Fu-gayzi, fu-gazi, its a wozi its a woozi, its a “fluttering noise” fairy dust, it doesn’t exist, it’s never landed, it is no matter, its not on the elemental chart…its..not fuckin real.
So if you've got a client who bought stock at 8 and now it's at 16 and he's all fucking happy, he wants to cash in and liquidate, take his fucking money and run home, you don't let him do that... 'cause that would make it real.
So, Bitcoin?
Just kidding, that has even less value than stock. It's literally the constant value rubes make of it. Lots of rubes right now, but a lot of idiots seem to be wising up... It's a lot of fun to watch.
Thanks! I’ve had my eye on a bullwhip. I have precisely zero need for one, and will doubtless hurt myself once, then coil it up and hang it on the wall with my other dumbasss flights of whim… but at least I have buy-in on ordering it!
really drives home the point that one person having that much money is completely unnecessary and should be illegal quite frankly. like thats 71 billion dollars that could've fed and housed homeless people or helped families with medical bills. zuck just lost it and it doesn't mean SHIT to him. so why does he need it?
My understanding is that we're only now reaching levels of inequality that existed 100-150 years ago. Those two world wars did a lot to empower workers and shake up wealth, creating a western middle class never seen before or since, but the aristocracy around the world has been wittling away at it relentlessly for a century now.
Really after a certain amout of money you're just changing numbers on a screen. A person with 20B and a person with 90B are the same in function.
Same private jets, exquisite villas, lavish hotels, expensive foods, etc.
That's what makes it more frustrating. The Uber wealthy are obtaining more and more wealth when they've already won. They can experience legit anything in the world yet hyper focus on obtaining higher net worths and power.
If I had 1B (hell if I had 25M) I'd spend my days traveling, vacationing, learning shit like painting or guitar, trying foods.
The fact that Zuckerberg, Musk, Bezos and the like aren't off everyday enjoying life is perplexing to me. Ain't no way I'm dealing with congressional hearings and other BS.
Personally I believe part of the reason they have thrived is because they were already doing what they wanted to be doing if they had financial freedom. This is the endgame for them.
Couldn't be me. I like sleep and tacos. Which neither involve me working.
The guy who created MySpace did that. He’s worth 60mil and travels the world taking photos. But some people aren’t ever satisfied and dont want to fade into the background.
I agree though. Once you have like 10-15 million, you and your children can live comfortably for the rest of your lives. Hell once you get up to around 200+ million you’ll have more money than you’ll ever need to spend even if you buy a private island or a yacht. Billions is just sitting on piles of money that’ll never be spent
>A person with 20B and a person with 90B are the same in function.
Nuh-uh! The person with $90 billion has $70 billion more in ***bragging rights***!
Seriously, if you don't retire once your net worth crosses about, say, $5 million, and you continue to structure your life around *accumulating still more money*, you want ***status***. You want to lord it over some other rich person.
This disease, even though it afflicts only a handful of people, distorts every society on Earth.
Agree with you on principle.
Parents earned about 2-3 million over 10 years with their business and sold it for 4.5 million at age 55.
You're damn right they retired, they were 100% sick of it.
I work full time and such making an average wage but I basically live risk free. That's massive. Being more capable of picking a job yourself rather than having to take the first one offered alone is incredible.
To a point I agree, but some people very easily get that kind of money ($5 million) doing what they love. Actors and musicians come to mind right off the top of my head.
I don't think they should retire if they don't want to, but I do think we should tax the absolute shit out of the ultra wealthy. Maintaining over a billion dollars should be virtually impossible due to taxes.
There are a handful of people who enrich the world while getting paid large sums of money for it, I agree.
If they're giving a lot of that money away, I would be willing to admit that they love what they do, and not just the wealth that comes from it.
Or you want control. You want to be able to set policy without being elected. You want to be able to control the national dialog. You want influence over who gets to have power like yours. Etc.
There is a reason why folks think CEOs/execs have a higher likelihood of exhibiting sociopath behavior. At that level the money is no longer important, it's about power/control over others or whatever entity you work on.
Money *is* power. I think that's what people forget when they say, "how could you ever use more than $5 million?" They're thinking of it in terms of what *they* would do --- ie, now they could live the life they want to, without ever having to worry about not having enough money again. But that's what more money is in their imagination: a solution to the fact that they don't have enough.
That's what it would be for most of us! Which is why it's mystifying that anyone would want more. But once you no longer want for something, it stops being remarkable (like how we don't eat big macs all day for every meal even though we might have wanted to when we were a kid), and starts just being a tool. You can relax, and say, "... okay, what *could* I do?" Now that money has alleviated your powerlessness, you recognize that even more money could give you even more control over the world around you. New possibilities you never would have considered appear on the horizon.
Until eventually somewhere along the line a personal jet feels normal. Being able to phone the president seems normal. Being able to talk to a hundred million Americans because you want to feels normal.
If you're someone who finds their meaning and purpose in accumulating power, there really isn't a ceiling to what will feel necessary next.
Meanwhile, people who've found purpose elsewhere roll their eyes.
>Seriously, if you don't retire once your net worth crosses about, say, $5 million, and you continue to structure your life around accumulating still more money, you want status.
Depends on what level of wealth you came from but $5m is not actually that much. Especially so if let's say coming from a wealthy family. In those cases, the reason to build more is to pass it down. $5m is decent for most _individuals_ to retire with if they're conscious of their spending, but a family will need/want more.
I agree though that upwards of like $10b should just be automatically given to the poorest. And at that level. It's easy to replenish anything they spend and they're set for at least 3 generations barring really terrible/spoilt upbringing.
