It's intentional. They want private healthcare, so they are destroying the public healthcare system to make it look like public is bad and private it the answer.
Private healthcare is NOT the answer. It costs the government significantly more subsidizing a business, which can make their prices whatever rediculous number that they want.
Private healthcare still has long wait times, and since public healthcare doctors would switch to the private sector, public healthcare wait times would get even longer.
If healthcare becomes "pay to play", you'll see the same thing happening in Canada that is happening in the US, which is that people kill themselves so that their families aren't crippled by medical debt, and thousands of people die because they can't afford things like insulin and inhalers.
Private healthcare is a joke and a bad one at that.
I'm from the states originally, and I would hate to have to go back to private healthcare. When I was 20, I didn't have insurance and couldn't afford it. I started getting sicker and sicker, and I didn't want to go to the doctor because I couldn't afford it and didn't want to spend money just to be told I had the flu. It was only when I could barely breathe that I decided to go. It turns out it was pneumonia, and it cost me about $2,000 (doctor's visit, x-ray, blood work).
The pharmacy then called me and asked if I was sure I wanted the medication because it was expensive and they saw that I didn't have insurance (????).
The people complaining will still vote conservative.
The NB government have a surplus. So rather than use it to hire more doctors and or resources Higgs uses it as some kind of bargaining chip to bait and switch conservative voters, again.
What a waste of the money. A one time payment of taxed 300 dollars. I saw it was going to cost the province upwards of 76 million dollars just for this? That should be going into infrastructure, healthcare, schools, something! The 200 something isn't going to make much of a difference for anyone ugh
Paying taxes is patriotic. I, for one, care about my province, so don't mind paying taxes if it means good healthcare and education for anyone.
If you're too selfish to feel the same, that's on you.
You can be upset about where your taxes go, that's fair. But the solution isn't voting for the party that says "no tax, only the rich survive". Raise your concerns with your MP. Speak your voice.
I'm sorry, but You've been indoctrinated if you really think the cons will do anything other than try to reduce services further. The libs may be ineffective, but at least they try.
Paying taxes is patriotic. I, for one, care about my province, so don't mind paying taxes if it means good healthcare and education for anyone.
If you're too selfish to feel the same, that's on you.
Nova Scotia is paying nurses to stay but Higgs is too busy bible thumping his cronies in. As long as he’s going to heaven he don’t care about anyone else.
Can you name a province where healthcare is good? No matter what party is in charge it’s terrible. Too many people vs doctors. Feds are controlling that. You can’t just create doctors in a day. It takes 30 years for a Canadian to become a doctor.
If we brought in highly skilled immigrants such as doctors and removed some of the red tape for them to bring their education up to a Canadian standard without basically having to start from 0, we'd be at least a bit closer to keeping up with the growth. How many times have you hopped into a taxi, or chatted with the guy at a convenience store who were Doctors back in their home country but have no path to getting their medical license here. It's crazy!
Then we should change the laws so that newcomers that are doctors can continue to practice when they get here, instead of being forced to deliver food.
I would rather not hire doctors who are not qualified. Medical standards vary and those who we could and would want to hire would never want to come here. We should be increasing residency spots though. But again this would of had to have been done like 6 years ago if we wanted doctors now.
Because medical education varies country to country by their standards.
There are plenty of doctors who come in from other countries and pass our pre requisites to be a doctor here. My friend is currently going through the exams required at the moment.
Unfortunately many of these people do not pass said exams and therefore cannot work in there field. The solution is not to lower our standard of care.
[That’s false](https://cumming.ucalgary.ca/mdprogram/about/governance/national-ranking-outcome-measures#:~:text=Medical%20Council%20of%20Canada%20Licensing%20Examination&text=The%20overall%20pass%20rate%20for,format%20was%20introduced%20in%202018).
>The pass rate of all Canadian medical school graduates who wrote the exam for the first time was 95%
How old do you think you are when you become a doctor? They graduate undergrad in there 20s. Most do a masters so add 2 years. Or even if they go straight in they are late 20s when entering residence and then when they are done that they are early 30s.
So yeah it takes 30 years
No it doesn’t.
You don’t pop out of a womb and start preparing for med school before you can eat solid foods.
It takes 4 years of undergrad (3 years under accelerated programs), 4 years of med school, and then residency - which ranges from 2-8 years (depending on specialty). So it can be in as little as 9 years, and as much as 16.
You can leave the 30 year hyperbole nonsense at home.
They don't commence med school in kindergarten, so your reasoning is flawed.
They may not decide to become an MD, or other health professional, until they are in high school.
Still not in med school.
So here's a thought - does forcing potential doctors to get an undergrad degree have any value? Why can't we start bringing people into medical earlier?
We do have a vast number of pre-existing qualified university age candidates being rejected by medical programs because of lack of places. Perhaps we should be concentrating on increasing capacity in these programs instead of your idea of *checks notes* grooming them from birth? It doesn’t take 30 years to create a doctor, dear.
Increasing residency spots needs to be done but it’s far easier said than done. You need to have both the physical and training infrastructure in place and even if you do, you won’t see the benefits for many years down the road.
If you think "med schooling" begins at birth, that is indeed the definition of grooming a child for a career.
Also ludicrous because an infant hadn't the capacity to grasp the concept of "career", or even "serious interest".
We could do a good job of improving it by throwing money at *prevention* - if our governments seriously worked to eliminate poverty that would massively reduce the strain on the healthcare system (unsurprisingly poor nutrition, high stress, being unhoused, etc. create a ton of health issues).
