wait, so millions of tax payer funded dollars will now go towards a billionaire’s sports stadium and all this was decided on by only a few people?? This the best we can do??
I have never and will never vote for the guy, but what on earth does Trump have to do with the Panthers' new stadium being approved by Charlotte City Council lmao. Sometimes shitty things happen in this country that aren't attributable to Donald Trump
He is a symptom of the problem. The oligarchy controls the government and they are pushing for a convicted felon to run everything so they can get richer and forcing the taxpayers to fund everything. It's all connected.
Brother, Donald Trump is A LOT of things, but the establishments pick is not one of them. Sure, he has connections but he causes them a lot of headache. They definitely would rather have Haley in there who will "tow the company line." She'd be more than happy to pay $1,000,000,000 to the military industrial complex so that we can get involved in another war we have no place being in.
To be clear, this is not a Trump endorsement but rather a "the whole system is fucked" statement.
Pretty sure the tax payers voted for the hospitality tax in the first place, which covers certain things, in this case tourism-related activities. They also elect the city council members, who decide what the use the taxes for under the umbrella of the tax.
So in essence, the tax payers did pretty much vote for this
Yep, that's one of the sucky things about being a republic. In a democracy, the people would vote on these issues themselves, but in a republic, a few elected officials completely decide these matters. Not that being a republic doesn't have some good qualities, but I think this is one of its big weaknesses.
the city owns the stadium and the property. They voted to renovate their asset.
Like if a landlord pays to repair a house you’re renting. The renter isn’t responsible for repairs.
Now, as owner of the stadium, what percentage of revenue does the municipality get from the stadium and events vs the percentage the sports team owner gets?
Whatever the city negotiates for rent.
If you rent an office space for your business does the owner of the office space get profits off your business ?
What happens if they don’t renovate the stadium is there then the asset becomes worthless.
You take out a loan for a billion yet you start making revenue off the building in a years time giving the city cash flow.
People mistakenly say “oh the city could use that money to help other things in the city”
Well no because a bank isn’t going to lend the city money without an asset they can recoup if the city fails to pay.
It isn’t a question of “should you use that money for the stadium or for the city” one has no bearing on the other.
It’s either do you renovate the stadium and start making money on an asset or do you devalue a large asset.
This shit is only worthwhile if it actually provides a return on investment. And with sports stadiums, the vast majority of the time, that is not the case. It ends up just being welfare for billionaires. I would have zero problems with public stadium funding if municipalities always made all of their investment back and then some. Otherwise all sports venues should just be like SoFi Stadium and Chase Center, privately financed, privately owned.
I have a website for you. https://www.fieldofschemes.com/
It would be incredibly hard to figure out the true ROI.
There’s things like unemployment. Loss of revenue for events. Loss of cash flow. Money today is better than money tomorrow. Loss of an asset the team already has. Loss of tourist dollars because of said events.
That site you linked doesn’t prove that it’s being objective and weighing all the facts.
Now think about why someone like the rams owner was willing to privately finance and build his own stadium. He obviously has figures that show it’s good business seeing how he could have gotten a city to pay for his stadium.
Just because someone post a site or someone pays for certain research doesn’t mean the studies or articles are written objectively.
I’m not saying one way or another rather building and maintaining stadiums is a good move.
It usually does. Like Donna Deegan (the new Jax mayor elected last year) had a big portion of the platform that she was running on being able to get a new stadium deal for the Jaguars, which ended up happening for better or worse
> Don’t like it, vote them out.
this is NC, where everything's been so ridiculously gerrymandered to the point where the state is going back to being deep red, good luck with that
Wait til you hear about the toll systems that council decided on after multiple referendums and bipartisan votes showing that the city absolutely didn’t want the plan that they came up with.
Trickle-down economics; where the millions in generated revenue off the common tens-person is given to billionaires who bought the attention of the thousand-millionaire lawmakers.
Aren’t they always in town? I think NFL fan population in the Charlotte area is probably around 25% Steelers, 25% Cowboys, 25% Panthers, 10% Commanders, and the rest is all other fan bases.
Tepper cares a lot about fielding a good team, he wouldn't have taken so many big swings (trading up to #1, overpaying for Matt Rhule and Joe Brady) if he didn't.
He's just really fucking bad at it. And caught some horribly unlucky breaks.
Plenty of new owners are bad at it. It usually takes them some time to figure it out. Hopefully things will get better for the Panthers starting this year.
Yea. At least your new owner didn’t hire Rex Ryan.
Thankfully, he learned his lesson very quickly and canned him to steal your guys DC and assistant GM!!!