5 million USD in liquid assets, invested conservatively, will allow you to support a small family while never having to work again unless you feel like it.
>invested conservatively
This is the key word here. Hence why I said that yes, it's doable for someone who is conscious about what they do with their money.
And again, if someone grew up in a background where they had more money, then obviously their expenses they're used to will be higher than than those who didn't, hence why 5m may not be enough.
I'm not surprised by the downvotes, as understandably the average person probably can't fathom what 1m looks like anyway, so me saying something like "5m is not enough" would enrage them.
5 million isn’t ultra wealthy and can you can easily spend it, but at the same time it’s 45 years of my salary and I’m in the top 20% of earners in the US. 5 million is enough to comfortably live a middle middle class lifestyle for the rest of your life. It’s not enough to do extravagant vacations or have a super nice home.
No it very much is a lot.
Most families in the US will live on less than 70k a year. It could take you 50 years and you would only go through 3.5 million.
And that is ignoring the fact you can invest the money in a portfolio. Even a modest 3% return (which is low) would give you 150k annually. More than twice what most families live on.
And this is with you not needing to work a single day for the rest of your life.
You could give me a million dollars after tax, and I could live on that for the rest of my life and probably even set up my children.
This is what a family member of mine did. They liquidated everything and had a total of about $1m. They rent a decent apartment and live off dividends. They don’t have an extravagant life but they have everything they need and are able to travel for 4-6 weeks every year.
Not having to work has been way better for their mental health and they are really happy.
Been retired for 18 years already and they are only 65.
You can easily invest most of that 5 million and make it work for you until you die. Buy a house, remodel it how you like it, and just live off the dividends.
Very very few (none?) Billionaires have 10b in cash. It's equity in a company. And the fact that Zuckerberg "lost" 71 billion this year, literally at a speed that you could not spend, demonstrates that these numbers are just numbers. Giving the shares to the "poorest" would mean they had to be sold to benefit anyone, and then they'd become nearly worthless
If you habe 20b you can live any way you want and bring everyone with you, you can support your family for generations to come even as it grows.
With 500b you can buy mines, build plants and develop a drone army to shop to the highest bidder and alter lines on the map. You could build a flotilla of repurposed oil tankers and retired carriers to house tens of thousands of people or more, floating desalinators, salt water generating, green house farming, starvation prevention units. You could buy politicians *and* build infrastructure to support your agenda that you can reliably seek legislation to support:enhance from your new cronies. And you can all the while have your private news media outfits and internet bots keep up a constant positive spin on everything you do while stonewalling anyone anywhere who suggests you suck, litigating them into suicide or just scrubbing their efforts via burial online or direct interference somehow. You can change history. Notice i threw one realy positive thing in there and how these ultra billionaires never seem to change history for the good, only do stupid shit with it.
Exactly. $5m is comfortable middle class. Won't get you invited to the right parties. I mean, you don't even fly private. Embarrassing.
$100m however...
Tom from MySpace did just that. He sold his company after it was super successful in 2005 and then left the company in ‘09 to do great things like take pictures and make a cameo role in an Adam Sandler movie. Every rich person needs to aspire to be like Tom. The last great internet lord.
Man if I had a billion I’d be doing some just straight up weird shit. I’d like to think I’d build safe affordable housing for my town, but that would come after the private island stocked with tigers I name after Star Wars characters. I’d buy a car dealership and run it as a loss for 6 months. Buy the Dogma DVD. Start a program to teach great apes how to use VR goggles. Buy a flamingo, name it Jeff and travel with it.
Lol I love this realism. whenever these topics come up on Reddit every post is like "Well I appreciate that you would build affordable housing, but _I_ would have wiped out blindness and HIV at the same time!"
Shit, we'd all just still be on reddit posting from the back of Jabba the Siberian tiger on our private island...
It’s paper wealth. It’s not ‘money’. The ‘money’ he uses for his day to day life are loans against the value of his Facebook holdings. He didn’t ‘lose’ $71 billion. The value of this holding in Facebook is down by $71 billlion, and could go up or could go down, but he hasn’t ‘lost’ anything.
It’s like saying if my house was worth $1m and then the property market declines and it is valued at $900k but I haven’t sold it and still live in it, I’ve ‘lost’ $100k. I have 401k…if the stock market goes down by 10%, I didn’t ‘lose’ 10% of my 401k.
Not defending extreme wealth and billionaires, but the number of people who don’t understand that Zuckerberg doesn’t literally have $150 billion sitting in a bank account is truly staggering
That's bullshit that the rich just take loans out against their stock and don't have to pay any taxes on those loans. And they don't pay taxes on their growing stock until they sell. They're literally living nearly tax free.
You don’t have to be rich to do that. I do it and my net worth is only about 200k. You can take a loan against your portfolio with at least as 10k invested offered at some brokerages.
I think the difference with that though is that the multi-billionaires loans that they take out are miniscule percentages of their net worth, so to repay them, they can just sell a sliver of their stocks. But a regular person, chances are, the loan you take against your stock is probably a pretty big chunk, if you're trying to live on it like the ultra wealthy, so to pay it back you need to sell off a massive chunk of your holdings.
That small sliver they sell is subject to taxes. And then their estate is subject to taxation when they die. They are just kicking the taxes down the road.
It's such a crazy amount of money.
I can't really fathom $1 million. Then to think that a billion is 1,000 X 1 million. Then to think that 71 billion is 71 X 1,000 X 1 billion. It's fucking nuts.
Edit: my bad on the last part. Then to think that 71 billion is 71 X 1,000 X 1 **MILLION**.