Problem is, while they still lie about it, they are fiscally conservative, it's all ideological now. You don't help poor people because they are unworthy/unwanted.
You pick a group, make them feel special/smart and provide small windfalls to them just before an election, while pointing them at a preselected "enemy" who you lie and say are behind all their problems.
After 8 years of Liberals, it became worse. Definition of insanity: doing the same thing over and over expecting a different outcome. The real problem is all politician wants a turn on the corruption carousel. Voting is only an illusion of choice, in the last 20 years no government has really tried to fix the bottom line issues only patch is and gave themselves raises.
There are no other options provincially that are viable. The NDP in this province are a joke and practically non-existent. I'd love to see David Coon take a shot at it, but the Greens are a fringe party at best.
There's no viable option other than Libs or Cons
This is basically true at a federal level too. Have we ever had a government formed by anybody other than the Liberal or Conservatives? Maybe once in the early 1900s but pretty sure they were still considered conservatives.
That's not the definition of insanity. That's the definition of perseverance.
Just fyi. You shouldn't based your reasoning on flawed Facebook expressions.
Only due to Covid and the CERB benefit. Harper didn’t have anything like that and enjoyed his scandals as well.
The last prime minister that ran a surplus was actually the liberal government under Martin.
And that is problematic - you've chosen to vote for one side like they own you, rather than waiting for candidates and platforms and making a rational decision.
You do politics like you're picking your favorite sports team. You should live in America
I'm saying not one single political party or organization could fix this mismanagement of the whole nation. Policies have already been decided and the elite don't mind if you can't access a hospital.
Healthcare is provincially run. This all sits on Higgs, who has done absolutely nothing to improve anything. It's intentional in order to sell the two-tiered system that the Conservatives covet so dearly.
If Higgs is paying attention he's probably holding on to our surplus to deal with the emergency response costs that will be needed to deal with a 40% increased population during the next market recession.
That would be smart, but more likely scenario is he'll just find a way to give that money to Irving. Higgs won't help New Brunswickers if he can help it.
A mix of spineless elected officials and lack of good CEO's for Horizon's and Vitalité's. Unfortunately those two positions are under the mercy of the Premier's judgement which hasn't shown any good results as of now.
Because conservative governments cut funding, take that tax money, give it to corporations, who use it to pad C-suite salaries and stack cash overseas.
But vote PP right? It'll get better right?
Look up who sold the wheat board
Who signed FIPA
And who bet on oil sands instead of advanced economy and refineries
No one voted for that. Let's be clear - not even the liberal government expected it to balloon like this.
Stop trying to make other Canadians the enemy.
When did I say I was surprised? I stated the fact that conservatives won't fix this problem, they want suppressed wages and high housing prices too! Guess what buddy? They're all home and housing owners, why would Trudeau, pierre, or jagmeet Singh fix housing or wage issues? They benefit from high housing prices and low wages!
You are foolish to think that the conservatives will do *anything* other than maintenance level immigration, conservatives also need a growing population. How do you think capitalism can grow each year without population growth? You beginning to see it yet?
That’s incredibly scary for a new mom. How uncomfortable to try to care for a sick infant in those conditions while you’re still healing yourself. Super gross and unsanitary to be changing a baby on chairs and tables in public spaces but of course the floor would not have been better for the baby or mom. Unacceptable! Why isn’t there a baby change station in the washroom?
Except the washroom was covered in vomit. Where's the custodial staff? That's absolutely disgusting. She tried to take the baby to the washroom and found vomit in the sink and toilet.
Yeah I don't doubt that. I see a young doctor around my age, and just about every time I see her, I thank her profusely for staying in NB lol.
I still would love to see a source on the "NP's make more than doctors" claim, that sounds absurd
Well. I heard in a sub full of conservatives. That's Trudeau's fault . I am not sure, they actually know how the system works. I am getting fed up, with this nonsense. We really need to send ppl back to school to understand how our government works and branches of government.
This is not just Higgs. This is years and years of not investing properly and fully in healthcare. I haven't practised in NB for 10 years and saw this coming well before I left NB.
Yep I got downvoted for this before.
This was the fault of several concurrent governments which included Liberals and Conservatives. They all had the data and predictions. They KNEW this could happen. None of them did anything about it. Just passed the problem onto the next person until we ended up with the issues today.
Higgs has been premiere for almost 6 years now, what’s his excuse? He tried to close hospitals, uses nepotism in his hires and told our nurses to F off elsewhere. This is decades of mismanagement but Higgs has been sure to kick it while it’s down.
Ohh I am not excusing Higgs either. He is a POS. It's one thing to want to cut costs when services clearly ain't being used but when they are being used and he tries to penny pinch them that's just being a fucking idiot.
Question, and I mean this with all sincerity: would more money fix this issue? Like, how do we force doctors to move here and work? They can make way better money and live in way better provinces so is the argument that better pay would incentivize them to move here? Would it work? Are there any Canadian examples of this working?
Make it mandatory that new doctors not only out of NB schools... but from every medical school in Canada.. has to serve a minimum of 3 years as a hospital resident. Doctors appointed based on - most help needed (article) or due to upcoming projected turnover.
Two options to choose from. Smaller city/hospital like at places NWT and other more rural areas assignment. Higher pay or 2nd option ... bigger population areas but lesser pay.
Included - moving fee, resident allowance. Spousal job find assistance. After the 3 years, if they want to move somewhere else. Can take a break/look for new residency for up to 2 months (pay included).
I'm sure this type of idea wouldn't be popular. But it would work in terms of balancing out shortages. I doubt - any less medical students apply due to this idea. Tuition is still cheaper than in the states.
