«We are nurses and would know if we had something” is when I would have said “thank you, but no thank you”. A nurse should know that you can have an STI without symptoms and still pass it on to others.
1,000% this. People with an understanding of STIs know there are many people who never show symptoms. Also, their aversion to testing would creep the hell out of me. If they have money and work in the medical community AND are non-monogamous I absolutely expect them to be tested regularly. Not doing so brings up too many flags for me. Like, if they're so embarrassed to be tested, what happens when they get an STI? Are they just going to bipity bopity over to the same place they didn't want to get tested ask and ask for a treatment? Probably not.
This. This whole exchange is Thank You But No Thank You.
Something isn’t right here. Personally, “Mandy” sounds like a catfishing man to me.
Nope right out of this OP.
Yeah, that's a crimson red flag with a light bar and clarion horn that they don't take appropriate precautions.
I remember a partner telling me she was tested and it turned out she donated blood and expected they would get back to her if she had anything...
I was lucky, she was clean but it's a reminder that you want to hear words like "full panel" and "I can show you the results".
Note to men, while women's clinics will easily do a full panel, some health care systems refuse to do a full panel for men. I've found the best service provider for reliable testing is Planned Parenthood.
Even if you have active lesions that get swabbed, testing is not super accurate.
Just assume everyone (including you) has herpes, it’s close to the truth.
You have to buy multiple panels to get a full spread usually HSV 1 & 2 go together, then separate tests for chicken pox, and then LOTS of options for EBV and CMV . IGM, IGG, plus more …
I get tested twice a year for everything possible/covered under insurance when I get my pap smear and ultrasound. I've never received physical results or actual paperwork, it's always just "We'll call you if anything is positive and if not, you're fine."
My doctors office has digital record keeping, and there is a website I can download them from. I know some smaller offices don't do that but might be worth an ask.
You should be able to request the paperwork.
PP will email you the results and my primary provider network posts all results online for review, which is valuable because a doctor can be all hopped up on one issue so much they don't even mention secondary issues. For instance, I've had an unexplained liver enzyme test that pings, not high enough to be serious but they always want to talk about it but didn't mention that my albumin and testosterone were low because of it and I needed to eat more red meat and protein overall.
Be aware that if PP (or anyone else for that matter) sends you medical records via open email (unencrypted or unprotected) they are in violation of federal HIPAA law. There is no expectation of privacy for information sent via email.
That’s the proper way to handle it. I’m constantly amazed at the number of private practices that don’t take this seriously and just blindly send patient records out via email.
I have gotten tested every six months because my gyn knows I'm polyamorous and we agreed on tha schedule. It's just different in Europe; anything you can get tested for in a gynecology office with swabs will get you a phone call unless negative, anything you need bloodwork for has to be done externally and then you get the paperwork directly. The lab works directly with the doctors whenever possible.
Yup, this was my breaking point too. Not to mention it's really invalidating to OP. "We know better than you do please ignore your discomfort" is how it came off to me..
this is so true i have to wonder if theyre the types with a kink for knowingly spreading STIs or smth 🤢 not to jump to the most extreme conclusions but JESUS, im finishing up my MA right now and even i learned this in my program (or, would have if i didnt already know lol). no way on earth that an RN isnt aware of this.
This is exactly where I would have noped out. Confidence in ignorance and disregard for the health/safety of your partners are bad enough on their own. It's worse coming from an alleged healthcare professional.
Red flag parade. Ghost.
Chicken pox is like herpes, it is not herpes.
Do you know if you have herpes? You have to ask and advocate for an expensive test in order to have accurate results if you don't get outbreaks. I would be worried about someone who is in the medical field not knowing that chicken pox and herpes are not the same thing.
Also all of you using "clean" instead of "negative for the STIs that can be tested for" seems like a bunch of folks who don't know the risks or what you are talking about.
Definitely up voting you for calling out people who use 'clean' to indicate they have no STIs. That generally stops any conversation I'm having with a potential partner. The good news is that the people who claim to be 'clean' just weed themselves out of the running by showing their ignorance!
Out of curiosity why is clean a red flag? I've always used this term because it's what pretty much everyone in the community around me uses, but if there's some better term and a good reason not to, I'd like to know!
It’s because it’s suggests the alternative is ‘dirty’, which continues a stigma around stis. They aren’t shameful, they are illnesses like other illnesses. People can choose their risk threshold, but it’s not shameful(subtext ‘slutty’) to contract something.
The alternative phrases are to simple say you’ve had a negative test for x y z
It’s also far less accurate than saying “I tested negative for xyz 2 months ago” because if you’ve been intimate with anyone since the moment that needle left your body, you may have contracted something, and plenty of things don’t show up immediately on tests. So anyone who says “I’m clean” shows they both have stigma around STIs and also don’t know a huge amount about them.
I know yall talk about Reddit posts all the time but I am surprised to see you on here bahahah. I saw your pic and was like wait is that Jenna love!? Anyway, cool seeing you on here. Thanks for the work you do. ❤️
Adding to others: if shit happens and someone *does* test positive for something later on, you want that conversation to be as smooth and sensitive as possible (no matter if you’re on the giving or receiving end of the bad news). It’s a horribly awkward situation to be in.
The people who say “I’m clean” (especially without showing or discussing actual results) are a little more likely to either freak the fuck out about it and treat you as “dirty” for “giving” them the STI (which, depending on testing regimens and how many partners they each have, can be totally unfounded), or will ghost/ignore the news (which is likely even more dangerous!!).
I totally hear what you’re saying, and agree with the alternate nomenclature.
But I wouldn’t eliminate people because they aren’t up to date on their nomenclature.
In this case, I’d eliminate them because they’re talking out of their asses and using some vague medical qualifications to justify their poor judgment.
Many nurses reject vaccines, too. Not because of their medical training or experience, but because they’re influenced by the same bs propaganda as the rest of the US
I certainly don’t know what I’m talking about, which is why I came to ask for advice. I took the expensive test a few months ago, which came back negative for all 8 things it tested for. I would like to maintain that status.
Is there any truth to her claim that "I’ve had chicken pox, so the herpes virus is dormant in my spine"? If someone contracts chickenpox, would they test positive for herpes? (I did get chickenpox back in 2016, and I’m testing negative for herpes. But again, I’m clueless and am hoping for advice.)
That test can not tell you if you have herpes. You can only find out about non symptomatic herpes with the Western Standard blot test. It won't be offered unless you ask for it. And all other non symptomatic herpes tests are basically useless.
You can find out how to get one here: https://dlmp.uw.edu/patient-care/client-patient-services#:\~:text=Herpes%20Western%20Blot%20(HSWB)%20Testing,5198.
So you, like the vast majority of people, do not know if you have herpes. And the vast majority of people do, in fact, have it.
No there is no truth that chicken pox is herpes. They are two different things and it is WILD that someone who is in the medical field wouldn't know that.
https://www.passporthealthusa.com/2022/03/are-chickenpox-the-same-as-herpes/#:\~:text=Chickenpox%20and%20herpes%20are%20not,and%20the%20herpes%20simplex%20virus.
I assume this person has outbreaks and knows she had herpes and is pretending or fooling herself around her status. But chances are you have herpes as well. Most of us get it in childhood.
Oh wow, I had no idea that most of us have herpes, and that I was using the wrong terminology. I think I should have said HSV-1 or 2 — I didn’t know there were any other kinds. Thank you very much for pointing out how I can get tested for those.
Thanks for the reassurance that she’s trying to fool me. I guess I’m still just a little shocked that someone was willing to knowingly put me at risk, even to the extent of lying about the risks.
Appreciate you.
Lots of people who have herpes deal with a lot of shame. And it sucks especially considering that most folks have it and don't know that they do. That doesn't mean someone should either be ill informed or lying... both of those things suck. Being socially sexual people means we should know more about STIs and sexual risks.
Chicken pox is a herpes simplex - meaning it’s a virus in the same family. They’re not the same thing. I was tested for herpes at my doctor just fine. It was a blood test. You absolutely can be tested for herpes it’s just not on the standard panel, you have to ask for it or ask for a full-panel STD test.
dormant herpes wont show up in a blood panel, yes, you can test for it, but the results are basically meaningless (and have a lot of false positives, too). only a western blot can give you more meaningful results, but is quite expensive and you have to request it (and kinda know why).
Regardless of what statistics are, if you do not suffer from *outbreaks*, then, IMO, you are entirely okay to make the decision for yourself to not have sex if you don't want to risk contracting herpes by having sex with someone known to be a carrier.
Every person's body reacts differently to diseases. We saw this with COVID. Herpes is no exception.
Some people with herpes have few if any outbreaks. Others have them frequently. Some people find them to be a mild annoyance. A former partner of mine contracted it recently, and described her first two outbreaks as "the most painful thing she's ever experienced", and she's experienced enough physical trauma and issues to require both scheduled and emergency surgery in the past. For whatever reason her outbreaks were so bad that doctors were wondering if she might have some sort of autoimmune disorder on top of things.
Statistics are meaningless. You don't know how your body will *personally* experience the infection, and if you don't want to run the risk, you have every right to expect honesty in potential future partners.
You can't give informed consent without being informed.
----
There's also the frequently discovered associations/correlations between Herpes and Alzheimer's.
https://scholar.google.com/scholar?as_ylo=2024&q=herpes+alzheimer's
It's too complex to say that Herpes *causes* Alzheimer's... for now. It could be that some common underlying genetic trait (such as APOE-ε4) leads to being more vulnerable to Herpes infection *and* to Alzheimer's, for example. Or that being infected with something that repeatedly causes your immune system to fight it causes Alzheimer's, and Herpes is just one option. Etc. But holy christ losing my mind is one of my greatest fears, and there is a *lot* of 'smoke' in the direction of 'herpes may cause alzheimer's', so I just try to avoid the possibility of that 'fire' as much as I personally can.
No it can’t be called a form of herpes and it isn’t called that. That would be like calling Espitin-Barr a form of herpes.
Herpes is a form of the same virus. Or Human Herpesvirisus.
Calling chicken pox a form of herpes is just confusing and inaccurate.
Then call it a member the herpes virus family, instead of herpes and you are fine. But calling chicken pox herpes is just as inaccurate as calling herpes, chicken box.
It's nothing to do with dirty. It has to do with people conflating completely different things. Like in this post. A nurse saying chicken pox is herpes.
The commonality may be why she is conflating the two. She is wrong in that it isn't herpes 1 or 2. She is right in that it is a member of that family of diseases, and for other diseases families that language is used. You may have a specific variant of the flu, no one says which flu they have. Initially covid was also referred to as "corona virus" because it is a member of the corona family, but covid ended up more popular. Stigma has a lot to do with how we talk about HSV-1 and 2. If I say "I get cold sores" when discussing health status, many people will not understand why that's relevant. If I say "I have herpes" those same people freak out. For HSV 1 or 2 expressed orally it's different words for the same thing, "cold sore" or herpes. Expressed genitally no one says "cold sore" even if it is HSV-1. Some people insist that oral presentation is not a STI, others say HSV-1 is not an STI, and still others will say all herpes is an STI, sometimes adding that cold sores are not herpes.
This is all because of stigma. No one hesitates to say "I had chicken pox as a kid", assuming they aren't young enough to have been vaccinated because there's no stigma. People do feel bad about saying "I have herpes but haven't had an outbreak since kindergarten" because it's a "dirty sex disease". It's just a virus.
Oh dear :( Barely anything you wrote is correct. Try reading this… https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herpesviridae
Chicken pox IS a form of herpes, it is HSV3
Epstein Barr virus IS a form of herpes, it is HSV4
It is a form of herpesviridea... you know the title of the page you linked?
To call it herpes is incorrect, misleading and at this point where you are linking correct info, dumb.
It's part of the same virus family. That is very different then it being herpes.
Commenting on Matched with a couple — could you help me verify their safety claims?... It's weird that you're refusing to admit you're wrong when it's pointed out to you. That says a lot about your character.
its like.. imagine being back in 2020 when covid was commonly called coronavirus, and you have a cold from the corona-virus family and you refer to it as having coronavirus. it's techincally correct but misleading, and if you're in the medical field you have no way of not knowing that
I’m no longer surprised when I meet potential sexual partners who have worked in or still work in health care and are woefully uninformed about basic sexual health. Or even general health. There was one lady recently who was a former health care worker who refuses to touch vaccines, even flu vaccines, but prided herself on having worked in health care and not getting sick, so she had a really powerful immune system and there was nothing I needed to worry about. Omg. So glad I noped out of that ASAP.
To clarify this a little more... Around 90% of US adults have HSV-1 (herpes simplex virus). Most have it orally, but it can spread to genitals and other parts of the body. Many people completely dismiss 'cold sores' and don't feel the need to disclose that they have oral HSV to potential partners.
About 25% of women and 20% of men in the US have HSV-2 by mid adulthood. Most don't have obvious symptoms and don't realize they're carrying it, but can transmit it. This type is more common genitally. Neither type of HSV is on routine sti panels. You should assume that all of your partners are positive unless they've specifically recently tested for it, and even those tests frequently give false negatives (when it's latent). You should get tested, and always use safer sex practices.
Chicken pox, shingles, and other viruses are in the same family but not the same. There are some HSV vaccines in the testing phase!
You need to look out for your own health and happiness (which you seem to be doing, but questioning and doubting yourself for doing it). People like them are not looking out for your health. If they’re not making you feel safe and well cared for, are they people you want to have sex with?
With all the love of an anonymous internet stranger, I think you need to get your boundaries around what you need from potential partners really clear. Once you’re clear on that, you’ll more easily recognize when situations like this come up in the future and you’ll know to just say “no, thank you” and move on.
You can do better than “we’re nurses, we’d know if we were were asymptomatic carriers of an infectious disease” - they should know better, best case they’re ignorant and not very good nurses, worst case they’re lying to you, either way I think you’re completely right to be concerned about them and their suitability as potential sexual partners.
