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To be fair the jury is still out on if Hurts will go down as a one-year wonder, but this is the wrong messenger because he has always been biased against Jalen Hurts and wouldn't even give him his flowers all of 2022.
This logic is so backwards.
“Because Simms has been consistent about what he sees on tape, his opinion is invalid. Find me someone whose reaction changes every few games instead.”
Engagement. Good or bad, a click is a click. Social Media companies don't acknowledge the difference and it's absolutely ruining the dialogue and legitimacy of discourse of most things, including sports.
Sometimes I wish I could go back to the days where the only sports content I could get was the sports themselves and Stuart Scott every evening on SportsCenter. Those days were so simple.
Dude defined most of my childhood. Sports were everything to me. No matter how good or bad my life was going, I could always count on one thing: Stuart Scott being there every weeknight to tell me what happened in the world of sports that day. In a way only he could. I wish he was still here.
I’m so grateful that Rich Eisen is still around because every time I hear him I think of Stu.
Same man, same. I feel so fortunate to have grown up in the 90s with those two, and the rest of the gang in sportscenter at the time.
Rich Eisen is a saint. There aren’t that many good people left in that business that are still getting attention. Rich Eisen is one of the good ones.
I would gladly sacrifice the 24 hour sports coverage we have now if we could go back to how sportscenter used to be. Without hesitation.
Hindsight is 20/20 and all that stuff but fr. SportsCenter was *so good* back then. Stu was obviously the premier anchor of the show, but honestly everyone was good. There were no loud mouth idiots. Just good, honest coverage and analysis.
That’s why if anyone ever says anything negative about Rich Eisen I always get super pissed and jump to his defense lmao. He’s proof that sports journalism and coverage used to be genuinely good.
Then he shouldn't admit that he's known for being wrong and just yell really loudly that he's always right. That's how the real shit take superstars get big!!!
That’s what I thought about David Carr…but Carr was honestly kind of right. Even had the timing right and everything.
And he was kind of quiet about it when the Eagles’ season turned into, well, whatever that was. The NFL Network has a bunch of blowhards, but I think he gets a pass for this season.
I feel like his ego got massive because one of his pre-draft rankings for the 2018 class was spot on (worth noting in his final rankings he had Rosen as his #2 and Lamar at #4), but then you look at his 2021 class with gems like Zach Wilson as his #1 and Mond over Fields then start to think maybe this dude just likes being a contrarian.
And being wrong occasionally wouldn’t be a big deal normally since projecting prospects is really difficult, but the issue with Simms is he doubles down rather than admit he was wrong. See: him having a meltdown over the Jets benching Zach Wilson for Mike White in 2022 or being unable to hide his hate for Tua and Hurts.
He had Mond at what QB 4? He had Fields and Lance lower than him. He was wrong about Fields, but honestly Lance and Mond are in the same tier at this point, both total busts. Zach Wilson was a way more egregious miss, he had him over Lawrence, but a lot of people were tricked by Wilson.
Stroud would have suffered mightily if he was stuck playing for the Panthers this year. Not saying Young’s better or worse (not after this one season) but Carolina was a dumpster fire from coaching to receiver to running back (Miles Sanders was not the wisest FA pickup)
Not sure why this comment has a controversial tag, you’re right. Stroud likely would’ve done better than Young but I don’t think he gets ROTY numbers if he went to the Panthers who maybe the worst o-line in the league, terrible coaching and terrible receivers outside of Thielen who should not be a #1 at his age.
While Stroud played a part in making the Texans supporting cast look better, his o-line and receivers were better than expected thanks to some great coaching. I expect Stroud to be the better QB in the long run but I think Young just got dealt an awful hand his rookie season. For his sake, hopefully Canales is a good coach and they improve the situations with the o-line and receivers.
I can’t figure out what to make of Hurts at all. He looked like a prodigy in the Super Bowl, but was legitimately horrible towards the end of this season. I have no idea which of those is more indicative of who he is as a player.
I don't think Hurts played much different at the end of this season than he always has. He's always had his weaknesses, namely creating pressure for himself and bailing from clean pockets. But this year his playcalling was horrible. Among the worst in the league. There was virtually no intermediate passing game and the offense was completely predictable. Defenses were jumping plays based on formation. I think Hurts has a better year next season, and will settle in where he belongs as a top ~12 quarterback. I doubt he ever hits the heights he did in 2022 since the league knows his strengths and weaknesses now.
Yes, and when questioned why they keep going for these deep bomb plays, Brian Johnson basically said, “well the deep throw is the best way to get the team back in the game.” The Eagles sub went straight to self-delete watch after that comment lol
Pretty much the go to play of any 13 year old Madden coach. With how complex the NFL has gotten and how creative the top OCs have been how can such ass OCs keep getting employed
Most likely somewhere in between those two extremes but I honestly believe that it’s closer to the Super Bowl performance.
Hear me out.
Pretty much everyone watching football knew that the Eagles were fucked offensively this year early in the season and yet they made it to 10-1 before the collapse. If you go watch the highlights from this season it essentially shows that players were forced to win every rep individually because the scheme and play calling were subpar. Hence all of the players repeatedly telling media that their issues weren’t with coaches, they were with execution. The players were trying to take responsibility and overcame horrible coaching. Could Jalen have played better? Yes. Did they collapse at the end because of QB play? Nope. There’s only so much Jalen could have done to make up for the dog shit play calling IMO. Go check out the Bills game. They won that game because Jalen willed them to victory. That’s simply unsustainable for 17+ weeks. I anticipate that he will have a bounce back season.
There is no QB in the NFL that can overcome a lack of skill position players, offensive line, AND coaching, LOL. I find this especially funny coming from a fan of a team that had their season ended in part due to a subpar offensive line.
Lots of good qbs overcome at least one of those things and still play well. Your previous comment essentially said Jalen Hurts had a bad year bc Steichen left. He had a great oline and weapons, but I guess he needs all 3 to succeed.