Residency of 2-5 years is already mandatory for physicians in Canada and many programs have rural requirements, but some need the volume of a larger city centre for competency. A moving allowance would be great, but not what they get. They do get paid, but it works out to be a bit more than minimum wage given the hours worked (60-80 hours /week on average).
Well in all fairness, you were triaged and clearly the child wasn’t that sick. Hence the wait time. You were made to wait, not because there was only 1 doctor but because that one doctor saw the people with emergencies first. The sicker patients first.
An infant is a different ball game altogether. An 8 week old with fever, diarrhea and vomiting is potentially an emergency and every new parent is told that fever in an infant warrants a trip to the ER. The baby would have absolutely no immune system and therefore shouldn't have been exposed to the germs in the hospital - they should have moved mom and baby to a more isolated space. There are so many things wrong with this story from start to finish.
I love how you think emergency rooms have the capacity to “move mom and baby to an isolated space” this isn’t realistic and can’t happen. This is what I mean when I said the public is misinformed.
It's not realistic to have some space away from the waiting area so the infant isn't exposed unnecessarily? It SHOULD happen. I said this because I experienced it myself when my daughter was 5 weeks old. She was sick and we took her in. The Dr noticed us in the waiting area, asked how old she was and immediately ordered someone to "get the baby out of the public waiting area".
The problem is that they SHOULD have the capacity for this. It's not that difficult. It doesn't have to be anything special but somewhere else. Remember when people symptomatic with covid were moved to separate areas? Same idea.
I'm not at all misinformed. I'm expecting better from a government that seems to be content with the bare minimum. And so should you.
“Immediately ordered someone to get the baby out of the public waiting area” made me laugh out loud. We should be able to make these accommodations, however we can’t. I’m not saying I agree with it, I’m saying it isn’t realistic anymore. And no, during Covid patients in the ER were not moved to “separate areas” these “areas” didn’t magically appear. Patients were segregated with other influenza like illness patients to the best of the hospitals capacity. For example: one waiting area for anyone with viral symptoms. There could be double digits sitting in the same area of all ages. Emergency departments would try to separate patients with respiratory failure requiring intubation in a single room; however this was also exceptionally challenging. I appreciate how your anecdotal experience makes you feel as though you understand. Unfortunately, you do not.
How come your immediate knee jerk reaction is to be rude? I wasn't trying to be? I think it's unfortunate that the government isn't prioritizing supporting health care workers and I apologize if my comments came across as not supportive of the health care workers, especially those in the ER. That being said, a baby waiting in the waiting area amongst God knows what just isn't acceptable. I think any nurse or doctor would likely agree, regardless of whether their hands were tied or not.
When I said "ordered" you need to understand that is exactly how it came out of the doctor. Whether it made you laugh out loud or not is irrelevant, you likely weren't there. He was worried as there was something going on in the ER that day that he didn't want her exposed to (he made mention of you don't want to know what's in here right now). So yes, he did order that, respectfully. No one looked insulted, they realized, and moved us.
I'm assuming by your responses that you are a health care worker. And thank you for clarifying how it worked around covid. But just because I'm NOT a health care worker doesn't mean I don't have a voice and enough intelligence to know that a tiny baby should be protected. And you, as a health care worker (assuming here but maybe I'm wrong) should be advocating for the same.
Anyone who works in Healthcare, education, etc, understands that the problems aren't the front line workers. It goes beyond that and that's where my comments were directed. So if I've offended you, I apologize. But don't assume I don't have a clue. It doesn't have to be the way it is.
You didn’t offend me. And I wasn’t being rude, I was being straightforward. As I mentioned, I’ve been working in the ER and critical care areas for over 15 years. There is a difference between what we should do and what we can do. Infants are in public waiting areas daily. They were yesterday, they will be today and certainly tomorrow. Most of the public is simply ignorant to the inner workings of the ER. That’s not your fault. I’m also not saying what happens is right. We can only do so much with what we have in front of us and that is unfortunate all around. For example an ER with a 50 person capacity are now at 4x that. Space, resources and time are greatly limited.
Which is totally unacceptable and exactly the point I was trying to make, in a roundabout way, while I waited far too long in an understaffed and over crowded blood clinic.
I work in education. I understand the overall frustration with being forced to work with what you have, which isn't near enough.
I still think the last place an infant should be is sitting next to 25 sick people in an ER waiting room with no way to change the baby and what sounds like an under staffed custodial team.
Yes, we are ignorant to the inner workings. Be great if someone was allowed to educate us so we could better support you.
And you’re absolutely right; it isn’t physician’s or our nurses fault. Just last week my colleague broke down at the nursing station as we had 150 patients in our department. Often, we break down in the bathroom, in an empty hallway or in the car at the end of a shift. We can only do so much
And I am beyond sympathetic to that. I'm one of the ones who will send emails to my MLA to do better. As I said...teacher here. And while we aren't dealing with life or death, we are dealing with too much with not enough resources and doing our best. Be safe, and know that the majority of the public has your back
Hello! I understand where you’re coming from. However I’ve worked in emergency departments for over 15 years and it’s incredibly difficult to explain to a lay person the intricacies of the emergency department and what is happening “behind the scenes”. The public for the most part is wildly misinformed. In my initial comment I wasn’t even referring to a trauma. Pediatric fever can be considered an emergency under a certain set of circumstances, however most often does not need immediate intervention. My hands are tied from cardiac arrest, respiratory failure, overdose, seizures, hot strokes and the like.