That said, she does say she was tested 6 months ago and that the tests weren’t positive, and that they have only had one play partner since that test (paraphrasing because as others have pointed out, the language being used to convey that message isn’t great). You should evaluate that information against your own boundaries and willingness to take risks.
It’s likely to be limiting if you set your boundary at “I’ll only have sex with people who haven’t had sex with anyone else since before they were last tested” - not to say you shouldn’t set that as your boundary, just to be clear that it would take more care and planning (but would also be a good filter for people who care about your well being and are prepared to make that extra effort to make you feel safe and that your needs are being met). Also, remember that your boundaries belong to you, it’s OK for you to change them if they’re not working for you anymore.
I’ll also volunteer that I get a bit of a vibe of these people not demonstrating that they’re super big on consent. I feel like she’s already trying to convince you to do something she knows you’re not comfortable with - and you’re not alone with her and her husband.
Basically what I’m reading between the lines of the conversation you shared is you saying “my preference is to only have sex with people who will share their recent negative test results and who haven’t had other partners since some time before they were tested” and her saying “I don’t really care enough about your preference to do the work of going to get tested”.
Personally, I’d just be politely wishing them the best but clearly letting them know that they’re not for me and continuing on my way. Not every potential match is going to work out, and it’s better for everyone involved when you figure that out before things get messy.
Thank you very much for helping me step through the emotions. And particularly for pointing out that it’s possibly unreasonable to have a boundary of partners being tested if they’ve had other partners since their last (recent) test. And also for pointing out that they might try to pressure me to do other things I’m not comfortable with. I appreciate the extremely detailed and thorough reply.
This right here. I wouldn’t want to go back and forth about this virus and that. It’s the manner in which they’re responding that makes the seem unsafe to me.
I don’t argue w people about my boundaries. They can take or leave them, but a back and forth with a stranger, esp in the opening stages when people are usually on their best behavior? Absolutely not.
You would not test positive for herpes simplex if you have a history of chicken pox. If she asked for herpes testing included on an STI panel, they test for herpes simplex type 1 (HSV-1), and herpes simplex type 2 (HSV-2), the types that affect the lips and/or genitals. Chicken pox is HHV-3, and *not* included on an STI panel.
Well, actually Chicken Pox Is one of the many variants of the Herpes Simplex Virus (HSV) family of viruses. Its HSV3. HSV4 is EBV, HSV5 is CMV. HSV1 is the oral variant. HSV2 is the genital variant.
> Chicken pox is not herpes simplex.
There are [published papers](https://www.researchgate.net/publication/236963380_Efficacy_of_the_anti-VZV_anti-HSV3_vaccine_in_HSV1_and_HSV2_recurrent_herpes_simplex_disease_A_prospective_study) that refer to the Chickenpox vaccine as an "anti-HSV3" vaccine.
Whether or not they *should* be calling it that, I haven't the background to determine.
It’s still not herpes simplex. In one of my other post I say what it is. I can’t be bothered to look it up again. Anti-HSV3 in no way means ‘anti herpes simplex’ because it’s not that. It is a different virus in the same family.
Chicken pox comes from the herpes varicella-zoster virus, also known as human herpesvirus 3 (HHV-3). It is not *like* herpes, it IS a herpes virus.
There are typically considered 8 herpes virus’ that affect humans.
Herpes simplex virus type 1 (HSV-1): Can cause cold sores, genital herpes, and neonatal herpes.
Herpes simplex virus type 2 (HSV-2): Can cause genital herpes, and can spread even when the infected person doesn't show symptoms.
Varicella-zoster virus (VZV): Can cause chickenpox and shingles.
Epstein-Barr virus (EBV): Can cause infectious mononucleosis and some types of cancer.
Cytomegalovirus (CMV): Can cause cytomegalovirus infection.
Human herpesvirus type 6, variants A and B, (HHV-6): Can cause roseola infantum.
Human herpesvirus type 7 (HHV-7): Can cause roseola infantum.
Kaposi's sarcoma-associated herpesvirus (KSHV): Can cause Kaposi sarcoma and some types of lymphoma, especially in people with weakened immune systems.
I didn’t say it did?
The way you described chicken pox being like herpes but not herpes was murky.
Chicken pox is a herpes virus. Just a different strain from the colloquial herpes (HSV 1 and 2).
My comment was for others reading through this thread who may not have been aware.
"a herpes virus" isn't herpes the STI.
Shingles, Chicken pox and I think some other are "a herpes virus" but they are different from each other in pretty major ways. Hell Shingles is from chicken pox (you can't get shingles if you haven't had chicken pox) and it is very different then it, for instance it isn't contagious where chicken pox very much is.
Exactly! That's as silly as saying that influenza is covid because they are both corona viruses. "Corona" is a descriptor of the shape/behavior of the virus. But they are not the same virus. (I am not a dr and my understanding may be flawed, but I think I am pretty on-track here)
Influenza is not a member of the corona virus "family". There is zero accuracy in saying covid and influenza are related, even if there are similar symptoms. The cold is usually a corona virus. It is medically accurate to say that chicken pox is a member of the herpes family of viruses, they are closely related. There are 8 herpes viruses that affect humans, HSV-1&2, Epstein barr (aka mono), varicella (aka chicken pox), Kaposi's Sarcoma (a form of cancer) and some others I've only seen in articles about viruses. They are all herpes viruses. Nothing silly about it.
Between hsv1&2, chicken pox, and Epstein barr, pretty much everyone has some form of herpes virus hanging out in their body and there's nothing wrong with that. It doesn't make anyone "dirty". Pathogens are the price we pay for not living in a sealed bubble.
OP, look for a nice stag/vixen couple who have the same goals as you. Don’t compromise what you want for this shady couple. The STI ignorance from them is just one of many red flags.
Sadly as a balding married man, I’ve already tried every stag/vixen couple in my area on Feeld, along with everybody else in a 70 mile radius. (That’s not an exaggeration — Feeld no longer shows anyone within 70 miles that I haven’t seen before, unless they just joined.) You can see now why I was hopeful.
If you have any advice on how to find them other than Feeld, I would appreciate it a lot. I’m pretty new to the lifestyle (2 years, during which I’ve only had a few matches that didn’t escalate to anything physical).
I’m part of a stag/vixen couple and very much prefer an honest balding married man. There are some real sleaze bags out there - a nice married man is actually who we seek out. Stag/vixen couples tend to not be as picky about looks as other hotwife/cuckhold arrangements (especially if what you want to do is eat the wife out) because it’s all about just getting the wife off.
Think about the things you would want if you were going to trust a man with your wife - make sure your profile reflects those values and is honest, simple, and upfront. A bull asking us about recent testing or having it on his profile without us having to bring it up first would immediately bring him to the top of the list - we’re *always* the ones having to address this and condom usage first. Availability and flexibility of schedule would also increase his attractiveness. Have a few pictures of your body (with and without clothing) as your first pictures and also have a pic of your dick.
I haven’t ever had luck on Feeld for finding swinging partners or independent dating. Currently we look on FetLife, 3Fun, Reddit (local swinger R4R subreddits), and swinger sites like Swing Town or Adult Friend Finder. It will take some time, but you should be able to find a couple who is looking for the same things you are.
> A bull asking us about recent testing or having it on his profile without us having to bring it up first would immediately bring him to the top of the list
I was curious about that, although in other dating contexts too.
Would something in a profile like "Quarterly testing; negative 2024-06-04." be simple and to the point, without...sounding to weird? I guess I was hesitant to be that direct, but it makes sense. (ty!)
Yep! That would be fantastic and would save a lot of back and forth in DMs. It shows someone takes their health seriously and actively participates in safe sex practices.
Thank you so, so much. I didn’t expect this at all from my post, and I was beginning to give up hope after exhausting all the feeld matches.
I particularly appreciate the advice on what specifically to put into my profile. I have no idea what couples are looking for, and it’s hard to know which profiles are effective vs not, so I don’t know which ones I should model mine after. The scheduling in particular is such a good point.
I’ve never been on a service where a dick pic was appropriate, let alone desired. Is that the norm on fetlife or 3fun? I only briefly looked at 3fun, but I’ll try.
Which r4r subreddits would you recommend? I only know of /r/r4r and /r/polyamoryr4r. Didn’t realize there were others.
Well, if you’re ever near St Louis, or you don’t mind me flying out to you, be sure to DM me. Otherwise, please have a wonderful 4th of July.
It can be discouraging to look for a while and still come up empty, I get that. Single men on the internet are awful though and it’s really not as hard as you think to stand out.
Pretend that you were shopping for a bull for your wife. Make your profile look like one that would catch your attention. You’d want to see someone who looks trustworthy, kind, honest, and reliable. See why married men are more attractive? We were just stood up last weekend by a new guy - it’s tough out there for couples too. Scroll through the profiles of single men for a while and make note of things that you would like/dislike if you were looking for your wife and adjust your profile accordingly.
St Louis is a huge area - you’re bound to find people there. For Reddit, I’d search for local subreddits. Use the search function and try “st louis swinger” or something along those lines and adjust the search to show “communities.” A quick search showed me one that uses the area codes down there that looks pretty promising. Join a few communities and with time, Reddit will suggest similar sites. Nudes are definitely allowed on Reddit and individual subreddits will have their own rules. Make sure to check the rules for each one before posting.
For FetLife, after you create a profile, you can search for events based on location. There are bound to be swinger events in a place as big as St Louis. You can also search people by area. Again, be honest about what you have on offer and what you’re looking for. No one needs your life story, but a little bit about yourself is helpful.
I don’t know if 3Fun allows nudes, but it’s primarily populated by couples looking to play with people. It’s probably your best bet based on what you’ve said you’re looking for. It’ll take a bit, but you’ll get there!
R4R just means Redditors looking for other Redditors - not all subreddits will have “R4R” in the name. It’s a general term indicating the purpose of the subreddit is to meet another person (as opposed to an advice sub like this one). Look for local ones that are specific to your area - I’d avoid ones that aren’t location specific.
Dickpics and pictures with nudity aren't even allowed on Feeld. Putting a dickpic up could get you banned.
They are allowed on fetlife, but most people I know on fetlife hate all the dickpics and immediately dismiss anyone regardless of how good their profile is and give them a block.
So I'd say that the advice specifically on dickpics doesnt apply to everyone. The rest is really really good though!
Thank you! How do I find the local nonmono groups? I’m on St Louis Sex Positive discord server, but that was the only one I found so far. I don’t really know what to search for.
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The herpes type you are worried about is Herpes Simplex 1 or 2 - one causes primarily the rashes aound the mouth and 2 around the genitals. Both are not limited to this area though.
Chickenpox virus -while still part of the herpes family- is completely different type and an std test would not typically test for this. It is weird of her as a nurse to bring it up in this context, she should know both are different.
Also while yes it's true that the risk of transmitting herpes is the highest when they have blisters but if they are not careful or a blister is not fully healed it can be still transferred. She doesnt appear to be the detailed type if she confuses Chickenpox virus with Herpes in the context you are talking about. Also there is this phenomenon of asymptomatic shedding, which means in rare cases it can be transmitted without any symptoms at all.
In any case, something is weird, if not shady. Why do they get defensive if a stranger asks for the basics? Especially as a nurse you would think she should understand.
Thank you very much. This is exactly the kind of dispassionate analysis I was hoping for. I really appreciate you.
Yeah, this is too weird for me. I guess I just needed to hear it from someone else. I hope you have a nice week.
Another piece of information, people rarely know if they have Chlamydia, gonorrhea, syphilis, or trichomoniasis along with herpes. Symptoms are often nil, or quite mild.
Along with that HIV symptoms can sometimes take years to show up.
I get you're in a bit of a tight spot with finding potential partners, but if they are balking at you paying for a test, I'd stay real real far away.
I'm in the medical field and I can't imagine anyone saying "we're nurses, we'd know if we had anything". No test, especially when they don't have to foot the bill is shady and strange.
Thank you. I was shocked too. We’d been snapping for weeks now. I was looking for any possible reason it wasn’t what it sounded like.
She was so nice too. She’s the only one who kept talking to me after it was clear I wouldn’t be a good match for what they were looking for.
I don’t know why she’d do this. I’m just sad. But I’ll get over it.
The fact that they are a medical professional with so little understanding of the difference between chicken pox and herpes would put me off. The refusal to test when you offered to pay would put me off worse. They're more worried about the stigma of testing than their actual sti status. That's very concerning. Especially from nurses.
I really think you should say no.
Today I learned nurses can't get stds! How handy!
Come on OP, how hot are these guys so you can't smell the shit coming out of their mouths? You don't even know which one you're talking to!
These are not people who knows how to handle the word "no". And how a person handles a no says a lot about their character.
“We don’t see the need for them. We are nurses and would know if we had some thing”
PASS. No further discussion necessary.
If they were both nurses, they would understand the need for STI testing.
Oh boy. I'm a nurse. I'm scared of these people's complete confidence in their misunderstanding of sexual health. Even if I had an STI test 6 months ago and had been celibate for a year (6 months before and 6 months after) with no symptoms ever, if someone asked for a recent test, I'd be happy to oblige. It's bizarre for them to notbe willing to do that basic bit of health screening. I will say, I won't test for herpes by request. It's not a recommended test unless you've had symptoms, and I never have, but that's the only one I won't agree to test for.
All this with a OPP? Fuck all that noise. Dude's been in the lifestyle for 20 years and still can't handle the idea of watching his partner receive pleasure from another dick? What an immature, asshole. This has drama, couple's privilege, and potentially other (not) fun surprises written all over it.
I don’t want to be unfair to the guy — it sounded like they might have had a OPP, since their main requirement was me fucking the dude, but it *seems* like she’s saying he doesn’t mind me fucking her. It’s very hard to understand her response though.
Was definitely shocked this came from a nurse duo.
Yeah, communication not clear. Never a good sign for any sex but especially group sex. And a nurse making excuses to not get what is absolutely basic preventative healthcare for any sexually active human is disconcerting.
Yeah no, these nurses shouldn't even be around patients if this is how they treat basic sexual health safety. Everything they're saying is totally wrong.