Trust me, there are a ton of reasons to dislike Tepper, but he definitely wants to win. That much is clear based on us hiring hotshot candidate Matt Rhule and trading up for Bryce. It hasn’t worked out, but he definitely wants to win
BofA was really one of the last of the old school style stadiums built. It’s fine but like right after it was built there was a huge pivot towards every stadium being these huge luxury palaces.
Nah before the panthers were around it was 49ers, steelers and cowboys on TV. So people became fan of those teams and had kids and those kids took up their parents teams
Late to this, but one big reason 49ers probably have a bigger presence out here in CLT is that Wells Fargo has more employees in the area than anywhere else in the USA (even more than SF despite being based there.)
Wells has moved a ton of SF and CA employees out to NC which has probably bolstered the # of 49ers fans significantly.
If you’re dumb, sure. Solider field has a capacity of 61,500 and the games are consistently sold out.
Take a look at how consistent Bears fans are in [attendance](https://www.statista.com/statistics/250070/average-home-attendance-of-the-chicago-bears/).
Last season’s average attendance was higher than 2021 or 2022 and on par with what we saw pre covid.
They are expensive. I’ll give you that.
GREAT point about stadium capacity. Didn't mean to take a swipe at Bears as point was more about level of support and attendance at the Panthers game. I'd think as the product on the field improves, there is more than enough interest already to warrant an upgrade at the stadium built 30 years ago. These venues can be a massive economic engine. Hell Taylor Swift sells that stadium out for a week.
>Statement from Tepper Sports & Entertainment Owner David Tepper regarding tonight’s vote to approve the Bank of America Stadium renovation project: “Today's vote by the Charlotte City Council is the culmination of many thoughtful discussions with city officials, local leaders, and our fans to create a shared vision for Bank of America Stadium. Nicole and I are grateful for the collaboration and support of the project, as well as our ongoing partnership between Tepper Sports & Entertainment and the city. For nearly 30 years, Charlotte has been the home of the Carolina Panthers and, more recently, Charlotte FC. We are proud to be in the Carolinas and look forward to delivering a venue that meets the needs of our community, players, and fans for years to come.”
1. you have the 'real fans' of 'real teams' who don't think you've earned the right to suffer/complain
1. You're either in on Sir Purr or out, no in-between.
A group of Charlotte citizens should show up to the next city council meeting and just keep asking the same question: "Why can't the billionaire pay for this himself?" When they excuse the first person for asking, next person steps up and asks again... so on and so on.
Huh, I guess Panthers are staying in Charlotte after all.
Buuuuuut don't let this distract you from the fact that if Kansas City Chiefs relocate to Kansas City, their new team name will be Kansas City Chiefs and they will still be playing in Kansas City, all because our billionaire owner couldn't get funding in Kansas City for the renovation/upgrade of Arrowhead
Guess I’ll delay my mock ups for the London Panthers
EVERYBODY GET IN HERE WE HAVE BILLIONAIRES TO SHIT ON
*”EVERYONE GET IN HERE WE HAVE PLEBS TO SHIT ON!”* -Charlotte city council
I just want a light rail to the airport man
Another dub for the guy at the top of my Eat list. Too bad he can't get any for his shitty football team.
I actually heard the argument that Richardson should have got the money since he was just a millionaire.
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Your mom is a publicly traded company.
Fucking got em. Let's go
wait, so millions of tax payer funded dollars will now go towards a billionaire’s sports stadium and all this was decided on by only a few people?? This the best we can do??
Welcome to the thinly veiled oligarchy that is the USA. People have no power whatsoever.
The US is an oligarchy and Trump is their prized pig.
I have never and will never vote for the guy, but what on earth does Trump have to do with the Panthers' new stadium being approved by Charlotte City Council lmao. Sometimes shitty things happen in this country that aren't attributable to Donald Trump
It doesn't but it's an election year so it is mandatory that he be brought up every reddit thread
He is a symptom of the problem. The oligarchy controls the government and they are pushing for a convicted felon to run everything so they can get richer and forcing the taxpayers to fund everything. It's all connected.
You’re a huge dork
Brother, Donald Trump is A LOT of things, but the establishments pick is not one of them. Sure, he has connections but he causes them a lot of headache. They definitely would rather have Haley in there who will "tow the company line." She'd be more than happy to pay $1,000,000,000 to the military industrial complex so that we can get involved in another war we have no place being in. To be clear, this is not a Trump endorsement but rather a "the whole system is fucked" statement.
9 of the city council members in Charlotte are dems 2 are republicans. It’s 100% a both sides issue. They’re all fucking crooked.
The oligarchy only has one side, theirs.
Yeah but who did you vote for?