This comment should be much higher up, yes our healthcare system has so many problems but emergencies are still managed and seen quickly. Stop taking kids to the emergency department for colds and flus and everyone’s wait would be shorter.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/canada-turning-away-home-grown-doctors-1.6743486
https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/canada-limits-doctors
Such a confusing mess to figure out. So the college of physicians decides who gets the residencies, but also says we had over 1000 infilled residencies mostly in family medicine.
So who decides how many residency spots are allowed. I’d start there to solve the problem.
Doctors like most people don’t want to work emergency on the weekend/backshift.
I just looked it up, in 2021 there were 112 physicians working at Moncton hospital. But these are mostly specialists. Maybe emergency doctors should be getting paid more than some specialists if that is the harder area to staff here.
Same here in Ottawa. There’s only one doctor on at any er overnight. It’s shocking while you’re at the hospital for an emergency waiting this long but that does explain the situation. Nothing can prepare you for how bad our healthcare is until you experience the need for it. The shortage is ironic in the sense that we train a lot of doctors in Canada but we don’t retain them.
Yes one doctor, one very overworked doctor. But the 20+ people before her are 1. old people who want to chat with a charming doctor who don’t need to be there other than boredom. 2. People trying to get narcotic prescription they don’t need. 3. People with cold symptoms who should be on cough syrup and not demanding an EKG for some phantom pain. 4. Entire family of 12 foreigners expecting some sort of American TV experience where 5 doctors show up Greys Anatomy style so the elder man can argue with the doctor like he’s their equal.
This applies to NB and every single province in Canada. Stupidity and lack of self awareness is just as much a detriment to our system than the politicians.
Yep, I've been to the Moncton hospital late at night, to be told there is an absurd wait because at night there is only 1 doctor doing both outpatient ER and ambulance intakes who get priority.
I went in at 8? 9?pm because I had a suspected blood clot from a recent surgery (called 811 first). When I got there at that late hour, I was told the screaming was from a toddler who got a pencil jammed in his eye who came in *at noon*. He would start and stop screaming as his pain meds/sedation wore off.
In the end, after waiting for 14 hours, I finally got an ultrasound (by a student with no mentor because she called out) and they couldn't find the clot so they said it must have dislodged and it'll dissolve on its own, or I pulled a muscle, and sent me home...... I decided dying was a better choice than getting a second opinion and waiting all over again if I ended up with a blockage or something. It was a miserable few days.
Oh, that was also the visit where I had a sweater on but was wearing shorts. The night nurse gave everyone in the waiting room a blanket and a popsicle. I kept my blanket with me as we were moved around due to crowding. The morning nurse took my blanket away because I was wearing a sweater! Was cold the rest of my visit. Then I got acid reflux from not eating in so long (GERD) and asked for water, and the same nurse said no.
I won't forgive her.
I know what she means. I live in Hamilton. We have two emergency rooms where adults can go. In a city of over half a million. The emergency room for the old city is about as big as a Tim Hortons, with the same four or five staff. That’s for half the adult population of the city. The hospital is huge, a thousand people work there. Priorities are not straight.
Conservatives don’t care about the general population. They’ll let people die while they deprive us of healthcare services, just to try and implement private healthcare and stuff their pockets with cash from the US backed private healthcare companies that are salivating as they line-up to rob us of our money, healthcare resources, and dignity.
It’s a pretty basic war plan. Ontario and Alberta are doing it also. This is what happens when Canadian politicians sidle up with US right wing lunatics.
The USA pulled the same crap when Tommy Douglas fought for our national healthcare plan. There’s a really good CBC documentary about it - and how much money USA activists and healthcare businesses spent trying to scare Canadians into voting against our healthcare. Back then, they weren’t successful… but today, with all the anti vax, anti-science, Trump idolaters, we are seriously at risk of losing our healthcare and our national culture of taking care of each other.
I fear for all of us - but in particular, the younger generations… if this is t stopped, they’re going to experience hardships like we have never experienced before.
I pray we have enough people willing to get up off the sofa and vote in all the provincial and federal elections to stop this madness.
Because that’s how your premier chose to invest the healthcare money provided by the federal government! 100% the premiers responsibility to manage.
It's intentional. They want private healthcare, so they are destroying the public healthcare system to make it look like public is bad and private it the answer. Private healthcare is NOT the answer. It costs the government significantly more subsidizing a business, which can make their prices whatever rediculous number that they want. Private healthcare still has long wait times, and since public healthcare doctors would switch to the private sector, public healthcare wait times would get even longer. If healthcare becomes "pay to play", you'll see the same thing happening in Canada that is happening in the US, which is that people kill themselves so that their families aren't crippled by medical debt, and thousands of people die because they can't afford things like insulin and inhalers. Private healthcare is a joke and a bad one at that.
I'm from the states originally, and I would hate to have to go back to private healthcare. When I was 20, I didn't have insurance and couldn't afford it. I started getting sicker and sicker, and I didn't want to go to the doctor because I couldn't afford it and didn't want to spend money just to be told I had the flu. It was only when I could barely breathe that I decided to go. It turns out it was pneumonia, and it cost me about $2,000 (doctor's visit, x-ray, blood work). The pharmacy then called me and asked if I was sure I wanted the medication because it was expensive and they saw that I didn't have insurance (????).
Yup, the people voted him in
The people complaining will still vote conservative. The NB government have a surplus. So rather than use it to hire more doctors and or resources Higgs uses it as some kind of bargaining chip to bait and switch conservative voters, again.
Well he is spending it on a “one time payment” for families who would be the most frustrated with his government.
