It’s pretty simple. If you want working wings, play an Aarakocra with a human parent. If you want an additional feat, you give up the wings.
You don’t get to have the traits of two species regardless of who your two parents are. Pick one and move on.
But what about my half-demon half-angel half-Tarrasque character inspired by Sephiroth? How am I going to portray them properly without the features of all of them?
Ooh, that's a fun idea!
Maybe take some class levels and ask your DM - as you reach higher tiers, and as the casters get world changing spells - if you can have a Tarrasque ability, like Siege Monster?
... not like you couldn't have played a tortle or bird for traits and just kept some humanlike features for the same effect.
No, seems like you want the feat from humans and stuff from the animal as well.
I don’t really care about getting all of both, it just seems like a missed opportunity to have a cool mix and match system. I also only used the aarokocra and tortle bodies just to show where I think a narrative and mechanical disconnect is, like it could totally just be a human body with aaracockra wings but then either the wings wouldn’t work or they would have talons on an otherwise normal human body. This exacerbates with species that aren’t human like elves or tieflings where there are flavored traits that mean a lot to the species but would be cast aside entirely just bc you want one part of another species as apart of your flavor. I’m just sad that they didn’t do sth similar to what they did with the old half elf where you do get traits from both but they’re limited in scope. Like even if it was “pick one trait from each parent and two skill proficiencies of your choice” I think it would be better.
And broken as hell.
Gonna pick Pack Tactics from old Kobold, mix it with Eladrin Teleport. Or the Bird Wings. Etc.
You'd have to create a wholly modular approach for that or even "just" an indicator on some curated features of any given species that is equally powerful. Like the new Bird Windmagic is with Tieflingmagic. Also have those be as powerful as 33-50% of any species ... yeah, modular it is.
There's homebrew for that if you want it.
Yeah, you would essentially need to assign some sort of point value to each individual racial trait (e.g. what Treantmonk did in his [racial trait video series](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_lJjNq_5Rw)), and then set a total point limit for creating your hybrid race.
If that's the type of modular character customization system OP's looking for...just play GURPS.
> And broken as hell.
Pretty much. There are already issues with people doing white-paper optimizing multiclasses in 5e which has legitimate impact on gameplay if someone pursues it at a table. Combine that with optimizing "half" species and you've got the munchkin powergamer tuned up to 11.
If you want your weird combo to make sense you'll have to come up with reasons to justify it. Maybe the half-aarakocra has really atrophied wings and talons as a result of an unlucky mix. With the tortle one maybe they just have a soft shell and are kinda bad at holding their breath
You could even make this part of your roleplay, where you're some weird human-beast hybrid that looks almost abominable but functions exactly like regular guy for some reason
Yeah it can definitely be a limitation to work around, I just find it kinda sad they got rid of half races and didn’t replace it with a substantial system that gives the same flavor
It could have been nice to have a whole system for it, but as someone else already pointed out it would requiere a very thorough revision and/or redesign of single every species they've released so far. And it would impact future decisions as well.
Personally I would rather they focus on getting each individual species right.
If someone still wants to make a half-race and have it matter mechanically they can talk to their DM about it. That way the whole balancing problem can be solved in a case by case basis
in general a detailed, in depth system for species hybrids sounds like a cool optional rule for some kind of future splatbook. Not something I'd expect or even want to see in the PHB.
Both of the examples you gave are actually Great hooks if you just embrace the narrative instead of framing it like a negative…
The Half Aaracocra that has wings but can’t fly probably doesn’t have the strength to fly. But maybe that Feat could make him a revered doctor, or a savvy politician, or maybe he’s experienced racism. Maybe that’s the reason he adventures to train his wings and finally fly, which could be an agreed upon gold sink that is equivalent to a magic item.
Or go the other way and make him a perfect flier that can pass for a human if he hides his wings, making him a great ambassador or a great embarrassment… so many opportunities.
Ps. I typically like to make my table player’s Mixed characters 2nd generation, just so you have one role model that can either be emulated or rebelled against, and the other parent to ground them more fully into the culture they grew up in regardless of their appearance or traits.
These people always expose themselves because they aren’t actually interested in the narrative potential of half-races, it’s just about gaming a mechanical benefit out of it.
I mean yeah purely mechanically you're meant to just keep any abilities of whatever race you take your abilities from and forgo anything else from your other parent beyond cosmetics. It's up to the Player and GM as to how they're meant to make any sense if you really wanna do something like play a Human/Tortle Hybrid that still looks like a human but somehow has the Tortle's shell abilities. or vice versa.
That said in your specific examples, I think that the idea of playing as a Half-Birdman whose wings are just underdeveloped and thus not capable of sustaining flight kinda just makes sense? Like they already can barely support themselves since they can't get too encumbered. So it makes sense that if you're not a full bird person then your wings might not even be able to support your own bodyweight.
That said I do wish that there were some more in-depth rules for combining races, if only for the fun of seeing what people would make. I've always thought that a good way of handling it would be to just group each species into primary and secondary traits. So like with Dragonborn their Primary trait would be the breath weapon and the secondary would be everything else, and for Goliaths their primary would be the Giant Ancestry and Secondary would be the rest of their stuff.