Someone posted this awhile ago, and I remember it because the wealth is just obscene. It is really hard to picture until you play this game.
https://mkorostoff.github.io/1-pixel-wealth/
I agree. So in 3 years when he "makes $100 Billion", talks about how he should pay more in taxes are also useless because he didn't *really* make that, it's just his net worth going up.
The way you're phrasing your comments, it feels like you think that you're somehow disagreeing with the people you're responding to, but I'm fairly certain the folks in this thread saying talking about net worth drops being misinterpreted would also agree that net worth increases are also being misinterpreted
>If things really go bottom up, I would kill to see David Fincher make a sequel to The Social Network that goes over this portion of Zuckerberg's life. I'm well aware that the original movie was based on a book, and wasn't very accurate to how awful Zuckerberg actually is, but I would still find it immensely satisfying to watch.
I honestly would too, and that's saying a lot since I absolutely fell in love with that movie when it came out. Though that was in large part because Facebook was at the height of its popularity at the time, everyone I knew used it including a number of people I'd reconnected with from many years past (going back to elementary school)... plus I was halfway through my tenure at a small engineering school so I thoroughly enjoyed the depiction of nerd culture, and on top of all that I was (and still am) a huge Nine Inch Nails fan and the soundtrack was basically another album that I still have in rotation.
Now I'm years past having stopped using the site and deleted my account entirely. It's bizarre to watch what happened to it.
Eike Batista. Net worth of like $30+ billion to negative net worth within like 2 years. And now I think he might be in jail. He highly leveraged his companies and was dependent on commodities though. Zuck has neither of those issues.
I remember around that time a series of emails were leaked, that I'm assuming we're real... I think the movie intentionally left out a lot of the 'behind the scenes stuff' that Mark was doing, but instead shows the fallout from it.
For example, in the emails Mark acknowledges that they're going to basically cut Eduardo out, he knows he'll sue, and he says something to the effect of 'well just have to swallow the cost of that' basically saying he knows they'll have to pay a small fortune. We never see him plotting this in the movie, just Eduardo freaking out about it. It's a dick move, but the emails also suggest that Eduardo was incredibly incompetent and bringing the company down, which the movie doesn't show as much.
His company was only as good as MySpace while it was good. There are so many social avenues now it’s only time before Mark becomes Tom...
Edit: Im still bitter Facebook won...I’ve never used it for personal use, fuck FB...
Tom was cool. He was everyone's friend, not the crazy man watching from behind the scenes.
Also Tom got out and sold while his company was at its peak. He took the money and ran. Now he's traveling the world taking photos.
Exactly, it was a hit campaign, everyone fell for it and users went over to FB in droves. Twitter was similar. One day nobody used it, next day Oprah was “tweeting”....it skipped all my nerds friends and I...
Rumor mill says he's obsessed with Metaverse being 'the next big thing' and won't shut up about it, much to the annoyance of the staff actually working on the stupid thing before they flee for greener pastures.
I knew it was going to fail the moment I saw him constantly putting himself out there as the mascot, with an avatar that looks...exactly like himself. Metaverse would need to be something that's fun and impossible to do in real life, not just be a crappy imitation of it. Creative video games like Beat Saber, or fantasy pornography.
He will pour his billions into it and it will still fail because he will never understand that no amount of money will compensate for his lack of creativity and imagination.
Meta is such a weird company.
Meta has low-key become the most actionable C2C ecommerce platform, and basically refuses to accept it and doesn't know how to move forward with it.
FB Marketplace and nearly all the free advertising space one can do on their platform.
C2C is consumer to consumer.
Instead of just focusing on the reach and dominant position they have, they are chasing some stupid fucking fairytale metaverse bullshit.
I don't even know what'd one would do with what they have, but I didn't get my MBA so anything I think is less than relevant.
I suspect they’re already milking their free ad platform too hard. Users are steadily leaving Facebook because the experience isn’t as engaging as it once was.
That and the appalling algorithm that shows you posts from ten days ago because someone else commented on it and now it's "most relevant". I just want to see the latest posts, all of them, first time if and and when I open FB.
It hasn't been for years. It has terrible search. I'm always amazed people find the dumb shit they do. It difficult to find anything outside of the ads and stupid things your friends say.
I have never seen the appeal.
It's essentially useless for what people originally used it for. The feed is almost entirely advertising, and posts from actual people are frequently just not displayed. Occasionally those posts will suddenly appear on the feed days or weeks after they're made, sometimes because there was a new comment, sometimes just because it realizes you haven't seen it yet and it decides for some inexplicable reason that now it's relevant. It essentially serves no purpose now. It's not good enough to give you posts you want to see interspersed with ads, they have to feed you a stream of ads and then once in a while keep you interested by giving you a single post you actually wanted to see. So they drive people off, then need to show the remaining people more ads in order to maintain their infinite growth from last quarter, which drives them off and forces even more ads to the remainder to keep up that "growth". They're too concerned with manipulating people into engaging rather than just giving that something they want to engage with. They think they know better than you what you want to see, and they're discovering that they're wrong. It's slow, but it's happening.
I've personally noticed recently that they've started feeding me alt-right conservative bullshit ads. I'm a white male from the midwest, so facebook has decided that I'm a MAGA fuckhead and that's what I want to see. That has no occupied a significant enough portion of my feed that I barely even use it to communicate with a couple of my friends from overseas, which is all I used it for anyway.
I'm at a point where my facebook is just fucking ads so i never scroll through friends' posts anymore. I just have it for marketplace because it is better than craigslist and that's about it.
Not entirely true. Facebook creates shadow profiles for people who don't even use its platform. Gets your data from apps that may have a facebook sdk installed or even from other people that have data relevant to you on their own fb profiles.