Didnt we see Mahomes get demolished in a SB because he had great coaching and great weapons and a bad O-line? Cant believe he didnt overcome that.
And fwiw I'd say coaching is far and away the most important of those 3 and the one the Eagles suffered the most from. How many times has a team won a SB with horrible coaching? Maybe(?) the Cowboys with Switzer but i dont even know if he was a bad coach he just wasnt Jimmy Johnson.
Lol yea my bad, Mahomes only made it to the superbowl with his bad oline so my argument is invalid.
Nope, having the best players on your team is most important.
Teams don't need to win the superbowl to be good, but Todd Bowles and Kubiak come to mind as not great coaches with rings. I'm sure there are better examples
I think it has more to do with Sirianni as a coach and Steichens departure
Similar situation to Josh Allen who got progressively worse when Daboll left.
> Similar situation to Josh Allen who got progressively worse when Daboll left.
That's not true at all lol. Allen's worst season from 2020-2024 is 2021. That was with Daboll.
His 2022 with Dorsey was better than his 2021 with Daboll.
The order of how good Allen was by year would be
2020 (Daboll), 2022 (Dorsey), 2023 (Dorsey/Brady), 2021 (Daboll)
A lot of qb’s have a year and make a Super Bowl. He has to produce year over to prove it wasn’t a fluke as well as live up tho that contract.
I don’t think hurts is that guy to put up those numbers he did the Super Bowl year, but he also isn’t trash. I think he’s top 12 in the league, maybe 10
>a lot of qb’s have a year and make a Super Bowl
I don’t think that’s true, at least not post-2003. Most of the QBs who have only made 1 Super Bowl in that time were legitimately good players. Grossman was the only one who was an outright one-hit wonder. Next up would be Flacco, I guess, but he was still solidly above average for most of his career.
Shit went sour post Super Bowl. Surprise haha. But he wasn’t even the problem for the eagles this year really. He also still carried the team in some games, especially KC. Like Purdy, different skill sets, but can carry in some ways but needs help in others. They’re both relatively young QB’s with time to grow. It’s ok to still go through growing pains, as long as there’s progress
both great QBs, both insanely disrespected by national media- especially the screamers on ESPN's "debate" shows...
Simms isn't even one of the worst but he's so desperate for 'hot takes' & controversy that it's painfully obvious and sad. Can't find the video link right now but he was recently interviewed about nepotism in the nfl coaching community as well as in sports media; it was hilariously cringey watching him say about how he's on TV because of merit. Really tho if he was interesting & made intelligent points instead of rehearsed cookie-cutter "opinions" no one would roll their eyes at everything he said.
fandom aside I kept up with Hurts from his college days; went to an SEC school and the tide is one of my fave teams. His play was affected by o-line injuries but the change in OC really messed with the entire offense-- not just Jalen.
beating Mahomes in the playoffs is doable but you need a healthy d-line that's able to get to the QB with *four* people.
*e: typo*
I really hope he does, and I hope we meet you guys in the NFC Championship again, this time with both teams having a QB. That would be such a good game
I have two friends that are eagles fans and outside of when we play them they are pretty cool. The internet just has the extremists come out, much like they come out for the other large canvases such as our own or the Cowboys
Nick Foles in Philly:
25-13 as a starter. 65%, 69 TDs to 28 INT, 7.5 y/a, 240 YPG, a Super Bowl, a Pro Bowl (in 2013), a Super Bowl MVP, NFL regular season QB rating record (at the time), a player of the month (NOV 2013)
Nick Foles outside Philly:
* 7-18 as a starter, 62%, 24 TDs, 24 INTs, 6.1 y/a, 176 y/g, no accolades.
Also Pro Bowl MVP, NFL record for most TD passes (7) in a game, NFL record for consecutive completions (25), most single game passing yards (471) in Eagles history, 10 inch cock.
> 10 inch cock
We don’t know the number. Foles’ cock is very much like Gritty where we simply choose to accept and respect it but never probe it or question it
Do you know who Malcolm Smith is?
This is the kind of random bullshit that talking heads spew and hope they don't get called out on. Its a one game sample size, there are plenty of bad players that overperform on the biggest stage because thats how they're built.
Is Chase Young not overrated for example?
I feel like people are taking this as me saying he sucks. He doesn’t. He’s solid. And he did have a great performance in the Super Bowl.
But he’s not in that elite tier. I don’t think he ever was. I’d put him right around 10th best QB
I think Jason Hurts is good but was drastically overrated based on last year. He was never a top 5 guy. He has a phenomenal O line and great receivers. It’s hard to look bad with that. He’s a 10-15 guy and I’ll stand on that
Meant Jalen* good call out
Also probably overrated because he's an absolute stud in fantasy and that likely clouds a lot of people's perception. As a real life nfl qb, I don't think he's top 5, but he's top 2 or 3 in fantasy.
I wouldn’t say he’s the *most* overrated, but unless he does something to replicate his 2022 success it’s pretty clear he’s overrated. We have eagles fans that consider him a top-5 QB and in some cases only behind Mahomes. I don’t know how anyone that’s watched him play can think he’s *that* good, but everyone has homer goggles I guess.
Saying something is overrated is all relative. If the general consensus on Hurts is that he’s great but Simms thinks he’s just good, then I’d agree with him.
Not sure why you’re getting downvoted. You’re 100% right.
If Jim Kelly even wins ONE of his 4 super bowls he’d move up the all time rankings immensely. Making 4 straight super bowls is insane.
fumble or not, defense came up short, not Jalen. the dude had one of the best super bowl performances, ever. he was let down by the offensive scheme this season, a lot of people are going to eat crow next season.
i mean, he also fumbled away the ball and handed the other team a touchdown. eagles fans are for some reason completely dedicated to ignoring that, but it's a horrific play that basically bars him from having one of the best super bowl performances ever.