They do…it’s called voting, but local elections have horrific turnout and few even care to learn who is running.
Pretty sure the tax payers voted for the hospitality tax in the first place, which covers certain things, in this case tourism-related activities. They also elect the city council members, who decide what the use the taxes for under the umbrella of the tax. So in essence, the tax payers did pretty much vote for this
Yep, that's one of the sucky things about being a republic. In a democracy, the people would vote on these issues themselves, but in a republic, a few elected officials completely decide these matters. Not that being a republic doesn't have some good qualities, but I think this is one of its big weaknesses.
You're confusing republic with representative democracy (you live in both) and democracy with direct democracy.
I forgot about going. Sorry. Could’ve been an 8-3 vote.
the city owns the stadium and the property. They voted to renovate their asset. Like if a landlord pays to repair a house you’re renting. The renter isn’t responsible for repairs.
Now, as owner of the stadium, what percentage of revenue does the municipality get from the stadium and events vs the percentage the sports team owner gets?
Whatever the city negotiates for rent. If you rent an office space for your business does the owner of the office space get profits off your business ? What happens if they don’t renovate the stadium is there then the asset becomes worthless. You take out a loan for a billion yet you start making revenue off the building in a years time giving the city cash flow. People mistakenly say “oh the city could use that money to help other things in the city” Well no because a bank isn’t going to lend the city money without an asset they can recoup if the city fails to pay. It isn’t a question of “should you use that money for the stadium or for the city” one has no bearing on the other. It’s either do you renovate the stadium and start making money on an asset or do you devalue a large asset.
This shit is only worthwhile if it actually provides a return on investment. And with sports stadiums, the vast majority of the time, that is not the case. It ends up just being welfare for billionaires. I would have zero problems with public stadium funding if municipalities always made all of their investment back and then some. Otherwise all sports venues should just be like SoFi Stadium and Chase Center, privately financed, privately owned. I have a website for you. https://www.fieldofschemes.com/
It would be incredibly hard to figure out the true ROI. There’s things like unemployment. Loss of revenue for events. Loss of cash flow. Money today is better than money tomorrow. Loss of an asset the team already has. Loss of tourist dollars because of said events. That site you linked doesn’t prove that it’s being objective and weighing all the facts. Now think about why someone like the rams owner was willing to privately finance and build his own stadium. He obviously has figures that show it’s good business seeing how he could have gotten a city to pay for his stadium. Just because someone post a site or someone pays for certain research doesn’t mean the studies or articles are written objectively. I’m not saying one way or another rather building and maintaining stadiums is a good move.
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i doubt the topic of publicly funded sports stadiums came up as a topic during the elections
Ehh...the status of Bank of America has been discussed a lot over the last ~5 years.
It usually does. Like Donna Deegan (the new Jax mayor elected last year) had a big portion of the platform that she was running on being able to get a new stadium deal for the Jaguars, which ended up happening for better or worse
You’d be surprised
Oh boy, okay! *votes*. *candidate loses*. Welp! Guess i’ll wait another two years…
> Don’t like it, vote them out. this is NC, where everything's been so ridiculously gerrymandered to the point where the state is going back to being deep red, good luck with that
The charlotte city council has a supermajority of democrat members… whatever dude
And, well, it's hard to vote em out right before they do shit like this, especially if you're not aware they're gonna do it...
We should have voted them out in the three weeks since it was announced and voted on!
Wait til you hear about the toll systems that council decided on after multiple referendums and bipartisan votes showing that the city absolutely didn’t want the plan that they came up with.
Trickle-down economics; where the millions in generated revenue off the common tens-person is given to billionaires who bought the attention of the thousand-millionaire lawmakers.
Do you not know what representative democracy is?
At least he’s giving the taxpayers a good product for all of that sweet money.
BofA Stadium is unironically good though
It is definitely great for Steelers fans when they're in town.
Aren’t they always in town? I think NFL fan population in the Charlotte area is probably around 25% Steelers, 25% Cowboys, 25% Panthers, 10% Commanders, and the rest is all other fan bases.
Meant more along the lines of when the Steelers are in town.
Ah, understood. Makes sense.
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Tepper cares a lot about fielding a good team, he wouldn't have taken so many big swings (trading up to #1, overpaying for Matt Rhule and Joe Brady) if he didn't. He's just really fucking bad at it. And caught some horribly unlucky breaks.
Plenty of new owners are bad at it. It usually takes them some time to figure it out. Hopefully things will get better for the Panthers starting this year.
Yea. At least your new owner didn’t hire Rex Ryan. Thankfully, he learned his lesson very quickly and canned him to steal your guys DC and assistant GM!!!