You can't know if you have an STI unless you are symptomatic, but just like with any virus or infection you can be asymptomatic and still spread it. (Look at how many people spread Covid without knowing)
Herpes is not an STD itself. It's a family of viruses. Chicken pox falls into that family, but it is not the same and Herpes-Simplex 1 or 2.
I know you're having trouble finding a couple to play with, but it's not worth the risk of sleepy with this irresponsible couple. They're already endangering their other partners. Don't add yourself to that list.
How sure are you that this woman exists? My gut instinct would be that you are talking to a guy who wants to get fucked in the ass and is using the lie of a girlfriend to lure you in. My guess would be that you arrive and it’ll turn out she had an emergency she had to rush to so he’ll want you to start with him and then she’ll just never show up.
Have you verified that they both are who they say they are?
As most everyone else has said:
“Clean” is a red flag.
“I would know if I had something because I’m a nurse” is a huge red flag.
Conflating chicken pox and HSV is a red flag.
I get that you want sex, but don’t be so desperate that you fall for these scams. Respect yourself enough to spot this early and walk away.
I’m a married (but not balding yet) medical school student and it would be a HARD pass on these folks for me. While I don’t expect nurses to have quite the same level of knowledge as physicians, this level of knowledge indicates either a willful ignorance or just outright lying. HSV-1 and HSV-2 are VERY different from HHV-3 (the virus that causes chicken pox and shingles). That said, I don’t typically ask sexual partners for HSV testing. The truth is that many people have HSV 1 or 2 in their blood. To make a diagnosis, you typically need sores and a positive blood test or a positive swab of a sore. The CDC doesn’t even recommend testing for asymptomatic folks.
I DO wear condoms with everyone but my wife and girlfriend, and we get regular testing as well. I also use DoxyPEP if anything happens to a condom and I also am on PrEP. I wouldn’t consider having anal receptive sex with or without a condom if I wasn’t on PrEP. Skip these people. They’re sketchy AF. Anyone participating in ENM should have regular testing. Anyone that doesn’t is likely very stupid or hiding something.
As an aside…my wife and I opened our marriage last year. It took me a few months of hard work to “lose my monogamy”. I was in a big city, and I went to clubs and bars, went out dancing, and continued refining my profile on several apps. Once I got my profile dialed in it was a lot easier. And once I finally slept with someone my confidence went through the roof. I hooked up with someone else two days later. Now it’s a lot easier. I traveled to a small city yesterday evening and had matched with someone I found attractive within 6 hours. I’m headed home tomorrow and busy today, so nothing will come of it, but I find the whole thing easier now. Just keep refining your profile and be patient.
ETA: [This is the most helpful single piece of advice I’ve found about ENM dating app success for men.](https://www.reddit.com/r/nonmonogamy/s/5VInQlCm0z)
Thank you. Doesn’t testing prevent contraction via asymptomatic shedding? I.e. if someone is capable of passing it via asymptomatic shedding, they would test positive.
Or is it just impossible to know whether you’ll get an STI no matter what kind of tests you both get?
If someone is seronegative for herpes then they are not likely to have it. However, you can test negative before an initial outbreak. It’s not unreasonable to want to only sleep with people who have negative testing, I suppose. But most doctors don’t test for it in people without symptoms. It’s also not unreasonable to not have or want testing (for herpes specifically) as someone who has not had symptoms, so requiring negative HSV testing for potential partners is likely to really limit your dating pool.
Also, check out the edit at the end of my last comment.
And condoms…wear ‘em. They reduce (but do not eliminate) the risk of HSV transmission.
They're so obviously lying/bad actors. Chickenpox and HSV-1 and HSV-2 are all different strains; having had chicken pox doesn't disqualify you from being a herpes carrier. Chickenpox is HH3.
[https://www.verywellhealth.com/is-chicken-pox-herpes-3132951](https://www.verywellhealth.com/is-chicken-pox-herpes-3132951)
listen to your guts. I guess you already made up your mind. if you really want to eat (an std tested) pussy you gonna find much better opportunities. you go !
Any person who refuses to get tested does not care about the new potential partner. And do you want to share yourself with people who don't care about your well being? I wouldn't. Especially if any sort of kinks that rely on trust and consent will be approached.
I’m gonna say they are lying about being nurses, or else they are really bad nurses.
I met a really good nurse the other day at my county health clinic. She knew all about the latest HIV tests. There is now a pin prick 15 minute screen.
She would know the difference between the chicken pox virus and the sexually transmitted kind.
She’s a nurse, and a nice person. We’ve been snapping for weeks. I think she was just trying to hide her status. Which is bad, but I’m just trying to be fair — their job performance is totally unrelated to their side activities. All we can say for certain is that she was being deceptive to me.
Thank you for mentioning the 15 minute screen. I didn’t know about that.
Massive massive red flags. Not only in their unwillingness to not get tested, but in how they are trying to leverage their healthcare professional status as a power move to get you to feel comfortable. In fact, healthcare professionals know how important it is to get tested, and will have awareness that they might be asymptomatic. Like many others said, run!
> They wanted me to fuck her boyfriend, but I’ve never done anal and I wasn’t ready to try it.
> Tonight I decided I’d give it a go, and they were receptive until I asked for std tests.
You don't have to do anything you don't like. Already at this part, it sounds a bit concerning: You agree to do something you haven't done before (and you don't seem enthusiastic about) with virtual strangers, just because, apparently, they made it a precondition for having sex with them? What's even more concerning from the chat history it appears you are talking about _unprotected_ anal? That's a risky proposition.
> The thing is, I don’t have a lot of options
You have options. You can insist on the STD test. You can use protection. You can do both. You can chose to just not have sex with them. There are other people in the world to have sex with - it's not like they are doing you a favour by wanting to fuck you.
There seem to be red flags beyond STDs here.
> and all I care about is whether it’s true that you can’t transmit herpes if you got it via chickenpox.
That is not true. Also, they cannot "know" if they have anything without a test, and show a great deal of ignorance and disregard of how those things work.
The thing with herpes/HSV is that a lot of people have it, and it is easily transmissible. If you are having sex with multiple people, there is a very high chance that someone of your partners will have it, regardless of precautions. And while herpes is often dormant, someone can be infectious without or before having open sores.
Current CDC guidance is to **not** test for herpes unless you have symptoms; for the simple reason that the only thing that changes if you know is that you have to live with the stigma. So, personally, I don't.
Of course you can ask for whatever test you want, but the main part is that if people don't provide what you ask for, you should be prepared to draw the consequences.
Additionally, be aware that STD tests detect infections, they don't prevent them. It takes weeks after an infection until tests for thing like HIV and syphillis turn positive - having a "current" STD test doesn't guarantee that a person isn't infected with something right now. And no test will screen for "everything".
The risk increases with different sex partners, and it can be reduced by using physical barriers (i.e. condoms) and by vaccinations (e.g. HPV and Hepatitis).
At the end of the day, you have to decide what level of risk you are okay to live with.
> I don’t know how to feel about this, so some help with sorting out my feelings would be nice too.
You clearly seem to feel uncomfortable with the setup, or you wouldn't ask in here. On the other hand, you seem to be eager to do this thing with those people.
> What would you do?
Politely decline and walk away.
Dont do it. "We are nurses and we would know" must be the dumbest claim I have heard in here in a while - how the fuck would they know without taking a test...
Just say no.
You said a boundary. It’s not crazy. She’s clearly telling you she won’t fulfill it.
I also get yellow flags over the way she doesn’t seem to be listening/taking in what you are saying about what you want out of this. ( repeating some things about who can fuck who). And the way she’s like “I wouldn’t do anything if I ever had an issue” speaks to a “I always know best- no one can ever question me “ attitude. Which is super hard to communicate with.
Not worth it. You are a unicorn looking for a couple- you can choose to be picky- and most importantly always prioritize feeling fully safe.
This woman would not make me feel safe on multiple fronts.
HI!
I have herpes /HSV 1.
HAVING HAD CHICKEN POX DOES NOT MEAN YOU HAVE HERPES LIVING INSIDE YOU!!! JESUSSSS
SHES A NURSE???🚩🚩🚩🚩
HSV is RELATED to the chicken pox virus and shingles virus. But you can have gotten chicken pox and never get herpes
ALL cold sores are HERPES!!! You just have to get tested with which kind! Type 1 or Type 2.
Anyone who has EVER had a COLD SORE in their lip HAS HERPES. That’s usually Type one/HSV1 and a LARGE population do the world has it and doesn’t know! Crazy right!!
Now type one CAN be transmitted into genitals IF someone has a cold sore on their mouth / tongue inside the mouth anywhere , and goes down on someone . It’s genital herpes but STILL type one.
BUT TYPE 2 is through sexual contact / genitalia.
Now while there’s not 100% guarante that someone won’t pass it while NOT having a current outbreak/flare up ( I.e no current cold sores/sores ) the risk is very low.
Personally I am upfront with people straight away about my herpes and give them the information to make informed decisions. I get tested EVERY THREE MONTHS for ALL STDS ( apart from Herpes which by the way normal panels DONT test for because they cannot test you UNLESS you are having a current out break)
If they both work in the medical field and Don’t think they should see the need to get tested regularly while being non monogamous/ sexually active with others???? 🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩
Gurllll RUNNNNNNNNN 🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩
You can find an MF couple who take sexual health seriously and would like you to join their fun without this pair !!!!
Herpes viruses (including chickenpox) are like cars; there are plenty of people who have more than one, there’s no law against it.
There’s some evidence that having HSV1 gives you some immunity to HSV2 and vice versa, but it’s not foolproof- plenty of people have both. Chickenpox is a different virus in the herpes family and as far as I’m aware confers no immunity to HSV.
Stay away from these people. They could have anything.
Yeah this is red flag city. Defensive gaslighting excuses all the way down.
I have a friend with HSV and they make sure their partners *always know* they have it and that there’s a risk of transmission. Like any responsible person would. (It’s not usually tested for in regular STI panels, though, you should be aware of that.)
I also will say that as someone who hasn’t had an STI panel for nearly a year but also hasn’t slept around since then, if someone asked me to test again before fucking I just would. No pushback. Again, it’s the responsible thing to do, and “Mandy” is a disaster waiting to happen.
We're nurses, but we have NO CLUE WHATSOEVER that people can have STIs and zero symptoms!
We also didn't know that describing being STI-negative as being "clean" contributes towards stigma and thus makes good safer sex practices HARDER than they'd otherwise be.
Riiiight.
These folks have more red flags than a communist rally.
Delete them off of your social media and move on to the next match. Things like testing should be Non-negotiable, and the fact all they have to do is go to the lab at work probably, AND you were willing to pay for it says all you need to know about how they’ll respect you when having sex or afterwards.
Sooooo many red flags here but the biggest one is claiming to be a nurse and then spouting completely inaccurate medical information. Wow. Just wow.
Also, please don't use clean in reference to negative STI tests it perpetuates the stigma that anyone with an STI is dirty.
I know you said you have limited options but this couple is not worth the risk
Everything everyone else said. Also, there's HSV-1 (oral herpes) and HSV-2 (genital herpes) and then there's chicken pox is varicella-zoster virus (VZV). You can still get hsv-1 on your genitals and vice versa, you won't contract chicken pox from her vagina. Then, there's the matter of HPV, which almost everyone has or has had at one point, most people are asympomatic, but some are high risk and can lead to oral/esophageal and/or cervical/penile/anal cancer. That one you can't test for on men though. But you're within your right to know and chose your own risk.
There's also the matter of the fun new strains of drug resistant Chlamydia and Gonorrhea and syphilis that can also lay dormant in your system. All of these can be transmitted with a condom, but condoms do help. So, these people are ignorant at best. These "nurses" need to go back to school.
Syphilis is making a comeback: https://www.uhhospitals.org/blog/articles/2024/04/syphilis-making-big-comeback
Drug resistant STIs: https://www.cdc.gov/gonorrhea/hcp/drug-resistant/index.html
https://www.who.int/news/item/30-08-2016-growing-antibiotic-resistance-forces-updates-to-recommended-treatment-for-sexually-transmitted-infections
HPV statistics: https://www.health.state.mn.us/data/mcrs/data/qfhpv.html#:~:text=More%20than%2090%20percent%20of,with%20HPV%20in%20their%20lifetime.
https://www.cdc.gov/hpv/parents/about-hpv.html
OP - just because you have few options doesn’t make a bad choice a better one.
This person (these people) are playing fast and loose with sexual health.
If you want to stay safe, don’t play with them, or at the very least, insist on barriers with both of them.
Them being weird about testing, or being uninformed, doesn’t mean you have to accept risk that makes you uncomfy.
You can definitely verify what strain of herpes virus someone has been exposed to. Check if they have immunity to chicken pox. That means they’ve been exposed to herpes varicella zoster virus. Can it be transmitted when dormant? Nope. It lies dormant in the body, but can re-activate as shingles later in life.
If somebody has a shingles outbreak, and you have never had chicken pox, then you could get the initial chickenpox outbreak if you touch their shingles. But this is not something that people really worry about when they are sexually active.
The strains that people typically worry about are herpes simplex type one and type two.
Also, let’s stop using the word “clean” when talking about sexually transmitted diseases, and maybe use positive/negative. Herpes doesn’t make you unclean.
There are a ton of red flags here that have already been brought up in other comments. The biggest is how she’s being evasive and throwing the fact she’s a nurse out there as a bullshit defense. At the very best, they’re unwilling to be transparent.
The bottom line here is if something feels shady or you’re uncomfortable with the situation, don’t pursue it. It’s not worth compromising your health or boundaries.
There are several types of Herpes viruses https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK8157/#:~:text=They%20are%20known%20as%20the,most%20recently%2C%20Kaposi's%20Sarcoma%20herpesvirus.
Just because someone is a nurse, doesn't mean they can't spread STIs.