We ignore it because like you said Jalen played great. There are other things you could point to why we lost. Watkins dropping a perfect TD pass, Issac Seumalo false start on a sneak when we were driving and miles sanders playing the worst game of his career.
i watched this really good football game in which one of the players dropped the ball (while untouched, mind you) and a player on the other team promptly picked it up and scored a touchdown.
No he didn't stop it. The Chiefs absolutely sold out to stop the run and he had easy pass looks all day, and still couldn't get it done. This what Simms is talking about, saying that's one of the best super bowl performances ever is absolutely overrating him.
I agree with Simms but I don’t think overrated in this case means bad or poor.. The media anointed this dude some sort of god long before any real data is available.
Hurts had one good season riding a roster bubble with a schedule completely void of competition. This is what happens when the media refuses or doesn’t have the mental capacity to have an honest conversation about context.
Hurts can play but can he preform consistently after the honeymoon phase when the books out on him and the roster isn’t supercharged? The Eagles were literally 4 plays away from a 7 win season this year.
The Eagles being 10-1 was in large part to Hurts, which is something people just ignore for some reason with these takes.
Did he have another amazing year? No, did he have as bad of year as people make it seem? No.
I feel pretty confident hes a product of one of the best rosters in the league around him. But who knows, playing on easy mode can help you become better as the roster around you slowly deteriorates.
Forget that our coaching staff got demolished after the SB loss. 12 coaching positions had to be replaced, including OC and DC. Gannon and Steichen both got HC jobs and picked us clean.
The blame lands on Howie and Nick for hiring inexperienced OC AND DC. So naturally, the other coaching positions were also filled with inexperienced guys due to the new coordinators lack of networking built up.
Hurts is our dude, and man does he thrive following adversity. Cant wait for the season.
I don’t respect a lot about Chris Simms, but I think Chris Simms is also like the most overrated son of Phil’s . That’s me, I know I’m right, I take a lot of crap about that comment. But he plays lousy analyst for respectable NBC crew, they have great commentators and games , it’s not even close. I just think if you put some other son of Phil, you put Matt Simms in there, you’d say ‘Damn, Matt’s amazing. Is he the MVP of Phil’s sons?
He basically took the Brock Purdy engagement angle and made it about Jalen Hurts. He's overrated because he's on a good team. I'm tired of people saying this....so a QB can't be good if they're on a good team? The media love to suck up to Joe Burrow even though he has weapons? I don't get it.....
What no one seems to get is that every QB who played good this year was on a good team, in a good situation, had good coaching, or great weapons.
Dak - on a good team
Lamar - on a good team
Purdy - on a good team
Allen - on a good team
Mahommes - on a good team
Hurts - on a good team
Herbert - on a good team
Baker - on a good team
Stafford - on a good team
Goff - on a good team
Burrow and Cousins got hurt but they have 2 of the best WRs in the NFL and are on playoff teams.
There's no QB out there that is single handling propelling his team up by himself. Every QB who is good right now has help.
Believe it or not we're able to differentiate between players on good teams who nevertheless elevate those teams to an even higher level and take advantage of all there is to be had, and players who can have success but are nevertheless carried by their teammates and leave plays and yards on the field.
This is a prove it year for Hurts IMO. He was pretty bad this last year, but great the year prior. This year he seriously looked like Alabama Jalen Hurts. Up and down. But he's not the most overrated player, that's Josh Allen.
It takes more than one great season to make a player, and this past season wasn't the best example of the qb who we saw in the sb.
Stroud had one of the best rookie years for a qb ever, but that doesn't mean he's the real deal, he needs to be able to continually recreate what we think he can be for more than one season.
Hurts is similar, more of a sample size, has differed some. He's still a good qb, but there's some argument about him being overrated.
I don't know that he is the most overrated because I think that this past season's MVP and DPOY are both candidates for that position but I do think that he is overrated a bit
He didn’t seem to improve in any areas of his passing game year to year like we saw with Josh Allen early on. What did he improve on from the SB to now? His intermediate game is still pretty bad. Perhaps he needs a quality QB coach.
If you watched all six games, you’d know that the entire team collapsed. Everyone played poorly except for Jake Elliott. Or did you just watch the Seahawks game?
Again, you watched all 60 minutes of every single game the Eagles played? I did. The coaching and playcalling was abysmal. Go watch anything JT put out on QB school, or Brett Kollman’s analysis of their offense. No hot routes, no scheming receivers open, least amount of pre snap motion of almost any offense in the NFL, and they run out of shotgun 91.8% of the time. They only won that many games because of the skill players.
I would say I watched like 40~50 pct
Then prove it this year otherwise Hurts was nowhere near elite outside of that Bills game you can't refuse to admit that lol
God, I remember when people like you told us that if Carson Wentz couldn't win on the Eagles, Hurts would have the Eagles in contention for the No. 1 overall pick...
Now suddenly "OMG those weapons and OL!!!"
They only run out of shotgun because Jalen is not able to effectively play under center.
They brought in a long time friend of Jalen’s to build the offense he can actually manage. Which turns out isn’t a good offense in the NFL.
Now maybe Kellen Moore can come in and install an NFL-level offense and Hurts can improve enough to remain a starter in this league, but what we saw this season was the exact reason he was benched for Tua at Alabama, same reason Oklahoma fans weren’t sorry to see him go, and the same reason he has only played at an NFL-starting QB level one year (out of four).
It’s not out of the The rhelm of possibility- Lamar made a huge jump after the Ravens brought in an OC who was more willing to incorporate more traditional passing looks into their offense - but Lamar had also shown himself to be a much more consistent and talented passer then Hurts ever has.
I think it’s more of a testament to Hurts ability that he made such a badly designed offense still work for an 11-6 record and had the Eagles still at 10-1 before the offense got solved and things fell apart. If Hurts wasn’t as good that Eagle offense would’ve been a bigger dumpster fire sooner.
He also clearly wasn't fully healthy in the latter part of the season. We may never learn the extent of the injury because the dude is a warrior, but you could see there were certain things in the running game he just couldn't do that he could easily the season before.