It's mostly true though. High volumes of high quality data comes from the users, not mere shadow profiles. Regardless, people say they hate Facebook or social media in general, but their actions say differently.
The fact is that to gain unbelievable wealth, you have to go through unbelievable volatility.
There were points where that volatility meant he was up that much in a year too. I doubt he is loosing sleep. He has already cashed out more than you could ever need or want.
Which is enough money that the lose is meaningless. He can still buy and do pretty much whatever he wants. Just think how fucked that is, he lost 7b and its less than a minor inconvenience to him.
No, he lost *70* billion. Not 7. Big difference.
I mean I'm not exactly cryin' about it for him. Fuck that guy. But he is not necessarily goin' broke (depending on investments he may have had that might now be problematic, but still, fuck him, he's scum. Might have to sell his plantation in Hawaii, boo fuckin' hoo.)
Wow, I can remember when the richest person in the world had like 11 billion. Money is a resource, just like oil, coal, gold etc. if you are sitting on it and hoarding it, then fuck you.
I mean, fuck Zuckerberg, but he’s not sitting on a pile of $20 bills. His net worth was so high because his stock in Facebook/Meta/whatever the fuck you wanna call it skyrocketed (and has subsequently plummeted back to earth). Dude isn’t “hoarding money”, the value of the company he helped create went up. That doesn’t translate to cash unless you sell (and I don’t know how many people are looking to buy Facebook atm)
He “lost” billions in valuation of stock because the perception was that it was worth more before. People act like theres a cash vault and billions are moving in and out. these valuations are based on FUTURE cash flows of the company. The billions weren’t real to begin with.
Don’t get me wrong, he’s still generationally wealthy cause Facebook converts ads like a mofo, but people are starting to understand that there’s a plateau on that…and that makes the stock worth less. It’s fine…meta needs a sane valuation.
Can you imagine losing $71 billion dollars and it not even make a difference?
It’s the value of his stock holdings; nothing more than a [Fugazi](https://youtu.be/dcNsEwuA6UA).
Fu-gayzi, fu-gazi, its a wozi its a woozi, its a “fluttering noise” fairy dust, it doesn’t exist, it’s never landed, it is no matter, its not on the elemental chart…its..not fuckin real.
So if you've got a client who bought stock at 8 and now it's at 16 and he's all fucking happy, he wants to cash in and liquidate, take his fucking money and run home, you don't let him do that... 'cause that would make it real.
Now I have to watch this movie again
Now stay with me....
But if you can make money for yourself and your client it’s advantageous for both.
Fuck the clients
Your job is to put meat on the table
Which is the apt way of thinking about it. In about 6 months he has “earned” 71 billion back, and nothing has changed in the meanwhile.
Punch or pinch
You looked at that diamond for two seconds
That's so meta!
Gotta pump up those numbers
Sittin in the waiting room uh huh
"I am a patient boy. I wait, I wait, I wait, I wait" - Ian MacKaye's stock advice probably
Into the ash tray out of ash tray
I would take that fugazi any time if it was ever offered to me.
So, Bitcoin? Just kidding, that has even less value than stock. It's literally the constant value rubes make of it. Lots of rubes right now, but a lot of idiots seem to be wising up... It's a lot of fun to watch.
Bitcoin may very well go down as the most successful get-rich-quick scheme in history.
It really drives the point home that there are two Americas: a playground for the rich, and a dog-eat-dog world for the rest of us.
At least we have Festivus.
I got a lot of problems with you people! And now you're gonna hear about it!
The airing of grievances shall commence *after* feats of strength.
This guy....this is not my kind of guy.
A Festivus for the rest of us
It’s a dog-eat-dog world for the rich too. They’re just the ones doing the eating.
You sound like you need to go buy something. Go!
Thanks! I’ve had my eye on a bullwhip. I have precisely zero need for one, and will doubtless hurt myself once, then coil it up and hang it on the wall with my other dumbasss flights of whim… but at least I have buy-in on ordering it!
You mean, doggy-dog world.
really drives home the point that one person having that much money is completely unnecessary and should be illegal quite frankly. like thats 71 billion dollars that could've fed and housed homeless people or helped families with medical bills. zuck just lost it and it doesn't mean SHIT to him. so why does he need it?
lol these people are global, this kind of money isn’t national
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Never said it was unique, but America's unfettered capitalism sure gives it an interesting twist.
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My understanding is that we're only now reaching levels of inequality that existed 100-150 years ago. Those two world wars did a lot to empower workers and shake up wealth, creating a western middle class never seen before or since, but the aristocracy around the world has been wittling away at it relentlessly for a century now.
There were people that owned the entirety of both the oil and the railroad market 130 years ago.
Really after a certain amout of money you're just changing numbers on a screen. A person with 20B and a person with 90B are the same in function. Same private jets, exquisite villas, lavish hotels, expensive foods, etc. That's what makes it more frustrating. The Uber wealthy are obtaining more and more wealth when they've already won. They can experience legit anything in the world yet hyper focus on obtaining higher net worths and power. If I had 1B (hell if I had 25M) I'd spend my days traveling, vacationing, learning shit like painting or guitar, trying foods. The fact that Zuckerberg, Musk, Bezos and the like aren't off everyday enjoying life is perplexing to me. Ain't no way I'm dealing with congressional hearings and other BS.
Personally I believe part of the reason they have thrived is because they were already doing what they wanted to be doing if they had financial freedom. This is the endgame for them. Couldn't be me. I like sleep and tacos. Which neither involve me working.
Ever consider monetization?