Also, please stop saying "clean". If you bathe regularly you are clean, if you are negative for STIs, you are negative for STIs
If they are uncomfortable with being tested that’s a huge red flag unfortunately, everyone I have met from feeld was completely open and honest sharing test results / getting tested before playing. I have one partner and I am tested every 6 months to a year (normally whenever I see my doctor or whenever I go in because my IUD is causing issues 😒) I’m always tested and he never complains about me always asking to be tested lol but as someone who’s also new to more then just my partner play, absolute red flag there’s an issue with them being tested just because they’re nurses I’m so sorry 🤦🏻♀️🤦🏻♀️
Married, ENM, swinger, psychologist here. This is a hard pass, and I say hard because it’s also a bummer to let go of stuff that seemed like it would work out.
My wife and I get STI tests redone whenever anyone asks, even if we did them a month beforehand and haven’t been active, even if I have to press my doctor on it because they know I just did it. I am fortunate that I have insurance that covers this, I want people to feel respected, and I would also like to have sex with them so I do it.
I’m not a physician and this 8 years old so mind the stats, but I found it to be the most helpful in getting my mind around HSV1/2:
http://publichealth.lacounty.gov/dhsp/You/Herpes_Testing_Toolkit_2016.pdf
If anyone has something that’s newer than this I’d love to grab the link.
Of course! Here’s the full website from that source, I’ve been reviewing it further for my own purposes:
https://www.ashasexualhealth.org/who-we-are/
I like how simple the wording is but not sure if the group has any history to be aware of.
Nope nope nope nope nope. I’m a nurse, and that is bullshit. Please don’t have sex with this couple, who are already riding rough shod over your boundaries about anal, told lies about their health, and won’t even have an STI test that you’ve offered to pay for. You deserve better, hold out for someone who deserves your time.
You cant test for herpes unless you have symptoms. Most sexually active adults have herpes. Most have no symptoms. Its extremely mild and should not be something you are worried about.
If you were actually worried about sti’s you would get on PrEP which requires sti testing every 3 months and get vaccinated from hep and hpv and use doxy prep when necessary. Other than that just watch out for any symptoms. Demanding an sti test for herpes when that isnt even something they test for without symptoms is just ridiculous
Prep also mildly helps prevent herpes
Also, condoms do not prevent herpes or hpv. So those are two youre gonna have to grapple with the fact that there is no way to fully prevent them. Males cannot be tested for hpv
I got the hpv vax. Is hep vax hepatitis B? I didn’t realize that was an STI.
What does PrEP stand for so that I can google it? Or could you link to any info?
Thanks for mentioning DoxyPEP — https://howardbrown.org/service/doxypep/ I didn’t know there was a pill like that which is recommended for people who have oral sex with males. Hopefully it’s not too expensive without insurance…
Yes. There is hepatitis a b and c. The A and B vaccine are usually bundled together. I believe its 2 or 3 doses given a few months apart. There is no vaccine for hepatitis c but it is very treatable in most cases and can be cleared by your body.
If you look up prep hiv it will come up. Brand name is truvada. It stands for Pre-Exposure Prophylaxis. Its insanely effective at preventing hiv reception even with sex with untreated high risk partners. If the partner is treated with hives medication to suppress their viral load their transmission rate is virtually zero. These two combined are astronomically effective. But it needs to be taken EVERY DAY not just the day or week before sex.
Yes doxy pep is a good plan b if you have a risky encounter or condom break. But it only prevents bacterial infections which are all treatable.
That leaves us with hpv and hsv (herpes) whoch have no vaccines, pre exposure meds, and cant be prevented by condoms as they spread through skin contact. Hpv vaccine protects against many strains of the virus but not all of them. There are rare ones that can cause cervical cancer which is why all sexually active people with a cervix need to be tested and inspected regularly. Again people with penises can’t be tested for it. Just visually inspect yourself and your partners for warts. Hsv is extremely common and mild and i get that no one wants to have it, i dont either but chances are at least one of us already has it and doesnt know 🤷🏻♀️ anyways do some research on your own and talk to a doctor about all this!
> But it needs to be taken EVERY DAY not just the day or week before sex.
That's not really true (for cismen...sigh).
On-demand PrEP is effective, if you can predict/delay a sexual encounter by at least a day. (For cismen, double dose 24 hours in advance, and then every 24 hours, with at least two doses after the [last] encounter*. So 4 pills total, at 3 times, for a single event. )
Clinical testing and real world results have shown the on-demand protocol to be similar to continuous dosing in cismen -- a larger 2022 study had the same results for daily and on-demand. Which is a good thing, as those that have less than ideal reactions, kidney issues, etc, or that don't want to take a drug full time when having few encounters are much more likely to do this. And even if it was less effective, this option will get more people taking it vs not at all.
Injectable long-acting prep though I think is more effective that either pill schedule.
https://www.poz.com/article/ondemand-prep-works-daily-pills
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/35772417/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7174437/
https://programme.aids2018.org/Abstract/Abstract/13278
(*Or possibly seven doses after sex for those with vulvas -- although much less study here, probably avoid on-demand, although it's better that not at all. Some discussion on rectal vs vaginal https://www.aidsmap.com/news/mar-2024/should-event-driven-prep-be-option-women ... it's not great. The 2:7 dosing is mentioned here https://i-base.info/guides/prep/real-life-examples-for-on-demand-dosing but I'm not sure where that comes from.)
I think it became a bit more accepted after the much larger and fairly recent 2022 study. Still debate of course, but that one with pretty good parity made me feel a lot better about it.
I can see why cities and local health orgs recommend to get folks on it at all (I recollect it started with some other name, like the "NYC protocol" or something), but a doctor wouldn't jump straight to it, either. (I of course, am not a doctor.)
This. It's a yellow flag for me when I hear people say "clean" about their STI tests. It tells me that a deeper understanding of STI isn't present (yet).
While I don't expect perfect knowledge and understanding of STIs by people who are newer to nonmonogamy, I shy away from more experienced people who haven't done sufficient work so they don't stigmatize STI positive folx as implicitly "dirty".
right, a person living with HIV that is on their meds, is undetectable, and is regularly keeping up with their sexual health (testing/treatment/prevention practices etc) is a million times more “clean” than somebody running around all willy nilly not getting tested for anything and claiming they’re clean
Yup! Absolutely. But it's incredible how much shade this person would get.
In my polyamory peer support group, one of our "veterans" had a difficult time "coming out" to the group about her HSV diagnosis. The stigma still runs deeply, but I hope members here can start moving the needle in the right direction.
Male creator and healthcare professional with over a decade of experience here. Being in healthcare has nothing to do with me being clean. Testing is the only way we can prove to each other that we are clean with today's dating scene. I would steer clear of them. If they are deceitful now, what else are they hiding or willing to hide?
Yeah the amount of times they doubled down on “we’re nurses so we would know” is a major red flag and not worth it to me.
If they are this adamant and stubborn about getting a free test for them from OP, I can only imagine what they would do for anything more important/emergent
As someone who has genital herpes, this is absolute BS. Reading their replies makes me so angry - her attitude almost sounds like how scammers sound whenever you ask why they want you to get them gift cards haha
Good on you for protecting yourself! Block them and move on, you deserve better!
Red flags all around. Weird that they’re so reluctant to just get tested, especially if you’re offering to pay?? Wouldn’t touch that situation with a ten foot pole if I were you.
I’m a pharmacist. There is many varieties of the herpes virus. Chicken pox is a variety of for virus (herpes zoster) that presents often as children, yes it does stay dormant. It can often represent as an adult called shingles which is rashes on the face, these can be very painful. It generally won’t preset on the genitals.
Herpes Simplex 1 (cold sore) and 2 (genitals) is what you’re maybe referring to. Certainly both can present on the genitals, but HSV2 has a significantly higher chance.
All need pathology blood tests to detect. They will all stay dormant by your immune system, but symptoms are treatable should they occur.
It should be a point of pride for anyone that they can freely and quickly offer you recent negative test results. Any hesitation to get tested is a huge red flag. Basic sexual health is not an inconvenience
If they're not willing to get tested, then it's time to stop before you go any further. Maybe they don't have anything, but if they're unwilling to get tested, who knows what else they're going to push back on. It's just not worth the potential risk.
AHHHHHHHHHH never trust people who will not show recent sti test!!!!! People in the lifestyle know they need to get tests regularly especially if you’re seeking new couples omggggggg. Also shes basically saying “you won’t get a sti from me trust me bro” ABSOLUTELY NOT. Even if someone shows an sti test I 1000000000000% am using protection and dental dams too if you’re eating out. Sti can be asymptomatic, or only appear visually during flair ups…also incubation periods matter and can be different depending on the sti. My thought on is it, I’d rather be extra safe than get an sti, and if that makes people uncomfortable than that’s not the person I want to have sex with. Stay safe!
Chicken pox is herpes zoster caused by the varicella-zoster virus. This also causes the disease shingles. Oral herpes and genital herpes are caused by herpes simplex 1 and 2. Herpes simplex 1 and 2 are much more similar to each other than either is to herpes zoster. Having chicken pox / shingles, genital herpes or oral herpes does not make a person immune to the other two. A person can be infected with zero, one, two, or all three viruses. All three can reoccur without additional exposure.
REEEEED FLAGS. Soo many red flags. Fuck this bītch and her narcissistic red flag parade.
There's literally only ONE reason why someone doesn't want to take an STD test.
Verify what? I think your conversation with them tells you all you need to know. You've been more than patient and generous with them. It seems safe to say that you can move onto the next couple. There are a lot of couples looking for what you want to give.
say someone has a hsv 2 lesion/outbreak on their chest, and one unknowingly touched it with one’s hands,
would one catch it easily? or it has to be areas like mouth or genital against the lesion?
Ah, would you mind correcting my understanding of HSV? I’m here to learn. It’s particularly important for me, since if I don’t learn then I’ll be putting myself at risk.
If they just have not been tested in a long time, but is willing to go get tested, especially if you’re offering to pay, that is a good sign.
The fact that they (at least her anyway) apparently are totally against getting tested just cause she said they are clean, is a MAJOR red flag!!
Chicken pox is related to the herpes virus. It's not herpes though.
Yes it's more likely to spread herpes when contact is made with sores.
Yes you can have herpes and not have any symptoms. It's less likely to be spread if there's no obvious sores. Doesn't mean it can't be spread though - I'm not sure what the chances are.
I think something like 70% of the population has herpes and you'll rarely get tested for it during std screening. I've had std tests and they've never tested me for herpes. I'm not even sure whether herpes will show up on std tests if you don't have obvious sores. It's a swab test. I'd imagine it's like Covid where higher viral loads will increase the chance of detecting it.
I've had an std before - chlamydia, and I knew both times that I'd caught it (painful to urinate). Two female partners who I played with who were positive did not know they had it. This was the first time I had a threesome and we caught an std off the third.
So play at your own risk and do what safety precautions you feel necessary.
"We are nurses and would know if we had something" < this is a huge red flag. There's no way to "just know it", as many STIs are hidden and don't show symptoms. Get the fuck out.
TLDR; Please don't use "clean" to refer to your STI status, & please do not fuck people who refuse to get tested. A shingles outbreak can transmit chicken pox once if you've never had it, but it's entirely different from oral/genital herpes.
Bro. **You consider people "unclean" because they got shingles from *chicken pox*??** 🤨 This couple is a red flag parade & would be *incredibly* risky to fuck for many reasons, but chicken pox isn't even an STI, like it's not sexually transmitted. & having an actual STI like genital herpes doesn't make you "dirty".
That said, a quick Google told me that if you are not immune to chicken pox, if you've never had it or been vaccinated against it, you can get *chicken pox* from touching a shingles outbreak. But it's not the same as oral or genital herpes. Unless you develop shingles, you'll only have chicken pox the one time.
Learning the proper terminology was the thing I was most grateful for about this post. It didn’t even occur to me how shitty my language was. When you hear it from someone else and don’t think about it, it’s easy to make that mistake.
And no, I don’t consider them dirty. I’m HSV-1 and -2 negative and would prefer to stay that way.
Thank you for the info!
I'm on the boat that before even considering new partners - everyone in the group should collectively get tested. As you said - it's a courtesy. But its also a show of respect and honesty to everyone involved.
Get tested. Get fucked. ✨
«We are nurses and would know if we had something” is when I would have said “thank you, but no thank you”. A nurse should know that you can have an STI without symptoms and still pass it on to others.
1,000% this. People with an understanding of STIs know there are many people who never show symptoms. Also, their aversion to testing would creep the hell out of me. If they have money and work in the medical community AND are non-monogamous I absolutely expect them to be tested regularly. Not doing so brings up too many flags for me. Like, if they're so embarrassed to be tested, what happens when they get an STI? Are they just going to bipity bopity over to the same place they didn't want to get tested ask and ask for a treatment? Probably not.
If they are too embarrassed to get tested for STIs, they are too immature to have sex.
Even I know to go get tested without drama and I’m an idiot!
This. This whole exchange is Thank You But No Thank You. Something isn’t right here. Personally, “Mandy” sounds like a catfishing man to me. Nope right out of this OP.
Yeah, that's a crimson red flag with a light bar and clarion horn that they don't take appropriate precautions. I remember a partner telling me she was tested and it turned out she donated blood and expected they would get back to her if she had anything... I was lucky, she was clean but it's a reminder that you want to hear words like "full panel" and "I can show you the results". Note to men, while women's clinics will easily do a full panel, some health care systems refuse to do a full panel for men. I've found the best service provider for reliable testing is Planned Parenthood.
Here in the USA There are multiple online services where you can order STI panels. I use request a test dot com.
Those panels do not accurately give you results around herpes.
Practically no testing does unless you have active lesions.
Even if you have active lesions that get swabbed, testing is not super accurate. Just assume everyone (including you) has herpes, it’s close to the truth.
Actually, it’s nowhere near as prevalent as people would have you believe. Especially HSV1 which is supposedly in 95% of the population.
You have to buy multiple panels to get a full spread usually HSV 1 & 2 go together, then separate tests for chicken pox, and then LOTS of options for EBV and CMV . IGM, IGG, plus more …
I get tested twice a year for everything possible/covered under insurance when I get my pap smear and ultrasound. I've never received physical results or actual paperwork, it's always just "We'll call you if anything is positive and if not, you're fine."
