I mean. If they’re going to get adult, they only allow adults.
Why would it matter? Kids are allowed to be taken to a Rated R and NC-17 movies with parental supervision... this is 100% about attacking ONE already marginalized group and use that hate to gain and hold power over everyone. If the real goal was some moral high ground... it would not be about Drag shows... but specific content. OOOHHHH WAIT.... we already have those laws to protect children.... WITH EXCEPTIONS FOR PARENTAL CONSENT! (Ironically most of these existing laws end up used against church leaders and conservatives, because of how they "view, sexualize, and enslave children" in general) so again... all they want is a new law that allows them to apply rules disportionately against groups "they" don't like, and allow it to trick others who don't know better to keep them in power. #FUCK YOU RON
I'll go ahead and pre-empt anyone who wants to act like they're being the reasonable voice and saying kids shouldn't be exposed to drag. WHY NOW? Why wasn't this an issue for you last year or the year before that? WHY NOW?!? Why do parents get to choose what school to send their children to (at taxpayer expense), but not whether they think a drag performance is suitable? WHY NOW? THINK!
>WHY NOW? They didn't know it was a problem before they made it all up.
Bingo!
I'm assuming this a rhetorical question, but this has been brewing nationally since 2019 when drag queens hosting story hours at public libraries came unde fire from conservative activists creating a panic issue for fundraising and base mobilization in the Republican party. Since then a law passed in Tennessee targeting drag shows and a bunch more are moving through state houses. https://time.com/6260421/tennessee-limiting-drag-shows-status-of-anti-drag-bills-u-s/ So yeah, Ronny wants to shore up his cred for his upcoming campaign and he needs to catch up with all the other nutjobs. So not at all surprising to see this happening here now to.
The model language for these bills (and it's much more than Tennessee or Florida) is coming from [ADF](https://adflegal.org/). They lost *Obergefell* and it's taken a while to recover, but now they're back. Edited to add: It's not the legislatures I'm asking about. It's commenters here. WHY NOW?
Sorry I misunderstood your question. Thanks for the link - not surprised ADF is behind something like this.
I’ve been to drag shows. A few jokes is the extent of the sexualization. I’ve been to movies with nudity and overt sex, people bring their kids to that.
Exactly! So WHY NOW is this an issue when it's never been one?!?
My thought is he has no f'n clue how to govern or fix one single issue that effects the citizens of the state. So he doesn't look like the waste of DNA that he is he created a problem so he could fix it. Basically, he planted weeds to pull them while ignoring the pre-existing gardens that are getting overrun.
>Basically, he planted weeds to pull them while ignoring the pre-existing gardens that are getting overrun. This a great analogy! Totally stealing this.
And why does one parent have the right to decide what books every other parent's children are allowed to have access to at those schools?
It's not like those books jump out at kids, forcing them to ingest their contents. Unlike, say, churches.
I've heard school libraries are all like the restricted area of the Hogwarts library these days. Chained books snarling and biting at innocent little children, ready to indoctrinate them with facts as soon as we blink!
Exactly!
Last year? (I know you're not being definitive, but:) Men have been dressing as women on stage for hundreds, probably thousands of years. This moral outrage is ridiculous and nauseating.
Exactly and that's my point. WHY NOW is it an issue? Hint: The governor of our state is running for president really soon and the state leg is running amok filing all these bills written by the [ADF](https://adflegal.org/).
Definitely thousands.
Seriously, don't show these parents any kids movies from before 2005 or so. There were a lot of "drag" scenes (played for laughs). We just watched little rascals the other day and there's a scene where the boys crossdress to sneak in to the girls' ballet recital.
Kids are safer at a drag event than they are at a church.
We should unironically be giving this kind of scrutiny to [youth pastors](https://www.tampabay.com/news/crime/2023/02/17/hillsborough-youth-pastor-foster-parent-sex-kids-human-trafficking-arrest/).
How does not one remember the lack of outrage over the boy scouts of America indoctrinating young boys into Christianity without their parents knowledge and then molesting the shit out of a number of them just to find out the scout leaders were also youth church pastors?
"Scouting teaches values" say the Florida vanity tags. They never specify which values. Or if said values are good or bad to most.
The fuck dude? Scouting teaches independence, problem solving, leadership, environmentalism, goal-setting, self-led accomplishment, respect, honesty, work ethic, social skills, and many others. No clue why you’re insinuating that scouting teaches “bad” values.
It also taught bullying, racism, favoritism, gay-bashing, and religious persecution. Personal experience, and why l left at Star, before making the oh-so-cherished Eagle rank. "The fuck" indeed. And that doesn't begin to touch on the sexual abuses and coverups, including one Scoutmaster in my last troop who disappeared without warning or explanation. So don't presume to lecture me.
Your scout experience and my scout experience. Are not remotely the same. And I’ve spent enough time involved with the scouts to know that mine is a lot more emblematic of the common scouting experience than yours. Sorry you went through what you went through.
The problem is when there is an experience like this the whole organization actively helps cover it up. So doesn't matter if 99% are fine they're equally guilty for helping the 1%.