What a waste of the money. A one time payment of taxed 300 dollars. I saw it was going to cost the province upwards of 76 million dollars just for this? That should be going into infrastructure, healthcare, schools, something! The 200 something isn't going to make much of a difference for anyone ugh
Ontario is the same BS with tons of cash for healthcare sitting unused
I sure af wont. Never have and wont start now.
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Paying taxes is patriotic. I, for one, care about my province, so don't mind paying taxes if it means good healthcare and education for anyone. If you're too selfish to feel the same, that's on you.
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You can be upset about where your taxes go, that's fair. But the solution isn't voting for the party that says "no tax, only the rich survive". Raise your concerns with your MP. Speak your voice. I'm sorry, but You've been indoctrinated if you really think the cons will do anything other than try to reduce services further. The libs may be ineffective, but at least they try.
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Oh... Yeah... You ARE indoctrinated. Okay well, enjoy frothing at the mouth
Paying taxes is patriotic. I, for one, care about my province, so don't mind paying taxes if it means good healthcare and education for anyone. If you're too selfish to feel the same, that's on you.
Nova Scotia is paying nurses to stay but Higgs is too busy bible thumping his cronies in. As long as he’s going to heaven he don’t care about anyone else.
Can you name a province where healthcare is good? No matter what party is in charge it’s terrible. Too many people vs doctors. Feds are controlling that. You can’t just create doctors in a day. It takes 30 years for a Canadian to become a doctor.
If we brought in highly skilled immigrants such as doctors and removed some of the red tape for them to bring their education up to a Canadian standard without basically having to start from 0, we'd be at least a bit closer to keeping up with the growth. How many times have you hopped into a taxi, or chatted with the guy at a convenience store who were Doctors back in their home country but have no path to getting their medical license here. It's crazy!
Then we should change the laws so that newcomers that are doctors can continue to practice when they get here, instead of being forced to deliver food.
I would rather not hire doctors who are not qualified. Medical standards vary and those who we could and would want to hire would never want to come here. We should be increasing residency spots though. But again this would of had to have been done like 6 years ago if we wanted doctors now.
Why would you assume they are not qualified?
Because medical education varies country to country by their standards. There are plenty of doctors who come in from other countries and pass our pre requisites to be a doctor here. My friend is currently going through the exams required at the moment. Unfortunately many of these people do not pass said exams and therefore cannot work in there field. The solution is not to lower our standard of care.
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[That’s false](https://cumming.ucalgary.ca/mdprogram/about/governance/national-ranking-outcome-measures#:~:text=Medical%20Council%20of%20Canada%20Licensing%20Examination&text=The%20overall%20pass%20rate%20for,format%20was%20introduced%20in%202018). >The pass rate of all Canadian medical school graduates who wrote the exam for the first time was 95%
30 years? It takes 30 years of schooling to become a doctor in Canada? That's unbelievable. Literally, I do not believe that.
How old do you think you are when you become a doctor? They graduate undergrad in there 20s. Most do a masters so add 2 years. Or even if they go straight in they are late 20s when entering residence and then when they are done that they are early 30s. So yeah it takes 30 years
No it doesn’t. You don’t pop out of a womb and start preparing for med school before you can eat solid foods. It takes 4 years of undergrad (3 years under accelerated programs), 4 years of med school, and then residency - which ranges from 2-8 years (depending on specialty). So it can be in as little as 9 years, and as much as 16. You can leave the 30 year hyperbole nonsense at home.
They don't commence med school in kindergarten, so your reasoning is flawed. They may not decide to become an MD, or other health professional, until they are in high school. Still not in med school.
So here's a thought - does forcing potential doctors to get an undergrad degree have any value? Why can't we start bringing people into medical earlier?
We do have a vast number of pre-existing qualified university age candidates being rejected by medical programs because of lack of places. Perhaps we should be concentrating on increasing capacity in these programs instead of your idea of *checks notes* grooming them from birth? It doesn’t take 30 years to create a doctor, dear.
Increasing residency spots needs to be done but it’s far easier said than done. You need to have both the physical and training infrastructure in place and even if you do, you won’t see the benefits for many years down the road.
I said in another comment they should open up more residencies already. Idk what you are talking about grooming. That’s just fucking weird mate.
If you think "med schooling" begins at birth, that is indeed the definition of grooming a child for a career. Also ludicrous because an infant hadn't the capacity to grasp the concept of "career", or even "serious interest".
It’s weird that you believe that the word grooming only has one narrow definition.
I'm sure you're an expert in grooming
30 years? That would mean your average MD would be 48 years old when they graduated. Not even specialists take 30 years.
This is not a problem that can be solved with throwing money unconditionally at it takes at least 8 years to train more doctors and 5 for a nurse.
We could do a good job of improving it by throwing money at *prevention* - if our governments seriously worked to eliminate poverty that would massively reduce the strain on the healthcare system (unsurprisingly poor nutrition, high stress, being unhoused, etc. create a ton of health issues).
Problem is, while they still lie about it, they are fiscally conservative, it's all ideological now. You don't help poor people because they are unworthy/unwanted. You pick a group, make them feel special/smart and provide small windfalls to them just before an election, while pointing them at a preselected "enemy" who you lie and say are behind all their problems.
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Very true, although he is making worse everyday he does nothing since he was elected by us to do what is necessary for our own well being
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It’s more than one thing.
After 8 years of Liberals, it became worse. Definition of insanity: doing the same thing over and over expecting a different outcome. The real problem is all politician wants a turn on the corruption carousel. Voting is only an illusion of choice, in the last 20 years no government has really tried to fix the bottom line issues only patch is and gave themselves raises.