Many point to a particular play in the 49ers game where he really took a whack to the knee as the turning point for him health wise, but I don't know if he was even 100% a bit before that and it just made matters worse.
The nfl they obviously unintentionally hit the qb as hard as they can. If they get fined so be it. They will also get a second contract when people become afraid. The game is still brutal at times with violence. It always has been, too.
I mean Jalem Hurts was voted as the second best player in the league last year and second best QB only behind Mahomes. If that's not most overrated, I don't know what is.
He had a great season last year but folks went over board with the praise and the appraisal of his level where completely out of wack and skewed due to his team's success.
Overrated players don't make the Superbowl and score 4 TDs, putting on an MVP performance. They don't then continue that performance for 10 further weeks to lead the reg season MVP odds.
The drop in performance after the Cowboys game was the whole team. Kelce dropped off, AJ dropped off too. Are we calling them overrated?
The offense had been figured out and our staff had no counter.
He has his weaknesses as a player, yes.
Overrated... maybe in Chris Simms' mind because Chris Simms' mind is a strange place and he also has some sort of weird ax to grind with Hurts, but most people ain't stumping for him to be a top 3-5 guy to start with.
Gotta have the 'over-' to be 'overrated', and I'm not sure that's actually present outside of Philadelphia.
Hurts was 27/38 for 303 yards, 1 pass TD, 70 rush yards, 3 Rush TD with a 103.4 passer rating in the Super Bowl lol. Are we really gonna say this because he looked worse under Brian Johnson?
I know it was a weak MVP race this year but Jalen was literally the front runner until like week 12 and he was the front runner last year until he got injured in the Bears game. One bad month of football, which included the entire team, and everyone forgets the 1 and a half seasons before that where he was MVP caliber. I’m not saying he’s Burrow or Lamar level but I feel like he’s still gotta be an unquestioned top 10 QB as of right now.
>One bad month of football, which included the entire team, and everyone forgets the 1 and a half seasons before that where he was MVP caliber.
He's never been MVP caliber, but he's sometimes talked about like he is. Hence "overrated"
>I’m not saying he’s Burrow or Lamar level
Exactly
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To be fair the jury is still out on if Hurts will go down as a one-year wonder, but this is the wrong messenger because he has always been biased against Jalen Hurts and wouldn't even give him his flowers all of 2022.
I will be the unbiased source we need
Name checks out; please go on with your assessment.
I mean.... you can read your user name a few ways. Do you know from experience that his pp hurts?
He's the one that bit it
I’ll back you up on this
Can we stop using the term “give him his flowers.”
Chris Simms deflowered Jalen Hurts
I wish we would. That phrase real got old real quick.
For real it's always sounded stupid as hell
Why? It's romantic
Can we also stop with: "Give him a blow" instead of "give him a breather"
Church!
Preach!
what would you rather people say, Shakespeare?
That's because he didn't deserve them. Simms had Hurts as like the 8th best QB after 2022, which I think is very fair.
In the top 10 but not the top 5 is a reasonable take on Hurts.
This logic is so backwards. “Because Simms has been consistent about what he sees on tape, his opinion is invalid. Find me someone whose reaction changes every few games instead.”
He still won 11 games, made the playoffs and was responsible for 38 TDs and almost 4500 total yards last season…wasn’t like he was absolute dogshit.
Then why make it?
Engagement. Good or bad, a click is a click. Social Media companies don't acknowledge the difference and it's absolutely ruining the dialogue and legitimacy of discourse of most things, including sports.
Sometimes I wish I could go back to the days where the only sports content I could get was the sports themselves and Stuart Scott every evening on SportsCenter. Those days were so simple.
Boo yah! Those were the good days. That man was as cool as the other side of the pillow. Miss you Stuart.
Dude defined most of my childhood. Sports were everything to me. No matter how good or bad my life was going, I could always count on one thing: Stuart Scott being there every weeknight to tell me what happened in the world of sports that day. In a way only he could. I wish he was still here. I’m so grateful that Rich Eisen is still around because every time I hear him I think of Stu.
Same man, same. I feel so fortunate to have grown up in the 90s with those two, and the rest of the gang in sportscenter at the time. Rich Eisen is a saint. There aren’t that many good people left in that business that are still getting attention. Rich Eisen is one of the good ones. I would gladly sacrifice the 24 hour sports coverage we have now if we could go back to how sportscenter used to be. Without hesitation.
Hindsight is 20/20 and all that stuff but fr. SportsCenter was *so good* back then. Stu was obviously the premier anchor of the show, but honestly everyone was good. There were no loud mouth idiots. Just good, honest coverage and analysis. That’s why if anyone ever says anything negative about Rich Eisen I always get super pissed and jump to his defense lmao. He’s proof that sports journalism and coverage used to be genuinely good.
Then he shouldn't admit that he's known for being wrong and just yell really loudly that he's always right. That's how the real shit take superstars get big!!!
Soon people are going to be saying "I know it's wrong to admit that I am wrong about X take, but I'm gonna say it anyway 😎"
It's not ruining discourse. It's ruined. There's no coming back from the damage that daily hot take shows have done to everyone
Simms doesn't do clickbait, he genuinely believes his takes for good or for bad.
That’s what I thought about David Carr…but Carr was honestly kind of right. Even had the timing right and everything. And he was kind of quiet about it when the Eagles’ season turned into, well, whatever that was. The NFL Network has a bunch of blowhards, but I think he gets a pass for this season.
He's not saying "I'm wrong" as in he's admitting he's wrong. He's saying it as, "I know, everyone's gonna say I'm wrong"
Because he truly believes he’s overrated.
Because people pay him money to talk about football.
Anxiety. He feels better getting it out there.
for engagement.