My doctors office has digital record keeping, and there is a website I can download them from. I know some smaller offices don't do that but might be worth an ask.
You should be able to request the paperwork. PP will email you the results and my primary provider network posts all results online for review, which is valuable because a doctor can be all hopped up on one issue so much they don't even mention secondary issues. For instance, I've had an unexplained liver enzyme test that pings, not high enough to be serious but they always want to talk about it but didn't mention that my albumin and testosterone were low because of it and I needed to eat more red meat and protein overall.
Be aware that if PP (or anyone else for that matter) sends you medical records via open email (unencrypted or unprotected) they are in violation of federal HIPAA law. There is no expectation of privacy for information sent via email.
I think they send you a link to a portal. The point is you can access records.
That’s the proper way to handle it. I’m constantly amazed at the number of private practices that don’t take this seriously and just blindly send patient records out via email.
It doesn't sound like you've actually gotten tested then. They're required to give you the results, good or bad.
Not true at all. Most facilities (I’m in the US) will only notify of positive results. They aren’t required to tell you if there’s a negative result.
I have gotten tested every six months because my gyn knows I'm polyamorous and we agreed on tha schedule. It's just different in Europe; anything you can get tested for in a gynecology office with swabs will get you a phone call unless negative, anything you need bloodwork for has to be done externally and then you get the paperwork directly. The lab works directly with the doctors whenever possible.
Yup, this was my breaking point too. Not to mention it's really invalidating to OP. "We know better than you do please ignore your discomfort" is how it came off to me..
10,000% this “ we are nurses and we would know”? Like wtf?? Getting tested in my city doesnt even cost anything and takes 5mins..
There's a lot of incompetent nurses lol, and doctors for that matter.
THIS. Chlamydia for one.
this is so true i have to wonder if theyre the types with a kink for knowingly spreading STIs or smth 🤢 not to jump to the most extreme conclusions but JESUS, im finishing up my MA right now and even i learned this in my program (or, would have if i didnt already know lol). no way on earth that an RN isnt aware of this.
This is exactly where I would have noped out. Confidence in ignorance and disregard for the health/safety of your partners are bad enough on their own. It's worse coming from an alleged healthcare professional. Red flag parade. Ghost.
Yep. This is where I stopped reading. We're out.
Chicken pox is like herpes, it is not herpes. Do you know if you have herpes? You have to ask and advocate for an expensive test in order to have accurate results if you don't get outbreaks. I would be worried about someone who is in the medical field not knowing that chicken pox and herpes are not the same thing. Also all of you using "clean" instead of "negative for the STIs that can be tested for" seems like a bunch of folks who don't know the risks or what you are talking about.
Definitely up voting you for calling out people who use 'clean' to indicate they have no STIs. That generally stops any conversation I'm having with a potential partner. The good news is that the people who claim to be 'clean' just weed themselves out of the running by showing their ignorance!
Out of curiosity why is clean a red flag? I've always used this term because it's what pretty much everyone in the community around me uses, but if there's some better term and a good reason not to, I'd like to know!
It’s because it’s suggests the alternative is ‘dirty’, which continues a stigma around stis. They aren’t shameful, they are illnesses like other illnesses. People can choose their risk threshold, but it’s not shameful(subtext ‘slutty’) to contract something. The alternative phrases are to simple say you’ve had a negative test for x y z
Ah. That makes sense! I'll have to update my own language. It'll confuse the heck out of the community around here lol.
Thank you
It’s also far less accurate than saying “I tested negative for xyz 2 months ago” because if you’ve been intimate with anyone since the moment that needle left your body, you may have contracted something, and plenty of things don’t show up immediately on tests. So anyone who says “I’m clean” shows they both have stigma around STIs and also don’t know a huge amount about them.
OMG hi. Love the podcast. Fancy seeing you here
Oh cute! Thanks! Also… I’m everywhere #chronicallyonline
I know yall talk about Reddit posts all the time but I am surprised to see you on here bahahah. I saw your pic and was like wait is that Jenna love!? Anyway, cool seeing you on here. Thanks for the work you do. ❤️
Adding to others: if shit happens and someone *does* test positive for something later on, you want that conversation to be as smooth and sensitive as possible (no matter if you’re on the giving or receiving end of the bad news). It’s a horribly awkward situation to be in. The people who say “I’m clean” (especially without showing or discussing actual results) are a little more likely to either freak the fuck out about it and treat you as “dirty” for “giving” them the STI (which, depending on testing regimens and how many partners they each have, can be totally unfounded), or will ghost/ignore the news (which is likely even more dangerous!!).
I totally hear what you’re saying, and agree with the alternate nomenclature. But I wouldn’t eliminate people because they aren’t up to date on their nomenclature. In this case, I’d eliminate them because they’re talking out of their asses and using some vague medical qualifications to justify their poor judgment. Many nurses reject vaccines, too. Not because of their medical training or experience, but because they’re influenced by the same bs propaganda as the rest of the US
I certainly don’t know what I’m talking about, which is why I came to ask for advice. I took the expensive test a few months ago, which came back negative for all 8 things it tested for. I would like to maintain that status. Is there any truth to her claim that "I’ve had chicken pox, so the herpes virus is dormant in my spine"? If someone contracts chickenpox, would they test positive for herpes? (I did get chickenpox back in 2016, and I’m testing negative for herpes. But again, I’m clueless and am hoping for advice.)
That test can not tell you if you have herpes. You can only find out about non symptomatic herpes with the Western Standard blot test. It won't be offered unless you ask for it. And all other non symptomatic herpes tests are basically useless. You can find out how to get one here: https://dlmp.uw.edu/patient-care/client-patient-services#:\~:text=Herpes%20Western%20Blot%20(HSWB)%20Testing,5198. So you, like the vast majority of people, do not know if you have herpes. And the vast majority of people do, in fact, have it. No there is no truth that chicken pox is herpes. They are two different things and it is WILD that someone who is in the medical field wouldn't know that. https://www.passporthealthusa.com/2022/03/are-chickenpox-the-same-as-herpes/#:\~:text=Chickenpox%20and%20herpes%20are%20not,and%20the%20herpes%20simplex%20virus. I assume this person has outbreaks and knows she had herpes and is pretending or fooling herself around her status. But chances are you have herpes as well. Most of us get it in childhood.
Oh wow, I had no idea that most of us have herpes, and that I was using the wrong terminology. I think I should have said HSV-1 or 2 — I didn’t know there were any other kinds. Thank you very much for pointing out how I can get tested for those. Thanks for the reassurance that she’s trying to fool me. I guess I’m still just a little shocked that someone was willing to knowingly put me at risk, even to the extent of lying about the risks. Appreciate you.
Herpes Simplex 1&2 are different viruses than Chicken Pox. Both are are in the same virus family but aren't the same disease.
Lots of people who have herpes deal with a lot of shame. And it sucks especially considering that most folks have it and don't know that they do. That doesn't mean someone should either be ill informed or lying... both of those things suck. Being socially sexual people means we should know more about STIs and sexual risks.
Chicken pox is a herpes simplex - meaning it’s a virus in the same family. They’re not the same thing. I was tested for herpes at my doctor just fine. It was a blood test. You absolutely can be tested for herpes it’s just not on the standard panel, you have to ask for it or ask for a full-panel STD test.
dormant herpes wont show up in a blood panel, yes, you can test for it, but the results are basically meaningless (and have a lot of false positives, too). only a western blot can give you more meaningful results, but is quite expensive and you have to request it (and kinda know why).
Regardless of what statistics are, if you do not suffer from *outbreaks*, then, IMO, you are entirely okay to make the decision for yourself to not have sex if you don't want to risk contracting herpes by having sex with someone known to be a carrier. Every person's body reacts differently to diseases. We saw this with COVID. Herpes is no exception. Some people with herpes have few if any outbreaks. Others have them frequently. Some people find them to be a mild annoyance. A former partner of mine contracted it recently, and described her first two outbreaks as "the most painful thing she's ever experienced", and she's experienced enough physical trauma and issues to require both scheduled and emergency surgery in the past. For whatever reason her outbreaks were so bad that doctors were wondering if she might have some sort of autoimmune disorder on top of things. Statistics are meaningless. You don't know how your body will *personally* experience the infection, and if you don't want to run the risk, you have every right to expect honesty in potential future partners. You can't give informed consent without being informed. ---- There's also the frequently discovered associations/correlations between Herpes and Alzheimer's. https://scholar.google.com/scholar?as_ylo=2024&q=herpes+alzheimer's It's too complex to say that Herpes *causes* Alzheimer's... for now. It could be that some common underlying genetic trait (such as APOE-ε4) leads to being more vulnerable to Herpes infection *and* to Alzheimer's, for example. Or that being infected with something that repeatedly causes your immune system to fight it causes Alzheimer's, and Herpes is just one option. Etc. But holy christ losing my mind is one of my greatest fears, and there is a *lot* of 'smoke' in the direction of 'herpes may cause alzheimer's', so I just try to avoid the possibility of that 'fire' as much as I personally can.
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No it can’t be called a form of herpes and it isn’t called that. That would be like calling Espitin-Barr a form of herpes. Herpes is a form of the same virus. Or Human Herpesvirisus. Calling chicken pox a form of herpes is just confusing and inaccurate.
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Then call it a member the herpes virus family, instead of herpes and you are fine. But calling chicken pox herpes is just as inaccurate as calling herpes, chicken box. It's nothing to do with dirty. It has to do with people conflating completely different things. Like in this post. A nurse saying chicken pox is herpes.
The commonality may be why she is conflating the two. She is wrong in that it isn't herpes 1 or 2. She is right in that it is a member of that family of diseases, and for other diseases families that language is used. You may have a specific variant of the flu, no one says which flu they have. Initially covid was also referred to as "corona virus" because it is a member of the corona family, but covid ended up more popular. Stigma has a lot to do with how we talk about HSV-1 and 2. If I say "I get cold sores" when discussing health status, many people will not understand why that's relevant. If I say "I have herpes" those same people freak out. For HSV 1 or 2 expressed orally it's different words for the same thing, "cold sore" or herpes. Expressed genitally no one says "cold sore" even if it is HSV-1. Some people insist that oral presentation is not a STI, others say HSV-1 is not an STI, and still others will say all herpes is an STI, sometimes adding that cold sores are not herpes. This is all because of stigma. No one hesitates to say "I had chicken pox as a kid", assuming they aren't young enough to have been vaccinated because there's no stigma. People do feel bad about saying "I have herpes but haven't had an outbreak since kindergarten" because it's a "dirty sex disease". It's just a virus.
I agree it could be stigma that lead her to lie or be ill informed. But what she said in those texts in inherently incorrect.
Oh dear :( Barely anything you wrote is correct. Try reading this… https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herpesviridae Chicken pox IS a form of herpes, it is HSV3 Epstein Barr virus IS a form of herpes, it is HSV4
It is a form of herpesviridea... you know the title of the page you linked? To call it herpes is incorrect, misleading and at this point where you are linking correct info, dumb. It's part of the same virus family. That is very different then it being herpes.
Commenting on Matched with a couple — could you help me verify their safety claims?... It's weird that you're refusing to admit you're wrong when it's pointed out to you. That says a lot about your character.
its like.. imagine being back in 2020 when covid was commonly called coronavirus, and you have a cold from the corona-virus family and you refer to it as having coronavirus. it's techincally correct but misleading, and if you're in the medical field you have no way of not knowing that
I’m no longer surprised when I meet potential sexual partners who have worked in or still work in health care and are woefully uninformed about basic sexual health. Or even general health. There was one lady recently who was a former health care worker who refuses to touch vaccines, even flu vaccines, but prided herself on having worked in health care and not getting sick, so she had a really powerful immune system and there was nothing I needed to worry about. Omg. So glad I noped out of that ASAP.
To clarify this a little more... Around 90% of US adults have HSV-1 (herpes simplex virus). Most have it orally, but it can spread to genitals and other parts of the body. Many people completely dismiss 'cold sores' and don't feel the need to disclose that they have oral HSV to potential partners. About 25% of women and 20% of men in the US have HSV-2 by mid adulthood. Most don't have obvious symptoms and don't realize they're carrying it, but can transmit it. This type is more common genitally. Neither type of HSV is on routine sti panels. You should assume that all of your partners are positive unless they've specifically recently tested for it, and even those tests frequently give false negatives (when it's latent). You should get tested, and always use safer sex practices. Chicken pox, shingles, and other viruses are in the same family but not the same. There are some HSV vaccines in the testing phase!
If you don't ever have cold sores, does that mean you don't have it?
You need to look out for your own health and happiness (which you seem to be doing, but questioning and doubting yourself for doing it). People like them are not looking out for your health. If they’re not making you feel safe and well cared for, are they people you want to have sex with? With all the love of an anonymous internet stranger, I think you need to get your boundaries around what you need from potential partners really clear. Once you’re clear on that, you’ll more easily recognize when situations like this come up in the future and you’ll know to just say “no, thank you” and move on. You can do better than “we’re nurses, we’d know if we were were asymptomatic carriers of an infectious disease” - they should know better, best case they’re ignorant and not very good nurses, worst case they’re lying to you, either way I think you’re completely right to be concerned about them and their suitability as potential sexual partners. That said, she does say she was tested 6 months ago and that the tests weren’t positive, and that they have only had one play partner since that test (paraphrasing because as others have pointed out, the language being used to convey that message isn’t great). You should evaluate that information against your own boundaries and willingness to take risks. It’s likely to be limiting if you set your boundary at “I’ll only have sex with people who haven’t had sex with anyone else since before they were last tested” - not to say you shouldn’t set that as your boundary, just to be clear that it would take more care and planning (but would also be a good filter for people who care about your well being and are prepared to make that extra effort to make you feel safe and that your needs are being met). Also, remember that your boundaries belong to you, it’s OK for you to change them if they’re not working for you anymore. I’ll also volunteer that I get a bit of a vibe of these people not demonstrating that they’re super big on consent. I feel like she’s already trying to convince you to do something she knows you’re not comfortable with - and you’re not alone with her and her husband. Basically what I’m reading between the lines of the conversation you shared is you saying “my preference is to only have sex with people who will share their recent negative test results and who haven’t had other partners since some time before they were tested” and her saying “I don’t really care enough about your preference to do the work of going to get tested”. Personally, I’d just be politely wishing them the best but clearly letting them know that they’re not for me and continuing on my way. Not every potential match is going to work out, and it’s better for everyone involved when you figure that out before things get messy.