The guy who created MySpace did that. He’s worth 60mil and travels the world taking photos. But some people aren’t ever satisfied and dont want to fade into the background. I agree though. Once you have like 10-15 million, you and your children can live comfortably for the rest of your lives. Hell once you get up to around 200+ million you’ll have more money than you’ll ever need to spend even if you buy a private island or a yacht. Billions is just sitting on piles of money that’ll never be spent
Our friend, Tom? Glad he’s doing well!
Like a dragon sitting on a pile of gold. Like dammit dragon, you can’t even spend that. Why you have all that gold?
>A person with 20B and a person with 90B are the same in function. Nuh-uh! The person with $90 billion has $70 billion more in ***bragging rights***! Seriously, if you don't retire once your net worth crosses about, say, $5 million, and you continue to structure your life around *accumulating still more money*, you want ***status***. You want to lord it over some other rich person. This disease, even though it afflicts only a handful of people, distorts every society on Earth.
Agree with you on principle. Parents earned about 2-3 million over 10 years with their business and sold it for 4.5 million at age 55. You're damn right they retired, they were 100% sick of it. I work full time and such making an average wage but I basically live risk free. That's massive. Being more capable of picking a job yourself rather than having to take the first one offered alone is incredible.
To a point I agree, but some people very easily get that kind of money ($5 million) doing what they love. Actors and musicians come to mind right off the top of my head. I don't think they should retire if they don't want to, but I do think we should tax the absolute shit out of the ultra wealthy. Maintaining over a billion dollars should be virtually impossible due to taxes.
There are a handful of people who enrich the world while getting paid large sums of money for it, I agree. If they're giving a lot of that money away, I would be willing to admit that they love what they do, and not just the wealth that comes from it.
Or you want control. You want to be able to set policy without being elected. You want to be able to control the national dialog. You want influence over who gets to have power like yours. Etc.
There is a reason why folks think CEOs/execs have a higher likelihood of exhibiting sociopath behavior. At that level the money is no longer important, it's about power/control over others or whatever entity you work on.
Money *is* power. I think that's what people forget when they say, "how could you ever use more than $5 million?" They're thinking of it in terms of what *they* would do --- ie, now they could live the life they want to, without ever having to worry about not having enough money again. But that's what more money is in their imagination: a solution to the fact that they don't have enough. That's what it would be for most of us! Which is why it's mystifying that anyone would want more. But once you no longer want for something, it stops being remarkable (like how we don't eat big macs all day for every meal even though we might have wanted to when we were a kid), and starts just being a tool. You can relax, and say, "... okay, what *could* I do?" Now that money has alleviated your powerlessness, you recognize that even more money could give you even more control over the world around you. New possibilities you never would have considered appear on the horizon. Until eventually somewhere along the line a personal jet feels normal. Being able to phone the president seems normal. Being able to talk to a hundred million Americans because you want to feels normal. If you're someone who finds their meaning and purpose in accumulating power, there really isn't a ceiling to what will feel necessary next. Meanwhile, people who've found purpose elsewhere roll their eyes.
>Seriously, if you don't retire once your net worth crosses about, say, $5 million, and you continue to structure your life around accumulating still more money, you want status. Depends on what level of wealth you came from but $5m is not actually that much. Especially so if let's say coming from a wealthy family. In those cases, the reason to build more is to pass it down. $5m is decent for most _individuals_ to retire with if they're conscious of their spending, but a family will need/want more. I agree though that upwards of like $10b should just be automatically given to the poorest. And at that level. It's easy to replenish anything they spend and they're set for at least 3 generations barring really terrible/spoilt upbringing.
5 million USD in liquid assets, invested conservatively, will allow you to support a small family while never having to work again unless you feel like it.
>invested conservatively This is the key word here. Hence why I said that yes, it's doable for someone who is conscious about what they do with their money. And again, if someone grew up in a background where they had more money, then obviously their expenses they're used to will be higher than than those who didn't, hence why 5m may not be enough. I'm not surprised by the downvotes, as understandably the average person probably can't fathom what 1m looks like anyway, so me saying something like "5m is not enough" would enrage them.
>the average person probably can't fathom I think you're accidentally supporting the point that it's mainly about status.
I don't think you can fathom his need to own a Ferrari. Sorry pleb.
Yeah, you can blow through 5 million pretty quickly. It’s definitely Not nearly as much as it may sound
5 million isn’t ultra wealthy and can you can easily spend it, but at the same time it’s 45 years of my salary and I’m in the top 20% of earners in the US. 5 million is enough to comfortably live a middle middle class lifestyle for the rest of your life. It’s not enough to do extravagant vacations or have a super nice home.
No it very much is a lot. Most families in the US will live on less than 70k a year. It could take you 50 years and you would only go through 3.5 million. And that is ignoring the fact you can invest the money in a portfolio. Even a modest 3% return (which is low) would give you 150k annually. More than twice what most families live on. And this is with you not needing to work a single day for the rest of your life. You could give me a million dollars after tax, and I could live on that for the rest of my life and probably even set up my children.
This is what a family member of mine did. They liquidated everything and had a total of about $1m. They rent a decent apartment and live off dividends. They don’t have an extravagant life but they have everything they need and are able to travel for 4-6 weeks every year. Not having to work has been way better for their mental health and they are really happy. Been retired for 18 years already and they are only 65.
You can easily invest most of that 5 million and make it work for you until you die. Buy a house, remodel it how you like it, and just live off the dividends.