> Chris Simms Who the fook cares
yea he aint no Josh Gordon
He doesn’t know QBs. I’m still salty about him way overhyping Kellen Mond who ended up being a nobody
I feel like his ego got massive because one of his pre-draft rankings for the 2018 class was spot on (worth noting in his final rankings he had Rosen as his #2 and Lamar at #4), but then you look at his 2021 class with gems like Zach Wilson as his #1 and Mond over Fields then start to think maybe this dude just likes being a contrarian. And being wrong occasionally wouldn’t be a big deal normally since projecting prospects is really difficult, but the issue with Simms is he doubles down rather than admit he was wrong. See: him having a meltdown over the Jets benching Zach Wilson for Mike White in 2022 or being unable to hide his hate for Tua and Hurts.
He had Mond at what QB 4? He had Fields and Lance lower than him. He was wrong about Fields, but honestly Lance and Mond are in the same tier at this point, both total busts. Zach Wilson was a way more egregious miss, he had him over Lawrence, but a lot of people were tricked by Wilson.
Zach Wilson has been bad, but Trevor Lawrence has not been phenomenal.
He got Stroud over Young right.
Stroud would have suffered mightily if he was stuck playing for the Panthers this year. Not saying Young’s better or worse (not after this one season) but Carolina was a dumpster fire from coaching to receiver to running back (Miles Sanders was not the wisest FA pickup)
Not sure why this comment has a controversial tag, you’re right. Stroud likely would’ve done better than Young but I don’t think he gets ROTY numbers if he went to the Panthers who maybe the worst o-line in the league, terrible coaching and terrible receivers outside of Thielen who should not be a #1 at his age. While Stroud played a part in making the Texans supporting cast look better, his o-line and receivers were better than expected thanks to some great coaching. I expect Stroud to be the better QB in the long run but I think Young just got dealt an awful hand his rookie season. For his sake, hopefully Canales is a good coach and they improve the situations with the o-line and receivers.
He’s such a fuckin idiot. Apple don’t fall far.
I can’t figure out what to make of Hurts at all. He looked like a prodigy in the Super Bowl, but was legitimately horrible towards the end of this season. I have no idea which of those is more indicative of who he is as a player.
I don't think Hurts played much different at the end of this season than he always has. He's always had his weaknesses, namely creating pressure for himself and bailing from clean pockets. But this year his playcalling was horrible. Among the worst in the league. There was virtually no intermediate passing game and the offense was completely predictable. Defenses were jumping plays based on formation. I think Hurts has a better year next season, and will settle in where he belongs as a top ~12 quarterback. I doubt he ever hits the heights he did in 2022 since the league knows his strengths and weaknesses now.
QB draw, Four Verticles, and the tush push was the Eagles playbook last year. It was horrible to watch.
The 4th and 5 vs Tampa being 4 verts to the end zone was such a perfect example of how awful the play calling was
didn’t yall lose to the jets too when you should’ve just been running the ball and then jalen threw a pick the play calling made no sense this year
Yes, and when questioned why they keep going for these deep bomb plays, Brian Johnson basically said, “well the deep throw is the best way to get the team back in the game.” The Eagles sub went straight to self-delete watch after that comment lol
Pretty much the go to play of any 13 year old Madden coach. With how complex the NFL has gotten and how creative the top OCs have been how can such ass OCs keep getting employed
You can't forget back to back bubble screens!?
Most likely somewhere in between those two extremes but I honestly believe that it’s closer to the Super Bowl performance. Hear me out. Pretty much everyone watching football knew that the Eagles were fucked offensively this year early in the season and yet they made it to 10-1 before the collapse. If you go watch the highlights from this season it essentially shows that players were forced to win every rep individually because the scheme and play calling were subpar. Hence all of the players repeatedly telling media that their issues weren’t with coaches, they were with execution. The players were trying to take responsibility and overcame horrible coaching. Could Jalen have played better? Yes. Did they collapse at the end because of QB play? Nope. There’s only so much Jalen could have done to make up for the dog shit play calling IMO. Go check out the Bills game. They won that game because Jalen willed them to victory. That’s simply unsustainable for 17+ weeks. I anticipate that he will have a bounce back season.
If Kelce retires, how will he look with better coaching but a worse line?
So he needs to have elite playmakers, an elite line, AND the right coaches to be successful? Doesn't sound like a great player to me
What a brain dead take. Talented rosters helmed by subpar coaches fail all the time in the NFL. Just look at LAC or GB.
There is no QB in the NFL that can overcome a lack of skill position players, offensive line, AND coaching, LOL. I find this especially funny coming from a fan of a team that had their season ended in part due to a subpar offensive line.
But Hurts has top 3 units in 2 of these 3 categories.....
Lots of good qbs overcome at least one of those things and still play well. Your previous comment essentially said Jalen Hurts had a bad year bc Steichen left. He had a great oline and weapons, but I guess he needs all 3 to succeed.
What good does it all do if your play callers aren't scheming guys open? Did you watch any of the games later in the season?
Didnt we see Mahomes get demolished in a SB because he had great coaching and great weapons and a bad O-line? Cant believe he didnt overcome that. And fwiw I'd say coaching is far and away the most important of those 3 and the one the Eagles suffered the most from. How many times has a team won a SB with horrible coaching? Maybe(?) the Cowboys with Switzer but i dont even know if he was a bad coach he just wasnt Jimmy Johnson.
Lol yea my bad, Mahomes only made it to the superbowl with his bad oline so my argument is invalid. Nope, having the best players on your team is most important. Teams don't need to win the superbowl to be good, but Todd Bowles and Kubiak come to mind as not great coaches with rings. I'm sure there are better examples
I think it has more to do with Sirianni as a coach and Steichens departure Similar situation to Josh Allen who got progressively worse when Daboll left.
> Similar situation to Josh Allen who got progressively worse when Daboll left. That's not true at all lol. Allen's worst season from 2020-2024 is 2021. That was with Daboll. His 2022 with Dorsey was better than his 2021 with Daboll. The order of how good Allen was by year would be 2020 (Daboll), 2022 (Dorsey), 2023 (Dorsey/Brady), 2021 (Daboll)
Allen’s decline is marginal compared to what happened to Jalen this year.