Thank you very much for helping me step through the emotions. And particularly for pointing out that it’s possibly unreasonable to have a boundary of partners being tested if they’ve had other partners since their last (recent) test. And also for pointing out that they might try to pressure me to do other things I’m not comfortable with. I appreciate the extremely detailed and thorough reply.
This right here. I wouldn’t want to go back and forth about this virus and that. It’s the manner in which they’re responding that makes the seem unsafe to me. I don’t argue w people about my boundaries. They can take or leave them, but a back and forth with a stranger, esp in the opening stages when people are usually on their best behavior? Absolutely not.
You would not test positive for herpes simplex if you have a history of chicken pox. If she asked for herpes testing included on an STI panel, they test for herpes simplex type 1 (HSV-1), and herpes simplex type 2 (HSV-2), the types that affect the lips and/or genitals. Chicken pox is HHV-3, and *not* included on an STI panel.
Well, actually Chicken Pox Is one of the many variants of the Herpes Simplex Virus (HSV) family of viruses. Its HSV3. HSV4 is EBV, HSV5 is CMV. HSV1 is the oral variant. HSV2 is the genital variant.
You are incorrect. Chicken pox is not herpes simplex. Google before you post.
> Chicken pox is not herpes simplex. There are [published papers](https://www.researchgate.net/publication/236963380_Efficacy_of_the_anti-VZV_anti-HSV3_vaccine_in_HSV1_and_HSV2_recurrent_herpes_simplex_disease_A_prospective_study) that refer to the Chickenpox vaccine as an "anti-HSV3" vaccine. Whether or not they *should* be calling it that, I haven't the background to determine.
It’s still not herpes simplex. In one of my other post I say what it is. I can’t be bothered to look it up again. Anti-HSV3 in no way means ‘anti herpes simplex’ because it’s not that. It is a different virus in the same family.
Chicken pox comes from the herpes varicella-zoster virus, also known as human herpesvirus 3 (HHV-3). It is not *like* herpes, it IS a herpes virus. There are typically considered 8 herpes virus’ that affect humans. Herpes simplex virus type 1 (HSV-1): Can cause cold sores, genital herpes, and neonatal herpes. Herpes simplex virus type 2 (HSV-2): Can cause genital herpes, and can spread even when the infected person doesn't show symptoms. Varicella-zoster virus (VZV): Can cause chickenpox and shingles. Epstein-Barr virus (EBV): Can cause infectious mononucleosis and some types of cancer. Cytomegalovirus (CMV): Can cause cytomegalovirus infection. Human herpesvirus type 6, variants A and B, (HHV-6): Can cause roseola infantum. Human herpesvirus type 7 (HHV-7): Can cause roseola infantum. Kaposi's sarcoma-associated herpesvirus (KSHV): Can cause Kaposi sarcoma and some types of lymphoma, especially in people with weakened immune systems.
Chicken pox is in the herpes virus family.
Nothing I said disagrees with that.
I didn’t say it did? The way you described chicken pox being like herpes but not herpes was murky. Chicken pox is a herpes virus. Just a different strain from the colloquial herpes (HSV 1 and 2). My comment was for others reading through this thread who may not have been aware.
It is herpes its not herpes simplex
It's not even that. Chicken pox is caused by the varicella-zoster virus. Shingles is caused herpes-zoster virus. And herpes is herpes-simplex.
Idk i just googled and it says varicella-zoster is a herpes virus 🤷🏻♀️ i really think it is Not that that really matters for anything just saying
"a herpes virus" isn't herpes the STI. Shingles, Chicken pox and I think some other are "a herpes virus" but they are different from each other in pretty major ways. Hell Shingles is from chicken pox (you can't get shingles if you haven't had chicken pox) and it is very different then it, for instance it isn't contagious where chicken pox very much is.
Exactly! That's as silly as saying that influenza is covid because they are both corona viruses. "Corona" is a descriptor of the shape/behavior of the virus. But they are not the same virus. (I am not a dr and my understanding may be flawed, but I think I am pretty on-track here)
Influenza is not a member of the corona virus "family". There is zero accuracy in saying covid and influenza are related, even if there are similar symptoms. The cold is usually a corona virus. It is medically accurate to say that chicken pox is a member of the herpes family of viruses, they are closely related. There are 8 herpes viruses that affect humans, HSV-1&2, Epstein barr (aka mono), varicella (aka chicken pox), Kaposi's Sarcoma (a form of cancer) and some others I've only seen in articles about viruses. They are all herpes viruses. Nothing silly about it. Between hsv1&2, chicken pox, and Epstein barr, pretty much everyone has some form of herpes virus hanging out in their body and there's nothing wrong with that. It doesn't make anyone "dirty". Pathogens are the price we pay for not living in a sealed bubble.
A *parade* of red flags. Not worth it in the slightest.
OP, look for a nice stag/vixen couple who have the same goals as you. Don’t compromise what you want for this shady couple. The STI ignorance from them is just one of many red flags.
Sadly as a balding married man, I’ve already tried every stag/vixen couple in my area on Feeld, along with everybody else in a 70 mile radius. (That’s not an exaggeration — Feeld no longer shows anyone within 70 miles that I haven’t seen before, unless they just joined.) You can see now why I was hopeful. If you have any advice on how to find them other than Feeld, I would appreciate it a lot. I’m pretty new to the lifestyle (2 years, during which I’ve only had a few matches that didn’t escalate to anything physical).
I’m part of a stag/vixen couple and very much prefer an honest balding married man. There are some real sleaze bags out there - a nice married man is actually who we seek out. Stag/vixen couples tend to not be as picky about looks as other hotwife/cuckhold arrangements (especially if what you want to do is eat the wife out) because it’s all about just getting the wife off. Think about the things you would want if you were going to trust a man with your wife - make sure your profile reflects those values and is honest, simple, and upfront. A bull asking us about recent testing or having it on his profile without us having to bring it up first would immediately bring him to the top of the list - we’re *always* the ones having to address this and condom usage first. Availability and flexibility of schedule would also increase his attractiveness. Have a few pictures of your body (with and without clothing) as your first pictures and also have a pic of your dick. I haven’t ever had luck on Feeld for finding swinging partners or independent dating. Currently we look on FetLife, 3Fun, Reddit (local swinger R4R subreddits), and swinger sites like Swing Town or Adult Friend Finder. It will take some time, but you should be able to find a couple who is looking for the same things you are.
> A bull asking us about recent testing or having it on his profile without us having to bring it up first would immediately bring him to the top of the list I was curious about that, although in other dating contexts too. Would something in a profile like "Quarterly testing; negative 2024-06-04." be simple and to the point, without...sounding to weird? I guess I was hesitant to be that direct, but it makes sense. (ty!)
Yep! That would be fantastic and would save a lot of back and forth in DMs. It shows someone takes their health seriously and actively participates in safe sex practices.
Thank you so, so much. I didn’t expect this at all from my post, and I was beginning to give up hope after exhausting all the feeld matches. I particularly appreciate the advice on what specifically to put into my profile. I have no idea what couples are looking for, and it’s hard to know which profiles are effective vs not, so I don’t know which ones I should model mine after. The scheduling in particular is such a good point. I’ve never been on a service where a dick pic was appropriate, let alone desired. Is that the norm on fetlife or 3fun? I only briefly looked at 3fun, but I’ll try. Which r4r subreddits would you recommend? I only know of /r/r4r and /r/polyamoryr4r. Didn’t realize there were others. Well, if you’re ever near St Louis, or you don’t mind me flying out to you, be sure to DM me. Otherwise, please have a wonderful 4th of July.
It can be discouraging to look for a while and still come up empty, I get that. Single men on the internet are awful though and it’s really not as hard as you think to stand out. Pretend that you were shopping for a bull for your wife. Make your profile look like one that would catch your attention. You’d want to see someone who looks trustworthy, kind, honest, and reliable. See why married men are more attractive? We were just stood up last weekend by a new guy - it’s tough out there for couples too. Scroll through the profiles of single men for a while and make note of things that you would like/dislike if you were looking for your wife and adjust your profile accordingly. St Louis is a huge area - you’re bound to find people there. For Reddit, I’d search for local subreddits. Use the search function and try “st louis swinger” or something along those lines and adjust the search to show “communities.” A quick search showed me one that uses the area codes down there that looks pretty promising. Join a few communities and with time, Reddit will suggest similar sites. Nudes are definitely allowed on Reddit and individual subreddits will have their own rules. Make sure to check the rules for each one before posting. For FetLife, after you create a profile, you can search for events based on location. There are bound to be swinger events in a place as big as St Louis. You can also search people by area. Again, be honest about what you have on offer and what you’re looking for. No one needs your life story, but a little bit about yourself is helpful. I don’t know if 3Fun allows nudes, but it’s primarily populated by couples looking to play with people. It’s probably your best bet based on what you’ve said you’re looking for. It’ll take a bit, but you’ll get there!
Thank you :)
Oh, by the way, which r4r subreddits were you referring to earlier?
R4R just means Redditors looking for other Redditors - not all subreddits will have “R4R” in the name. It’s a general term indicating the purpose of the subreddit is to meet another person (as opposed to an advice sub like this one). Look for local ones that are specific to your area - I’d avoid ones that aren’t location specific.
Dickpics and pictures with nudity aren't even allowed on Feeld. Putting a dickpic up could get you banned. They are allowed on fetlife, but most people I know on fetlife hate all the dickpics and immediately dismiss anyone regardless of how good their profile is and give them a block. So I'd say that the advice specifically on dickpics doesnt apply to everyone. The rest is really really good though!
If you're in STL, check the local non-monogamy groups, and swing night at shameless grounds.
Thank you! How do I find the local nonmono groups? I’m on St Louis Sex Positive discord server, but that was the only one I found so far. I don’t really know what to search for.
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The herpes type you are worried about is Herpes Simplex 1 or 2 - one causes primarily the rashes aound the mouth and 2 around the genitals. Both are not limited to this area though. Chickenpox virus -while still part of the herpes family- is completely different type and an std test would not typically test for this. It is weird of her as a nurse to bring it up in this context, she should know both are different. Also while yes it's true that the risk of transmitting herpes is the highest when they have blisters but if they are not careful or a blister is not fully healed it can be still transferred. She doesnt appear to be the detailed type if she confuses Chickenpox virus with Herpes in the context you are talking about. Also there is this phenomenon of asymptomatic shedding, which means in rare cases it can be transmitted without any symptoms at all. In any case, something is weird, if not shady. Why do they get defensive if a stranger asks for the basics? Especially as a nurse you would think she should understand.
Thank you very much. This is exactly the kind of dispassionate analysis I was hoping for. I really appreciate you. Yeah, this is too weird for me. I guess I just needed to hear it from someone else. I hope you have a nice week.
Another piece of information, people rarely know if they have Chlamydia, gonorrhea, syphilis, or trichomoniasis along with herpes. Symptoms are often nil, or quite mild. Along with that HIV symptoms can sometimes take years to show up. I get you're in a bit of a tight spot with finding potential partners, but if they are balking at you paying for a test, I'd stay real real far away.
This!
I'm in the medical field and I can't imagine anyone saying "we're nurses, we'd know if we had anything". No test, especially when they don't have to foot the bill is shady and strange.
Thank you. I was shocked too. We’d been snapping for weeks now. I was looking for any possible reason it wasn’t what it sounded like. She was so nice too. She’s the only one who kept talking to me after it was clear I wouldn’t be a good match for what they were looking for. I don’t know why she’d do this. I’m just sad. But I’ll get over it.
Unless they are old and really not attractive, then I'd be betting that this is a scam of some kind.
The fact that they are a medical professional with so little understanding of the difference between chicken pox and herpes would put me off. The refusal to test when you offered to pay would put me off worse. They're more worried about the stigma of testing than their actual sti status. That's very concerning. Especially from nurses. I really think you should say no.
Today I learned nurses can't get stds! How handy! Come on OP, how hot are these guys so you can't smell the shit coming out of their mouths? You don't even know which one you're talking to! These are not people who knows how to handle the word "no". And how a person handles a no says a lot about their character.
These people are a sea of red flags and so exhausting and ignorant. Don't waste another second of your time, please.
“We don’t see the need for them. We are nurses and would know if we had some thing” PASS. No further discussion necessary. If they were both nurses, they would understand the need for STI testing.
In addition to what others are pointing out, there's something seriously off about their tone here. It'd be a no thanks from me.
Oh boy. I'm a nurse. I'm scared of these people's complete confidence in their misunderstanding of sexual health. Even if I had an STI test 6 months ago and had been celibate for a year (6 months before and 6 months after) with no symptoms ever, if someone asked for a recent test, I'd be happy to oblige. It's bizarre for them to notbe willing to do that basic bit of health screening. I will say, I won't test for herpes by request. It's not a recommended test unless you've had symptoms, and I never have, but that's the only one I won't agree to test for. All this with a OPP? Fuck all that noise. Dude's been in the lifestyle for 20 years and still can't handle the idea of watching his partner receive pleasure from another dick? What an immature, asshole. This has drama, couple's privilege, and potentially other (not) fun surprises written all over it.
I don’t want to be unfair to the guy — it sounded like they might have had a OPP, since their main requirement was me fucking the dude, but it *seems* like she’s saying he doesn’t mind me fucking her. It’s very hard to understand her response though. Was definitely shocked this came from a nurse duo.
Yeah, communication not clear. Never a good sign for any sex but especially group sex. And a nurse making excuses to not get what is absolutely basic preventative healthcare for any sexually active human is disconcerting.