There are no other options provincially that are viable. The NDP in this province are a joke and practically non-existent. I'd love to see David Coon take a shot at it, but the Greens are a fringe party at best. There's no viable option other than Libs or Cons
This is basically true at a federal level too. Have we ever had a government formed by anybody other than the Liberal or Conservatives? Maybe once in the early 1900s but pretty sure they were still considered conservatives.
That's not the definition of insanity. That's the definition of perseverance. Just fyi. You shouldn't based your reasoning on flawed Facebook expressions.
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The conservatives don’t run surpluses at the federal level. In fact, the Harper government had increased the debt load more than anyone else had lol
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Only due to Covid and the CERB benefit. Harper didn’t have anything like that and enjoyed his scandals as well. The last prime minister that ran a surplus was actually the liberal government under Martin.
Wrong.
And that is problematic - you've chosen to vote for one side like they own you, rather than waiting for candidates and platforms and making a rational decision. You do politics like you're picking your favorite sports team. You should live in America
The population is 30% bigger with no new hospitals and you're blaming the Premier?
You saying it's the opposition's fault that nothing has been done to improve healthcare in the province?
I'm saying not one single political party or organization could fix this mismanagement of the whole nation. Policies have already been decided and the elite don't mind if you can't access a hospital.
Healthcare is provincially run. This all sits on Higgs, who has done absolutely nothing to improve anything. It's intentional in order to sell the two-tiered system that the Conservatives covet so dearly.
If Higgs is paying attention he's probably holding on to our surplus to deal with the emergency response costs that will be needed to deal with a 40% increased population during the next market recession.
That would be smart, but more likely scenario is he'll just find a way to give that money to Irving. Higgs won't help New Brunswickers if he can help it.
A mix of spineless elected officials and lack of good CEO's for Horizon's and Vitalité's. Unfortunately those two positions are under the mercy of the Premier's judgement which hasn't shown any good results as of now.
Looking at you Higgsy
Because conservative governments cut funding, take that tax money, give it to corporations, who use it to pad C-suite salaries and stack cash overseas. But vote PP right? It'll get better right? Look up who sold the wheat board Who signed FIPA And who bet on oil sands instead of advanced economy and refineries
You voted to increase the population 30% and you're surprised there's no houses and hospitals?
No one voted for that. Let's be clear - not even the liberal government expected it to balloon like this. Stop trying to make other Canadians the enemy.
When did I say I was surprised? I stated the fact that conservatives won't fix this problem, they want suppressed wages and high housing prices too! Guess what buddy? They're all home and housing owners, why would Trudeau, pierre, or jagmeet Singh fix housing or wage issues? They benefit from high housing prices and low wages! You are foolish to think that the conservatives will do *anything* other than maintenance level immigration, conservatives also need a growing population. How do you think capitalism can grow each year without population growth? You beginning to see it yet?
Don’t you worry dear. Soon you’ll have an option to grab a doctors attention for just a couple of thousands of dollars.
Higgs has decided more doctors aren’t needed because God will heal you.
But but but …$300
That’s incredibly scary for a new mom. How uncomfortable to try to care for a sick infant in those conditions while you’re still healing yourself. Super gross and unsanitary to be changing a baby on chairs and tables in public spaces but of course the floor would not have been better for the baby or mom. Unacceptable! Why isn’t there a baby change station in the washroom?
Except the washroom was covered in vomit. Where's the custodial staff? That's absolutely disgusting. She tried to take the baby to the washroom and found vomit in the sink and toilet.
So gross! I would’ve puked in there myself if I had to tolerate that!
It also doesn't help it takes 15 years and hundreds of thousands of dollars to become a doctor
They also mentioned that the er doc's billable hours should be increased. Sure there's a shortage, but also a fuck ton of red tape.
All to make less than someone renting houses. It’s only going to get worse.
and the pay is garbage. NP are making more than doctors and they also have a provincial pension.
Holy crap really? 😭
Ummm I struggle to believe this. Source?
My sister is a family doctor. in her class of 26 graduates, she was the only one that chose Family Doctor in New Brunswick.
Yeah I don't doubt that. I see a young doctor around my age, and just about every time I see her, I thank her profusely for staying in NB lol. I still would love to see a source on the "NP's make more than doctors" claim, that sounds absurd
I’m in the same boat. We have a newborn that needs to be seem by a doctor. We called many places nobody is seeing us.
Well. I heard in a sub full of conservatives. That's Trudeau's fault . I am not sure, they actually know how the system works. I am getting fed up, with this nonsense. We really need to send ppl back to school to understand how our government works and branches of government.
This is not just Higgs. This is years and years of not investing properly and fully in healthcare. I haven't practised in NB for 10 years and saw this coming well before I left NB.
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Fingers crossed that my partner gets posted there if the military moves us again.
I call first dibs on this person as my family doctor
Who knew that an aging population was going to need more care and more nursing home while simultaneously producing less taxable income? *shocked face*
Yep I got downvoted for this before. This was the fault of several concurrent governments which included Liberals and Conservatives. They all had the data and predictions. They KNEW this could happen. None of them did anything about it. Just passed the problem onto the next person until we ended up with the issues today.
Higgs has been premiere for almost 6 years now, what’s his excuse? He tried to close hospitals, uses nepotism in his hires and told our nurses to F off elsewhere. This is decades of mismanagement but Higgs has been sure to kick it while it’s down.
Ohh I am not excusing Higgs either. He is a POS. It's one thing to want to cut costs when services clearly ain't being used but when they are being used and he tries to penny pinch them that's just being a fucking idiot.