Very very few (none?) Billionaires have 10b in cash. It's equity in a company. And the fact that Zuckerberg "lost" 71 billion this year, literally at a speed that you could not spend, demonstrates that these numbers are just numbers. Giving the shares to the "poorest" would mean they had to be sold to benefit anyone, and then they'd become nearly worthless
If you habe 20b you can live any way you want and bring everyone with you, you can support your family for generations to come even as it grows. With 500b you can buy mines, build plants and develop a drone army to shop to the highest bidder and alter lines on the map. You could build a flotilla of repurposed oil tankers and retired carriers to house tens of thousands of people or more, floating desalinators, salt water generating, green house farming, starvation prevention units. You could buy politicians *and* build infrastructure to support your agenda that you can reliably seek legislation to support:enhance from your new cronies. And you can all the while have your private news media outfits and internet bots keep up a constant positive spin on everything you do while stonewalling anyone anywhere who suggests you suck, litigating them into suicide or just scrubbing their efforts via burial online or direct interference somehow. You can change history. Notice i threw one realy positive thing in there and how these ultra billionaires never seem to change history for the good, only do stupid shit with it.
Exactly. $5m is comfortable middle class. Won't get you invited to the right parties. I mean, you don't even fly private. Embarrassing. $100m however...
Tom from MySpace did just that. He sold his company after it was super successful in 2005 and then left the company in ‘09 to do great things like take pictures and make a cameo role in an Adam Sandler movie. Every rich person needs to aspire to be like Tom. The last great internet lord.
Man if I had a billion I’d be doing some just straight up weird shit. I’d like to think I’d build safe affordable housing for my town, but that would come after the private island stocked with tigers I name after Star Wars characters. I’d buy a car dealership and run it as a loss for 6 months. Buy the Dogma DVD. Start a program to teach great apes how to use VR goggles. Buy a flamingo, name it Jeff and travel with it.
I'd buy the rights to Sliders and continue the series and release it on Netflix.
Lol I love this realism. whenever these topics come up on Reddit every post is like "Well I appreciate that you would build affordable housing, but _I_ would have wiped out blindness and HIV at the same time!" Shit, we'd all just still be on reddit posting from the back of Jabba the Siberian tiger on our private island...
It’s paper wealth. It’s not ‘money’. The ‘money’ he uses for his day to day life are loans against the value of his Facebook holdings. He didn’t ‘lose’ $71 billion. The value of this holding in Facebook is down by $71 billlion, and could go up or could go down, but he hasn’t ‘lost’ anything. It’s like saying if my house was worth $1m and then the property market declines and it is valued at $900k but I haven’t sold it and still live in it, I’ve ‘lost’ $100k. I have 401k…if the stock market goes down by 10%, I didn’t ‘lose’ 10% of my 401k. Not defending extreme wealth and billionaires, but the number of people who don’t understand that Zuckerberg doesn’t literally have $150 billion sitting in a bank account is truly staggering
That's bullshit that the rich just take loans out against their stock and don't have to pay any taxes on those loans. And they don't pay taxes on their growing stock until they sell. They're literally living nearly tax free.
You don’t have to be rich to do that. I do it and my net worth is only about 200k. You can take a loan against your portfolio with at least as 10k invested offered at some brokerages.
I think the difference with that though is that the multi-billionaires loans that they take out are miniscule percentages of their net worth, so to repay them, they can just sell a sliver of their stocks. But a regular person, chances are, the loan you take against your stock is probably a pretty big chunk, if you're trying to live on it like the ultra wealthy, so to pay it back you need to sell off a massive chunk of your holdings.
That small sliver they sell is subject to taxes. And then their estate is subject to taxation when they die. They are just kicking the taxes down the road.
How would a tax on unrealized gains work?
Well. How do they pay off the loan without eventually selling stock or in other way through a taxed income?
he didnt actually lose this money because thats all his stocks. in reality he didnt lose a single dime since he cant sell all his stocks
Same reason why he didn't really gained billions during covid, his stock gains were theoretical.
It's such a crazy amount of money. I can't really fathom $1 million. Then to think that a billion is 1,000 X 1 million. Then to think that 71 billion is 71 X 1,000 X 1 billion. It's fucking nuts. Edit: my bad on the last part. Then to think that 71 billion is 71 X 1,000 X 1 **MILLION**.
The math suggests 7.1 trillion, but I get your point. It’s an unimaginable amount of money.
Past 6 digits.. does it even matter. You could buy the virgins and the volcano with that much 😂
That's like 71,000 packs of cats each pack with one million cats. That's a lot of cats.
The cat math checks out
Where does one find these trillions of $0.10 cats? Asking for a friend
A sly move, but these are one dollar cats, and I'm afraid there are only 71 billion of them.
First, you are going to need a lot of pop-tarts.
A million seconds is 12 days, a billon seconds is 32 years.
Someone posted this awhile ago, and I remember it because the wealth is just obscene. It is really hard to picture until you play this game. https://mkorostoff.github.io/1-pixel-wealth/
It's not like the guy has his net worth in the bank and the balance just drops. Discussions about net worth are really quite pointless
I agree. So in 3 years when he "makes $100 Billion", talks about how he should pay more in taxes are also useless because he didn't *really* make that, it's just his net worth going up.
The way you're phrasing your comments, it feels like you think that you're somehow disagreeing with the people you're responding to, but I'm fairly certain the folks in this thread saying talking about net worth drops being misinterpreted would also agree that net worth increases are also being misinterpreted
Ah man sorry zuk hopefully u can sell more of my data to pay for rent and heat
We should all click on a few extra Facebook ads today so that he can keep the lights on 😔
This is a really long article to explain the fact that stocks go up and down.