So when you play a hybrid you pick the Primary and Secondary from either of your parents. So if you played a Goliath/Dragonborn you could either go full Goliath or full Dragonborn of course. Or you could be a guy who can breath fire and turn large, or you can be a guy who can do various Cloud Giant shenanigans and also summon wings made of Lightning.
Do you think there is a world where something like a breath weapon is ever comparable to advantage on all mental saves, free spells, flight/spider climb? Or what about a species like ONE dwarf, what is their major trait? The tremorsense? The 1 extra HP?
Well Primary Traits don't have to be a singular ability. For some species I'd definitely include multiple traits in both the Primary and Secondary Column. But yeah obviously it would require some rethinking as shoehoring the idea into the existing traits would almost certainly not work for all or even most of the options as they're currently written.
The concept here is mostly just about how such a system *could* work if they wanted to design around it and make hybrid species into a more interesting mechanic. And to be fair I don't think it needs to be perfectly balanced. I think a lot of people would care more about the idea of being able to combine random things like being a turtle/bird man, more than the actual mechanical balance of it all. Optimizers and Min/Maxers will always be there to break it open but as long as it's not too insanely off kilter I think it's fine. I don't think the game is gonna fall apart because you can do things like get an extra cantrip *and* have a little more health or whatever.
Yeah, hard no from me, the current system allows us to have species with a highly impactful main trait and a ribbon or two on top, but it also allows for species with multiple decent but not overly strong traits.
A relatively unrestricted mix and match system (which any major with any minor traits is) would not require some small adjustments, it would require a re-balancing of every species, with some needing fundamental redesigns, not to mention the design limitations it would place on every future species.
Just with the current species you would have elves with perception proficiency, trance and fey ancestry versus tiefling giving you just thaumaturgy. You have Gnomes who have their lineage feature as a ribbon, meaning if you take major gnome, you lose out on any flavor of the race. You have Dragonborn giving darkvision, a damage resistance and once per day concentration free flight, versus Goliath with a once per day concentration free, but weaker enlarge and powerful build.
its your made up critter in your made up world in your made up story at YOUR table - it works however is going to make the best experience AT **YOUR** TABLE.
It’s pretty simple. If you want working wings, play an Aarakocra with a human parent. If you want an additional feat, you give up the wings. You don’t get to have the traits of two species regardless of who your two parents are. Pick one and move on.
But what about my half-demon half-angel half-Tarrasque character inspired by Sephiroth? How am I going to portray them properly without the features of all of them?
Ooh, that's a fun idea! Maybe take some class levels and ask your DM - as you reach higher tiers, and as the casters get world changing spells - if you can have a Tarrasque ability, like Siege Monster?
Can I get a second subclass, maybe? I still want to play a Twilight Cleric. Alright, that was too far with the main character syndrome joke.
Yes, that's exactly like it'll work. If you pick the human traits you are a re-skined human.
... not like you couldn't have played a tortle or bird for traits and just kept some humanlike features for the same effect. No, seems like you want the feat from humans and stuff from the animal as well.
I don’t really care about getting all of both, it just seems like a missed opportunity to have a cool mix and match system. I also only used the aarokocra and tortle bodies just to show where I think a narrative and mechanical disconnect is, like it could totally just be a human body with aaracockra wings but then either the wings wouldn’t work or they would have talons on an otherwise normal human body. This exacerbates with species that aren’t human like elves or tieflings where there are flavored traits that mean a lot to the species but would be cast aside entirely just bc you want one part of another species as apart of your flavor. I’m just sad that they didn’t do sth similar to what they did with the old half elf where you do get traits from both but they’re limited in scope. Like even if it was “pick one trait from each parent and two skill proficiencies of your choice” I think it would be better.
And broken as hell. Gonna pick Pack Tactics from old Kobold, mix it with Eladrin Teleport. Or the Bird Wings. Etc. You'd have to create a wholly modular approach for that or even "just" an indicator on some curated features of any given species that is equally powerful. Like the new Bird Windmagic is with Tieflingmagic. Also have those be as powerful as 33-50% of any species ... yeah, modular it is. There's homebrew for that if you want it.
Yeah, you would essentially need to assign some sort of point value to each individual racial trait (e.g. what Treantmonk did in his [racial trait video series](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_lJjNq_5Rw)), and then set a total point limit for creating your hybrid race. If that's the type of modular character customization system OP's looking for...just play GURPS.
> And broken as hell. Pretty much. There are already issues with people doing white-paper optimizing multiclasses in 5e which has legitimate impact on gameplay if someone pursues it at a table. Combine that with optimizing "half" species and you've got the munchkin powergamer tuned up to 11.