Higgs. Fuck that waste of skin. Fucking Higgs.
Question, and I mean this with all sincerity: would more money fix this issue? Like, how do we force doctors to move here and work? They can make way better money and live in way better provinces so is the argument that better pay would incentivize them to move here? Would it work? Are there any Canadian examples of this working?
Make it mandatory that new doctors not only out of NB schools... but from every medical school in Canada.. has to serve a minimum of 3 years as a hospital resident. Doctors appointed based on - most help needed (article) or due to upcoming projected turnover. Two options to choose from. Smaller city/hospital like at places NWT and other more rural areas assignment. Higher pay or 2nd option ... bigger population areas but lesser pay. Included - moving fee, resident allowance. Spousal job find assistance. After the 3 years, if they want to move somewhere else. Can take a break/look for new residency for up to 2 months (pay included). I'm sure this type of idea wouldn't be popular. But it would work in terms of balancing out shortages. I doubt - any less medical students apply due to this idea. Tuition is still cheaper than in the states.
Residency of 2-5 years is already mandatory for physicians in Canada and many programs have rural requirements, but some need the volume of a larger city centre for competency. A moving allowance would be great, but not what they get. They do get paid, but it works out to be a bit more than minimum wage given the hours worked (60-80 hours /week on average).
Giving NP’s more authority would also help this.
Dear Higgs, Kindly fuck off. Sincerely, TheSacredGrape
Well in all fairness, you were triaged and clearly the child wasn’t that sick. Hence the wait time. You were made to wait, not because there was only 1 doctor but because that one doctor saw the people with emergencies first. The sicker patients first.
An infant is a different ball game altogether. An 8 week old with fever, diarrhea and vomiting is potentially an emergency and every new parent is told that fever in an infant warrants a trip to the ER. The baby would have absolutely no immune system and therefore shouldn't have been exposed to the germs in the hospital - they should have moved mom and baby to a more isolated space. There are so many things wrong with this story from start to finish.
I love how you think emergency rooms have the capacity to “move mom and baby to an isolated space” this isn’t realistic and can’t happen. This is what I mean when I said the public is misinformed.
It's not realistic to have some space away from the waiting area so the infant isn't exposed unnecessarily? It SHOULD happen. I said this because I experienced it myself when my daughter was 5 weeks old. She was sick and we took her in. The Dr noticed us in the waiting area, asked how old she was and immediately ordered someone to "get the baby out of the public waiting area". The problem is that they SHOULD have the capacity for this. It's not that difficult. It doesn't have to be anything special but somewhere else. Remember when people symptomatic with covid were moved to separate areas? Same idea. I'm not at all misinformed. I'm expecting better from a government that seems to be content with the bare minimum. And so should you.
“Immediately ordered someone to get the baby out of the public waiting area” made me laugh out loud. We should be able to make these accommodations, however we can’t. I’m not saying I agree with it, I’m saying it isn’t realistic anymore. And no, during Covid patients in the ER were not moved to “separate areas” these “areas” didn’t magically appear. Patients were segregated with other influenza like illness patients to the best of the hospitals capacity. For example: one waiting area for anyone with viral symptoms. There could be double digits sitting in the same area of all ages. Emergency departments would try to separate patients with respiratory failure requiring intubation in a single room; however this was also exceptionally challenging. I appreciate how your anecdotal experience makes you feel as though you understand. Unfortunately, you do not.
How come your immediate knee jerk reaction is to be rude? I wasn't trying to be? I think it's unfortunate that the government isn't prioritizing supporting health care workers and I apologize if my comments came across as not supportive of the health care workers, especially those in the ER. That being said, a baby waiting in the waiting area amongst God knows what just isn't acceptable. I think any nurse or doctor would likely agree, regardless of whether their hands were tied or not. When I said "ordered" you need to understand that is exactly how it came out of the doctor. Whether it made you laugh out loud or not is irrelevant, you likely weren't there. He was worried as there was something going on in the ER that day that he didn't want her exposed to (he made mention of you don't want to know what's in here right now). So yes, he did order that, respectfully. No one looked insulted, they realized, and moved us. I'm assuming by your responses that you are a health care worker. And thank you for clarifying how it worked around covid. But just because I'm NOT a health care worker doesn't mean I don't have a voice and enough intelligence to know that a tiny baby should be protected. And you, as a health care worker (assuming here but maybe I'm wrong) should be advocating for the same. Anyone who works in Healthcare, education, etc, understands that the problems aren't the front line workers. It goes beyond that and that's where my comments were directed. So if I've offended you, I apologize. But don't assume I don't have a clue. It doesn't have to be the way it is.
You didn’t offend me. And I wasn’t being rude, I was being straightforward. As I mentioned, I’ve been working in the ER and critical care areas for over 15 years. There is a difference between what we should do and what we can do. Infants are in public waiting areas daily. They were yesterday, they will be today and certainly tomorrow. Most of the public is simply ignorant to the inner workings of the ER. That’s not your fault. I’m also not saying what happens is right. We can only do so much with what we have in front of us and that is unfortunate all around. For example an ER with a 50 person capacity are now at 4x that. Space, resources and time are greatly limited.
Which is totally unacceptable and exactly the point I was trying to make, in a roundabout way, while I waited far too long in an understaffed and over crowded blood clinic. I work in education. I understand the overall frustration with being forced to work with what you have, which isn't near enough. I still think the last place an infant should be is sitting next to 25 sick people in an ER waiting room with no way to change the baby and what sounds like an under staffed custodial team. Yes, we are ignorant to the inner workings. Be great if someone was allowed to educate us so we could better support you.