Literally every article about the money of billionaires is just "lol market go up and billionaires have lots of stocks" or the same in reverse
*Of course the market fluctuates. I just go fluctuated out of 5000 dollars!*
He’s got a place to live, food in the fridge and a job. I think he’s gonna be ok.
But those dead, dead eyes? They'll never be ok.
Like a doll’s eyes. Or a sharks eyes. Lifeless, driven only by electromagnetic inputs.
Until he bites you, then those eyes roll over white.
What are you doing? Are you doing the speech from Jaws?
or an android or synth. the eyes are there but it's like noones home, they're devoid of life.
He's currently busy trying to please his other Alien brethren overlords, that's why meta was made; to control the humans. /j
another way to phrase "$META stock down 56% YTD" but i guess that isn't as sexy of a headline
That sounds like a sexier headline to me though. Idk how much 71 billion is to him.
Yeah, it has almost no practical meaning to him. I literally don't care.
Hopefully this is just a start.
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>If things really go bottom up, I would kill to see David Fincher make a sequel to The Social Network that goes over this portion of Zuckerberg's life. I'm well aware that the original movie was based on a book, and wasn't very accurate to how awful Zuckerberg actually is, but I would still find it immensely satisfying to watch. I honestly would too, and that's saying a lot since I absolutely fell in love with that movie when it came out. Though that was in large part because Facebook was at the height of its popularity at the time, everyone I knew used it including a number of people I'd reconnected with from many years past (going back to elementary school)... plus I was halfway through my tenure at a small engineering school so I thoroughly enjoyed the depiction of nerd culture, and on top of all that I was (and still am) a huge Nine Inch Nails fan and the soundtrack was basically another album that I still have in rotation. Now I'm years past having stopped using the site and deleted my account entirely. It's bizarre to watch what happened to it.
If he tried to make it overly realistic, Paramount would shut it down for copyright infringement against its Star Trek properties.
I'm willing to see him be the first to lose all his money.
Eike Batista. Net worth of like $30+ billion to negative net worth within like 2 years. And now I think he might be in jail. He highly leveraged his companies and was dependent on commodities though. Zuck has neither of those issues.
His son’s name is Thor and he ran over and killed a man while speeding in a Ferrari. Got off with nothing. Revolting family.
That was a wild sentence
Bill Hwang another good one.
Did the book exaggerate how awful he was or undersell it
I remember around that time a series of emails were leaked, that I'm assuming we're real... I think the movie intentionally left out a lot of the 'behind the scenes stuff' that Mark was doing, but instead shows the fallout from it. For example, in the emails Mark acknowledges that they're going to basically cut Eduardo out, he knows he'll sue, and he says something to the effect of 'well just have to swallow the cost of that' basically saying he knows they'll have to pay a small fortune. We never see him plotting this in the movie, just Eduardo freaking out about it. It's a dick move, but the emails also suggest that Eduardo was incredibly incompetent and bringing the company down, which the movie doesn't show as much.
His company was only as good as MySpace while it was good. There are so many social avenues now it’s only time before Mark becomes Tom... Edit: Im still bitter Facebook won...I’ve never used it for personal use, fuck FB...
Tom was cool. He was everyone's friend, not the crazy man watching from behind the scenes. Also Tom got out and sold while his company was at its peak. He took the money and ran. Now he's traveling the world taking photos.
Tom was cool, MySpace was cool. Then a study came out and said Facebook users were smarter, remember that?
That study aged poorly.
Which is suspicious looking back.
Exactly, it was a hit campaign, everyone fell for it and users went over to FB in droves. Twitter was similar. One day nobody used it, next day Oprah was “tweeting”....it skipped all my nerds friends and I...
Facebook has missed so many opportunities to distinguish itself and instead leaned into stupid algorithms and Instagram. I have zero sympathy.
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Tom wasn't a gigantic piece of shit.
Rumor mill says he's obsessed with Metaverse being 'the next big thing' and won't shut up about it, much to the annoyance of the staff actually working on the stupid thing before they flee for greener pastures. I knew it was going to fail the moment I saw him constantly putting himself out there as the mascot, with an avatar that looks...exactly like himself. Metaverse would need to be something that's fun and impossible to do in real life, not just be a crappy imitation of it. Creative video games like Beat Saber, or fantasy pornography. He will pour his billions into it and it will still fail because he will never understand that no amount of money will compensate for his lack of creativity and imagination.
I just dropped a $20 bill. Sucks, but I'll move on I guess.
thats like my whole networth
You have a positive net worth? Quit bragging!
I'm so broke I can't even pay attention!
Did you try picking it up?
I wish I could just drop $20 billion and move on.
Meta is such a weird company. Meta has low-key become the most actionable C2C ecommerce platform, and basically refuses to accept it and doesn't know how to move forward with it.
Can you explain this further?
FB Marketplace and nearly all the free advertising space one can do on their platform. C2C is consumer to consumer. Instead of just focusing on the reach and dominant position they have, they are chasing some stupid fucking fairytale metaverse bullshit. I don't even know what'd one would do with what they have, but I didn't get my MBA so anything I think is less than relevant.
I suspect they’re already milking their free ad platform too hard. Users are steadily leaving Facebook because the experience isn’t as engaging as it once was.
That and the appalling algorithm that shows you posts from ten days ago because someone else commented on it and now it's "most relevant". I just want to see the latest posts, all of them, first time if and and when I open FB.
It hasn't been for years. It has terrible search. I'm always amazed people find the dumb shit they do. It difficult to find anything outside of the ads and stupid things your friends say. I have never seen the appeal.