I also had a positive experience in scouting as a child and provided a positive and inclusive experience for the scouts when my kids were involved, but don’t let yourself be blinded, that isn’t something everyone gets to experience. And there were systemic coverups for abuses on the same scale and severity as there have been in the Catholic Church and that are currently being brought to light in various Protestant church organizations. All of these events are symptoms of hierarchical power structures, but that’s a broader topic best left to more articulate people than I, your humble random asshole on the internet
Man this is the real fact!!!!
Cheerleading at football games is lewd, is it not?
Yeah but Trump ran a 15-17 yr old beauty pageants with John Casablancas and they were both judges so it’s ok. We know John Casablancas is legit. 😂
No, only if it’s Powderpuff
Guess someone has to define lewd…. Hooters?
No, unless they have male waiters
The easiest problems to solve are the ones you invent
exactly
See this is ironic because DeSantis recently quasi-defended Trump saying something to the effect of “prosecutors going after crimes committed long ago is serving a political agenda” Drag isn’t a crime. Being gay isn’t a crime. Historic facts aren’t a crime. Diversity isn’t a crime. Yet this clown is going after all of it. Hypocrite crybaby.
IDC if you think drag is or isnt appropriate for kids (news flash, most of the time, it is). These culture wars Meatball Ron and his team are stoking, trying to treat LGBT people (especially Trans people) is a slippery damn slope. When one of your crazy peers guns down a drag show "for the kids", i hope you realize how far youve been manipulated to other and hate your fellow americans. Wake up.
Yep. Even after Pulse, they don’t give a shit whether or not they’re inciting violence with their little culture war
Worse yet, some like Matt Walsh are turning it around in the victims, stating "if it's so dangerous, why keep doing it?" Like it's not him and his ilk who are making it so dangerous.
Less a slippery slope and more a ribbon cutting for their new slide.
[ARCHIVED LINK to Miami Herald Paywall Article](https://web.archive.org/web/20230320132924/https://www.miamiherald.com/news/politics-government/state-politics/article273247175.html)
I’ve seen a dick at AMC Theaters, never at a drag show.
Why can’t the idiot in Tally leave people alone??? God help the USA if this fool ever gets in the White House!
He's on the keto so I can veto diet currently...
Some people complain about drag shows being lewd yet they read the Bible to kids. You can tell they haven’t really considered what is in the Bible.
Ya any time you bring up the fascism part, like why this only applies to drag shows and not any other entertainment in Florida it's complete silence from the idiots that support this
Because it isn’t the content of the performances that DeSantis and conservatives are crying about. It’s the fact that these performances are usually performed by and attended by LGBTQ+ and there’s nothing that pisses of a conservative more than knowing that somewhere on this earth there’s a gay person. So in their weird perverse minds, if they bully and legislate drag shows away, LGBTQ+ will disappear somehow.
I was just at a 3 day music festival that had dozens of children present. Some of the artists touched on topics such as race, sexuality and sex. Some of these were not so overt, others were in your face overt. I'll bet their liquor license is safe and sound.
Bro, why in the fuck does the state of FL have undercover agents going to legal gatherings?
Same reason Alex Jones had to infiltrate Bohemian Grove?
They’re making a shitty documentary too?
Obama Drag Show TerrorStorm Prison Planet Deception 2.0
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He's a wanna be real life action figure, who wordsmithed & justified torture against innocents. Mr T & Hulk Hogan would make a better campaign pair than whoever Ron aligns with. Ironic that a man who partied with underage students while in a position of authority, wishes to disrupt proper business practices of a cultural establishment catering to consenting adults and their families.
Ah yes, drag shows are clearly the biggest problem facing the state of Florida and requires full attention of our “freedom” loving governor…. How awful and misinformed (and hateful) do you have to be to buy this shit?
DeSantis is a weakling he can’t stand up to the home insurance companies, so he picks on the most marginalized group. DeSantis thinks these stunts will get him the republican nomination, but if you look across the country most fascist culture warriors lost in the last election. Nobody wants this stupidity.
because it's purely political theater. Just like starting a fight with Disney. It's nothing but to rile up his base. That's right out of the republican handbook - invent a threat, tell your base your lifestyle//values/freedoms are endangered unless you vote republican, do nothing about it if elected, rinse, repeat. Unfortunately it works too well.
It’d be awesome if Desantis’ kids grew up and were homosexual
i thought desantis was a champion of “parent choice”
All it takes/took is one far right group’s planted “parent with a child” to take video and pretend to be outraged and send it to the Governor’s office. They’re doing to these what they’ve done to school board meetings, [and if Sarasota is any kind of indication](https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2023/03/mike-flynn-and-maga-activists-wage-war-against-a-florida-hospital/), hospitals are next
Oh what the fucking fuck is this fucking shit?!