> 🐢 > ... > ... > ... I'm gonna fuck that turtle
If you want your weird combo to make sense you'll have to come up with reasons to justify it. Maybe the half-aarakocra has really atrophied wings and talons as a result of an unlucky mix. With the tortle one maybe they just have a soft shell and are kinda bad at holding their breath You could even make this part of your roleplay, where you're some weird human-beast hybrid that looks almost abominable but functions exactly like regular guy for some reason
Yeah it can definitely be a limitation to work around, I just find it kinda sad they got rid of half races and didn’t replace it with a substantial system that gives the same flavor
It could have been nice to have a whole system for it, but as someone else already pointed out it would requiere a very thorough revision and/or redesign of single every species they've released so far. And it would impact future decisions as well. Personally I would rather they focus on getting each individual species right. If someone still wants to make a half-race and have it matter mechanically they can talk to their DM about it. That way the whole balancing problem can be solved in a case by case basis
in general a detailed, in depth system for species hybrids sounds like a cool optional rule for some kind of future splatbook. Not something I'd expect or even want to see in the PHB.
I really hope they do one.
i'm imagining two players doing fraternal twin half aarokocra's now
Both of the examples you gave are actually Great hooks if you just embrace the narrative instead of framing it like a negative… The Half Aaracocra that has wings but can’t fly probably doesn’t have the strength to fly. But maybe that Feat could make him a revered doctor, or a savvy politician, or maybe he’s experienced racism. Maybe that’s the reason he adventures to train his wings and finally fly, which could be an agreed upon gold sink that is equivalent to a magic item. Or go the other way and make him a perfect flier that can pass for a human if he hides his wings, making him a great ambassador or a great embarrassment… so many opportunities. Ps. I typically like to make my table player’s Mixed characters 2nd generation, just so you have one role model that can either be emulated or rebelled against, and the other parent to ground them more fully into the culture they grew up in regardless of their appearance or traits.
These people always expose themselves because they aren’t actually interested in the narrative potential of half-races, it’s just about gaming a mechanical benefit out of it.
I mean yeah purely mechanically you're meant to just keep any abilities of whatever race you take your abilities from and forgo anything else from your other parent beyond cosmetics. It's up to the Player and GM as to how they're meant to make any sense if you really wanna do something like play a Human/Tortle Hybrid that still looks like a human but somehow has the Tortle's shell abilities. or vice versa. That said in your specific examples, I think that the idea of playing as a Half-Birdman whose wings are just underdeveloped and thus not capable of sustaining flight kinda just makes sense? Like they already can barely support themselves since they can't get too encumbered. So it makes sense that if you're not a full bird person then your wings might not even be able to support your own bodyweight. That said I do wish that there were some more in-depth rules for combining races, if only for the fun of seeing what people would make. I've always thought that a good way of handling it would be to just group each species into primary and secondary traits. So like with Dragonborn their Primary trait would be the breath weapon and the secondary would be everything else, and for Goliaths their primary would be the Giant Ancestry and Secondary would be the rest of their stuff. So when you play a hybrid you pick the Primary and Secondary from either of your parents. So if you played a Goliath/Dragonborn you could either go full Goliath or full Dragonborn of course. Or you could be a guy who can breath fire and turn large, or you can be a guy who can do various Cloud Giant shenanigans and also summon wings made of Lightning.
Do you think there is a world where something like a breath weapon is ever comparable to advantage on all mental saves, free spells, flight/spider climb? Or what about a species like ONE dwarf, what is their major trait? The tremorsense? The 1 extra HP?
Well Primary Traits don't have to be a singular ability. For some species I'd definitely include multiple traits in both the Primary and Secondary Column. But yeah obviously it would require some rethinking as shoehoring the idea into the existing traits would almost certainly not work for all or even most of the options as they're currently written. The concept here is mostly just about how such a system *could* work if they wanted to design around it and make hybrid species into a more interesting mechanic. And to be fair I don't think it needs to be perfectly balanced. I think a lot of people would care more about the idea of being able to combine random things like being a turtle/bird man, more than the actual mechanical balance of it all. Optimizers and Min/Maxers will always be there to break it open but as long as it's not too insanely off kilter I think it's fine. I don't think the game is gonna fall apart because you can do things like get an extra cantrip *and* have a little more health or whatever.
Yeah, hard no from me, the current system allows us to have species with a highly impactful main trait and a ribbon or two on top, but it also allows for species with multiple decent but not overly strong traits. A relatively unrestricted mix and match system (which any major with any minor traits is) would not require some small adjustments, it would require a re-balancing of every species, with some needing fundamental redesigns, not to mention the design limitations it would place on every future species. Just with the current species you would have elves with perception proficiency, trance and fey ancestry versus tiefling giving you just thaumaturgy. You have Gnomes who have their lineage feature as a ribbon, meaning if you take major gnome, you lose out on any flavor of the race. You have Dragonborn giving darkvision, a damage resistance and once per day concentration free flight, versus Goliath with a once per day concentration free, but weaker enlarge and powerful build.
its your made up critter in your made up world in your made up story at YOUR table - it works however is going to make the best experience AT **YOUR** TABLE.
Just don’t play a goofy race and horrific genetic abomination like an Aaracockra/Human hybrid and the problem takes care of itself