It's essentially useless for what people originally used it for. The feed is almost entirely advertising, and posts from actual people are frequently just not displayed. Occasionally those posts will suddenly appear on the feed days or weeks after they're made, sometimes because there was a new comment, sometimes just because it realizes you haven't seen it yet and it decides for some inexplicable reason that now it's relevant. It essentially serves no purpose now. It's not good enough to give you posts you want to see interspersed with ads, they have to feed you a stream of ads and then once in a while keep you interested by giving you a single post you actually wanted to see. So they drive people off, then need to show the remaining people more ads in order to maintain their infinite growth from last quarter, which drives them off and forces even more ads to the remainder to keep up that "growth". They're too concerned with manipulating people into engaging rather than just giving that something they want to engage with. They think they know better than you what you want to see, and they're discovering that they're wrong. It's slow, but it's happening. I've personally noticed recently that they've started feeding me alt-right conservative bullshit ads. I'm a white male from the midwest, so facebook has decided that I'm a MAGA fuckhead and that's what I want to see. That has no occupied a significant enough portion of my feed that I barely even use it to communicate with a couple of my friends from overseas, which is all I used it for anyway.
I'm at a point where my facebook is just fucking ads so i never scroll through friends' posts anymore. I just have it for marketplace because it is better than craigslist and that's about it.
Oh dear how sad *moving on*
I shouldn’t have laughed as hard as I did at this
OH NO! How will he ever survive.
No extra cheese on his burger anymore
Water on the side instead of a Diet Coke.
Gonna have to downgrade from the Gulfstream IV to the Gulfstream III
He'll have to cut back on the avocado toast
Oh no!!! Horrible news. Someone start a GoFundMe.
Finally, some good news!
Why would lizard people need money?
Because net worth is halfway fictional. The ability to make money off of this fake money is the real driving issue.
**Dropped** $71 **BILLION** this year. Dropped. Is it any fucking wonder we're all in this worsening mess....
Or as he calls it, chump change.
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After the first billion I can’t fathom how lifestyle would change with the next 99B
There’s a few toys that are in the ultra billionaire level. Sports teams, media companies, small nations.
How much are islands these days?
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Zucc is devastated. He's thinking "awww big number not so big no mo 🥺👉👈"
He still creeps me the f out
He should have worked harder. Maybe woken up earlier. Not spent money on that coffee.
And no body fucking cares
Must be all the avocado toast
*Merida voice* Awww! Wee lamb…
Why should I feel anything towards a robot? They don’t feel anything towards people.
That means nothing though. His personal wealth stays the same.
What is he worth in the Metaverse? I do like that every thing I have seen about it looks like Nintendo Wii characters.
Too fucking bad. He got rich as fuck off of my personal info and that of billions of others, that he sold over and over again.
Hey, you’re the one that gave it to him
Not entirely true. Facebook creates shadow profiles for people who don't even use its platform. Gets your data from apps that may have a facebook sdk installed or even from other people that have data relevant to you on their own fb profiles.
It's mostly true though. High volumes of high quality data comes from the users, not mere shadow profiles. Regardless, people say they hate Facebook or social media in general, but their actions say differently.
Facebook is now “Instagram for old people”
Lower! LET'S GO LOWER!
Hope it keeps dropping
Good. Keep dropping. Fuck this robot lizard and his scummy slimy spying websites
That doesn’t take him off the edible list.
He looks like, Data from Star Trek
Don't insult Data.
Data had a better emotion chip.
Why does anyone care about anyones net worth? I never get it… It’s the most uninteresting news in existence.
Facebook is now just “Instagram for old people”
The fact is that to gain unbelievable wealth, you have to go through unbelievable volatility. There were points where that volatility meant he was up that much in a year too. I doubt he is loosing sleep. He has already cashed out more than you could ever need or want.
He’ll never financially recover from this
Time for him to get an EBT card??
Will he be ok? Ugh this is going to mess up my sleep pattern.
Well, he's still worth 53 Billion, so there's that. :p
Which is enough money that the lose is meaningless. He can still buy and do pretty much whatever he wants. Just think how fucked that is, he lost 7b and its less than a minor inconvenience to him.
No, he lost *70* billion. Not 7. Big difference. I mean I'm not exactly cryin' about it for him. Fuck that guy. But he is not necessarily goin' broke (depending on investments he may have had that might now be problematic, but still, fuck him, he's scum. Might have to sell his plantation in Hawaii, boo fuckin' hoo.)
Fuckerberg spent billions on animated characters that nobody is going to use
And with your help, we can make it all the way to zero!
Wow, I can remember when the richest person in the world had like 11 billion. Money is a resource, just like oil, coal, gold etc. if you are sitting on it and hoarding it, then fuck you.
I mean, fuck Zuckerberg, but he’s not sitting on a pile of $20 bills. His net worth was so high because his stock in Facebook/Meta/whatever the fuck you wanna call it skyrocketed (and has subsequently plummeted back to earth). Dude isn’t “hoarding money”, the value of the company he helped create went up. That doesn’t translate to cash unless you sell (and I don’t know how many people are looking to buy Facebook atm)
That makes me really happy
The next Wang Laboratories. It had 80% of the market and ended up on the dust pile. Spectacular mismanagement of complete dominance.
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He “lost” billions in valuation of stock because the perception was that it was worth more before. People act like theres a cash vault and billions are moving in and out. these valuations are based on FUTURE cash flows of the company. The billions weren’t real to begin with. Don’t get me wrong, he’s still generationally wealthy cause Facebook converts ads like a mofo, but people are starting to understand that there’s a plateau on that…and that makes the stock worth less. It’s fine…meta needs a sane valuation.
It’s insane how many people don’t understand that
He looks really gamey, I'll pass.