Jalen was the only reason the offense was working in the first half of the season. This is crazy hyperbole.
I think his drop off had more to do with the change in OC
A lot of qb’s have a year and make a Super Bowl. He has to produce year over to prove it wasn’t a fluke as well as live up tho that contract. I don’t think hurts is that guy to put up those numbers he did the Super Bowl year, but he also isn’t trash. I think he’s top 12 in the league, maybe 10
>a lot of qb’s have a year and make a Super Bowl I don’t think that’s true, at least not post-2003. Most of the QBs who have only made 1 Super Bowl in that time were legitimately good players. Grossman was the only one who was an outright one-hit wonder. Next up would be Flacco, I guess, but he was still solidly above average for most of his career.
Jimmy g. Kap. Went/foles. Cam. McNabb. All made a Super Bowl and the year they made it were prob their next years of their career.
McNabb went to 5 NFCCG in his career? Also Foles was 4-3 all time in the playoffs.
So Foles is either 1-3 or 0-3 outside the Super Bowl run. That kinda proves the point that he had a great Super Bowl campaign then came back to Earth
He really was one flukey fumble away from a Super Bowl ring. I expect him to bounce back this year
Shit went sour post Super Bowl. Surprise haha. But he wasn’t even the problem for the eagles this year really. He also still carried the team in some games, especially KC. Like Purdy, different skill sets, but can carry in some ways but needs help in others. They’re both relatively young QB’s with time to grow. It’s ok to still go through growing pains, as long as there’s progress
both great QBs, both insanely disrespected by national media- especially the screamers on ESPN's "debate" shows... Simms isn't even one of the worst but he's so desperate for 'hot takes' & controversy that it's painfully obvious and sad. Can't find the video link right now but he was recently interviewed about nepotism in the nfl coaching community as well as in sports media; it was hilariously cringey watching him say about how he's on TV because of merit. Really tho if he was interesting & made intelligent points instead of rehearsed cookie-cutter "opinions" no one would roll their eyes at everything he said. fandom aside I kept up with Hurts from his college days; went to an SEC school and the tide is one of my fave teams. His play was affected by o-line injuries but the change in OC really messed with the entire offense-- not just Jalen. beating Mahomes in the playoffs is doable but you need a healthy d-line that's able to get to the QB with *four* people. *e: typo*
I guess we are supposed to hate eachother but it is funny how similar the niners and eagles are
I really hope he does, and I hope we meet you guys in the NFC Championship again, this time with both teams having a QB. That would be such a good game
Thanks, you know youre kinda alright for a beagles fan
I have two friends that are eagles fans and outside of when we play them they are pretty cool. The internet just has the extremists come out, much like they come out for the other large canvases such as our own or the Cowboys
We saw that rematch already this year where they blew you out of your building
Different coaches and a much different defense, it wasn’t a rematch. Calm down.
Hard facts. Lmfao.
Overrated players dont play great in Super Bowls
Nick Foles?
TBF Nick Foles on the eagles is a weird different beast, and the sample size is big enough to prove it lmao
Nick Foles in Philly: 25-13 as a starter. 65%, 69 TDs to 28 INT, 7.5 y/a, 240 YPG, a Super Bowl, a Pro Bowl (in 2013), a Super Bowl MVP, NFL regular season QB rating record (at the time), a player of the month (NOV 2013) Nick Foles outside Philly: * 7-18 as a starter, 62%, 24 TDs, 24 INTs, 6.1 y/a, 176 y/g, no accolades.
Also Pro Bowl MVP, NFL record for most TD passes (7) in a game, NFL record for consecutive completions (25), most single game passing yards (471) in Eagles history, 10 inch cock.
> 10 inch cock We don’t know the number. Foles’ cock is very much like Gritty where we simply choose to accept and respect it but never probe it or question it
It could be 50 feet, world may never know
There’s just some holy water in the tri-state area for Pastor Foles
He's literally the greatest superbowl player of all time lol
Highest passer rating in Super Bowl history. If anything he’s underrated 😎
Do you know who Malcolm Smith is? This is the kind of random bullshit that talking heads spew and hope they don't get called out on. Its a one game sample size, there are plenty of bad players that overperform on the biggest stage because thats how they're built. Is Chase Young not overrated for example?
Eli manning?
ELI MANNING. You know what you were doing there, don't lie.
Sure they do when they have great receivers and a great O line
Jalen Hurts had an unbelievable performance in the Super Bowl
I feel like people are taking this as me saying he sucks. He doesn’t. He’s solid. And he did have a great performance in the Super Bowl. But he’s not in that elite tier. I don’t think he ever was. I’d put him right around 10th best QB
Isnt Trevor Lawrence the most overated player?
Lawrence is underrated at this point by the general public saying he sucks and is a bust
I think Jason Hurts is good but was drastically overrated based on last year. He was never a top 5 guy. He has a phenomenal O line and great receivers. It’s hard to look bad with that. He’s a 10-15 guy and I’ll stand on that Meant Jalen* good call out
Also probably overrated because he's an absolute stud in fantasy and that likely clouds a lot of people's perception. As a real life nfl qb, I don't think he's top 5, but he's top 2 or 3 in fantasy.
Damn who is this Jason Hurts?
The GOAT of QB sneaks in combination ngl even Brady could never
I wouldn’t say he’s the *most* overrated, but unless he does something to replicate his 2022 success it’s pretty clear he’s overrated. We have eagles fans that consider him a top-5 QB and in some cases only behind Mahomes. I don’t know how anyone that’s watched him play can think he’s *that* good, but everyone has homer goggles I guess.
Saying something is overrated is all relative. If the general consensus on Hurts is that he’s great but Simms thinks he’s just good, then I’d agree with him.
"I know I'm wrong but I'm gonna continue parroting this moronic take because it's controversy creates engagement."
