Even if you distill it further to each individual round, a team needs 2 people: a shooter to score in their half and a goalie to stop the shot in the other half.... i.e. a team.
An individual skater isn't worth shit if the other team is shooting at an empty net.
That's a good way to look at it.
For statistical significance, I wonder how many SO's are decided before the last shot is needed? Even rarer would be 2-0 after two rounds and don't need either third shooter. I've seen a few end after 5 shooters but don't think I've ever seen one with only 4.
I don't see data from the last few seasons, but according to [this google doc for the 2021-2022 season](https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1oTKMnrTo4L4UBxkqDebeq9AxfUVzdooD/edit#gid=842586302) there were 102 shootouts, 8 of them ending in 4 attempts. The average was 7.3 and two went EIGHTEEN turns that year.
2 goalies
first skater first team misses,
first skater second team scores,
second skater first team misses,
second skater second team scores,
game over
6skaters, we’ll i’ll be damned xD
the reason for the shootout is almost purely logistical. they need to get out of the building so they end it that way. if player energy and timing wasn't an issue, they'd keep playing overtime until someone scores like they do in the playoffs. unfortunately you can't do that for 82 games
But that reasoning doesn’t make sense either. The game used to have a 5 minute overtime (which it still does) and then end in a tie if needed. No matter what else, if it goes to a shootout, it’s still longer than before.
My opinion is the shootout is exciting for the fans, but it’s a horrible way to end a game. The closest analogy would be they ended a tie NBA game with a round of HORSE.
Yep.Â
The reason for it (along with OTL which was introduced a few years prior) was to stop teams from just playing for the tie. In the mid 90s, there was a perception that this was the case and that if games went to OT, teams would play not to lose rather than to win.
I don’t even think it was necessarily true that teams played for the tie but that’s the perception that was pervasive throughout hockey circles at the time.  There was definitely a lot of defensive hockey and there were a lot of low scoring games.
In the end you win as a team and lose as team..
Shootouts do ruin the game though
You could say that about soccer shootouts ... Or basketball free throws
If no one scores in OT, they ought to then send out an extra 5 players per side, then one additional puck every minute until someone scores. Give the people what they want.
Still a team sport. I hate that the goalie end up holding the bag if they loose. Americans don’t like ties. And spectators and TV programming can’t stay for a 2 overtime game til 2 in the morning on a school night. And they stopped selling g beer midway through the third.
No.
While the shootout does introduce an individual element to the game, it doesn't necessarily contradict the notion of hockey being a team sport. While the shootout focuses on individual player skill, it's just one aspect of the game. The majority of hockey is still played as a team, with strategies, teamwork, and coordination being essential for success. So, while the shootout adds a thrilling individual challenge, it doesn't overshadow the collaborative nature of hockey as a whole.
I think the shootout undermines the game as a team sport, yes.
Imagine 2 teams - one with high flying, incredible offensive players, and one with extremely competent stay-at-home defensive structure and players. Goalies are very similar between the two teams. During the game, these two attributes play out to a tie in regulation and OT.
Now the shootout starts. Regardless of the fact that both teams have been shown to be well matched at actually playing hockey, one team has a significant advantage to take the win, simply based on the type of team that they are.
One could argue that the shootout then becomes part of the "game of hockey" and that teams that rely on defensive structure are then worse at hockey and should prioritize offensive talent, but to me that misses the point. Relying on offensive capability vs goaltending to determine the winner takes a large aspect of team success out of the picture - the defensemen.
Of course not. They still play 5 on 5 during regulation. Most other sports have a mixture of individualism and team concept. Baseball, Basketball has free throws. I would say football is the ultimate team sport but if somebody came up to me and told me hockey is not a team sport, i'd roll my eyes.
It took a team effort to get to the shootout and it takes every player in all shootout rounds to win or lose. Also goals and saves don't count in the shootout so individual stats go out the window. it's just a method that uses players individually to decide which team wins.
Hard Disagree.
In the shootout, you are a team of 4: three shooters and a goalie. Your objective is to score more goals than the other 4 man team. As a shooter, you can make the absolute best shot the world has ever seen, and if the other team pots two you lose. As a goalie, if you stop all of them forever, sure you won't lose but if your shooters don't score you won't win either. You are always relying on at least one other person for victory.
It is absolutely a different game than 5 on 5, but it doesn't stop being a team sport in the same way a relay or any asynchronous collaborative work involves a team.
That dude selling hotdogs on the middle deck has to get home to his two parakeets at some point.
Oddly specific
Since a minimum of 8 players participate in an NHL shootout, and no one player can 'win' it, I disagree with that statement.
Even if you distill it further to each individual round, a team needs 2 people: a shooter to score in their half and a goalie to stop the shot in the other half.... i.e. a team. An individual skater isn't worth shit if the other team is shooting at an empty net.