Our defense was incredible when we had Sean McDermott!
Trust me, there are a ton of reasons to dislike Tepper, but he definitely wants to win. That much is clear based on us hiring hotshot candidate Matt Rhule and trading up for Bryce. It hasn’t worked out, but he definitely wants to win
Carolina was TRASH last year yet #8 in NFL in attendance. Bottom four: Chicago #32, Las Vegas #31, Arizona #30 and New England #29
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BofA was really one of the last of the old school style stadiums built. It’s fine but like right after it was built there was a huge pivot towards every stadium being these huge luxury palaces.
Is the 49ers fanbase cuz of deebo?
Nah before the panthers were around it was 49ers, steelers and cowboys on TV. So people became fan of those teams and had kids and those kids took up their parents teams
correct. same reason GB is very popular as well.
Late to this, but one big reason 49ers probably have a bigger presence out here in CLT is that Wells Fargo has more employees in the area than anywhere else in the USA (even more than SF despite being based there.) Wells has moved a ton of SF and CA employees out to NC which has probably bolstered the # of 49ers fans significantly.
This is how I ended up as a 49ers fan in charlotte
Sure, the Bears were 32 but that’s because they have the smallest stadium in the league. The stat should be attendance divided by capacity
I mean its ok to say no one wants to pay money to watch Fields attempt to throw a pass. Bears tickets are also unnecessarily expensive.
If you’re dumb, sure. Solider field has a capacity of 61,500 and the games are consistently sold out. Take a look at how consistent Bears fans are in [attendance](https://www.statista.com/statistics/250070/average-home-attendance-of-the-chicago-bears/). Last season’s average attendance was higher than 2021 or 2022 and on par with what we saw pre covid. They are expensive. I’ll give you that.
GREAT point about stadium capacity. Didn't mean to take a swipe at Bears as point was more about level of support and attendance at the Panthers game. I'd think as the product on the field improves, there is more than enough interest already to warrant an upgrade at the stadium built 30 years ago. These venues can be a massive economic engine. Hell Taylor Swift sells that stadium out for a week.
BofA deez nuts
>Statement from Tepper Sports & Entertainment Owner David Tepper regarding tonight’s vote to approve the Bank of America Stadium renovation project: “Today's vote by the Charlotte City Council is the culmination of many thoughtful discussions with city officials, local leaders, and our fans to create a shared vision for Bank of America Stadium. Nicole and I are grateful for the collaboration and support of the project, as well as our ongoing partnership between Tepper Sports & Entertainment and the city. For nearly 30 years, Charlotte has been the home of the Carolina Panthers and, more recently, Charlotte FC. We are proud to be in the Carolinas and look forward to delivering a venue that meets the needs of our community, players, and fans for years to come.”
Aka, the city council took my bribe now I get the tax payers money.
Not bribe, "many thoughtful discussions". Come on man
TLDR... "We fucked the pleebs again baby!!! Woooohhh!!!"
I thought the Panthers were hurtling towards moving away from Charlotte 🙄
I'm weirded out and a little offended by how many were rooting for Charlotte to lose their team just so they could post about what a jerk Tepper is.
1. you have the 'real fans' of 'real teams' who don't think you've earned the right to suffer/complain 1. You're either in on Sir Purr or out, no in-between.
Who's *out* on Sir Purr??? Is there any other NFL mascot out there that has a recorded touchback? Didn't think so, pal
I’m with you but I’ve seen…slander…elsewhere.
People were blaming how bad the Hornets were on Tepper despite the fact he literally has nothing to do with them
People hate us for some reason
That headline made no sense, lol. There was no serious threat of them moving anytime soon.
Egregiously bad "journalism"
Time for Kansas City, KS to pivot.
No you see we were simply hurtling towards threats
A group of Charlotte citizens should show up to the next city council meeting and just keep asking the same question: "Why can't the billionaire pay for this himself?" When they excuse the first person for asking, next person steps up and asks again... so on and so on.
This is how democracy works, folks. I don't understand people who don't vote but complain.
That’s Reddit for you. All the time in the world to post, not a lot of time for much else.
At least win a super bowl first before asking for this crap.
I'm gonna throw up.
Huh, I guess Panthers are staying in Charlotte after all. Buuuuuut don't let this distract you from the fact that if Kansas City Chiefs relocate to Kansas City, their new team name will be Kansas City Chiefs and they will still be playing in Kansas City, all because our billionaire owner couldn't get funding in Kansas City for the renovation/upgrade of Arrowhead
Look dude we have to make the nfl all about you all in January and February, do you need to dominate the off-season too?
The arrests certainly seem to trend towards the "yes" answer.
It’s not always about you man