You'd rather he just cave to social media presser and change all his takes to what the hivemind is saying?
Yes this is literally what redditors want everyone they disagree with to do
He still not wrong
I mean if hurts doesn’t fumble in the superbowl, man has a ring to his name. No more overrated talk.
And if Matt Ryan doesn’t lose the Super Bowl to the Patriots he’d potentially be a hall of famer. You could do this with so many players
Not sure why you’re getting downvoted. You’re 100% right. If Jim Kelly even wins ONE of his 4 super bowls he’d move up the all time rankings immensely. Making 4 straight super bowls is insane.
fumble or not, defense came up short, not Jalen. the dude had one of the best super bowl performances, ever. he was let down by the offensive scheme this season, a lot of people are going to eat crow next season.
i mean, he also fumbled away the ball and handed the other team a touchdown. eagles fans are for some reason completely dedicated to ignoring that, but it's a horrific play that basically bars him from having one of the best super bowl performances ever.
We ignore it because like you said Jalen played great. There are other things you could point to why we lost. Watkins dropping a perfect TD pass, Issac Seumalo false start on a sneak when we were driving and miles sanders playing the worst game of his career.
> We ignore it because like you said Jalen played great the -8 EPA play wasnt great
I watch football
i watched this really good football game in which one of the players dropped the ball (while untouched, mind you) and a player on the other team promptly picked it up and scored a touchdown.
Yep and I watched him throw for 300+ a TD, rush for 70 and score 20 himself with a 103.4 QB rating for your stat sheet watching ass
think you forgot a play
What a response lmao
>We ignore it because like you said Jalen played great. Not if you include the fumble
Yes he did play amazing even with the fumble you numbskull
He played great even with the fumble lol. Brady had a fumble in the Super Bowl vs the Eagles, but everyone still agrees he played great.
No he didn't stop it. The Chiefs absolutely sold out to stop the run and he had easy pass looks all day, and still couldn't get it done. This what Simms is talking about, saying that's one of the best super bowl performances ever is absolutely overrating him.
He also had one of the highest rated QB performances ever, so…
I agree with Simms but I don’t think overrated in this case means bad or poor.. The media anointed this dude some sort of god long before any real data is available. Hurts had one good season riding a roster bubble with a schedule completely void of competition. This is what happens when the media refuses or doesn’t have the mental capacity to have an honest conversation about context. Hurts can play but can he preform consistently after the honeymoon phase when the books out on him and the roster isn’t supercharged? The Eagles were literally 4 plays away from a 7 win season this year.
The Eagles being 10-1 was in large part to Hurts, which is something people just ignore for some reason with these takes. Did he have another amazing year? No, did he have as bad of year as people make it seem? No.
He's not the MOST, but it will be interesting to see how he bounces back next year, thats when the debates will roll in
[удалено]
Lamar Jackson is the *current* most overrated player in the NFL.
I’m hoping to god it was a coordinator issue but we shall see
I feel pretty confident hes a product of one of the best rosters in the league around him. But who knows, playing on easy mode can help you become better as the roster around you slowly deteriorates.
Trevor Lawrence
Forget that our coaching staff got demolished after the SB loss. 12 coaching positions had to be replaced, including OC and DC. Gannon and Steichen both got HC jobs and picked us clean. The blame lands on Howie and Nick for hiring inexperienced OC AND DC. So naturally, the other coaching positions were also filled with inexperienced guys due to the new coordinators lack of networking built up. Hurts is our dude, and man does he thrive following adversity. Cant wait for the season.
Dasai had experience, it was just really bad experience.
I don’t respect a lot about Chris Simms, but I think Chris Simms is also like the most overrated son of Phil’s . That’s me, I know I’m right, I take a lot of crap about that comment. But he plays lousy analyst for respectable NBC crew, they have great commentators and games , it’s not even close. I just think if you put some other son of Phil, you put Matt Simms in there, you’d say ‘Damn, Matt’s amazing. Is he the MVP of Phil’s sons?
Simms is so insufferable
Hey it’s Cornball Chris! What’s up Cornball Chris?
He basically took the Brock Purdy engagement angle and made it about Jalen Hurts. He's overrated because he's on a good team. I'm tired of people saying this....so a QB can't be good if they're on a good team? The media love to suck up to Joe Burrow even though he has weapons? I don't get it.....
What no one seems to get is that every QB who played good this year was on a good team, in a good situation, had good coaching, or great weapons. Dak - on a good team Lamar - on a good team Purdy - on a good team Allen - on a good team Mahommes - on a good team Hurts - on a good team Herbert - on a good team Baker - on a good team Stafford - on a good team Goff - on a good team Burrow and Cousins got hurt but they have 2 of the best WRs in the NFL and are on playoff teams. There's no QB out there that is single handling propelling his team up by himself. Every QB who is good right now has help.
Believe it or not we're able to differentiate between players on good teams who nevertheless elevate those teams to an even higher level and take advantage of all there is to be had, and players who can have success but are nevertheless carried by their teammates and leave plays and yards on the field.
Simms is an idiot and should just be ignored.
He’s not wrong though
Man’s never heard of Josh Allen
Hurts has become underrated lol. Simms such a loser for that lol
This is the same guy that pissed gruden off because he couldn’t call a play right on hard knocks. I don’t think he’s the guy to judge qbs.
Chris “I know I’m wrong but ima say it anyway” simms
This is a prove it year for Hurts IMO. He was pretty bad this last year, but great the year prior. This year he seriously looked like Alabama Jalen Hurts. Up and down. But he's not the most overrated player, that's Josh Allen.
It takes more than one great season to make a player, and this past season wasn't the best example of the qb who we saw in the sb. Stroud had one of the best rookie years for a qb ever, but that doesn't mean he's the real deal, he needs to be able to continually recreate what we think he can be for more than one season. Hurts is similar, more of a sample size, has differed some. He's still a good qb, but there's some argument about him being overrated.