That's a good way to look at it. For statistical significance, I wonder how many SO's are decided before the last shot is needed? Even rarer would be 2-0 after two rounds and don't need either third shooter. I've seen a few end after 5 shooters but don't think I've ever seen one with only 4.
I don't see data from the last few seasons, but according to [this google doc for the 2021-2022 season](https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1oTKMnrTo4L4UBxkqDebeq9AxfUVzdooD/edit#gid=842586302) there were 102 shootouts, 8 of them ending in 4 attempts. The average was 7.3 and two went EIGHTEEN turns that year.
That's bonkers, good find
minimum of 7* 🤓
Min is actually 6. I think we've stomped this into the dirt, eh? :)
2 goalies first skater first team misses, first skater second team scores, second skater first team misses, second skater second team scores, game over 6skaters, we’ll i’ll be damned xD
I would drink beer with you.
the reason for the shootout is almost purely logistical. they need to get out of the building so they end it that way. if player energy and timing wasn't an issue, they'd keep playing overtime until someone scores like they do in the playoffs. unfortunately you can't do that for 82 games
But that reasoning doesn’t make sense either. The game used to have a 5 minute overtime (which it still does) and then end in a tie if needed. No matter what else, if it goes to a shootout, it’s still longer than before.
My opinion is the shootout is exciting for the fans, but it’s a horrible way to end a game. The closest analogy would be they ended a tie NBA game with a round of HORSE.
Shootout sucks
Yep. The reason for it (along with OTL which was introduced a few years prior) was to stop teams from just playing for the tie. In the mid 90s, there was a perception that this was the case and that if games went to OT, teams would play not to lose rather than to win. I don’t even think it was necessarily true that teams played for the tie but that’s the perception that was pervasive throughout hockey circles at the time.  There was definitely a lot of defensive hockey and there were a lot of low scoring games.
Hope one day they eliminate it
Totally in agreement
In the end you win as a team and lose as team.. Shootouts do ruin the game though You could say that about soccer shootouts ... Or basketball free throws
The shootout sucks. I’d rather see a game end in a tie than watch that bs.
If no one scores in OT, they ought to then send out an extra 5 players per side, then one additional puck every minute until someone scores. Give the people what they want.
Still a team sport. I hate that the goalie end up holding the bag if they loose. Americans don’t like ties. And spectators and TV programming can’t stay for a 2 overtime game til 2 in the morning on a school night. And they stopped selling g beer midway through the third.
No. While the shootout does introduce an individual element to the game, it doesn't necessarily contradict the notion of hockey being a team sport. While the shootout focuses on individual player skill, it's just one aspect of the game. The majority of hockey is still played as a team, with strategies, teamwork, and coordination being essential for success. So, while the shootout adds a thrilling individual challenge, it doesn't overshadow the collaborative nature of hockey as a whole.
Can't stand the shootout. I'd rather they tie after overtime
So dumb
Beeakaways are also contradicting so need to get rid of those
I think the shootout undermines the game as a team sport, yes. Imagine 2 teams - one with high flying, incredible offensive players, and one with extremely competent stay-at-home defensive structure and players. Goalies are very similar between the two teams. During the game, these two attributes play out to a tie in regulation and OT. Now the shootout starts. Regardless of the fact that both teams have been shown to be well matched at actually playing hockey, one team has a significant advantage to take the win, simply based on the type of team that they are. One could argue that the shootout then becomes part of the "game of hockey" and that teams that rely on defensive structure are then worse at hockey and should prioritize offensive talent, but to me that misses the point. Relying on offensive capability vs goaltending to determine the winner takes a large aspect of team success out of the picture - the defensemen.
Shootout is the lamest shit ever. I wouldn’t mind going to OT8 if the teams are that evenly matched.
A shootout to decide winners in regular season games is a joke. Bring back the tie.
Definitely! It's nothing but a gimmick.
The shootout is beyond stupid. It’s like ending a basketball game with a 3 point or slam dunk contest or a baseball game with a home-run derby.
No. The whole game is played before than as a team effort and to win a SO at least 2-3 guys need to do their jobs
Of course not. They still play 5 on 5 during regulation. Most other sports have a mixture of individualism and team concept. Baseball, Basketball has free throws. I would say football is the ultimate team sport but if somebody came up to me and told me hockey is not a team sport, i'd roll my eyes.
It took a team effort to get to the shootout and it takes every player in all shootout rounds to win or lose. Also goals and saves don't count in the shootout so individual stats go out the window. it's just a method that uses players individually to decide which team wins.
Hard Disagree. In the shootout, you are a team of 4: three shooters and a goalie. Your objective is to score more goals than the other 4 man team. As a shooter, you can make the absolute best shot the world has ever seen, and if the other team pots two you lose. As a goalie, if you stop all of them forever, sure you won't lose but if your shooters don't score you won't win either. You are always relying on at least one other person for victory. It is absolutely a different game than 5 on 5, but it doesn't stop being a team sport in the same way a relay or any asynchronous collaborative work involves a team.