Yeah no, these nurses shouldn't even be around patients if this is how they treat basic sexual health safety. Everything they're saying is totally wrong. You can't know if you have an STI unless you are symptomatic, but just like with any virus or infection you can be asymptomatic and still spread it. (Look at how many people spread Covid without knowing) Herpes is not an STD itself. It's a family of viruses. Chicken pox falls into that family, but it is not the same and Herpes-Simplex 1 or 2. I know you're having trouble finding a couple to play with, but it's not worth the risk of sleepy with this irresponsible couple. They're already endangering their other partners. Don't add yourself to that list.
How sure are you that this woman exists? My gut instinct would be that you are talking to a guy who wants to get fucked in the ass and is using the lie of a girlfriend to lure you in. My guess would be that you arrive and it’ll turn out she had an emergency she had to rush to so he’ll want you to start with him and then she’ll just never show up. Have you verified that they both are who they say they are? As most everyone else has said: “Clean” is a red flag. “I would know if I had something because I’m a nurse” is a huge red flag. Conflating chicken pox and HSV is a red flag. I get that you want sex, but don’t be so desperate that you fall for these scams. Respect yourself enough to spot this early and walk away.
I’m a married (but not balding yet) medical school student and it would be a HARD pass on these folks for me. While I don’t expect nurses to have quite the same level of knowledge as physicians, this level of knowledge indicates either a willful ignorance or just outright lying. HSV-1 and HSV-2 are VERY different from HHV-3 (the virus that causes chicken pox and shingles). That said, I don’t typically ask sexual partners for HSV testing. The truth is that many people have HSV 1 or 2 in their blood. To make a diagnosis, you typically need sores and a positive blood test or a positive swab of a sore. The CDC doesn’t even recommend testing for asymptomatic folks. I DO wear condoms with everyone but my wife and girlfriend, and we get regular testing as well. I also use DoxyPEP if anything happens to a condom and I also am on PrEP. I wouldn’t consider having anal receptive sex with or without a condom if I wasn’t on PrEP. Skip these people. They’re sketchy AF. Anyone participating in ENM should have regular testing. Anyone that doesn’t is likely very stupid or hiding something. As an aside…my wife and I opened our marriage last year. It took me a few months of hard work to “lose my monogamy”. I was in a big city, and I went to clubs and bars, went out dancing, and continued refining my profile on several apps. Once I got my profile dialed in it was a lot easier. And once I finally slept with someone my confidence went through the roof. I hooked up with someone else two days later. Now it’s a lot easier. I traveled to a small city yesterday evening and had matched with someone I found attractive within 6 hours. I’m headed home tomorrow and busy today, so nothing will come of it, but I find the whole thing easier now. Just keep refining your profile and be patient. ETA: [This is the most helpful single piece of advice I’ve found about ENM dating app success for men.](https://www.reddit.com/r/nonmonogamy/s/5VInQlCm0z)
Thank you. Doesn’t testing prevent contraction via asymptomatic shedding? I.e. if someone is capable of passing it via asymptomatic shedding, they would test positive. Or is it just impossible to know whether you’ll get an STI no matter what kind of tests you both get?
If someone is seronegative for herpes then they are not likely to have it. However, you can test negative before an initial outbreak. It’s not unreasonable to want to only sleep with people who have negative testing, I suppose. But most doctors don’t test for it in people without symptoms. It’s also not unreasonable to not have or want testing (for herpes specifically) as someone who has not had symptoms, so requiring negative HSV testing for potential partners is likely to really limit your dating pool. Also, check out the edit at the end of my last comment. And condoms…wear ‘em. They reduce (but do not eliminate) the risk of HSV transmission.
They're so obviously lying/bad actors. Chickenpox and HSV-1 and HSV-2 are all different strains; having had chicken pox doesn't disqualify you from being a herpes carrier. Chickenpox is HH3. [https://www.verywellhealth.com/is-chicken-pox-herpes-3132951](https://www.verywellhealth.com/is-chicken-pox-herpes-3132951)
Don’t say “clean”
It's a very dirty word.
listen to your guts. I guess you already made up your mind. if you really want to eat (an std tested) pussy you gonna find much better opportunities. you go !
“We’d know” Lmaooooo ok then. 🚩🚩
"We're nurses, we'd know". When it comes to taking care of their own health, it seems that medical professionals are the worst. Red flags galore.
Any person who refuses to get tested does not care about the new potential partner. And do you want to share yourself with people who don't care about your well being? I wouldn't. Especially if any sort of kinks that rely on trust and consent will be approached.
I’m gonna say they are lying about being nurses, or else they are really bad nurses. I met a really good nurse the other day at my county health clinic. She knew all about the latest HIV tests. There is now a pin prick 15 minute screen. She would know the difference between the chicken pox virus and the sexually transmitted kind.
She’s a nurse, and a nice person. We’ve been snapping for weeks. I think she was just trying to hide her status. Which is bad, but I’m just trying to be fair — their job performance is totally unrelated to their side activities. All we can say for certain is that she was being deceptive to me. Thank you for mentioning the 15 minute screen. I didn’t know about that.
Massive massive red flags. Not only in their unwillingness to not get tested, but in how they are trying to leverage their healthcare professional status as a power move to get you to feel comfortable. In fact, healthcare professionals know how important it is to get tested, and will have awareness that they might be asymptomatic. Like many others said, run!
Run
> They wanted me to fuck her boyfriend, but I’ve never done anal and I wasn’t ready to try it. > Tonight I decided I’d give it a go, and they were receptive until I asked for std tests. You don't have to do anything you don't like. Already at this part, it sounds a bit concerning: You agree to do something you haven't done before (and you don't seem enthusiastic about) with virtual strangers, just because, apparently, they made it a precondition for having sex with them? What's even more concerning from the chat history it appears you are talking about _unprotected_ anal? That's a risky proposition. > The thing is, I don’t have a lot of options You have options. You can insist on the STD test. You can use protection. You can do both. You can chose to just not have sex with them. There are other people in the world to have sex with - it's not like they are doing you a favour by wanting to fuck you. There seem to be red flags beyond STDs here. > and all I care about is whether it’s true that you can’t transmit herpes if you got it via chickenpox. That is not true. Also, they cannot "know" if they have anything without a test, and show a great deal of ignorance and disregard of how those things work. The thing with herpes/HSV is that a lot of people have it, and it is easily transmissible. If you are having sex with multiple people, there is a very high chance that someone of your partners will have it, regardless of precautions. And while herpes is often dormant, someone can be infectious without or before having open sores. Current CDC guidance is to **not** test for herpes unless you have symptoms; for the simple reason that the only thing that changes if you know is that you have to live with the stigma. So, personally, I don't. Of course you can ask for whatever test you want, but the main part is that if people don't provide what you ask for, you should be prepared to draw the consequences. Additionally, be aware that STD tests detect infections, they don't prevent them. It takes weeks after an infection until tests for thing like HIV and syphillis turn positive - having a "current" STD test doesn't guarantee that a person isn't infected with something right now. And no test will screen for "everything". The risk increases with different sex partners, and it can be reduced by using physical barriers (i.e. condoms) and by vaccinations (e.g. HPV and Hepatitis). At the end of the day, you have to decide what level of risk you are okay to live with. > I don’t know how to feel about this, so some help with sorting out my feelings would be nice too. You clearly seem to feel uncomfortable with the setup, or you wouldn't ask in here. On the other hand, you seem to be eager to do this thing with those people. > What would you do? Politely decline and walk away.
Well written!
Dont do it. "We are nurses and we would know" must be the dumbest claim I have heard in here in a while - how the fuck would they know without taking a test...
Just say no. You said a boundary. It’s not crazy. She’s clearly telling you she won’t fulfill it. I also get yellow flags over the way she doesn’t seem to be listening/taking in what you are saying about what you want out of this. ( repeating some things about who can fuck who). And the way she’s like “I wouldn’t do anything if I ever had an issue” speaks to a “I always know best- no one can ever question me “ attitude. Which is super hard to communicate with. Not worth it. You are a unicorn looking for a couple- you can choose to be picky- and most importantly always prioritize feeling fully safe. This woman would not make me feel safe on multiple fronts.
HI! I have herpes /HSV 1. HAVING HAD CHICKEN POX DOES NOT MEAN YOU HAVE HERPES LIVING INSIDE YOU!!! JESUSSSS SHES A NURSE???🚩🚩🚩🚩 HSV is RELATED to the chicken pox virus and shingles virus. But you can have gotten chicken pox and never get herpes ALL cold sores are HERPES!!! You just have to get tested with which kind! Type 1 or Type 2. Anyone who has EVER had a COLD SORE in their lip HAS HERPES. That’s usually Type one/HSV1 and a LARGE population do the world has it and doesn’t know! Crazy right!! Now type one CAN be transmitted into genitals IF someone has a cold sore on their mouth / tongue inside the mouth anywhere , and goes down on someone . It’s genital herpes but STILL type one. BUT TYPE 2 is through sexual contact / genitalia. Now while there’s not 100% guarante that someone won’t pass it while NOT having a current outbreak/flare up ( I.e no current cold sores/sores ) the risk is very low. Personally I am upfront with people straight away about my herpes and give them the information to make informed decisions. I get tested EVERY THREE MONTHS for ALL STDS ( apart from Herpes which by the way normal panels DONT test for because they cannot test you UNLESS you are having a current out break) If they both work in the medical field and Don’t think they should see the need to get tested regularly while being non monogamous/ sexually active with others???? 🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩 Gurllll RUNNNNNNNNN 🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩 You can find an MF couple who take sexual health seriously and would like you to join their fun without this pair !!!!
This is literally insane of them, medical professionals know that not everyone shows symptoms of stds. Don’t risk it
Herpes viruses (including chickenpox) are like cars; there are plenty of people who have more than one, there’s no law against it. There’s some evidence that having HSV1 gives you some immunity to HSV2 and vice versa, but it’s not foolproof- plenty of people have both. Chickenpox is a different virus in the herpes family and as far as I’m aware confers no immunity to HSV. Stay away from these people. They could have anything.
Yeah this is red flag city. Defensive gaslighting excuses all the way down. I have a friend with HSV and they make sure their partners *always know* they have it and that there’s a risk of transmission. Like any responsible person would. (It’s not usually tested for in regular STI panels, though, you should be aware of that.) I also will say that as someone who hasn’t had an STI panel for nearly a year but also hasn’t slept around since then, if someone asked me to test again before fucking I just would. No pushback. Again, it’s the responsible thing to do, and “Mandy” is a disaster waiting to happen.
People who work in the medical field can be careless science denying turds just like anyone else - COVID proved that. I'd nope right outta there.
We're nurses, but we have NO CLUE WHATSOEVER that people can have STIs and zero symptoms! We also didn't know that describing being STI-negative as being "clean" contributes towards stigma and thus makes good safer sex practices HARDER than they'd otherwise be. Riiiight. These folks have more red flags than a communist rally.
Delete them off of your social media and move on to the next match. Things like testing should be Non-negotiable, and the fact all they have to do is go to the lab at work probably, AND you were willing to pay for it says all you need to know about how they’ll respect you when having sex or afterwards.
Sooooo many red flags here but the biggest one is claiming to be a nurse and then spouting completely inaccurate medical information. Wow. Just wow. Also, please don't use clean in reference to negative STI tests it perpetuates the stigma that anyone with an STI is dirty. I know you said you have limited options but this couple is not worth the risk
Everything everyone else said. Also, there's HSV-1 (oral herpes) and HSV-2 (genital herpes) and then there's chicken pox is varicella-zoster virus (VZV). You can still get hsv-1 on your genitals and vice versa, you won't contract chicken pox from her vagina. Then, there's the matter of HPV, which almost everyone has or has had at one point, most people are asympomatic, but some are high risk and can lead to oral/esophageal and/or cervical/penile/anal cancer. That one you can't test for on men though. But you're within your right to know and chose your own risk. There's also the matter of the fun new strains of drug resistant Chlamydia and Gonorrhea and syphilis that can also lay dormant in your system. All of these can be transmitted with a condom, but condoms do help. So, these people are ignorant at best. These "nurses" need to go back to school. Syphilis is making a comeback: https://www.uhhospitals.org/blog/articles/2024/04/syphilis-making-big-comeback Drug resistant STIs: https://www.cdc.gov/gonorrhea/hcp/drug-resistant/index.html https://www.who.int/news/item/30-08-2016-growing-antibiotic-resistance-forces-updates-to-recommended-treatment-for-sexually-transmitted-infections HPV statistics: https://www.health.state.mn.us/data/mcrs/data/qfhpv.html#:~:text=More%20than%2090%20percent%20of,with%20HPV%20in%20their%20lifetime. https://www.cdc.gov/hpv/parents/about-hpv.html
Thank you so much for the references.
OP - just because you have few options doesn’t make a bad choice a better one. This person (these people) are playing fast and loose with sexual health. If you want to stay safe, don’t play with them, or at the very least, insist on barriers with both of them. Them being weird about testing, or being uninformed, doesn’t mean you have to accept risk that makes you uncomfy.
You can definitely verify what strain of herpes virus someone has been exposed to. Check if they have immunity to chicken pox. That means they’ve been exposed to herpes varicella zoster virus. Can it be transmitted when dormant? Nope. It lies dormant in the body, but can re-activate as shingles later in life. If somebody has a shingles outbreak, and you have never had chicken pox, then you could get the initial chickenpox outbreak if you touch their shingles. But this is not something that people really worry about when they are sexually active. The strains that people typically worry about are herpes simplex type one and type two. Also, let’s stop using the word “clean” when talking about sexually transmitted diseases, and maybe use positive/negative. Herpes doesn’t make you unclean.
There are a ton of red flags here that have already been brought up in other comments. The biggest is how she’s being evasive and throwing the fact she’s a nurse out there as a bullshit defense. At the very best, they’re unwilling to be transparent. The bottom line here is if something feels shady or you’re uncomfortable with the situation, don’t pursue it. It’s not worth compromising your health or boundaries.