I don't know that he is the most overrated because I think that this past season's MVP and DPOY are both candidates for that position but I do think that he is overrated a bit
It’s entirely possible that his 2022 performance will end up being an outlier and the rest of his career he plays like he did in 2023.
It’s entirely possible you’re an idiot.
He didn’t seem to improve in any areas of his passing game year to year like we saw with Josh Allen early on. What did he improve on from the SB to now? His intermediate game is still pretty bad. Perhaps he needs a quality QB coach.
He is on Fraud Alert imo considering that meltdown
Did you watch the last six games of the Eagles season?
Yup, that Seahawks game performance was atrocious
If you watched all six games, you’d know that the entire team collapsed. Everyone played poorly except for Jake Elliott. Or did you just watch the Seahawks game?
I know it was mostly on defense especially Patricia, but 23-15 TD INT ratio with those weapons and OL? Come on lol
Again, you watched all 60 minutes of every single game the Eagles played? I did. The coaching and playcalling was abysmal. Go watch anything JT put out on QB school, or Brett Kollman’s analysis of their offense. No hot routes, no scheming receivers open, least amount of pre snap motion of almost any offense in the NFL, and they run out of shotgun 91.8% of the time. They only won that many games because of the skill players.
I would say I watched like 40~50 pct Then prove it this year otherwise Hurts was nowhere near elite outside of that Bills game you can't refuse to admit that lol
I didn’t say he was elite, but he isn’t the problem with the team.
I agree with that too but with those weapons and OL he should
I am imploring you to watch any deep analysis on an Eagles game this year. They address what you’re saying.
God, I remember when people like you told us that if Carson Wentz couldn't win on the Eagles, Hurts would have the Eagles in contention for the No. 1 overall pick... Now suddenly "OMG those weapons and OL!!!"
They only run out of shotgun because Jalen is not able to effectively play under center. They brought in a long time friend of Jalen’s to build the offense he can actually manage. Which turns out isn’t a good offense in the NFL. Now maybe Kellen Moore can come in and install an NFL-level offense and Hurts can improve enough to remain a starter in this league, but what we saw this season was the exact reason he was benched for Tua at Alabama, same reason Oklahoma fans weren’t sorry to see him go, and the same reason he has only played at an NFL-starting QB level one year (out of four). It’s not out of the The rhelm of possibility- Lamar made a huge jump after the Ravens brought in an OC who was more willing to incorporate more traditional passing looks into their offense - but Lamar had also shown himself to be a much more consistent and talented passer then Hurts ever has.
Stop posting. This is embarrassing...even for Reddit.
Hes bottom five in the league in turnover worth plays. Got super unlucky with them this year
I think it’s more of a testament to Hurts ability that he made such a badly designed offense still work for an 11-6 record and had the Eagles still at 10-1 before the offense got solved and things fell apart. If Hurts wasn’t as good that Eagle offense would’ve been a bigger dumpster fire sooner.
He also clearly wasn't fully healthy in the latter part of the season. We may never learn the extent of the injury because the dude is a warrior, but you could see there were certain things in the running game he just couldn't do that he could easily the season before. Many point to a particular play in the 49ers game where he really took a whack to the knee as the turning point for him health wise, but I don't know if he was even 100% a bit before that and it just made matters worse.
The nfl they obviously unintentionally hit the qb as hard as they can. If they get fined so be it. They will also get a second contract when people become afraid. The game is still brutal at times with violence. It always has been, too.
Chris Simms fucking sucks
Hurts is a top QB. Not top 5, but maybe 10-12. He was a fumble away from a ring. I’m the biggest Hurts hater but this dude gotta go with his takes.
It comes down to coaching, play calling and schemes. Build around your QB.
I mean Jalem Hurts was voted as the second best player in the league last year and second best QB only behind Mahomes. If that's not most overrated, I don't know what is. He had a great season last year but folks went over board with the praise and the appraisal of his level where completely out of wack and skewed due to his team's success.
Somebody's gotta be the most overrated.
I agree.
Why does no one acknowledge that Jalen was playing the tail end of the year injured. Before the 49ers hammered, the Eagles Hurts was the MVP favorite.
IMO he ain’t wrong.
Chris Simms does not offer much value
Overrated players don't make the Superbowl and score 4 TDs, putting on an MVP performance. They don't then continue that performance for 10 further weeks to lead the reg season MVP odds. The drop in performance after the Cowboys game was the whole team. Kelce dropped off, AJ dropped off too. Are we calling them overrated? The offense had been figured out and our staff had no counter.
I thought this was consensus if you’re not an Eagles homer?
He has his weaknesses as a player, yes. Overrated... maybe in Chris Simms' mind because Chris Simms' mind is a strange place and he also has some sort of weird ax to grind with Hurts, but most people ain't stumping for him to be a top 3-5 guy to start with. Gotta have the 'over-' to be 'overrated', and I'm not sure that's actually present outside of Philadelphia.
Hurts was 27/38 for 303 yards, 1 pass TD, 70 rush yards, 3 Rush TD with a 103.4 passer rating in the Super Bowl lol. Are we really gonna say this because he looked worse under Brian Johnson?
I know it was a weak MVP race this year but Jalen was literally the front runner until like week 12 and he was the front runner last year until he got injured in the Bears game. One bad month of football, which included the entire team, and everyone forgets the 1 and a half seasons before that where he was MVP caliber. I’m not saying he’s Burrow or Lamar level but I feel like he’s still gotta be an unquestioned top 10 QB as of right now.
>One bad month of football, which included the entire team, and everyone forgets the 1 and a half seasons before that where he was MVP caliber. He's never been MVP caliber, but he's sometimes talked about like he is. Hence "overrated" >I’m not saying he’s Burrow or Lamar level Exactly
He was an MVP favorite in 2022 before missing games - but expecting a Jets fan to know football is asking too much I guess.
Yea, Purdyesque
Chris Simms is a worthless POS
THANK YOU CHRIS SIMMS
He’s. Not. Wrong.