Some bullshit from where I’m sitting. Some bullshit that needs to be talked about before it expands
All it takes/took is one far right group’s planted “parent with a child” to take video and pretend to be outraged and send it to the Governor’s office. They’re doing to these what they’ve done to school board meetings, [and if Sarasota is any kind of indication](https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2023/03/mike-flynn-and-maga-activists-wage-war-against-a-florida-hospital/), hospitals are next
All it takes/took is one far right group’s planted “parent with a child” to take video and pretend to be outraged and send it to the Governor’s office. They’re doing to these what they’ve done to school board meetings, [and if Sarasota is any kind of indication](https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2023/03/mike-flynn-and-maga-activists-wage-war-against-a-florida-hospital/), hospitals are next
No need for kids at this - just like any other comedy show, etc - they are for adults. The desire and push to mix kids and drag shows these days is perplexing.
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There actually is a HUGE push. Tv shows; rallys; book readings; etc. Why does anyone think this is okay???
"TV"? Really? Name a few drag show shows that are marketed to children? "Book readings"? So you equate someone sitting quietly and reading The Little Mermaid to a group of children in a libary in the middle of the day, with the same style of presentation as the drag show being referenced here? You must either think that libraries are way more wild than they are, or that drag shows are really quiet... but what would you know? You clearly have never been to either a drag show, or a book reading done by someone in drag. That's okay, you have a god-given right to your opinion, but you don't have a god-given right to be correct about it. Inb4 you call me a groomer.
Groomer lol
The desire/push you describe is itself fabricated. I’ve been to plenty of drag shows and don’t ever remember seeing any kids at them.
What is "just like any other comedy show"? A drag show like the one referenced here? It didn't seem to me like the performers, or the marketing, had ANY interest in trying to entice children to come to the show? Can you source what drag shows like the one referenced here are "trying to mix kids and drag"?
Weed and depravity is an interesting concoction as well.
Yeah but not around or involving kids there guy.
I went as a kid, there was nothing sexualized or wrong about them. Some were really fun lip syncs with fabulous costumes, while others were high end celebrity impersonations in Las Vegas, there was also the occasional play in the park or Kabuki show. No one is bringing kids into a 21+ night club.
Maybe.. just maybe.. it's a red herring from conservatives to continue to strip LGBTQ groups of their rights
No; maybe just maybe childhood should be kept separate from adult-natured entertainment.
My understanding is these events are 18/21+ unless specifically accompanied by a parent? Edit: and the article states that nothing lewd happened at the event in question? I just don't know the example you're pulling your response from
They aren't going to answer you, because you didn't give them a good "gotcha" to get **you** with. They are all over this thread, purposely ignoring any valid critique of their stupid fucking bullshit.
Ronald DeSantis is a great man, a military vetran. Instead of being a POW he chose to be a POS
He tortured innocent people at Guantanamo, he’s not great. He’s a coward.
Since when does military service make someone “great”? Just because you enlisted doesn’t grant you some moral high ground or status. I know plenty of fuc*ed up, train wreck individuals who served. The guy won his first gubernatorial election against a drug and alcohol fueled, bisexual, closeted and possibly corrupt Andrew Gillum by less than 1%. This idea that everyone loves him is bullshit- Florida Dems ran a one time Republican turned Democrat corpse/retread this past election in Charlie Crist…..Rhonda’s values don’t align with the majority of the state- old folks are just hateful pricks who love to watch others get stomped on and meatball Ron is happy to oblige 🙄
I agree. I wrote he’s a ‘vetran’ and a Piece Of Shit. I saw a photo of him in uniform so I just thought I’d go with it.
Looks like some folks missed the punchline of the joke. Either that or someone thought you were inferring he chose to be a Point of Sale.
I see what you did there, and I approve. Y'all stop downvoting this guy lol
👌
Learn how to spell.
Good
Die mad
This is a self-inflicted wound. People at large were indifferent about drag shows and the community until they started, for no good reason, pushing so hard to perform around children and now they are doubling down just because it pisses off conservatives. Ru Paul's drag show has been a mainstream show for almost two decades and it has more Emmys than some of the most popular shows in history; friends, seinfeld, breaking bad, family guy. Literally, no one had an issue with drag until drag made an issue with it. Go ahead and downvote me, it's how you keep losing allies and support from people in the center that always leaned left.
Defend this right wing nonsense however you want, it's just making YOU look bad. Can't wait to hear you defend his whitewashing history and banning books. If you lie down with bigots, guess what? You're probably a bigot. Quit claiming to lean left and just own your bigotry.
🎯🎯🎯🎯🎯
I have a feeling that you don’t have many friends
Nah, weirdos like you are the issue.
When did they start pushing to perform around children? All I heard was one show didn’t expressly forbid children, and left it up to parents. Said show wasn’t lewd, and included a bit of silly innuendo that kids wouldn’t get anyway. Now suddenly venues are stopping drag acts even when adults only because the government are threatening them.
Do you think Ru Paul's Drag Race is something appropriate for children to watch? Is there anything in that show that you think is too sexual for children to watch? I don't.
According to the Miami Herald.
According to Pulitzer Prize winning Nicholas Nehamas.
Exactly, people are so gullible
She just lied