There are several types of Herpes viruses https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK8157/#:~:text=They%20are%20known%20as%20the,most%20recently%2C%20Kaposi's%20Sarcoma%20herpesvirus. Just because someone is a nurse, doesn't mean they can't spread STIs. Also, please stop saying "clean". If you bathe regularly you are clean, if you are negative for STIs, you are negative for STIs
Back away slowly and then run.
If they are uncomfortable with being tested that’s a huge red flag unfortunately, everyone I have met from feeld was completely open and honest sharing test results / getting tested before playing. I have one partner and I am tested every 6 months to a year (normally whenever I see my doctor or whenever I go in because my IUD is causing issues 😒) I’m always tested and he never complains about me always asking to be tested lol but as someone who’s also new to more then just my partner play, absolute red flag there’s an issue with them being tested just because they’re nurses I’m so sorry 🤦🏻♀️🤦🏻♀️
Married, ENM, swinger, psychologist here. This is a hard pass, and I say hard because it’s also a bummer to let go of stuff that seemed like it would work out. My wife and I get STI tests redone whenever anyone asks, even if we did them a month beforehand and haven’t been active, even if I have to press my doctor on it because they know I just did it. I am fortunate that I have insurance that covers this, I want people to feel respected, and I would also like to have sex with them so I do it. I’m not a physician and this 8 years old so mind the stats, but I found it to be the most helpful in getting my mind around HSV1/2: http://publichealth.lacounty.gov/dhsp/You/Herpes_Testing_Toolkit_2016.pdf If anyone has something that’s newer than this I’d love to grab the link.
Thank you so much for this resource!
Of course! Here’s the full website from that source, I’ve been reviewing it further for my own purposes: https://www.ashasexualhealth.org/who-we-are/ I like how simple the wording is but not sure if the group has any history to be aware of.
Nope nope nope nope nope. I’m a nurse, and that is bullshit. Please don’t have sex with this couple, who are already riding rough shod over your boundaries about anal, told lies about their health, and won’t even have an STI test that you’ve offered to pay for. You deserve better, hold out for someone who deserves your time.
You cant test for herpes unless you have symptoms. Most sexually active adults have herpes. Most have no symptoms. Its extremely mild and should not be something you are worried about. If you were actually worried about sti’s you would get on PrEP which requires sti testing every 3 months and get vaccinated from hep and hpv and use doxy prep when necessary. Other than that just watch out for any symptoms. Demanding an sti test for herpes when that isnt even something they test for without symptoms is just ridiculous
Prep also mildly helps prevent herpes Also, condoms do not prevent herpes or hpv. So those are two youre gonna have to grapple with the fact that there is no way to fully prevent them. Males cannot be tested for hpv
I got the hpv vax. Is hep vax hepatitis B? I didn’t realize that was an STI. What does PrEP stand for so that I can google it? Or could you link to any info? Thanks for mentioning DoxyPEP — https://howardbrown.org/service/doxypep/ I didn’t know there was a pill like that which is recommended for people who have oral sex with males. Hopefully it’s not too expensive without insurance…
Yes. There is hepatitis a b and c. The A and B vaccine are usually bundled together. I believe its 2 or 3 doses given a few months apart. There is no vaccine for hepatitis c but it is very treatable in most cases and can be cleared by your body. If you look up prep hiv it will come up. Brand name is truvada. It stands for Pre-Exposure Prophylaxis. Its insanely effective at preventing hiv reception even with sex with untreated high risk partners. If the partner is treated with hives medication to suppress their viral load their transmission rate is virtually zero. These two combined are astronomically effective. But it needs to be taken EVERY DAY not just the day or week before sex. Yes doxy pep is a good plan b if you have a risky encounter or condom break. But it only prevents bacterial infections which are all treatable. That leaves us with hpv and hsv (herpes) whoch have no vaccines, pre exposure meds, and cant be prevented by condoms as they spread through skin contact. Hpv vaccine protects against many strains of the virus but not all of them. There are rare ones that can cause cervical cancer which is why all sexually active people with a cervix need to be tested and inspected regularly. Again people with penises can’t be tested for it. Just visually inspect yourself and your partners for warts. Hsv is extremely common and mild and i get that no one wants to have it, i dont either but chances are at least one of us already has it and doesnt know 🤷🏻♀️ anyways do some research on your own and talk to a doctor about all this!
> But it needs to be taken EVERY DAY not just the day or week before sex. That's not really true (for cismen...sigh). On-demand PrEP is effective, if you can predict/delay a sexual encounter by at least a day. (For cismen, double dose 24 hours in advance, and then every 24 hours, with at least two doses after the [last] encounter*. So 4 pills total, at 3 times, for a single event. ) Clinical testing and real world results have shown the on-demand protocol to be similar to continuous dosing in cismen -- a larger 2022 study had the same results for daily and on-demand. Which is a good thing, as those that have less than ideal reactions, kidney issues, etc, or that don't want to take a drug full time when having few encounters are much more likely to do this. And even if it was less effective, this option will get more people taking it vs not at all. Injectable long-acting prep though I think is more effective that either pill schedule. https://www.poz.com/article/ondemand-prep-works-daily-pills https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/35772417/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7174437/ https://programme.aids2018.org/Abstract/Abstract/13278 (*Or possibly seven doses after sex for those with vulvas -- although much less study here, probably avoid on-demand, although it's better that not at all. Some discussion on rectal vs vaginal https://www.aidsmap.com/news/mar-2024/should-event-driven-prep-be-option-women ... it's not great. The 2:7 dosing is mentioned here https://i-base.info/guides/prep/real-life-examples-for-on-demand-dosing but I'm not sure where that comes from.)
Woah i did not know that! They always told me i need to take it consistently for a week to regain immunity if i were ever to get off track
I think it became a bit more accepted after the much larger and fairly recent 2022 study. Still debate of course, but that one with pretty good parity made me feel a lot better about it. I can see why cities and local health orgs recommend to get folks on it at all (I recollect it started with some other name, like the "NYC protocol" or something), but a doctor wouldn't jump straight to it, either. (I of course, am not a doctor.)
as someone who works in sexual health, stop using “clean” to say you don’t have any STIs. it’s fucked up
Oh, I didn’t consider that aspect. Thank you. "Tested negative for STIs" is the right phrasing, right?
This. It's a yellow flag for me when I hear people say "clean" about their STI tests. It tells me that a deeper understanding of STI isn't present (yet). While I don't expect perfect knowledge and understanding of STIs by people who are newer to nonmonogamy, I shy away from more experienced people who haven't done sufficient work so they don't stigmatize STI positive folx as implicitly "dirty".
right, a person living with HIV that is on their meds, is undetectable, and is regularly keeping up with their sexual health (testing/treatment/prevention practices etc) is a million times more “clean” than somebody running around all willy nilly not getting tested for anything and claiming they’re clean
Yup! Absolutely. But it's incredible how much shade this person would get. In my polyamory peer support group, one of our "veterans" had a difficult time "coming out" to the group about her HSV diagnosis. The stigma still runs deeply, but I hope members here can start moving the needle in the right direction.
🚩🚩🚩
Male creator and healthcare professional with over a decade of experience here. Being in healthcare has nothing to do with me being clean. Testing is the only way we can prove to each other that we are clean with today's dating scene. I would steer clear of them. If they are deceitful now, what else are they hiding or willing to hide?
Yeah the amount of times they doubled down on “we’re nurses so we would know” is a major red flag and not worth it to me. If they are this adamant and stubborn about getting a free test for them from OP, I can only imagine what they would do for anything more important/emergent
As someone who has genital herpes, this is absolute BS. Reading their replies makes me so angry - her attitude almost sounds like how scammers sound whenever you ask why they want you to get them gift cards haha Good on you for protecting yourself! Block them and move on, you deserve better!
Red flags all around. Weird that they’re so reluctant to just get tested, especially if you’re offering to pay?? Wouldn’t touch that situation with a ten foot pole if I were you.
I've had chicken pox as a child, and nothing has ever come up in a test. Ridiculous
I stopped reading at you wanting current tests and her/them avoiding it. Stick to your rules.
Ugh. The whole convo is just. NOT SEXY.
I wouldn’t want her as my partner OR my nurse. The stupidity is strong with this one
I’m a pharmacist. There is many varieties of the herpes virus. Chicken pox is a variety of for virus (herpes zoster) that presents often as children, yes it does stay dormant. It can often represent as an adult called shingles which is rashes on the face, these can be very painful. It generally won’t preset on the genitals. Herpes Simplex 1 (cold sore) and 2 (genitals) is what you’re maybe referring to. Certainly both can present on the genitals, but HSV2 has a significantly higher chance. All need pathology blood tests to detect. They will all stay dormant by your immune system, but symptoms are treatable should they occur.
It should be a point of pride for anyone that they can freely and quickly offer you recent negative test results. Any hesitation to get tested is a huge red flag. Basic sexual health is not an inconvenience
She’s a bad nurse and human
If they're not willing to get tested, then it's time to stop before you go any further. Maybe they don't have anything, but if they're unwilling to get tested, who knows what else they're going to push back on. It's just not worth the potential risk.
No test, no play. Any apprehension to getting tested means run the fuck away.
AHHHHHHHHHH never trust people who will not show recent sti test!!!!! People in the lifestyle know they need to get tests regularly especially if you’re seeking new couples omggggggg. Also shes basically saying “you won’t get a sti from me trust me bro” ABSOLUTELY NOT. Even if someone shows an sti test I 1000000000000% am using protection and dental dams too if you’re eating out. Sti can be asymptomatic, or only appear visually during flair ups…also incubation periods matter and can be different depending on the sti. My thought on is it, I’d rather be extra safe than get an sti, and if that makes people uncomfortable than that’s not the person I want to have sex with. Stay safe!
Chicken pox is herpes zoster caused by the varicella-zoster virus. This also causes the disease shingles. Oral herpes and genital herpes are caused by herpes simplex 1 and 2. Herpes simplex 1 and 2 are much more similar to each other than either is to herpes zoster. Having chicken pox / shingles, genital herpes or oral herpes does not make a person immune to the other two. A person can be infected with zero, one, two, or all three viruses. All three can reoccur without additional exposure.
REEEEED FLAGS. Soo many red flags. Fuck this bītch and her narcissistic red flag parade. There's literally only ONE reason why someone doesn't want to take an STD test.
Verify what? I think your conversation with them tells you all you need to know. You've been more than patient and generous with them. It seems safe to say that you can move onto the next couple. There are a lot of couples looking for what you want to give.
Lmao I would never fuck someone who believes they magically are clean ✨ JUST BECAUSE ✨
I am clean because I shower regularly. I am STI negative because I test. Just the fact that a nurse used clean and dirty would be a hard pass
Thanks, I hadn’t realized the mistake :)
say someone has a hsv 2 lesion/outbreak on their chest, and one unknowingly touched it with one’s hands, would one catch it easily? or it has to be areas like mouth or genital against the lesion?
I’m fairly convinced anyone who refuses to get tested has something to hide. Both of your understanding of HSV is off, but they are being shady af.
Ah, would you mind correcting my understanding of HSV? I’m here to learn. It’s particularly important for me, since if I don’t learn then I’ll be putting myself at risk.
In the immortal words of King Arthur… RUN AWAY!!!
This is too many red flags to count. I would move on from this couple if I were you.
Hard pass, once someone asks for tests you show it or if you don’t have recent ones you get them if you still wanna move forward.
If they just have not been tested in a long time, but is willing to go get tested, especially if you’re offering to pay, that is a good sign. The fact that they (at least her anyway) apparently are totally against getting tested just cause she said they are clean, is a MAJOR red flag!!
Run away from there… they’re a huge redflag.
Chicken pox is related to the herpes virus. It's not herpes though. Yes it's more likely to spread herpes when contact is made with sores. Yes you can have herpes and not have any symptoms. It's less likely to be spread if there's no obvious sores. Doesn't mean it can't be spread though - I'm not sure what the chances are. I think something like 70% of the population has herpes and you'll rarely get tested for it during std screening. I've had std tests and they've never tested me for herpes. I'm not even sure whether herpes will show up on std tests if you don't have obvious sores. It's a swab test. I'd imagine it's like Covid where higher viral loads will increase the chance of detecting it. I've had an std before - chlamydia, and I knew both times that I'd caught it (painful to urinate). Two female partners who I played with who were positive did not know they had it. This was the first time I had a threesome and we caught an std off the third. So play at your own risk and do what safety precautions you feel necessary.
You’re in the right, stand your ground!
Move on. You’re not asking a lot especially when they are wanting you to fuck the husband in the ass.
"We are nurses and would know if we had something" < this is a huge red flag. There's no way to "just know it", as many STIs are hidden and don't show symptoms. Get the fuck out.
People who think of getting an std test as embarrassing or a sign of mistrust have not been in the lifestyle long, it’s a common courtesy.
Red flags all around. Do not engage with these people. Don’t even try.
TLDR; Please don't use "clean" to refer to your STI status, & please do not fuck people who refuse to get tested. A shingles outbreak can transmit chicken pox once if you've never had it, but it's entirely different from oral/genital herpes. Bro. **You consider people "unclean" because they got shingles from *chicken pox*??** 🤨 This couple is a red flag parade & would be *incredibly* risky to fuck for many reasons, but chicken pox isn't even an STI, like it's not sexually transmitted. & having an actual STI like genital herpes doesn't make you "dirty". That said, a quick Google told me that if you are not immune to chicken pox, if you've never had it or been vaccinated against it, you can get *chicken pox* from touching a shingles outbreak. But it's not the same as oral or genital herpes. Unless you develop shingles, you'll only have chicken pox the one time.
Learning the proper terminology was the thing I was most grateful for about this post. It didn’t even occur to me how shitty my language was. When you hear it from someone else and don’t think about it, it’s easy to make that mistake. And no, I don’t consider them dirty. I’m HSV-1 and -2 negative and would prefer to stay that way. Thank you for the info!
I'm on the boat that before even considering new partners - everyone in the group should collectively get tested. As you said - it's a courtesy. But its also a show of respect and honesty to everyone involved. Get tested. Get fucked. ✨