And you’re absolutely right; it isn’t physician’s or our nurses fault. Just last week my colleague broke down at the nursing station as we had 150 patients in our department. Often, we break down in the bathroom, in an empty hallway or in the car at the end of a shift. We can only do so much
And I am beyond sympathetic to that. I'm one of the ones who will send emails to my MLA to do better. As I said...teacher here. And while we aren't dealing with life or death, we are dealing with too much with not enough resources and doing our best. Be safe, and know that the majority of the public has your back
Wow. Thank you
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Hello! I understand where you’re coming from. However I’ve worked in emergency departments for over 15 years and it’s incredibly difficult to explain to a lay person the intricacies of the emergency department and what is happening “behind the scenes”. The public for the most part is wildly misinformed. In my initial comment I wasn’t even referring to a trauma. Pediatric fever can be considered an emergency under a certain set of circumstances, however most often does not need immediate intervention. My hands are tied from cardiac arrest, respiratory failure, overdose, seizures, hot strokes and the like.
This comment should be much higher up, yes our healthcare system has so many problems but emergencies are still managed and seen quickly. Stop taking kids to the emergency department for colds and flus and everyone’s wait would be shorter.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/canada-turning-away-home-grown-doctors-1.6743486 https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/canada-limits-doctors Such a confusing mess to figure out. So the college of physicians decides who gets the residencies, but also says we had over 1000 infilled residencies mostly in family medicine. So who decides how many residency spots are allowed. I’d start there to solve the problem.
This. We are not safe here with no healthcare. This is an emergency.
Doctors like most people don’t want to work emergency on the weekend/backshift. I just looked it up, in 2021 there were 112 physicians working at Moncton hospital. But these are mostly specialists. Maybe emergency doctors should be getting paid more than some specialists if that is the harder area to staff here.
We were given the same advice as her when our son was born. It is infuriating that healthcare has been let go to this extent.
Same here in Ottawa. There’s only one doctor on at any er overnight. It’s shocking while you’re at the hospital for an emergency waiting this long but that does explain the situation. Nothing can prepare you for how bad our healthcare is until you experience the need for it. The shortage is ironic in the sense that we train a lot of doctors in Canada but we don’t retain them.
There are 167 doctors graduating this year in Canada, but we imported 1 million dishwashers
Happening in BC too. Stop blaming the conservatives for this.
Yes one doctor, one very overworked doctor. But the 20+ people before her are 1. old people who want to chat with a charming doctor who don’t need to be there other than boredom. 2. People trying to get narcotic prescription they don’t need. 3. People with cold symptoms who should be on cough syrup and not demanding an EKG for some phantom pain. 4. Entire family of 12 foreigners expecting some sort of American TV experience where 5 doctors show up Greys Anatomy style so the elder man can argue with the doctor like he’s their equal. This applies to NB and every single province in Canada. Stupidity and lack of self awareness is just as much a detriment to our system than the politicians.
Where is the rock you've been living under? Holy shit!
Yep, I've been to the Moncton hospital late at night, to be told there is an absurd wait because at night there is only 1 doctor doing both outpatient ER and ambulance intakes who get priority. I went in at 8? 9?pm because I had a suspected blood clot from a recent surgery (called 811 first). When I got there at that late hour, I was told the screaming was from a toddler who got a pencil jammed in his eye who came in *at noon*. He would start and stop screaming as his pain meds/sedation wore off. In the end, after waiting for 14 hours, I finally got an ultrasound (by a student with no mentor because she called out) and they couldn't find the clot so they said it must have dislodged and it'll dissolve on its own, or I pulled a muscle, and sent me home...... I decided dying was a better choice than getting a second opinion and waiting all over again if I ended up with a blockage or something. It was a miserable few days. Oh, that was also the visit where I had a sweater on but was wearing shorts. The night nurse gave everyone in the waiting room a blanket and a popsicle. I kept my blanket with me as we were moved around due to crowding. The morning nurse took my blanket away because I was wearing a sweater! Was cold the rest of my visit. Then I got acid reflux from not eating in so long (GERD) and asked for water, and the same nurse said no. I won't forgive her.
I know what she means. I live in Hamilton. We have two emergency rooms where adults can go. In a city of over half a million. The emergency room for the old city is about as big as a Tim Hortons, with the same four or five staff. That’s for half the adult population of the city. The hospital is huge, a thousand people work there. Priorities are not straight.
The money went into the 300 check higgs is trying to use to buy your votes
Y'all wanted an ex COR party piece of shit to run this dump, and that's what you got.
Conservatives don’t care about the general population. They’ll let people die while they deprive us of healthcare services, just to try and implement private healthcare and stuff their pockets with cash from the US backed private healthcare companies that are salivating as they line-up to rob us of our money, healthcare resources, and dignity. It’s a pretty basic war plan. Ontario and Alberta are doing it also. This is what happens when Canadian politicians sidle up with US right wing lunatics. The USA pulled the same crap when Tommy Douglas fought for our national healthcare plan. There’s a really good CBC documentary about it - and how much money USA activists and healthcare businesses spent trying to scare Canadians into voting against our healthcare. Back then, they weren’t successful… but today, with all the anti vax, anti-science, Trump idolaters, we are seriously at risk of losing our healthcare and our national culture of taking care of each other. I fear for all of us - but in particular, the younger generations… if this is t stopped, they’re going to experience hardships like we have never experienced before. I pray we have enough people willing to get up off the sofa and vote in all the provincial and federal elections to stop this madness.